CBD (hemp extract) and the filling out a 4473

[Borderland]

How does a person answer 11e on the 4473 if they're using CBD to control pain from deteriorating discs in their back? It's legal in this state but evidently still a controlled substance according to the fed. He says the stuff is a miracle drug which avoids steroid shots or surgery.

Asking for a friend.

[Tensaw]

CBD is not an intoxicant and is a distinct molecule. It is not THC (although CBD products may have some minute level of THC). Check out the Peter Attia The Drive podcast #81 for a deep dive. Good luck.

[bofe954]

The question specifically states marijuana. I would say that CBD is not marijuana and answer no to the question.

[blues]

The question specifically states marijuana. I would say that CBD is not marijuana and answer no to the question.

I would agree and I think the lawyers would as well.

[olstyn]

Relevant for now, but if attitudes keep trending the way they have been the last few years, they're going to have to remove that question. I don't see how we can remain in this logically inconsistent state of having marijuana be a controlled substance at the federal level but not bothering to enforce that in the wide variety of states that have declared it legal inside their borders indefinitely, and the prevailing attitude definitely leans in the "pot is OK" direction.

[Le Français]

Relevant for now, but if attitudes keep trending the way they have been the last few years, they're going to have to remove that question. I don't see how we can remain in this logically inconsistent state of having marijuana be a controlled substance at the federal level but not bothering to enforce that in the wide variety of states that have declared it legal inside their borders indefinitely, and the prevailing attitude definitely leans in the "pot is OK" direction.

Specifically concerning marijuana, removing the question doesn’t matter. Federal law would have to be changed either to make marijuana legal, or to make possession of a firearm by illegal marijuana users legal. Whether or not a question appears on the 4473 doesn’t impact whether or not possession of a firearm or ammunition by certain persons is legal.

[olstyn]

Specifically concerning marijuana, removing the question doesn’t matter. Federal law would have to be changed either to make marijuana legal, or to make possession of a firearm by illegal marijuana users legal. Whether or not a question appears on the 4473 doesn’t impact whether or not possession of a firearm or ammunition by certain persons is legal.

I didn't mean to suggest that it would. I simply meant that it's looking more and more like marijuana is going to be actually legal every year as more and more states declare it legal within their borders in direct contradiction to federal law and the federal government does nothing about it. I personally have no horse in the race, as I've never used it and have no intention of starting, but I also don't really care if others want to use it as long as they don't drive high, don't carry high, don't force me to breathe their smoke, etc. When and if that happens, the 4473 will need to change in order to reflect the change in legality.

[RoyGBiv]

If it doesn't metabolize into 11-Nor-9-carboxy-Δ9-tetrahydrocannabinol, it's not Mary Jane.

Good to gun.

[Joe in PNG]

I suspect if CBD was on the bad list, it would say something to the effect of "including CBD oil and related products", or updated to read as such.

[txdpd]

I'm not a lawyer. The question doesn't ask about engaging in the "illegal use of drugs", it ask about being an "unlawful user". The statement is not relevant to the question due to poor wording, but I'm not putting up the legal fees or years of lost freedom to fight that battle.


Are you an unlawful user of, or addicted to, marijuana or any depressant, stimulant, narcotic drug, or any other controlled substance? Warning: The use or possession of marijuana remains unlawful under Federal law regardless of whether it has been legalized or decriminalized for medicinal or recreational purposes in the state where you reside.

https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/27/478.11


Unlawful user of or addicted to any controlled substance. A person who uses a controlled substance and has lost the power of self-control with reference to the use of controlled substance; and any person who is a current user of a controlled substance in a manner other than as prescribed by a licensed physician. Such use is not limited to the use of drugs on a particular day, or within a matter of days or weeks before, but rather that the unlawful use has occurred recently enough to indicate that the individual is actively engaged in such conduct. A person may be an unlawful current user of a controlled substance even though the substance is not being used at the precise time the person seeks to acquire a firearm or receives or possesses a firearm. An inference of current use may be drawn from evidence of a recent use or possession of a controlled substance or a pattern of use or possession that reasonably covers the present time, e.g., a conviction for use or possession of a controlled substance within the past year; multiple arrests for such offenses within the past 5 years if the most recent arrest occurred within the past year; or persons found through a drug test to use a controlled substance unlawfully, provided that the test was administered within the past year. For a current or former member of the Armed Forces, an inference of current use may be drawn from recent disciplinary or other administrative action based on confirmed drug use, e.g., court-martial conviction, nonjudicial punishment, or an administrative discharge based on drug use or drug rehabilitation failure.

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/42/12210



(d) “Illegal use of drugs” defined
(1) In general

The term “illegal use of drugs” means the use of drugs, the possession or distribution of which is unlawful under the Controlled Substances Act [21 U.S.C. 801 et seq.]. Such term does not include the use of a drug taken under supervision by a licensed health care professional, or other uses authorized by the Controlled Substances Act or other provisions of Federal law.


Edited: I'm not finding a definition for "prescribed by a physician" plenty of things about needing a "prescription" from a "licensed physician" to obtain certain controlled substances. But it's not my freedom.

[10mmfanboy]

I check no and carry on. I even smoke it too and use the oil. Live in constant back pain or use cbd? hmmmm, I'll take cbd.

[Crawls]

CBD oil can also be also be derived from hemp which avoids the federal legal issues.

[El Cid]

Are you an unlawful user of, or addicted to, marijuana or any depressant, stimulant, narcotic drug, or any other controlled substance?

.
I’ve always read that and wondered if it applied to alcoholics? Addicted to a depressant...

[10mmfanboy]

CBD oil can also be also be derived from hemp which avoids the federal legal issues.

CBD is Hemp, that is exactly right. Any good company will provide you with a 3rd party Lab Test which will show the different levels detected. You can never get rid of all traces of THC but it has to fall below .3% although I think TN is .8% THC. But you also have THC A and THC B, THC B is the illegal element found in normal marijuana. Also if you are looking for CBD oil, make sure it says CBD oil and not hemp oil. Hemp oil has no medicinal values. Most of the oils will be something crazy like 4,000 MG. CBD oil starts around 100 MG, 300 MG, 600 MG.

I think CBDPure is the best oil out there. But smoking CBD is the best way for your body to absorb CBD or eat it. If you have serious pain, inflammation, anxiety... CBD flower is your best bet.

[TC215]

CBD is Hemp, that is exactly right. Any good company will provide you with a 3rd party Lab Test which will show the different levels detected. You can never get rid of all traces of THC but it has to fall below .3% although I think TN is .8% THC. But you also have THC A and THC B, THC B is the illegal element found in normal marijuana. Also if you are looking for CBD oil, make sure it says CBD oil and not hemp oil. Hemp oil has no medicinal values. Most of the oils will be something crazy like 4,000 MG. CBD oil starts around 100 MG, 300 MG, 600 MG.

I think CBDPure is the best oil out there. But smoking CBD is the best way for your body to absorb CBD or eat it. If you have serious pain, inflammation, anxiety... CBD flower is your best bet.

It’s .3%. Used to be .9%, but was changed a few years ago.

[ssb]

It’s .3%. Used to be .9%, but was changed a few years ago.

I was under the impression the answer to that question was "TBI won't test suspected marijuana for THC content so why bother?"

[TC215]

I was under the impression the answer to that question was "TBI won't test suspected marijuana for THC content so why bother?"

That’s not true. If it’s more than half an ounce, the lab will test it. If it’s less than half, they’ll test it with a letter from the DA’s office. The labs have only recently gotten the equipment/ability to quantify THC, and the process is more time consuming compared to the other tests they do.

[ssb]

That’s not true. If it’s more than half an ounce, the lab will test it. If it’s less than half, they’ll test it with a letter from the DA’s office. The labs have only recently gotten the equipment/ability to quantify THC, and the process is more time consuming compared to the other tests they do.

At conference this year, we were told they wouldn't necessarily test a felony amount unless we requested it. Nevertheless, now that everybody's suddenly in the possession of hemp according to their attorney that decision effectively legalized marijuana for recreational use.

I definitely get the bottleneck issues, but the crime lab baffles me sometime. Their insistence to always test blood samples for alcohol before going to drug testing -- even when it's a limited amount of blood and not their standard two tubes of blood, and even when the officer writes "I had to Narcan this dude and he didn't smell like alcohol at all" on the request form -- is another gripe.

[BillSWPA]

About a year ago, the definition of marijuana under federal law was changed to exclude hemp that contains less than 0.3% THC. So, as long as the CBD is made from hemp that contains less than 0.3% THC, it is not an illegal drug. Although marijuana may be legal under the laws of some states for some purposes, it remains 100% illegal under federal law.

Even if you are using legal CBD, you can still have enough THC in your system to fail a drug test.