Help me plan my Colt Rail Gun build!

[Crash41984]

I purchased a black cerakote model "XSE" style Colt Rail Gun several years back. I had grandiose ideas of turning this pistol into a full house custom, but every damn time I get ready to pull the trigger, other life expenses come up or I talk myself out of it and buy another 1911. I've tried to get this done 4 times in the past 5 years, and ended up with a SA MC OP, a DW Specialist, a new furnace, and a rebuilt back deck.

I'm going to make the commitment this time and slowly gather parts until spring, then everything is going to Evolution. If I piece meal the parts, I think I'll have a better chance of getting this guy completed.

This particular gun is more accurate than I am, the barrel locks up solid as a rock, and I can live with the less than perfect slide to frame fit. It is a Colt after all. However, the remainder leaves quite a bit to be desired cosmetically. The stock ambi safety has shot loose and feels mushy, the grip safety is fit like sh*t, front strap needs checkering, it needs tritium, I want a magwell, I want a solid trigger, maybe a dehorn, maybe a Clark rib, maybe replace some MIM, and then Ionbond DLC all over everything.

I'm thinking WC Bullet Proof Ambi Safety and Beavertail Safety, Solid Long Trigger, and maybe a hammer, sear, and disconnector. Also want a set of Heinie Straight 8 sights like the set on my Specialist. I was going to order a WC one piece magwell, but my only options are 20 or 30lpi, and I want the FSC at 25lpi. I usually wouldn't care, but being that I have waited this long, I want everything matchy matchy. Now I'm thinking I should just save some additional coin and have Evolution fit a Stan Chen Gen II while the gun is there.

My goal is to carry/shoot the piss out of it, establish some honest wear, and give this to my oldest son on his 21st birthday (he's 4). So I want it to be something special. Heirloom Customs did a "Blackened Rail Gun" awhile back that I'm drooling over for inspiration, but that had to have been a 5-7k build. I'm gonna try to mod this out for $1,000-$1,500, not including the parts I'm going to start picking up.

Any advice as to the direction I'm headed? Any 1911 aficionados have a better idea for the parts list?

[JTQ]

My caveat is I've never done this, but I've been into 1911's since the 1980's.

I'd tell the gunsmith of your choice what you want the gun to do and what you want from the gun and let him pick the parts that he wants to work with and will provide the experience you want.

You may pick some part, that the gunsmith doesn't care for, or knows doesn't work well with your Colt, then the gunsmith needs to do extra work to get that part to function with your gun.

[farscott]

Many smiths will not guarantee parts that are provided by the customer for two reasons:

1) Bad parts have to be returned to the customer, not the vendor, causing issues and delays.
2) Smiths get some markup by buying parts at FFL prices and selling at retail.

I strongly suggest selecting a smith that listens to input, provides feedback, and then outlines the final choices in writing so there are no surprises later. Sight types are easy and most smiths will have no issues with customer choices, as long as the part is decent. Heinie definitely qualifies. Trigger style and length is another good input, but I suggest letting the smith choose the exact part. Grip safeties and thumb safeties are parts you can specify but the smith should source. There are some issues with grip safeties and the holes in the frame for the safety pins. John Harrison has a good article on that on his website under his FAQ. It is good reading, as is the rest of the FAQ.

Also from his FAQ.


You'll notice that my prices include the cost of parts as well as labor to install and fit each part. I am confident that I can do a better job, with fewer interruptions and delays, by supplying all parts myself. I have learned this the hard way. My experience working with customer-supplied parts has typically been poor. Sending me parts to use on your pistol that you have obtained is something like taking your car to the dealer for a brake job and you supplying the pads. How well do you think that’s going to work out?

If you want something that you don't see offered in the "Services and Prices" section, please ask, as I can most likely supply it.

[41magfan]

Are you referring to Evolution Armory for your build?

[Bergeron]

Yes, you'll want to decide if it is essential for you that you are providing parts that you want to see used, or if you could be happy sending off the gun and requesting the parts that you'd like to have installed.

Some notes:

1.) Wilson Combat parts have an excellent reputation, so while I understand that from the smith's perspective, it might be preferable to avoid being required to use customer parts, this is probably less of an issue if you're staying with Wilson parts.

2.) The BulletProof magwell is offered with a smooth mainspring "ready for your choice of texture".

3.) Have you considered sending the gun to Wilson for the modifications? Except for the Heine sights, and the IonBond, everything you listed, Wilson can do to your gun, using the parts that you want. You could then have the sights and finish completed elsewhere.

Love the plans, sounds like a perfect scheme and present!

[theJanitor]

My last build with Jim Garthwaite, I supplied a few critical parts. They were a Vickers ignition kit, and a King's safety. Both items are no longer available and there was no way for him to source them. The thing is, he knew what I was going for, and was accommodating enough to give them a shot, BUT we also agreed that if they weren't up to his standards or liking, we'd nix their use.

I wholeheartedly agree with JTQ and farscott and their above comments. Your plan can be made to work, but it will take real effort and mutual understanding to do so. To me it's not worth it, for off-the-shelf parts that the builder can get on his own.

[Crash41984]

Are you referring to Evolution Armory for your build?

I am. I’ve spoken with them on the phone before and their work appears outstanding. The gent I spoke with seemed crazy knowledgeable and was real polite too. I decided during that call I’d be going with them when it was time. That and their wait time was months and not years, granted that was a year ago now.

I’ve only been looking at parts that I know they use regularly.

[Crash41984]

My last build with Jim Garthwaite, I supplied a few critical parts. They were a Vickers ignition kit, and a King's safety. Both items are no longer available and there was no way for him to source them. The thing is, he knew what I was going for, and was accommodating enough to give them a shot, BUT we also agreed that if they weren't up to his standards or liking, we'd nix their use.

I wholeheartedly agree with JTQ and farscott and their above comments. Your plan can be made to work, but it will take real effort and mutual understanding to do so. To me it's not worth it, for off-the-shelf parts that the builder can get on his own.

I wholeheartedly understand that and I wish I could squirrel away the extra cash to have the whole project handled at once. However, my wife will scrutinize this less if I can break the total cost down a bit over a period of time. She is super understanding when it comes to my shooting affliction, but she has limits that I’m routinely testing. ;)

[RevolverRob]

You may consider calling MARS. They do a package on the XSE that is sweet and not particularly expensive overall - http://www.marsguns.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=9_45&products_id=211

[banzaijohn]

You may consider calling MARS. They do a package on the XSE that is sweet and not particularly expensive overall - http://www.marsguns.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=9_45&products_id=211

Funny you should mention that, I was going to suggest he just sell his rail gun and buy this (that's a smokin' deal!):

https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?211546-MARS-Armament-Colt-Rail-Gun-w-mags-holster-grips

[theJanitor]

You may consider calling MARS. They do a package on the XSE that is sweet and not particularly expensive overall - http://www.marsguns.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=9_45&products_id=211

No. I have a provisional spot next year with Steve. I don't need any more people messing things up

[theJanitor]

I am.



Dave at Evolution is doing outstanding work, And I know there are EA builds in the holsters of a couple PF'ers

[RevolverRob]

No. I have a provisional spot next year with Steve. I don't need any more people messing things up

Next year, you say?

Perfect, I was thinking of buying a Defender and sending it to MARS for work. I could probably be persuaded to wait a bit for that one...but like all good things...it's gonna cost ya. ;) :eek:

[theJanitor]

Next year, you say?

Perfect, I was thinking of buying a Defender and sending it to MARS for work. I could probably be persuaded to wait a bit for that one...but like all good things...it's gonna cost ya. ;) :eek:


HAHA! This one will likely push the boundaries of what parts a smith will accept from the customer. I've been accumulating hard to find parts for several years, waiting for the time to build something. We'll see if Steve will delete my phone number :cool:

[Poconnor]

When the colt combat unit rail gun came out I traded my stock colt rail gun in and avoided the whole gunsmith wait.

[41magfan]

I am. I’ve spoken with them on the phone before and their work appears outstanding. The gent I spoke with seemed crazy knowledgeable and was real polite too. I decided during that call I’d be going with them when it was time. That and their wait time was months and not years, granted that was a year ago now.

I’ve only been looking at parts that I know they use regularly.

The reason I asked;

I crunched a few numbers (based on their prices and your wants) and it totaled over $2k and you still won't have a pistol with a fitted slide/frame and barrel. The used market is pretty rich with some very nice (new or like new) 1911's and the same outlay of cash will buy you a LOT more gun ..... without a wait.

[Robinson]

My Rail Gun is pretty much good to go as is, but it's a newer generation. I think Evolution Armory is a good choice, they seem willing to listen to customer input and have a reputation for quality work at a fair price. Plus they know Colts.

Colt's MIM parts are mostly very good, so swapping them out would be a matter of preference not necessity. I do agree that the ambi safeties they used on the XSE guns weren't the best. My Special Combat Governments have Novak safeties which are better parts.

I'd be tempted to have Evolution swap out the sights, install a better ambi safety, and do 25 LPI checkering on the front strap. Possibly have a S&A mag well installed and ask them to bevel it a bit on the outside edges to make it less angular. That should match the 25 LPI checkering just fine. Slide to frame fit doesn't affect accuracy much, some people just prefer a tight fit because it feels more like quality than a loose fit. My Rail Gun has a very good slide to frame fit but probably doesn't shoot any better than yours.

It boils down to either having Evolution just correct the things about your gun that are lacking, or paying more and having them take the gun up to the next level. It sounds like you want the latter so go for it.

[Crash41984]

The reason I asked;

I crunched a few numbers (based on their prices and your wants) and it totaled over $2k and you still won't have a pistol with a fitted slide/frame and barrel. The used market is pretty rich with some very nice (new or like new) 1911's and the same outlay of cash will buy you a LOT more gun ..... without a wait.

Yeah, I know. It’s expensive for sure, and I’m sure that I could get way more gun checking out the used market and prowling the classifieds on addicts or something. This school of thought is how I wound up with the Specialist I bought last year. I bought that DW in lieu of sending the Colt to a smith. It’s a beautiful pistol without a doubt, but still left me longing for something truly my own. My thought was to put together a pile of top end parts over a longer period, and pay for the labor to have everything installed, as well as the other services I mentioned in the OP. I’m thinking I could bring that $2k+ down to my target budget if I stretched it out that way. I wasn’t including those parts I intend to gather in the budget. I may be way off base here too, I’ve never sent a gun in for custom services.

[theJanitor]

Crash41984 It's not a bad plan. You just need to find the smith that will accommodate you, and your ideas. The right smith is out there for you. Good luck!

p.s. if you do start to buy parts before finding the smith, stay away from Ed Brown parts. I've seen too many that were not suitable for use. Stick with the heavy hitters (wilson, EGW, etc). And if you're already narrowing down the smith list, and he has his OWN line of products, assume he wants to use his own stuff.

[Guerrero]

Isn't anyone going to make a "Well, *I'm* building a phased plasma rifle in the 40-watt range" joke?

[theJanitor]

Isn't anyone going to make a "Well, *I'm* building a phased plasma rifle in the 40-watt range" joke?

Building the perfect 1911 is harder to do.

Anyway if I were to build one, it would be a 45 watt Plasma rifle

[Wondering Beard]

Isn't anyone going to make a "Well, *I'm* building a phased plasma rifle in the 40-watt range" joke?

Because, as the title of the thread says: it's a rail gun (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Railgun). ;-)

[Guerrero]

Because, as the title of the thread says: it's a rail gun (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Railgun). ;-)

Touché

[Crash41984]

Isn't anyone going to make a "Well, *I'm* building a phased plasma rifle in the 40-watt range" joke?

Longslide, laser sighting.