Beginning Reloading Powder Suggestions -

[RevolverRob]

I'm finally going to get into reloading after all these years. It'll be another 4-6 months before I pick up a press, but with gun sales rates going up, I'm seeing panic buying on the horizon in the near future. I want to go ahead and start ordering powder and primers.

I'll be reloading in bulk:

9x19
.45 ACP
.38 Special

Sparingly:

.357 Mag

I know I'll want to experiment with a few different pistol powders - so I figured to order a pound of each to try - Sitting in my Brownells cart I have:

Unique
Bullseye
HP38
TiteGroup
Trail Boss
N320

___

Am I on the right track? Is there a powder I absolutely should try? And any (including any of the above) I should absolutely avoid until I have a bit more practice reloading?

[john c]

Rob, of the powders on your list, HP38 is all you need. It will produce good loads for each of these calibers, though not top velocities for .357.

Start with that one, first, and then see if you want a faster powder for very light loads, or a slower powder for hot magnum loads.

Trail boss is only appropriate for lighter .38 spl or cowboy .357 in the calibers you’re reloading.

Titegroup overlaps HP38 to a large extent. There’s no need to duplicate. It very high density, so there’s more risk of double charging.

Bullseye and Unique are great powders, and versatile, but older technology and harder to meter well. They’re dirtier than newer powders. On the plus side, there are many, many established great loads with these powders, and a ton of data that wouldn’t be developed today. HP38 does everything Bullseye will do in a pistol, and most of what Unique will do.

N320 is an excellent powder, but again, a duplicate of HP38 that costs more. It’s very clean, and meters great.

In your shoes, I’d get a 4 or 8 pounder of HP38 and get shooting.


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[gringop]

I've settled on HP38. Here's what I load with it.

380
38sp normal and +p
38-40
9mm light and normal loads
40 light loads
45ACP

For heavier stuff like 10mm and 45 Colt I use Blue Dot and Universal for full power 40, but HP38 seems the most versatile for most pistol loads.

Gringop

[mtnbkr]

Concur with John C. Of what you listed, HP38 is a safe and flexible choice.

I have been a reloader for 20 years. From your list of cartridges and powder, I've reloaded 38special and 357mag with Bullseye, HP38, Unique, Trail Boss. I like Trail Boss, but more in rifle (lots of fun in 308Win) and large handgun (ie 44special/mag, 45Colt, etc). I never liked it much in 38 or 357. In those two cartridges, I could be happy with only Unique (I have about 5lbs on hand), but I don't know how well it works in 9mm or 45ACP. Being a fairly large flake, it can be a bit tedious to meter, but it's oh so flexible (10gr Unique is kind of the standard cast bullet starting point for a huge number of cartridges, including many rifles).

For non-rifle use, I have in my stash:
Bullseye
HP38
Unique
2400
H110
Trail Boss

I use Unique the most, with Trail Boss a close second.

Chris

[Moylan]

I love Unique. One neat thing about Unique is that it's a great reduced load rifle powder! I use it for my cast bullet loads in my 30-06.

It's also good for shotgun loads, which I believe is actually its primary purpose. But I don't reload for shotgun so I can't comment on that side of things.

[deputyG23]

I have had good results with Alliant BE-86 in 9mm, .38 special, .40, and .45. Produces service load velocity and energy with less pressure than some other choices available. Haven't tried .357 yet.

[JohnO]

One of the nice things about using Unique in .45 ACP is case volume. A double charge is easy to spot. Typical Unique loads are in the neighborhood of 6.0 grains. A double charge will fill the case almost to the rim and sticks out like a sore thumb. The likelihood of not noticing this and placing a bullet on a double charged case is minimal. Some other powders at their specified loads do not occupy anywhere near the volume and a double charge is not as apparent.

I will drop two loads of Unique in the same case just to witness what a double charge looks like. I usually do this when starting each loading session. I'm running my press and checking for proper powder measure drop and consistency. Visually reminding myself what a problem looks like is a safety measure I practice.

One of the practices I use came from a conversation with Brian Enos. He told me not to go crazy trying to adjust the powder measure by checking individual drops. Brian said drop 4 loads and if your average is the amount you want for each load and you can repeat this you are good to go. For example: Your required load in 6.0 grains, drop 4 loads and if your scale measures 24 grains and this is repeatable you are good. I've adjusted my powder measure like that for years.

[Jim Watson]

I am also a HP38 (W231) loader for non-Magnums.
I use Bullseye for .45 Midrange and could use it for the others except I have so much data with HP38.
Titrgroup, Unique and N320 didn't show me anything special, nor did several others.
Trail Boss good in .44-40.

Been a while since I loaded any Magnums. My .44 is more accurate with 4227, the .357 got good old 2400.
If I were experimenting for speed, I'd try N110.

[ACP230]

I started with Bullseye in 1976. Unique came along shortly afterward and I still
use a lot of it. Only use other powders, usually H110 for Magnum pistol loads.

Bullseye and Unique are still good places to start.

[Clusterfrack]

Titegroup is a very versatile and economical powder. I keep a decent amount around in case there's another component drought. But it's not my first choice--and definitely not a good choice for beginning reloaders. Especially in .45 or other large cases because of the risk of a double charge. Fuck, you can even put a triple charge of TG in a .45 case.

VV N320 is the best 9mm minor powder in existence, but you pay double for it. It meters well, is clean, not smokey, and shoots well. Importantly, it is also temperature insensitive.

HP38 is temperature sensitive (https://forums.brianenos.com/topic/230930-hp-38-temperature-sensitivity/), so I don't use it. For casual use, it's fine.

Since powder isn't a huge component cost, I recommend n320 unless you're really low budget.

If you can afford a press with an extra station for a powder check die (e.g. Dillon 650/750), you can add an RCBS lockout die and safely use Titegroup.

[ranger]

HP38 or W231 or - if you are willing to pay more - N320. When powder gets rare - you can use shotgun powders for pistol. I am a big fan of WSF for 9mm. Primers are they key.

[mmc45414]

It has been mentioned but not blurted right out, HP-38 and Win 231 are supposed to be the same thing and the data on the Hodgdon site is identical. This may increase your odds of a steady supply.

I have been using Clays, my main motivation is that I use it for 12g so I have a supply around (8 pounds is a lotta pistol powder, it is sorta the reorder point for shotguns). It is a very popular shotgun powder, so maybe that also creates market demand and production levels. OTOH shotgunners use a shitload so there is demand if supplies are low. It is also inexpensive. Others here are vastly more knowledgeable than I am (I have been doing this for 45 years, but not at the same level as others here) so somebody might have a good reason why it is not as good as I think it is.

Also, Midway is a fine company and I like them a great deal, but you may want to price shop Powder Valley, they have 8 pounds of my Clays for $139. Also once when I tried to order powder from Midway they wanted an extra fee for drop shipping, and that just seemed like a goofy concept to charge extra for (they said they cannot inventory powder at their facility) and I ordered from Powder Valley.

[BehindBlueI's]

I like CFE-Pistol for smaller handgun cartridges, pretty much any common auto-loader. I used Winchester Super Target for .45 with really good results but ran out during The Great Powder Shortage and branched out a bit.

It's not great for large case volume cartridges like .38/.35 (unless you're loading wadcutters, it's fine for that). Too much free space left over and it becomes position sensitive.

For no particular reason I like the Accurate line of powders for most revolver rounds. Unique isn't the easiest to meter but works well for many loads. H110 is my go to for holy-shit-that's-a-magnum loads or Ruger Only loads. I'm rapidly tiring of that sort of thing, though.

[mmc45414]

H110 is my go to for holy-shit-that's-a-magnum loads or Ruger Only loads.
I will probably buy in to some more to have it around and for 300BO. And if I have the powder, maybe I will buy a .410, because that is the way my lizard brain works on this stuff...

[BehindBlueI's]

I will probably buy in to some more to have it around and for 300BO. And if I have the powder, maybe I will buy a .410, because that is the way my lizard brain works on this stuff...

The Wheels of Justification...;)

[CCT125US]

I use Unique for all the positive reasons listed.

A point of caution, powder selection / choice can be akin to the 9 / 45 debate, best holster, best carry ammo, best gun for CCW.....

Pick one that will cover desired calibers and stock up. Powder is one of the many variables. Brass mfg, bullet profile / type / weight / powder coated / lead ( hardness) / jacketed / enclosed base / exposed base / etc..... are enough variables to tweak and find the perfect load.

[BN]

I started reloading during the 1970's using mostly Bullseye and Unique. I still use Bullseye for .38 Special and .45 ACP. I use Titegroup for 9mm now. In the past it was said that you could load almost any caliber with Unique. It's pretty dirty though.

I get my powder and primers from Powder Valley.

[Whirlwind06]

Using BE-86 and titegroup now. Started with unique and bullseye. Unique in 9mm is pretty wild literally fills the case and you are compressing the powder.

During one of the shortages I would go to my local place with my Lee reloading manual and look up powders that they had. I have some odd balls from that.

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[LittleLebowski]

You guys are doing a great job advising him, thank you.

[mmc45414]

The Wheels of Justification...;)
I am the guy who bought a Ruger American and a PSA pistol in 300BO and a set of dies and a cutoff saw with a jig and a second 650, pretty much just because I ruined some 223 casings, so buying a .410 and a loader cause I have some gunpowder is just like a two foot putt...

[olstyn]

I learned on Unique, and it will produce acceptable loads in all of the calibers the OP mentioned, but the +/- 0.2-0.3 grain metering that the big flakes cause means it's harder to get consistent velocities than with other powders, at least when loading on a progressive press.

As clusterfrack mentioned, N320 is the hotness for ~130 PF 9mm. I've been extremely happily using it exclusively for several years. It meters well, produces single-digit velocity standard deviation, and is clean enough that I really only bother to clean guns every 1500-2500 rounds or so, and then only because I start to feel guilty. I've also tried CFE Pistol, and it works fine, but produces a bit more recoil impulse for any given velocity than N320, presumably due to the slower burn rate/higher charge weight. I did recently pick up a pound of Alliant Sport Pistol to try, since people on the Enos forum keep saying that it's performance equivalent to N320 for half the price, and I want to see for myself, but it's going to be a while before I find out, because I've still got a solid supply of loaded rounds of N320 and a powder measure full of N320 that will need to be emptied first.

[mmc45414]

For the cartridges you are focused on a single pound is gonna load between 1200-1500 cartridges. So it is not like picking out china patterns, just get a pound of something, soon enough it will be gone and you can decide.

And at this point your personality is probably inclined to look at the raft of options as a good thing, eventually you will probably be more inclined to just have a few.

[Stumpnav]

At first, I would suggest picking one cartridge, one powder, one bullet, one primer...spend some time perfecting you technique and knowledge on loading.
I would suggest starting with the 38 Special and a 158 grain bullet. For powder, I would use HP38...it will work for the 38 and the rest of you cartridges to start with. Once you get the hang of things, you can venture into other powders.
I know we are in the world of electronic everything, but if you can find a good old fashioned real live Reloading Manual in book form it would be a good reference to have.

[RevolverRob]

Awesome guys!

I think I’ll get a pound of Unique and a pound of N320. I didn’t mind spending a little more for the 320 since it seems folks report across the board that it meters really well.

I have reloading manuals for .38 Special and .45 ACP. But want to pick up a big book for reference.

For now, I’ll focus on .45 since that is what I am shooting more of.

Now to pick out a press. Since I’m limited on space right now, I’m going to opt for a single stage to give myself utility (I also have a couple of rifles I might eventually load for), without hammering my budget.

I’ve loaded .38 Special before using a good old Lee Loader, so I learned early on to batch things to save time and setup. I prefer that because it allows my OCD to have me check and double check everything.

[Jim Watson]

Let us know if you can tell a difference in the brand of powder with loads at the same velocity.
I can't, but I read Princess and the Pea stories all the time.

[olstyn]

Let us know if you can tell a difference in the brand of powder with loads at the same velocity.
I can't, but I read Princess and the Pea stories all the time.

I'm surprised to hear you say that you can't tell the difference, but I imagine a lot of the perceived difference depends on which powders you're comparing, and in what size/weight of gun.

N320 vs Titegroup in a big, heavy gun? Probably the only difference you'd notice is that Titegroup is hot and dirty vs. N320 being [relatively] cool and clean.

N320 vs Unique (or something even slower) in a small, light gun? Noticeable difference in perceived recoil, at least for me.

[mtnbkr]

Let us know if you can tell a difference in the brand of powder with loads at the same velocity.
I can't, but I read Princess and the Pea stories all the time.

I've not tested it side by side, but if you accept that the weight of the powder can contribute to felt recoil (as an additive effect to the weight of the bullet, something I've seen claimed before), then two loads with identical velocity could "feel" different if one was with a fast powder (less powder weight) and the other was with a slower powder (more weight).

In mag handgun loads, there is a qualitative difference in feel between faster powders like Unique or 2400 compared to H110, with the latter being blastier and flashier. However, I haven't noticed a difference in felt recoil.

Chris

[LittleLebowski]

I'm surprised to hear you say that you can't tell the difference, but I imagine a lot of the perceived difference depends on which powders you're comparing, and in what size/weight of gun.

N320 vs Titegroup in a big, heavy gun? Probably the only difference you'd notice is that Titegroup is hot and dirty vs. N320 being [relatively] cool and clean.

N320 vs Unique (or something even slower) in a small, light gun? Noticeable difference in perceived recoil, at least for me.

Titegroup is smoky, smelly, and dirty. I love it (because of the price, not recommended for a beginning reloader).

[mtnbkr]

Now to pick out a press. Since I’m limited on space right now, I’m going to opt for a single stage to give myself utility (I also have a couple of rifles I might eventually load for), without hammering my budget.


When I got started reloading, I was doing it in a 1br apartment with my Lee turret press connected to a short board that I c-clamped to my desk. That worked for a couple years until I bought a house and built a proper work bench. You can run a turret press like a single stage or you can run it like a proper turret if you want speed. Point is, I don't see a benefit in the hair shirt of a single stage unless your needs can only be met by one (overly large cartridge or major case forming activities).

If you are truly tight on space, the Lee hand press works. I have one, but mainly use it for flaring case mouths for rifle cast bullet loads. I haven't used it for legit loading in over a decade. That said, maybe I should take it to the range and do some on-site load development...

Chris

[Jim Watson]

I started reloading with the W.H. English Pak Tool, a small compound leverage hand tool, and a set of Lee dippers.
I soon graduated to a Rockchucker on a pedestal mount with measure, scale, and components on a card table. When not in use, I draped a throw over the press, folded the table, and put the accessories in a cabinet. You can squeeze a pretty good outfit into a corner.

[BehindBlueI's]

I...if you accept that the weight of the powder can contribute to felt recoil (as an additive effect to the weight of the bullet, something I've seen claimed before)

Equal and opposite reaction dictates that the gasses and unburned powder accelerating forward are going to cause the gun to accelerate backward.

Handy calculator here: http://www.shooterscalculator.com/recoil-calculator.php

Of course "felt recoil" is going to be a combination of factors, but there's no doubt powder weight affects recoil.

[spinmove_]

So, having just scooped myself a 550C and have 0 experience reloading, I’ve got a couple of calibers I want to start reloading for en masse. I carry a J-frame at least 5 days a week (thanks, employer), but I also shoot Production and need more practice ammo. In the J-frame I carry Federal GMMWCs.

I was previously told that Titegroup was the way to go, but you guys are saying it’s not great for beginners. It sounds like it’s really hard to go wrong with HP-38 and N320. Given that, according to my calculations, powder goes a long way so cost isn’t going to kill me too much there. Would it be a good idea to stock N320 for 9mm to replicate factory strength FMJ loads and HP-38 for .38 Special to replicate 148gr wadcutter loads for practice? Or would it be better to consolidate on one of these two powders for both until I really get the hang of things?

For reference, I’m currently shooting at least 400 rounds of 9mm a month and 50 rounds of .38 Special a month. I want to bump both of those numbers up (because they’re rookie numbers).


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[mtnbkr]

So, having just scooped myself a 550C and have 0 experience reloading, I’ve got a couple of calibers I want to start reloading for en masse. I carry a J-frame at least 5 days a week (thanks, employer), but I also shoot Production and need more practice ammo. In the J-frame I carry Federal GMMWCs.

I was previously told that Titegroup was the way to go, but you guys are saying it’s not great for beginners. It sounds like it’s really hard to go wrong with HP-38 and N320. Given that, according to my calculations, powder goes a long way so cost isn’t going to kill me too much there. Would it be a good idea to stock N320 for 9mm to replicate factory strength FMJ loads and HP-38 for .38 Special to replicate 148gr wadcutter loads for practice? Or would it be better to consolidate on one of these two powders for both until I really get the hang of things?

For reference, I’m currently shooting at least 400 rounds of 9mm a month and 50 rounds of .38 Special a month. I want to bump both of those numbers up (because they’re rookie numbers).


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Buy both powders and Unique. Powder, properly stored, last years, decades even. All three powders will work for both cartridges. You'll use it eventually. :)

Chris

[spinmove_]

Buy both powders and Unique. Powder, properly stored, last years, decades even. All three powders will work for both cartridges. You'll use it eventually. :)

Chris

So basically what I’m hearing is “buy the biggest tub of both you can find and stick to those until you run out. By then you’ll have a really good idea of what you’re doing and will probably be buying both again later since I’ll most likely have worked up a good load for both and consistency is king.”


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[mmc45414]

So, having just scooped myself a 550C and have 0 experience reloading
I was previously told that Titegroup was the way to go, but you guys are saying it’s not great for beginners.
It sounds like it’s really hard to go wrong with HP-38 and N320.
Or would it be better to consolidate on one of these two powders for both until I really get the hang of things?
As mentioned, it really doesn't matter for a while. But IMO all of the reasons to get really specific on matching a powder to a cartridge are down the road for ya. I would simplify with something, probably HP-38/W231, and get in the groove before you get too much extra stuff to worry about. Having only one powder eliminates the potential for confusing the two. On that topic a tip I have always adhered to is when you are loading only keep ONE powder on the bench, obviously having only ONE powder in the shop would be extra safe. If you pour the wrong stuff in to refill the powder measure and realize it, now you have polluted the whole measure full of powder and have to discard it all. If you don't realize it then the consequences can be a BFD. If you load a bunch of rounds and then realize you have made a mistake then you got a bunch of bullets to pull to get at the powder you are probably gonna need to burn up on the BBQ grill.

I think when you are on square one it makes sense to KISS. Not that I mean to imply that anybody here is "S", but the differences in these powders are quite subtle, until you start loading specialized stuff like hot 357 or hot 44 or hot 10mm. Just get a generic powder like HP-38/231 (or Unique, or one of many others) and get some initial experience.

And let me reiterate, this is just an opinion.

ETA:

So basically what I’m hearing is “buy the biggest tub of both you can find and stick to those until you run out. By then you’ll have a really good idea of what you’re doing and will probably be buying both again later since I’ll most likely have worked up a good load for both and consistency is king.”
Remember that there are 7000 grains in a single pound. The load for HP-38 for a 148g wadcutter is 3.5g-4g, so like 1800 rounds out of ONE pound of powder. I say buy a little bit of something and try it and be sure you like it.
EATA:
42443

[mtnbkr]

So basically what I’m hearing is “buy the biggest tub of both you can find and stick to those until you run out. By then you’ll have a really good idea of what you’re doing and will probably be buying both again later since I’ll most likely have worked up a good load for both and consistency is king.”


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Yup. Though, you'll get a 1000-1500 rounds out of each pound, so you can even go with the small jugs and not run out anytime soon.

Chris

[Whirlwind06]

I agree with getting some 1 pound bottles of powder to see what you like.

But during the last crazy times I struggled to find powder. I'm in the opinion now that I would rather have couple 8 pound jugs of general purpose powders, and primers on hand. Maybe it won't be the best powder for what I'm doing. But at least it something.

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[Stumpnav]

The key is to start. If you're not careful, you can get paralysis by analysis quite easily.
I also like the idea of starting with a single stage. I loaded a lot of 45 on a Rock Chucker before I moved on to the Dillon 550. I still load the vast majority of my rifle ammo on the RC.
My biggest gripe with the 550 is changing primer size. I hate it so much I have two 550s. One for large primers and one for small primers.

[Spartan1980]

Awesome guys!

I think I’ll get a pound of Unique and a pound of N320. I didn’t mind spending a little more for the 320 since it seems folks report across the board that it meters really well.

I have reloading manuals for .38 Special and .45 ACP. But want to pick up a big book for reference.

For now, I’ll focus on .45 since that is what I am shooting more of.

Now to pick out a press. Since I’m limited on space right now, I’m going to opt for a single stage to give myself utility (I also have a couple of rifles I might eventually load for), without hammering my budget.

I’ve loaded .38 Special before using a good old Lee Loader, so I learned early on to batch things to save time and setup. I prefer that because it allows my OCD to have me check and double check everything.

Pretty good plan. I would echo BE86 and would go that route over Unique. It has a practically identical burn rate and can load from .25ACP to .44Mag. It's also flash suppressed. It shares chemistry with Power Pistol and Bullseye, both of which are excellent. I think one could get by with that single powder for 99% of ALL handgun use. That's the good thing about Unique, it's just so versatile but I think BE86 is a lot cleaner burning and basically replaces Unique in my mind.

N320 with a jacketed (non exposed base) or a plated bullet will let you shoot thousands before needing to clean. It's great for gamer loads. But dat price doh....

Both of those will get you a long way down the road.

Edit to add: Try to find a used turret press. You won't regret it. I have a Redding T7 and got it after 20 years of loading on a rock chucker. I'm still kicking myself in the ass. Even if it's a Lee, check into a turret.

[Jamie]

There is some excellent advice in this thread!

I've been handloading since 1986. I started on a Lee Single stage (I still use it as it simply won't wear out or so it seems) and a Dillon 550 since '89.

I appreciate the words of caution on some of the finer powders such as TG and W 231. You really have to be cautious and keep a very close eye on your powder level, especially in larger cases like 45 acp.
I've handloaded well over 50K of 45 using W231 back in the late 90's and did what others are cautioning about and double charged a 230 gr fmj 45 acp. My go to load was 5.7 grs W231 and I charged 11.4 into the case. All it took was a second's distraction... It quite well blew up my Glock 21 during a match, bulging the barrel and slide, splitting the grip frame, and blew all the plastic off the trigger leaving a metal nub. I wasn't injured, got the shot, and Glock replaced the gun even though I told them I was using handloads. I wasn't injured and consider myself incredibly fortunate.

Unique was my first powder and it was suggested to me because of it's wide range of uses and bulkiness. I still use it for the majority of my 9mm on my Dillon because it's nearly impossible to double change without it spilling over. While it can be a bit messy, it's simply a great old powder. I use and/or have on hand pretty much every powder mentioned as they all have their particular uses.

I've also found that the powder company reps and tech assist folks to be incredible and often very responsive and helpful resources. During the last powder shortage shortage a rep from Alliant, via e-mail, helped me develop several loads using powder such as Green Dot for 130 gr PC 9mm we made. Good folks.

I haven't seen it mentioned yet, but as finances allow you might consider a Chronograph. I consider one an absolute necessity (for me, at this point in what I do). I handloaded a long time without one, but it's a standard part of load development in what I do now and I can't recommend one enough.
I use a Competition Electronics ProChrono and find it a value at around $120.00. (Midwayusa)

Glad you are getting into the arena. On some levels I enjoy handloading almost as much as shooting, not quite, but almost. :)

[olstyn]

I haven't seen it mentioned yet, but as finances allow you might consider a Chronograph. I consider one an absolute necessity (for me, at this point in what I do). I handloaded a long time without one, but it's a standard part of load development in what I do now and I can't recommend one enough.
I use a Competition Electronics ProChrono and find it a value at around $120.00. (Midwayusa)

Good call, and the rest of us were remiss not to have mentioned it.

[Hambo]

So basically what I’m hearing is “buy the biggest tub of both you can find and stick to those until you run out. By then you’ll have a really good idea of what you’re doing and will probably be buying both again later since I’ll most likely have worked up a good load for both and consistency is king.”

Unless your standards are as low as mine, I'd start with a pound of powder. Otherwise you're married to it for thousands of rounds. That said, I've found that just about any powder will produce acceptable velocity/accuracy for me. I'm using CSB-1 now, but my source for it no longer has any, so I'll switch to something else when it runs out.

[BN]

I haven't seen it mentioned yet, but as finances allow you might consider a Chronograph. I consider one an absolute necessity
I use a Competition Electronics ProChrono and find it a value at around $120.00. (Midwayusa)

I've had a Competition Electronics chronograph since 1988. A couple of years ago it started giving me funky readings. I contacted Competition Electronics and they don't repair such old units, but they gave me a really good deal on a new one. :) I got the one with the digital link to my I-Phone. I have a record of all my chrono data on my phone. Pretty cool. :)

[camsdaddy]

I started loading in 2014. I have to order powder online as there is no where close that sells supplies. My initial order included Tightgroup and Bullseye. I ordered TG for 9mm and BE for 38. I have never tried anything else. I wonder if I am missing out on something.

[mtnbkr]

I started loading in 2014. I have to order powder online as there is no where close that sells supplies. My initial order included Tightgroup and Bullseye. I ordered TG for 9mm and BE for 38. I have never tried anything else. I wonder if I am missing out on something.

What do you load for? You may not be missing out on anything at all. For example, if I was just loading 38special, I could be content with nothing but Bullseye for the rest of my life.

Chris

[camsdaddy]

What do you load for? You may not be missing out on anything at all. For example, if I was just loading 38special, I could be content with nothing but Bullseye for the rest of my life.

Chris
I only load 9mm and 38.

[JohnO]

I'm not certain if anyone one brought this up yet but since I see folks recommending multiple powders a word of caution. Always know with absolute certainty what powder you are loading with! Do not ever mistakenly use the wrong powder, very bad things happen.

A good friend of mine was at my club shooting. A buddy of his arrived and had with him a new 45/70 rifle. My friend commented on the rifle and his friend asked him if he wanted to try it. He did. The rifle blew up like a grenade and partially de-gloved the shooters support hand, sent shrapnel into his neck, face and upper arm. A number of years later his hand has some scarring but it about 90% recovered.

What happened. The owner of the 45/70, a reloader mistakenly used a pistol powder which had a burn rate WAY TOO FAST for a rifle. Attention to detail is a Must!

Side note: The incident made the local news. Reported as, "man shot at local range."

[mtnbkr]

I only load 9mm and 38.
That's right. You said that in your post.

In that case, I'd stick with what you have. I doubt you'll gain much by changing powders unless you're trying to do something unusual for the cartridge.

Chris

[BehindBlueI's]

I'm not certain if anyone one brought this up yet but since I see folks recommending multiple powders a word of caution. Always know with absolute certainty what powder you are loading with!

My system for this is to leave the power container next to the hopper, even if empty. All powders not being used are stored on shelves.

[mmc45414]

My system for this is to leave the power container next to the hopper, even if empty. All powders not being used are stored on shelves.And in some cases I have been marking them.
This is the 20g press, and it is just going to do one thing with one powder. The 12g press next to it uses Clays instead of International, not that that could be conducive to a screw up, though in that case it would not likely cause a catastrophic problem.https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190913/73899debfdf72f9803ecaca5fbcd76db.jpg

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[john c]

So basically what I’m hearing is “buy the biggest tub of both you can find and stick to those until you run out. By then you’ll have a really good idea of what you’re doing and will probably be buying both again later since I’ll most likely have worked up a good load for both and consistency is king.”


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This is a do-as-I-say and not a do-as-I-do statement. Buy a large bottle of one type of well known, established powder with a lot of load data. A powder suitable for .38 spl and 9mm will be relatively fast, but can load up to .44 mag, but not with blistering speeds. The get a well known good bullet, and work up some good loads. You’ll waste more money buying a bunch of bullets and powders looking for nirvana. Have a bunch of left over bullets and powders is a pain. Plus it takes a LOT of time to load up test loads and shoot them.

So one good powder with one good bullet. Try 3-4 known accuracy loads, and maybe a ladder test, and get shooting. You are unlikely to see any difference between N310 and Clays loaded in .45 Acp with known bullseye accuracy loads. N310 is cleaner, but more expensive. But in shooting, they’ll group a good bullet into 3 inches at 50 yards.

Get shooting and after 5-10 years, you’ll know what you like and what works for you.


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[Jamie]

My system for this is to leave the power container next to the hopper, even if empty. All powders not being used are stored on shelves.

I pretty much do the same, except for my Unique as it's in 8# containers (but it's sitting out within my visual field). I also label my powder dispensers. All powders not in use are locked up in a cabinet.

(Excuse the clutter.This pic is a couple of years old and I was loading 5.56 on the old Lee press)... I need a bigger space!

42500

[spinmove_]

This is a do-as-I-say and not a do-as-I-do statement. Buy a large bottle of one type of well known, established powder with a lot of load data. A powder suitable for .38 spl and 9mm will be relatively fast, but can load up to .44 mag, but not with blistering speeds. The get a well known good bullet, and work up some good loads. You’ll waste more money buying a bunch of bullets and powders looking for nirvana. Have a bunch of left over bullets and powders is a pain. Plus it takes a LOT of time to load up test loads and shoot them.

So one good powder with one good bullet. Try 3-4 known accuracy loads, and maybe a ladder test, and get shooting. You are unlikely to see any difference between N310 and Clays loaded in .45 Acp with known bullseye accuracy loads. N310 is cleaner, but more expensive. But in shooting, they’ll group a good bullet into 3 inches at 50 yards.

Get shooting and after 5-10 years, you’ll know what you like and what works for you.


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Good bullets can’t be that hard to find. Pick a weight and manufacturer. Powder on the other hand is what I’m trying to determine.

Are you saying N320 is good for both 9mm and .38 Special? Or should I be going for HP-38? A pound or two of one or the other?


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[mtnbkr]

Good bullets can’t be that hard to find. Pick a weight and manufacturer. Powder on the other hand is what I’m trying to determine.

Are you saying N320 is good for both 9mm and .38 Special? Or should I be going for HP-38? A pound or two of one or the other?


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Power Pistol may also be a good choice. Suitable for both calibers, fine grained, so it meters well, and clean burning. Burn rate is close to Unique. I burned a pound of it in 357mag.

Chris

[john c]

Good bullets can’t be that hard to find. Pick a weight and manufacturer. Powder on the other hand is what I’m trying to determine.

Are you saying N320 is good for both 9mm and .38 Special? Or should I be going for HP-38? A pound or two of one or the other?


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From your questions, all of which are very good, it appears that you may think that powders are "narrower" in scope than they are. Obviously, some powders are better in certain applications than others, and there's a wide gap between rifle and pistol powders. But powders in the same general range overlap one another to a huge degree. N320 and HP38 are very similar powders. HP38 is a tad faster, but N320 is not far behind. Check out the Vihtavuouri burn rate chart (one of the best). With a bunch of caveats, powders that burn with similar speeds are roughly equivalent and are usable in similar applications.

There is published load data for both .38 spl and 9mm for both N320 and HP38. The burn rates for each powder are in the very good to perfect range for each cartridge.

Looking at the Vihtavuori burn rate chart, you'll see probably 20-30 different powders that would be perfect for both cartridges. The reasons to choose one or the other is very small between them.

Getting back to versatility, there are published load data for both HP38/Win231 and N320 for every cartridge between .380 and .44 magnum. You won't get top velocities in a .44 magnum, but you'll get within 85% of top velocities. So there's little need to get a bunch of different powders for each application.

Load development takes a LOT of time and range trips. If that's your thing, by all means go for it. If you want to shoot more, research some good loads and bullets and load them up. Maybe do a little bit of ladder testing in 3% increments up and down from the known accuracy load to see if your gun is a little off from others. In an autoloading pistol, there are so many other factors at play that the known good load will likely be the best.

Another point I want to make it that good bullets are probably 70% of the accuracy equation. Powder is maybe 10%. Finding good bullets is a real issue with cast bullets, but now with cheaper FMJs and JHPs this is less of an issue. But cast bullets there are probably 5 major variables that determine if a bullets will shoot into a playing card or garbage can lid.

Thus my suggestion to buy a 4 or 8 pound can of a good, available powder with a bunch of known accuracy loads. Get a good bullet. RMR FMJs are pretty good for practical shooting; Hornady XTPs are the best for Bullseye accuracy. Good cast bullets will shoot 95% as well as XTPs for 1/10 the cost.

Good luck!

[john c]

One more thing: I've loaded Bullseye powder extensively, and a bit less with Unique. Both great powders, but I feel that technology has surpassed these with better metering and cleaner burning. The benefit to these powders is the sheer volume of load data developed over 100 years. The powders are so well understood that I'd have no problem loading either of these in rifle, pistol, or shotgun (with a lot of care rifle). That's not true with newer powders.

A downside to newer powders is that if you work up a good load, but the powder never gets popular, it will be discontinued in a couple of years. You'll need to develop new load data. So popular powders are a better choice.

[Hambo]

Good bullets can’t be that hard to find. Pick a weight and manufacturer. Powder on the other hand is what I’m trying to determine.


You need to read loading data. This is Hodgdon's site, but a manual will work.

http://www.hodgdonreloading.com/

As john c says, there is a lot of overlap. Also, IME there isn't a lot of accuracy difference between one powder and another. In 9mm I load what I can get a deal on, or whatever is available. During one panic I could get Bullseye, so I went retro. Since then I've used Unique (what I could get), ETR7 (CSB1 relabeled), CSB1-M that I bought in bulk, Longshot. I've also switched between plain lead, plated, and coated bullets. For a long time I shot 147/150gr, now I'm back to 115gr.

You can chase components all you want, but the only accuracy problem has been me, not the ammo.

[Clusterfrack]

Good bullets can’t be that hard to find. Pick a weight and manufacturer. Powder on the other hand is what I’m trying to determine.

Are you saying N320 is good for both 9mm and .38 Special? Or should I be going for HP-38?

I have no idea about .38, but I prefer n320 for 9mm.

Bullets:

Avoid bullets with exposed lead bases. Look for TMJ or JHP in jacketed.

I don’t like plated bullets, especially if they are soft lead. Soft bullets can behave unpredictability as you approach max charge weight. Plus, they make barrels dirty and shave lead when you load.

I like Blue Bullets. They are polymer coated. I’ve shot maybe 50k since I switched from SNS, and am very happy with them.

[SecondsCount]

My favorite loads for the calibers that the OP listed-

9mm- 124 Precision Delta 124HP with 5.0 grains of WSF or 3.9 grains N320. I have shot tens of thousands of these.

38 Special- I don't remember the exact load but I liked Hodgdon Clays, 3.5 grains if I remember correctly, behind a 148 grain lead bullet. This is one that you have to be very careful of a double charge. I don't shoot a lot of revolver but I have won a few informal target competitions with that load.

45ACP- 3.9 grains of Hodgdon Clays behind a 200 grain lead semiwadcutter. Very soft shooting and accurate.

Lately I have been testing some 135 Blue bullets with Clays and am like the results. Light recoil, and will cycle my P30, but recoil is pretty soft so it may not be making minor if that is a concern.

[WDR]

Picking a bulky powder that is hard to double charge a case with, is a good idea for a beginner. I started out with Universal Clays in 9mm, and Varget in .223. Sticking with popular powders often gives you more data options to look at. Once you find a combo you like, then you can buy in bulk. Pistol powders generally go a long way per pound. It sucks to have a partially used 8lb jug of a powder you don't particularly care for sitting around.

I use quite a bit of W231 in .38 and .357 (target velocity) loads. 2400 for boomer .357 loads. 4ish grains of WSF and a 147gr bullet is my current go-to 9mm load, and is very accurate for me.

[Hambo]

I don’t like plated bullets, especially if they are soft lead. Soft bullets can behave unpredictability as you approach max charge weight. Plus, they make barrels dirty and shave lead when you load.
.

Plated bullets? I've never had that happen with Xtreme or Berry. It's been more of a problem with powder coated bullets.

[olstyn]

Plated bullets? I've never had that happen with Xtreme or Berry. It's been more of a problem with powder coated bullets.

Never shot Xtreme, but I agree regarding Berry's - I've never had them shave lead or plating. I definitely had to adjust how much I was belling cases (more) when I switched to coated in order to prevent that, though.

Tried Acme, didn't like the profile of their 124 grain 9mm round nose at the time (apparently they've since switched to a profile that's more short/tight chamber friendly, so YMMV), switched to Blue Bullets 125 grain truncated cone @1.100" OAL over 4.0 grains of N320, got satisfactory results, and haven't looked back. (That load chronos ~131 PF for me, and I've been able to hit poppers with it at 50 yards in matches, so I figure accuracy is good enough. Might theoretically be able to tune it to be better than that, but I haven't bothered.)

[BehindBlueI's]

I don’t like plated bullets, especially if they are soft lead. Soft bullets can behave unpredictability as you approach max charge weight. Plus, they make barrels dirty and shave lead when you load.


I've used a lot of Xtreme plated bullets in .38, .357 mag, .45 Auto, and .45 Colt. If you're shaving the plating, bell the brass a bit more, but it's not a problem I've had. I've not noticed them being dirty at all.

[ranger]

I will add I had great results with Bayou coated bullets.

[Clusterfrack]

Plated bullets? I've never had that happen with Xtreme or Berry. It's been more of a problem with powder coated bullets.

I’ve had coated bullets that were soft and did that also. As BBI said you need to bell more with these, but in a high throughput loading session, soft lead still results in some shaved or deformed bullets, which can cause malfunctions.

I don’t see the point of plates bullets now that there are such high quality coated ones. The coating is thicker, more durable, and more lubricious.

[Spartan1980]

One should treat plated bullets like swaged pure lead. Because that's basically what they are with a thin copper plate. Some of the "thick plated" for open or major loads are better, but Extreme ruined me on plated. I get shotgun patterns instead of groups. If you try to push a normal plated bullet like a jacketed, you are going to very disappointed.

[willie]

Older shotgun shooters who reload often have large quantities of shotgun powders like Red Dot, Green Dot, Blue Dot, Herco, Unique, and 2400. 2400 is used for 410 shells. All are useful. I am sitting on a large quantity of these powders, all of which I bought from estates or from shops who bought them. I paid very low prices. Hence, over time others can do the same. Also, many good deals are to be had when buying used presses. I have bought many that were used either not at all or were used sparingly.

When Lee designed the Classic Turret Press, their engineers outdid themselves. Consider one of these in addition to all others. Ditto for the Lee Classic traditional single stage press.

2400 is a slow powder and excels for loading the magnum handgun calibers. Too, it meters well. Because it's a slow powder, heavier charges are used. Therefore, it is almost impossible to double charge a case. Powder would overflow the case. Win 231 and 2400 would satisfy most needs. 231 is on the fast end of the spectrum with 2400 on the slow end. Unique is in the middle. It is highly versatile.

[chances R]

Random thoughts having reloaded shotgun for 50 yrs and switched over to pistol about 7 yrs ago. One must be OCD about recipes. Unique is problematic on consistent drop weights, but have used it a lot starting out. While Clays can be used for some pistol loads, mistakes are somewhat unforgiving. Chronos are helpful, just buy a name brand. My shooting group compared 4 diff. brands including the lab radar and no significant variance. IMO, why load max or near max loads? Simply cost more per round and the hole is the same size on paper, so don't abuse your gun or self. I like Xtreme plated and have had no problems. Got to avoid over crimping though. I think that is where some get into problems. Also like Bayou bullets, just have to add a little more bell to the case, not a big deal. My current go to powder for pistol is BE86. Use to be a commercial powder with characteristics similar to Bullseye. Contains a flash suppressant. Stay safe.

[Borderland]

As others have said, you can load 38 spl, 45 acp and 9x19 with one powder. I use Alliant American Select for all three but there are others that work just as well. HP38 might be one but I have no experience with it. Bullseye is dirty and Unique doesn't meter well.

357 requires something else if you want the 1200 fps velocity it was designed for. You can however down load 357 to 750 fps (cowboy loads) but then it's just 38 velocity so what's the point.

Alliant 2400 is a good 357 high velocity powder. I wouldn't buy too much of it tho because it's uses are limited in handgun cartridges. I purchased 8 lbs of it years ago when I loaded a lot of 30 carbine and 357. I don't load any 357 anymore and very little 30 carbine. I'll probably die with about 4 lbs of it. ;)