HE508T | First impressions and initial range review, with comparison to RMR

[Noisefighters]

Note: this is posted by the official Noisefighters account, but comments are being made by the owner of the company in an unofficial capacity and are not an official endorsement of any product. Noisefighters is not currently affiliated with Holosun nor any other optics company.

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My background: USMC combat vet with 1/6 SSP back in the mid 2000's. I really got into pistols after the military, though. I've been running pistol red dot sights (RDS) since 2011 with the first being the original Leupold Deltapoint with triangle reticle, based off a recommendation from Bowie Tactical Concepts in an issue of Custom Combat Handguns. That RDS was neat, but I didn't think it was durable enough for hard duty use. I have been playing with Sig's ROMEO1 ever since they released the protective steel shroud for it. I have had multiple experiences shooting with Trijicon RMR's but have never personally purchased one due to the small window size, apparent magnification / fisheye effect, and heavy green tint. I have not yet had a chance to try Aimpoint's new ACRO P1 closed-emitter RDS.

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HOLOSUN HE508T (https://amzn.to/2LtJmGD) | BOTTOM LINE UP FRONT:

I believe this titanium-housed, multi-reticle, RMR-mount using, 100,000 hour rated, solar- and battery-powered, relatively inexpensive product may be the best pistol-mounted red dot sight for duty and defense -- but only if it turns out to be as durable as the venerable Trijicon RMR in the long run.

MSRP: $447.05

Street price: ~$349.99 at Midway USA

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First Impressions:

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Headline feature: it appears to be billed as the first titanium-housed pistol RDS. On the surface, it seems like an odd choice, since titanium is about 67% more dense compared to aluminum or magnesium used on competing pistol RDS. However, the tensile and yield strength, stiffness, hardness (throughout the entire structure, not just the surface), and fracture toughness (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fracture_toughness) of a titanium alloy can be significantly higher than an aluminum or magnesium alloy. Titanium also has a much higher natural resistance to the elements, as well, so corrosion should be minimized.

What I think Holosun has done is potentially engineered a way around Trijicon's RMR's patented, superior hood design that absorbs shocks quite well, by instead using a tougher material to accomplish the same goal. It will be interesting to see what Aaron Dynamics (Sage Dynamics) finds out if he decides to review this thing.

The window is slightly skinnier than a SIG ROMEO1 and Leupold DPP and is perhaps slightly shorter, but it doesn't seem like anything's really lost by using the HE508T's (https://amzn.to/2LtJmGD) smaller window size versus those optics, because the housing is suitably thin and doesn't block much viewing space. The HE508T (https://amzn.to/2LtJmGD)presents a similarly compact form on a handgun to the Trijicon RMR, yet it provides a significantly bigger and subjectively much clearer view than the RMR.

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The window is recessed from the front limits of the housing, especially compared to the SIG ROMEO1, and this should provide significant protection from frontal impact. Based on the titanium housing, recessed window, and the fact that the less-rugged, aluminum-housed Holosun HS507C survived Sage Dynamics' torture testing (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JuOyq90oa-Q), I would not hesitate to use this sight as a slide-racking tool if needed.

The glass has a slight green tint, approximately to the same degree as that found on Leupold DPP and SIG's ROMEO line of pistol RDS. The green tint is not noticeable to me outdoors and is quite minimal indoors. Also, like most RDS, there is a separate red tint that can be observed through the window under certain lighting conditions that can cover large parts of the visual field, but it doesn't appear to conceal those areas, just tint all the colors.


https://youtu.be/Q9430E1c9tc

There is an apparent magnification (fisheye effect) to the window, noticeably higher than a Leupold DPP and SIG ROMEO1, but less than what I perceive a Trijicon RMR's and Trijicon MRO's magnification to be. The Leupold DPP and SIG ROMEO1 seem like a 1.02x, the HE508T seems like a 1.07x, and the Trijicon RMR and MRO seem like a 1.10x. These are subjective approximations based on lens distortion I can perceive, not scientifically measured. It would be really cool if an optical engineer could chime in and let us know if there's a simple way to measure this. The fisheye effect on the HE508T is right at the limit of what I can tolerate, and I'm very picky. At close ranges, my brain just ignores the fisheye effect on this optic. At distances of 25 yards and more, it seems to bother me slightly.

As stated previously, the optic comes with a 1913-style low mount adapter installed, but it can be quickly removed. The HE508T uses a Trijicon RMR style mounting pattern and appears to fit RMR-type plates for the Glock MOS system / FN509 adapter plates / etc. This appears to be a superior setup than going with a proprietary mount like the Aimpoint ACRO P1 requires, but I'm not going to judge that one yet until I try it. Maybe the P1 is worth changing everything.

Mine is currently mounted on a Glock 45 MOS using the excellent, low-profile C&H adapter plate V3 (http://www.chpws.com/product/holosun-glock-mos-adapter-plate-v3). If you have a Glock MOS pistol without that plate, you are really missing out, as the additional thread engagement, slightly lower RDS height, two additional recoil lugs, no need for an RMR sealing plate (if running an RMR), and improved aesthetics make it the go-to choice.

The obnoxiously bright, painted markings from Holosun's lower cost offerings like the HS507C are thankfully not included. The unit is branded on three sides but without any coloring, and on the right side are laser-marked (gray color) lettering showing the model name and serial number. The only current housing color offered is flat black. The coating does not scratch easily, and my testing showed that even moderate taps from a brass gunsmithing hammer could not leave permanent marks (they rubbed right off without any damage).

Sight adjustments are conventionally placed on the right and top using click-style screws. It took more force to adjust the screws than any RDS I've ever tested, but it was easy to tell when one click was accomplished. I cannot complain about this system, because from what I can tell, there's no way for the screws to be accidentally moved in transit and they're unlikely to budge under recoil.

Holosun quotes "up to 100,000 hours" of continuous use of the combined circle + dot reticle on the medium brightness setting using the on-board battery and "up to 200,000 hours" of just the dot reticle on the medium setting. FYI, 100,000 hours is exactly 11.4 years, but industry convention seems to round down that hour number approximately 10% before converting to an equivalent yearly rating, so I believe ~10 or ~20 years battery life (depending on reticle selection) is the way to look at the HE508T. As far as I know, this is the highest battery life rating of any powered red dot sight on the market and overtakes the Trijicon RMR Type 2's quoted 4-year rating, the Aimpoint T2's quoted 50,000 hour / ~5-year rating, and even the Aimpoint Comp M4's 80,000 hour / ~8-year rating. If you know of a longer-rated red dot battery life, please let us all know. Also, as stated before, I'm not affiliated with Holosun and do not know how they calculated this rating.

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The HE508T also includes Holosun's proprietary "Solar Fail Safe" technology that includes a solar panel on top. According to the manual (if I read it correctly), the optic prefers solar power and will only switch to battery as necessary. In addition, the optic features "Shake Awake" technology that turns off the reticle after a user-determined time window of zero movement, and turns back on instantaneously with very slight motion. The user can select 10 minutes, 1 hour, of 12h of inactivity or completely disable this feature and ensure their dot only turns off with manual intervention. Regardless of time selected, the reticle will power back on at the same brightness setting as last used. Finally, when the battery is low (below 2.2 volts), the reticle will blink. I trust the "Shake Awake" feature to work after having tested it extensively.

A "Multiple Reticle System" includes an EOTech-style 32 MOA circle reticle and 2 MOA center dot, but the circle (or the dot) can be disabled as desired. To me, it seems quite a bit faster to find the circle + dot reticle simply because it covers more viewing area. This could be especially helpful for new pistol RDS users, since the dot can jump around enough that the shooter needs to constantly hunt for the reticle. The option to turn the circle off is nice for those who just want a dot.

Note: this optic comes with a red reticle, but a green reticle model (HE508T-GR) is coming soon.

The HE508T (https://amzn.to/2LtJmGD) uses a CR2032 battery that sits underneath the housing and requires the entire unit to be removed, and additionally requires a proprietary tool (included) for removal. While this is the same as the Trijicon RMR, this is not optimum, as the sight zero may be affected upon reinstallation. Fortunately, with a ~10 or ~20 year battery rating and a solar panel as the primary power source, this is not going to be a common occurrence.

The optic is rated IPX8 for continuous waterproof immersion greater than 1 meter.

The HE508T (https://amzn.to/2LtJmGD) is quoted at weighing 1.76 oz, but I forgot to verify this before mounting it to my Glock 45 MOS. My apologies. I do not know if the weight includes the 1913-type rail adapter. I'll update this post if I ever remove the optic or get the info from someone else.

There are 12 manual brightness settings (10 daylight and 2 described as night vision compatible). The highest setting is extremely bright, perhaps brighter than necessary for almost any condition unless one was shooting right into the sun.

The brightness adjustment buttons are very small, unpainted, made of what appears to be a rubber-like material, are recessed, and have either a + or - sign molded in. I can manipulate them with thin gloves on (both leather pilot's / flight gloves and Mechanix-style gloves), but winter-style gloves make it slightly more difficult to adjust due to the small size. They are definitely not like the adjustable LED brightness RMR's with the huge buttons on either side, but perhaps this system is better for some folks because the buttons will not likely be accidentally pressed. I know that I've never accidentally bumped my SIG ROMEO1 (with or without steel shroud) buttons, and they're similarly sized. I think I'd prefer larger buttons, but it's not a deal breaker.

There is also an auto-brightness setting. I found the auto-brightness system to work fine for casual range use but would definitely not recommend it for duty use, as the brightness at the shooter is used to calculate the reticle brightness, and that doesn't always match the target brightness.

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Initial Field Test:

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I put a couple hundred rounds through the G45 MOS with the Holosun HE508T (https://amzn.to/2LtJmGD) and it has worked flawlessly, without flickering or any unexpected behavior. I'll update this post if anything ever goes wrong.

It appears to be a quality RDS, but no optic is perfectly reliable, I would always recommend using backup sights for duty use. For Glock MOS, my choice is the suppressor-height AmeriGlo GL-429 steel sights for an approximate lower-1/4 or lower-1/5 cowitness (they are quite low in the window), as their low, ~$45 price point and simplicity are appreciated.

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Summary:

The Holosun HE508T (https://amzn.to/2LtJmGD) beats the Trijicon RMR in terms of window size, reticle choices, power conservation features, and is ~25% less expensive while using the same footprint. The lens tint and distortion is minimal and should not be annoying for most everyone, unlike the RMR. Plus, the less-rugged, aluminum-housed version of this same optic, the HS507C, survived Sage Dynamics' torture testing (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JuOyq90oa-Q) with a partially-cracked window and still held a zero.

This titanium-housed version may survive that testing without even a cracked window if it's been designed correctly. If it does survive without issue and the window / electronics hold up over the long term, it seems to me that it will no longer make sense for potential RDS owners to purchase the RMR over the HE508T for duty use due to the disparity in feature set and price. The one drawback versus an equivalent RMR that I can find is that the brightness adjustment buttons are quite small.

I can also see RMR users upgrading to this optic due to the circle + dot reticle option. It's something you need to try before you swear it off. It appears faster to me to find the circle + dot reticle under both recoil and normal presentation simply due to the increased field of view taken up by the reticle. I may end up running some tests to see what speed improvement, if any, there actually is.

As I haven't used an Aimpoint ACRO P1 yet, I hesitate to compare it directly and would prefer others chime in who've tested both. From the spec sheets alone, though, there are stark differences in terms of battery life, reticle choices, and size. Also, for concealment purposes, especially in the appendix position, the ACRO P1's design seems to lend itself to printing (https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?31579-Aimpoint-just-dropped-ACRO-P-1-MRDS!&p=911516&viewfull=1#post911516) much more than a traditional open-emitter design. I definitely look forward to seeing how the ACRO P1 compares to the HE508T in the future.

That's all I can think of right now. If you have any questions or need clarification on some point, let me know.

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Shoot straight and Semper Fi,
Neal

[Super77]

Nice review! BTW I just ordered some Noisefighters based on VoodooMan’s recommendation. Looking forward to them.

How close is the form factor to an RMR? If you have a custom milled slide with a tight fit RMR do you think the Holosun would fit?

[LittleLebowski]

Well done review, jarhead.

[voodoo_man]

Good post.

[Dan_S]

Due to the type of optic this is, can I safely assume it might be more friendly to those with astigmatism, like the RMR?


If so...this is awfully tempting.

[Noisefighters]

Nice review! BTW I just ordered some Noisefighters based on VoodooMan’s recommendation. Looking forward to them.

How close is the form factor to an RMR? If you have a custom milled slide with a tight fit RMR do you think the Holosun would fit?

Thanks for trying out my ear pads. I really appreciate that

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The form factor is nearly exact in terms of X-Y (footprint) dimensions. In fact, the C&H adapter plate for MOS pistols does not distinguish between the RMR and the HS507C / HE508T. As stated earlier, it's a little bit taller, and the window size feels comparatively huge versus the RMR. However, the window seems about 85% of a Leupold DPP or Sig ROMEO1. I think it's just right.

If one had their slide milled for the RMR, the machinist may have radiused certain edges in order for the RMR to fit exactly, and the corner radiuses on the HE508T may not line up perfectly. I don't have an RMR on hand to compare. That said, if the internet is to be believed, many people have been able (https://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=1481414) to successfully transplant (https://www.ar15.com/forums/Handguns/Holosun-HS507C-MRDS-Update-Update-06-14-2019/23-183348/) a Holosun HS507C right onto their RMR-milled slides... I'm guessing Holosun copied the radiused corners perfectly.

[Noisefighters]

Due to the type of optic this is, can I safely assume it might be more friendly to those with astigmatism, like the RMR?


If so...this is awfully tempting.

I'm not sure I'd consider it more friendly to those with astigmatism. I have insight into this because of a full thickness corneal transplant on one of my eyes, as it brings with it highly irregular astigmatism. Both this optic and the RMR project a reticle that appears quite distorted when I look through it with that bad eye. When the circle is enabled, the reticle becomes a much larger blob of distorted light, and it's more difficult for me to accurately aim. If I were using that bad eye with this optic, I'd just use the center dot without the circle, since the visual field would be less cluttered and easier for me to figure out where the actual center point is.

[Dan_S]

Hmmm. Ok. Interesting.

I thought at one point the RMR was regarded pretty well as an option for those with astigmatism.


Not likely I’ll have a chance to try one out, and not looking to drop more money on stuff I can’t use well. 😐

Design looks fantastic though and I’ll look forward to updates!

[cornstalker]

Nice write up. Mine is due in tomorrow and I feel a little better about my purchase already.

[GJM]

Something I noticed with the Holosun 507 (https://amzn.to/2ZE0IdS), is the front lens seemed to scratch easily. Any thoughts on that aspect of this optic?

[Noisefighters]

Something I noticed with the Holosun 507, is the front lens seemed to scratch easily. Any thoughts on that aspect of this optic?

I do not have any input regarding the scratch resistance (or lack thereof) on the HE508T. Best advice, as I'm sure you know, is to only use an optic-quality, clean microfiber cloth to clean the window.

My long-term experience with the SIG ROMEO1 (https://amzn.to/2UEnYCJ) shows that even a careful cleaning regimen can't avoid minor scratches on the lens, mostly due to objects hitting the window. I don't seem to notice them, especially at close range.

[GJM]

I do not have any input regarding the scratch resistance (or lack thereof) on the HE508T. Best advice, as I'm sure you know, is to only use an optic-quality, clean microfiber cloth to clean the window.

My long-term experience with the SIG ROMEO1 shows that even a careful cleaning regimen can't avoid minor scratches on the lens, mostly due to objects hitting the window. I don't seem to notice them, especially at close range.

Not sure if you can see this big scratch — but I believe it came from a case bouncing off the front of the optic.

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[Noisefighters]

Not sure if you can see this big scratch — but I believe it came from a case bouncing off the front of the optic.

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That sucks. I'm going to add a polyurethane screen protector to the front lens to prevent that!

[flyrodr]

That sucks. I'm going to add a polyurethane screen protector to the front lens to prevent that!

Never considered that. Have a bunch of that material for cell phones, etc. While I've only noticed a few small nicks on any of my red dots, I still think I'll try that and see if it stays put, affects sight picture/zero, etc. Seems like a good idea!

[cornstalker]

I will have to check into that as well. What might that do to the lens coating?

Thanks to USPS, my optic that was supposed to be here today is not. Seems to be the norm now.

[Noisefighters]

Hey everyone,

I can't seem to edit the original post (maybe it's time sensitive?), so here's an update regarding my initial examination and comparison of the Aimpoint ACRO P1 versus the Holosun HE508T.

I'll keep it very brief: the amount of magnification / fisheye distortion on the ACRO P1 appears nearly identical to my eyes as the HE508T. I was somewhat surprised that the glass wasn't as "flat" as the SIG ROMEO1, for example. However, the ACRO P1 glass may have a tiny bit less green tint, but it seemed hard for me to tell. In addition, the ACRO P1 window size appears slightly smaller compared to the HE508T, but not terribly so, perhaps because of its thick, enclosed-emitter housing that forms a toilet-paper tube effect like an Aimpoint T1 / T2. I really liked the buttons on the ACRO P1, though.

As I mentioned on the first post, the ACRO P1's unusual mounting requirements, strange battery, lack of solar power, single (dot-only) reticle choice, heavier weight, and much higher propensity to print in the AIWB position (https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?31579-Aimpoint-just-dropped-ACRO-P-1-MRDS!&p=911516&viewfull=1#post911516) should give anyone pause before plunking down the cash for it. I love Aimpoint as much as anyone, but I only see the ACRO P1 making sense for those users who are running a duty pistol outside the waistband, where the optic is constantly exposed to the elements. In that role, it has no peer and I wouldn't hesitate to recommend it.

So, in my opinion, the HE508T appears to meet the requirements of concealed carry pistol users better than the ACRO P1 and Trijicon RMR. Please read the original post for more context. After trying the ACRO P1, I can now more strongly suggest the HE508T as the preferred pistol-mounted RDS for concealed carry pistol users based on features alone. However, both torture testing and long-term durability testing are needed to form a clearer picture. In addition, based off anecdotal evidence from Holosun HS507C users (the aluminum-housed version of the titanium-housed HE508T), it sounds like adding a transparent lens cover, like on a cell phone, may be necessary to avoid scratches to the front window.

[Trukinjp13]

Noisefighters what is the round count through this thing now? Have you racked the mrds off of anything? Not asking if you hit it with a hammer. I think I would have to see some seriously wide spread use of one of these before I would ever switch for my rmr2. Hopefully more people will jump
on the Holosun train and give this thing a run for its money.


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[GJM]

Regarding footprint, a top view of the Acro, SRO and Holosun.

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[GJM]

And, a side view — SRO on top, then Holosun in middle, and Acro on bottom.

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[Noisefighters]

Noisefighters what is the round count through this thing now? Have you racked the mrds off of anything? Not asking if you hit it with a hammer. I think I would have to see some seriously wide spread use of one of these before I would ever switch for my rmr2. Hopefully more people will jump
on the Holosun train and give this thing a run for its money.


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I’m only at a few hundred rounds. As mentioned in my first post, my intent is to keep this thread updated throughout the optic’s life. That said, the HE508T looks to be nearly the same optic as the HS507C but in a titanium housing. The aluminum HS507C has been put through the ringer, most notably by Sage Dynamics, and it seems to survive most everything. I can’t link it right now, but I’d suggest watching the video Aaron put out for that RDS, since he treats it like a hammer and then conducts drop testing, then confirms zero afterwards. It’s one of very few pistol RDS that survived without the glass shattering. Because the HE508T is clad in a more durable material than even the HS507C (please see the original post where I throw out a few reasons why this is), there’s a good chance this RDS is even more durable.

I understand your point of view and don’t think anyone needs to switch until the torture / durability testing is completed. I’m not affiliated with Holosun and don’t care if anyone chooses to buy this thing. However, as a shooter, I do want to let others know that they might want to wait for some HE508T durability results before buying an RMR. The HE508T seems like the better choice at this point.

[ADK]

A problem with Holosun is Chinese quality control consistency. We have samples of one doing fine, but many others not so much. I started with 2 HS507Cs. After both were exposed to water, one failed. Holosun replaced it. The replacement failed from normal use. The third one may still be fine but is currently in its box as a potential 4th line backup (after RMR T2s, 2.5 MOA SROs and 5 MOA SROs).

[GJM]

A problem with Holosun is Chinese quality control consistency. We have samples of one doing fine, but many others not so much. I started with 2 HS507Cs. After both were exposed to water, one failed. Holosun replaced it. The replacement failed from normal use. The third one may still be fine but is currently in its box as a potential 4th line backup (after RMR T2s, 2.5 MOA SROs and 5 MOA SROs).

Same here, with one a hard failure early on, another one working and a third working with a big scratch on the front lens.

[Trukinjp13]

I just keep picturing primary arms. Either works or does not. Maybe a American company can piggyback the titanium idea if it works. I just have a hard time believing this will work with widespread use. I also prefer as simple of a system as possible. I hope my gut is wrong and this will be a great option.


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[GearFondler]

I just picked up a 507C and have yet to shoot it but I did notice 2 things right away... But this is only my sample of one.

1. The Auto-adjust is not good indoors... Way too sensitive. Just walking through a room the overhead lighting will cause the dot to brighten and dim constantly, with each adjustment being darker than I desire. In low lighting with a WML forget about it... I can't see the reticle at all.
Manual mode fixes this issue.

2. The Motion Sensor is not as responsive as I expected, but I'm not saying that's a bad thing, just a thing.
I am comparing it to a DPP which will activate if a mouse farts in its vacinity. By contrast I have very gently picked up the 1301 I have it on and shoulder mounted it without activating the dot. But any realistic motion that causes some inertia will trip it on... Just a small twitch activated it.

[Noisefighters]

I just picked up a 507C and have yet to shoot it but I did notice 2 things right away... But this is only my sample of one.

1. The Auto-adjust is not good indoors... Way too sensitive. Just walking through a room the overhead lighting will cause the dot to brighten and dim constantly, with each adjustment being darker than I desire. In low lighting with a WML forget about it... I can't see the reticle at all.
Manual mode fixes this issue.

2. The Motion Sensor is not as responsive as I expected, but I'm not saying that's a bad thing, just a thing.
I am comparing it to a DPP which will activate if a mouse farts in its vacinity. By contrast I have very gently picked up the 1301 I have it on and shoulder mounted it without activating the dot. But any realistic motion that causes some inertia will trip it on... Just a small twitch activated it.

Thanks for your input. As mentioned in the first post, the HE508T appears to suffer from the same auto brightness issue. It's likely fine for one-way range use outdoors, but that's about it. My recommendation is to not use it at all. The buttons are small but not that bad.

I find your comment really interesting about the motion sensor. For everyone's reference, the Sig ROMEO1 has a similar sensitivity as the Leupold DPP, which is that it turns on with even crazy small movement (like lightly blowing air on it while it's sitting on a table). The HE508T that I own has motion sensitivity similar to the ROMEO1 / DPP, but perhaps a little bit less. If I pick up the pistol, even gently, it turns on.

Just an update: I fired another 200 rounds through the G45 MOS today with the HE508T mounted in the C&H Precision MOS plate. It's still secure, it's still accurate, and it's still extremely fast. That circle + dot reticle is just perfect for me.

[Trukinjp13]

Any updates on this?


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[Noisefighters]

Any updates on this?


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My HE508T is still working the same as from the beginning. No issues. I've had it out for two big range days since the last update and it's done fine. Actually, it's done a lot better than my old but reliable Sig ROMEO1 RDS because that one can't get bright enough for full sunlight shooting when targets are brightly colored. The HE508T is on a different level of potential brightness, plus its circle + dot reticle is huge.

Unfortunately, I'm not putting it on an accelerated wear schedule like Sage Dynamics does, so I don't plan on posting any more updates unless I encounter problems.

[Trukinjp13]

My HE508T is still working the same as from the beginning. No issues. I've had it out for two big range days since the last update and it's done fine. Actually, it's done a lot better than my old but reliable Sig ROMEO1 RDS because that one can't get bright enough for full sunlight shooting when targets are brightly colored. The HE508T is on a different level of potential brightness, plus its circle + dot reticle is huge.

Unfortunately, I'm not putting it on an accelerated wear schedule like Sage Dynamics does, so I don't plan on posting any more updates unless I encounter problems.

Okay, thanks. Was curious on rounds and how she was doing. You seem to be the only person I have read that is using one and putting out any useful knowledge. The few have been guys that called them rmr2 beaters since they had 4-500 “FLAWLESS” rounds through theirs.


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[Tackleberry40sw]

https://youtu.be/EK0O6eI5rZU

[David S.]

TLDW.
It passed the 2000 round test.
Slight "chipping?" at the top of the window after the four shoulder height drop tests. There were no serious cracks and it didn't lose zero.
Ranks in his most durable optic category, along with RMR and ACRO.
The ring reticle is good for teaching new dot shooters to find dot.
He likes the 508T

[David S.]

Base on my experience with the 407c, I'm giving strong consideration to swapping my RMRs out for 508T's.

OTOH, On a couple recent (last couple days) Instagram Live Chats, Steve Fisher has said that he is testing a new Holosun pistol optic that he can't show us. I'm going to wait and see what that's all about.

[cornstalker]

I wonder if it’s the closed emitter model that has been floating around in the rumor mill.

I have had my HS508T for a while and haven’t even shot it yet. It did not fit the pocket milled for a 407 quote as tight as I had hoped.

[Tod-13]

I wonder if it’s the closed emitter model that has been floating around in the rumor mill.

https://holosun.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2&products_id=96

I'd think a real winner would be keeping the RMR footprint and making it enclosed.

[Noisefighters]

Hey everyone,

Thanks for updating this thread with Sage Dynamics' review of the HE508T. It appears he came to the same conclusions I drew in the first post, but he was actually able to definitely prove (with a sample size of one) that the new titanium housing can withstand some serious abuse, basically on the same level as the RMR. It's nice to have someone like him doing all the hard work! :D

One thing I noticed about his RDS reviews is that he doesn't always mention optical distortion and tint, nor compare the reviewed optic's distortion / tint to some baseline LED emitter-based optic like the Aimpoint T2 (which could be considered the gold standard). As mentioned earlier, the HE508T has some fisheye distortion and it's at the level where I do not see it as a problem, while the RMR is just plain annoying to me; the HE508T basically has no noticeable tint during use, while the RMR has a green tint that is distracting to me. Your mileage may vary.

Aaron mentioned the shake-awake feature we've been discussing and how he doesn't want to trust it. Please be aware that it can be turned off easily or the timeline for the optic going to sleep can be adjusted.

Quick update: I put another few hundred rounds through my G45 MOS with HE508T last weekend and there were no issues. It's kept zero and functions the same as new.


https://holosun.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2&products_id=96

I'd think a real winner would be keeping the RMR footprint and making it enclosed.

Tod-13,

I used to think the same thing. For immediate compatibility, that would make the most sense. However, after initially inspecting the ACRO P1 and being disappointed on both its unusual mounting system and (IMHO) inferior feature set, I revisited the optic recently and came away with an entirely different opinion on the mounting system. What Aimpoint has done is eliminated the above / below battery tray issue that plagues current generation pistol-sized RDS and simultaneously provided a (relatively) quick detach mounting system that is weaver / picatinny compatible and super low profile. It does away with the proprietary, mutually-incompatible #6-48 gunsmith screw-based mounting patterns used by the RMR / Deltapoint / Viper / Docter.

As we all know from mounting RDS to carbines, the screw / clamp method is basically bombproof and can, with the right setup, provide quite reliable return to zero after removal / reattachment. With Holosun now adapting the ACRO-style screw / clamp mounting system for their soon-to-be-released HE509T enclosed emitter RDS, it may be more future proofed.

For everyone's info, Aimpoint is selling ACRO mounting plates for nearly every pistol that comes RDS-ready from the factory. The list of mounts can be found on the product description page on the bottom right (https://www.aimpoint.com/product/aimpoint-acro-p-1/). Once the new Holosun HE509T is released, I'll likely pick up some plates and switch everything over to this new system. I don't see a downside in moving from open emitter to enclosed emitter and from a proprietary mounting pattern to the ACRO-based weaver / picatinny system...let me know if you do.

-Neal

[GearFondler]

^^^ My concern with an ACRO/Picatinny style mount for a pistol is two-fold...
1. It will be difficult to mount as low as the top screw systems increasing the height over bore and necessitating stupidly tall irons.
2. The increased height will make the pistol more difficult to conceal.
Solve or at least mitigate those two issues and I'm all for it.

[GJM]

^^^ My concern with an ACRO/Picatinny style mount for a pistol is two-fold...
1. It will be difficult to mount as low as the top screw systems increasing the height over bore and necessitating stupidly tall irons.
2. The increased height will make the pistol more difficult to conceal.
Solve or at least mitigate those two issues and I'm all for it.

Not sure about the BUIS iron issues, as a RMR and SRO on a MOS plate seem to require taller irons than an Acro on a MOS plate.

44227

[e_stern]

^^^ My concern with an ACRO/Picatinny style mount for a pistol is two-fold...
1. It will be difficult to mount as low as the top screw systems increasing the height over bore and necessitating stupidly tall irons.
2. The increased height will make the pistol more difficult to conceal.
Solve or at least mitigate those two issues and I'm all for it.

Acro sits lower than screw mount optics in my experience.

[Steven T]

Quoting Noisefighters

As we all know from mounting RDS to carbines, the screw / clamp method is basically bombproof and can, with the right setup, provide quite reliable return to zero after removal / reattachment. With Holosun now adapting the ACRO-style screw / clamp mounting system for their soon-to-be-released HE509T enclosed emitter RDS, it may be more future proofed.

For everyone's info, Aimpoint is selling ACRO mounting plates for nearly every pistol that comes RDS-ready from the factory. The list of mounts can be found on the product description page on the bottom right. Once the new Holosun HE509T is released, I'll likely pick up some plates and switch everything over to this new system. I don't see a downside in moving from open emitter to enclosed emitter and from a proprietary mounting pattern to the ACRO-based weaver / picatinny system...let me know if you do.

-Neal


Neal is the HE509T the same mounting base as the ACRO? I thought I had read this somewhere but haven't been able to verify that info. If so maybe I will wait until the HE509T is released to have my P320's milled.

[Noisefighters]

Neal is the HE509T the same mounting base as the ACRO? I thought I had read this somewhere but haven't been able to verify that info. If so maybe I will wait until the HE509T is released to have my P320's milled.

I cannot confirm they'll use the exact same mounting base as I have no first hand knowledge. Some people at IWA 2019 claimed a Holosun rep said (https://primaryandsecondary.com/forum/index.php?threads/upcoming-holosun-he509t-enclosed-emitter-tube-style-titanium-pistol-optic.6279/) that they're going to make RMR-to-HE509T adapter plates. Holosun also advertises the product (https://holosun.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=96) as using an "Industry standard footprint for your pistol mounting needs" and I have to believe they've copied the ACRO footprint.

Regarding the backup sight height, it will be very interesting to see how the HE509T compares to the ACRO and what will be required to make them work. As far as I've seen, the only real HE509T in the wild was mounted on a picatinny rail adapter that slid into a rear sight dovetail on a Glock airsoft gun, so it's hard to draw conclusions.

[Tackleberry40sw]

http://holosun.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=50&products_id=96

[Xhado]

^^^ My concern with an ACRO/Picatinny style mount for a pistol is two-fold...
1. It will be difficult to mount as low as the top screw systems increasing the height over bore and necessitating stupidly tall irons.
2. The increased height will make the pistol more difficult to conceal.
Solve or at least mitigate those two issues and I'm all for it.

ATEi Milled ACRO footprints use standard size glock sights (not suppressor height sights) to co-witness.

When there is no screw going down, you can sink the optic lower into the slide.

[Bill S]

Any info out there as to when the new HE509T is going to be available to we peons?

[vandal]

Got to shoot my new 508T (200 rounds) on a milled G19.3 slide (no bosses) alongside my G19.5 with a G19X slide with AOS and a RMR06 type 2

First on the fit, the Holosun did not fit tightly in the milled RMR cut like the RMR did. And without bosses I was a little concerned. But if the Holosun continues to perform it will love to the AOS gun.

I thought I’d like the Eotech reticle but in the end I found it distracting when trying for a precise shot. And I was more prone to think of the whole reticle as the aiming point. Nice that it’s so easy to switch to the single dot.

I found the auto brightness feature to never be bright enough so I switched to the manual mode. Is the manual mode supposed to have shake awake? Because I’ve left it sit the reticle never seemed to shut off.

The larger window is slightly more forgiving and if the dot leaves the window in recoil I get to see more of the dot travel path before I need to press the trigger. Vs the RMR where as soon as the dot reappears it’s time to start pressing. Hope that makes sense. And or maybe my dot technique is wrong.

Appreciated the less blue glass as on my indoor range with crappy lighting my eye gets more info without having to work as hard. I’ve read that given two separate views your brain prefers the brighter one so crappy lighting + tint = my dominant eye has to work harder to vs my non dominant eye with less obscurity from the tint.

Size wise it doesn’t seem to make any concealment difference AIWB.

Liked that it was designed from the start with a sealed battery compartment vs the RMR janky sealing plate.

Haven’t really thought about the solar part of the equation.

[Noisefighters]

I found the auto brightness feature to never be bright enough so I switched to the manual mode. Is the manual mode supposed to have shake awake? Because I’ve left it sit the reticle never seemed to shut off.

Yep, manual mode does have shake awake. Page 13 of my manual: the default sleep setting is 10 minutes, and you can press and hold the + button for 10 seconds to enter time adjustment mode. There are 4 options: 10 minutes, 1 hour, 12 hours, or shake awake (sleep mode) disabled. Press and release the + or - button to select the option you wish. The LED will blink once for 10 minutes, twice for 1 hour, three times for 12 hours, and four times for shake awake (sleep mode) disabled. Then press the + and - buttons simultaneously to save the time setting and power off the sight.


I thought I’d like the Eotech reticle but in the end I found it distracting when trying for a precise shot. And I was more prone to think of the whole reticle as the aiming point. Nice that it’s so easy to switch to the single dot.

I can definitely understand that when it comes to longer range (perhaps 10+ yards) shooting. Inside that distance, though, it's like having a 32MOA dot, which is super fast for me to find. I do switch back and forth some times.

----

Update: I had the chance to shoot my G45 MOS again today with the HE508T and really enjoyed it. Still no issues on my end. It acts like new.

[vandal]

Yep, manual mode does have shake awake. Page 13 of my manual: the default sleep setting is 10 minutes, and you can press and hold the + button for 10 seconds to enter time adjustment mode. There are 4 options: 10 minutes, 1 hour, 12 hours, or shake awake (sleep mode) disabled. Press and release the + or - button to select the option you wish. The LED will blink once for 10 minutes, twice for 1 hour, three times for 12 hours, and four times for shake awake (sleep mode) disabled. Then press the + and - buttons simultaneously to save the time setting and power off the sight.


I have a real hard time pressing the - button. But I did enter the auto-off setting and make sure it was set to 10 minutes. Previously I had let it sit but was unable to sneak up on it and find it off. But now it does work.



I can definitely understand that when it comes to longer range (perhaps 10+ yards) shooting. Inside that distance, though, it's like having a 32MOA dot, which is super fast for me to find. I do switch back and forth some times.


I can absolutely see that. I was at shooting 4" numbered circles at 25y.

[ssb]

I did my first range trip with my 508T yesterday, 475 rounds fired.

Opposite of what I thought, I vastly preferred the 2MOA dot to the 32MOA circle dot. While the 32MOA circle dot felt faster, the timer simply didn't bear that out -- and when shooting B8s at speed (the Test, etc.), I found precision lacking as I had a difficult time finding the center dot. The 2MOA dot on the other hand was bouncing around mostly inside the black, which made life easy (one run was a 99 in 8.04 seconds). Having said that, I simply haven't been dry firing lately due to having to send a gun off for repair and it showed. Now that I've got my practice gun back, I'll be working some more with the 508T and attempting to confirm that the 2MOA dot is indeed best for me.

I found the slight increase in window size to be quite significant in practice. With a bit more vetting, I can see myself carrying this as a primary dot over an RMR.

[Noisefighters]

I have a real hard time pressing the - button. But I did enter the auto-off setting and make sure it was set to 10 minutes. Previously I had let it sit but was unable to sneak up on it and find it off. But now it does work.

Hey, I ended up trying to adjust the sleep timer myself and can't seem to get it to work. I hold down the + button and the optic blinks at 3 seconds, switching from manual to auto or from auto to manual mode. It doesn't get to 10 seconds and enter the sleep time adjustment mode. I'm wondering if the red dot version of the HE508T is set on a fixed timer and the manual is wrong. Can you confirm you were actually able to adjust the timer?

[vandal]

I was able to adjust the timer with those instructions, and mine is the red version.


Hey, I ended up trying to adjust the sleep timer myself and can't seem to get it to work. I hold down the + button and the optic blinks at 3 seconds, switching from manual to auto or from auto to manual mode. It doesn't get to 10 seconds and enter the sleep time adjustment mode. I'm wondering if the red dot version of the HE508T is set on a fixed timer and the manual is wrong. Can you confirm you were actually able to adjust the timer?

[cornstalker]

With both the circle and the dot turned on, my "crosshairs" seem to be canted to the left. Anyone else notice this or are yours clocked at 12,3,6,9?

[Noisefighters]

With both the circle and the dot turned on, my "crosshairs" seem to be canted to the left. Anyone else notice this or are yours clocked at 12,3,6,9?

Mine are aligned correctly with 12/3/6/9. Sounds like part of your emitter is canted. That's a bummer and not something I've heard of happening before. Anybody else heard of it? If you decide to start a warranty claim, please let us all know how it goes. I've been running Holosun products for awhile now and have never had an issue, so I'd like to know how they treat you, at least.

[cornstalker]

I will contact them. This unit has been bolted on, but not had a round fired under it yet.

Edit. Actually, I had better take it off the mount and double check it on a flat surface first.

[mrozowjj]

I will contact them. This unit has been bolted on, but not had a round fired under it yet.

Edit. Actually, I had better take it off the mount and double check it on a flat surface first.


I have a 507c and I looked through the 507c green model and they were all canted too. Reddit seems to say this is fairly common and not much can be done about it except send it in.

I vaguely remember some saying the battery compartment being too tight might have been part of the cause but I read so much stuff about various red dots that I might be getting things confused with a different dot.

[Noisefighters]

45596
45597

I decided to move the HE508T to my P320RX. It requires very little modification of the slide. Shout out to Mark from L&M Precision Gunworks (https://www.landmprecisiongunworks.com/) for doing a fine job of milling my P320RX slide for HE508T use. It was perfect quality and fast. I'd highly recommend anybody looking to use a P320 as a host to consider the P320RX, since you can sell the ROMEO1 or mount it on something else, and the milling job is super cheap since there's so little work involved.

What's interesting to note is that the lower portion of the HE508T is perhaps 0.050" shorter than the Sig ROMEO1 red dot without shroud, so the suppressor-height iron sights are easier to pick up once the Holosun is swapped in. If the the ROMEO1 shroud was used previously, the difference when the HE508T is installed is quite apparent.

I'm going to put the P320RX + HE508T combo to the test on Saturday.

[cornstalker]

I filled out an inquiry form on Holosuns site Wednesday night around 9:30 PM. By 10 am Thursday I got an email back saying to fill out a warranty form and they would send me a prepaid shipping label to send it in. The said the turnaround time may be as quick as 10 days.

Will update when I get it back, but at least they are very responsive.

[mrozowjj]

Due to the type of optic this is, can I safely assume it might be more friendly to those with astigmatism, like the RMR?


If so...this is awfully tempting.

Not an expert or an optometrist but the Holoson series of dots are less better to my eyes than the RMR is by a noticeable amount with my mild astigmatism but the RMR is the best red dot for me with my particular astigmatism.

My theory for why is this: the tint, the dot size, and the fact that it's an open red dot. For me I've noticed the larger the dot the more crisp it appears to my eye with my astigmatism and this is universal across all dots regardless of maker particular LED technology used open or closed dot etc.

I don't know why the open design improves the dot to my eye but dots like the RMR and the Holosun 407/507 series makes it better than closed tubes like the Aimpoints (No joke Aimpoints look the worst in my eyes and this includes the Holosun and Primary Arms tubes.)

And I think the reason the tint on the RMR helps with the dot looking crisp to me is the tint was designed to contrast against the dot; that tint in the RMR is part of the reason why it had the best battery life of the mini red dots for a very very long time; by making the window tint contrast you can use a lower setting and still make the dot out easily. I think that is why the RMR is the best for astigmatism; that tint means you can turn the brightness down lower and still see the dot preventing the blooming effect from too bright of an LED.

So for me the RMR is still king because of that green tint that everyone else complains about. On all "serious" use pistols I get the 6.5 MOA RMR because it looks crisp to me. I've even put the 3.25 MOA RMR on home defense rifles and yes I guess mud or snow could get in there which is a disadvantage compared to the closed tube options but that 3.25 MOA dot looks crisper to me than any other red dot of similar size which makes it far more useful to me. I like it so much I'm considering if it would look too absurd to put a magnifier behind it.

The one thing new to market that looks promising is the Holosun 407CO which is the model with a 8 MOA ring. I got one last weekend, mounted it to a Glock and I'm going to go sight it in tomorrow so I'll see how it goes but it has the potential to be the best budget option for astigmatism by virtue of not even using a dot at all.

Of course all of this is tricky because everyone's eyes and level of astigmatism is different so your best bet is to check out a few options in person.

[Noisefighters]

Thanks for posting your experience with pistol RDS and astigmatism. It's nice to have another data point.


The one thing new to market that looks promising is the Holosun 407CO which is the model with a 8 MOA ring. I got one last weekend, mounted it to a Glock and I'm going to go sight it in tomorrow so I'll see how it goes but it has the potential to be the best budget option for astigmatism by virtue of not even using a dot at all.


I'm wondering if you've had a chance to switch reticles on the Holosun HS407C or HE508T and try out the ring-only reticle (center dot removed). The outer ring is a large 32MOA, of course, so I can understand why you're interested in the smaller 8 MOA ring on the HS407CO.

Also, how did sight in go with the HS407CO?

[mrozowjj]

Thanks for posting your experience with pistol RDS and astigmatism. It's nice to have another data point.



I'm wondering if you've had a chance to switch reticles on the Holosun HS407C or HE508T and try out the ring-only reticle (center dot removed). The outer ring is a large 32MOA, of course, so I can understand why you're interested in the smaller 8 MOA ring on the HS407CO.

Also, how did sight in go with the HS407CO?


Just to clarify the 407c is the model with just the dot the 507c is the model with the option to switch between dot, 32 MOA ring and 32 MOA ring + dot.

I have a 507c and what I notice is the ring only looks pretty crisp to me but 32 MOA isn't ideal for more precise shooting. (That said 32 MOA is about 8 inches at 25 yards and about 3.2" at 10 yards so in a pinch not the worst thing for a pistol) Having both on seems to be better than the dot alone. I'm not sure if it just tricks my eye or if it's because with the 32 MOA ring on it's easier to find the dot so I can turn the brightness lower.

Sight in went well. It's pretty much the ideal reticle to me for anything in a pistol caliber for sure. Being the aluminium framed model I would probably still put an RMR on anything I would want to trust my life on but I think the 407CO is my new go to budget red dot from here on out. I have been previously using a 6 MOA Vortex Venom red dot as my budget pistol red dot but I like the Holosun 407co so much I'm thinking about swapping all of them out with this. One of my big complaints with the Vortex is that the lowest brightness setting is way way too bright so indoors it starbursts. Also the top load battery compartment is a bigger pain in the ass to use than it's worth.

As I said in my other post I like the large dot on a pistol because I can find it easier and it stays crisp. Some would argue 6-8MOA is too large but 6-8MOA is 1.5-2" at 25 yards and it covers less as you get in closer which IMO makes it the ideal size for a pistol. Well having a ring where the outer diameter is 8MOA and the inner diamter is 6 MOA is just about perfect because closer in you can just treat it like a dot but further out with a smaller target you center the target in the dot. It reminds me a lot of this 22 LR rifle I had that had these olympic style sights where the rear and front sight were both an aperature so to light up the sights you put the smaller circle in the center of the larger circle. It was very intuitive.

I've attached a picture of the reticle on some targets so you can get a sense of scale. The left target is a 3/4 scale USPSA target where I placed a black 3" target sticker in the center and the target on the right is a 14"x22" paper B-29 target. Sorry for the large pictures but it makes it easier to see.



45721


45722


45723


45724



Here's some pictures of my targets. The top right was 25 yards from a bench done after I got a nice good sight in with the dot. The others were all off hand at 10, 15 and 20 yards.

45720

[Noisefighters]

Just to clarify the 407c is the model with just the dot the 507c is the model with the option to switch between dot, 32 MOA ring and 32 MOA ring + dot.

You're quite right. My mistake. I must be more tired than I thought...


Here's some pictures of my targets. The top right was 25 yards from a bench done after I got a nice good sight in with the dot. The others were all off hand at 10, 15 and 20 yards.

Dang. This is very interesting. Now I want to try my HE508T with the circle reticle / no dot and see what kind of groups I get. Thanks again for posting.

[mrozowjj]

You're quite right. My mistake. I must be more tired than I thought...



Dang. This is very interesting. Now I want to try my HE508T with the circle reticle / no dot and see what kind of groups I get. Thanks again for posting.


Their model names/number is confusing; it doesn't seem to follow any obvious reason.


Give it a go. The 32 MOA should cover 8 inches at 25 yards which would still be smaller than either target I used. I'm thinking of putting my 507 on a 22 pistol and if I do I'll take some pictures of that too.

[mrozowjj]

I went to the range today and took some pictures of the Holosun 507 reticle today at 25 yards just for some comparison like I said I would.

The targets are the same 3/4 sized USPSA target and the paper 14x22" target.

With the dot and the circle:

https://i.imgur.com/lyK2Ppb.jpg



https://i.imgur.com/lL7xLfR.jpg



And now with just the circle:

https://i.imgur.com/mpZpLr8.jpg




https://i.imgur.com/PCj0hJa.jpg


It's really hard to get the brightness correct when you're looking through your phone, but you get the idea here, mainly that the 32 MOA ring by itself is almost the exact same with as the 3/4 USPSA target so on a full size target you could center the 32 MOA ring and still have room on either side. Most USPSA does not have you shoot that far; you're ususally inside 15 yards but I didn't think to take pictures at that distance but at 15 yards the 32 MOA ring should cover just under 5 inches or in other words inside of 15 yards it should be smaller than the IDPA 0-ring.


I also went to the steel range and at 10 yards you can see that the 32 MOA ring is smaller than a 6 inch steel plate which just goes to show what I said above:

https://i.imgur.com/5SX41r4.jpg

[mrozowjj]

One final threat hijack I promise.

I took the 407CO to the rifle range today. My local range only has fixed berms at 25, 100 and 200 yards so I couldn't do any intermediate distances but I put one of the 407COs on my Scorpion and sighted it in at 25 yards and then took it to 100 yards.

Here is a very bad picture of the reticle at 100 yards:

https://i.imgur.com/IftJKBJ.jpg

The target is a 2/3s scale USPSA target so the target is 12 inches across and at 100 yards the 8 MOA ring is almost the same size as the whole target. 8 MOA is 8.34" at 100 yards which means in theory it should have 1.3" on either side of the ring if I center it in the target but it's very hard to see those 1.3" when you center it at least with my eyes. If it were a full size target it'd be 18" across which would no doubt be even easier to use to center it in. (Technically if you were shooting a standard sized USPSA target at 200 yards the ring should appear to be about 1" smaller but I doubt you'd be able to see that difference but you could still make a reasonably easy hit with this reticle at that distance.)


I put one of my 3" sticker targets in the center of the target and using this it was easy to see the 3" circle inside of the ring and assuming that 9mm could drop some at 100 yards but not knowing exactly how much I basically put the bottom inner edge of the ring on the 3" sticker and fired off 20 rounds. This was the target.


https://i.imgur.com/qPpGLGP.jpg



I took a Tavor to the range today too with one of the 1.5x mini ACOGs and I honestly found it harder to use that with the 3 MOA dot at 100 yards than this ring; partly because it was a typical overcast PNW day and the range is covered so the fiber on the ACOG was getting little light making it a black reticle so I was trying to find a black dot inside of a black sticker which was hard to do.


All in all I do believe this 8 MOA ring is possibly my favorite reticle for anything in a pistol caliber; really for any gun you are content to only ever shoot inside of 100 yards.

[cornstalker]

I filled out an inquiry form on Holosuns site Wednesday night around 9:30 PM. By 10 am Thursday I got an email back saying to fill out a warranty form and they would send me a prepaid shipping label to send it in. The said the turnaround time may be as quick as 10 days.

Will update when I get it back, but at least they are very responsive.

I received a replacement sight today. It looks exactly the same as the one I sent in.

[mrozowjj]

I received a replacement sight today. It looks exactly the same as the one I sent in.

That's a bummer but I can't say I'm surprised. Are you just going to live with it or try again?

One of the 8moa ring models I have wouldn't hold windage adjustment so I mailed that back to them last week. Guess I'll see if they fix that.

[cornstalker]

That's a bummer but I can't say I'm surprised. Are you just going to live with it or try again?

One of the 8moa ring models I have wouldn't hold windage adjustment so I mailed that back to them last week. Guess I'll see if they fix that.

Just gonna live with it. I hope they get you fixed up.

[GearFondler]

It's a small concern and not one that would influence my choice, but still one I notice weekly...
The really nice addition of the solar panel means the frame around the glass is relatively wide which means the interior side of the glass is deeply recessed. This means it's a pain in the ass to get in there and "clean out the ashtray". It's the interior edges of the glass that are so hard to reach... A finger inside a rag just can't get in there very easily.
Again, not a deal breaker but definitely an extra bit of aggravation when compared to an RMR.

[mrozowjj]

Just gonna live with it. I hope they get you fixed up.

Well I got it back and tried to sight it in and again I got a horrible group. I no longer believe it is the red dot though; I firmly stand in the camp that it's the gun... so there is that.

[noguns]

I just got one of these and my first rds. What are you guys doing with the brightness? Leave on manual setting 6? Do you really adjust on the fly as conditions/lighting changes? If so what settings do you use? Living in the blue zone of VA it won't look so great carrying around my slide in public to see what the for looks like in various conditions. I was impatient and mounted it on my slide right away.
Thanks

[GearFondler]

I just got one of these and my first rds. What are you guys doing with the brightness? Leave on manual setting 6? Do you really adjust on the fly as conditions/lighting changes? If so what settings do you use? Living in the blue zone of VA it won't look so great carrying around my slide in public to see what the for looks like in various conditions. I was impatient and mounted it on my slide right away.
ThanksI set mine to the highest setting in the morning and if I remember I knock down two spots in the evening... I'd rather have it too bright than too dim.

[ssb]

So last weekend I noticed during dry fire that my 508T reticle was flashing. Consulting the manual, that is a low battery indicator. This was unexpected -- I installed a Duracell CR2032 in early November and the manufacturer claims 100,000 hours on setting 6. Mine tended to live on settings 10-11 with the 2MOA dot, but this was also my practice gun and thus the shake awake feature (which I know works -- I checked) should have kept the optic off for the overwhelming majority of the time. Nevertheless, OK, whatever, I changed the battery -- four months isn't terrible. Yesterday, six days after the battery change, the dot began flashing at the range -- once again, low battery. I again used a Duracell CR2032, but from a different lot on last week's battery change.

My suspicion is that somewhere along the way the optic developed some sort of battery drain issue. I *think* I've filed a warranty request with the manufacturer, but their website leaves something to be desired and no confirmation e-mail resulted. I may follow up with a phone call this week.

It has not been my week with RDS optics.

[cornstalker]

So last weekend I noticed during dry fire that my 508T reticle was flashing. Consulting the manual, that is a low battery indicator. This was unexpected -- I installed a Duracell CR2032 in early November and the manufacturer claims 100,000 hours on setting 6. Mine tended to live on settings 10-11 with the 2MOA dot, but this was also my practice gun and thus the shake awake feature (which I know works -- I checked) should have kept the optic off for the overwhelming majority of the time. Nevertheless, OK, whatever, I changed the battery -- four months isn't terrible. Yesterday, six days after the battery change, the dot began flashing at the range -- once again, low battery. I again used a Duracell CR2032, but from a different lot on last week's battery change.

My suspicion is that somewhere along the way the optic developed some sort of battery drain issue. I *think* I've filed a warranty request with the manufacturer, but their website leaves something to be desired and no confirmation e-mail resulted. I may follow up with a phone call this week.

It has not been my week with RDS optics.

That's a bummer. When I sent mine in for the crooked reticle thing I got an email response on the next business day. They were pretty easy to work with and quite customer-friendly.

[noguns]

It would be nice if manufacturers would give us estimates on battery life depending on the brightness settings used.

I read somewhere that the battery use goes up exponentially when cranked up past "halfway" but I don't know where I read that. It would be good to know.

[Steve m]

Noisefighters,

Any updates on your 508T, I have a 507C V2, that I am trying out?

[Noisefighters]

Noisefighters,

Any updates on your 508T, I have a 507C V2, that I am trying out?

Hi Steve M,

My 508T V1 is still going strong. I've since moved away from the circle-dot reticle and just use the dot. Having the circle was great for the transition from irons to a RDS and now I don't see as much of a need. Because of this, I recently picked up a pair of HS407C (dot only, no circle integrated) for my pistols and I think it's the best bang for the buck RDS available. If I had to recommend one RDS for IWB carry use, I'd tell people to save the money and get the 407C, and only get the 507C if they absolutely needed the circle. For duty use on a pistol or as an offset dot on a carbine, definitely go for the titanium models for the enhanced durability.

I'm looking forward to the enclosed-emitter HE509T being released, but it keeps getting pushed back. Based on features and reviews, it seems like the best RDS yet. Bummer about the delays.

Wish I had the V2 model of the 508T and 407...but it's not a big deal. I don't really mess with the brightness settings after finding one that seems to work at day and night (with a WML), so the larger buttons on the V2 would largely be wasted on me. It does look a lot better, of course, and looking good is half the battle. ;)

[DMCutter]

I have a 507C on a P229 and an RMR on my MR920. Side by side the windows look identical in size to me. I'm sending a USPC9 to L&M to have an RMR mounted next week when my RMR comes in. I was on the fence between the 508t and RMR but no one has the 508t in stock and I wanted the absolute waterproofness of the RMR. I don't think I'm actually going to take it scuba diving with me but I consider it to be my ultimate end of the world gun and I want it to be as everything proof as possible.

[Steve m]

Looking forward to using the 507C v2. This will be my first true foray into RDS. I will use this exclusively for my training/competition pistol. I have used my Gen5 17s with Leupold DPP in IDPA. If the 507C works out I will probably get rid of the Leupold and go strictly 507c, if I can find a 508 local I will pick that up instead.

[Lon]

Looking forward to using the 507C v2. This will be my first true foray into RDS. I will use this exclusively for my training/competition pistol. I have used my Gen5 17s with Leupold DPP in IDPA. If the 507C works out I will probably get rid of the Leupold and go strictly 507c, if I can find a 508 local I will pick that up instead.

Where’s local? I just left a gun shop (The Miami Armory) that has a 508. Almost walked out with it.

[GJM]

Where’s local? I just left a gun shop (The Miami Armory) that has a 508. Almost walked out with it.

V1 or V2?

[Lon]

V1 or V2?

I know the 507 I looked at was a v2. I think the 508 was but won’t swear to it. Let me check.

[GJM]

I know the 507 I looked at was a v2. I think the 508 was but won’t swear to it. Let me check.

Think the +/- is larger on the V2?

[Lon]

Think the +/- is larger on the V2?

The side battery compartment is what caught my eye on the 507c. I texted my buddy and the 508 was v1. They haven’t seen a v2 508 yet. I did not get either out of the case just took a quick look while I was waiting to ship a pistol.

[noguns]

Anyone killed a battery yet? I actually find the auto mode pretty versatile if I use circle dot. I find that I need to put it on at least setting 8 or 9 on DOT only to be bright enough without having to adjust throughout the day.

Eventually I'll get some version of V2 so I can crank it up really bright and not have to worry about adjusting the zero.

[Steve m]

GJM,

The + and - are definately larger, I compared a V2 to a V1 and the V2 buttons were larger and easier to manipulate. I am liking the V2, shot on Saturday with a buddy who had a Glock milled for RMR, he liked my Gen5 MOS with the 507C (https://www.amazon.com/Holosun-HS507C-Multi-Reticle-Pistol/dp/B084VGDK6K/ref=sr_1_2?crid=2IRPHHLBOHRLB&dchild=1&keywords=holosun+507c&qid=1588607727&sprefix=Holosun+%2Caps%2C145&sr=8-2), he offered to trade.

[elm3c]

Noisefighters, in your initial post for this thread, can you please identify the specific iron sights installed? I also have a G45 MOS, with the HE508T-V2 on order. I'm trying to find the lowest sights that would still work through the window. Thanks!

[noguns]

Op mentioned using gl429 by Ameriglo. I'm using the gl411 that have the same height. I just have a tritium front with white ring around the vial. I would say they are just barely tall enough to be usable.
I'm using a gen 5 MOS with ch precision v3 plate and holosun 508tv1.

[elm3c]

Op mentioned using gl429 by Ameriglo. I'm using the gl411 that have the same height. I just have a tritium front with white ring around the vial. I would say they are just barely tall enough to be usable.
I'm using a gen 5 MOS with ch precision v3 plate and holosun 508tv1.

Thanks, noguns! I appreciate the detail. I missed the point about the GL-429 in the original post. I'll go with the same setup.

[GyroF-16]

I’m toying with the idea of putting an HE508T on my Beretta 1301T, or maybe on a new AR pistol. I’ve been using MROs, and am pleased with them, but would like to try something smaller.
Anyone have experience with this (or another RMR-ish RDS) on either of these types?

[stomridertx]

Just a quick note to those perceiving a canted circle dot reticle in these optics. Make sure that is not also your astigmatism causing this effect. I had the exact same issue with a HS503GU on an AR, but noticed that the circle and hash mark would straighten back out when I viewed the whole reticle through the small rear aperture of the BUIS. That is not a test you can do with a pistol so it may make you think the reticle is canted, which it very well may be. My astigmatism affected the ACSS reticle version of the Holosun as well when I looked through one and it looked like a double horseshoe that was slightly out of alignment. Take a photo of the reticle with your phone and make sure it's really a canted emitter and not your eyesight. I recently got Rigid Gas Permeable contact lenses for my astigmatism and it has mostly cured the red dot problems for me.

[Basher]

NECROPOST!!!

Sorry about that, but this seems to be the only 508T specific thread here, so I felt it most belonged in this thread for now.

Anywhooo… I’m about ready to purchase an RDS or two for my 92G and PX4. I’m toying with the idea of a 509T for the 92G, but would have to buy a new plate for it. The EPS also appeals to me for the PX4, but again, a new plate setup would be required and the EPS are rare as hen’s teeth. Since the PX4 in particular will be a concealed EDC, I’m OK with using an open emitter, and thus need to decide between going with an RMR or the 508T.

My main holdup: ideally, I’d like to use the auto-adjust setting to save juice when concealed. I hear the RMR trumps the 508T here, as it is more “accurate”/responsive to adjusting to the target’s brightness whereas the 508T seems to adjust to the lighting over or near the unit itself. I’m looking to see if current models have improved there or not before I make my decision, hence this post. Any feedback I can get comparing the 508T to the RM06 or RM07 would be ideal. Thanks!

[Utm]

NECROPOST!!!

Sorry about that, but this seems to be the only 508T specific thread here, so I felt it most belonged in this thread for now.

Anywhooo… I’m about ready to purchase an RDS or two for my 92G and PX4. I’m toying with the idea of a 509T for the 92G, but would have to buy a new plate for it. The EPS also appeals to me for the PX4, but again, a new plate setup would be required and the EPS are rare as hen’s teeth. Since the PX4 in particular will be a concealed EDC, I’m OK with using an open emitter, and thus need to decide between going with an RMR or the 508T.

My main holdup: ideally, I’d like to use the auto-adjust setting to save juice when concealed. I hear the RMR trumps the 508T here, as it is more “accurate”/responsive to adjusting to the target’s brightness whereas the 508T seems to adjust to the lighting over or near the unit itself. I’m looking to see if current models have improved there or not before I make my decision, hence this post. Any feedback I can get comparing the 508T to the RM06 or RM07 would be ideal. Thanks!
I would choose the 508t because you don't need to take it off to change the battery. You can throw a new battery in every 6 months and be fine. I am not a fan of auto adjust personally but it is actually not bad on the rm07

[Basher]

Thanks!

Anyone else with feedback they’d be willing to share?

[GearFondler]

RMR auto adjust is not always perfect (WML can sometimes cause issues) but definitely better than the 508T.
The 508T has a taller window which can help with finding the dot and tracking it. The bottom portion of the RMR's window is hidden by the deck of the module when looking straight through it as happens when pistol mounted.

[breakingtime91]

Thanks!

Anyone else with feedback they’d be willing to share?

recently got a rmr06 on a glock 26. If I could go back I would of done a 508t but honestly with the holosun eps out, it wins. Just my opinion.

[Basher]

Thanks folks!

RE: the Holosun EPS. Langdon now has plates for them, but the problem is they’re ~$95 a set once you factor in tax and shipping, then the EPS is $350-400 depending on model. So that’s ~$500 each to set up my 92G and PX4. If I opt to just run a 508T or RMR for now, I could save $150-225 per pistol depending on which model I go with. That’s significant, plus the unknown backorder times. If the EPS proves itself, I’ll likely upgrade both eventually, but right now that’s not an option for me.

[DaBigBR]

NECROPOST!!!

Sorry about that, but this seems to be the only 508T specific thread here, so I felt it most belonged in this thread for now.

Anywhooo… I’m about ready to purchase an RDS or two for my 92G and PX4. I’m toying with the idea of a 509T for the 92G, but would have to buy a new plate for it. The EPS also appeals to me for the PX4, but again, a new plate setup would be required and the EPS are rare as hen’s teeth. Since the PX4 in particular will be a concealed EDC, I’m OK with using an open emitter, and thus need to decide between going with an RMR or the 508T.

My main holdup: ideally, I’d like to use the auto-adjust setting to save juice when concealed. I hear the RMR trumps the 508T here, as it is more “accurate”/responsive to adjusting to the target’s brightness whereas the 508T seems to adjust to the lighting over or near the unit itself. I’m looking to see if current models have improved there or not before I make my decision, hence this post. Any feedback I can get comparing the 508T to the RM06 or RM07 would be ideal. Thanks!

I would recommend against the auto adjust on either the RMR or 508T. They just do not work well enough when you are dealing with varying light conditions, particularly when you add weapon lights, handheld lights, etc. The 508T allows battery changes without removing the optic. CR1632s can be had for $2-$3 each. If you're concerned about it, replace every year or every six months or whatever.

[Basher]

I would recommend against the auto adjust on either the RMR or 508T. They just do not work well enough when you are dealing with varying light conditions, particularly when you add weapon lights, handheld lights, etc. The 508T allows battery changes without removing the optic. CR1632s can be had for $2-$3 each. If you're concerned about it, replace every year or every six months or whatever.

Thanks. Have you actually compared them back to back, in person, in the varying lighting situations you mention? Or do you have a link to a reputable source that has done this? I’m looking for actual feedback, not anecdotal stories, so just making sure I’m getting real-world advice from someone who’s experienced with both. :)

[DaBigBR]

I've got several of each and have used them extensively. The ONLY pistol optic that I have seen that I felt could keep up was the SCS, although to my eye it is almost always brighter than I would like. Everything else is usually dimmer than I would like and slower to respond.

Ultimately, all of this is subjective when we're talking about how our eyes perceive a particular optic in a particular set of circumstances.

[Basher]

I've got several of each and have used them extensively. The ONLY pistol optic that I have seen that I felt could keep up was the SCS, although to my eye it is almost always brighter than I would like. Everything else is usually dimmer than I would like and slower to respond.

Ultimately, all of this is subjective when we're talking about how our eyes perceive a particular optic in a particular set of circumstances.

Awesome, thanks for confirming that and for your feedback.

Ultimately I suppose you’re right regarding individual perceptions. Since both my pistols currently have the RMR plate, I may just have to save up and purchase one of each and compare for myself to see which I prefer and/or whether I trust the auto adjust on them.

Since you don’t seem to use that feature, what’s your preferred brightness setting for EDC that you anticipate will work with your own needs most of the time? I realize I’ll have to figure that out for myself when I get my optics, but I’m curious where most end up keeping their brightness at. Thanks again!

[DaBigBR]

I try to pick a brightness that will work in any lighting condition. I think the most challenging light condition is either very bright sunlight or, more likely, against a high output weapon or handheld light.

If I'm messing around with brightness I'll use my weapon light (X300 Ultra or Turbo, usually) against a white wall and use that to index the brightness. Generally, for me, that's going to be the second highest brightness on a red Holosun, the second or third highest on an RMR, and maybe the third or fourth highest on a green Holosun. I have some red color vision deficiency, so your mileage still vary. There are folks I work with whose dots I can barely see at their chosen setting, but they say they're fine with it and their shooting supports it.

Other than the battery location, my biggest issue with the Type 2 RMR is the brightness resetting itself to ambient conditions after several hours. If the gun is under a concealment garment or in a dark room when that happens, the dot may be too dim to see. It's obviously the shooter's responsibility to know the status of their gear, but not having an optic that is able to actively work against you would be my preference.