Another mass arson attack (Mexico)

[0ddl0t]

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/aug/28/mexico-bar-attack-fire-dead-injured-coatzacoalcos

23 dead so far... The attack comes just over 1 month since an arsonist killed 33 in Japan and almost 8 years to the day after another arson attack killed 52 in Monterrey.

[spinmove_]

Time to ban assault fire! We must have common sense fire control!


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[the Schwartz]

So, when will they ban "assault matches"?

It's for the children, y'know?

[Kanye Wyoming]

So, when will they ban "assault matches"?

It's for the children, y'know?

If you had bothered to educate yourself, you'd know that AM stands for Atlas Match, not Assault Match.
https://atlasmatch.com

Still, nobody NEEDS more than 10 matches in a matchbook. The NMA has blood on its hands.

ETA - at the very least we have to get rid of the legal loophole that allows the online purchase of high caliber military assault matches with no background check.

41827

[Greg]

Burning people to death is next level psychotic.

[RevolverRob]

Hey guys, I’m gownna be the wet blanket on your sarcasm party...w

Can we can the “let’s ban the X...!” Sarcasm shit?

We all tend to agree that prohibition doesn’t work and that humans will find a way to kill each other. 23 dead and counting for gang violence. Mexico is spiraling into a war zone and innocent people are being killed because of it.

This isn’t a narcissist seeking fame. This is cartel violence run amok. No different than ethnic cleansing.

[Kanye Wyoming]

Hey guys, I’m gownna be the wet blanket on your sarcasm party...w

Can we can the “let’s ban the X...!” Sarcasm shit?

We all tend to agree that prohibition doesn’t work and that humans will find a way to kill each other. 23 dead and counting for gang violence. Mexico is spiraling into a war zone and innocent people are being killed because of it.

This isn’t a narcissist seeking fame. This is cartel violence run amok. No different than ethnic cleansing.
Apologies for the sarcasm.

This is a terrible tragedy. Mexico is plagued by cartel violence and the country and its people would be much better off if cartel violence could be eliminated. Mass killing by means other than firearms could be thought to have relevance to the efforts in the U.S. to ban or restrict civilian ownership of all or some firearms or firearms components because it illustrates that people with evil in their hearts and/or a screw loose, who want to kill many other people, will always have a readily available means to do so that doesn't involve firearms.

Better?

[RevolverRob]

Apologies for the sarcasm.

This is a terrible tragedy. Mexico is plagued by cartel violence and the country and its people would be much better off if cartel violence could be eliminated. Mass killing by means other than firearms has no relevance to the efforts in the U.S. to ban or restrict civilian ownership of all or some firearms or firearms components because it in no way illustrates vividly that people with evil in their hearts and/or a screw loose, who want to kill many other people, will always have a readily available means to do so that doesn't involve firearms.

Better?

No.

We can both discuss reasonably how a culture of disarmament can promote horrific acts of violence using other means than firearms. But we can do so in a manner that is productive, genuine, and lacks the acerbic ‘wit’ that so many default to.

In other words, it’s possible to be both reflective and empathetic.

Being an asshole doesn’t accomplish much. Other than make you look like an asshole. And it’s a good way to make other people think you lack empathy. I don’t believe you, personally Zimmer81, lack empathy. Nor do I think anyone here really lacks empathy. But we should think about how we discuss and word things. Not just amongst ourselves in “the locker room” - but in general. We really must endeavor to be and project the message we desire to be seen.

[Kanye Wyoming]

No.

We can both discuss reasonably how a culture of disarmament can promote horrific acts of violence using other means than firearms. But we can do so in a manner that is productive, genuine, and lacks the acerbic ‘wit’ that so many default to.

In other words, it’s possible to be both reflective and empathetic.

Being an asshole doesn’t accomplish much. Other than make you look like an asshole. And it’s a good way to make other people think you lack empathy. I don’t believe you, personally Zimmer81, lack empathy. Nor do I think anyone here really lacks empathy. But we should think about how we discuss and word things. Not just amongst ourselves in “the locker room” - but in general. We really must endeavor to be and project the message we desire to be seen.


Humor is one of the most effective ways of confronting adversity and coping with difficult situations, especially when we have little control over them, or none at all. “By laughing at our fate, it is as if we were stepping out of a situation and looking at it from a distance, as if we were outside observers, so to speak,” writes Rabbi Reuven Bulka.

By so doing, we gain the ability to transcend the circumstances, which may be the cause of our anguish. Theodor Reik, a disciple of Sigmund Freud who settled in New York in the 1920s, remarked that life is often tragic and sad. By joking about it, we succeed in transcending the tragic character of an event and bringing it under our control. “By using humor, the lament often turns into laughter,” remarked Reik (Jewish Wit, New York, 1962).

What do you suppose makes Jews joke so much about adversity? “It is the instinct for self-preservation” says Ausubel. “By laughing at the absurdities and cruelties of life, we draw much of the sting from them. The jester’s bells make an honest tinkle, and his comic capers conceal his inner gravity. His satire and irony have one virtue: you never for a moment suspect that his barbs are directed at you. And so you laugh boisterously, feeling supe*rior to the poor shmiggege, while all the time, it is you who are the target!”

In Jewish humor, comedy and tragedy are intertwined and it is often what you might call “laughter through tears,” or as we say in Yiddish, “a bitterer gelekhter!”
https://www.myjewishlearning.com/article/laughing-through-the-tears/

[blues]

Rob, I know you mean well but seriously, you don't get to choose when it's appropriate for a sarcastic remark or cynical reply, especially from the moral high ground.

Perhaps you should comb through your posts on this board and then try to remember the adage: "Physician, heal thyself!"

[RevolverRob]

https://www.myjewishlearning.com/article/laughing-through-the-tears/

So your excuse for being an asshole then being called on it is - you’re using humor to cope with the difficulty of the situation? Or are you just being an asshole...

Humor is a great way to deal with genuine tragedy and loss. But there is an appropriate time and place for it. And an appropriate time and place for a serious discussion.

If you can’t tell the difference then probably best to observe the old adage, “Better to be thought a fool, than open your mouth and remove all doubt.”

[RevolverRob]

Rob, I know you mean well but seriously, you don't get to choose when it's appropriate for a sarcastic remark or cynical reply, especially from the moral high ground.

Perhaps you should comb through your posts on this board and then try to remember the adage: "Physician, heal thyself!"

I never deny being an asshole who occasionally lacks empathy. We all are.

Perhaps we can take it as, “Takes one to know one” and leave it at that?

[spinmove_]

No.

We can both discuss reasonably how a culture of disarmament can promote horrific acts of violence using other means than firearms. But we can do so in a manner that is productive, genuine, and lacks the acerbic ‘wit’ that so many default to.

In other words, it’s possible to be both reflective and empathetic.

Being an asshole doesn’t accomplish much. Other than make you look like an asshole. And it’s a good way to make other people think you lack empathy. I don’t believe you, personally Zimmer81, lack empathy. Nor do I think anyone here really lacks empathy. But we should think about how we discuss and word things. Not just amongst ourselves in “the locker room” - but in general. We really must endeavor to be and project the message we desire to be seen.

Dude. Seriously, just chill. We’re not the ones you need to preach to on this matter nor are we so callous that any of us find our sarcasm genuinely hilarious. This is YET ANOTHER tragedy that has occurred that the general masses will get bent out of shape over for all the wrong reasons that they’ll do absolutely nothing about. Our sarcasm in response to this is our way of coping for another tragedy while simultaneously being irritated that other tragedies are allowed to erode our rights. It’s a lose/lose/lose. And then you come along waggling your finger in our faces telling us that WE need to be better than that.

Yes, we can be better, but so can everyone else on such a more grander scale. Our sarcasm is the equivalent of taking away our plastic straws in an effort to fix climate change. Go wet blanket Moms Demand Action or something before you start hammering your own.


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[RevolverRob]

Dude. Seriously, just chill. We’re not the ones you need to preach to on this matter nor are we so callous that any of us find our sarcasm genuinely hilarious. This is YET ANOTHER tragedy that has occurred that the general masses will get bent out of shape over for all the wrong reasons that they’ll do absolutely nothing about. Our sarcasm in response to this is our way of coping for another tragedy while simultaneously being irritated that other tragedies are allowed to erode our rights. It’s a lose/lose/lose. And then you come along waggling your finger in our faces telling us that WE need to be better than that.

Yes, we can be better, but so can everyone else on such a more grander scale. Our sarcasm is the equivalent of taking away our plastic straws in an effort to fix climate change. Go wet blanket Moms Demand Action or something before you start hammering your own.


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BULLSHIT.

Hammering on and policing your own is the way you generate a unified front to face obstacles together.

Don’t give me that shit. Don’t like being called callous? Stop writing callous shit.

[the Schwartz]

41830

[TexasSiegfried]

It seems to me that there may be a very serious personal reason and background to this reaction to the humor usex in this situation.

I, for one, would be happy to "listen", if you wish to share.

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[blues]

It seems to me that there may be a very serious personal reason and background to this reaction to the humor usex in this situation.

I, for one, would be happy to "listen", if you wish to share.

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I don't think he'll accommodate you in an open forum...he's been burned before.

[spinmove_]

BULLSHIT.

Hammering on and policing your own is the way you generate a unified front to face obstacles together.

Don’t give me that shit. Don’t like being called callous? Stop writing callous shit.

I can be an extremely callous motherfucker. I’m not offended to be called as such, so by all means, label me as such in your mind. I’m all out of feels to be hit right in at the moment so your empathetic lamenting against a coping mechanism is really nothing more than inane whining to my ears.

I agree that policing your own is the way to move forward, but this specific hill in this specific instance is not one that I would suggest dying on. Go find a better hill. I’ll probably be right next to you on it.

Until then, relax, Francis.


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[RevolverRob]

It seems to me that there may be a very serious personal reason and background to this reaction to the humor usex in this situation.

I, for one, would be happy to "listen", if you wish to share.

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Thanks. Maybe I am a little extra-sensitive to this one for personal reasons.

That said I kind of expected to make it three posts before the sarcasm. Or at least a, “Fucking tragedy.” Followed by the coping mechanism or sarcasm. That’s kind how coping mechanisms work.

And Blues is right - I am not on a moral high ground. I am well know for callous and insensitive remarks at times. And just like others expect better of me and I expect better of me I can ask the same. So next time I’m acting like an asshole, call me out on it.


I don't think he'll accommodate you in an open forum...he's been burned before.

See, that was actually funny.


I can be an extremely callous motherfucker. I’m not offended to be called as such, so by all means, label me as such in your mind. I’m all out of feels to be hit right in at the moment so your empathetic lamenting against a coping mechanism is really nothing more than inane whining to my ears.

I agree that policing your own is the way to move forward, but this specific hill in this specific instance is not one that I would suggest dying on. Go find a better hill. I’ll probably be right next to you on it.

Until then, relax, Francis.


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This hill is gone. Next time we can all think twice before going straight to sarcasm.

We could remember that these folks were friends, relatives, brothers, sisters, fathers, mothers.

And then we can go to the dark humor -

In this scenario we can look at the bright side, though many were lost, their families will at least save money on cremations.















Too soon?

[spinmove_]

Thanks. Maybe I am a little extra-sensitive to this one for personal reasons.

That said I kind of expected to make it three posts before the sarcasm. Or at least a, “Fucking tragedy.” Followed by the coping mechanism or sarcasm. That’s kind how coping mechanisms work.

And Blues is right - I am not on a moral high ground. I am well know for callous and insensitive remarks at times. And just like others expect better of me and I expect better of me I can ask the same. So next time I’m acting like an asshole, call me out on it.



See, that was actually funny.



This hill is gone. Next time we can all think twice before going straight to sarcasm.

We could remember that these folks were friends, relatives, brothers, sisters, fathers, mothers.

And then we can go to the dark humor -

In this scenario we can look at the bright side, though many were lost, their families will at least save money on cremations.















Too soon?

So, lemme get this straight, you’re going to slam me for being sarcastic and then pull a cremation joke in the same thread? And it’s because I didn’t feel sorry enough to your standards via writing it in the thread (because I couldn’t have possibly said a prayer for those people outside of the thread) before being sarcastic? Get fucked, buddy, and check your self-righteousness before going off half-cocked next time.


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[RevolverRob]

So, lemme get this straight, you’re going to slam me for being sarcastic and then pull a cremation joke in the same thread? And it’s because I didn’t feel sorry enough to your standards via writing it in the thread (because I couldn’t have possibly said a prayer for those people outside of the thread) before being sarcastic? Get fucked, buddy, and check your self-righteousness before going off half-cocked next time.


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Now that is proper outrage. The kind of actual fucking emotion that should be felt about these things.

I didn’t slam you personally (go back and read what I wrote).

That doesn’t preclude you making a joke. And it didn’t single you out.

Making tasteless jokes rubs you the wrong way - why? Wonder why the relentless dead horse beating rubbed me the wrong way?

I’m not trying to be self-righteous. I actually admitted to profligate sarcasm and assholery one post ago.

To quote you, “relax, Francis...”

[the Schwartz]

*Aren't we a morose bunch today?






*Of course, this is nothing unusual. 🤣

[Maple Syrup Actual]

Personally I think it's unfortunate that instead of having a discussion about this event we're now having a discussion about the discussion.

Targeted arson killings are exactly the next level of antisocial mass violence I expect to see and I have been dreading the move from guns to incendiaries for years.

[blues]

Personally I think it's unfortunate that instead of having a discussion about this event we're now having a discussion about the discussion.

Targeted arson killings are exactly the next level of antisocial mass violence I expect to see and I have been dreading the move from guns to incendiaries for years.

Cheap and easy wins the day. Biologicals and chemicals will round out the available tools.

Let's face it...it won't be for the want of tools that mayhem is curbed.

[Totem Polar]

Targeted arson killings are exactly the next level of antisocial mass violence I expect to see and I have been dreading the move from guns to incendiaries for years.

So, what I think I hear you saying is: gun violence has finally met its match.

[Maple Syrup Actual]

I mean is this truly the branch on which we all need... to light?

[spinmove_]

Now that is proper outrage. The kind of actual fucking emotion that should be felt about these things.

I didn’t slam you personally (go back and read what I wrote).

That doesn’t preclude you making a joke. And it didn’t single you out.

Making tasteless jokes rubs you the wrong way - why? Wonder why the relentless dead horse beating rubbed me the wrong way?

I’m not trying to be self-righteous. I actually admitted to profligate sarcasm and assholery one post ago.

To quote you, “relax, Francis...”

You read WAY too much into things in the internet. Outrage? No, just irritation towards your hypocrisy. And then you have the gall to tell me to check my emotions?

I’m done. Y’all have fun.


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[TheNewbie]

I go to Mexico often. Walk alone in the dark.


Still, there is always a lingering sense in me that things aren’t like they are back in Kansas.


Mexico has some serious cultural problems as it relates to corruption and violence. Ask people who are from
there about it sometime, and no I don’t mean ask Jorge Ramos.

[blues]

You read WAY too much into things in the internet. Outrage? No, just irritation towards your hypocrisy. And then you have the gall to tell me to check my emotions?

I’m done. Y’all have fun.


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Meh...just consider the source and don your flame suit!

[spinmove_]

Meh...just consider the source and don your flame suit!

Well, there IS plenty of retardant for the flames...


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[fly out]

Personally I think it's unfortunate that instead of having a discussion about this event we're now having a discussion about the discussion.

Targeted arson killings are exactly the next level of antisocial mass violence I expect to see and I have been dreading the move from guns to incendiaries for years.

As we've all heard, and some of us probably forget from time to time, Columbine was a failed bombing before it was a shooting.

[Lex Luthier]

Personally I think it's unfortunate that instead of having a discussion about this event we're now having a discussion about the discussion.

Targeted arson killings are exactly the next level of antisocial mass violence I expect to see and I have been dreading the move from guns to incendiaries for years.

I hit the like button, but that's because there's no " nod and shudder at the thought" button.

There is an annual gathering less than two miles from my house that will host over a million people over the course of this week. I hope that nothing of the kind is afoot here, and that those in charge of preventing such things are bringing their best game.

[blues]

Well, there IS plenty of retardant for the flames...


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That's the spirit!

[HCountyGuy]

I’m telling you guys - PFestivus in the open desert with sim guns would help get the frustration out!

As for the original topic, it takes a truly twisted sumbitch to light other people on fire.

[RevolverRob]

Well, there IS plenty of retardant for the flames...


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Just don’t let your flamethrower be retarded by running out of napalm.

—

Look guys - I have to go get a sonogram next week to have my gall bladder and liver checked. But I’m afraid they’ll find out I’m pregnant. If they do, I’ll be sure to let you guys know, so you can write off my bitchiness for an actual reason. :rolleyes:

[Totem Polar]

As for the original topic, it takes a truly twisted sumbitch to light other people on fire.

Absolutely this. That said, as a species, we’ve been known to do such, recreationally, for centuries. I’m just glad that the occasion currently draws forth horror, and not spectators—as in days of yore.

#angelsofourbetternature
#witchcraft
#publicstakings

[HCM]

I’m so glad something like this could never happen in the U.S. ....oh, wait, it did ....

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Happy_Land_fire

[FNFAN]

We had a despondent college instructor going through a divorce whip up a nice jar of ricin. He ended up just doing himself, but I always wondered what his full plan was. Not hard to inflict your madness on society with a little creativity.

[FrankinCA]

Yes, I’ve been keeping up on this. Fire, started remotely, may be the next trend.

[scjbash]

I agree with Rob about the "time to ban x jokes" but for a completely different reason. They simply aren't funny. Maybe they were a few million tellings ago but at this point they are just predictable, tired, and plain old fucking lame.