Active shooter in Philadelphia

[BaiHu]

At least six officers have been shot in an "active and ongoing" scene in Philadelphia, police said.

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[Cory]

Looks like it's literally going on right now.

Hang in there Philly PD.

-Cory

[Chance]

It evidently started as a narcotics call. Doesn't sound like a mass shooter.

[BaiHu]

It evidently started as a narcotics call. Doesn't sound like a mass shooter.Mods feel free to change the title. Thanks Chance

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[Hambo]

Warrant service that turned into a barricaded subject.


https://www.foxnews.com/us/philadelphia-shootout-multiple-officers-hurt

[TC215]

Sounds like there are 1 or 2 narc guys still inside, possibly hostages.

[NEPAKevin]

Philadelphia... prolonged shootout...barricaded suspect.... May 14, 1985 (https://www.nytimes.com/1985/05/14/us/police-drop-bomb-on-radicals-home-in-philadelphia.html)

[TGS]

News talking head said HRT is on scene. That would've been a super quick deployment if they hadn't already been in town, but my guess is they're not actually there and the news just doesn't know what they're saying.

[Drang]

Philadelphia... prolonged shootout...barricaded suspect.... May 14, 1985 (https://www.nytimes.com/1985/05/14/us/police-drop-bomb-on-radicals-home-in-philadelphia.html)

The only time I ever heard my father actually use profanity.

[Lester Polfus]

News talking head said HRT is on scene. That would've been a super quick deployment if they hadn't already been in town, but my guess is they're not actually there and the news just doesn't know what they're saying.

I wonder if they are confusing the local FBI Swat team with HRT.

[BillSWPA]

Don't we have at least one Philadelphia police officer participating on this forum? Hope they are ok.

The news reports I have seen indicate that it was a police action targeting drug dealers.

[TheNewbie]

Sounds like there are 1 or 2 narc guys still inside, possibly hostages.


Any updates on this?

[Chance]

Apparently two officers, and potentially people apprehended in the raid, are still inside. I'm guessing they can't safely leave as there's no mention of hostages.

[Drang]

Apparently two officers, and potentially people apprehended in the raid, are still inside. I'm guessing they can't safely leave as there's no mention of hostages.

CNN says "trapped inside".
(We monitor the Commie News Network 24/7.
(Sound off, thank God.
(They're bene running this since I got to work today, without, apparently, saying anything.)

[Chance]

CBSN is saying there was a raid down the road and the police might have moved to the present location on a tip. They're saying thirty officers discharged their weapons.

[RJ]

What a mess. Hope all the officers and bystanders end up safe.

Anyone know if the Philly PD has a Robot?

[Chance]

The police officers inside were stuck on the second floor, with the shooter on the first. They have reportedly gotten out, along with one of their prisoners. There may be two prisoners remaining on the second floor.

The talking heads are now talking for the sake of talking, and the reporters on scene aren't sure if they're hearing gun shots or thunder, so I think I'm finished with coverage for the evening. Hopefully the shooter gives up and this concludes without more people getting hurt.

[HCountyGuy]

Suspect surrendered and is in custody.

[Hambo]

Anyone know if the Philly PD has a Robot?

I'm sure they do, but I'm curious why you think it would matter.

[HCountyGuy]

I'm sure they do, but I'm curious why you think it would matter.

Think Dallas...

[Hambo]

Think Dallas...

Just because PPD used a bomb once doesn't mean their command staff has the stones to do it again.

[Cypher]

I get the feeling that this is going to be the thing that galvanizes them. If the antis don't get an assault weapons ban out of this they won't get one out of anything

[BillSWPA]

The incident is now over with the suspect in custody.

He had an AK-47 and multiple handguns despite multiple gun convictions which made his possession of those guns illegal. PA already has universal background checks for all transfers except between husband and wife, parent and child, and grandparent and child. This situation is being used to call for more gun control, but if anything, it shows that gun control does not work.



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[Irelander]

I get the feeling that this is going to be the thing that galvanizes them. If the antis don't get an assault weapons ban out of this they won't get one out of anything

Yeah I'm sure they will expect that drug dealers will give up their weapons during an "assault" weapons ban. Strong delusion abounds.

[Cypher]

Yeah I'm sure they will expect that drug dealers will give up their weapons during an "assault" weapons ban. Strong delusion abounds.

It's not the drug dealers they're trying to disarm

[Yung]

I get the feeling that this is going to be the thing that galvanizes them. If the antis don't get an assault weapons ban out of this they won't get one out of anything

That's an interesting idea that people applied this to Sandy Hook but it might not apply to a high-risk warrant that ended with a higher number of wounded officers than the public might expect.

I'm reminded of a couple relatively recent videos around California and Nevada and elsewhere, where multiple rounds were fired during vehicle pursuit or in an area where a lot of cars were passing by.

I will not pretend to know the details of this particular situation yet, nor do I know anything about what the outlook on training is for law enforcement in Philadelphia and to what degree it influenced the outcomes here. However when I read the mayor's reaction to this, along with Mr. Weems' remarks on the the mentally disturbed individual with a knife attacking two Athens officers, I must hope that what you say is not true, because it's one thing if the civilian disarmament agenda gets pushed further. But it is another entirely new thing to me if the increased media attention on police controversies and casualties that result from perpetually mismanaged/underfunded/undertrained departments is used to justify that.

[Cypher]

That's an interesting idea that people applied this to Sandy Hook but it might not apply to a high-risk warrant that ended with a higher number of wounded officers than the public might expect.

I'm reminded of a couple relatively recent videos around California and Nevada and elsewhere, where multiple rounds were fired during vehicle pursuit or in an area where a lot of cars were passing by.

I will not pretend to know the details of this particular situation yet, nor do I know anything about what the outlook on training is for law enforcement in Philadelphia and to what degree it influenced the outcomes here. However when I read the mayor's reaction to this, along with Mr. Weems' remarks on the the mentally disturbed individual with a knife attacking two Athens officers, I must hope that what you say is not true, because it's one thing if the civilian disarmament agenda gets pushed further. But it is another entirely new thing to me if the increased media attention on police controversies and casualties that result from perpetually mismanaged/underfunded/undertrained departments is used to justify that.

I suspect they're going to frame it as "Not even the police are safe from these weapons of war."

ETA well what do you know

https://www.facebook.com/67450987175/posts/10157840737842176/

[blues]

The fact that most chiefs and commissioners are not 2A proponents will only help the antis.

[Guinnessman]

I suspect they're going to frame it as "Not even the police are safe from these weapons of war."

ETA well what do you know

https://www.facebook.com/67450987175/posts/10157840737842176/

Well Mr. Mayor, maybe you should arm your officers with better gear and training!

Unbelievable.

[psalms144.1]

Well Mr. Mayor, maybe you should arm your officers with better gear and training!

Unbelievable.It struck me as odd (and sad) that one of the original police radio communications requesting help SPECIFICALLY called for officers with rifles to respond. Meaning Philly PD hit a known dope target with at least one known violent offender in residence WITHOUT any long guns. Because why?

Regardless, I just wish that well meaning people on the other side of this argument would realize that passing a restrictive law isn't the same as using a Harry Potter wand and yelling "expeli armus!" The BG who are getting their weapons and armor illegally will continue to do so. Restrictive laws ONLY affect the law abiding - criminals will continue to ignore them...

[Poconnor]

Illegal drugs are brought in by the ton from all over the world. Would anybody be surprised if drug traffickers started selling military weapons to drug dealers? Imagine a drug stash house with RPGs and belt fed machine guns. Last I knew philly PD had its own swat team, negotiators not to mention a stakeout squad. I would be surprised if they didn’t have a robot. Finally, PA does not have universal background checks. When you read title 18 section 6111 it reads like it does but you have to read all of it. That section uses a very specific definition of firearms with translated into handguns, same as the carry permit.

[OlongJohnson]

So if they do a ban like they did before, where it's non-confiscatory, you want to have everything you'll ever want or need in advance. If they get confiscation, having more stuff that's subject to it is just a straight financial loss for those who do not risk the total destruction that non-compliance can lead to. Which way to go?

[RJ]

I'm sure they do, but I'm curious why you think it would matter.

A robot was used to resolve a situation with a barricaded individual in 2016.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-texas-crime-idUSKBN1FK35W



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[Rex G]

Illegal drugs are brought in by the ton from all over the world. Would anybody be surprised if drug traffickers started selling military weapons to drug dealers?

Already happening, since the early/mid-Eighties, at least; probably much earlier. The specific example, related to me, by a federal investigator, were crates of Chinese pistols, seized from a narc-related operation. The find was in southern Texas, IIRC. Pistols are small, true, but, “crates” are not small. This was a first-person account, told to me in the Eighties.

One of my former colleagues worked his way into narcotics, and then into multi-agency stuff, which included investigational stings of LEOs and customs/border folks looking the other way, and/or waving things through. He was not seizing things, as he was UC, at that time, but, yes, with the right folks paid-off, a convoy of tractor-trailer trucks could bring anything through a remote border crossing in the wee hours. (I do not know if the increased use of body-worn cameras has yet reached the border-crossing personnel since that time.)

[BillSWPA]

Illegal drugs are brought in by the ton from all over the world. Would anybody be surprised if drug traffickers started selling military weapons to drug dealers? Imagine a drug stash house with RPGs and belt fed machine guns. Last I knew philly PD had its own swat team, negotiators not to mention a stakeout squad. I would be surprised if they didn’t have a robot. Finally, PA does not have universal background checks. When you read title 18 section 6111 it reads like it does but you have to read all of it. That section uses a very specific definition of firearms with translated into handguns, same as the carry permit.

I just checked that statute, and it does appear that the universal background checks do not apply to rifles or shotguns, but they definitely apply to the multiple handguns used by the drug dealer in this case.



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[Wake27]

Illegal drugs are brought in by the ton from all over the world. Would anybody be surprised if drug traffickers started selling military weapons to drug dealers? Imagine a drug stash house with RPGs and belt fed machine guns. Last I knew philly PD had its own swat team, negotiators not to mention a stakeout squad. I would be surprised if they didn’t have a robot. Finally, PA does not have universal background checks. When you read title 18 section 6111 it reads like it does but you have to read all of it. That section uses a very specific definition of firearms with translated into handguns, same as the carry permit.

I don’t know about RPGs but I’m absolutely surprised that we haven’t seen more automatic weapons smuggled in and used.


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[Poconnor]

It always changes and escalates. They would start with AK underfolders, that would quickly move to belt fed. Look at the rise of the technical truck in Mexico. Once they get dushku machine guns RPGs are next. Not to mention drones etc. it has already happened in small numbers. If it gets wide spread like in Mexico it will be mad max time and civilian police will drastically change and not for the better. I don’t think it will get that bad. I think LE agencies will start targeting technical trucks by air with drones or helicopters. I will never forget watching the live thermal feed of three insurgents setting up a mortar tube to hit my JSS. An Apache helicopter was in the right place at the right time. A short burst with the chain gun and it was over except to clean up the pieces. Doesn’t Texas LE patrol the border river in boats with 240s? Or is that only for special circumstances?

[NEPAKevin]

Philly shooting prompts Gov. Wolf to delay gun violence executive order (https://www.witf.org/news/2019/08/gov-tom-wolf-will-sign-sweeping-executive-order-to-reduce-gun-violence.php)


This story has been updated. The governor's office announced the signing ceremony planned for Thursday would be postponed out of "respect for the officers injured" in a North Philadelphia standoff.

Translation. Never let a crisis go to waste.

[BillSWPA]

Philly shooting prompts Gov. Wolf to delay gun violence executive order (https://www.witf.org/news/2019/08/gov-tom-wolf-will-sign-sweeping-executive-order-to-reduce-gun-violence.php)



Translation. Never let a crisis go to waste.

While I doubt there is much that can be done by executive order other than the data sharing among agencies, the article describes the orders only by their goals, not their actual substance.

[Cypher]

https://www.congress.gov/bill/116th-congress/house-bill/1296/text?r=21&s=1

[WobblyPossum]

https://www.congress.gov/bill/116th-congress/house-bill/1296/text?r=21&s=1

That bill was proposed about six months ago. As far as I know, it never made it out of committee. I still don’t see it going anywhere.