How useful do you find night sights?

[TR675]

I haven't found them especially useful to date, but my experience is very limited.

Background: Night sights came standard on an M&Pfs, which I used in a Hackathorn class with a low-light section. They were moderately useful in near-pitch black with no flashlight and precious little moonlight. I couldn't hardly see the target but knowing where it was I could line up the sights.

I used an M&P9c with CT lasergrips and night sights at the Polite Society Tac Con this year. In moderately low-light conditions I could barely pick up the night sights when I very briefly tried to use them. The laser, on the other hand, was fantastically useful throughout the course of fire.

Later, I attended a Givens lecture about low light tactics where he made the following points:

1. night sights are useful only in a very small spectrum of light conditions which very rarely occur in the continental U.S. The usefulness in a small spectrum bit is in accord with my experiences above.

2. if there is enough illumination to see the target, you can pick up your sights, so spend your money on ammo and learn how to shoot in low light without night sights.

3. if there isn't enough illumination to see your sights at all, you probably can't see the target either, so you shouldn't be shooting at anything anyway.

All of that makes makes sense to me to one degree or another.

What is your experience with night sights? How useful do you find them? And, most importantly, does that usefulness outweigh their expense?

[orionz06]

After using certain Ameriglo and 10-8/Redback One combinations I am less likely to feel helpless without a rear but the front needs to be there for me. I found myself losing the front sight and getting misaligned in a recent AMIS class from Southnarc. I also agree with the comments mentioned from Givens. I sort of got there myself and used it to justify a front only. In the long run, for me, the cost to have them is minimal and will not impact my training so I get them.

[JeffJ]

A few months ago I shot an IDPA classifier in the evening as a storm rolled in. At one point I could make out the targets downrange but could barely make out the outline of my gun. Without night sights I wouldn't have even pulled the trigger, with my night sights I made my hits. We re-adjusted the range for better lighting conditions after that string - but it confirmed, for me, that night sights are a necessity.

Granted, had I pulled out my flashlight I could have neck indexed or even had enough flash to use non-night sights. But that would have taken substantially more time which is kind of important shooting a classifier as well as in an SD situation.

I have now experienced first hand an instance where I could ID my target, but not see my sights - so it's night sights for me (at least on carry/fighting pistols)

ETA - I shoot glocks, so I've got to change the sights anyway, therefore I consider it a very minor expense

[ToddG]

Didn't we just have this discussion?

I've found night sights incredibly useful in a wide variety of conditions. I've shot plenty of IDPA stages in realistic lighting conditions where a flashlight wasn't needed to ID the threat but there wasn't nearly enough light on the target to get a good sight picture.

[JV_]

Didn't we just have this discussion?It does seem to come up a lot. http://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?814-Let%E2%80%99s-talk-about-front-posts-amp-rear-notches&p=19111&viewfull=1#post19111

[TR675]

Didn't mean to beat a dead horse. Thanks for the link.

[David Armstrong]

I haven't found them especially useful to date, but my experience is very limited.

Background: Night sights came standard on an M&Pfs, which I used in a Hackathorn class with a low-light section. They were moderately useful in near-pitch black with no flashlight and precious little moonlight. I couldn't hardly see the target but knowing where it was I could line up the sights.

I used an M&P9c with CT lasergrips and night sights at the Polite Society Tac Con this year. In moderately low-light conditions I could barely pick up the night sights when I very briefly tried to use them. The laser, on the other hand, was fantastically useful throughout the course of fire.

Later, I attended a Givens lecture about low light tactics where he made the following points:

1. night sights are useful only in a very small spectrum of light conditions which very rarely occur in the continental U.S. The usefulness in a small spectrum bit is in accord with my experiences above.

2. if there is enough illumination to see the target, you can pick up your sights, so spend your money on ammo and learn how to shoot in low light without night sights.

3. if there isn't enough illumination to see your sights at all, you probably can't see the target either, so you shouldn't be shooting at anything anyway.

All of that makes makes sense to me to one degree or another.

What is your experience with night sights? How useful do you find them? And, most importantly, does that usefulness outweigh their expense?

I'd have to disagree with 1, 2, and 3. My experience is that night sights are useful across a rather broad spectrum of lighting conditions. #2 & #3 are patently incorrect. There are many situations where you can see the target and not be able to see the sights. Personally, I'd like night sights on all my fightng guns.

[Byron]

Here's another link in which points #2 and 3 were discussed a fair amount:

http://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?2957-Illuminated-Front-Sight-Only

[Chuck Haggard]

I've worked nights on the street for most of my 25 years on the job. During that time I have encountered pretty much every lighting condition you can find in an urban area. I am also an adjunct for Strategos so I get rather a bit more than average training time on the low-light subject matter.

I find it common to be in a situation where you can ID the target, yet due to clothing, especially black clothing, you would be unable to see your sights.

The best night shift urban cop sights I have found so far are the Ameriglo green trit/orange paint ring front with the black rear with yellow tritium. Just to show where my opion falls.

[TR675]

Great, thanks for the replies. Opportunities for low light shooting around here are pretty slim, so I appreciate the input.

On my current set up the night sights are a backup in case the lasergrip goes down, but I am happy to have the option and glad to see they are useful in and of themselves.

[FotoTomas]

All of my personal defense guns have night sights except for my revolvers. At some point I want at least a front sight on them as well.

My shotgun and AR both have front only. In my opinion they are very much worth having. I too, many times in my LE career, have had circumstances on duty where night sights would have been a boon. Back then it was not an option. Now, for me, it is a requirement.

I also want to add this. Seeing those little green eyes on the nightstand make me happy when I go lights out.

[Failure2Stop]

I like them for the reasons already mentioned, but also for another reason:
When close and under stress I tend to target-focus, and in the absence of light for wahtever reason, the little bright bits of radioactive gas give me something to line up quickly as the gun moves out even if the sights aren't in sharp focus. I find this to be pretty helpful if the target color doesn't highly contrast with the sights in the lighting conditions present.

[BWT]

Gives the eyes something to gravitate to.

Because depending on the darkness level, etc, you're point shooting. I mean some people may handle a gun a lot, and be very good with said gun and point it very well, but, I like the reference, I like the ability to discern.

Plus... let's be honest, for the cost of night sights (even though you're looking at basically 120-ish and 30-50 to install), you're getting your money's worth. Good night sights are generally great day sights as well, IMHO. They're more than the glow in the dark vials.

ETA: For instance, not only do the Warren Sights on my Glock 17 have tritium vials. They also are metal. I also went with a .245'' front sight height to "shoot the dot" instead of shoot ontop of the dot, which is what is traditional in Glock sights. They also have a good shape, now I'll be honest, I was skeptical, and I mean skeptical about the whole Warren tactical "Our sights naturally attract the human eye to the front sight" deal, I was. I've changed my opinion, I think they work well, would a U-Notch rear sight work just as well? Possibly, but, I like the Warren 2-dot sights. I've tried traditional three dot, and squared rear notches, and re-painting the front sight orange, etc, and I just didn't get that natural magnetism to the front sight, or become as cognisant of it. I shot a gun with Warren 2-dot night sights on it and it just worked for me, I found that I did in fact focus on the front sight, in the light, and it was much less busy at night with the two dots, so they meet my needs very well. I like the thinner front sight for more accuracy, I can't recall the width off the top of my head. I want to say .125 but that doesn't seem right, I know the rear sight is a .150'' notch.

But, even if I got all Black Warrens in the same configuration, I'd only be saving what? 30-40 bucks, and I'd still have all of those benefits, where actually only one is the vials. Plus, batteries die, and door kicker military units also have guys for back up, and they better not be shooting a pistol anyway, how many of them aren't using Electronic Optics? There's a challenge, find a military/L.E. unit that shoots in doors a lot, and is very active that doesn't like Electronic optics. I'd say most of them are using some kind of Electronic Optic and a light in conjunction almost 100% of the time.

I see that as comparative to not liking night sights on pistols.