Used AR Lower Question

[23JAZ]

Hypothetically question. You buy a used lower via a private party. How do you know you can build a pistol with it if the seller never specified if it was originally a rifle or pistol? Does the original format of the gun matter since you bought it stripped?

[Dave J]

Not a lawyer, or an ATF agent, but if I didn't know FOR SURE that the 4473 it was originally sold had it recorded as a "pistol" (or "other", for a stripped receiver), I wouldn't even consider building it into anything but a rifle. New lowers aren't that expensive.

[MistWolf]

Contact the manufacturer with the serial number to see what configuration it was originally sold as.

[Darth_Uno]

As you know, the ATF says the "gun" is not the entire gun, it's just the receiver. If it was originally sold as a rifle, you may not convert it to a pistol.

I'll also add that I bet a ton of people have done it, most likely not even knowing the law says not to. Nor have I heard of anyone getting prosecuted for it. But it's still illegal.

I'd just buy another lower. Cheap insurance.

[CleverNickname]

Not a lawyer, or an ATF agent, but if I didn't know FOR SURE that the 4473 it was originally sold had it recorded as a "pistol" (or "other", for a stripped receiver), I wouldn't even consider building it into anything but a rifle. New lowers aren't that expensive.

But even then, it would still be possible for someone to buy a stripped lower, have the FFL record it as an "other" when transferred, build it into a rifle, and then later strip off the upper and stock and just sell the lower. The 2nd owner could not legally build it into a pistol, but there'd be no paper trail proving that.

[Norville]

Snip...

I'd just buy another lower. Cheap insurance.

Same here, build this one as a rifle, get a nice new lower sold as an “other”

[MistWolf]

But even then, it would still be possible for someone to buy a stripped lower, have the FFL record it as an "other" when transferred, build it into a rifle, and then later strip off the upper and stock and just sell the lower. The 2nd owner could not legally build it into a pistol, but there'd be no paper trail proving that.

Yes, there is. The manufacturer keeps record how the receiver was convicted when it left the factory.

[CleverNickname]

Yes, there is. The manufacturer keeps record how the receiver was convicted when it left the factory.

It may have left the factory as an "other", but there's nothing legally stopping anyone from changing that gun to either a rifle or pistol. If they make it into a rifle, and then they later sell just the receiver, then neither the manufacturer's records nor any FFL's records will reflect the fact that the gun was a rifle at one point. Yet the receiver would only be legal to make into a rifle again.

Or let's make it more complicated. Owner #1 buys a stripped receiver from FFL #1, builds it into a rifle, then some time later transfers the complete rifle to FFL #2, who records the sale as a rifle. FFL #2 transfers it to owner #2, who later parts it out and transfers just the reciever to FFL #3, who records the sale as an "other." FFL #3 transfers it to owner #3, who calls up the manufacturer and asks if his receiver left the factory as a stripped receiver. The factory truthfully says "yes, left as a stripped receiver." Yet it was proveably a rifle at one point, as recorded in FFL #2's bound book, and can't legally be made into a pistol.

[HCM]

As cheap as stripped lowers are at this time this is a waste of time and energy. Just buy another lower to build your pistol.

[psalms144.1]

As cheap as stripped lowers are at this time this is a waste of time and energy. Just buy another lower to build your pistol.This, this, a thousand times THIS. I would NEVER think about trying to build a lower as a pistol unless I knew for a FACT it shipped from the manufacturer as "other" or a pistol lower.

[rcbusmc24]

I'm not saying there are not FFL's that will not do it, but every one I am familiar with, to include standing behind the counter for at times, will only book a AR in from a individual as either a rifle or a pistol, they only book them as others from the distributors, I also have not seen too many people trying to sell used stripped lowers through FFL's around here, Typically those are armslist sales conducted in Walmart parking lots.....

[whomever]

"Yet it was proveably a rifle at one point, as recorded in FFL #2's bound book, and can't legally be made into a pistol."

I know that the ATF's position was once that becoming a rifle was a one way street, but I thought they had changed that to 'if originally assembled as a rifle, always a rifle, but if originally assembled as a pistol then you could change pistol->rifle->pistol->rifle to your heart's content. Have I gotten a bum steer?

See, for example:
" However, it is perfectly legal to build the receiver into a pistol first and then convert it to a rifle. If the receiver is built into a pistol first, you can configure it back and forth from handgun to rifle and back again as much as you want.

...

There is some wisdom in building every AR-15 lower receiver that you purchase into a pistol first. That way you have the maximum versatility should you want to convert it to a pistol later."

from: http://jerkingthetrigger.com/2013/11/20/ar-15-pistols-clearing-up-some-misconceptions/

which cites: https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/ruling/2011-4-pistols-configured-rifles-rifles-configured-pistols/download

I think the second 'Held further' is addressing the question, though it's hardly a model of clarity:

"Held further, a firearm, as defined by 26 U.S.C. 5845(a)(3) and (a)(4), is not made
when a pistol is attached to a part or parts designed to convert the pistol into a rifle with a
barrel of 16 inches or more in length, and the parts are later unassembled in a configuration
not regulated under the NFA (e.g., as a pistol)."


(BTW, I concur on the 'why take a chance' sentiment; only build pistols on lowers you know the history of. Besides, you wanted another rifle anyway :-))

[WobblyPossum]

Another vote for just buying a new spare lower. They’re available in every price range and it’s a buyer’s market. You can get a PSA or Anderson lower for $40. You can get an Aero Precision loser for $50-60. You can get a Sons of Liberty Gunworks or a Sionics Weapon Systems lower for around $90.

[Casual Friday]

With the market where it's at right now, I wouldn't even bother with a used lower.

[Kyle Reese]

With the market where it's at right now, I wouldn't even bother with a used lower.Right? With PSA running deals all of the time, you can snap up a dedicated AR pistol lower for beer money prices.

Sent from my VS995 using Tapatalk

[Casual Friday]

Right? With PSA running deals all of the time, you can snap up a dedicated AR pistol lower for beer money prices.

Sent from my VS995 using Tapatalk

I was thinking more along the lines of Aero Precision, but I recognize that my luck with PSA seems to be worse than others.

I did grab one of their $39 free shipping stealth lowers a few months ago, this one happens to be in spec and it's wearing a BCM LPK, LAW folder, SBA3, and 6933 upper.

The upper I bought from them around the same time was dog shit.