Beretta 92 series vs Beach Sand

[jwperry]

I really like my M9A1/A3 hybrid gun. With the TJIAB, it has the best DA trigger I've ever had owned(sorry to Sig & their P226 AEP). I'm a believer in "Passion of the Gun" and will train with whatever I want most at that moment. Currently, it is my B92 variant.

I'm looking to slim down to 1 pistol type with only 2-3 variants of that (full size & compact) in my safe. I've been very happy with the performance of my P228/P229 when exposed to surf conditions(in Sigs the DAK hammer spring increases the pull weight and will light off pretty much anything, no matter the debris between hammer & FP). We're entering boating season and I'm literally in the water 3+ times a month now, plus other trips with the family to the beach where the holstered pistol will be exposed to beach sand and lack of lubrication.

Should I be concerned with the M9A1 & B92 compact ability to work with low lubrication and FL Gulf Coast beach sand thrown into the action?

-Side note to this is how is Beretta's Bruniton finish hold up with salt water exposure?

[PGT]

Get sand resistant PVD mags from the M9A1, BrigTac or M9A3. They have a sand channel in them and a slick finish...designed for more hard environments overseas and battle-tested.

[jwperry]

PGT
I've bought a bunch of the MecGar mags; they've served well in my P226/P229 inventory and exposure. I finally had rust on my first mag; my reload mag which has been carried for the past few years had rust on the feedlip & where the carrier rubbed it against my body. I was assuming that MecGar would be GTG for the B92 as well since it's the same tube essentially (feed lips, capacity witness holes & mag catch appear to be the only differences).

My concern about the B92 series is looking from the top of the slide down and seeing the locking inserts and where they cam.

[Duke]

PGT
).

My concern about the B92 series is looking from the top of the slide down and seeing the locking inserts and where they cam.

Throw some sand in it and find out first hand

[jwperry]

Throw some sand in it and find out first hand

It'll happen Friday if no one has done it before me. :D
I just don't want to be dissatisfied with the results, post the gun for sale and have to disclaim "severe malfunctions due to environmental conditions" as that tends to lower value and add time on the market.

[Duke]

It'll happen Friday if no one has done it before me. :D
I just don't want to be dissatisfied with the results, post the gun for sale and have to disclaim "severe malfunctions due to environmental conditions" as that tends to lower value and add time on the market.

I think you’ll be okay.

Been lots of Berts carried and shot in and around moondust for be last 17 ish years

[AdioSS]

I’m pretty sure the Army & Navy have tested the 92 in conditions worse than what you’ll be doing.

[MSparks909]

I hesitate to post this because sample of one and all that...but this should give a general idea:

https://youtu.be/kLlJRpBIHUA

[Alpha Sierra]

have to disclaim "severe malfunctions due to environmental conditions"

Are you serious?

Are you really rolling around in the sand and swimming in the beach with a pistol in your trunks?

[jwperry]

Are you serious?

Are you really rolling around in the sand and swimming in the beach with a pistol in your trunks?Hopping off the bow of a boat onto waist deep water, yes.

Sent from my Moto G (5) Plus using Tapatalk

[Hambo]

Should I be concerned with the M9A1 & B92 compact ability to work with low lubrication and FL Gulf Coast beach sand thrown into the action?

-Side note to this is how is Beretta's Bruniton finish hold up with salt water exposure?

I can go a year or 8-10K without cleaning a 92, but only 1500-2200 rounds without oiling it. You will induce malfunctions if it's dry.

Saltwater and small Beretta parts will be bad.

I don't wade flats with a gun and on a boat I leave it in my tackle bag.

[Alpha Sierra]

Hopping off the bow of a boat onto waist deep water, yes.

Sent from my Moto G (5) Plus using Tapatalk

Is this recreationally or professionally?

[03RN]

Are you serious?

Are you really rolling around in the sand and swimming in the beach with a pistol in your trunks?

Living in and around boats/ocean is hard on guns. Salt water is very harsh.

I don't carry a gun on my person while going to the beach with the family to lay about and swim.

Unfortunately that's about 1% of my time around the water.

While I'm no longer a commercial lobsterman my Captain has been known to ask if I can go on a trip here and there. Add in digging cherry stones on my knees, wading thigh deep for oysters that I need to bend over to get, hiking along shores, camping on the sand, hopping out of a boat to secure a line, falling, sitting next to a fire with a kid or a dog kicking up sand, etc, etc.

I have historicaly carried my g19 when in and around salt water. I find it easier to dunk in fresh water, then oil when I get a chance. I haven't found Berettas to be as resistant to running dry as well as glocks.

I'm not to to worried about sand in a Beretta due to my experience with it in the Hawaiian, Philippine, and Iraqi sand.

A good holster helps too.

[Alpha Sierra]

Living in and around boats/ocean is hard on guns. Salt water is very harsh.

I don't carry a gun on my person while going to the beach with the family to lay about and swim.

Unfortunately that's about 1% of my time around the water.

While I'm no longer a commercial lobsterman my Captain has been known to ask if I can go on a trip here and there. Add in digging cherry stones on my knees, wading thigh deep for oysters that I need to bend over to get, hiking along shores, camping on the sand, hopping out of a boat to secure a line, falling, sitting next to a fire with a kid or a dog kicking up sand, etc, etc.

I have historicaly carried my g19 when in and around salt water. I find it easier to dunk in fresh water, then oil when I get a chance. I haven't found Berettas to be as resistant to running dry as well as glocks.

I'm not to to worried about sand in a Beretta due to my experience with it in the Hawaiian, Philippine, and Iraqi sand.

A good holster helps too.
Dude I get it. I grew up in the Caribbean and spent my HS years screwing around boats before going into the Navy. I know all to well what salt water will do to stainless steel and other common marine metals.

I have a hard time conceptualizing a desire to be armed at all times when boating recreationally. So be it if others want to or feel the need to, but it's an alien concept to me.

[03RN]

Dude I get it. I grew up in the Caribbean and spent my HS years screwing around boats before going into the Navy. I know all to well what salt water will do to stainless steel and other common marine metals.

I have a hard time conceptualizing a desire to be armed at all times when boating recreationally. So be it if others want to or feel the need to, but it's an alien concept to me.

Yes, I desire to carry at all times. Putting a seat belt on during a crash is an alien concept to me.

[UniSol]

Dude I get it. I grew up in the Caribbean and spent my HS years screwing around boats before going into the Navy. I know all to well what salt water will do to stainless steel and other common marine metals.

I have a hard time conceptualizing a desire to be armed at all times when boating recreationally. So be it if others want to or feel the need to, but it's an alien concept to me.

So the OP wasn't asking for an opinion on whether or not he should be armed....."Is this recreationally or professionally?" Holy fucking shit, what's with all the snide virtue signal cropdusting of posts lately. It was old as fuck yesterday.

[UniSol]

As far as the OP goes, try it out, I think it will be fine. Give the gun attention due the circumstances. They have been getting put through the wringer for the last 17 going on 18 years now. MEUSOC (not MARSOC) 1911s and P226es and 228s on the Navy side were getting (some still do) land, over the beach, and salt water treatment for a long time without any major issues.

[jwperry]

Is this recreationally or professionally?

Recreational.

To provide some better context, a lot of beaches/parks along the southwest Florida Gulf Coast have inland trails that are accessible via boat. Most of this area though has mangroves right to the shore line and the best way to anchor a boat to gain access to these areas is partially off shore in the flats. The wife likes these areas as she can takes pictures of all kinds of birds, I like it because my cell phone won't work out there and it helps expose the kids to Wild Florida, not just the I4 Corridor. We've seen all kinds of wild life on these trips, so my question stems more from a "if I need to draw my pistol and shoot a hog/bobcat/coyote, will I get more than 1 shot before the gun locks up". I'm just sum-dood who likes to go outside, not an operator operating operationally.

[EVP]

Honestly I would just use a different gun. A polymer gun like that you don’t care about like a Glock or something. I would locate a police trade in or a old gen 3 g19 or 17 and use that. If you really wanted to have a more impervious pistol then look at Robars NP3+ Norton special.


Not that the Berettas could not take it but I would not take my Wilson Berettas boating or fishing. A Glock is easier to maintain in those situations. Then keep the B92s clean and lubed for your normal carry and use.

[jwperry]

Honestly I would just use a different gun. A polymer gun like that you don’t care about like a Glock or something. I would locate a police trade in or a old gen 3 g19 or 17 and use that. If you really wanted to have a more impervious pistol then look at Robars NP3+ Norton special.


Not that the Berettas could not take it but I would not take my Wilson Berettas boating or fishing. A Glock is easier to maintain in those situations. Then keep the B92s clean and lubed for your normal carry and use.

I had a bunch of sand get in a G17.4 and completely lock the trigger up once. It had a grip plug and everything. I didn't realize it until I went to break it down to clean it; I couldn't pull the trigger to field strip it. I did really like the weight on the belt though.

[Alpha Sierra]

Recreational.

To provide some better context, a lot of beaches/parks along the southwest Florida Gulf Coast have inland trails that are accessible via boat. Most of this area though has mangroves right to the shore line and the best way to anchor a boat to gain access to these areas is partially off shore in the flats. The wife likes these areas as she can takes pictures of all kinds of birds, I like it because my cell phone won't work out there and it helps expose the kids to Wild Florida, not just the I4 Corridor. We've seen all kinds of wild life on these trips, so my question stems more from a "if I need to draw my pistol and shoot a hog/bobcat/coyote, will I get more than 1 shot before the gun locks up". I'm just sum-dood who likes to go outside, not an operator operating operationally.

I think any pistol should work fine for a long time if exposed to salt water so long as it's maintained properly. Particularly if it's made mostly of stainless or stainless and plastic.

I think many pistols will work just fine if exposed to some sand ingestion so long as the sand is dry

I don't think there are too many pistols that will work semi reliably if they ingest significant quantities of wet sand.

[ralph]

Honestly I would just use a different gun. A polymer gun like that you don’t care about like a Glock or something. I would locate a police trade in or a old gen 3 g19 or 17 and use that. If you really wanted to have a more impervious pistol then look at Robars NP3+ Norton special.


Not that the Berettas could not take it but I would not take my Wilson Berettas boating or fishing. A Glock is easier to maintain in those situations. Then keep the B92s clean and lubed for your normal carry and use.

This^^^^^^^^ I like Berettas as much as anybody here, but in this situtation, the Glock wins simply because it's easily completely disassembled..all the small parts are easy to get to and clean or replace if they start rusting up. Taking a Beretta frame apart is'nt bad, but when you start on the slide it's a different ball game..a couple of very small spring loaded detents, usually requiring you to disassemble the slide in a plastic bag... Beretta slides are a pain in the ass to do anything with, even cleaning out the extractor, required you to restake the pin, where with a Glock you can simply drop it out, clean the slide up, and very easily reassemble the slide ,and no plastic bag needed.. In this situtation, Glock wins simply on it's merits of ease of complete dissassembly alone.. If you use this in a salt water enviroment, sooner or later you're going to have to dissassemble the pistol in order to get all the salt out, I'd pick something that's easily disassembled, as well as reliable, A used, gen 3-4, g17 fills that bill.

[Duelist]

Maybe look at your carry method, too. A shoulder holster, or Hill People Gear, or Maxpedition, or kydex, or nylon full flap, or something, might be a better idea than a standard OWB holster, especially leather.

I don’t know, haven’t seen, but I hear tell that saltwater is really hard on aluminum. So a good finish beyond anodizing would be a thing I’d look at if I were going to consider using an aluminum framed gun around saltwater.

I once went hiking in an area that open carry would have been severely frowned upon, with a group of youth from my church. It included wading in a river through a slot canyon for several miles. I wasn’t planning on taking that hike, but they ended up needing me to. I carried my 642 for low profile and probable survival of an accidental dunking. I got wet to my waist. The gun was fine.

A kid or two fell in a hole and had to be yanked back up, though.

[Dave J]

I don't think I've ever taken a Beretta to the beach, but Uncle Sam has generously provided me a few years of experience using them in desert environments. :)

Given reasonable maintenance, the only issues I personally experienced or observed all involved heavy amounts of blowing sand. As in, massive desert sandstorms, or rotor wash on sandy HLZ's. Simply carrying the gun in a sandy area, especially concealed, or an occasional dunk in water wouldn't concern me.

Salt water, I can't really speak to, but am not sure a Beretta would be my first choice. I was using one, and anticipated it getting submerged, I'd be really tempted to have Robar do the internals with NP3. I've also noticed that the barrels seem to be much less corrosion resistant than the slides, so I'd prefer either a stainless barrel, or have it preemptively coated with something more corrosion-resistant than the factory finish. An Inox gun would seem like the ideal start point.

[Clusterfrack]

Dude I get it. I grew up in the Caribbean and spent my HS years screwing around boats before going into the Navy. I know all to well what salt water will do to stainless steel and other common marine metals.

I have a hard time conceptualizing a desire to be armed at all times when boating recreationally. So be it if others want to or feel the need to, but it's an alien concept to me.

At least around here on the OR coast, that’s one time I am always armed. It’s very isolated, and there are some very odd folks.

I take a Glock or P07, and don’t worry about surface corrosion. Blowing sand gets in everything, but I haven’t had issues yet.

[LSP552]

I’ve spent a lot of recreational in and around salt water, on the beach, in the water and on the boat. Personally, I’d like something easier detail stripped than a Beretta if I’m expecting to dunk it. And if you spend a lot of time around the water, it will get dunked.

I typically use a Glock for my dunking guns.

[ubervic]

If I'm bound and determined to have a firearm on my person 100% of the time while doing recreational boating and beaching, I'm going to run the gun that represents the least risk of financial loss and, more importantly, operational failure if it goes underwater. Even if I hated Glocks, I'd own at least one for use in this specific environment.

[MSparks909]

Is sticking it in a small dry box while you transport it to and from shore not an option?

[Bergeron]

NP3+ has some pretty exciting lubricity/corrosion resistance claims behind it.

https://robarguns.com/custom-firearm-finishes/np3-plus/

Maybe it would be worth having an entire gun completely done in NP3+? Or, as has been suggested, maybe just the internals, or the intervals plus the slide?

M9/92FS are going for some attractive prices if you wanted a dedicated hostile environment gun.

I imagine that getting the sand-resistant magazines coated wouldn’t hurt.

[OlongJohnson]

Whatever you go with, I'd recommend the Hornady One Shot cleaner/lube. It wipes off to leave basically a dry lube that's super slick but won't attract dust like oil or grease do. It actually keeps unfinished cast iron from rusting in my garage in Houston. I wouldn't rely on it for a lot of rounds downrange, just to be ready to go after being carried quite a bit.

I don't like a Beretta in salt water, honestly. And beach sand is different than desert. I've spent plenty of time in both. The stuff that gets blown into everything in the desert is usually a lot more like silt. A fine powder. Beach sand is grittier, and potentially would do more damage, faster, to the rails. If I carried an aluminum frame gun on the beach, in and out of the water, I'd detail strip it and clean it before shooting it in other than an emergency. The requirement to unstake/restake the slide of the Beretta to do a complete detail strip makes it less favorable for use in salt-sand than a pistol that doesn't have staking. Even tapping the coil pins out of a Sig slide is preferable. (If you do that, buy the $7 pin punch set at Home Depot and put one side of the 1/8" pin on a belt sander to make it flat. No need to spend $20-30 for a special Sig tool.)

Like many others posting, my first thought was a G19. I'd add maritime spring cups if I thought I might need to use it concurrent with or immediately after dunking it.

I'd also throw out the P250 as a possible option. I haven't detail stripped a slide on one, but the frame is super easy. The whole fire control unit comes out of the plastic grip module, and all the nooks and crannies are fully accessible from 360 degrees. You can swirl the whole thing in a jar of solvent to clean it, then blow it off with compressed air and spray it with lube. The grip module can go in the dishwasher. They're pretty inexpensive on GB, especially in .40 cal. If I was potentially going to face down pigs, Burmese pythons, Florida Man, gators, escaped pit bulls, panthers, etc., I wouldn't mind having a little heavier round in the chamber.

USPs are known for extreme corrosion resistance, in addition to reliability and longevity. Grip/pointability is not totally dissimilar to the Beretta. Used ones in .40 can be had for super cheap these days.

[fixer]

Like many things, the 92s allergy to dust/dirt is way overblown.

[Hambo]

Recreational.

To provide some better context, a lot of beaches/parks along the southwest Florida Gulf Coast have inland trails that are accessible via boat. Most of this area though has mangroves right to the shore line and the best way to anchor a boat to gain access to these areas is partially off shore in the flats. The wife likes these areas as she can takes pictures of all kinds of birds, I like it because my cell phone won't work out there and it helps expose the kids to Wild Florida, not just the I4 Corridor. We've seen all kinds of wild life on these trips, so my question stems more from a "if I need to draw my pistol and shoot a hog/bobcat/coyote, will I get more than 1 shot before the gun locks up". I'm just sum-dood who likes to go outside, not an operator operating operationally.

Get a HPG kit bag and grab it when you leave the boat. For ease of tear down I'd carry a 1911. For lack of caring if I watched it sink I'd carry a cheap, used Glock .40.

[Alpha Sierra]

I'd also throw out the P250 as a possible option. I haven't detail stripped a slide on one, but the frame is super easy. The whole fire control unit comes out of the plastic grip module, and all the nooks and crannies are fully accessible from 360 degrees. You can swirl the whole thing in a jar of solvent to clean it, then blow it off with compressed air and spray it with lube. The grip module can go in the dishwasher. They're pretty inexpensive on GB, especially in .40 cal. If I was potentially going to face down pigs, Burmese pythons, Florida Man, gators, escaped pit bulls, panthers, etc., I wouldn't mind having a little heavier round in the chamber.

That's a great suggestion.

[jwperry]

Get a HPG kit bag and grab it when you leave the boat. For ease of tear down I'd carry a 1911. For lack of caring if I watched it sink I'd carry a cheap, used Glock .40.

That's probably what I'm going to go with. Well, a derivative, I have a Kelty Sling Bag that I use as my "dad bag". I'll probably just go with that. I just prefer the pistol on me to keep as I don't have to worry about anyone trying to go through my bag looking for snacks or sunscreen and pulling the pistol out.

I did the 1911 thing for years and it was a great solution for this. IonBond done by Evolution Armory made that pistol invincible.

But, I'm looking to pare down my safe to 1 common magazine type and maybe 2-3 pistols that use them. As much as I romanticize about getting a pair of Springfield Pro LR, IonBond coating them and never looking back, I want to lower my overall investment in my guns and put that investment elsewhere.

And I have tried Glocks (G19, G17). When I went to clean my Glock after a weekend out and about camping in this environment I couldn't pull the trigger to field strip it, it had that much sand inside the action. Basically had to unload it, put it into our pool and shake it a bunch to get the sand to start moving so I could pull the trigger to take it apart.

I have thought about the USPc/P2000/P30 option for the future of my gun owning.

[CCT125US]

I have thought about the USPc/P2000/P30 option for the future of my gun owning.

Part of me wants to second that, as the P2000 and P30s are dirt cheap right now. However, Glocks are pretty universal and also dirt cheap right now.

[EVP]

Sand can stop any handgun. The polymer pistols are going to be some of the most resistant to the environmental conditions your are speaking too. Your experience with Glock could of happen with many guns and I personally would rather do a detailed cleaning on a inexpensive easy to disassemble gun.

But the main reason why I suggest a cheap Glock or m&p is that if you are recreational boating i would have a gun that could end up at the bottom of a lake or river. A disposable gun if you may. I have seen police trade in m&ps for cheap. I would not take a normal carry gun into a boat or environment like that.

[Duelist]

Sand can stop any handgun. The polymer pistols are going to be some of the most resistant to the environmental conditions your are speaking too. Your experience with Glock could of happen with many guns and I personally would rather do a detailed cleaning on a inexpensive easy to disassemble gun.

But the main reason why I suggest a cheap Glock or m&p is that if you are recreational boating i would have a gun that could end up at the bottom of a lake or river. A disposable gun if you may. I have seen police trade in m&ps for cheap. I would not take a normal carry gun into a boat or environment like that.

What if your normal carry is a Glock or M&P? ;)

[EVP]

What if your normal carry is a Glock or M&P? ;)

Then rock on!


Honestly I have transitioned back to Glocks with the release of the gen 5 pistols. But I would have no issue using a m&p, Glock or HK for this type of purpose. Really they are all great guns and I would get the cheapest gun and have it as a dedicated “fishing or boating gun”.

[JonInWA]

In the environment described, it's gonna be a Glock kinda day-and most likely my Gen 3 G19, G17 or G22 as sand and silt can flummox the triple nested RSA of my Gen4 G22. Best, Jon

[Cory]

I live on the gulfcoast as well. I dont own a boat, but have been invited out multiple times and just havent made time yet. I wish there was a good Da/Sa gun for this role that was similar in manual of arms to the 92. I need to round out my 92s more, but eventually another similar option would be nice.

Any ideas how the Smith 3rd gen guns do with salt water? I think they're controls are closest to a 92, and a 10mm would be nice to have.

-Cory

[Trooper224]

I've nothing to add concerning the choice of handgun, I'd just pack one of my usual working guns and not think twice about it. You're in the river, not rolling around in quicksand. One thing I would point out is that a holster with a good retention system might be a greater priority than the type of firearm. Dropping your weapon in the water might make its type a moot point.

[Clusterfrack]

cor_man257 My 1006 barely ran without sand and salt. On the other hand it would have made a great boat anchor.

[QUOTE=cor_man257;858779
Any ideas how the Smith 3rd gen guns do with salt water? I think they're controls are closest to a 92, and a 10mm would be nice to have.[/QUOTE]

[Cory]

cor_man257 My 1006 barely ran without sand and salt. On the other hand it would have made a great boat anchor.

I didn't know they had function issues. I thought they were generally regarded as durable, relia le guns. I'd love to hear more.

-Cory

[Clusterfrack]

My first autos were a 669 and a 1006. Neither was especially reliable (feed and ejection issues). The 669 had frame peening that resulted in misalignment of the slide. The 1006 also had problems with the firing pin seizing in the channel. I wouldn’t trust a S&W TDA for defense.

These guns set me on a good path though. To well engineered guns like HK, Glock, and CZ.

[mmc45414]

I really don't know jack about the Berettas, but would a Px4 be a companion to the 92 and offer some of the plastic advantages? I know it eliminates much of your criteria, but think perhaps rather than having a 92 and a Glock it might be a more elegant transition to have a 92 and a Px4?

[LSP552]

My first autos were a 669 and a 1006. Neither was especially reliable (feed and ejection issues). The 669 had frame peening that resulted in misalignment of the slide. The 1006 also had problems with the firing pin seizing in the channel. I wouldn’t trust a S&W TDA for defense.

These guns set me on a good path though. To well engineered guns like HK, Glock, and CZ.

I killed an early 669 with a very low round count. S&W semiautos were a popular low rent option to SIGs with LSP for personal weapons. In general, they were less reliable and certainly harder to repair. I didn’t go to the armorer course for them, but I know LSP 952 hated working on them with a passion.

[JonInWA]

Back in the Second/Third Generation S&W timeframe, I preferred Ruger and SIG-Sauer to S&W; specifically the Ruger P85/P89, P90, P97 and P94; and SIG P220, P225, P228, P229, and P2340 The only one out of the entire lot that I still have is my late-production (2007) product improved P89, which is an excellent pistol, and personally well-proven.

Best, Jon

[03RN]

I really don't know jack about the Berettas, but would a Px4 be a companion to the 92 and offer some of the plastic advantages? I know it eliminates much of your criteria, but think perhaps rather than having a 92 and a Glock it might be a more elegant transition to have a 92 and a Px4?

Aren't the px4s even more reliant on lube than 92s? I know they're enjoying a little bit of a come back most likely due to Ernests work showing how great they are but I know they didn't always have this going for them and the local cops that carried them have nothing good to say about them.

[M2CattleCo]

I had a bunch of sand get in a G17.4 and completely lock the trigger up once. It had a grip plug and everything. I didn't realize it until I went to break it down to clean it; I couldn't pull the trigger to field strip it. I did really like the weight on the belt though.



I had a single grain of beach sand get between the frame and trigger bar on a Glock 21 and fired the round in the chamber and had to be detail stripped to get back into action.

I've spent a lot of time in salty, sandy conditions and will only carry a pistol that is easily detail stripped in the field.

So Glock or 1911 were the two choices, 1911 it is because they carry better IWB.

[Gray01]

Get a HPG kit bag and grab it when you leave the boat.

A Wilderness Safepacker is also good kit for similar issues.

[psalms144.1]

I've told this story before, but I once dropped my (then) primary carry Gen4 G19 on a very cold, wet range day, landing it in the beach sand of the local PD range. Even with a grip plug, sand got into the "works", and worse still, into the RSA. This effectively locked the gun up tight, requiring some "heroic efforts" to even get the action open to clear the pistol.

The RSA was a write off - once back home it went into the trash. The rest of the pistol got detail stripped, thoroughly rinsed with warm soapy water, then flushed with running water until I couldn't see any more sand anywhere. After CAREFULLY and fully drying the components out (paying particular attention to the striker channel), I relubed and reassembled the pistol, which went on to keep shooting with no long-term effect. Back in the 2010 timeframe, right after the Gen4s came out, I had a G19 that went "dead trigger" on my when some flashing from the frame wore off and got into the cruciform/trigger bar junction - again, quickly fixable with a detail strip, but requiring switching to my G26 BUG until I could get the gun back in action.

So, what's the point? Glocks seem to be particularly sensitive to this kind of issue, but they're hella easy to get "fixed." I'd hate to think of what it would take to detail strip a classic Sig, VP9, or P320 that got sand/gunk in the works. I also think the tighter the tolerances on your pistols, the harder it will be to get sand in the works, but the greater the effect of said sand.

Not bashing GLOCK here at all - I carried a G19 for almost five years where it was darned near constantly exposed to high velocity sand/dust (think rotary wing operations in SWA), and never had any issues with it. At the same time, I saw M9s and M11s that were completely deadlined by the same exposure, requiring armorer level attention to get them back in action.

Is there any point to looking at something like a LCR for water-sports? I would like to think it might be more tolerant of abuse, and, if you're getting into an extended fight on your boat, your shit is probably already pretty weak as is - might as well go down with some style points...

[Bergeron]

I don’t know how good of an answer we can get to the mud/sand/saltwater question.

Beretta 92/M9 and Sig 226/229 went through some extensive testing back in the 80s- so they are well known. The magazine designs are also broadly similar, and it’s worth nothing that the OIF Beretta failures can be attributed to the gov’t specced/required parkerizing on the tube internals. We also now have the sand-resistant magazines. There is a past Gun Nuts Media post written by Tim that describes training at BlackWater during a wet/muddy/sandy environment with a B92 that kept running while other pistols malfunctioned.

Aluminum is delicate against saltwater, so a slick and corrosion resistant finish would seem to be in order.

USP is noted for reliability in these kinds of environments. The Glock experiences people are having is interesting. I note that the Zev OZ-9 has “sand/dirt/lube” accumulation areas in the frame, but I have no idea how well it would work.

I have seen antecdotal evidence that well-fit 1911s can be resistant to sand and mud.

My personal guns are 1911s and Glocks, with a single Beretta that I’m trying on for size. I’ve also had USP experience. I don’t regularly encounter mud, sand, or saltwater, but if I did, I’d probably just take any one of those designs with all the NP3+ I could get on the gun, including the small parts and magazines. I’d also use a holster that gave me the best environmental protection I could get.

In addition to USG treats, we have the video series of InRange TV and Military Arms channel. While totally unscientific, the videos are still interesting. InRange posited that a gun with its internals sealed as best possible from mud/sand ingression fared best in their tests, as evidenced by the superior performance of a no-kidding Luger.

[M2CattleCo]

After doing some ridiculous beach sand 'testing' with a Les Baer that I particularly hated, I came away very impressed.

The only thing that really stopped it was so much sand packed in the slide that the hammer couldn't hit the firing pin, and sand getting in the trigger tracks preventing reset.

[03RN]

After doing some ridiculous beach sand 'testing' with a Les Baer that I particularly hated, I came away very impressed.

The only thing that really stopped it was so much sand packed in the slide that the hammer couldn't hit the firing pin, and sand getting in the trigger tracks preventing reset.

That's been my observation as well.

Make sure the safety is on, grab the slide and whip it, whip it good, then give it a good blow. And that should clear out enough sand that it will fire. Once it fires it should shake even more sand away.

I also find 1911s pretty easy to completely disassemble which is nice after going into salt water. Another reason why I like grease. I've had 1911s completely submerged for a while and when disassembled still had grease on parts a couple days later.

[revchuck38]

whip it, whip it good

Like you didn't see this coming...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RidtrSCogg0

[AdioSS]

It is possible to still find factory NP3 coated Berettas. They were usually .40 caliber 96 models made for law enforcement, but pretty much everything was coated, including the sear. I very often carry this 96G Centurion that was originally made for Palm Beach PD.
https://i.imgur.com/6n6rYcMl.jpg
It came with very well used laser grips for under $500 shipped.

My other NP3 Beretta is a full-size 96D that came from the Ohio State Police. It was also under $500 from a local gun store.
https://i.imgur.com/Gaspzmhl.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/vWHn6FBl.jpg

[mmc45414]

Aren't the px4s even more reliant on lube than 92s?Well, perhaps. And after all

I really don't know jack about the Berettas :)
I was just brainstorming. Does seem like maybe that rotary lockup thing might be intolerant.

As a long time fan it is interesting to me how much support the 1911 has for this role, I guess it is pretty simple to break down into a pile of parts.

[Gray01]

hella easy to get "fixed."

I have, very frequently over decades, detail stripped the firearm (Glocks), and washed them in a dishwasher on "heavy/sanitize cycle" with everyday DW detergent. Small parts in a fine mesh bag, in the silverware cubby. Blew off with compressed air while still warm from the drying segment, lubed appropriately, and back in action. Never experienced any negative issues.

ETA: regarding the Beretta 92 variants, about 30 or more years ago, in a fairly large S. CA agency there were locker decals that said something like "Lubricate or Die".

[10mmfanboy]

Sand is pretty much a guns worst nightmare. I wouldn't even consider a px4 for that environment. I'd probably go glock with maritime cups and a BUG. Way easier to clean, cheaper. I have a px4 and a m9a3 that I love and would have no qualms about mucking it up but they wouldn't be my first choice for that sort of thing. I know a lot of farmers around here use shoulder holsters and until this thread never really understood why, but makes sense to keep your pistol as high up as possible out of the muck. Stepping up in power wouldn't be a bad idea either, frickin land sharks and all. And I've found 40 cal snakeshot pretty reliable compared to 9mm, just because of the projectile shape I guess.

Two is one and one is none would be my suggestion, even if it's two smaller options.