Pistols for the ladies

[Tensaw]

It continues to strike as slightly ironicable that us fellows spend a lot of time, energy, and money on firearms and other protective tools/measures whilst, frequently, our ladies - who present much softer, and in many ways, more desireable targets, move around all day either completely without any sort of protective tool, or at best, very minimally armed (speaking in generalities here).

This situation is hardly new - but what is new, is the release of the Glock 48/43X (and 43 & 42). No offense to you guys who are really digging these, but the 48 strikes me as a great option for a lady's house pistol. Like a G19 for girls. I'm just wondering how many 48's and 43X's are going to find their way into nightstands and purses across the country.I am thinking that they will end up be very popular with the ladies as time goes on.

Anybody have a different take on this? I have a wife and two daughters (one daughter in college out-of-state). As it stands right now, the wife has a PPS stashed in the center console (no lectures please), and PPS stashed in the house, and an LCP in her purse. The daughter at college has a .380 EZ which replaced the Walther PPQ .22 she had previously. The youngest daughter is my shooter, but is not yet old enough to carry. She presently loves my G19X; but she has yet to shoot a G48 (as have I). The wife is okay with firearms, but is by no means an enthusiast. The daughter in college is okay with them in concept and is all about self-defense, but actually shooting a gun is pretty low on her list of enjoyable things to do. For her, having a pistol is like going to the dentist. The youngest, as noted, is all about shooting. Cool thing is, I can see the G48 being the pistol that they prefer/gravitate to.

I would be interested to hear what firearms the ladies in your households gravitate toward for defensive use and how they are carried/stored.

[Duelist]

When my wife can be bothered to carry, its a GLOCK 42. She used to have a Makarov because it was easy to shoot, but it was too heavy to actually carry in her opinion. She shoots about 2x a year, and finds the 42 a good fit for her small hands, controllable and shootable, and a nice size/weight for carry. The 43 was too much recoil for her to put a full magazine through.

Our adult daughter has anxiety and depression, and thinks that her owning a gun at present is ill-advised.

[Clusterfrack]

I've been through a similar process with quite a few females, including Daughter #1, #2, my wife, and her friend (we'll call her Princess Di).

Daughter #2 is strong, athletic, and shot her first USPSA match at 13. She isn't a big girl, but can run pretty much any gun, including .44 mag, 12 Ga, and ARs. Best choice for this girl: Glock 19 or 17, or whatever.

Daughter #1 is very tiny, and has the strength of a child. She has not had great confidence with firearms, but with some hard work, she can now shoot a Glock 43 and a LCP quite well. Her hands simply aren't large enough for a G19, and she causes stovepipes because her grip is weak. Interestingly, the 43 runs perfectly for her, even SHO or WHO. So I think a G48 could be a great choice.

My wife does Crossfit 5 times a week. She is strong and athletic. She does not like guns, and has zero interest in shooting. She can shoot a Glock 19.

Princess Di wants to be able to shoot because she is often home alone. But she has very little strength, is recoil sensitive, and has no tolerance for discomfort. She cannot rack the slide on any Glock, and doesn't like the way a serrated trigger feels on her finger. I have settled on a .22 revolver or OC spray for her.

[Bigghoss]

I've seen petite woman with big guns that could put anyone to shame.

[OlongJohnson]

There's a thread about "grandma gun" or something like that here. The P250 .380 is strong in that one. I have been shooting one, and agree it is likely the perfect girl gun. Available with grip modules in compact and subcompact with "small" grip circumference/trigger reach. The DA trigger is extremely smooth and light, the slide is extremely easy to rack, the manual of arms as simple as a semi can be. The Compact length mags hold 15 rounds, so 16 with a plus-one. I had serious back surgery a few months ago, and will spend a few months shooting it when I get past .22LR. I have a special person in my life who is half my size and has expressed dislike of recoil. It would be perfect for her if she didn't live behind the West Coast Wall.

FWIW, my LCP is on consignment at the LGS right now, because I realized that my trigger finger was injured every time I took it to the range. It's simply so small I can't grip it strongly enough to keep it from flipping around and doing bad things to my XXXL hands.

[hufnagel]

got arthritis or some other compromised hand strength condition, and still want a semi auto? H&K VP9 with the charging wings was a total selling point for a lady friend of mine. It's her go-to gun, even with the ever expanding collection between her and her companion.

[ChaseN]

Yeah trying to pigeonhole "girl guns" is a non starter IMO. I took my 22y/o workout fanatic 5'2" sister in law to a rental range last year so she could pick out her first gun for SD in the home as well as range practice. She shot everything under the sun and ended up buying a M&P9 2.0 FS. The process was really no different than that of men I've advised on purchasing their first gun - other than she approached her purchase with an open mind vs whatever last month's gun rags said is an appropriate man's gun and caliber.

Some women are weak, some are strong, some are 5'0", some are 6'2", the criteria isn't different than men that fit in those same categories.

[Drang]

My take is, unless she decides she wants to learn to shoot, and/or to carry, don't waste your time and her patience.

Once she decides so, seek beginners classes for her, don't try and teach her yourself. Doing much more than saying "This works for me/some" to a significant other/daughter/sister/etc. will pressure test your relationship much like trying to teach her to drive.

And do not, I say again DO NOT make assumptions about what gun she can or cannot shoot. Take her to an indoor range with rental guns, and let her try a variety. She may need the lesson in applied physics that a lighter gun may be easier to carry but nastier to shoot. Or that what Uncle Bud carried isn't for her. Or that the gun that catches her eye isn't All That.

I loathe the idea of "ladies guns". "Guns for the inexperienced", sure, "guns for the less physically capable", perhaps, but nothing I wrote above is exclusive to ladies, however you define "lady".

[ChaseN]

This reminds me, I carried a .357 P229 for the US Secret Service for long enough to observe that the average woman we hired off the street does just fine carrying & shooting a 2.5lb pistol with a 12lb trigger pull in a nasty little caliber, with high quality instruction.

[Sauer Koch]

For people with trigger reach issues,the HK V1 LEM is a great option. My wife chose the P30sk, and has been very happy with it.

[Medusa]

Yeah trying to pigeonhole "girl guns" is a non starter IMO. I took my 22y/o workout fanatic 5'2" sister in law to a rental range last year so she could pick out her first gun for SD in the home as well as range practice. She shot everything under the sun and ended up buying a M&P9 2.0 FS. The process was really no different than that of men I've advised on purchasing their first gun - other than she approached her purchase with an open mind vs whatever last month's gun rags said is an appropriate man's gun and caliber.

Some women are weak, some are strong, some are 5'0", some are 6'2", the criteria isn't different than men that fit in those same categories.

So much this.

I’m comfortable with just about anything though, and am kind of an Amazon. my spouse, also female, also very strong and tall, knows the fundamentals (was taught when young) but doesn’t like firearms and never has. The bigger question for women is how to carry effectively given various wardrobe options, imho.

[AMC]

So much this.

I’m comfortable with just about anything though, and am kind of an Amazon. my spouse, also female, also very strong and tall, knows the fundamentals (was taught when young) but doesn’t like firearms and never has. The bigger question for women is how to carry effectively given various wardrobe options, imho.

That was going to be my point. For women it's often about the concealment options, or lack of them, with a women's wardrobe. Having been asked for advice by numerous female officers over the years, this has been my number one takeaway. One savvy young female officer, who is also and excellent shooter, had already discovered the websites "The Well Armed Woman", "Kornered Kat", and "Gunterist". Those seemed to be decent resources

On point, I think the new Glocks would be attractive to any smaller statured person as a concealment option ..
Or a tall guy wanting a smaller gun.

[BillSWPA]

After trying my wife on almost every 9mm in existence as well as some .38 revolvers, a few .380’s, and a .45 1911, she was most comfortable and did her best shooting with a Springfield XD9. So far it has been trouble free. That is her home defense gun. For carry it is usually a Kel-Tec P-32, primarily for the concealment issues discussed above.

When I was helping with my range’s NRA Basic Pistol, I found myself working with a disproportionate number of the older ladies, often with hand issues. Some general observations:

About 40% percent of the ladies I have worked with have difficulty with trigger weights over 9 lb. Either SA autos or guns that start from a partially preset position (Glock etc.) are advantageous.

Recoil mitigation will vary from shooter to shooter. While I tend to encourage semiautos with tilt barrel designs for this reason, two ladies with hand/wrist issues found revolver recoil to be more comfortable. One used two index fingers on the trigger for DA shooting.

Weight is s good thing for recoil reduction. I do not recommend small and lightweight unless it is really needed for a given application, and am careful to recommend a caliber that will be easy to shoot in that size/weight gun.

Expect the ladies you try to help to surprise you with their preferences. Let them try a wide variety of designs.

Unlike a man’s elbow, a lady’s elbow is not straight when it is locked. Shooting with s slight bend in the elbows will reduce elbow pain for them.

Often the characteristics that make a gun a good man’s gun also make that same gun a good lady’s gun, but these characteristics are even more critical for the ladies.

One of the biggest mistakes I made with my wife was focusing too much on minimum calibers and not enough on what will actually be carried and yet make good hits easy to obtain. Focusing more on the latter criteria makes it more likely that something will actually be carried.

While I am presently underwhelmed by the larger single stack Glocks, if more ladies start buying, carrying, and shooting them, and find that these guns work well for them, I will completely change my opinion of these guns.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Vista461]

My wife likes shooting my 45 Shield more than her 9mm version. She also played with the 43x at the gun store and liked that as well.

[Totem Polar]

"Ladies guns." Judas Priest on a pogo stick. Ladies are pretty much individuals. I’ve seen ladies in the sub 5-foot/100lb range go totally queer for a Browning HP in .40 S&W, and seen other reasonably petite women go for SP101s in .357. An old college roommate’s mom carried a 2 1/2" model 19 with silvertips in it (we got along ok). The 1911 seems to capture the female shooter about as much as the male shooter, per capita, of course.

That said, beginner females have gone for the G42 in alarming numbers on the occasions when I let new distaff shooters try a representative set of exemplars from my collection, so there’s definitely something there. But I like the G42 too, so it may just be the puppy dog nature of the gun, and not the gender. The G42 is my wife’s second favorite gun, after my Reichard-tuned NY-1... but she really isn’t a gun person.

At any rate, I’ve seen as much or more variety of iron in the hands of women than men over the years.

[peterb]

At one beginner class I attended that had a variety of guns for the students to use, the woman I was partnered with got the biggest smile shooting a 686. I know a couple of women who prefer full-size 1911s. Tastes vary.....

That said, some guns do work better for smaller hands and/or people with less arm & grip strength. The G42 and Shield EZ are popular for good reasons.

My wife doesn’t shoot much any more, but with her tiny hands and recoil sensitivity the only thing she enjoyed shooting was a Ruger Bearcat.

[rathos]

I have never found a "girl gun". The biggest hurdle most women have is finding a holster that works with what they wear and is comfortable for a woman to wear. Most holsters are designed for men. Appendix works well for some women, others prefer behind the hip. Most of the ones I have helped do not like IWB which provides an even bigger challenge. I will say the gun that gets pushed on most women is a small revolver and with those being the hardest to shoot dissuades a lot of women from carrying or shooting. The M&P shield in 9mm seems to be a very popular gun as it is light recoiling and small enough to carry.

[Rex G]

My wife favors J/K/N S&W revolvers. Her sister favors a rounded-grip-frame S&W L-snub.

For OPSEC reasons, that is all I will say.

[Jim Watson]

A friend of the feminine persuasion upgraded from a 642 considerately selected by Hubby to a LCP. She doesn't like it much better and is definitely interested in a Slimline. She shoots IDPA and USPSA with a G34 so I figure she can handle it.

[Duke]

Mine has done a few classes including FOF. She’s aware and actually a great shooter but she lacks the passion for it.

Anything beyond purse carry isn’t going to happen, so the guns size isn’t a factor.

She does keep a blade on her person


35019

[gato naranja]

So... anyone here have ideas about a firearms/shooting techniques to try for a female late-boomer who is recovering from rotator cuff repair on her shooting shoulder? Somewhat recoil-sensitive in the past, but probably more so after she is cleared by the doctor.

Up to now she is enthusiastic about a 9mm 4" 1911 and a Ruger SR22... an odd combo, eh, what?

gn

[Sauer Koch]

She’s aware and actually a great shooter but she lacks the passion for it.

This is my wife. She’s got a lot of potential, but doesn’t have the passion for it like I do. She has just enough that she will progress, but any less, and it’d be a struggle.
She watched me shoot my first IDPA match, and was not enticed by what she saw. The second time, I nudged her into the match, and she had a great time, and was sold, and we will both shoot again next Saturday.
This may be a great avenue for some women to get more involved, unless they’re timid, which my wife is not.

She’s made GREAT progress over the last three years, and I’m proud of her.

[breakingtime91]

My wife is a very small asian woman. She is also active duty so a 320 with thumb safety is about to be common in our house. Sometimes you have to learn to shoot whats issued, thankfully for me I am a fan of the 320.

[Totem Polar]

She does keep a blade on her person



This is an interesting sidebar. I’ve lost count of the number of women I’ve met across a scale from marginally postive/meh on guns to flat-out anti gun, who dig edged things; knives, swords, you name it.

Even my wife, who grudgingly admits that firearms have real utility (in my hands) goes ape for a good blade. She has as respectable a stash as I do—mostly gifts from me or my dad—and once saw the contents of her purse featured in national media because it had all this diva stuff, in addition to multiple quality knives and flashlights.

If I’m cleaning a firearm, she pretty much just ignores it and lets me do my thing, but any time a knife comes out she wants to see what it is. The other day, I’m dinking around with a Spyderco Civilian, and she’s peering over my shoulder saying "you’re such a badass" and actually meaning it. I’m thinKing "this knife is encouraging the warm and fuzzies, and a 642 centennial is the ring of Sauron on a black horse? Takes all kinds to fill a world..."

I’m just glad that she’s found tools to actually EDC, all the time (knives, first aid stuff, lumens). Plus I get to coonfinger her lionsteel collection... :D

[Quotron]

What about the Smith & Wesson Shield 380EZ? The easy rack slide and low recoil make this an attractive option for my mother who can rack the slide on a G19 or 17 but not particularly with authority.

[JHC]

It continues to strike as slightly ironicable that us fellows spend a lot of time, energy, and money on firearms and other protective tools/measures whilst, frequently, our ladies - who present much softer, and in many ways, more desireable targets, move around all day either completely without any sort of protective tool, or at best, very minimally armed (speaking in generalities here).

This situation is hardly new - but what is new, is the release of the Glock 48/43X (and 43 & 42). No offense to you guys who are really digging these, but the 48 strikes me as a great option for a lady's house pistol. Like a G19 for girls. I'm just wondering how many 48's and 43X's are going to find their way into nightstands and purses across the country.I am thinking that they will end up be very popular with the ladies as time goes on.

Anybody have a different take on this? I have a wife and two daughters (one daughter in college out-of-state). As it stands right now, the wife has a PPS stashed in the center console (no lectures please), and PPS stashed in the house, and an LCP in her purse. The daughter at college has a .380 EZ which replaced the Walther PPQ .22 she had previously. The youngest daughter is my shooter, but is not yet old enough to carry. She presently loves my G19X; but she has yet to shoot a G48 (as have I). The wife is okay with firearms, but is by no means an enthusiast. The daughter in college is okay with them in concept and is all about self-defense, but actually shooting a gun is pretty low on her list of enjoyable things to do. For her, having a pistol is like going to the dentist. The youngest, as noted, is all about shooting. Cool thing is, I can see the G48 being the pistol that they prefer/gravitate to.

I would be interested to hear what firearms the ladies in your households gravitate toward for defensive use and how they are carried/stored.

I'm thinking similarly about this G48. OTOH my wife and tiny handed DILs have done decently with standard frame Glocks. But their faces light up holding a G42 and G43. The light remains shooting the 42 but flickers shooting the 43. ;)

I find the 48 noticeably easier than the 43 recoil wise but it remains to be seen how they find it.

[TGS]

My wife has a P226 and P250 .380.

She really likes her P226 and can hold all rounds in the black on a B8 at 7 yards on her own pace, but can have trouble racking the slide and her lack of regular practice means that she forgets to decock habitually.

She has the P250 .380 as a CCW option (purse carry) for this reason. It's about an ideal service-sized pistol for those with reduced hand strength.....old man gun, ladies gun , whatever. Forget your local liberal slacktivist club, I guess getting triggered and virtue signalling over this stuff is even cool on P-F.com these days.

[That Guy]

Add me into the camp of those who think having a separate category of "girl guns" is silly. People are individuals, their firearm selections should be as well.



I would be interested to hear what firearms the ladies in your households gravitate toward

Her favorite pistol is a 1911 steel frame Government model in .45 (Although due to ammo costs she mostly shoots her 9mm Walther P99 these days; but the 1911 is definitely more liked. One of these days I really need to come up with the money to build a proper reloading setup...) She also likes her Mossberg 590 shotgun. Carbine-wise, she has started to really prefer her Colt 6920 over her AK; the lighter recoil of the .223 over the 7.62x39mm being one factor. A large factor is probably the lighter weight of the AR.

[Sauer Koch]

The first gun my wife fell in love with, was a 1911/45. She lifts and has very strong hands, so recoil control for her wasn’t an issue, in terms of mentally being afraid of the recoil. But this was in the context of a range gun; when it came to having a gun to carry, she ended up with a M11 A-1. She didn’t like the idea of having to address the 1911 thumb safety in an oh shit moment, so she liked the long DA pull acting as a safety of sorts.
Her strong hands allowed her to manipulate the DA trigger, even though she was using an ‘incorrect grip’ with her strong hand, to allow proper finger placement on the trigger. If her finger was just .25” longer, she’d have been able to use proper grip and have ideal finger placement on the trigger, even though she had the thin, Sig short reach trigger on the gun. She shot pretty well like this for quite a while, before I realized what she’d been doing. At this point, we began searching for a new gun, that offered better trigger finger ergos.
After an exhausting search, we ran across a used P30sk V1, and a V3, so she dry fired both of them, and decided she liked the LEM better, so we ordered her a new one. Her finger rested on the trigger perfectly, all the way forward, and the super light pre travel on the LEM allowed her to easily manipulate the trigger back to the wall. I’m convinced that this is the perfect gun for her, and she’s very happy with it.

I think this may apply to other people as well. Most double stacks will create trigger reach issues, so the LEM can help.

[Gun Mutt]

My wife actually cut two guys several years ago.

When we met, she worked with dogs professionally, doing both training and daycare, her best money coming from wealthy private clients that hired her to house sit as part of caring for their dogs. It was truly impressive to watch her run a full field with as many as 100 dogs at once; sheer command presence through patience and constant doggie OODA resets...y'all'd like her, she's my Khaleesi.

Before she got her CCW and her first pistol, I got her a *Delica and asked her to commit to carrying it. I asked her to intentionally and smoothly, draw and open it at least 3x a day (10-300 being even better). She always had to grab scissors in her job to open boxes, bags, etc, so I further encouraged using the Delica for those tasks (when it wouldn't scare a coworker, of course) to build familiarity. I told her that it wouldn't take long for it to become reflexive enough that if, God forbid, something so horrible was happening that she found herself in a fight or flight moment, she'd still have to decisions to make, but she'd probably be making them with an open and locked blade in her hand.

For training, we covered solely X-cuts; hands or teeth, whatever the threat might be, she'd slash furious X's at it until it was the right time to run or get stabby. She ended up opening and using it all the time, carried it religiously.

Fast forward a few months and she goes for Mexican food with her lifelong friend (who, we must note, is going through yet another shit show stage and needed consolation after her abortion that afternoon). After dinner, they went to the little neighborhood bar across the street where Shit Show immediately starts getting drunk and flirty with a couple of strangers. Wife finishes her bottle of beer and heads to the ladies room. She returns to find a fresh beer waiting and declines it, she doesn't drink anything she didn't maintain control of...and they'd paid her tab...nope, time to go.

SS wants to go back to their hotel room and needs to be reminded just why this is such a bad idea, especially that evening. SS switches to crying mode and my lady is guiding her to her Jeep when the two guys follow them into the parking lot. SS now goes aggressive, yelling and insulting the guys. That's when BG1 slapped SS, and again. BG2 takes a step towards Kahleesi, reaches for her and gets cut across his left forearm with the first move of her X. She said it was a good cut, too, lots of blood, him backing up and yowling while holding it with his right hand. BG1 was turned slightly away from her and as his hand came back to chamber another slap for SS, Kahleesi took a step forward and made the same cut along the back of his right arm, she's not sure if she got more deltoid or tricep, but she remembers it being an even better cut. She shoved SS through her open door and climbed over her to drive away.

Later she would tell me that she didn't even remember drawing the knife, it was just there. It wasn't the reaching hands that triggered her either, it was his eyes she tells me. For days afterword, she'd give a little shiver and say; I can still feel him looking at me, it was so ugly it makes me feel dirty. Keep this part in mind if your lady love ever has to go full Kahleesi, she probably won't come home in the mood for a steak and a hearty romp.

*Delica tidbit: she'd switched to a waved Delica for a while and gave her original to another lady student from our EMT class (which is where we met). She told me she wanted to switch back and a friend was at Blade Show at that moment. I texted him and asked him to pick one up if he saw a good deal. An hour later he sends me a pic of him shaking hands with Michael Janich as MJ presents him with a Delica. And that's the knife that was in her pocket that night. Still her favorite knife, too. I shared a different board with Mr. Janich years ago and he enjoyed this story very, very much.

Anyway, guns: She likes a G19/X300 for bedside and will generally grab her S&W 351c over her G42 these days, but she loves them both.

You mess with this Lioness or her loved ones, you're gonna get shot in the face repeatedly.

35039

[OlongJohnson]

There's a thread about "grandma gun" or something like that here. The P250 .380 is strong in that one. I have been shooting one, and agree it is likely the perfect girl gun. Available with grip modules in compact and subcompact with "small" grip circumference/trigger reach. The DA trigger is extremely smooth and light, the slide is extremely easy to rack, the manual of arms as simple as a semi can be. The Compact length mags hold 15 rounds, so 16 with a plus-one. I had serious back surgery a few months ago, and will spend a few months shooting it when I get past .22LR. I have a special person in my life who is half my size and has expressed dislike of recoil. It would be perfect for her if she didn't live behind the West Coast Wall.

In defense of my political incorrectness, I was just doing what SHE Tamara did:

Enter the “Grandma Gun”: The Sig P250 Compact (https://www.luckygunner.com/lounge/changing-face-first-time-gun-buyer/)

And yes, the adult women I care about range from 5'4" to 6'3", and there was even once a 5'10" athlete with feet shorter than my hands. So of course I get that everyone is an individual. But there are still trends. Women definitely trend smaller in size, with smaller hands. And from the small end to the large end of the spectrum, I have personally heard expressions of dislike for recoil. One friend's wife took an intro pistol class with a G19 and didn't like the .22LR when she tried it, because it seemed like there was nothing happening. My first pistol as an adult was a Buck Mark, and I still really like them, along with my GP100 and P220. It still is reasonable to me to start a new shooter, especially a female, with less recoil and let them work up to whatever their comfort level ends up being.

Notice, at 6'4" and 240 lb, I make the point that the "grandma gun" is the right one for me due to my physical condition in the near future. But there are still trends.

[JHC]

Gun Mutt Delica straight edge or serrated?

[Totem Polar]

Gun Mutt, great story. Good for your lady. And I bet Mike J did like hearing the reasonably happy outcome. ;)

[HCM]

This reminds me, I carried a .357 P229 for the US Secret Service for long enough to observe that the average woman we hired off the street does just fine carrying & shooting a 2.5lb pistol with a 12lb trigger pull in a nasty little caliber, with high quality instruction.

Selecting young, physically fit women who are at least somewhat more aggressive than average (true of most women in LE) doesn’t hurt.

Even once they get into their 40s and 50s the female shooters who have hand size / strength issues go back to shooting well as soon as you get them a 9mm and/ or a gun that fits their hand.

[HCM]

In defense of my political incorrectness, I was just doing what SHE @Tam did:

Enter the “Grandma Gun”: The Sig P250 Compact (https://www.luckygunner.com/lounge/changing-face-first-time-gun-buyer/)

And yes, the adult women I care about range from 5'4" to 6'3", and there was even once a 5'10" athlete with feet shorter than my hands. So of course I get that everyone is an individual. But there are still trends. Women definitely trend smaller in size, with smaller hands. And from the small end to the large end of the spectrum, I have personally heard expressions of dislike for recoil. One friend's wife took an intro pistol class with a G19 and didn't like the .22LR when she tried it, because it seemed like there was nothing happening. My first pistol as an adult was a Buck Mark, and I still really like them, along with my GP100 and P220. It still is reasonable to me to start a new shooter, especially a female, with less recoil and let them work up to whatever their comfort level ends up being.

Notice, at 6'4" and 240 lb, I make the point that the "grandma gun" is the right one for me due to my physical condition in the near future. But there are still trends.

We are all gonna age and lose strength- assuming we live that long. The original concept was actually Claude Werner’s “old man” gun.

[BillSWPA]

My wife actually cut two guys several years ago.

When we met, she worked with dogs professionally, doing both training and daycare, her best money coming from wealthy private clients that hired her to house sit as part of caring for their dogs. It was truly impressive to watch her run a full field with as many as 100 dogs at once; sheer command presence through patience and constant doggie OODA resets...y'all'd like her, she's my Khaleesi.

Before she got her CCW and her first pistol, I got her a *Delica and asked her to commit to carrying it. I asked her to intentionally and smoothly, draw and open it at least 3x a day (10-300 being even better). She always had to grab scissors in her job to open boxes, bags, etc, so I further encouraged using the Delica for those tasks (when it wouldn't scare a coworker, of course) to build familiarity. I told her that it wouldn't take long for it to become reflexive enough that if, God forbid, something so horrible was happening that she found herself in a fight or flight moment, she'd still have to decisions to make, but she'd probably be making them with an open and locked blade in her hand.

For training, we covered solely X-cuts; hands or teeth, whatever the threat might be, she'd slash furious X's at it until it was the right time to run or get stabby. She ended up opening and using it all the time, carried it religiously.

Fast forward a few months and she goes for Mexican food with her lifelong friend (who, we must note, is going through yet another shit show stage and needed consolation after her abortion that afternoon). After dinner, they went to the little neighborhood bar across the street where Shit Show immediately starts getting drunk and flirty with a couple of strangers. Wife finishes her bottle of beer and heads to the ladies room. She returns to find a fresh beer waiting and declines it, she doesn't drink anything she didn't maintain control of...and they'd paid her tab...nope, time to go.

SS wants to go back to their hotel room and needs to be reminded just why this is such a bad idea, especially that evening. SS switches to crying mode and my lady is guiding her to her Jeep when the two guys follow them into the parking lot. SS now goes aggressive, yelling and insulting the guys. That's when BG1 slapped SS, and again. BG2 takes a step towards Kahleesi, reaches for her and gets cut across his left forearm with the first move of her X. She said it was a good cut, too, lots of blood, him backing up and yowling while holding it with his right hand. BG1 was turned slightly away from her and as his hand came back to chamber another slap for SS, Kahleesi took a step forward and made the same cut along the back of his right arm, she's not sure if she got more deltoid or tricep, but she remembers it being an even better cut. She shoved SS through her open door and climbed over her to drive away.

Later she would tell me that she didn't even remember drawing the knife, it was just there. It wasn't the reaching hands that triggered her either, it was his eyes she tells me. For days afterword, she'd give a little shiver and say; I can still feel him looking at me, it was so ugly it makes me feel dirty. Keep this part in mind if your lady love ever has to go full Kahleesi, she probably won't come home in the mood for a steak and a hearty romp.

*Delica tidbit: she'd switched to a waved Delica for a while and gave her original to another lady student from our EMT class (which is where we met). She told me she wanted to switch back and a friend was at Blade Show at that moment. I texted him and asked him to pick one up if he saw a good deal. An hour later he sends me a pic of him shaking hands with Michael Janich as MJ presents him with a Delica. And that's the knife that was in her pocket that night. Still her favorite knife, too. I shared a different board with Mr. Janich years ago and he enjoyed this story very, very much.

Anyway, guns: She likes a G19/X300 for bedside and will generally grab her S&W 351c over her G42 these days, but she loves them both.

You mess with this Lioness or her loved ones, you're gonna get shot in the face repeatedly.

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Great story! One question: why the switch back to the non-waved Delica?

Hopefully your wife is spending a lot less time with SS.


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[ChaseN]

Selecting young, physically fit women who are at least somewhat more aggressive than average (true of most women in LE) doesn’t hurt.

This is undoubtedly some truth to this. That said, federal hiring and USAJobs being what they are, there are a lot of agents (male and female) who would have gone to work for the Peace Corps if they'd have called them back first. Never saw anyone who the instructors couldn't get spun up on the 229.

[Gun Mutt]

Gun Mutt Delica straight edge or serrated?
Straight edge.


Great story! One question: why the switch back to the non-waved Delica?
Hopefully your wife is spending a lot less time with SS.

She's tiny and she's practical, so she does BJJ. When she's on her back with her knees &/or feet on her opponents hips, she can't make the wave work. She also only carries the one knife, so it serves general purpose duty, too. Snapping your blade out to open a box at work doesn't always earn ooohs and ahhs and nowadays, she'd be waving it open right at our son's face level.

Full disclosure, she's a full time mom these days and mostly wears yoga pants around the house, jeans maybe once a week, so the Delica spends most of it's time on the kitchen counter. This is also why she prefers her 351c w/ClipDraw to her G42 in a Keepers Errand most days.

SS seemed to get a good bit of fecal cohesion over the years, getting a job as a theraputic masseuse for a children's chiropractor. She earned a black belt in some hard style of karate, did lots of kata competition and bumped her self esteem considerably. Even left her latest loser boyfriend because, well, he was a loser. She's gone full lefty last we heard, I'm sure she's just a riot at the dinner table now.

She was over for one of our nearly weekly bonfires at the old house in Indy before we moved and did one of her forms for gathered; fun to watch, she's cute and played to us like we were the judges, I see why she won a lot. Later, alone, Kahleesi gave her appraisal: Oh, I'd effing kill her in a fight, not even close.

[BillSWPA]

Straight edge.



She's tiny and she's practical, so she does BJJ. When she's on her back with her knees &/or feet on her opponents hips, she can't make the wave work. She also only carries the one knife, so it serves general purpose duty, too. Snapping your blade out to open a box at work doesn't always earn ooohs and ahhs and nowadays, she'd be waving it open right at our son's face level.

Full disclosure, she's a full time mom these days and mostly wears yoga pants around the house, jeans maybe once a week, so the Delica spends most of it's time on the kitchen counter. This is also why she prefers her 351c w/ClipDraw to her G42 in a Keepers Errand most days.

SS seemed to get a good bit of fecal cohesion over the years, getting a job as a theraputic masseuse for a children's chiropractor. She earned a black belt in some hard style of karate, did lots of kata competition and bumped her self esteem considerably. Even left her latest loser boyfriend because, well, he was a loser. She's gone full lefty last we heard, I'm sure she's just a riot at the dinner table now.

She was over for one of our nearly weekly bonfires at the old house in Indy before we moved and did one of her forms for gathered; fun to watch, she's cute and played to us like we were the judges, I see why she won a lot. Later, alone, Kahleesi gave her appraisal: Oh, I'd effing kill her in a fight, not even close.

The 351 is a surprising solution that makes perfect sense for her.

I used to know a lady that attended the same MMA class as me who carried a folding Benchmade clipped into the AIWB position of her yoga pants. So, a knife can work, but I would never pick a knife over the 351.

I like the Spyderco waved knives, but they do tend to be tough to withdraw from a pocket without them waving open. I doubt that would be my choice if it was in a waistband rather than in a pocket.

KnifeCenter has some really nice looking wood-handled Delicas and Enduras, just in case these are of any interest to your wife. They do not have the weave.

It appears that knife carry may be part of a solution to female weapon carry, but also presents its own challenges. I wonder if knives for the ladies is a useful topic in the edged weapons sub forum?



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[ViniVidivici]

I'm with Drang, don't care for the principle of "ladies gun". I'm happy to report that my 6 actual is competent and capable, loves her G19 and G43, shoots them well, never leaves home without one, or both.

Yes, I'm lucky to have her as backup. We make a good fireteam.

[jwperry]

My wife opted for the P225A1.

She's not small, not an enthusiast and carries in her purse or in the center console of her car. Rarely on her person. If on her person, since women's clothing seems to omit useful beltloops, she uses DCC clips to secure to whatever pants she's wearing. Previously, she'd use a modified JMCK holster with a velcro'd spring clip to secure onto her pants.

She preferred the M&P9 but kept forgetting to deactivate the thumb safety (her requirement, not mine) on her old one. She liked my P229 and opted for the smaller grip circumference model. She gets the magazine release and decocker confused, but won't switch. I've been trying to warm her up to the PX4c, which she can actually run the slide on without first cocking the hammer, but she doesn't like the lack of grip texture. I need to get one of my frames textured and have her try again.

[Glenn E. Meyer]

No one mentioned www.corneredcat.com as a reference? Anyway, my daughter who is 5'2" (and annoyed by being shorter than her parents) can shoot a G19, 642 and Colt Cobra quite competently. When folks discussed racking problems for women, I took the G19 (clearly and repeatedly checked to be clear) and showed her how to rack. I asked if she could do this and she did and said: So what? She does work out a tad.

I found among gun friends (who don't train) that their wives were happy with a Taurus 85 buried in their purse. Some are moving to G42s though.

[BillSWPA]

Purse carry using a dedicated gun purse can work quite well as long as extra care is taken to keep the purse within the lady’s control. In fact, it can work better than some of the on-body solutions that exist. Some videos made by a well-trained lady were previously posted in another thread, demonstrating this point.

Keeping control of that purse is critical. Years ago, a 4 year old riding in the same Wal-Mart shopping cart as his mother’s gun purse managed to get the gun out of the purse and shoot himself while his mother was pulling something off a shelf.

I hope those Glock 42’s do not end up buried in purses as opposed to specifically designed gun purses. One of those ladies will hear a loud bang when their lipstick works its way into the trigger.


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[That Guy]

I've been trying to warm her up to the PX4c, which she can actually run the slide on without first cocking the hammer, but she doesn't like the lack of grip texture. I need to get one of my frames textured and have her try again.

I didn't like the lack of texture on the grip of my PX4, either. Talon Gun Grips makes a much simpler solution to the problem than either bringing out the soldering iron or spending money on custom work. Especially if the custom work is for an experiment, like in your situation. If she still doesn't warm up to the gun, and you don't want to keep the texturing, a Talon grip is fully reversible - you just peel it off. If you are concerned about increasing the grip size, the tape is quite thin and won't make a noticeable difference.

[Rex G]

We are all gonna age and lose strength- assuming we live that long. The original concept was actually Claude Werner’s “old man” gun.

Yes, we lose strength, and, the “fit” of guns can change, as there is less meat on the bones. I have yet to switch to an old man gun, or a granny gun, but have had to make accommodations for my right hand, which has not aged well. Thankfully, my left hand has remained healthier.

[HCM]

No one mentioned www.corneredcat.com as a reference? Anyway, my daughter who is 5'2" (and annoyed by being shorter than her parents) can shoot a G19, 642 and Colt Cobra quite competently. When folks discussed racking problems for women, I took the G19 (clearly and repeatedly checked to be clear) and showed her how to rack. I asked if she could do this and she did and said: So what? She does work out a tad.

I found among gun friends (who don't train) that their wives were happy with a Taurus 85 buried in their purse. Some are moving to G42s though.

One alternative method of racking slides for those with reduced strength is to hold the slide and push the frame. It is mechanically easier though it requires a good trigger finger index.

[JBP55]

We are all gonna age and lose strength- assuming we live that long. The original concept was actually Claude Werner’s “old man” gun.

That would be me. Old and disabled I now stay with striker fired 9mm pistols.

[JBP55]

[QUOTE=HCM;844910]One alternative method of racking slides for those with reduced strength is to hold the slide and push the frame. It is mechanically easier though it requires a good trigger finger index.[/QUOTE

I teach that in my CHP classes for shooters who are unable to rack the slide in the conventional manner.

[Notorious E.O.C.]

About once a year, Mrs. Write initiates a discussion on concealed carry options for her. It lasts about a week, and then we go back to another 358 days of disinterest. The most sustained progress I've made is a commitment to biennial range sessions with the house guns (PPQ and AR SBR) to maintain some level of basic familiarity.

Her weapon of choice, and the only gun in the safe that was her selection and her name on the 4473, is a lightly-tuned Browning Hi-Power that I believe used to be someone's bowling pin gun. It'd make an awesome BBQ gun but the sights are so big you could mount them in your instrument panel as an artificial horizon. Unfortunately, because her first gun was a tuned BHP, she measures everything else against it.

The running thread on the EDC X9 has me casting occasional glances toward that as a possible practical alternative (insofar as any $3k gun can be said to be "practical"). If I thought it'd actually induce her to carry, I'd drop the money without hesitation, but it'd be an awfully expensive experiment to do so without some level of commitment on her part.

(Yes, I am aware that if the experiment failed, I would still have an EDC X9. Don't tempt me further.)

[Bucky]

About once a year, Mrs. Write initiates a discussion on concealed carry options for her. It lasts about a week, and then we go back to another 358 days of disinterest. The most sustained progress I've made is a commitment to biennial range sessions with the house guns (PPQ and AR SBR) to maintain some level of basic familiarity.

Her weapon of choice, and the only gun in the safe that was her selection and her name on the 4473, is a lightly-tuned Browning Hi-Power that I believe used to be someone's bowling pin gun. It'd make an awesome BBQ gun but the sights are so big you could mount them in your instrument panel as an artificial horizon. Unfortunately, because her first gun was a tuned BHP, she measures everything else against it.

The running thread on the EDC X9 has me casting occasional glances toward that as a possible practical alternative (insofar as any $3k gun can be said to be "practical"). If I thought it'd actually induce her to carry, I'd drop the money without hesitation, but it'd be an awfully expensive experiment to do so without some level of commitment on her part.

(Yes, I am aware that if the experiment failed, I would still have an EDC X9. Don't tempt me further.)

Do you have any opportunity to let her shoot one? If you were local to me, I’d hook you up.

[Gun Mutt]

Do you have any opportunity to let her shoot one? If you were local to me, I’d hook you up.

After seeing pics of some of your collection, I'd make a serious road trip for a range day!

[Notorious E.O.C.]

Do you have any opportunity to let her shoot one? If you were local to me, I’d hook you up.

Sadly, no. I haven't found anyone who owns one here in Bluegrassistan, and the only place that stocks them has fairly limited hours. Which may be best for my savings account.

[theJanitor]

I think my sister is going the MP9/RMR route, after trying out my brother's g19/RMR. Also, racking the slide with an optic is WAY easier

[Bergeron]

It’s interesting being considered as the “gun person” in my acquaintance/friend group when the topic of women introducing themselves to guns occurs. When it happens to me, I always try to point to women who are content creators and SMEs such as corneredcat and VFTP. I think I can mainly provide value in being able to put hands on books and guns in private settings and proving hardware-oriented information without trying to make a sale.

My mother and sister got interested through the sport shooting side of the house, but I find that most women who I talk to are focused on mainly self defense. I try to talk up flashlights and OC as much as I do the guns.

The hand strength thing is one of my favorite parts of corneredcat because it comes up often- I often worry that new shooters are so ready to believe that operating a slide is strength versus technique and it feels great to be able to whip the old phone out and directly navigate to pictures and discussion of technique. The big lack in my personal arsenal is a mid-size locked breech .380- I wish there was a 42x.

I also wish there were more .22 conversions for the small little 9s and .380s. I always make a pitch for shooting as a hobby, and convincing someone that not only should they spend additional money on training, a holster, belt, and quality defensive ammo, making the pitch for a whole other gun is difficult.

Sometimes I think about getting a bob tailed, short-triggered, thin-gripped aluminum 9x19 Commander, some light loads and just handing the whole thing over on loan like a library book.

[gato naranja]

Sometimes I think about getting a bob tailed, short-triggered, thin-gripped aluminum 9x19 Commander, some light loads and just handing the whole thing over on loan like a library book.

Interesting. I won't go into the long, boring history of how it happened, but - other than MAYBE the bobtail part - I am coming around to this way of thinking. I will say, however, that an awful lot of women do seem to take a shine to the very thing you describe when they try one out (my wife included, though her fingers are long enough to use a "standard" trigger).

One of the ranges we frequent ended up putting multiple 9mm 1911s in the rental section because women were basically waiting in line to use the first one they offered.

gn

[Gun Mutt]

I said in the ladies knife thread; my work has so often had me in close, trusted proximity to women that I've been blessed to leave a heartwarming trail of armed (probably semi-armed in most cases) women. These are my observations of those wonderful, smart, funny and hardworking women:

Most will never get the competition bug.

Few will go through a quality class.

Of those that owned a pistol (even those that carried regularly), the vast majority owned only the one pistol.

Sure, there's Tamara, Stephanie B, @Heidi Smith, my wife...but IME, they're the exceptions that prove the rule. My wife is 5'3" of elfen hellcat and a 100rd range session is just about her top end. She's run 200+rds through her G42 in one long range session and she paid dearly for the experience for several days...just physics.

I'm paraphrasing Chuck Whitlock here, again from the ladies knife thread: Is it present and will she use it? If I can get two yeses here, then the rest of their answer is great with me.

Because of my experiences above, I'm an absolutely unabashed shill for the G42 and the .22 LCR/j-frame. If they can carry one safely, produce it on demand and shoot a hand sized mag/cylinder dump at 3yds, which I think Claude Werner would approve of for men or women, then they're aces in my book. If they choose to further add a double stack w/WML on their bedside, I'll get genuinely giddy.

[Sauer Koch]

If on her person, since women's clothing seems to omit useful beltloops, she uses DCC clips to secure to whatever pants she's wearing. Previously, she'd use a modified JMCK holster with a velcro'd spring clip to secure onto her pants.

FYI, the UltiClip is pretty awesome. My wife didn’t care for having to use a belt to be able to carry her P30sk in her Kydex holster. I ran across the UltiClip on YT, and it seemed like a fix for her issue. I bought one from Tier 1 Concealed, when I bought my holster, just to see what they were like.
My previous holster was from Muddy River Tactical, and due to their great CS, quality holsters, and extremely quick ship time, I spoke with Kevin the owner, and explained my situation with the clip, and asked if he’d be willing to build her another IWB using the UltiClip, and he said sure! He got the clip on Thursday, called me on Friday for payment since it was a verbal special order, and I had the holster in my hands on Tuesday!

For those who want to carry a smaller gun without a belt, these are great. They clamp down with some serious pressure, and even with yoga pants, my wife tested it, and the clip maintained a hold on her pants, and the gun came out of the kydex perfectly.
Just wanted to share.
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