Send CRG to Custom Shop.. Or spring for a new Les Baer or a DW?

[Crash41984]

Like the title says, I have a decision to make. I currently have a Colt Rail Gun (original split rail frame) that I intend to send to Evolution in the next couple months for a slew of custom touches. Specifically, 20lpi front strap checkering, fit and blend Stan Chen Gen 2 magwell, night sights, Harrison True Radius Trigger and Trigger Job, fit Harrison or EGW thumb and grip safety, Harrison or EGW slide stop, flush cut and crown, ball cuts, dehorn, etc... Basically everything sans a weld up and cosmetic serrations.

I shoot the CRG really well, it is one of my carry guns, and I've had all of the mods on my wishlist for awhile. I've got a SA MCOP and a trio of Glocks that can keep me company during the 6 month or so turnaround time.

My issue is the price tag (~$1,500- ~$1,800.00). I'm certain the work will be worth the money plunked down, however, I'll be within a few hundred dollars of a new Les Baer or Dan Wesson. Either way, it will end up being carried, performing nightstand duty, riding in kydex during carbine courses, and otherwise not being babied.

Do I send the CRG to Evo? Or do I just buy a LB or DW? What say you?

[HopetonBrown]

I shoot the CRG really well,

How did you determine that?

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[rjohnson4405]

All things being equal having two quality guns is better than one.

IF the Dan Wesson and/or Les Baer have all the features you want, it doesn't make sense to put the same money and work into a "used" gun (I understand you're replacing most wear parts anyway). Plus no 6 months of wait.

IF you want something bespoke, then the custom Colt route makes sense to me.

[41magfan]

I'd throw that money towards a nice used Baer or DW and keep your Colt as is for now. Both can be readily had within the price range you quoted.

[jwperry]

I sent a Night Hawk to Evolution Armory and was very, very happy with the result. If I'd have stayed a 1911 shooter, it would still be #1 for everything gun. You won't be disappointed with their work.

Just understand that you'll never get your $$ back out of a custom build unless it was done by Heirloom Precision or someone who's wait list is measured in years.

[Robinson]

Why are you thinking of having the work done in the first place? Probably so you can get exactly what you want, right? That's a good argument for sending the Colt in for customization. Evolution Armory is building a good reputation in the industry and they know Colts very well. And Colt's frames/slides/parts are actually some of the best to begin with.

On the other hand, if you plan to carry the gun or otherwise use it in a serious role you should consider having more than one if possible. That way if your primary goes down you have a backup, plus you can dedicate one to practice/training while keeping wear and tear off your primary. So that is a case for putting the money toward another pistol instead.

It boils down to deciding what your priorities are.

[Crash41984]

How did you determine that?

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My groups are tighter than with my Springfield and it just overall feels better in my hand despite not being fit quite as nicely. I mostly shoot between 7 and 25 yards, running a couple hundred rounds down the pipe each session. I'm no bullseye shooter, but cloverleafs are the norm.

[Dave Williams]

My groups are tighter than with my Springfield and it just overall feels better in my hand despite not being fit quite as nicely. I mostly shoot between 7 and 25 yards, running a couple hundred rounds down the pipe each session. I'm no bullseye shooter, but cloverleafs are the norm.

The Colt frames seem to be more svelte than other 1911 brands.

I'd get the Colt customized. Just know that you'll never get your money back, but you'll have exactly what you want.

[HopetonBrown]

My groups are tighter than with my Springfield and it just overall feels better in my hand despite not being fit quite as nicely. I mostly shoot between 7 and 25 yards, running a couple hundred rounds down the pipe each session. I'm no bullseye shooter, but cloverleafs are the norm.25 yard cloverleafs as the norm means you're an exceptional bullseye shooter. Got any pictures?

[Rex G]

Well, I had to search for “MCOP.”

Having your SA MCOP means having a 1911 during your CRG’s absence, if you choose the customization route.

OTOH, I have read so many heartbreaking accounts of firearms going missing during shipping, and that would make me hesitate to send a perfectly good, known-reliable weapon though a shipping service.

A Les Baer pistol is a object of much joy. I have a TRS, acquired new, about the year 2000, and a Monolith, acquired pre-owned, recently, though they are turn-key boutique pistols, not truly custom. I do, also, have a Harrison-customized Baer, based on a Premier II, though it was customized for its previous owner, so I cannot comment on the joys and anxieties of waiting for an already-loved pistol to return from a trip to the ‘smith.

One comment about the Harrison recoil spring plug mod; it makes reassembly quite a chore! If one launches the thing, and cannot find it, using a stock recoil spring plug as a temporary replacement seems unworkable, so, take care during stripping and reassembly, and perform that task in a safe area.

I realize I have not provided persuasive advice, one way or the other.

[EVP]

If I still had a Colt 1911 or picked up another one, I would send it to Steve at MARS and have him work on it.

[45dotACP]

In spite of being super ghey for 1911s, I probably would not send it in for the custom work. If it works just fine as is I'd probably just shoot it and build a high degree of proficiency, saving in reserve the money you have to repair it if it goes down.

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[Jim Watson]

I don't think much if any of that laundry list comes standard on a Dan Wesson or Les Baer.
So if you bought one, you would have two guns that did not fulfill your desires.

[Crash41984]

25 yard cloverleafs as the norm means you're an exceptional bullseye shooter. Got any pictures?

Yeah, I just re-read that post. At 7yds I can put rounds through the same hole all day with this pistol. At 25yds, no, cloverleafs are not normal practice. However, at 25yds, groups with the Colt are noticeably smaller than my other guns by a half inch or more. 2-2.5” at 25 is certainly doable.

[theJanitor]

I'd send it in. Making a gun you like into gun you adore is not a frivolous adventure. And if anyone knows factory Colts, it's Evolution.

With that being said, a new 5" LB will outshoot most anything out there, with no wait time and worry.

But it isn't a custom, either.

[theJanitor]

FYI, there are a couple of Evo tuned rail guns for sale on the forums right now. Wake27 has got a CRG tuned by Evo for sale, IIRC

[Wake27]

FYI, there are a couple of Evo tuned rail guns for sale on the forums right now. Wake27 has got a CRG tuned by Evo for sale, IIRC

Mine actually went to SACS, before they (mostly) shut down. Having gone through a similar decision recently, here are my thoughts, many of which have already been stated.

1. Money: you will likely spend more going the customization route than buying one of the nicer guns right off the bat, assuming there is something that has anything you want. You will also never get nearly the amount out of it that you'd hope, if you ever decide to sell it. I'd like to think that a CRG modified by SACS would keep almost as much of its value as possible, but mine had about $3,300 invested and sat at $1,700 asking price for a few days (after starting at $2,200 a week or two earlier).
2. Quality: I had a few reasons for trying to sell mine. Its the only .45 I have, and I've been wanting a 9mm 1911 for a while because of how soft they reportedly shoot, plus, dropping an entire caliber really sounded nice. I assumed that with all of the money invested into my CRG, I'd be able to sell it for about $2k which would leave me enough money to buy a Specialist with CZ's military discount and still have a few hundred to put towards vet bills for my dog. I also assumed that the Specialist would feel better than my CRG, because I assumed a good factory pistol would be nicer than a decent base pistol with work done to it. I only held the Specialist for a few minutes at the LGS, but my assumption was wrong. Subjectively, my CRG felt tighter and smoother then the Specialist.
3. Misc: wait time sucks, shipping sucks, and at least for me, having a gun modified by anyone other than its manufacturer can be kind of a bummer. All of those are fairly minor details, but still true.

All of that being said, theJanitor is correct on the aspect of customizing it just how you want. I'm more tied to my CRG than I thought, and the more I dropped my asking price, the ore I knew I'd regret it. There are three things I wish I had done differently with it however, and had those been done, I don't know if I would've tried to sell it at all.

ETA - I should also mention that the Specialist didn't have everything I wanted. I strongly prefer FCS and flat triggers, so if it was built that way, it very likely may have changed my mind. This probably hasn't been helpful at all because I don't know which I'd recommend. Customizing a gun to your preferences is oddly pleasing, but then again, buying another gun is always nice too.

[farscott]

For the money to upgrade the CRG, you can get a Rock River Arms Carry. MSRP is $1650, and it is light years better than the Baer Thunder Ranch/Ultimate Tactical Carry. RRA uses the same Kart barrel, properly fits the barrel, uses Heinie Straight 8 sights, and uses pretty good parts that are well fit.

https://www.rockriverarms.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=category.display&category_ID=135

[HopetonBrown]

I have a Les Baer, it's really kinda rough when compared to my Wilson or Nighthawk. I was at my friend's last weekend, he has a MC Operator. It wasn't that great, either.

All these are going to do about the same in our hands, but I'd rather have one 1911 I love than two I just like. The problem is if you want to compete or train with a 1911 you really need two. But if you send the Colt in you'll have one to love, and the MCO can be backup.

[TheNewbie]

For the money to upgrade the CRG, you can get a Rock River Arms Carry. MSRP is $1650, and it is light years better than the Baer Thunder Ranch/Ultimate Tactical Carry. RRA uses the same Kart barrel, properly fits the barrel, uses Heinie Straight 8 sights, and uses pretty good parts that are well fit.

https://www.rockriverarms.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=category.display&category_ID=135


Do the Rock River 1911's have a good reputation? I have heard very little in regard to them.

[HCM]

Do the Rock River 1911's have a good reputation? I have heard very little in regard to them.

The older Rock River's do. RRA was a semi custom 1911 bulder on par with Les baer quality and price wise before they got into AR's. The AR's took off to the point they stopped doing 1911's but just brought them back withing the last year or two. The new ones havent been out long but appear promising.

I have a couple LB and one DW. LB used to be a great value, they were in a sweet spot under $2k but with the accuracy and reliability of higher end guns like Wilson and NightHawk. The fit and finish of LB was not as nice as the higher end guns but there is no free lunch.

The LBs have now creeped up into the mid to high $2k's, low end wilson territory, without any corresponding improvements in the actual product.

Dan Wesson now occupies the sub $2k sweet spot, LB and higher reliability and accuracy but with, IMHO, better fit and finish that LB. Even moreso is you qualify for CZ/DW's LE/MIL pricing.

[TheNewbie]

The older Rock River's do. RRA was a semi custom 1911 bulder on par with Les baer quality and price wise before they got into AR's. The AR's took off to the point they stopped doing 1911's but just brought them back withing the last year or two. The new ones havent been out long but appear promising.

I have a couple LB and one DW. LB used to be a great value, they were in a sweet spot under $2k but with the accuracy and reliability of higher end guns like Wilson and NightHawk. The fit and finish of LB was not as nice as the higher end guns but there is no free lunch.

The LBs have now creeped up into the mid to high $2k's, low end wilson territory, without any corresponding improvements in the actual product.

Dan Wesson now occupies the sub $2k sweet spot, LB and higher reliability and accuracy but with, IMHO, better fit and finish that LB. Even moreso is you qualify for CZ/DW's LE/MIL pricing.



Interesting. The RRA 1911 Carry sure looks like a nice pistol.


I read that Dan Wesson was discontinuing the Valor.

[farscott]

Do the Rock River 1911's have a good reputation? I have heard very little in regard to them.

I have one of the Carry models built in 2017 as well as two older (early 2000s) full custom (one blued Government-length and one hard chromed Commander-length) Elite Commandos. The Carry is every bit as good as my old SA Pro and exceeds every Les Baer of my experience. I think the Carry model is priced too low; if it was priced higher, it would sell better.

[theJanitor]

I have one of the Carry models built in 2017 as well as two older (early 2000s) full custom (one blued Government-length and one hard chromed Commander-length) Elite Commandos. The Carry is every bit as good as my old SA Pro and exceeds every Les Baer of my experience. I think the Carry model is priced too low; if it was priced higher, it would sell better.

I regret not getting a number of RRA 1911's that passed my way. they were great pistols

[StraitR]

Interesting. The RRA 1911 Carry sure looks like a nice pistol.


I read that Dan Wesson was discontinuing the Valor.


Confirmed. The Valor is not on their 2019 price sheet.

[JAD]

I enjoy having Colts customized, and I also own a couple of deedubs. Therefore i suggest you do both.

Gratuitous custom Colt (Wilson on a super lightweight commander). https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190126/1285c835c9bb5252dece478d46bc722a.jpg

[Crash41984]

I appreciate all of the advice, gents. I’ll probably change my mind 6-8 times, but I’m thinking I’m gonna stick with the original plan and send the CRG to Evo. Maybe I’ll learn how to post a pic while I’m waiting.

[M2CattleCo]

My opinion is that for the money Baers aren't quality guns (owned 2) and DWs are nice drop-in fit guns, but nothing like a real built 1911 (I own one, have owned 3).

You likely won't live long enough to wear out a modern steel 1911, so quality over quantity is the name of the game for me.