Downsizing & Rethinking

[XXXsilverXXX]

So I want to downsize, and I currently own 2 vp9, a px4cc, p2000, & a p30. Also a STI 2011 in 45acp that I haven’t shot in probably 5 years sitting and collecting dust that I badly want to get rid of but can’t bring myself to sell. The 9mm shield I have may fund a 642 so I can still have a pocket pistol.
I shoot every gun reasonably well (haven’t shot the g19 gen5). Getting better is going to be down to concentrating on one set of guns, and getting rid of the rest so I have no distractions. Using the Money from selling the others for more ammo, and hopefully a class or two if I ever have any time.

[Bigghoss]

So I want to downsize, and I currently own all of them except the glock 19 gen5, I shoot every gun reasonably well (haven’t shot the g19 gen5). Getting better is going to be down to concentrating on one set of guns, and getting rid of the rest so I have no distractions.

Are there any other factors to consider? Are you an armed professional that carries an issued gun at work? Do you have more invested in support gear for any platform? Do you have more experience operating any of the platforms besides just pulling the trigger?

All else being equal I'd say Glock just because it's got the most aftermarket support for holsters and sights. But for the most part one's just as good as another. Do you enjoy any of them more than any other? A gun you like to shoot is a gun you will shoot more.

[XXXsilverXXX]

Are there any other factors to consider? Are you an armed professional that carries an issued gun at work? Do you have more invested in support gear for any platform? Do you have more experience operating any of the platforms besides just pulling the trigger?

All else being equal I'd say Glock just because it's got the most aftermarket support for holsters and sights. But for the most part one's just as good as another. Do you enjoy any of them more than any other? A gun you like to shoot is a gun you will shoot more.

Not a armed professional, I only have a holster for the p2000 & p30 but that isn’t a big loss. As of late I have been using the px4cc and the p2000 more then anything else. If I would say any one in particular would be between the px4 & p2000, with g19 being last, I have always liked the g19’s and have always shot them slightly Better then the da/sa guns. But I am leaning more toward having a da/sa.

[AZgunguy]

I'd have to echo Bigghoss. If you don't have an issued gun, stay with the one you like best. You're most likely to shoot that one the best.

If you have an issued gun, keep the one closest to that. Changing gun types between on and off duty can screw up your aim, which could be fatal.

[StraitR]

So are we voting for what to keep, or what to get rid of?

If absolute practicality is the goal, keep the 19.5 and get rid of the rest as you see fit. One man's opinion.

[Bigghoss]

Not a armed professional, I only have a holster for the p2000 & p30 but that isn’t a big loss. As of late I have been using the px4cc and the p2000 more then anything else. If I would say any one in particular would be between the px4 & p2000, with g19 being last, I have always liked the g19’s and have always shot them slightly Better then the da/sa guns. But I am leaning more toward having a da/sa.

Sounds like it's between the P2000 and the PX4 then. If you want a 642 for a pocket gun then maybe an LEM P2000 if yours isn't already. Honestly you could probably just throw a dart and go with whatever it lands on and be just fine. The important thing is you're picking one and concentrating on that.

[XXXsilverXXX]

So are we voting for what to keep, or what to get rid of?

If absolute practicality is the goal, keep the 19.5 and get rid of the rest as you see fit. One man's opinion.

Keep

[backtrail540]

I voted vp9 simply because you already have two. One to vet then carry and one as a dedicated dry practice/ training gun. The gun doesn't matter much, putting in the work does.

[revchuck38]

I'm biased, but since you're leaning toward DA/SA I'd say keep the PX4 and sell the others. You won't find a better currently-produced TDA gun, IMO Beretta has that niche nailed down.

[YVK]

The answer is "doesn't matter" if the purpose is concealed carry. If you want to introduce other variables, like thinking of competing and trying to do well there, I would think the VP9 or G19 (with intent to get a full frame Glock later). For concealing and classes, whatever appeals to you for the reasons that are primary to you. For a DA/SA option, I think PX4CC is more shootable than P2000 and P30 as long as shorter sight radius doesn't bother you.
My personal choice would've been Gen5 19.

[Joe in PNG]

I generally have regretted selling any of my 9mm service type pistols.
Just saying.

[olstyn]

Which mag release do you like better? Paddle vs button is one of the largest differences between those guns...

[TheNewbie]

The P-07 is a nice TDA option.

[UniSol]

Seems like a better question first might be "Hammer/TDA or some flavor of fully/partially tensioned striker?" Out of those, I would personally choose the PX4, but it's almost a wash. Or go with an outside hire like a P07. Six of one, 1/2 dozen of the other. Nothing wrong with a Glock 19 either.

[einherjarvalk]

Of the options presented, I would start by axing the P2000. It's the red-headed stepchild of the HK hammer series, with neither the aftermarket support of the USP/USP Compact, nor the ergonomics of the P30/VP9. The VP9 and P30 would be next to consider dropping, since at that point the primary difference is striker vs TDA, but it won't hurt to keep both since magazines are interchangable.

If I had to tell you to keep only one, however, it would be the Glock, simply because the Glock 19 is a gun I think every shooter should own and the Gen 5 models are by far the best.

[RevolverRob]

So I want to downsize, and I currently own 2 vp9, a px4cc, p2000, & a p30. Also a STI 2011 in 45acp that I haven’t shot in probably 5 years sitting and collecting dust that I badly want to get rid of but can’t bring myself to sell. The 9mm shield I have may fund a 642 so I can still have a pocket pistol.
I shoot every gun reasonably well (haven’t shot the g19 gen5). Getting better is going to be down to concentrating on one set of guns, and getting rid of the rest so I have no distractions. Using the Money from selling the others for more ammo, and hopefully a class or two if I ever have any time.

Appendix carry? If yes, the PX4CC - sell everything else and buy another PX4CC.

If no, keep the VP9s and sell everything else and buy a VP9 SK to augment those two.

That's what I would do.

And 2011s can generally be disappeared to someone else's safe who will use them (if that's a consolation). The .45 is a little tougher than a 9 or .40, but it'll sell. I'd tell you to just send it to my FFL and I'll send you a check, but my wife keeps telling me she wants a "house". What good is a house if I don't have twelve STIs to house inside of it?! :eek:

[pangloss]

2 VP9s and 2 P30s make sense from a magazine perspective. You could add a P30sk and a VP9sk and have parallel striker and hammer setups. I'm currently quite enamoured with my P30, but earlier in the year I was quite enamoured with my PX4cc. I would be content to use either model for edc instead of my Glocks. All the pistols you listed are good pistols, so there's no wrong answer.

My 1911 is sitting in the LGS on consignment right now. I don't miss it and I hope it sells soon.

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[WobblyPossum]

I think RevolverRob had a good suggestion and I vote for that.

[Jason M]

I think RevolverRob had a good suggestion and I vote for that.

This! But if you liked the universal availability of all things Glock, keep the 19.5, have a sale to get some cash and then wait for SHOT 19 before making any other purchases.

[OlongJohnson]

Am I the only one who reads the OP to say he doesn’t actually own a G19.5?


I shoot every gun reasonably well

I suspect you may be in a situation like I am, and wanting to do something about it. Achieved what feels like a reasonable post-beginner level of all-around fundamentals that seem to transfer reasonably well between most platforms. But wanting to get to more advanced levels by focusing on one gun.

Get over it and ditch the STI. Get a shot timer and buy however much 9mm you can afford at the favorable prices currently available. Solve the logistical problem of where to shoot (rapid fire, changing targets and distance at will without supervision, holster work, etc.) Start with a bunch of dry fire practice with each gun. At least a couple weeks of every night. Include presentations from a low ready. It’s almost certain that one or more of what you have will walk itself out the door. Focus on each one of what’s left for a couple months, or a few thousand rounds of live fire. Use the timer, take detailed notes. You will get better, you will find more that works for you or doesn’t.

You’ll know which one you want to move forward with.

[Jason M]

This! But if you liked the universal availability of all things Glock, keep the 19.5, have a sale to get some cash and then wait for SHOT 19 before making any other purchases.

This is why I shouldn’t post before coffee. 🙄

Ok. After carefully reading this time .... RR’s input is a solid plan for what you have.

[Darth_Uno]

Assuming they’ve all proven themselves dependable, keep the one(s) you like best. While I choose a 19 for most days and a 43 for more discrete carry, you can do the same with the VP9 and Shield (or 642 if you get one). There’s no “everyone should do exactly this” right answer.

[rob_s]

Is there a financial need to get rid of some of them? Or a need for more space in the home which would allow a physical downsizing of a safe or other storage?

What's driving the downsize?

I'm all in favor of getting rid of crap you don't use, but if there's no financial or spatial need, I'd just leave the stuff you don't use in the back of the safe collecting dust. You might find a "need" for one of them later on.

that said, keep the Glock 19, it's the answer, always.

[1986s4]

My advice: Keep the HK's, all those mags are can be used by the other pistols. Get the revolver for pocket use.

[Guinnessman]

Do you carry AIWB? That can make you lean more towards a hammer or a gadget. How much support gear do you have for each gun? Are you going to compete? Do you have a passion for a particular gun?

Make a list to answer these questions and it may help your decision.

PF always has a “Gun Du Jour,” which is currently Glock and Beretta, and in the past has been “Insert gun name here.”

Any of the guns from your list will work.

[XXXsilverXXX]

Appendix carry? If yes, the PX4CC - sell everything else and buy another PX4CC.

If no, keep the VP9s and sell everything else and buy a VP9 SK to augment those two.

That's what I would do.

And 2011s can generally be disappeared to someone else's safe who will use them (if that's a consolation). The .45 is a little tougher than a 9 or .40, but it'll sell. I'd tell you to just send it to my FFL and I'll send you a check, but my wife keeps telling me she wants a "house". What good is a house if I don't have twelve STIs to house inside of it?! :eek:

This is true, as having just bought a house I can understand this... maybe we can come to a agreement lol 😅

[XXXsilverXXX]

Is there a financial need to get rid of some of them? Or a need for more space in the home which would allow a physical downsizing of a safe or other storage?

What's driving the downsize?

I'm all in favor of getting rid of crap you don't use, but if there's no financial or spatial need, I'd just leave the stuff you don't use in the back of the safe collecting dust. You might find a "need" for one of them later on.

that said, keep the Glock 19, it's the answer, always.

It’s has come down to not having enough time to go shooting, in 2018 I made it to the range two times, and I won’t be able to go any time this month... plus I don’t have a big safe after moving across country just a tiny 10 gun safe.

[rob_s]

It’s has come down to not having enough time to go shooting, in 2018 I made it to the range two times, and I won’t be able to go any time this month... plus I don’t have a big safe after moving across country just a tiny 10 gun safe.

Gotcha.

I ask because to me it's a matter of what is your rarest commodity: money, space, or time. I think that for most white collar and/or suburban dad types it's time for sure. So other than selling off the guns ( and I get that they might be a distraction) there isn't really a time benefit.

Approaching shooting like you'd approach working out can help too. Scheduling training time with someone else, and having them committing to a time slot with you as well, can hold you accountable. Also, getting involved in competitive shooting can give you a goal and a deadline, and agreeing to meet up with a friend at the match can also help assure that you go.

Both of these things will also help you to focus on the "one gun" since the goal is improvement.

[Nephrology]

It’s has come down to not having enough time to go shooting, in 2018 I made it to the range two times, and I won’t be able to go any time this month... plus I don’t have a big safe after moving across country just a tiny 10 gun safe.

I'm in essentially the same position as you, which has kept me from experimenting with different guns.

Honestly I don' think it matters which you pick, but Glock is hard to beat for lots of reasons. Unless you are really averse to them or enjoy one of the other guns much more I'd just stick with them.

[pangloss]

It’s has come down to not having enough time to go shooting, in 2018 I made it to the range two times, and I won’t be able to go any time this month... plus I don’t have a big safe after moving across country just a tiny 10 gun safe.

I shoot mostly Glocks, but I have time to shoot on a pretty regular basis. For me, dry fire with a TDA gun is less of a chore than dry fire with a Glock because I don't have to reset the slide. Given your very limited range time, you may want to consider which gun, if any, you enjoy dry firing more and let that be a factor in your decision.

[Clusterfrack]

I can't imagine being without at least two Glock 19s. And I carry a P-07.

[OlongJohnson]

Am I the only one who reads the OP to say he doesn’t actually own a G19.5?

Apparently, I am the only one sufficiently reading impaired to read the post and ignore the poll. It’s either my usual dumbassery or anti-participation bias regarding social media polls. At least I’ll tell myself that.

[RJ]

...Getting better is...



How would you define “getting better”?

[Larry Sellers]

I'll echo folks here. Hard to beat a Glock...Lord knows I've tried to find the platform that does it better than another.

I have the free time, access to a range within 500 yards of my home and a bit of extra $ to spend on gun stuff. What I've come to realize is that I shoot my 19.5 with Bolds better than anything because it's what I focus on and spend time with. Insert any other gun in the equation and you should see very little if any difference given the same time and energy spent on it.

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[HCountyGuy]

From a practical standpoint, it’s hard to argue against just picking up a Glock and getting to work. Hell, I’ve mulled over ditching my P30 just to consolidate on Glock. By and large the Glock is great for most folks, from the casual owner to those who compete. Other firearms are nifty but with the ease of use and a metric ton of aftermarket support it’s almost stupid not to own at least one and put some work in behind it.

For reasons already listed, the P2000 would be the most sensible to sacrifice first. It really is the black sheep of the HK pistols.

[jwperry]

To second what rob_s said, set goals and times and actually work towards them.

What I'll add to that is pick the gun that you want to take shooting. Time is my limited resource so I don't want to have to "go to work" to do something that I'm supposed to be enjoying(skill building). The G19 does a lot of things well, but for me it doesn't inspire me to go shooting. My performance ceiling is pretty low and capped with a G-series guns (trust me I've dedicated years, thousands of rounds, dedicated training and other acumen to making them something more for me); measured on B8s/Bill Drills/FAST drills/Dot Torture, but find that I can better excel with other platforms.

Which platform inspires you to go and shoot? If you think it is a DA/SA gun, the PX4cc is hard to beat. Even a standard PX4 compact has a fairly low investment cost and can provide a suitable substitute for your currently owned PX4cc that you can attempt to wear out.

[willie]

I urge you to remember how long and how much sacrifice was required to put together your current battery. Very soon nice handguns will become much more expensive. If you are intent on selling, wait until after the next election when your collection will be more valuable. Now you might stock pile ammo and also buy a couple guns that you would like to try. None will ever see ammo this cheap again.

[Clusterfrack]

I urge you to remember how long and how much sacrifice was required to put together your current battery. Very soon nice handguns will become much more expensive. If you are intent on selling, wait until after the next election when your collection will be more valuable. Now you might stock pile ammo and also buy a couple guns that you would like to try. None will ever see ammo this cheap again.

This is an excellent argument--to sell whatever you have to and buy a Glock 19. :D

[Spartan1980]

I urge you to remember how long and how much sacrifice was required to put together your current battery. Very soon nice handguns will become much more expensive. If you are intent on selling, wait until after the next election when your collection will be more valuable. Now you might stock pile ammo and also buy a couple guns that you would like to try. None will ever see ammo this cheap again.

I'll second this.

As to which one to keep, I vote P30. Because it's basically a more accurate G19, and it complies with your leaning to a hammer fired gun, and I'm a HK fanboy these days. Your collection is very good as is, but so is your train of thought. If you can wait to divest, I'd wait.

Edited, because I can't quote the right damn post. Grrr....

[ssb]

I guess it's the in thing for PF to do, but I'll jump on the "system" train.

There is significant value, in my opinion, with sticking to one gun -- or at least one type of gun -- exclusively or near-exclusively. I've been on the P30 LEM train for the past 15 months. I won't win any USPSA matches with it, but I've done some of the best shooting in my life over the past 10,000 rounds or so. I'm seeing progress in practice: for example, for the first time I broke into light pin territory on an informal run of the Gabe White Standards the other week. I passed the Air Marshall qual the other month with a respectable -- but not perfect -- score. I shot the most consistent runs of The Test and the HiTS Super Test I've ever shot. Part of that is simply that I've gotten a lot of good training over the past year, but I can't discount the fact that I've fired at least 20 times the amount of ammo through 9mm LEM guns over the past 15 months as I've fired through any other guns combined. I'm not saying it's the LEM trigger that lets me do this (though it has certain shooting benefits I happen to appreciate), but I am saying that it's the consistent dry- and live-fire use of the trigger that allows for this skill development.

I think you're smart to downsize.

There is value in having multiples of the same gun. I have a carry gun and a training gun and a bag full of spares. I can take my carry gun off and stick it in the safe, drop my training gun in the holster, and go to work in dry fire. This encourages a) more dry fire (I'm apprehensive about rechambering rounds and irrationally stingy when it comes to ammo), and b) safe practices. I can't ND if I don't fiddle with the gun. Likewise, I can put the miles on the training gun and not worry too much about my vetted copy suffering premature (or even reasonable) parts breakage. I can shoot a full day of class, pop the carry gun back in the holster, and not worry about how dirty, wet, or on-the-verge-of-breaking-a-spring my gun is. If for whatever reason the training gun goes down, I'm not in the position of having to switch carry guns. Benefits abound.

Whatever you end up choosing, pick up at least one duplicate copy is my advice.

Sticking to a single gun allows you to put more of your discretionary income towards building that system. I'm sitting on a great big pile of mags right now in my attempts to AWB-proof myself. I've got tools to work on the guns (to the best of my ability, anyway) -- things I probably wouldn't have bought had I had to worry about half a dozen different gun types ("Don't I need some more 1911/M&P/Glock/SIG mags?") -- and enough spares to replace the common wear parts and perform basic service on the guns. I've got holsters I am happy with. And you know what? I've got more gun money because of it. I'm buying more ammo now because I've reached a point where I've got damn near everything I "need" for the P30s -- mags, holsters, sights, spare parts -- and a few things I don't need. I'd rather be sitting on most of a pallet of ammo in 2020 than I would half a dozen various pistol types. Furthermore, I've got more money to put towards my fun stuff: I've got my needs covered by my HD/WML pistol, my carry pistols, my training pistol, and my HD shotgun. So... I can afford to build that cool AR or keep that nice 1911 around.

The financial benefits are there for me as well.

---

Now, as to what you've got...

From a practical perspective, I'd keep the pair of VP9s and ditch everything else that didn't blow my hair back (sounds like the STI, for example, doesn't do it for you). You've already got two of the things so you obviously like them. You've already got two, so there's no need to go out and buy a duplicate copy. You've already got two, which means you own at least four mags...

Unless you're heavily in favor of going hammer-fired (and there are valid reasons for that, particularly for AIWB carry), I personally see no sound reason to concentrate on a hammer-fired gun in this day and age, and I say that as a guy who is heavily invested in some oddball wannabe striker fired trigger with a hammer on the back.

I wanted a striker-fired gun, if nothing else to keep up with the times. I think that despite the resurgence of hammer guns amongst the enthusiast crowd, the ship has sailed on hammer-fired guns going forward. Nobody's really coming out with new duty-type hammer guns anymore and apart from maintaining legacy lines I see many manufacturers scaling back their hammer-fired catalogs significantly over the next few years. Further, I think RDS-equipped handguns are the next big thing and, with a little more development, I'll jump into that. SFA guns are just plain easier to equip from a direct-mill perspective (and I highly doubt HK views a P30 Optics Ready pistol as financially viable...). I own one (a VP9) and settled on it largely due to its ability to plug into the system I talked about above.

/gun nerd

(Also, this is Pistol Forum. Sell your cloak and buy a Beretta...)

[OlongJohnson]

Another thought, since you're range time challenged, is to focus on dry fire practice effectiveness.

It's been posted by many here, and I found the same, that dry practice is substantially enhanced with a DA or DAO trigger. No need to reset, just press away. Double taps, etc. If nothing else, you can get a lot more presses in a much shorter time. Just leave a snap cap in the chamber and hammer on it until there are little brass flakes everywhere. It was helpful for me.

I've only shot a magazine through a PX4CC, but my distinctive impression was that there was a much more notable difference in the position of the break between DA and SA pulls, much greater than the classic Sigs and USPs that I am more used to. It was dark and smoky, and a long time ago, so my memory may not be perfect, but that was enough for me to not spend a lot more brain cells on the poly Beretta.

George has mentioned having caused himself problems with a dedicated dry fire program on the USP. I am not sure how that carries over on the P2000 and P30, but I concur with his observation as it applies to the USP. The DA press is just too heavy to do a lot of reps.

All of which is leading to a suggestion to pick up an inexpensive DA pistol as a dry fire work horse. The cheapest GP100 on GunBroker and a little slickifying or an old Model 64 trade-in from wherever they come up cheap next would be excellent. I also find the later P250s to be excellent. The P250 is a gun that lots of people around here love to hate, but I suspect some of that comes from them being "tip of the spear" types. Like everything it does, Sig stomped on its noodle with the launch of that gun, so pretty much anybody who had exposure to the early ones thinks they are utter crap. But the later ones seem to be decent. I had some issues with mine, but it was traced to a specific ammo defect (lack of crimp after bullet seating) that I was able to correct and get 100 percent reliability without touching the gun. The DA pull is superbly smooth. The old 96D trade-ins on GB can also be had for cheap, and that's basically as smooth as a semi-auto DA is ever going to be.

Any of these will let you do a ton of dry fire reps in a short amount of time, which is both more efficient (important, given your apparent ability to get range time in) and more enjoyable and satisfying, so you're more likely to do it every day.

Just some thoughts.