Amazon Announces Location of HQ2 [Archive]

RevolverRob

11-13-2018, 01:12 PM

While I appreciate the importance of new business to a region's long-term health. I also recognize the potential negative impact on a region. Amazon is a great west coast business that will do a nice job ruining a southern city. It won't happen immediately, but imported management and west coast ethos will surely poison the local community.

Besides, in my experience very few of these large companies give what they say they'll give back to the community. It's always, always, take the tax breaks, hire half the work force you said you'd hire, and minimal to no philanthropy back to the community. And that always pisses me off. No problem taking the tax dollars and no effort to give back. And they have no trouble turning their back on the politicians and organizers that recruited them when it becomes convenient.

In short, no big loss to southern cities, in my opinion. In fact, I think they avoided a real nightmare.

txdpd

11-13-2018, 01:15 PM

It’ll be interesting to see what the butcher’s bill comes out to in five and ten years. Things like HQ2 look good on a lobbyist resume, but tax payers get left holding the bag on hundreds of thousands in tax incentives and revenues per job created.

mtnbkr

11-13-2018, 01:19 PM

While I appreciate the importance of new business to a region's long-term health. I also recognize the potential negative impact on a region. Amazon is a great west coast business that will do a nice job ruining a southern city. It won't happen immediately, but imported management and west coast ethos will surely poison the local community.

LOL. You've never been to Crystal City, VA have you?

It's a collection of office buildings near DC, hardly a bucolic Southern city. It's deep in "blue Virginia" and already subject to some of the worst traffic in the country. I doubt Amazon will have a material impact and may even improve the region, even if by accident.

Chris

JohnO

11-13-2018, 01:24 PM

Newly minted Democratic socialist congresswoman Alexandra Ocasio-Cortez says New Yorkers are 'outraged' over Amazon tax break that could total $1.5 BILLION for hiring tens of thousands at new headquarters

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6384949/Socialist-Ocasio-Cortez-says-New-Yorkers-outrage-Amazon-tax-break.html

-Amazon has chosen two locations for its second headquarters, New York City and Northern Virginia
-Retail giant is also making Nashville a new operations hub
-Future congresswoman Alexandra Ocasio-Cortez blasted Amazon.com and the New York City government on Tuesday
-She 's angry about a tax-relief agreement that lured the giant e-tailer to the Big Apple
-Ocasio-Cortez describes herself as a Democratic socialist
-She said on Twitter that she's skeptical Amazon won't let its new New York staff unionize, and wants the company to hire people in the neighborhood

Rick62

11-13-2018, 01:26 PM

I know Atlanta was desperately trying to get HQ2 here and some reports seemed to indicate it was a lock.

I wonder how much influence the outcome of the midterms had in the decision.

I wouldn’t rule out politics in general, but reports were coming out about the locations selected prior to Election Day.

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RevolverRob

11-13-2018, 02:03 PM

LOL. You've never been to Crystal City, VA have you?

It's a collection of office buildings near DC, hardly a bucolic Southern city. It's deep in "blue Virginia" and already subject to some of the worst traffic in the country. I doubt Amazon will have a material impact and may even improve the region, even if by accident.

Chris

Oh no, I don't care about what happens to VA or DC. As far as I am concerned, Virginia had its heyday prior to 1861 and has been on the downward slope ever since, the latest in midterm elections just reinforces that VA is the next Maryland.

I was mostly thinking about how Atlanta and Dallas dodged a bullet.

Unfortunately (?), Nashville was already done for, prior to being named an Amazon hub.

okie john

11-13-2018, 02:05 PM

I was mostly thinking about how Atlanta and Dallas dodged a bullet.

This. They have enough problems without becoming the next Seattle.

Okie John

trailrunner

11-13-2018, 02:07 PM

Crystal City has been underutilized since NAVAIR moved to Pax River 15 or 20 years ago, and a lot of other Navy agencies also left around this time. I still go to meetings on the south side of Crystal City about once a month, and compared to what I remember from the 1990s, it seems a bit deserted, but that just might be an erroneous perception. I have no idea if 25k jobs will fill the void or overwhelm the area. Pentagon City (next to Crystal City) has been undergoing some major renovations, including a big new building that I've been watching being constructed for a couple of years. South of Crystal City, they have been developing Potomac Landing, including building a lot of townhomes and apartments, a nice bike path, and soon a new metro station. People who bought a condo there 5 years ago just saw their property value increase 15 percent. Arlington along Glebe Road and Alexandria in Del Ray and Old Town will also benefit. I live in Fairfax County, so I may see a little bump in my home value (and if they would just locate the new FBI headquarters near the Franconia-Springfield metro station, it would go up another 10 percent and I could cash in and move out).

What will be interesting will be the situation with metro, which I assume was an attractive feature of choosing Crystal City. This past weekend Metro closed the Crystal City and DCA stops Friday through Monday. The Friday evening shutdown cause an epic travel nightmare in the area, including the airport. That only lasted four days and only affected two stops, but next summer, about the time Amazon moves in, both the Blue and Yellow lines south of DCA will be *completely* shut down for the summer to rebuild all the platforms. Welcome to Crystal City, Amazon.

As far as the politics go, Arlington is already deep blue. The workers will disperse throughout the region, but northern Virginia is pretty blue. I had lived in one of the red enclaves, but it is blue now, and the urban sprawl is spreading blueness to neighboring counties, whether or not Amazon is here.

Zincwarrior

11-13-2018, 02:40 PM

Casual Friday

11-13-2018, 03:20 PM

Remember when people used to shit on Walmart for paying dirt wages and running small Mom N Pop shops outta business? Pepperidge Farm remembers.

psalms144.1

11-13-2018, 03:51 PM

As a non socialist democrat NYer, I'm outraged at the thought of what traffic issues this is going to cause.

But, WTF do I know.

Of COURSE there are HYUGE tax breaks involved - why else would ANYONE move their company to NY - whose motto is changing to "The Vampire State - We'll Suck You Dry"

Chance

11-13-2018, 04:59 PM

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Sherman A. House DDS

11-13-2018, 05:14 PM

We are getting a new, “Amazon Nashville Center of Excellence,” I can see from my living room. Which is great, because it probably just doubled the value of our condo property!

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45dotACP

11-13-2018, 05:32 PM

I have no love for Jeff Bezos, his wishy washy political beliefs or how his company treats his employees.

I strongly suspect that when the chips are down, even a left leaning guy like him would go to child labor if he could get away with it stateside.

For these reasons and more, I hope Occasional-Cortex forces the Union issue and feels the full weight of his donations to her opponent next election cycle. Whether we stick it to Amazon or get her dumb ass out of office...it's a win win!

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mike_hammer

11-13-2018, 05:41 PM

I heard they'd pretty much decided the number and placement before even making any public statements. Interesting where they actually landed...have fun NY.

ranger

11-13-2018, 06:18 PM

My prayers were answered that Amazon did not pick Atlanta!

Guinnessman

11-13-2018, 06:43 PM

My prayers were answered that Amazon did not pick Atlanta!

Same with Pittsburgh!:cool:

blues

11-13-2018, 06:50 PM

SeriousStudent

11-13-2018, 07:03 PM

There were sighs of contentment here in the DFW Metromess when the news came out.

Good luck to you folks up there.

Chance

11-13-2018, 07:53 PM

I was relieved to hear DFW didn't get it too, although I never thought we were seriously in the running.

txdpd

11-13-2018, 08:05 PM

"Money goes in. Toasters come out. But where does the bread, dough, money go?"

Toasters are a great weapon against white privilege. White goes in, brown comes out. Soon she'll be an advocate for Amazon toasters.

For these reasons and more, I hope Occasional-Cortex forces the Union issue and feels the full weight of his donations to her opponent next election cycle. Whether we stick it to Amazon or get her dumb ass out of office...it's a win win!

And risk putting someone competent in that seat. She a Democrat party darling, at the moment untouchable within the party, and she's out encouraging protestors at Pelosi's office. As a disruptive force she's the one of the better things that the Republicans have going at the moment.

TGS

11-13-2018, 08:27 PM

I imagine them moving to Crystal City will make my property value go up, which is a good thing as an investment.

Simply out of spite, I'm also happy to see them move from Seattle. A lot of you guys look at Amazon as a company that "sucks a community dry" and doesn't give back or whatever, but an area can't lose 50,000 jobs and not notice it. Seattle is about to get a tangible lesson in economics, just like they got when they tried pulling that tax shit that has basically forced Amazon's hand for the long run.

DC is probably very happy. Anacostia has some gentrification projects going on, and this is likely going to put those into overdrive.

RevolverRob

11-13-2018, 09:05 PM

Simply out of spite, I'm also happy to see them move from Seattle. A lot of you guys look at Amazon as a company that "sucks a community dry" and doesn't give back or whatever, but an area can't lose 50,000 jobs and not notice it. Seattle is about to get a tangible lesson in economics, just like they got when they tried pulling that tax shit that has basically forced Amazon's hand for the long run.

My understanding is, they aren't pulling out of Seattle, they are just expanding. Maybe I miss understood?

Totem Polar

11-13-2018, 09:20 PM

Many of my friends and colleagues in Seattle are very un-enamored with Amazon.

Remember when people used to shit on Walmart for paying dirt wages and running small Mom N Pop shops outta business? Pepperidge Farm remembers.

https://i.imgflip.com/2mhywh.jpg (https://imgflip.com/i/2mhywh)futurama (https://imgflip.com/memegenerator)

But as these cities go all-out to win Amazon’s affections, they might take a lesson from the city where those same affections have dimmed: Seattle. To be sure, the town’s business community is mortified to be losing so much of Amazon’s future growth to another city and has roundly blamed the city’s left-leaning “anti-business” politics. But many ordinary Seattleites seem relieved. Most would acknowledge the extraordinary prosperity that Amazon has brought to Seattle since Jeff Bezos and his startup arrived in 1994. But they are also keenly aware of the costs, not least the nation’s fastest-rising housing prices, appalling traffic and a painful erosion of urban identity. What was once a quirkily mellow, solidly middle-class city now feels like a stressed-out, two-tier town with a thin layer of wealthy young techies atop a base of anxious wage workers. As one City Council member put it, HQ2 may give Seattle “a little breathing room” to cope with a decade of raging, Amazon-fueled growth. A commenter on a local news site was less diplomatic: “Amazon = cancer.”

TGS

11-13-2018, 09:38 PM

My understanding is, they aren't pulling out of Seattle, they are just expanding. Maybe I miss understood?

Expanding their HQ by 50,000!? That would be.....something.

The article I read said they were relocating. Bezos bought a $23 million mansion in DC.

Totem Polar

11-13-2018, 09:49 PM

Maybe the 50k will move to DC before the next WA state gun initiative comes up.

modrecoil

11-13-2018, 11:07 PM

idahojess

11-14-2018, 12:13 AM

This probably won't happen again (but it's pretty legendary):

32343

"The recession came as The Boeing Company, the region's largest employer, went from a peak of 100,800 employees in 1967 to a low of 38,690 in April 1971."

http://www.historylink.org/File/1287

If Amazon does move, I doubt it will change the Seattle/Central Puget Sound area's utopian dreams (head taxes on employers, etc).

Sensei

11-14-2018, 01:03 AM

Expanding their HQ by 50,000!? That would be.....something.

The article I read said they were relocating. Bezos bought a $23 million mansion in DC.

Didn’t we have some posts this years around a TED Talk given by Nick Hanauer about how all the plutocrats need pay employees at least $15/hr or risk being swept away by the angry mobs? I seem to recall him citing Seattle as a shining example of these economic distortions in practice. Well, it looks like the plutocrats decided to leave.

However, the real reason that Amazon moved is to be closer to areas of political influence. Bezos just bought a bunch of leftist politicians so that he can undercut his competition with these tax breaks. It was an investment.

As much as I hate to say it, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez has a very good point regarding the tax shelters for Amazon. They put Amazon’s competition at a disadvantage. Many of us (myself included) have rediculed this woman as an idiot. On this issue she is absolutely correct, and we should all start asking ourselves if the downstream risks from this political-economic machine is worth the convenience.

Drang

11-14-2018, 03:59 AM

...Nick Hanauer <spit!> ....

FIFY.

xray 99

11-14-2018, 04:04 AM

This time the socialist is 100%correct. This is bad corporate welfare.

Agreed.

OlongJohnson

11-14-2018, 11:25 AM

Ugh. OK if they move to DC but many will move to NOVA and some will be horrified by the still-permissive VA gun laws. Shall-issue permits...the horror. Hate to think of the damage the richest man in the world could do if he decided to fund a disarmament initiative. VA is already vulnerable.

Ssshhhh.

WA still has legal unpermitted open carry of handguns and shall-issue permitting for concealed carry. Show up at any LEO office in the state, pay the monies, pass a background check, and they mail it to you. Although if you're a resident, I think you might be required to do the business at the cop shop in your own town. It's been a couple years.

Shows you how far the state has been dragged, with most of it kicking and screaming. And how far there is left to go.

okie john

11-14-2018, 12:33 PM

My understanding is, they aren't pulling out of Seattle, they are just expanding. Maybe I miss understood?

They’re not pulling out in the same way that your spouse moving in with someone else isn’t leaving you.

Okie John

Totem Polar

11-14-2018, 01:32 PM

I think the writing is on the wall for the long haul. In the short term, they’ve got way too much wrapped up in Seattle to just leave; it’s not like Amazon is living in the back of a van. Pulling out of just the new skyscraper project would reportedly leave them on the hook for an impossible-to-fill lease that costs more than the head tax. Amazon accounts for 20 percent of office occupancy in DT Seattle. That figure cuts both ways.

HCountyGuy

11-14-2018, 03:45 PM

A news report on what Atlanta offered them to set up around here:

https://www.wsbtv.com/news/local/in-depth-look-at-georgias-secret-bid-for-amazons-hq2/872616691

Chance

02-15-2019, 09:44 AM

From NPR (https://www.npr.org/2019/02/14/694740118/amazon-drops-plans-for-new-york-headquarters):

Amazon will no longer build its additional headquarters in New York City.

The decision announced Thursday comes after an outcry from local politicians, union leaders and community organizers who had organized weeks of protests against massive financial breaks promised to Amazon, one of the world's most valuable companies.

It is also a big reversal of its much-hyped decision to build the campus in Queens after a highly publicized nationwide search that lasted over a year.

An Amazon spokeswoman told NPR that the company plans no further negotiations with city and state officials in New York, where the firm has faced scathing criticism in recent City Council hearings. One key issue was the almost $3 billion in state and city tax incentives Amazon was slated to receive in exchange for creating some 25,000 jobs.

Local union leaders had organized protests against the company and have accused it of anti-union behavior. Also, the state's Senate leader recently nominated an ardent critic of Amazon's deal to the state board that would have had control over Amazon's plan for Queens.

"A number of state and local politicians have made it clear that they oppose our presence and will not work with us to build the type of relationships that are required to go forward with the project we and many others envisioned in Long Island City," Amazon said in a statement, citing a recent poll it had commissioned showing that the majority of New Yorkers supported Amazon's presence.

New York City Mayor Bill de Blasio said Amazon was throwing away an opportunity by pulling out of the deal.

"You have to be tough to make it in New York City," he tweeted. "We gave Amazon the opportunity to be a good neighbor and do business in the greatest city in the world. Instead of working with the community, Amazon threw away that opportunity."

Amazon said it will not search for a new location for another HQ to replace New York City. This leaves the company with its main headquarters in Seattle and a second one planned for Northern Virginia. New York City will remain one of Amazon's biggest hubs, and the company says it will invest in its existing teams there.

RoyGBiv

02-15-2019, 09:54 AM

25,000 jobs paying 150K average. $3.75 Billion in annual salary. Countless downstream jobs to support all that spending.

Poof!

https://media1.tenor.com/images/2695df0a67b9e57f09981ae635ebff4e/tenor.gif?itemid=12400026

GardoneVT

02-15-2019, 11:12 AM

AZgunguy

02-15-2019, 11:27 AM

Will they? Cuomo was already bemoaning the fact that all of the middle class taxpayers are fleeing to Florida and Texas. They have a huge shortfall in tax revenue that's going to make them have to cut funds to someprograms. Cuomo and Deblasio really wanted this deal for the $$$$ but AOC screwed them. Something tells me AOC is going to be a one term Congresscritter.

Alpha Sierra

02-15-2019, 11:34 AM

The best way to render AOC ineffective is to let her run her mouth as much as possible.

Would all your enemies be this accommodating......LOL

RoyGBiv

02-15-2019, 11:57 AM

It’s NYC. They’ll manage without Amazon.

The sad part is that voters there will think this is a win for them, rather than being pissed that their "Leadership" let 3.75 billion in wages walk away.

Kanye Wyoming

02-15-2019, 12:06 PM

35162

Poconnor

02-15-2019, 12:07 PM

TGS

02-15-2019, 12:11 PM

35162

That pretty much sums it up!

I understand it’s NY city and 25000 jobs is not a lot but it’s a lot to just piss away

Exactly. Sure, NYC will get along without Amazon...but it's stupid to miss out on this revenue.

I used to live in a decayed industrial city.

During an election, I saw a campaign sign for a prospective mayor that read, "If a business wants to make money here, they should have to pay for that privilege!"

I really don't get why it's so hard to understand that this mentality is a bad idea.

LorenzoS

02-15-2019, 12:21 PM

Alpha Sierra

02-15-2019, 01:08 PM

The elephant in the room for NY/NYC is that Cuomo and Diblasio both flat out admitted the taxes, zoning and regulatory burdens are so great that a company like Amazon would never do business in the city without a deal to be relieved from those burdens.

So what about all the small and medium sized businesses without the negotiating clout of Amazon? Cuomo and Diblasio are silent on this even as they continue making the situation worse each year.

Shhhhhh…...it's leftist economics at work.

Personally, I'm glad NYC lost out on this. Big cities like it are growing more and more un-American by the day to the point that it's getting difficult to see them as part of the same country I live in.

mtnbkr

02-15-2019, 01:17 PM

During an election, I saw a campaign sign for a prospective mayor that read, "If a business wants to make money here, they should have to pay for that privilege!"

I really don't get why it's so hard to understand that this mentality is a bad idea.

You see that attitude within large companies as well. I would wager Amazon is guilty of it. I know Walmart is.

If not directly pay for the privilege, then offer substantial discounts, favorable terms, etc.

Chris

NEPAKevin

02-15-2019, 02:08 PM

35166

txdpd

02-15-2019, 03:23 PM

The sad part is that voters there will think this is a win for them, rather than being pissed that their "Leadership" let 3.75 billion in wages walk away.

That’s only a good deal if the jobs are offered to native New Yorkers and the money stays in NYC, which is not a realistic expectation. New Yorkers would likely shoulder the burden of Amazon moving 10’s of thousand of employees to NYC suburbs and nearby cities, where that money would be spent. For a significant number of people in NYC, HQ2 would just mean higher taxes and houses, and a net lower quality of living.

There’s a bigger assumption here that amazon was ever actually going to open HQ2. It’s pretty apparent that most of the HQ2 solicitations were just a data grab from cities. Those incentives are a big deal to native New Yorkers, but in a non-factor in Amazon's current tax environment. If HQ2 is being abandoned over the value of the incentives, I don't think that Amazon was ever serious about the venture, if this is a blow to Bezos Ego, it's a win because it would be a lot worse when he has moved in and them by the balls.

RevolverRob

02-15-2019, 03:39 PM

That’s only a good deal if the jobs are offered to native New Yorkers and the money stays in NYC, which is not a realistic expectation. New Yorkers would likely shoulder the burden of Amazon moving 10’s of thousand of employees to NYC suburbs and nearby cities, where that money would be spent. For a significant number of people in NYC, HQ2 would just mean higher taxes and houses, and a net lower quality of living.

Let's be clear on something - there are no "native" New Yorkers in the sense you mean. And the money would always stay in NYC to a degree. To begin with NYC does not have income tax, they have sales tax. Taxes that would be collected every time one of those 25,000 employees commuted into the city, or paid for parking, or bought a coffee, or bought a sandwich. None of that money gets spent now.

Second, HQ2 was going to be built in a region that needs significant infrastructural refinement and development. Here's a quote from AOC, "The 29-year-old went on to say: “Amazon is a billion-dollar company. The idea that it will receive hundreds of millions of dollars in tax breaks at a time when our subway is crumbling and our communities need MORE investment, not less, is extremely concerning to residents here.”

If you've got to haul in an extra 25,000 people daily, you have to invest in infrastructure. It's not like magically you build a new campus some place and then don't have a way to get workers there. Nope, part of campus infrastructural development is investment in the local community. Whole new sets of businesses cropping up to cater to those 25,000+ daily visitors. Imagine, you got 25k tourists show up one day and just decide to stay, forever. That's what 25k new jobs means to an area. And it means all that revenue ALL of it - is lost. The opportunities for current Queens residents to earn additional income, the chance for current Queens property owners to cash in on new higher property values, etc. All of that gone.

AOC's comments reflect immaturity and stupidity. Ten minutes of cruising around any sizable city will lead one to discover that "gentrification" that everyone loves to suggest is derogatory is one of the best things that can happen, financially, to any area. And yes the residents of that area, pre-gentrification will likely turn over and move away eventually, but many, many, of them will cash in on the the uprising of the area, before they do so. In otherwords, the majority of people are positively impacted by growth and the minority that are not, are typically so financially unwell that winning the lottery couldn't help them.

Example: The announcement to build the Obama Library right here in the neighborhood I live in, in Chicago. Over night, property values jumped 40% and over the coming months leapt up almost 80%. Long time condo owners in the neighborhood, some who have lived here for 30 or 40 years, cashed in and retired. Now they can live comfortably, where as some of them were wondering if they'd die living where they had for 30 years. That's an instantaneous financial win for those folks and for the city and state the collected income and property taxes on those sales.

Some folks, like my PhD supervisor, sold his small condo, purchased before he and his wife had a child, bought a newer, much larger, condo and had cash left over to send their daughter to private school. End result he now commutes to campus (instead of walking) and thus invests every day into the public transit system, he and his wife pay their property taxes, paid their taxes on their house sale, and fund a local private school with their tuition investments. Win, Win, Win for the city and his family.

Drang

02-15-2019, 04:23 PM

I watched AOC talk about all the things the could be done with the 3 billion dollar incentives given to Amazon. I got the feeling that she didn’t understand that this money did not exist yet. It reminded me of negotiating with kids when they were young. They whined for X; I offered Y. They refused and got nothing. I understand it’s NY city and 25000 jobs is not a lot but it’s a lot to just piss away

To be precise, she's talking about what they should do with the money that was never paid and never actually budgeted. In other words, it never existed.

Not that this is any different from any of her other proposals, economics-wise.

Remember when she was touting her economics degree?

Joe in PNG

02-15-2019, 04:47 PM

I still think she's a paid agent of the Babylon Bee.

Ocasio-Cortez Declares Victory Over The Modern-Day Equivalent Of Slavery: Jobs (https://babylonbee.com/news/ocasio-cortez-declares-victory-over-the-modern-day-equivalent-of-slavery-jobs)

WASHINGTON, D.C.—Representative Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez is busy celebrating her victory over the tyrannical Jeff Bezos and the horrible burden his company Amazon had planned to inflict on the people of New York City: 25,000 jobs.

“No, I’m very good with numbers,” Ocasio-Cortez said. She held up a notebook with a few hastily scrawled numbers on it. She pointed to one. “This one is a four.”

And while some say "Trump says stupid stuff too!", let's face it- she's on track to make him look wise, self-controlled, polite, careful, and measured in his comments.

Larry Sellers

02-15-2019, 06:04 PM

That pretty much sums it up!

Exactly. Sure, NYC will get along without Amazon...but it's stupid to miss out on this revenue.

I used to live in a decayed industrial city.

During an election, I saw a campaign sign for a prospective mayor that read, "If a business wants to make money here, they should have to pay for that privilege!"

I really don't get why it's so hard to understand that this mentality is a bad idea.I'm working in a city like that now....

We're one of the only places in the state that I know of that had a Lowe's go out of business. 80k people, central to the state and 3 major highways go through the city.

"We don't know why no business wants to come here?"

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk

JAD

02-15-2019, 10:57 PM

It’s NYC. They’ll manage without Amazon.

Manage to what?

NickA

02-17-2019, 05:37 PM

DeBlasio trying to save face by calling it an "abuse of corporate power" that Amazon is choosing to build elsewhere.
Because they should want to get their asses kicked in the media daily by AOC instead of going to one of the places that will welcome them with open arms. Clearly none of these halfwits know how business works.

https://www.cnn.com/2019/02/17/tech/bill-de-blasio-amazon-hq2/index.html

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk

02-17-2019, 05:52 PM

Will they? Cuomo was already bemoaning the fact that all of the middle class taxpayers are fleeing to Florida and Texas.

I'm familiar with the Real Estate market here in FL (Mrs. is retired Agent) and by far the most common place where folks are coming in to write deals are from NY. Much more so than in the past, apparently. Especially on the higher end price point properties.

TheRoland

02-17-2019, 05:54 PM

I'm working in a city like that now....

We're one of the only places in the state that I know of that had a Lowe's go out of business. 80k people, central to the state and 3 major highways go through the city.

"We don't know why no business wants to come here?"

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk

I'm not clear on the exact causes of CT's economic downturn but man, every time I visit family there another business has left. It's even hurting property prices in the part of CT that's really New York. What's the deal?

Larry Sellers

02-17-2019, 09:43 PM

I'm not clear on the exact causes of CT's economic downturn but man, every time I visit family there another business has left. It's even hurting property prices in the part of CT that's really New York. What's the deal?Increasing taxes, democratic leadership (and all associated issues) antiquated infrastructure.

The largest employer in the State of Connecticut, is the State of Connecticut

Blue state, cities (like mine) taking federal housing money and erecting section 8 communities. 10% of the population is consuming 90% of the city's resources. It's the rotten apple analogy: the further you are from the center, the better it is. Property taxes are high, an ever shrinking bond list and virtually no reason to move into the city.

Example:

I'll never argue that road workers safety isn't Paramount, but in every other state I've been to they can fix potholes etc with a truck and 2 workers. Here it's 2 miles of backup, 5 trucks all with signage and 2 men tossing cold patch into a hole. Nothing is quick, efficient or cost effective. It's almost a laughable topic. They'll dump tons and tons of salt in anticipation of snow.....yet spend untold sums of $ to arbitrarily deforest the median between the highways.

We're simply the state people have to pass through to see a Sox or Yankees game.

Seasons can be beautiful here and the proximity to major cities (Boston, NYC, The cape etc) is convenient but that's where it ends for me.

The state charges you an exit tax when you move out.....17 years to go.

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk

SeriousStudent

02-18-2019, 12:37 AM

Increasing taxes, democratic leadership (and all associated issues) antiquated infrastructure.

The largest employer in the State of Connecticut, is the State of Connecticut

Blue state, cities (like mine) taking federal housing money and erecting section 8 communities. 10% of the population is consuming 90% of the city's resources. It's the rotten apple analogy: the further you are from the center, the better it is. Property taxes are high, an ever shrinking bond list and virtually no reason to move into the city.

Example:

I'll never argue that road workers safety isn't Paramount, but in every other state I've been to they can fix potholes etc with a truck and 2 workers. Here it's 2 miles of backup, 5 trucks all with signage and 2 men tossing cold patch into a hole. Nothing is quick, efficient or cost effective. It's almost a laughable topic. They'll dump tons and tons of salt in anticipation of snow.....yet spend untold sums of $ to arbitrarily deforest the median between the highways.

We're simply the state people have to pass through to see a Sox or Yankees game.

Seasons can be beautiful here and the proximity to major cities (Boston, NYC, The cape etc) is convenient but that's where it ends for me.

The state charges you an exit tax when you move out.....17 years to go.

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Holy poop. What do they do if you fail to pay it, make you move back??

Totem Polar

02-18-2019, 02:39 AM

Holy poop. What do they do if you fail to pay it, make you move back??

Yeah, I’m curious as to how that works, too.

fixer

02-18-2019, 05:28 AM

Shhhhhh…...it's leftist economics at work.

Personally, I'm glad NYC lost out on this. Big cities like it are growing more and more un-American by the day to the point that it's getting difficult to see them as part of the same country I live in.

Gotta admit it had the same tone as Beretta almost literally fleeing to TN.

Alpha Sierra

02-18-2019, 08:26 AM

Gotta admit it had the same tone as Beretta almost literally fleeing to TN.

What do you mean "almost" literally? LOL

Beretta flat out stated in several releases that the anti firearms and anti business climate in Maryland were exactly the reasons they left.

There was no doubt about why and it was a big fuck you to that state's government.

RoyGBiv

02-18-2019, 09:18 AM

Yeah, I’m curious as to how that works, too.
They audit you to make sure that you actually have moved your domicile.
Mostly a scare tactic to dissuade people from claiming a domicile in a low tax state while actually earning their living in the high tax state.

https://www.nasdaq.com/article/clients-moving-to-lowtax-states-document-carefully-to-avoid-tax-disputes-cm590454

Totem Polar

02-18-2019, 12:41 PM

They audit you to make sure that you actually have moved your domicile.
Mostly a scare tactic to dissuade people from claiming a domicile in a low tax state while actually earning their living in the high tax state.

https://www.nasdaq.com/article/clients-moving-to-lowtax-states-document-carefully-to-avoid-tax-disputes-cm590454

^^^Interesting read, thanks.

Shoresy

02-18-2019, 12:49 PM

Increasing taxes, democratic leadership (and all associated issues) antiquated infrastructure.

The largest employer in the State of Connecticut, is the State of Connecticut

Blue state, cities (like mine) taking federal housing money and erecting section 8 communities. 10% of the population is consuming 90% of the city's resources. It's the rotten apple analogy: the further you are from the center, the better it is. Property taxes are high, an ever shrinking bond list and virtually no reason to move into the city.

Example:

I'll never argue that road workers safety isn't Paramount, but in every other state I've been to they can fix potholes etc with a truck and 2 workers. Here it's 2 miles of backup, 5 trucks all with signage and 2 men tossing cold patch into a hole. Nothing is quick, efficient or cost effective. It's almost a laughable topic. They'll dump tons and tons of salt in anticipation of snow.....yet spend untold sums of $ to arbitrarily deforest the median between the highways.

We're simply the state people have to pass through to see a Sox or Yankees game.

Seasons can be beautiful here and the proximity to major cities (Boston, NYC, The cape etc) is convenient but that's where it ends for me.

The state charges you an exit tax when you move out.....17 years to go.

Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk

My brother recently moved from CT to NY because (no joke) the cost of living in NY is lower.

Larry Sellers

02-18-2019, 12:52 PM

My brother recently moved from CT to NY because (no joke) the cost of living in NY is lower.Yeah, the issue for me is that my family has some health issues,as well as my job (civil service) is here. Unfortunately I don't have a degree, which in turn sort of holds me here. I've got seniority and a decent pension/457/Roth going now.

We're smart about cost shaving measures at the house (pellet stove this summer to cut down on our energy usage next winter)

Beautiful state. But it's dying

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Chance

12-06-2019, 09:10 PM

From CNN (https://www.cnn.com/2019/12/06/tech/amazon-new-york-office-hudson-yards/index.html):

Amazon may have killed its plan for a second headquarters in New York, but it still wants in on the city's tech talent.

The company will lease 335,000 square feet of new office space in Manhattan's Hudson Yards neighborhood, it said Friday.

....

The tech giant abandoned that project — which followed a public bidding process that had cities across the country jostling to attract it — after locals slammed the $1.5 billion in tax incentives New York offered the company. Protesters took to the streets in Long Island City, criticizing the deal for being bad for taxpayers and the neighborhood. HQ2 was expected to bring 25,000 jobs to New York City over time.

Amazon won't receive those benefits for its new office on 10th Avenue, which will open in 2021 and house more than 1,500 employees from its consumer and advertising teams. The online retailer currently employs more than 8,000 people in New York City, including through its customer fulfillment centers.