What rimfire .22 would you recommend?

[Dismas316]

So competed today in a Real Steel Challange which was a blast. I notice a lot of people were shooting rimfire .22’s and it got me thinking. This could be a great solution for my wife/kids to start shooting with me when I go to the range and really enjoy the shooting experience. My thoughts are more around something like the Walther 22, M&P 22, or something that is a little brother of a carry gun. I know nothing about these so any thoughts and suggestions are welcome. Thx as always for suggestions.

[OlongJohnson]

Since you mentioned service pistol cross trainer, there's a thread on the P250 in .22LR around here somewhere. I've really been enjoying that one. Sig also makes rimfire conversions for the classic series. Don't know if there's a P320. There's a .22LR version of the Beretta 92 that's supposed to be pretty decent.

Some people really like the K frame S&Ws. I like the balance of the 5.5-in GP100 in the gun shop, but haven't shot one.

For the Steel Challenge scenario, I'd look into a Browning Buck Mark. It's my fave. Unlike the Ruger, you can swap Buck Mark barrels easily, so playing with length and weight/inch with either aluminum or steel and bull or pencil profiles is easy. A bazillion SKUs get made. The triggers start OK and can be made fantastic. Trolling for deals on GunBroker will lead to excellent results eventually, and Browning seems to have $25 or $50 rebates a couple times a year if you buy new. Like any pistol, they really need a detail strip and deburr/smoothing of all the bits before going into service. I suggest the URX grip as magically fitting small and large hands well. You can ditch the wraparound and get stocks for that version of the frame that provide the minimum grip radius, if the smaller people in your life want it even smaller.

For the rapid target transitions in Steel Challenge, an aluminum barrel may be the hot ticket. The factory has built many, such as this one, which also has the URX grip:

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/789716045

This is what that frame looks like with non-wraparound stocks:

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/789302527

If you think you may want to run a red dot at some point, there are plenty of versions that include a partial or full-length rail from the factory. A super-rare cool-kid version of this is the Contour Lite, if you can ever find one. And there are factory threaded versions if you're into paying tax on stamps.

Tons of info with the hardcore geeks over at RimfireCentral.com.

.22LR ammo seems to be particularly cheap and plentiful these days, at least compared to the past five years.

[LittleLebowski]

https://www.brownells.com/firearms/handguns/semi-auto/mark-iv-22-45-lite-grey-black-22lr-threaded-prod117131.aspx

[GJM]

By chance, I also shot a Steel Challenge match today. Bunch of people were running a 10-22 with this stock:

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/2157287396/blackhawk-knoxx-axiom-r-f-adjustable-length-of-pull-rifle-stock-ruger-10-22-synthetic

Guy had a 22/45 Lite with a dot, like LL linked above, that looked good. I shot my CO Glock and also a PCC. My PCC time was only three seconds faster (78 vs 75) than my CO time, suggesting something.

[johnson]

What do you shoot with now? I have a CZ 75B SA with a Kadet conversion and it's been flawless with good ammo. It of course does not have an easy way to mount a factory red dot like the newer pistols but I wouldn't sell/trade it for anything.

I wish Ruger would release a 22/45 LITE without flutes.

[peterb]

A .22 with a red dot sight is probably the easiest way to start having fun shooting Steel Challenge. The dot takes some of the anxiety out of the long shots.

I’ve got a Ruger MkII with a Burris sight which is great fun to shoot. The all-steel guns can be heavy for smaller folks. If you buy an older Ruger without a rail you can add one, or there are adapters that use the rear sight dovetail.

For smaller hands and/or something more like a service pistol I’m looking at the M&P22 Compact. The Walther does not have a good reputation for reliability.

[BehindBlueI's]

Guy had a 22/45 Lite with a dot, like LL linked above, that looked good.

A range-buddy of mine has one I've shot several times, with and without an optic. I don't have much frame of reference for magazine fed .22 pistols, but I like shooting it enough I've kicked around getting one.

[Dismas316]

What do you shoot with now? I have a CZ 75B SA with a Kadet conversion and it's been flawless with good ammo. It of course does not have an easy way to mount a factory red dot like the newer pistols but I wouldn't sell/trade it for anything.

I wish Ruger would release a 22/45 LITE without flutes.


I mainly shoot glocks but have some sigs, M&P, and 1911. Used to have a PPQ but sounds like the Walther isn’t a good option. No CZ’s (yet)

[ArgentFix]

I really like my Ruger MK IV Target but it still stovepipes occasionally with 1200 rounds on it. It shoots well and feels excellent. I also have a Walther P22 which is smaller and feels cheaper but it's been freakishly reliable. After breaking it in with ~500 "CCI AR Tactical something" and whatever else I had laying around, it's had exactly zero stoppages in the last 2400 Mini Mag 40gr (with cleaning/lubing of course). I'd recommend against the long-barreled P22 because the "slide extension" is annoying. Cleaning and caring for both has been easy.

[awp_101]

I mainly shoot glocks but have some sigs, M&P, and 1911.
If you want to use what you carry, I've had good luck with the Advantage Arms Glock and 1911 conversions. I built a dedicated .22 G19 not long before I got out of Glocks all together and currently have a 1911 kit that is more fun than I can describe.

For non-conversions, I'm a fan of the Buckmark and the MkIV 22/45 Lite. I recently gifted the youngest my old 5.5" Target Buckmark so I could "justify" buying the 22/45.:D No experience with the M&P .22 but it's on my list of things to try out.

The 2 biggest things to remember with any .22 are:

1. the better the ammo, the better the results
2. every rimfire is a law unto itself so item 1 doesn't always work out the way you expect

[Jim Watson]

What I see are a lot of Rugers, Buckmarks, and a number of S&W Victories, plus some higher end target pistols.

If it hadn't been cold and wet yesterday, I was going to shoot my Nelson/1911.
My Kadet Conversion is a good shooter, but you need either good trigger control or a better trigger.
Can't speak to other conversions.

I wouldn't expect much out of my Plastic M&P .22 Compact, even though it is my most reliable .22 auto.

Since Steel Challenge is under USPSA, there are a multitude of Divisions, anything you would take to USPSA or IDPA, plus the .22s.

[BillSWPA]

Not much I can add to OlongJohnson’s thorough response except to say that my Buck Mark has been one of my best purchases. Not only does it provide me with inexpensive practice (paid for itself multiple times over), but I have used it to train multiple new shooters. It is the only handgun my 11 year old daughter currently enjoys shooting.



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[Duelist]

I guess the first question you have to answer is if you want to be competitive, or if you want to use an understudy for your carry gun.

Either way sounds like fun, but getting a gun with competitive potential and getting it set up will likely cost more money.

[Jim Watson]

Why an "understudy?"
Shoot the real thing.

Get your wife and kid a solid .22 that they can get hits with, I recommend the Buckmark.

[Crusader]

I own a handful of .22 handguns, I’ll list them in the order I like them.

Ruger Mark II with a five inch barrel. I’ve owned this gun for over 20 years, it just works and is so accurate and easy to shoot well. Both my kids learned how to shoot with it and still love it till this day. Highly recommend.

S&W 617, big and heavy with a four inch barrel and 10 shot cylinder. Very accurate with a great trigger, love shooting this almost as much as the Ruger. But most likely too heavy for your kids.

Ruger SR22, great little semi auto. Nice trigger and very reliable, again easy to shoot well and surprisingly accurate. My kids like this one also, only drawback is it’s backward safety (up for fire).

Ruger LCR-x, good little ‘kit gun’ light and durable. Problem, I can’t shot it for crap. Between its stiff trigger and light weight, it takes a lot of effort to shoot it accurately. Do not recommend.

Taurus PT22, cheapy I picked up many years ago. Stiff double action only trigger, tiny sights and oh yeah it breaks a lot. Twice I’ve had to have them send me a part that broke on the gun while shooting it. Stay far far away ha ha.

[farscott]

If it is a new rimfire for fun matches, the S&W SW22 Victory is hard to beat. All stainless steel construction with one screw needed to be removed for field stripping, good accuracy, good adjustable sights, and a very nice trigger for about $350. While I am partial (after shooting it for more than forty-five years) to the older Ruger Standard design with its vast aftermarket support, a new Ruger has a less than good trigger. One needs the aftermarket to get a decent Ruger trigger on a newer pistol. The older Ruger pistol with better triggers are available in only carbon steel, lack a last-shot bolt hold-open, have the magaziner release located at the heel, and require a somewhat unique field stripping and assembly process. The Victory is a good choice for a new rimfire shooter in that it is an easy gun to own and shoot. It is also easy to change the barrel on the Victory, needing to only remove one additional screw whereas the barreled receiver of the Standard is legally "the gun".

The only negative on the Victory is it cannot be dry fired whereas the Standard can.

[mtnbkr]

https://www.brownells.com/firearms/handguns/semi-auto/mark-iv-22-45-lite-grey-black-22lr-threaded-prod117131.aspx
I have a version of this gun (MKIII, different color, different shape ports). While my M17 is more refined, the Ruger is more fun, especially with the can.


A range-buddy of mine has one I've shot several times, with and without an optic. I don't have much frame of reference for magazine fed .22 pistols, but I like shooting it enough I've kicked around getting one.
They're lots of fun. I've used a red-dot on mine, but my eyes turn dots into smeared curls, so I prefer shooting with irons. That said, I have a cheap red-dot that offers a "crosshair" as an option and that works much better than a dot (no smearing). If I ever find a quality red-dot sight with the same option, I'll consider it.

Chris

[SD]

Possibly a pistol and rifle that use the same magazines. Buckmark is one that comes into mind, rifle is pricey. Both weapons follow the same controls for use assisting a beginner with the learning process.

[OlongJohnson]

The only negative on the Victory is it cannot be dry fired whereas the Standard can.

That is one issue with Buck Marks. The peen on the breech face is semi-jokingly called the "buck mark" over on RFC. New-in-box guns are found with it when opened at the dealer. The factory checks result in each pistol being dry fired. There may be no mark, it may be significant. The firing pins need to be fitted for length so they don't strike the breech face. This is a simple procedure, and once done, eliminates the problem permanently. There are several posts with various methods of establishing the amount of material to be removed over on RFC.

Brownells should commission PTG to start making the chamber ironing tool that's fairly recently gone out of production.

[hufnagel]

Crusader touched on two I have; the 617 and SR22.
the 617 is a hoot to shoot, but it is a meaty gun so those with smaller or weaker hands/wrists might find it too much to hold up. on the plus side because of its size it's also the softest shooting .22lr handgun I have.
the SR22 is just plain fun to shoot for all ages and sizes. It's my go-to newbie gun when I take people.
finally I also have a Beretta M9-22. It's as close to identical as you can get for an M9/92 gun short of the .22lr conversion kit. It also is a ton of fun to shoot.

[Dismas316]

Surprised I don’t hear much about a Glock conversion slide for the .22 (Other than awp_101 in post 10). Any issues with these? This might be a good option for me to double as some cheap practice with my glocks.

[Crusader8207]

Just picked up the Sig P250C .22 from CDNN. $289.00 delivered. Hard to beat that price and that gun.

[jandbj]

For round guns, I love my S&W model 17 & 43c.

For a semi that works like my carry gun, 250c... or wait for SHOT 2019. :confused:

Remember that we still have a stray Glock model # yet to drop. :cool:

[Crusader8207]

Also as a side note, GunMag Warehouse has the 250 .22 magazines for $14.99 each. Regular price is $34.99. Bought 6 today.

[Dismas316]

Just picked up the Sig P250C .22 from CDNN. $289.00 delivered. Hard to beat that price and that gun.

That’s a great price. Let us know how it shoots for you. I have heard it will not lock back after the last round, curious if you’ll have that issue. Good luck with it.

[Crusader8207]

That’s a great price. Let us know how it shoots for you. I have heard it will not lock back after the last round, curious if you’ll have that issue. Good luck with it.

Will do, I'll be at the range Saturday. From what I can tell, it doesn't lock back on the last round with the .22. I also have a 9mm X Change kit and put it on the frame last night. Slide does lock back with the 9mm.

[Crusader8207]

Shot the 250 .22 today. Really enjoyed shooting it. Accurate and the trigger was very smooth. @ Dismas316, the side did not lock back after the last round.

[OlongJohnson]

That is one issue with Buck Marks. The peen on the breech face is semi-jokingly called the "buck mark" over on RFC. New-in-box guns are found with it when opened at the dealer. The factory checks result in each pistol being dry fired. There may be no mark, it may be significant. The firing pins need to be fitted for length so they don't strike the breech face. This is a simple procedure, and once done, eliminates the problem permanently. There are several posts with various methods of establishing the amount of material to be removed over on RFC.

Brownells should commission PTG to start making the chamber ironing tool that's fairly recently gone out of production.

The Menck tool can still be had on fleabay, apparently. I strongly suggest anyone who is into rimfires get one while you still can.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Menck-22-Chamber-Ironing-Swage/202491007166

https://www.ebay.com/itm/352503808634

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Menck-22-Chamber-Ironing-Swage-Rimfire-Gunsmith-Tool-1-4-Inch-Hex-Drive/202480326143

[awp_101]

Thanks Olong, just ordered one!

[OlongJohnson]

This is an outstanding deal.

Basic, moo-cow-kitten (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6_wDEjCpeOc) .22LR pistol. The URX grip magically fits every hand from small to large.

https://www.academy.com/shop/pdp/browning-buck-mark-camper-22-lr-semiautomatic-pistol-200023439

There's a $75 rebate until the end of the year on all Browning rimfires:

https://www.browning.com/news/promotions-rebates/holiday-savings-up-to-100-in-rebates.html

After tax in TX, that's $250 for the default, basic, reliable, accurate pistol. That and a $205 case of 5000 rounds (https://www.targetsportsusa.com/geco-22-long-rifle-bolt-action-ammo-40-grain-lead-round-nose-254040050-p-4269.aspx)will get a person of any age started.

[john c]

Surprised I don’t hear much about a Glock conversion slide for the .22 (Other than awp_101 in post 10). Any issues with these? This might be a good option for me to double as some cheap practice with my glocks.

I know it's been a while since you posted this.

My experience with the Advantage Arms Glock conversion kits has been mixed, and I've owned several. They're not very accurate, for a .22, and the reliability isn't that great. I would rate these as terrible guns. However, looking at them as a training device, the accuracy is acceptable, and you can practice with your exact trigger and gun. You can also use your regular support gear. This is a big advantage.

So, if you want one to shoot, skip it and get a buckmark. If you want a subcaliber trainer, go for it.

[Edster]

I recently bought a Ruger Mark IV 22/45.

It is the most cheap fun since laser pointers and kittens. I honestly can't wait for the next chance to get to the range with it.

The S&W M&P 15-22 is way up there in the fun department, too. More so when it gets a red dot.

Yeah, shooting them is probably improving my overall marksmanship and fundamentals, too. I'm just too busy making little holes really close to each other to care.

[jandbj]

The S&W M&P 15-22 is way up there in the fun department, too. More so when it gets a red dot.


Surprisingly good red dot. Especially for rimfires. I have 3 on various platforms. Oldest is about 5000 rounds in on the 15/22.
FSI FieldSportI Micro Red Dot Sight with QD Riser Mount, Dual Layers of Glass,4 MOA, 11 Brightness Setting，RED ONLY NO Green and Come with a Low Profile Base https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00I007FPA/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_tai_s36eCbR0SB2DG

[UNK]

Buy these for dry fire.
https://www.larrysguns.com/Products/Chamber-Plugs__LGI.aspx

[Wake27]

I’m only about 1k rounds into my AA G19 kit but it’s been great so far. Haven’t actually tested it for accuracy but haven’t noticed anything crazy. The M&P 15-22 is also a ton of fun, I recently put in a BCM PNT trigger, have an XPS-2 waiting, and have the new Radian Raptor/Talon Kit on the way for it. I want to try one of the Colt .22 Rail Guns, since I have the “real” one.


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[gtae07]

I really likemy M&P 22 compact. Reliable even on bulk ammo as long as you clean it every couple hundred rounds, accurate, etc. My only gripe is that the grip is small. It makes me want to put too much finger on the trigger.

The less said about the POS Sig Mosquito I sold, the better...

[Maca]

2500 rounds through my Ruger sr22. First 200 were problematic but after that, the gun cleared up and has been solid. Except that it now doesn’t lock back on empty.

Side note - got a CMMG conversion for my AR15 and tried it this morning. 100 flawless rounds and an ear to ear grin. Pretty awesome for skill building.