H4895 versus Varget?

[LittleLebowski]

When should I consider 4895 over trusty Varget?

[mtnbkr]

When should I consider 4895 over trusty Varget?

Just checking Hodgdon's load data for 308win in 150gr, 165gr, and 180gr bullets, it appears Varget gives you slightly lower pressure, slightly more velocity, but higher load densities (could be an issue at the upper end as the loads are compressed).

I'm not sure there's a clear answer other than try both and go with whatever works best in your gun with your metallic components of choice.

I checked another cartridges in the 308 class, 338fed and 243win, and saw similar results.

ETA: I checked the data for 30-06 and 35whelen. The 06 reflected the comments above, but in the Whelen, the differences were slightly greater. Overall, Varget is a tad slower based on velocities, load densities, and pressure, but so close that it would really come down to the load and gun combination rather than a hard and fast rule. My opinion of course...

Chris

[Hambo]

If you were reloading before Varget and have a lot of experience with, or data for, 4895.

If you have a stockpile of 4895.

[mtnbkr]

If you were reloading before Varget and have a lot of experience with, or data for, 4895.

If you have a stockpile of 4895.

I was approaching it as if the powder was a new purchase in either case, but having worked up loads or a stock of H4895 would steer me towards H4895. I happen to have a few pounds of Varget on hand, so I would gravitate in that direction myself.

Chris

[Hambo]

I was approaching it as if the powder was a new purchase in either case, but having worked up loads or a stock of H4895 would steer me towards H4895. I happen to have a few pounds of Varget on hand, so I would gravitate in that direction myself.

Chris

Agreed. For the first time buyer it's a coin toss. I do remember when Varget came out, but at that time I had already gone through the try 'different powder phase' of reloading.

[GuanoLoco]

I’ve only worked with 4895 for .308, and it’s been a while.

Worked up a load, haven't messed with it much since.

[okie john]

When should I consider 4895 over trusty Varget?

H4895 is the gold standard for reduced-recoil loads. 35-36 grains under a 165-grain bullet basically turns a 308 into a 30-30. Ken Waters wrote about a similar load that he called the "30-30-06," but it may have used IMR 3031.


Okie John

[strow]

H4895 has tended to tune up better with higher velocities for me over Varget with 223/55's.

As mentioned H4895 works well on reduced loads.

Not to get off track but give IMR 8208 XBR a look. H4895 has always been my go-to powder, until I tried IMR 8208. The 8208 meter's much better, seems to be just as temperature insensitive, and has shot VERY well in the 223 loads I have tried.

[Trigger]

I use H4895 in a 223AI bolt gun. Shoots teeny tiny groups with Hornady 75 AMAXes. I think the load is 24.5gr, but I would have to verify that. That gun like H4895 better than Varget.

For 223 and 308, I like: Varget, RL15/N203B, H4895, 8208XBR. If forced to use only one powder, I would pick Varget.

[mtnbkr]

FWIW, in 308win, give RL17 a try. I'm getting 30-06 velocities with a sub-max load and no pressure signs. I'll have to check my notes, but I seem to remember I was hitting near 2800fps out of a 20" barrel. At least with peep sights, it was as accurate as I could want. Based on what I've read, the pressure curve is flatter, enabling it to "push" longer before dropping off.

Chris

[ranger]

Kind of dated but lots of 308 load data and lore here https://yarchive.net/gun/ammo/308_loads.html

[txdpd]

H4895 meters better than Varget. If you're just throwing charges by volume, H4895 gives better results on paper IME. If you're throwing charges and trickling up to weight, it's a moot point.

[LittleLebowski]

I very much appreciate the advice gents, I'm sticking with Varget. Hopefully my 195gr Sierra TMKs (https://www.brownells.com/reloading/bullets/rifle-bullets/tipped-matchking-bullets-prod80584.aspx) arrive this week so that I can see how they compare to my Juggs.