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JDM
03-09-2011, 08:30 PM
When is the appropriate time to involve the local authorities regarding a situation that has caused a gun to clear leather (kydex?)?

The following is purely hypothetical:

I rent a condo in an upscale neighborhood in Albuquerque, filled with retired people, professional types etc. Really an ideal place for someone who is trying to stay out of trouble and live nice and quietly.

As luck would have it, I live directly accross from a couple "bro" (urban dictionary for definition) types, that somehow have managed not to get the old heave-ho despite flagrant and regular defiance of property rules. Read this as daytime drinking. Loud bullshit till three in the morning etc. I've come to believe that these two schmucks are the only two idiots in the whole place, and of course they are right here.

These two morons keep a large, aggressive and rather unpleasant dog, And regularly have their front door open allowing the dog to enter and exit their dwelling as it pleases. This foul beast has forced me to clear leather twice, via aggressive charging. Once while I was solo, and once when I had my 4yo with me. Both incidents were in view of one of the retards that own the dog. Both of whom got a very unpleasant talking to. Aside from being VERY polite to me now, they still allow their dog to roam about the property. They do bring him inside when they see I'm leaving my home, but that is little comfort given their regular inebriation.

Complaints to management have accomplished nothing.

What's next?

ETA: excuse the misplaced caps and punctuation. This was composed on an iPhone.

David
03-09-2011, 08:57 PM
I'd call if for no other reason than to document the problem should you ever have to use force. (on the dog)

JDM
03-09-2011, 09:01 PM
I'd call if for no other reason than to document the problem should you ever have to use force. (on the dog)

I guess I should have added to my original post that I'm only reluctant to call the police because I don't want the dog to be put down. I'm sure he is a fine animal under the right circumstances, as in when nowhere near me, and the dog doesn't understand the idea of common areas, so he is doing what he thinks he should (guarding masters house).

Would confiscation and euthanasia be the recourse to a simple report, or can the police simply make a report, and save further action for a later date if it becomes necessary?

MTechnik
03-09-2011, 09:02 PM
When is the appropriate time to involve the local authorities regarding a situation that has caused a gun to clear leather (kydex?)?

The following is purely hypothetical:

I rent a condo in an upscale neighborhood in Albuquerque, filled with retired people, professional types etc. Really an ideal place for someone who is trying to stay out of trouble and live nice and quietly.

As luck would have it, I live directly accross from a couple "bro" (urban dictionary for definition) types, that somehow have managed not to get the old heave-ho despite flagrant and regular defiance of property rules. Read this as daytime drinking. Loud bullshit till three in the morning etc. I've come to believe that these two schmucks are the only two idiots in the whole place, and of course they are right here.

These two morons keep a large, aggressive and rather unpleasant dog, And regularly have their front door open allowing the dog to enter and exit their dwelling as it pleases. This foul beast has forced me to clear leather twice, via aggressive charging. Once while I was solo, and once when I had my 4yo with me. Both incidents were in view of one of the retards that own the dog. Both of whom got a very unpleasant talking to. Aside from being VERY polite to me now, they still allow their dog to roam about the property. They do bring him inside when they see I'm leaving my home, but that is little comfort given their regular inebriation.

Complaints to management have accomplished nothing.

What's next?

ETA: excuse the misplaced caps and punctuation. This was composed on an iPhone.

Check your state laws. In PA a dog "pursuing, wounding or attacking human beings" (depending on what happened with the charing episodes) is enough to put a dog down yourself. But your laws may be very different.

JDM
03-09-2011, 09:04 PM
Check your state laws. In PA a dog "pursuing, wounding or attacking human beings" (depending on what happened with the charing episodes) is enough to put a dog down yourself. But your laws may be very different.

The law I'm familiar with, and am comfortable acting under. It's the "when" of involving law enforcement that I'm unsure about.

MTechnik
03-09-2011, 09:05 PM
The law I'm familiar with, and am comfortable acting under. It's the "when" of involving law enforcement that I'm unsure about.

Next time the dog charges you, regardless of whether you shot it or not.

JDM
03-09-2011, 09:07 PM
Next time the dog charges you, regardless of whether you shot it or not.

The old third times a charm. I think this is good. They have had two chances.

David
03-09-2011, 09:09 PM
I guess I should have added to my original post that I'm only reluctant to call the police because I don't want the dog to be put down. I'm sure he is a fine animal under the right circumstances, as in when nowhere near me, and the dog doesn't understand the idea of common areas, so he is doing what he thinks he should (guarding masters house).

Would confiscation and euthanasia be the recourse to a simple report, or can the police simply make a report, and save further action for a later date if it becomes necessary?


I have no idea what your laws are there but usually they won't euthanize a dog unless it has harmed another person or animal. In either case at-least you would be on record as having made a complaint of the issue should you need to defend yourself from it. You can use some spray on the thing and once it returns home a few times whimpering covered in pepper gel they might get the idea.

JDM
03-09-2011, 09:11 PM
I have no idea what your laws are there but usually they won't euthanize a dog unless it has harmed another person or animal. In either case at-least you would be on record as having made a complaint of the issue should you need to defend yourself from it. You can use some spray on the thing and once it returns home a few times whimpering covered in pepper gel they might get the idea.

This hadn't even occurred to me.

...every problem looks like a nail.

Thanks!!! I'm sure the dog will too.

jslaker
03-09-2011, 09:17 PM
You can use some spray on the thing and once it returns home a few times whimpering covered in pepper gel they might get the idea.

You know, in another thread here, specifically mentioned that one of the reasons they carry OC is in case of aggressive dogs. Sounds like this might be a good idea in your case, OP. It'd give you some sort of recourse without resorting to having to shoot the dog, which it understandably sounds like something you'd like to avoid.

Aray
03-09-2011, 09:40 PM
You know, in another thread here, specifically mentioned that one of the reasons they carry OC is in case of aggressive dogs. Sounds like this might be a good idea in your case, OP. It'd give you some sort of recourse without resorting to having to shoot the dog, which it understandably sounds like something you'd like to avoid.

OC for Dogs and Drunks, sounds like you might need it for both.

JDM
03-09-2011, 09:53 PM
OC for Dogs and Drunks, sounds like you might need it for both.

Perhaps. Although once they realized their small statured, quiet, medical attired, and polite neighbor was as, ahem, prepared as he was; their interactions with me have become nothing short of absolutely polite. Which was not at all what I was trying to accomplish, however...

I don't see the human tenants being a problem anytime in the near future. It's the dog. Although I believe the solution lies in a small pressurized can.


Is there a "best" pepper spray, or is it a fairly level playing field?

willowofwisp
03-09-2011, 10:29 PM
Perhaps. Although once they realized their small statured, quiet, medical attired, and polite neighbor was as, ahem, prepared as he was; their interactions with me have become nothing short of absolutely polite. Which was not at all what I was trying to accomplish, however...

I don't see the human tenants being a problem anytime in the near future. It's the dog. Although I believe the solution lies in a small pressurized can.


Is there a "best" pepper spray, or is it a fairly level playing field?

Fox labs makes some awesome OC spray

http://foxlabs.com/home.shtml

JDM
03-09-2011, 10:45 PM
Fox Labs goodness on the way.

willowofwisp
03-09-2011, 11:03 PM
Fox Labs goodness on the way.

awesome and thanks for supporting a Michigan company (I have no affiliation with them at all.)

JDM
03-09-2011, 11:04 PM
awesome and thanks for supporting a Michigan company (I have no affiliation with them at all.)

Hahaha.

My mom was born in Royal Oak.

MI is on the short list of places to visit.

Mitchell, Esq.
03-11-2011, 10:50 AM
When is the appropriate time to involve the local authorities regarding a situation that has caused a gun to clear leather (kydex?)?

The following is purely hypothetical:

I rent a condo in an upscale neighborhood in Albuquerque, filled with retired people, professional types etc. Really an ideal place for someone who is trying to stay out of trouble and live nice and quietly.

As luck would have it, I live directly accross from a couple "bro" (urban dictionary for definition) types, that somehow have managed not to get the old heave-ho despite flagrant and regular defiance of property rules. Read this as daytime drinking. Loud bullshit till three in the morning etc. I've come to believe that these two schmucks are the only two idiots in the whole place, and of course they are right here.

These two morons keep a large, aggressive and rather unpleasant dog, And regularly have their front door open allowing the dog to enter and exit their dwelling as it pleases. This foul beast has forced me to clear leather twice, via aggressive charging. Once while I was solo, and once when I had my 4yo with me. Both incidents were in view of one of the retards that own the dog. Both of whom got a very unpleasant talking to. Aside from being VERY polite to me now, they still allow their dog to roam about the property. They do bring him inside when they see I'm leaving my home, but that is little comfort given their regular inebriation.

Complaints to management have accomplished nothing.

What's next?

ETA: excuse the misplaced caps and punctuation. This was composed on an iPhone.

The proper time to have called the police was when you noticed the animal was off the leash roaming around freely in violation of the municipal code which you researched and can cite if need be, for starters.

In the situation, it would be after you have cleared leather the first time and gotten to safety. Call to make a report of the incident, because if it leads to something else you need to have a documentable trail of what happened to show whoever reviews the incident this is not some guy over-reacting to a dog, then getting into a shooting with his neighbors.

Police reports before a shooting prevent criminal cases after a shooting.

Further, you need to be sending a letter to the landlorg about the dangerous conditions he is allowing on his property and requesting a copy of the declerations page of his insurance to take to your attorney.

And talk to animal control next time you see the fucker roaming around. Because allowing a beloved pet to roam unprotected is wrong. :cool:

And make a call to the anti-blight people in town hall. I'm sure someone would love to go out to fine them $100/day over the uncut grass, trash not in bags and beer cans on the steps. :D

TCinVA
03-11-2011, 11:23 AM
Fox Labs goodness on the way.

It is nicknamed "Liquid Pain".

JDM
03-11-2011, 12:02 PM
The proper time to have called the police was when you noticed the animal was off the leash roaming around freely in violation of the municipal code which you researched and can cite if need be, for starters.

In the situation, it would be after you have cleared leather the first time and gotten to safety. Call to make a report of the incident, because if it leads to something else you need to have a documentable trail of what happened to show whoever reviews the incident this is not some guy over-reacting to a dog, then getting into a shooting with his neighbors.

Police reports before a shooting prevent criminal cases after a shooting.

Further, you need to be sending a letter to the landlorg about the dangerous conditions he is allowing on his property and requesting a copy of the declerations page of his insurance to take to your attorney.

And talk to animal control next time you see the fucker roaming around. Because allowing a beloved pet to roam unprotected is wrong. :cool:

And make a call to the anti-blight people in town hall. I'm sure someone would love to go out to fine them $100/day over the uncut grass, trash not in bags and beer cans on the steps. :D

Thank you councilor.

Savage Hands
03-11-2011, 12:29 PM
Fox labs makes some awesome OC spray

http://foxlabs.com/home.shtml


Absolutely! It works great on 4 legged and 2 legged animals YMMV :cool: