VP9 best striker fired 9mm?

[Beardc66]

Is the HK vp9 the best built, most shootable striker fired pistol?

[okie john]

Is the HK vp9 the best built, most shootable striker fired pistol?

For what purpose?

There is no best, only varying degrees of imperfection.


Okie John

[SilentSc0rch]

Caveat:
I don't own a VP9 and haven't put nearly as many rounds through one as some folks here have.

Personal Experience:
1) I find the VP9 to be too large for what it is (a 15 round polymer striker gun).
2) This could've been subjective, and I haven't shot one in a while, but it seemed to have more noticeable muzzle flip than my G19 at the time.
3) Through my own research, the VP9 doesn't appear to be nearly as rugged as the rest of it's family which may be somewhat predictable given its name and price point.
4) But ultimately, the more I shoot and handle different platforms, the more I realize how useless judging a gun is by finger-banging it in a gun store or during dry fire. I can't tell you how many times I fell into the trap of "ooooh, that trigger is so much crisper" and "aaaah, that grip contour is so much more comfortable." Once the timer goes off or, god forbid, an actual threat presents itself, it really only matters how high and tight you can get on that gun and how quickly and accurately you can get your hits.

[critter]

Is the HK vp9 the best built, most shootable striker fired pistol?

I'd give that title to the PPQ M1. :cool: What you're asking is subjective as hell. The VP9 is a well built striker-fired pistol. How does it shoot for you? Most modern ranges have rentals of popular selling pistols. Check it, and a few others, out and see for yourself.

[Super77]

I'd give that title to the PPQ

Same here

[Peally]

It does what I need it to do. I won't say any gun is the best at anything but me switching from it would improve my USPSA scores and ranking by 0.0%.

[JBP55]

I'd give that title to the PPQ M1. :cool: What you're asking is subjective as hell. The VP9 is a well built striker-fired pistol. How does it shoot for you? Most modern ranges have rentals of popular selling pistols. Check it, and a few others, out and see for yourself.

I have owned several of each and I prefer the VP9. Different strokes.

[cheby]

Well, just to spice it up: The best striker fired 9mm is Glock, if you can handle the truth. Duh!

[Dr. No]

The VP9 is perfection in my book. The walther has a much taller slide which I think takes away from it's aesthetics. The Sig 320 would be the only thing that would give the HK a run for its money. We've had a slew of guys switch over to carrying the VP at my department. I'm at about 10k on both of mine and I've had exactly 0 issues, as expected. My only wish is that it would be a little heavier to make it more competitive against CZ's and such.

[pew_pew]

No. I want them to be my favorite but it’s a higher bore and you can’t get your hands up as high to control the gun as good as a Glock. No real ledge or anywhere good to put support hand thumb for the same purpose. The ergos feel nice just messing around with the gun but it doesn’t allow you to really drive your hand high in the beaver tail.

Not like it’s massively obvious but it’s there. Super accurate though and the trigger is good stock but not PPQ good.

Truexodus has a great review of the gun on YouTube.

[HCountyGuy]

Depends on who you ask.

I’m not much knowledgeable about build quality, as that’s still a bit outside my lane.

Shootability is a rather subjective standard, and I’ll give my two-cents:

Prior to the release of the Gen5 Glocks, I would likely have made my next striker-fired pistol a VP9. From the grip customization down to the trigger, it’s quite the attractive package to me. Of course, I’m not fond of the paddle mag-release but since EDCing a P30 it has grown on me some.

Now why would I choose a Gen5 Glock over it?

First and foremost is size. Many pistols these days struggle to hit that “sweet spot” a Glock 19 fills in the size and capacity department. Now it’s possible H&K tried to squeeze some extra rounds in the VP9 and it proved problematic, I don’t know. However the gun is a bit bigger (about half an inch iirc) with no capacity gain over the Glock 19. That half an inch may not sound like much, but it sure does make a world of difference in terms of concealability. A VP9 is still plenty concealable, but you have to make adjustments.

Next, the new Gen5 trigger is pretty darn nice. Up until their release, the VP9 had the best out of the box striker trigger I’d felt. Smooth and predictable. Glock apparently got their crap together when it came to the Gen5.

I’ve not shot the two (Glock & H&K) in a comparison, but both shot pretty well for me. But I still seem to pick up a Glock Gen5 and shoot it more naturally.

Another point to consider: Aftermarket support. You can find Glock parts in just about any gun store/pawn shop you walk in to. Not so with H&K.

I would love to see a ToddG style “torture test” of the VP9 though. To see if it truly lives up to the H&K name.

[Peally]

FWIW despite knowing they work fine I think button mag releases suck. Just depends on what you're acclimated to.

[FPS]

VP9 is a great gun and one I shoot the best out of all the pistols I have owned. I like it just slightly better than my PPQ, there is something about the recoil feel that I just like better - totally subjective. My Gen 3 G19 was a bit softer shooting but didn't fit my hand well and I couldn't shoot it nearly as accurately as the VP9 but that is me and own body mechanics. However, I carry a P30SK V3 which I definitely don't shoot as well but feel much more comfortable carrying. Something about the P30/VP9/PPQ grip shape that fits me perfectly.

There is no best. Lots of great guns, pick one out of the several that are at the top of the heap that fits you best. For most people, for home defense, I would always recommend to try out a Glock and see if it works for them due to the reputation and all the aftermarket support alongside a VP9, PPQ, and Gen 2 M&P. CC is a different story.

[Maca]

My VP9 has not been shot since i got my hands on a 19X.

While the Glock may not feel as "comfortable" in the hand, for me, the Glock locks into my hand better than any other pistol. It also points consistently out of the holster.

[RJ]

I traded my VP9 for a Glock 19.5 last November.

I tried hard to carry the VP9. It was just too long in the grip for me. It shot great in USPSA matches though. The hammer thing bugged me too.

For me the Glock just works better, carries easier, same capacity, and B8 scores at 25 yards are the same. I can get 2x magazines for what I paid for HK mags. The trigger in the Glock feels like a 1/2” travel VP9 trigger - which to me is very good. Plus: Gadget.

Both were/are malfunction free; 3,000+ on the VP9 and only 1,400 so far on the Glock.

[t1tan]

I was extremely excited for the VP9, got one maybe 6 months after launch, feels great in the hand but maybe I'm too used to Glocks. 650 rounds or so and it's sitting in it's case waiting for me to get around to selling it and the extras I added to it to get another Glock.

It's as impressive as any other HK, but I couldn't make it feel and shoot they way I want to like I can with Glocks.

[BobLoblaw]

Glocks have SCD Gadgets. That is the only practical advantage they have over the VP9.

[StraitR]

Glocks have SCD Gadgets. That is the only practical advantage they have over the VP9.

Agreed, Bob, and a huge advantage it is, exponentially so for those who AIWB. Then there is the fully tensioned striker/SAO aspect, which was a great discussion here not too long ago.

ETA: Here's the thread.... Striker Design Considerations and Safety (https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?24752-Striker-design-considerations-and-safety)

[Calvin118]

I had a VP9 in 2014, and personally could not find any practical way in which it was better than a Glock 17 Gen 4. Sure, it "felt" better in the hand during a tabletop examination, and the trigger was "crisper" in dry fire. In live fire, however, the Glock stuck to my hand better and tracked more quickly and predictably. I preferred the rolling break on the Glock trigger and shorter, more positive reset in live fire. I ran the two against each other in a variety of drills on a timer and the Glock won by a comfortable margin.

In my samples, accuracy was essentially the same benched at 25 yards with the types of ammunition I use. This surprised me because the P30s (which I could never warm up to) were definitely more accurate. The Glock has a much stronger track record than the VP9 for durability and reliability, has a much stronger aftermarket, avoids the fully cocked striker, is mechanically simpler, and is more user serviceable. More recently, the Glock has the aftermarket option of a striker control device. The Gen 5 models have (in my experience of owning two) improved triggers, ergonomics, and accuracy. Gen 5 also has factory option for excellent Ameriglo Bold sights.

I do not think that the VP9 is a bad gun, but I personally could not find any advantages over the Glock and see a number of disadvantages. Of course, the shape and size of all of our hands are different and as such experiences will vary.

[HopetonBrown]

Glocks have SCD Gadgets. That is the only practical advantage they have over the VP9.Wouldn't maintenance, ease of disassembly, lower cost replacement parts, larger aftermarket support be other practical advantages? I think of the forum member who sent his P2000 back to HQ for a spring replacement.

[LockedBreech]

I had a 2014 or 2015 manufacture VP9 that I put 1200 issue-free rounds through. I really liked the gun a lot and found it very well made and very reliable.

I got away from it for two main reasons:

1.) I found the trigger too light for me to be comfortable with it as a defense option without a safety.
2.) I was switching to Gen 4 Glocks

I never found that it could do more than the Gen 4 Glock and it had less interchangeability and aftermarket accessories.

That said, it was a fine gun that I have no bad experience with. I miss it. You would not hate one.

[BobLoblaw]

Wouldn't maintenance, ease of disassembly, lower cost replacement parts, larger aftermarket support be other practical advantages? I think of the forum member who sent his P2000 back to HQ for a spring replacement.

The mindset behind the design is totally different (shoot it, don’t mess with it) so a VP9 won’t need servicing until 10,000k rds I think? Your range pistol will eventually need springs but probably not your PD pistol. For a PD weapon, you really just field strip and lube which is essentially the same. VP9 has the takedown without pulling the trigger but BFD. HK USA is very reasonable when it comes to parts cost aside from mags but they make better mags so that’s still kind of a wash. Larger aftermarket support? Absolutely goes to Glock, holsters and sights without question. I kinda question the benefit of all the aftermarket redesigned extra parts though. Most everyone agrees OEM parts is a best practice for a defensive weapon. Oh and the fully tensioned striker thing, wasn’t it found that a partially-tensioned Glock striker would still set off primers should the FPB fail? I’m fuzzy on that one but if you strike the VP9 slide plate in a certain manner some samples have dropped the striker on the FPB, resulting in a dead trigger. Whether that’s a big deal is in the eye of the beholder.

Keep in mind I’m all about the DA/SA these days (and slowly turning into an unabashed Beretta fan) so I don’t really have much skin in the striker game. This is a Glock-centric forum so the VP9 doesn’t get much love around here.

[HCountyGuy]

This is a Glock-centric forum so the VP9 doesn’t get much love around here.

This is far from a Glock-centric forum, as evidenced by the “re-birth” of the PX4. Glock may have a prevalence, but the most of the folks here are fairly objective when it comes to handgun evaluations. Before Dropgate the P320 was enjoying some gaining popularity.

[BobLoblaw]

This is far from a Glock-centric forum, as evidenced by the “re-birth” of the PX4. Glock may have a prevalence, but the most of the folks here are fairly objective when it comes to handgun evaluations. Before Dropgate the P320 was enjoying some gaining popularity.

50% of this forum is Glock carriers year after year. All other handgun mfgs combined make up the other 50%.

https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?22241-What-do-you-carry-Survey-for-2016

https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?29050-2017-Pistol-Forum-com-CCW-Survey/page29

Saying bad things about Glocks has rubbed some folks the wrong way over the past few years. Take it from me, I’ve said a lot of stupid and inflammatory shit over the years and you can all be guarantee a response to a derogatory comment about Glocks. Luckily, there’s hardly anything to complain about with the Gen 5s.

[EricG]

I prefer the VP9 over every other striker fired gun I've shot over the last ~25 years.(Training and practice) That's a lot of rounds through a lot of guns.

No bloody knuckles/hands, no exaggerated grip angles, no frame surgery needed, no aftermarket barrel needed, no fancy aftermarket trigger or trigger job needed, usable factory sights...

Having said that, wtf HK? $45 magazines?

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[Dagga Boy]

It is my favorite striker fired LE service pistol. For other purposes YMMV.

[ViniVidivici]

Is the HK vp9 the best built, most shootable striker fired pistol?
Not while the Glock 17 and Smith M&P 9 exist.

[RJ]

50% of this forum is Glock carriers year after year. All other handgun mfgs combined make up the other 50%.

https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?22241-What-do-you-carry-Survey-for-2016

https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?29050-2017-Pistol-Forum-com-CCW-Survey/page29

Saying bad things about Glocks has rubbed some folks the wrong way over the past few years. Take it from me, I’ve said a lot of stupid and inflammatory shit over the years and you can all be guarantee a response to a derogatory comment about Glocks. Luckily, there’s hardly anything to complain about with the Gen 5s.

I thought it was interesting to go look at handgun data, reported by the BATF.

https://www.atf.gov/about/docs/undefined/afmer2016webreport508pdf/download

For 2016, for manufactured handguns (pistols) if I did the math right (had to take my shoes and socks off to count 'causen these are big numbers :cool:) the percentage of manufactured pistols across the companies looks like this:

Glock 368,146 8%
Ruger 902,437 19%
SCCY 160,676 3%
Taurus 125,418 3%
S&W 1,429,451 30%
Sig Sauer 580,588 12%
Kimber 220,804 5%

THE REST 932,555 20%

Total 4,720,075 100%

So it would seem that indeed Glock carriers, with only 8% of the pistols made in 2016, are represented well here at p-f.

Agree with you on the "Glock-o-philes" though; is a Glock perfect, no, but it makes a decent bullet launcher.

[Beat Trash]

I bought a VP9 about 6 months after it was released. There were a lot of things about the gun that I really liked. The grip was not one of them. No matter what combination of grip panels I used, the top portion of the grip was too small in diameter for my hand. The grip would feel excellent when handling the gun or when dry firing it. But when actually shooting it, I had a harder time maintaining a solid grip compared to one of my gen4 Glocks.

I bought a gen5 Glock 19 and realized the accuracy of my sample 19.5 was as mechanically accurate as my VP9. I ended up trading off the VP9 when I realized it had sat in the safe for over 6 months without seeing the light of day.

Is the VP9 an excellent striker fired pistol? Definitely.

Is it, "The Best"? That answer is based on your individual hand size and what you need out of a pistol. For me personally, no it is not. For you...?

[Rex G]

Is the HK vp9 the best built, most shootable striker fired pistol?

Welcome to Pistol-Forum dot com. :)

The short answer is, “Not best, for everyone.” My best, and your best, may well be quite different. No high-bore-axis pistol is going to be nearly the best, for me, unless it has some major, significant, seriously-redeeming features. The VP9 does not have enough redeeming features.

My “best” striker-fired auto-pistol may be the Gen4 G17, of which I have two, but I do not consider them “best pistols,” for me, if the striker requirement is removed from the equation.

I have no prejudice against striker-fired pistols, actually owning a pair of HK P7 pistols by 1985, carrying one in my police duty rig, and during personal time. I got away from the P7 due to changing duty equipment regulations, and reverted to hammer-fired guns for a number of years. (When the mandated switch to specified open-top, retention-type duty holsters occurred, no such holster was available for the P7.) I sold my P7 pistols during a lean financial time, and re-buying, today, means paying a collector’s price, so I do not know if the P7 would be my best striker-fired pistol, in 2018.

[OnionsAndDragons]

The standard answer: it depends.

I would say by most metrics, the VP9 is in the top tier of striker guns. You aren't going to go wrong with it.

I'd put it with the Gen5 Glocks and the PPQ as the cream of the crop. If I had to crown a king, I'd likely give the nod to the Gen5 Glocks as what I would be most likely to choose or recommend in a total vacuum.


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[JodyH]

VP9 is good, but it could use another 2 rounds in the magazine and it really needs more recoil spring and/or a redesign of the slide unlock. As is it's way too easy to push out of battery or have grunge keep it from going back into battery (even using the .40 recoil spring).
When the VP9 came out it was a step up from the mediocre Gen3/4 Glocks and the M&P9 with its accuracy issues.
Now that the M&P 2.0 and Gen 5 Glocks are out, H&K needs to step up and address the VP9's shortcomings.

[okie john]

Now that the M&P 2.0 and Gen 5 Glocks are out, H&K needs to step up and address the VP9's shortcomings.

Yes, especially it being bigger than a G19.


Okie John

[psalms144.1]

Many folks know that I'm the guy who loves to hate GLOCKs, but still carries them almost exclusively. I ran a VP9 for several months a while back, and it was a nice pistol, for sure. The fully pre-tensioned striker makes for a "nicer" trigger than GLOCK, and the customizable grip panels/backstrap certainly feel nice. Having said that, FOR ME, it was too large for capacity, and had a lot more muzzle flip than my G19. Folks who haven't had hundreds of thousands of rounds and decades of shooting GLOCKs might not feel the same, naturally.

[Mitch]

I don’t know if I got awesome VP9s or crappy gen 5 glocks, but my VP9 triggers (2) stomp the crap out of my glocks (3). I find the VP9 much easier to manage grip wise too with my hand size than even gen 5 glocks. I’m not sure if it’s due to me or the guns but the 25 yard targets with my VP9 are consistently better.

I download my Glock mags by one, and don’t with HK so there’s a 1 round difference for me between VP9 and a Glock 17. Even if it were more, I don’t think I’d care.

Not saying glocks suck at all, but VP9 is definitely my favorite striker fired gun.


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[JTQ]

I'm always intrigued by comments that a gun "only" hold 15 rounds (I used to think the same back in the days when the SIG P226 and Beretta 92/M9 came with 15 rounders). Is there a CZ SP01 or STI double stack forum somewhere where the folks comment about the G17/G34 and say, "sure they are nice guns, but they only hold 17 rounds"?

[HCountyGuy]

I'm always intrigued by comments that a gun "only" hold 15 rounds (I used to think the same back in the days when the SIG P226 and Beretta 92/M9 came with 15 rounders). Is there a CZ SP01 or STI double stack forum somewhere where the folks comment about the G17/G34 and say, "sure they are nice guns, but they only hold 17 rounds"?

Even the P226 nowadays can run 18-rounds flush with MecGars.

The gripe is about the size-to-capacity ratio. Everyone wants what a Glock 19 can do, but they don’t want a Glock 19. Weird right?

[HALO51]

I have (2) VP-9's....One has 25,006 flawless rounds and still operating with the original RSA and the other over 3,000 round count. The VP-9 was in R&D for 4.5 years prior to release. That's remarkable and unheard of in today's manufacturing process. HK doesn't BETA test their firearms via releasing to the public and fixing flaws on the fly. Being an HK armorer as well as several other platforms, the VP-9 is in my opinion the best out of the box striker fire pistol produced and I've grown to really appreciate the VP 9 platform. The pivoting striker safety is absolutely ingenious. I could type for awhile on the engineering on this platform. Call someone like a Rick Holm, Robert Burke or James Williamson and ask them these questions. They go into great detail on this platform and it's pure HK German Engineering.

[ralph]

Even the P226 nowadays can run 18-rounds flush with MecGars.

The gripe is about the size-to-capacity ratio. Everyone wants what a Glock 19 can do, but they don’t want a Glock 19. Weird right?

Maybe we should reprhase that..Everyone wants what a Glock 19 can do, but they don't want a Glock 19 that throws empty brass left, straight up, forward, back at your face, shoulders, back over your head, dribbles out on your wrist, or drop at your feet. Supposedly the Gen 5's have fixed that,(I honestly don't know) but then again, that's what they said about the Gen4 guns too.. If Glock could make a pistol with consistent to- the-right-ejection, then they'd be close to perfection. But, the way I figure it, that would take a whole redesign of the slide, (there's a few needed improvements in there) and they'd need to shit can their Rube Goldberg extraction system, and go with a more conventional spring loaded lever system, that actually works..

But, back to the VP9..I agree, the grip is too long for the number of rounds it holds, had HK decided to use P-2000 mags, and made the grip shorter, that would've been great.. But, they did'nt.. I have a VP9 I'd like to get rid of, but because the market is saturated with VP9's after HK dropped the price on them, I'd have to take a bath on it, just to get rid of it.. So, for now, it sits in the safe taking up space.. Myself, I think it's flippy when shooting it, My PX4 is a much flatter shooter.. The VP9 is a good pistol reliable, accurate, but really, it's nothing special.. I think as far as striker fired pistols go, the CZ P-10c is a better pistol than the VP9..

[JonInWA]

Interesting about the VP9 possessing more muzzle flip than comparable Glocks-I find the opposite to be true with my VP40 compared to my Gen4 G22 (and I'm pretty sure that a G23 would fare much worse). My VP40 demonstrably fires flatter and faster than my G22 with the same ammunition. Not that it obsoletes the G22 or renders me feeling ineffective with it, but it was a significant difference in favor of the heavy-slided VP40. Hmmmm....perhaps there really is something to what a number of the SME's (Wayne Dobbs and Darryl Boelke come to mind) have recommended about the conceptual validity of using the heavier Glock GAP pistol slides for .40 chambered Glocks...

And it's also interesting to note that the VPs utilize flatwire recoil springs like the "legacy" Glocks, not double or triple nested springs...

Best, Jon

[Peally]

Bore height and "flip" are massively overrated terms. Switching from a giant 45 to a 9 I can tell a difference. Between my VP9 and a buddies Glock? No way in hell, they shoot exactly the same for me.

[JBP55]

Bore height and "flip" are massively overrated terms. Switching from a giant 45 to a 9 I can tell a difference. Between my VP9 and a buddies Glock? No way in hell, they shoot exactly the same for me.

I have owned several VP9 and Glock pistols. Using the same ammunition the VP9 has more muzzle flip/felt recoil than a Gen 4/5 G17.
I have fired them side by side many times.

[OnionsAndDragons]

Bore height and "flip" are massively overrated terms. Switching from a giant 45 to a 9 I can tell a difference. Between my VP9 and a buddies Glock? No way in hell, they shoot exactly the same for me.

I'm with you here, bro.

With configured panels, I see no appreciable difference in my muzzle return to target. No real difference in 7yd or in Bills. My VP is a bit more precise at distance, but all my Glocks are Gen3 so that's probably a factor.


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[DacoRoman]

For what purpose?

There is no best, only varying degrees of imperfection.


Okie John

that response wins the internet

[Doc_Glock]

I have (2) VP-9's....One has 25,006 flawless rounds and still operating with the original RSA and the other over 3,000 round count. The VP-9 was in R&D for 4.5 years prior to release. That's remarkable and unheard of in today's manufacturing process. HK doesn't BETA test their firearms via releasing to the public and fixing flaws on the fly. Being an HK armorer as well as several other platforms, the VP-9 is in my opinion the best out of the box striker fire pistol produced and I've grown to really appreciate the VP 9 platform. The pivoting striker safety is absolutely ingenious. I could type for awhile on the engineering on this platform. Call someone like a Rick Holm, Robert Burke or James Williamson and ask them these questions. They go into great detail on this platform and it's pure HK German Engineering.

I agree on most counts. Love HKs. Think the VP9 is quality.

Things I don’t like:

1. I can make the striker fall without pulling the trigger. Just hit it in the right place with a hammer.

2. The slide releases are really over sensitive. I have found this on the P30 as well. They routinely auto forward on mag insertion, and are super sensitive to grip. Perhaps due to their length and or weak mag springs?

While I appreciate the engineering, it does nothing for me as a reliable, durable bullet launcher that a Glock or PPQ doesn’t do just as well.

[JonInWA]

I agree on most counts. Love HKs. Think the VP9 is quality.

Things I don’t like:

1. I can make the striker fall without pulling the trigger. Just hit it in the right place with a hammer.

2. The slide releases are really over sensitive. I have found this on the P30 as well. They routinely auto forward on mag insertion, and are super sensitive to grip. Perhaps due to their length and or weak mag springs?

While I appreciate the engineering, it does nothing for me as a reliable, durable bullet launcher that a Glock or PPQ doesn’t do just as well.

Hammers R'Us....

Enel, I haven't had any auto-forwarding to date with my sample size of 1 VP40 and 1 P30L.

Best, Jon

[Peally]

Hell I can't even tell the difference between different grip panels other than they shift my hand around a twinge. I tried swapping them around once just to see and eventually decided it wasn't worth spending time on. Slapped on the medium default ones and went back to dry fire.

[HCM]

I have owned several VP9 and Glock pistols. Using the same ammunition the VP9 has more muzzle flip/felt recoil than a Gen 4/5 G17.
I have fired them side by side many times.

I agree though it I s most noticeable when shooting multiple rounds quickly. The rounded grip that feels so nice in the hand is a detriment to consistent tracking when shooting multiple rounds quickly.

Flat sided guns for the win on tracking and quick shooting.

[Sensei]

So, what criteria is most important to the OP? I ask that owning multiple copies of virtually every striker fired pistol on the market and each platform brings something different to the market for me.

If we are talking about the ability to deliver multiple highly accurate hits, then for me the best is the 5" M&P9 2.0. That gun is almost as accurate as my P226 Legion SAO and my Wilson CQB Elite. That seems ironic to me that the least expensive platform in my armory, once known for suspect accuracy, is the most accurate platform in my hand. In fact, I’m noticeably more accurate and fast with the M&P9 than any other platform as we progress down comparable barrel lengths (i.e. my 2.0 compact is more accurate than my G19 or PPQ).

If size efficiency, parts abundance, and ease of maintenance are the primary concerns, then the G19 would be the best. That is to say, I have a G19 when I travel even though the M&P2.0 is more accurate because I know that I can more readily find parts for a G19 and service the Glock platform while traveling.

When it comes to the VP9, it is perhaps my most reliable striker platform. It is the only platform that has not given me a BTF or failed to cycle a round (I have about 5,000 round between 3 VP9s and I can recall not a single issue at all). However, my M&P9s and G19s are reliable enough that I rarely find myself loading out my VP9s for carry because other factors such as size, accuracy, and serviceability are important enough that to trump the VP9's reliability.

[Ed L]

I agree that the VP9 is my favorite striker fired pistol,


Caveat:
I don't own a VP9 and haven't put nearly as many rounds through one as some folks here have.

Personal Experience:
1) I find the VP9 to be too large for what it is (a 15 round polymer striker gun).


H&K went with the 15 round magazine for absolute reliability. I have had about 5 situations with M&P9 magazines where the rounds get lodged together in the magazine. Each time this has happened it was with different magazines and different brands of ammo, including Winchester Ranger and Black Hills. I have tried different followers and heavier magazine springs and still had this happen. The reason it happens is in their effort to make magazines that can hold 17 rounds, S&W uses mags that are wide enough to allow rounds to get lodged together under certain circumstances. I would rather go with a 15 round mag that is super reliable and durable like that of the VP9.

Bellow is a picture of the M&P mag with rounds lodged together from a bottom view:

28060

[HCM]

I have (2) VP-9's....One has 25,006 flawless rounds and still operating with the original RSA and the other over 3,000 round count. The VP-9 was in R&D for 4.5 years prior to release. That's remarkable and unheard of in today's manufacturing process. HK doesn't BETA test their firearms via releasing to the public and fixing flaws on the fly. Being an HK armorer as well as several other platforms, the VP-9 is in my opinion the best out of the box striker fire pistol produced and I've grown to really appreciate the VP 9 platform. The pivoting striker safety is absolutely ingenious. I could type for awhile on the engineering on this platform. Call someone like a Rick Holm, Robert Burke or James Williamson and ask them these questions. They go into great detail on this platform and it's pure HK German Engineering.

Stop being cheap and change your RSA,

[HCM]

Anyone have any idea why the VP9SK's consistently have better out of the box trigger pulls than the full size VP9 ?

[HALO51]

I agree on most counts. Love HKs. Think the VP9 is quality.

Things I don’t like:

1. I can make the striker fall without pulling the trigger. Just hit it in the right place with a hammer.

2. The slide releases are really over sensitive. I have found this on the P30 as well. They routinely auto forward on mag insertion, and are super sensitive to grip. Perhaps due to their length and or weak mag springs?

While I appreciate the engineering, it does nothing for me as a reliable, durable bullet launcher that a Glock or PPQ doesn’t do just as well.

Enel:

I’m not sure why you said you can make the striker fall without pulling the trigger by beating on it with a hammer? I guarantee you can’t make it go off with a hammer. I’m extremely familiar with this platform being an Armorer since it’s introduction into the market. This firearm was vetted for 4.5 years and has been through so many destructive tests, drop tests etc, too much to type by HK as well as many agencies in the European region. The GSG9 anti terror unit put the VP9 through tremendous tests as well for many months and it passed there criteria and now it’s their issue firearm. I will tell you that you are flat out wrong and it’s irresponsible to purposely utter false statements. Obviously you aren’t familiar with the striker safety on the VP 9, the safety features, how it works, how it can”t be defeated if used as OEM, how the rotating safety swivels as well as other safety features. The rotating safety alone will NOT move I don’t t care how much you beat on it. Please try and educate yourself on the VP9, and then re-enter the conversation.

[BCL]

Enel:

I’m not sure why you said you can make the striker fall without pulling the trigger by beating on it with a hammer? I guarantee you can’t make it go off with a hammer. I’m extremely familiar with this platform being an Armorer since it’s introduction into the market. This firearm was vetted for 4.5 years and has been through so many destructive tests, drop tests etc, too much to type by HK as well as many agencies in the European region. The GSG9 anti terror unit put the VP9 through tremendous tests as well for many months and it passed there criteria and now it’s their issue firearm. I will tell you that you are flat out wrong and it’s irresponsible to purposely utter false statements. Obviously you aren’t familiar with the striker safety on the VP 9, the safety features, how it works, how it can”t be defeated if used as OEM, how the rotating safety swivels as well as other safety features. The rotating safety alone will NOT move I don’t t care how much you beat on it. Please try and educate yourself on the VP9, and then re-enter the conversation.

Enel tested it on this forum last year, with a Youtube video:
https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?23227-Eric-s-Training-and-Gun-Testing-Journal&p=579013&viewfull=1#post579013


I dug into a few guns today.

The Sig 320 is really an ingenious design for drop safety. It is completely cocked, and has a pretty short take up. Less than a Glock or VP9.

I did notice that the sear could possibly release with a sharp stroke to the bottom of the gun. I have not tested this with a rubber mallet or anything so it is theoretical.

I tested it simply by pushing down on the striker catch and watching it go down without a trigger pull. The VP9 shares this vulnerability. A Glock or PPQ will not allow the striker catch to descend away from the striker tab without a trigger pull.

Even if the striker catch descended and released the striker on the VP9 or P320, in either case, the firing pin block would catch the firing pin assuming it was working. Perhaps this is how it is safe from such an impact.

I would appreciate anyone who understands the guts of these two pistols better to chime in.

The VP9 does indeed drop the striker. The P320 did not. The striker block caught the striker.



I spent a little time comparing take up on triggers as EL commented about how length of trigger pull can be more important than weight. A Glock and VP9 actually have decently long take up. The P320 is shorter than a PPQ slightly. A LEM trigger is longer, but not hugely more than a VP9. It would be interesting to compare the numbers.

None of the striker guns or the LEM is as easy to -not- shoot as the DA pull on a P226 Legion. Interestingly, none of the striker guns or LEM is as easy -to- shoot as the SA pull of the same Sig. I think I am starting to understand the appeal of TDA for carry.


https://youtu.be/GAiepTZ66Hs

[JAD]

I don’t care much for striker fired guns with no manual safety or means of controlling the striker. That has kept me from investigating the VP9, which has a lot of other stuff going for it.

[HCountyGuy]

Enel:

I’m not sure why you said you can make the striker fall without pulling the trigger by beating on it with a hammer? I guarantee you can’t make it go off with a hammer. I’m extremely familiar with this platform being an Armorer since it’s introduction into the market. This firearm was vetted for 4.5 years and has been through so many destructive tests, drop tests etc, too much to type by HK as well as many agencies in the European region. The GSG9 anti terror unit put the VP9 through tremendous tests as well for many months and it passed there criteria and now it’s their issue firearm. I will tell you that you are flat out wrong and it’s irresponsible to purposely utter false statements. Obviously you aren’t familiar with the striker safety on the VP 9, the safety features, how it works, how it can”t be defeated if used as OEM, how the rotating safety swivels as well as other safety features. The rotating safety alone will NOT move I don’t t care how much you beat on it. Please try and educate yourself on the VP9, and then re-enter the conversation.

You might ought to look in to the testing Enel has done with video documentation presented to us here on the forum.

Also he never said he was able to get it to “go off”, but rather could cause the striker to fall. The other safeties thus far keep the striker from contacting and igniting the primer, but the problem is that if you were to fall and bump the pistol just right you could have a dead trigger.

You may want to take your own “get educated” advice before coming unglued on someone with verifiable evidence of his claims.

[JBP55]

You might ought to look in to the testing Enel has done with video documentation presented to us here on the forum.

Also he never said he was able to get it to “go off”, but rather could cause the striker to fall. The other safeties thus far keep the striker from contacting and igniting the primer, but the problem is that if you were to fall and bump the pistol just right you could have a dead trigger.

You may want to take your own “get educated” advice before coming unglued on someone with verifiable evidence of his claims.

I would like to see this test done with a magazine in the VP9 and a dummy round in the chamber.

[MGW]

This is a Glock-centric forum so the VP9 doesn’t get much love around here.

It's a fairly Glock-centric world.

[JonInWA]

We've had a couple of comments recently on this thread that I think are worthy of further comment.

First, Pistol-Forum historically has been a straightforward, no-bs type forum, based substantively on empirical experience, and has always eschewed rampant fanboi-ism. Weapons and techniques are objectively measured in under the cold light of actual performance-no how much we, or others might be initially inclined to be predisposed towards a specific pistol, technique,, or piece of kit.

That doesn't mean that there isn't disagreement, but the vast majority of the time it's couched in a professional manner, and objectively supported. Sometimes we may "agree to disagree," but preferably in a professional, collegial manner that keeps the door open for future amicable discourse (and/or evidence).

Second, P-F member Enel performed a major service for the community on his investigation regarding the viability of the safety systems on the HK VP9, and very convincingly laid it out. The unfortunate reality is that manufacturers, for a variety of reasons simply cannot be totally relied upon regarding their assertions of their weapons' capabilities, performances, or safety. Some are more trustworthy on their face than others, but as ToddG and others here have pointed out, none are immune to failures in design, manufacture, quality control, and aftermarket customer support. None.

Third, additionally, it should be noted that manufacturers have been know to quietly change, replace, modify, and/or outsource components during a weapon's production cycle. And when I say "quietly," that means that it not unknown for their field representatives, trainers or national corporate structure in a given country to be kept in the dark-let alone end users and/or using organizations.

Any, and every weapon, technique, piece of kit, etc. will have constraints to their operating parameters. Individually and collectively we can increase in our knowledge so that we can make intelligent choices and selections.

Personally, I like and utilize HK (including an HK VP), Beretta, Glock and Ruger platforms primarily. But that's me, and my choices might be an anathema to others. But for my usage and operating parameters, I'm ok with that-but I always like to remain open-minded towards the informed opinions, experiences and expertise of of others. This forum has been a superb platform for that-and for me personally- and I'd like to see it continue.

Best, Jon

[Sensei]

Bellow is a picture of the M&P mag with rounds lodged together from a bottom view:
28060

That is an interesting picture. While I (and many others) have experienced a similar malfunction with the M&P45 using early generation magazine springs, this is the first report that I’ve seen in the M&P9 or 40.

[Peally]

That mallet thread was pretty stupid, sorry.

[HCM]

We've had a couple of comments recently on this thread that I think are worthy of further comment.

Some are more trustworthy on their face than others, but as ToddG and others here have pointed out, none are immune to failures in design, manufacture, quality control, and aftermarket customer support. None.

Third, additionally, it should be noted that manufacturers have been know to quietly change, replace, modify, and/or outsource components during a weapon's production cycle. And when I say "quietly," that means that it not unknown for their field representatives, trainers or national corporate structure in a given country to be kept in the dark-let alone end users and/or using organizations.



Quoted for truth.

[YVK]

That mallet thread was pretty stupid, sorry.

I didn't think so.

[Sensei]

I didn’t think that it was stupid per se, I just couldn’t reproduce the results on my N of 3.

[Doc_Glock]

Enel:

I’m not sure why you said you can make the striker fall without pulling the trigger by beating on it with a hammer? I guarantee you can’t make it go off with a hammer. I’m extremely familiar with this platform being an Armorer since it’s introduction into the market. This firearm was vetted for 4.5 years and has been through so many destructive tests, drop tests etc, too much to type by HK as well as many agencies in the European region. The GSG9 anti terror unit put the VP9 through tremendous tests as well for many months and it passed there criteria and now it’s their issue firearm. I will tell you that you are flat out wrong and it’s irresponsible to purposely utter false statements. Obviously you aren’t familiar with the striker safety on the VP 9, the safety features, how it works, how it can”t be defeated if used as OEM, how the rotating safety swivels as well as other safety features. The rotating safety alone will NOT move I don’t t care how much you beat on it. Please try and educate yourself on the VP9, and then re-enter the conversation.

I never said it would fire. It won’t. Unlike the P320.


https://youtu.be/GAiepTZ66Hs

You will get a dead trigger and I was able to reproduce my findings on one other sample. It takes a hard hit and is unlikely to be a real world issue but for me the VP9 was not compelling enough otherwise to stay with it.

Try it for yourself.

A PPQ will also drop its striker with much less of a hit. It also will not fire.
JonInWA, As far as failures to lock back and or auto forwarding: my experience is 2x P30l, P30, and VP9 all suffered from this. A friend’s VP9 has had problems locking back to the point where it took a trip back to HK without any resolution. He still carries it though because love.

I am pretty sure it is grip related on the failures to lock back, but it truly takes very little pressure to activate the slide releases on these. I believe some folks have ground them shorter in an attempt to improve the behavior.

[pastaslinger]

The VP9 has massive slide stops so it could be related to that. I find it hard to believe that there would be a mechanical reason for the gun to not lock back.

[Doc_Glock]

The VP9 has massive slide stops so it could be related to that. I find it hard to believe that there would be a mechanical reason for the gun to not lock back.

Yes. The long bilateral stock levers give a long lever arm which makes it very easy to release and perhaps not as solid on locking back.

Anyway that is a nit. It is a fabulous pistol, best ever? Depends on your fanboi status.