Steyr M and S Series

[TGS]

The Russian gun-handling thread got me thinking of all the different SFA guns out there.

Why don't we ever hear about the Steyr M and S guns?

They're designed by an ex-Glock engineer for Steyr, and feature a trigger that would rival the PPQ. However, no one ever got a hard on for the Steyr, unlike the PPQ. They're being imported again, so I just wanted to generate some discussion about this pistol.

Any high round count data on it? Shooting experiences?
594

[JodyH]

The one I had (M9?) suffered from frequent failures to extract and the triangle sights sucked with no alternatives available.

Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk

[TGS]

http://www.opticsplanet.net/trijicon-steyr-mannlicher-m-a1-3-dot-front-rear-night-sight-set-st01.html

Trijicon currently makes sights for it, so at least that part can be remedied.


Do you know if the FTE problem was widespread and recurring, or a teething issue? Or was yours just a lemon?

[JDM]

For a while I was amassing a collection of .357SIG pistols, and had an M357. I found it rather agreeable, but obviously not enough to keep it. I shot it very little, so no data there.

[TGS]

For a while I was amassing a collection of .357SIG pistols, and had an M357. I found it rather agreeable, but obviously not enough to keep it. I shot it very little, so no data there.

What characteristics made you want to sell it and keep the Glock/M&P/SIG/HK or whatever else you were using? Something about the grip? Trigger? Mag release? Or was it more related to aftermarket support?

[JDM]

What characteristics made you want to sell it and keep the Glock/M&P/SIG/HK or whatever else you were using? Something about the grip? Trigger? Mag release? Or was it more related to aftermarket support?

I sold it when I came to my senses and realized a safe full of guns was nonsense, and was preventing me from becoming a good shooter.

I didn't elect to keep the Styer because when I was selling everything and starting over, Styer wasn't importing anything for their pistols anymore and I thought the ship had sailed so to speak. I settled on the M&P because of aftermarket support almost entirely. I don't remember the last time I saw a Styer mag at the LGS, whereas they have M&P mags for sale by the pound.

[1986s4]

http://www.opticsplanet.net/trijicon-steyr-mannlicher-m-a1-3-dot-front-rear-night-sight-set-st01.html

Trijicon currently makes sights for it, so at least that part can be remedied.


Do you know if the FTE problem was widespread and recurring, or a teething issue? Or was yours just a lemon?

I had two; an M40 and M9. Both had great shooting characteristics but lousy extraction characteristics, as in consistent FTE. Several trips to Steyr made no difference so I rid myself of them. No more Steyr for me.

[JodyH]

I cured the extraction issues with a homemade extractor spring insert made from a nitrile O-ring (similar to the AR extractor spring inserts).
The Steyr just wasn't worth the effort it took to get parts, holsters, magazines or parts when compared to a Glock or even my P99 at the time (and the P99 was a pain to buy for back then).

[Cecil Burch]

I had an M9 for a while.

It felt great in my hand, the sights did not bother me too much, and the trigger was really good. I got rid of it for two reasons:

1) the support and aftermarket - At the time (2008ish) Steyr seemed to be out of the US market, and it was a bear to find holsters or even magazines. Just not worth the hassle. To be fair, when I found out I needed an extractor upgrade, Steyr customer service took great care of me and sent the part out fast. I just didn't know if they were going to be around for the long haul if I needed other parts.

2) FTE - the pistol had a weird tendency to sometimes FTE, but only with Remington ammo. And to make it even more frustrating, it was not a consistent stoppage. I could go a couple hundred rounds with nothing, and then BAM, a couple right in a row. On the Steyr forum, it seemed to be widely acknowledged that the gun had issues with Remington brand stuff. They just all suggested running Winchester/Federal/Hornady/Corbon whatever, and ignore Remington. For me, I just could not trust a gun like that. Again, to be fair, I never had a single problem with any other brand. It still was just too much for me to live with. I sold it to a guy who had no problem with running other brands.

[JonInWA]

I had a Steyr M40 for several years. My initial premise/hope was that it would be sort of a "product improved" Glock G23. Mine was an early production one, warranting a trip to Trussville for the improved trigger, which came back with a nice, consistant trigger pull. I actually liked, and performed reasonably decently with the OEM triangle-trapezoidal sights. The gun's ergos were actually quite good. However, the devil was in the operational details, notably extraction issues. I repeatedly had sporadic (but continual) issues with extraction/extraction jams. This was a systemmic problem with these "first generation Steyrs; I believe that the problem(s) was eridicated in subsequent (and current) production varients. If I wasn't pleased with my current Gen 3 Glocks, I might consider trying one of the current production 9mm versions, but I'm reluctant to peersonally recommend them based on my previous experience with the earlier version.

Best, Jon

[Chris Rhines]

My early Steyr M40 was horribly unreliable (again, extraction issues), and I've seen several other M-series guns that shared the trait.

-C

[CK1]

I had a couple different M9-A1's and didn't experience any of the issues guys are mentioning here, though I was well aware there were examples out there having some of the problems described.
I probably put 6k through one of them, and maybe 3k through the other without any stoppages at all.

Their ergos are maybe second to none even now (it was designed a while ago at this point), and there are many "smart" and/or unique features with them. The big thing though is that quality-wise they're put together as good or better than an H&K and for the money they may actually be a bargain compared to anything similarly built. Their grip somehow manages to fit everybody even without needing removable backstraps, and though the grip angle is quite radical (111 degrees, I think more extreme than a Glock's), since their bore-axis is lower than just about anything else out there, they sit in the hand like no other and point as naturally as pointing one's finger, yet, I never heard of anyone complaining of it "pointing high" like you hear with Glocks from many people.

Now all that said, there were some caveats: first off, for me, their slide-release lever protrudes too much if one uses a high thumbs-forward grip... the guys who like the Glock extended slide-release lever may love it as it's pretty much an improved design take on that, but IMHO it's actually too easy to hit inadvertently and is unnecessarily intrusive (much like a P30's or PPQ's), but hey, I think the Glock stock slide-release is the s**t as it's out of the way until slide-lock, and then suddenly is a perfect size to hit every time all at once (JMO, YMMV).
Second though is the real killer (at least for me), after shooting them for a while and finding it extremely annoying, then getting familiar with detail-stripping the gun and getting familiar with how it works, it becomes apparent that there is a slight/major inherent design flaw present. Their triggers tend to be fantastic for a striker-fired pistol, better than a PPQ's really, except just NOT consistently; 9 out of 10 pulls will be consistent and awesome, then the 10th may be 2+lbs heavier and crunchy... Due to the way their strikers are captured in the design there's a condition where the striker-spring gets pre-cocked while cycling and a retaining-washer that is somewhat like a Glock's spring-cups can land on it's seam... Voila: grit and added pull-weight at random... no bueno.

I believe the design has been updated recently with a roll-pin under the rear sight at the back of the slide that works to decrease the striker landing and then pre-loading in that state... I've played with one, and while it might be better, the hitch is still there as the same "great, great, great, great, CRAP, great, great, etc" trigger-pull inconsistency is still present.

Overall, I like 'em and there are many far worse pistols out there, but I like consistency so they're in the rear-view for me. Though, if they'd update them just a little more to nix the trigger inconsistency and offer a less intrusive slide-release, I'd be shooting one for sure.

P.S - they all got the same strength (stiff) recoil-spring whether 9mm, .40 or .357... IMO this contributed heavily to guys having extraction/ejecting issues with them... Lots of them kind of had the Glock Gen4 RSA issues before the Gen4's if you will...

[mrozowjj]

I have a M9-A1 and I like it a lot. At the time I bought it I shot it better than any of my other guns but this was before I got into IDPA and USPSA. I had an intention of shooting it in a match but finding a good holster and mag pouches was impossible. That was right when they were pulling the out of the US market so finding mags was getting to be difficult.

I didn't put a high round count on the gun at all but I had a few FTEs that seemed to be cured when Steyr shipped me a new extractor.

One range visit I had noticed the trigger failed to reset a few times and then I had the gun double once. Sent it to factory immediately. They fixed it promptly and had it back to me in a week or two but I have no idea what they did to it to correct that or why it happened in the first place.

I know you're thinking that sounds like a lot of negatives for someone that supposedly likes the gun but even with all those problems it's still just a neat gun. No I wouldn't trust my life to it and I can't really shoot it in competitions but it felt good in my hand, accurate, had a low bore so it had little muzzle flip, had a good trigger, and while a bit of a novelty I loved the triangle sights.

It was designed by the same guy that designed the new Caracal pistol.