What was the model 27/28 reputation from the past?

[314159]

For those with the memory/experiences/studies of the old days of police work:

What was the daily user's opinion of the S&W Model 27 or 28 way back when?

Too darn heavy to carry, great for the hard kicking magnums, awkward due to the weight, better/worse than the Python; that sort of stuff. I've always liked the 3.5 inch 27's and a good friend has a Highway Patrolman I've always admired but how many agencies issued them and how successful were they as an issue piece?

[FNFAN]

I started out with a 6 1/2" Model 27. It and later a 4" 66 went to 300 Gunsmithing in Denver for action work. The Model 27 initially rode in a Safariland swivel holster which was replaced by a Hoyt breakfront. Weight was never a problem, bulk was. That gun in the Hoyt was much akin to having a small cased violin hanging off your belt. I enjoyed carrying the 66 much more and still have it. The 27 was lost in a burglary.

I had a 5" 27 which I gave to my son last year as a post-deployment "Welcome Home" gift. I have my Dad's 3 1/2" 27 after he passed last fall and just this week picked up some very pretty Hogue's for it. Dad had a set of my old duty Pachmayrs on it and it accompanied him on many road trips and vacations over the years. I'm still waffling on putting on the Hogue's and I may just take some pics of it wearing the pretty wood and put the Pach's back on it. It's still Dad's gun, I'm just its caretaker. I have a 4" 28 which is in great shape and is a very accurate gun, it doesn't get shot often and I don't really have any history or attachment to it, but it was one of those "too good to pass-up" deal's.

I highly recommend the N frame guns for shooting quantities of magnum ammo, they'll stay in service and keep their action timing longer than the Python or lighter frame guns. The 3 1/2" guns look and balance great!

[zero67]

I carried a 5" 27-2 for many years back in the day and loved it. Still do. When I was transferred to an investigative unit I changed to a 3 1/2" barrel and carried it in a custom made shoulder holster. Yeah the N Frame is quite a bit heavier than the K Frame, but I find it a lot easier to keep the front sight on target because of that weight. Eventually we were issued Berettas and later Sigs, but I still love my 27.

The Model 28 Highway Patrolman is, to my knowledge, the same gun without the beautiful finish. They were issued to a lot of agencies and most were very happy with them, as I recall.

[Wayne Dobbs]

Everything was too heavy to carry for the capacity back then, but that's looking back having the polymer striker fired pistols in our frame of reference. The Model 27/28 was viewed as a top choice for shooting lots of .357 Magnum or as an impact weapon (and that's not a joke). The level of quality was usually top notch and you could get the grips you wanted, action jobs, etc. to create a great duty gun. This may create a storm, but it's the truth: they're still a viable choice today as a duty gun. You needed to know how to shoot well, not a lot. That's a lesson that lots of folks need to learn today.

[TheNewbie]

Everything was too heavy to carry for the capacity back then, but that's looking back having the polymer striker fired pistols in our frame of reference. The Model 27/28 was viewed as a top choice for shooting lots of .357 Magnum or as an impact weapon (and that's not a joke). The level of quality was usually top notch and you could get the grips you wanted, action jobs, etc. to create a great duty gun. This may create a storm, but it's the truth: they're still a viable choice today as a duty gun. You needed to know how to shoot well, not a lot. That's a lesson that lots of folks need to learn today.

Would you say the same about a K frame ?

Side note for fun-I work with a guy who carries a Model 19. It's in a holster not suitable for duty use and he carries his speedloaders on the back of his belt, above his butt.

[Hambo]

Everything was too heavy to carry for the capacity back then, but that's looking back having the polymer striker fired pistols in our frame of reference. The Model 27/28 was viewed as a top choice for shooting lots of .357 Magnum or as an impact weapon (and that's not a joke). The level of quality was usually top notch and you could get the grips you wanted, action jobs, etc. to create a great duty gun. This may create a storm, but it's the truth: they're still a viable choice today as a duty gun. You needed to know how to shoot well, not a lot. That's a lesson that lots of folks need to learn today.

I wish I could hit the like button a lot more.

[Pistol Pete 10]

27 and 28 are as good as it gets. I like the 19 better for carry tho.

[Lester Polfus]

I wish I could hit the like button a lot more.

Wayne's post made me wish we had an "amen" button in addition to a "like" button.

[Dagga Boy]

Although not a 27/28, I did carry an N frame .45 Long Colt S&W revolver in both a 4 and 5 inch for several years as a cop during some of the busiest crime periods in the last 50 years. All but 2 officers I knew of in an agency of around 200-250 officers carried the optional N frames on duty. Here is my take. A different gun for a different time. Cops shot a lot back then. Not as far as round counts, but frequency. We qualified monthly. Most practiced at least bi weekly. Shooting awards on uniforms actually meant something and were a sign of your prowess as a cop. Competition based around shooting was common, although declining significantly in my time. You didn’t get new guns. Often, in the middle of the 20th century, you carried and shot the same duty gun for 30 years. “Armorers” were like today’s master gunsmiths in many large agencies. Prior to the mid 70’s and an influx of folks who were smaller physically, females, and recruits from non-shooting backgrounds or cultures, ammo changed. You saw a HUGE swing away from Magnum calibers as duty and training loads and a complete domination by the K frame sized guns as cops changed. Weight wasn’t a huge factor, as we didn’t carry as much crap, and with physically large officers, N frames simply felt good. Yes, we also hit a lot of folks with guns, and N frames were great as an expedient impact weapon. My old duty gun has teeth marks in the trigger guard and earned the nickname “The Hebrew Hammer” from an incident as a trainee cracking a felon with it.
Training was often done with the 27/28’s and their precursors with full house magnum ammunition that was hot. Those N frames were built for big bores and magnums. One of the best police rounds ever made, the .41 Magnum essentially failed because of a lack of a “special” round and it was only in an N frame in a time when the size of cops who could handle a Magnum loaded N frame shot regularly was declining. When I was a kid in Los Angeles in the 60’s, LAPD cops were huge. Usually well over 6 feet and a ton were true greatest generation veterans of both WW2 and/ or Korea. Totally different kind of cop. N frames in agencies that did not issue them tended to be a sign of a “Gun Guy”. I have a 3.5”Registered Magnum from LAPD. The folks who remembered the guns said they remember 2 cops who carried them and both were very serious gunfighters who had shot a ton of crooks......sort of says something.
Today, with my arthritis issues, my true shooting service revolver is a beat old Model 28. It is a gun I love to both shoot and run with .38. I have 100%’d the LAPD Swat qualification with it in the last two Revovler Round Ups. I would have zero issue with taking that gun to a fight, especially loaded up with hot .357.
Overall....glorious guns and the N frame Smith’s are simply a thing I absolutely love in the firearms world over everything else.

[Lester Polfus]

As an aside, I'm planning on buying myself a .357 for my birthday this fall. While there's a pretty good chance that will be a used GP100, I am seeing Model 28s with some finish wear going for some very reasonable prices on Gunbroker.

[Trooper224]

For those with the memory/experiences/studies of the old days of police work:

What was the daily user's opinion of the S&W Model 27 or 28 way back when?

Too darn heavy to carry, great for the hard kicking magnums, awkward due to the weight, better/worse than the Python; that sort of stuff. I've always liked the 3.5 inch 27's and a good friend has a Highway Patrolman I've always admired but how many agencies issued them and how successful were they as an issue piece?

I started my career with a four inch 27. This was in 91-92 when the revolver was largely being replaced with semi-autos, but the small dept. I started with mandated revolvers in .38 or .357. If you carried a wheel gun at the time it was likely an S&W 686 or maybe a GP100, so my big N Frame was something of an anachronism even then. I got a lot of crap for it from some of the guys I worked with concerning my big cannon, but I was also one of the few that wore a "revolver expert" pin on my uniform when it meant something. The N Frame fit my big hands as if it was tailored made and full power magnum loads were like +P .38s, gargantuan muzzle blast not withstanding. It served me very well until I went to work for the staties and had to carry the mandated weapon.


Was it heavy? Yeah, but I was young and tough and could have cared less, nor did I have to contend with the additional thirty pounds of crap I carry today. I never had a single problem with it and it kept on keeping on when lighter guns were in need of service. I loved that gun and one of the biggest mistakes I've ever made was trading it off. I thought it was awesome and still do. If I was told I'd have to carry one again, I wouldn't voice approval but I wouldn't lose any sleep over it. The 27 served me very well on a couple of defining occasions and I have no doubt it could do so again. I just got back from the range and a session with my new to me Model 29 and it reminds me that I actually miss carrying a wheel gun, on serval non-logical levels.

[1slow]

When I was 12 years old in 1969, my Dad started me shooting with a 6" S&W Model 28. We shot everything from Super Vel to .38 Special. I never saw the recoil problem with a N frame and .357 loads. This opinion did not make me universally popular with other shooters.

I always lusted after a 27 but by the time I could afford one i had read a lot of Elmer Keith and bought several 4" pinned counter sunk .44 Magnum S&W#29s .

[OlongJohnson]

Did they ever get out of time with a lot of rapid fire DA and the heavy cylinder?

[Zeke38]

Yes they did. Started carrying a 28 on duty in 72. Heavy, accurate, reliable. Guys tried the 27/28s in PPC we had no ICORE, IPSC, IDPA and found that hundreds of fast DA rolling of the cylinder then stops egg shaped the cylinder notches. They also wouldn't take the longer 170 grain plus bullets, short cylinders.

Two more reasons for L Frames. Soon as I went to work for a Sheriff's Office I switched to 44s in 4" 29s. Couple ounces lighter and easier to shoot, less muzzle flash and report. Think single wide trailer house interior, with flame throwing, 357s damage hearing. No one guy who touched a 357 SuperVel off inside one of those tin boxes and he is still deaf as a stone 40 years later.

Carried the old Remington 240 FN at 1,000 fps and it was accurate with good recoil recovery. Also good for putting down injured big game due to big game/ car accidents.

If you're going to carry an N frame may the caliber begin with 4.

[HeavyDuty]

I always wanted a 28 back in the pre-semi auto days, but never managed to acquire one. I did get a chance to play with a friend’s 4” 629 alongside my 69a few months ago, and the N’s larger size was much more apparent than I expected. I’d still love a 58, though!

[RevolverRob]

There's still plenty of revolvers on my "want" list. And most of them are N-Frame Smiths.

A Registered Magnum.
A 3.5" M27.
A pair of M58s, a San Antonio PD one and a San Francisco PD one.
A 4" and 6" M29
And of course a smattering of 8-shooters and 6-shooters in .45 LC and ACP.

[Trooper224]

Did they ever get out of time with a lot of rapid fire DA and the heavy cylinder?

Only from heavy competition use. Just like the 29 started having problems when competitors in metallic silhouette shooting began pounding them repeatedly with heavy loads they weren't designed for. Stretch anything past its intended use and you'll have problems, shocking but true. You could encounter timing issues with a 27/28 but under normal duty type use it would take a long time to get there.

[Zeke38]

Trooper 224, you are correct about stressing the weapon through rapid fire DA. I rebuilt a friends Pre 27 as the old weapon had "major pushoff" and headspace problems. Asked him how many rounds he had put through it. His answer " 2 five gallon bucket loads of lead"! Asked him how many rounds and he said " 37,000 plus or minus a hundred". Then I asked him How many were Magnums? Answer: " All of em, I got 38s for shooting 38s.

The 357 was an 8 3/8s barreled model and I watched him make a head on chest shot on a Coyote at 152 yards, one round fired, one dead coyote. Stepped off the distance, days before laser range finders. The guy was an old rancher here in Idaho and was a great shot.

[TheNewbie]

Trooper 224, you are correct about stressing the weapon through rapid fire DA. I rebuilt a friends Pre 27 as the old weapon had "major pushoff" and headspace problems. Asked him how many rounds he had put through it. His answer " 2 five gallon bucket loads of lead"! Asked him how many rounds and he said " 37,000 plus or minus a hundred". Then I asked him How many were Magnums? Answer: " All of em, I got 38s for shooting 38s.

The 357 was an 8 3/8s barreled model and I watched him make a head on chest shot on a Coyote at 152 yards, one round fired, one dead coyote. Stepped off the distance, days before laser range finders. The guy was an old rancher here in Idaho and was a great shot.

That's beyond impressive.

How much magnum shooting could K frames endure compared to an L or an N.

[deputyG23]

I have passed up too many reasonably priced N frames in the last few years. One was a M58 with funky aftermarket stocks in a LGS in Fredericksburg, VA priced at $495. I didn’t want to add another caliber to the reloading list.
A finish worn 4” M28 with Magna stocks turned up at a LGS in Mechanicsville, VA on the consignment shelf for $475 about two years ago. Didn’t bite on that one either..Regretting both decisions now.

[Hambo]

That's beyond impressive.

How much magnum shooting could K frames endure compared to an L or an N.

I doubt it's a linear progression, but N>L>K.

[Stephanie B]

That's beyond impressive.

How much magnum shooting could K frames endure compared to an L or an N.

I doubt it's a linear progression, but N>L>K.

As most of us already know, even moreso with lighter bullets.

[w provence]

My first security job, when I was a kid, growing up in Texarkana was an ole pickle plant. It was spooky at night with all the open vats full of vinegar and cucumbers. It was a comfort carrying my old 4" model 28.

[Trooper224]

Trooper 224, you are correct about stressing the weapon through rapid fire DA. I rebuilt a friends Pre 27 as the old weapon had "major pushoff" and headspace problems. Asked him how many rounds he had put through it. His answer " 2 five gallon bucket loads of lead"! Asked him how many rounds and he said " 37,000 plus or minus a hundred". Then I asked him How many were Magnums? Answer: " All of em, I got 38s for shooting 38s.

The 357 was an 8 3/8s barreled model and I watched him make a head on chest shot on a Coyote at 152 yards, one round fired, one dead coyote. Stepped off the distance, days before laser range finders. The guy was an old rancher here in Idaho and was a great shot.

I'd say that's beyond getting your moneys worth. Discussions like this bring up interesting points. Back in the day (I hate using that expression but find myself doing so more and more.) we understood that guns were machines and like any machine it would eventually need maintenance. Today, we've gotten so indoctrinated to a disposable society that any thought of maintenance and/or upkeep gives people the vapors. Even the most routine maintenance issues seem foreign and lend a sense of trepidation. I've lost count of the times coworkers have brought personally owned weapons to me for issues they could have figured out themselves with a simple Google search. It's as if we've been conditioned to avoid even making the effort.

[Trooper224]

I have passed up too many reasonably priced N frames in the last few years. One was a M58 with funky aftermarket stocks in a LGS in Fredericksburg, VA priced at $495. I didn’t want to add another caliber to the reloading list.
A finish worn 4” M28 with Magna stocks turned up at a LGS in Mechanicsville, VA on the consignment shelf for $475 about two years ago. Didn’t bite on that one either..Regretting both decisions now.

I'm at a point now where I have a hard time passing up an N Frame Smith. They're my favorite handguns and stir my soul like nothing else.

[OlongJohnson]

I've lost count of the times coworkers have brought personally owned weapons to me for issues they could have figured out themselves with a simple Google search. It's as if we've been conditioned to avoid even making the effort.

Or read too many 37-page threads about the horrible fates that befall people who dare to work on their own firearms.

[Dagga Boy]

Just to emphasize.....cops won a ton of Gunfights with serious criminals with these things for a lot of years. You do your part, they’ll do theirs.

[Trooper224]

Or read too many 37-page threads about the horrible fates that befall people who dare to work on their own firearms.

True, but when it's literally something as simple as turning a screw it's hardly in the same league.

[Dagga Boy]

These things are also capable of wonderous work. This was the first 6 rounds at ten yards when I got this $425 Old Model 28 back from Frank Glen. Good duty action job and a well done muzzle crown.

[Trooper224]

These things are also capable of wonderous work. This was the first 6 rounds at ten yards when I got this $425 Old Model 28 back from Frank Glen. Good duty action job and a well done muzzle crown.

Man DB, those grips are retro. :)

[BehindBlueI's]

Or read too many 37-page threads about the horrible fates that befall people who dare to work on their own firearms.

What thread says "don't maintain your guns" ?

[Hambo]

Man DB, those grips are retro. :)

They should have been the factory grips. I was green as grass but I knew I hated the factory grips on my 586. I'm not sure what I was looking for, but fortunately a friend of mine who was a gunsmith pointed me to a set of those Rogers grips.

[CWM11B]

A 3.5 inch 27 is on my someday list, as is a model 57

[Joe in PNG]

A 3.5 inch 27 is on my someday list

Same here.

[Stephanie B]

A 3.5 inch 27 is on my someday list, as is a model 57

One of my eternal regrets is passing over the 4” M28s that were sold off by the New York State police in the early 1980s.

(What I don’t regret is passing over a 4” M28 that was offered for sale at a swap meet for $400. It was well out of time and had quite a bit of rust.)

[CWM11B]

One of the MANY boneheaded things I've done in my 50+ years on this mudball is selling a 6" 27 years ago.

[Dagga Boy]

Man DB, those grips are retro. :)

My favorite work grips. Used them on everything.

[TheNewbie]

My favorite work grips. Used them on everything.

What grips are they ? Can you still get them or something similar?

[Trooper224]

They should have been the factory grips. I was green as grass but I knew I hated the factory grips on my 586. I'm not sure what I was looking for, but fortunately a friend of mine who was a gunsmith pointed me to a set of those Rogers grips.

We all hated the factory grips and the first thing most of us did was toss them in the trash. That's why one of the lousy sets we could buy for ten dollars in the 80's is worth over a hundred today.

[Trooper224]

What grips are they ? Can you still get them or something similar?

Some of the original hard plastic Hogues I believe.

[Dagga Boy]

Some of the original hard plastic Hogues I believe.

Nope, Rogers which later became Safariland grips.

[andre3k]

Just to emphasize.....cops won a ton of Gunfights with serious criminals with these things for a lot of years. You do your part, they’ll do theirs.

Truth.

This picture was taken last month and this is at a very large agency. There are revolvers still in use out here.



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[Bushytale]

Hogue makes a set of nylon grips like the rubber ones that are a similar design to the Rogers/Safariland as are their wood grips.
I recently acquired a 2 1/2 inch 66-1 that had an early Hogue grip of wood look composite.

To the 27/28 question. In the early '70s I purchased a 5 inch 27 that had been a northern State Police issue. Can't seem to remember which agency it was from. It was a 5 screw that had been re-blued very professionally. The smoothest unmodified action I have ever in-countered. I shot it extensively for four or five years before stupidly trading it while at Colorado School of Trades in Denver. I got two guns for it, but have always regretted getting rid of it. I recently picked up a very fresh 4 inch 28-2 to fill the void.

[wvincent]

Truth.

This picture was taken last month and this is at a very large agency. There are revolvers still in use out here.



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Judging by the boots I'm guessing mounted patrol, the four legged kind?
That would be a sweet gig.

[Wayne Dobbs]

27 and 28 are as good as it gets. I like the 19 better for carry tho.

I love the Model 19 myself and found that it's lighter weight and seemed to be fast handling. As a very young (21 YOA) cop, I carried and shot one a lot. It became obvious very quickly that shooting lots of Magnum ammo in the gun was very hard on it from the endshake, timing and forcing cone wear imparted. When you get a clue about the 19, you realize it's a .38 Special you can shoot a few Magnums through, but not many. Bill Jordan, the father of the Combat Magnum (the real name for the gun), said that from the start.

[andre3k]

Judging by the boots I'm guessing mounted patrol, the four legged kind?
That would be a sweet gig.Close...Motors...same boots pretty much. The mounted guys will wear spurs on theirs.

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[Trooper224]

Truth.

This picture was taken last month and this is at a very large agency. There are revolvers still in use out here.



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I'd like to know that officers background and assignment. Even though I'm a revolver lover, they wouldn't be my first choice as a duty weapon in modern LE work, but they can still do good work if required. On the other hand, I question the lack of speed loaders. Just a belt slide?

[Rock185]

The Model 27/28 reputations were excellent. We were authorized to carry 4" S&Ws or Colts. Most carried the issue S&W Model 10s and 64s. Those who carried their own guns carried S&W Model 19s for the most part. A few guys carried Pythons. I don't think most considered one or the other better, just personal preference. A few guys carried Model 28s, but I never saw anyone carrying Model 27s. I bought a new Model 28-2 back in the day, and considered it to be every bit as good as the 27s I owned. The 28 got away from me somewhere along the way, but I still have the 27-2 I bought new in the '70s.

[Trooper224]

The Model 27/28 reputations were excellent. We were authorized to carry 4" S&Ws or Colts. Most carried the issue S&W Model 10s and 64s. Those who carried their own guns carried S&W Model 19s for the most part. A few guys carried Pythons. I don't think most considered one or the other better, just personal preference. A few guys carried Model 28s, but I never saw anyone carrying Model 27s. I bought a new Model 28-2 back in the day, and considered it to be every bit as good as the 27s I owned. The 28 got away from me somewhere along the way, but I still have the 27-2 I bought new in the '70s.

5 inch? Sexy.

[wvincent]

Quick question, what is an "overstamped" 27-1? What changes does it signify?

[Bergeron]

I was able to rent a 3.5" 27 about 5 years back. I was very suprised that such a gun would be sitting there on the rental shelf, and couldn't pass up the opportunity. The owner insisted that only .357 Magnum be fired out of the gun, so I gave it a go to see what it would all be about.

I also rented a CCF Raceframe metal Glock 22 and a M&P .45 for further comparison. The Smith's sights were crisp, the trigger was smooth, and it gave me the impression of impressive accuracy. I was unaccustomed to proper support hand thumb placement for a double action revolver, and when my grip was combined with the .357 ammo, I found it difficult to shoot the gun as quickly as the autopistols that I was more familiar with shooting.

Great fun, though. Putting .357s right where I wanted them was a pleasure, although double action revolvers are unlikely to capture my interest.

[Stephanie B]

There is a nice 6” 27 at a LGS for eight bills. There’s also a Mini-14 for six, but when I add in the need to buy mags and ammo for it, it’s a wash.

Decisions, decisions.


Damn the iPhone Typos!

[Stephanie B]

There is a nice 6” 27 at a LGS for eight bills. There’s also a Mini-14 for six, but when I add in the need to buy mags and ammo for it, it’s a wash.

Decisions, decisions.

Opinions, anyone?

[HeavyDuty]

Of the two, my choice would be the 27 hands down.

[NPV]

Opinions, anyone?

I'd get the Model 27 if it were at my LGS.

[deputyG23]

There is a nice 6” 27 at a LGS for eight bills. There’s also a Mini-14 for six, but when I add in the need to buy mags and ammo for it, it’s a wash.

Decisions, decisions.


Damn the iPhone Typos!
M27 for sure. No hesitation.

[OlongJohnson]

The Mini is a rabbit hole of just the right spec and getting the setup all dialed in.

[JAD]

There is a nice 6” 27 at a LGS for eight bills.

All day and twice on Sunday. The Mini 14 has that Hannibal Smith cache, but the N frame outclasses it by a mile.

[Duelist]

Opinions, anyone?

Being that I just had my LGS put a 28-2 back for me (less than $700), I think you may parse my answer.

[Stephanie B]

All right, fine! If it’s still there tomorrow....

Damn the iPhone Typos!

[Lester Polfus]

Sounds like your mind is made up, but I'd point out that they don't make Model 27's anymore, and you can buy a Mini-14 anytime you want.

[Trooper224]

Opinions, anyone?

Opinion? Model 27 and Mini-14 should never be put into the same sentence. :)

[Bushytale]

There is a nice 6” 27 at a LGS for eight bills. There’s also a Mini-14 for six, but when I add in the need to buy mags and ammo for it, it’s a wash.

Decisions, decisions.


Damn the iPhone Typos!

This will probably annoy the Ruger fans, but the Mini-14 is very magazine sensitive and parts difficult, a poor choice compared to a good AR-15.
Go for the 27.

[1slow]

Circa 1980: had 2 Mini14s and 12 factory 20 round mags.
Mini 14 will not stand being run hard, parts and accuracy are a problem compared to any AR-15 or any other decent real military rifle.

[LOBO]

Quick question, what is an "overstamped" 27-1? What changes does it signify?

Below is what an overstamped model number looks like. It's just a factory "boo-boo".

http://i66.tinypic.com/2wdyccx.jpg

[HCM]

Circa 1980: had 2 Mini14s and 12 factory 20 round mags.
Mini 14 will not stand being run hard, parts and accuracy are a problem compared to any AR-15 or any other decent real military rifle.

26609

[wvincent]

Below is what an overstamped model number looks like. It's just a factory "boo-boo".

http://i66.tinypic.com/2wdyccx.jpg

Wow, they sure seem to make a big deal out of it on GB, like Christ lubed it with his own tears or something.
Thanks for clearing that up.

ETA: I'm still going to bid on it, but at least now I can possibly maintain some semblance of self control.

[Stephanie B]

This will probably annoy the Ruger fans, but the Mini-14 is very magazine sensitive and parts difficult, a poor choice compared to a good AR-15.
Go for the 27.

Thanks to everyone for keeping me from making an expensive mistake.

https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?31398-Mini-14-failure-to-feed

[That Guy]

For what it's worth, I still like my Mini-14. I wouldn't choose it for any serious use, but it's fun to shoot at the range. Not every gun has to be for serious business only.

If you are looking for a fun gun, follow your heart. If you are looking for a tool to use in high stakes situations, follow your head.

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[Nephrology]

Love this gun. Will never sell it.

https://i.imgur.com/KSCxRYB.jpg?1

[NPV]

Well I just went ahead and bought a Model 28 off GB, looks to have been barely used. I will report back once I have it in hand.

I directly attribute this purchase to this thread........thanks all
27068
27069
27070
27071
27072

[HeavyDuty]

Well I just went ahead and bought a Model 28 off GB, looks to have been barely used. I will report back once I have it in hand.

I directly attribute this purchase to this thread........thanks all
27068
27069
27070
27071
27072

Looks like a beauty!

[farscott]

Quick question, what is an "overstamped" 27-1? What changes does it signify?

Here is the complete list of S&W M27 engineering changes.

27-1 (1960) Change extractor rod, right hand to left hand thread.
27-2 (1961) Cylinder stop changed, eliminate trigger guard screw.
1967 6 1/2" barrel discontinued
1968 Delete diamond grip
1969 Change to N serial prefix
1975 Target hammer, target trigger patridge front sight on 6" and 8 3/8" barrels, introduced with Goncalo Alves target stocks and case
1979 3 1/2" and 5" barrels discontinued, 4" introduced with red ramp and white outline rear sight
1980 Target stocks standard.
27-3 (1982) Eliminate cylinder counterbore and pinned barrel.
1986 Discontinue nickel finish
27-4 (1988) New yoke retention system.
27-5 (1990) Longer stop notch in cylinder.
1992 Discontinue 4" and 8 3/8" barrels.
27-6 (1993) Hogue grips, drill and tap frame, change rear sight leaf, change extractor.
1994 Model 27 discontinued.
27-7 (2000) Performance Center version built on new N frame with floating firing pin and extended frame lug.

So the 27-1 indicates the change to left-hand thread on the ejector rod to stop it from unscrewing under recoil and tying up the gun. The 27-1 variant was made for only a year and is very collectible. The "overstamped" may indicate a forgery or that S&W did the 27-1 upgrade before shipping. As a more common 27-2 cylinder assembly could have been fitted, it is very hard to determine if a 27-1 is original without paying for a "historical research" letter from S&W.

[wvincent]

Here is the complete list of S&W M27 engineering changes.

27-1 (1960) Change extractor rod, right hand to left hand thread.
27-2 (1961) Cylinder stop changed, eliminate trigger guard screw.
1967 6 1/2" barrel discontinued
1968 Delete diamond grip
1969 Change to N serial prefix
1975 Target hammer, target trigger patridge front sight on 6" and 8 3/8" barrels, introduced with Goncalo Alves target stocks and case
1979 3 1/2" and 5" barrels discontinued, 4" introduced with red ramp and white outline rear sight
1980 Target stocks standard.
27-3 (1982) Eliminate cylinder counterbore and pinned barrel.
1986 Discontinue nickel finish
27-4 (1988) New yoke retention system.
27-5 (1990) Longer stop notch in cylinder.
1992 Discontinue 4" and 8 3/8" barrels.
27-6 (1993) Hogue grips, drill and tap frame, change rear sight leaf, change extractor.
1994 Model 27 discontinued.
27-7 (2000) Performance Center version built on new N frame with floating firing pin and extended frame lug.

So the 27-1 indicates the change to left-hand thread on the ejector rod to stop it from unscrewing under recoil and tying up the gun. The 27-1 variant was made for only a year and is very collectible. The "overstamped" may indicate a forgery or that S&W did the 27-1 upgrade before shipping. As a more common 27-2 cylinder assembly could have been fitted, it is very hard to determine if a 27-1 is original without paying for a "historical research" letter from S&W.

Thank you!
Printed for reference.

[NPV]

Picked it up today as advertised, now I need to find a nice set of wood stocks. Thinking about a set of Ahrends or Eagles.
https://i.imgur.com/TzFaH9e.jpg

[Sherman A. House DDS]

Picked it up today as advertised, now I need to find a nice set of wood stocks. Thinking about a set of Ahrends or Eagles.
https://i.imgur.com/TzFaH9e.jpg

Historically, Ahrends fit better on my Smiths than Eagles do. I’ve had a number of Eagle grips that were gappy.


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[NPV]

Historically, Ahrends fit better on my Smiths than Eagles do. I’ve had a number of Eagle grips that were gappy.


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Good to know especially because the Ahrends are about 50% cheaper.

[FNFAN]

"1967 6 1/2" barrel discontinued"

Thanks farscott! A 6.5" was my first handgun and what I started my career with. Never knew it was that old.

[NPV]

Historically, Ahrends fit better on my Smiths than Eagles do. I’ve had a number of Eagle grips that were gappy.


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Thanks again for the recommendation a member on another forum reached out to me when he saw I was looking for some Ahrends Retro Combat stocks. I ended up with a set for my Model 28 and 19. They feel and look awesome I'm very happy with them.

https://i.imgur.com/k7yBIGp.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/jZvRZrU.jpg

[Dagga Boy]

On vacation and found a gorgeous 1974 4” Model 28 that needed adoption. It found a new home! I simply cannot pass these up when they are priced right.

[SeriousStudent]

Fotos, por favor! :)

[Dagga Boy]

Fotos, por favor! :)

Try when I get home. Figure it is possible this may also be able to even up a debt.....it was just too nice to leave at the store.

[SeriousStudent]

Try when I get home. Figure it is possible this may also be able to even up a debt.....it was just too nice to leave at the store.

Gasp...dare I dream?

I shall look forward to it. :)

[Dagga Boy]

Gasp...dare I dream?

I shall look forward to it. :)

Something to sleep on princess....it’s like a model 19 for grown ups..;-)

[LOBO]

Very nice! Looks new!

[HeavyDuty]

Interesting - the Model 28s I’ve seen have had a finish that was much more matte. Was that a feature of later production? I would have seen my first around 1978.

[Dagga Boy]

Interesting - the Model 28s I’ve seen have had a finish that was much more matte. Was that a feature of later production? I would have seen my first around 1978.

It’s just the lighting. It is fairly matte I’m the finish.

[Wayne Dobbs]

Another job for Frank Glenn.

[Stephanie B]

Something to sleep on princess....it’s like a model 19 for grown ups..;-)
P&R and no turn line? Nice.



Damn the iPhone Typos!

[03RN]

What's the going "fair" rate of a shooter 28? Anything under $800?

[SeriousStudent]

Something to sleep on princess....it’s like a model 19 for grown ups..;-)

Dayum, that's a beauty! :)

[SeriousStudent]

Another job for Frank Glenn.

From your lips to God's ears.

[NPV]

What's the going "fair" rate of a shooter 28? Anything under $800?

Got the one I posted in this thread for 6 Benjamins, I'm not even sure that it's been fired outside of the factory.

[HeavyDuty]

Got the one I posted in this thread for 6 Benjamins, I'm not even sure that it's been fired outside of the factory.

If I ever get a time machine, I’m gonna clean up.

[TGS]

N frames in agencies that did not issue them tended to be a sign of a “Gun Guy”. I have a 3.5”Registered Magnum from LAPD. The folks who remembered the guns said they remember 2 cops who carried them and both were very serious gunfighters who had shot a ton of crooks......sort of says something.


If you carried a wheel gun at the time it was likely an S&W 686 or maybe a GP100, so my big N Frame was something of an anachronism even then. I got a lot of crap for it from some of the guys I worked with concerning my big cannon, but I was also one of the few that wore a "revolver expert" pin on my uniform when it meant something.


I love the Model 19 myself and found that it's lighter weight and seemed to be fast handling. As a very young (21 YOA) cop, I carried and shot one a lot. It became obvious very quickly that shooting lots of Magnum ammo in the gun was very hard on it from the endshake, timing and forcing cone wear imparted. When you get a clue about the 19, you realize it's a .38 Special you can shoot a few Magnums through, but not many. Bill Jordan, the father of the Combat Magnum (the real name for the gun), said that from the start.

So, if the 27 and 28 were the gun of choice for tuned-in beat cops, what would said cops carry either off-duty or if they switched to a plainclothes assignment? That's a mighty big gun to conceal.

Was the 13 and 19 the plainclothes gun of choice while the 27/28 was used for uniform duty and heavy range days, or did guys typically run with the J-frame that I'm guessing they most likely carried as a BUG on duty?

Blues should jump in here too.

FWIW, we still have plenty of spare Combat Magnums and SP101s in the inventory. It's not uncommon for our guys to get to an assignment and have to rely on a loaner wheelgun until their own gear arrives......I know several people who've had to do such. This is one of the ways that I rationalize spending time on mine instead of only shooting the Glock 19, and if the need were to arise I'd gladly loan someone my G19 and carry the spare 2.5" Combat Magnum because after "studying" under rsa-otc I can probably run them more effectively than 99.9% of my agency. We shoot and qualify on both in our firearms instructor course, but it's very basic and most people only understand them as "that silver revolver and the black one."

In truth, I just love shooting them. :)

[blues]

Blues should jump in here too.



Just back from my annual LEOSA qual.

I don't have a lot to contribute, T. When I came on the job in the early 80's I was issued a 2" Model 15, though FLETC was still doing firearms training with the 2.5" Model 19, (which I preferred).

Then, after a while it became apparent that the cool guys at work would be issued a 2" Model 36, which I eventually received. (I had already purchased one at Jovino's for off-duty prior to this.)

When I transferred down to south FL in the middle 80's I was issued a stainless (Model 66) which I carried until I was issued a Colt Gov't Model that had been turned in by another agent. After that it was semi-auto pistols but for my off-duty 36 which I eventually traded in at Lou's Gun Shop in Hialeah. (The local cop shop.)

In NYC, we'd run out to Gene DeSantis' place in New Hyde Park when he had a leather order ready for our outfit.

[Dagga Boy]

“Was the 13 and 19 the plainclothes gun of choice while the 27/28 was used for uniform duty and heavy range days, or did guys typically run with the J-frame that I'm guessing they most likely carried as a BUG on duty?”

I carried a 25-5 at work. Never came home. Did have a round butted one built for concealed carry. I carried a 3” Model 13 off duty and then wore it behind my speed loaders at work when I was slimmer as a young cop. I carried a Model 36 or 38 on my ankle. Keep in mind in the very old days, the manner of men’s dress was conducive to large guns. 2” guns were really popular for off duty for most of the revolver years. The big N’s tended to be uniform only.

[Dagga Boy]

Also....better picture.

[Trooper224]

I carried my 27 off duty in a holster from El Paso Saddlery. I only did so because I was poor and had babies to feed. A dedicated off duty gun wasn't really an option. When I went to work for the state, the resulting pay raise allowed me to acquire more guns, so from that point, through the next two decades, it was a 1911 for off duty and non-uniform carry. That original four inch 27 was traded off about a year after joining the staties, something I still kick myself for.

[Jeep]

Also....better picture.

That is gorgeous.

[Sherman A. House DDS]

Also....better picture.

Are you keeping the stocks? Or switching to something more fashion forward?


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[Dagga Boy]

Had it set up for some faux ivory, but they have a different contour above the frame I didn’t like. This one is actually going to a new home to pay a debt, but I foresee some great stocks on it.

[OlongJohnson]

I've had this nagging, recurrent idea about meloniting an old blued revolver. It occurs to me that the non-high-gloss appearance of the 28 invites such a treatment, and the fact that they are surprisingly plentiful and affordable for a P&R Smith makes it seem like an even better idea.

[Kan S LaTrans]

My dad carried a 4" Model 27 for nearly 40 years as a deputy sheriff in northern Arizona. Yes, it was heavier than a Model 10, 15, or 19 K Frame. Yes, it was less easy to conceal than the Model 10, 15, or 19 K Frame.

BUT...it could digest all the hot 357 ammo you wanted to stuff into it and shoot. There was noticeably less felt recoil between the Model 27 and the Model 19.

The Model 27 was a finely finished, deeply blued revolver with checkering on the topstrap. The Model 28 highway Patrolman was more of a journeyman revolver without the checkering. Mechanically, they were the same gun.

You will never be poorly served by an N Frame Magnum.

[OlongJohnson]

I've had this nagging, recurrent idea about meloniting an old blued revolver. It occurs to me that the non-high-gloss appearance of the 28 invites such a treatment, and the fact that they are surprisingly plentiful and affordable for a P&R Smith makes it seem like an even better idea.

Spent a few minutes talking with technical sales at Burlington Industries, the SoCal shop that does a lot of meloniting on 1911s.

I don't want to misquote him or sow seeds of confusion regarding his exact statements versus my extension of them based on my knowledge of metallurgy, but I'll just log my conclusion here that as of this writing, I don't regard meloniting a revolver as an "aftermarket" solution to be practically feasible. One would need to consume at least one additional revolver, maybe more, for destructive testing to verify the safety of the process with a reasonable degree of confidence.

[KevH]

For those with the memory/experiences/studies of the old days of police work:

What was the daily user's opinion of the S&W Model 27 or 28 way back when?

Too darn heavy to carry, great for the hard kicking magnums, awkward due to the weight, better/worse than the Python; that sort of stuff. I've always liked the 3.5 inch 27's and a good friend has a Highway Patrolman I've always admired but how many agencies issued them and how successful were they as an issue piece?

I didn't scan the whole thread, but when I started police work there were still a lot of "revolver guys" still working although most were about to retire. Most of those guys carried either a 4" 19/66 (although I remember one particular deputy with a 6" 19 in a swivel holster), a 4" 686, or a 4" 45 Colt or 45 ACP N frame. I do not remember seeing a single local guy carrying an N frame, although I know SFPD still had some. You could almost tell when a guy was hired based on the type of gun he carried (since most carried the same guy their entire career).

By the 1980's and 1990's, the 27 and 28 were viewed as "big and heavy classics" at least around here. The impression I got was that after the Combat Magnums (Models 19 and 66) became prevalent (and readily available) in the late 1960's and early 1970's, most guys stopped carrying the N frames in 357 Magnum.

[JAH 3rd]

Back in the mid 70's, I was issued a nickel S&W model 19 4" barrel as a duty weapon. We had two auxillary officers that worked mainly weekends who had bought their own revolvers. Model 28's they were! My 19 was a youngster compared to the 28....the adult in the holster...haha. They were matte blue with a 4 " barrel. I was envious.

Later at a different department, we were issued model 66's.

[LtDave]

When I started as a reserve on a suburban SoCal PD in ‘78, I carried a personal 5” model 27, but soon went to the lighter K frame guns. I had a 2.5” 19 that I had a 4” barrel installed on with a yellow ramp front. Had Farrant make me a pair of RB to SB conversion grips for it. Wish I still had that one. Still have the 27 and the Farrants. Later while still a reserve I was issued a K-38 that the city had shortened to 4” with the patridge front sight remounted by a local gunsmith. It looked funky but shot great. Hated to give it up when I got hired full time. There might have been one or two other guys carrying M28’s and a Python or two, but most everyone else had a 4” or 6” K frame with adjustable sights. No one had a fixed sight duty gun.