airweight reload

[Moonshot]

I carry 148gr wad cutters in my backup gun (and on very rare ocasions my only gun) - a 642 no lock. My current ammo is Federal, but I still have some Remington boxes left over. They are easy to shoot, even with my non-dominant hand, they are accurate - shooting POI very close to POA, and the reduced recoil allows for rapid follow up shots. Perhaps the most important reason is they are easier for my wife or daughters to shoot, should I have to give one of them my j-frame in an emergency. I have no confidense that any HP - even a modern +P - will open up from a sub-2" barrel, and I understand from one of Doc's posts that a HP that fails to open up causes less wounding than a WC.

My question here is what do you all recommend as a reload? Wad cutters suck for reloading in a hurry and while under stress. I know from previous posts that many who load WCs in their Js as primary use SBGDs as their reloads, others used CD, PDX or DPX.

I notice all of these choices are +P, and while the cartridge profile makes for an easier reload, the +P negates all the WC advantages I listed in my 1st paragraph, plus I still have no confidence they will open up. If +Ps were OK for my reloads, they would be equally OK as my primary load.

What round would you all recommend for a reload - from both speed strips and speed loaders, that will have similar recoil , sufficient penetration, are manufactured from a large commercial outfit with .gov contracts (no boutique loads) and will have similar POI to my 148gr WCs?

The only option that I can think of (and this is my current reload) is a 158gr LSWC (non-HP). It's not perfect, but it's close. Is there a better choice?

[Hambo]

I carry 148gr wad cutters in my backup gun (and on very rare ocasions my only gun) - a 642 no lock. My current ammo is Federal, but I still have some Remington boxes left over. They are easy to shoot, even with my non-dominant hand, they are accurate - shooting POI very close to POA, and the reduced recoil allows for rapid follow up shots. Perhaps the most important reason is they are easier for my wife or daughters to shoot, should I have to give one of them my j-frame in an emergency. I have no confidense that any HP - even a modern +P - will open up from a sub-2" barrel, and I understand from one of Doc's posts that a HP that fails to open up causes less wounding than a WC.

My question here is what do you all recommend as a reload? Wad cutters suck for reloading in a hurry and while under stress. I know from previous posts that many who load WCs in their Js as primary use SBGDs as their reloads, others used CD, PDX or DPX.

I notice all of these choices are +P, and while the cartridge profile makes for an easier reload, the +P negates all the WC advantages I listed in my 1st paragraph, plus I still have no confidence they will open up. If +Ps were OK for my reloads, they would be equally OK as my primary load.

What round would you all recommend for a reload - from both speed strips and speed loaders, that will have similar recoil , sufficient penetration, are manufactured from a large commercial outfit with .gov contracts (no boutique loads) and will have similar POI to my 148gr WCs?

The only option that I can think of (and this is my current reload) is a 158gr LSWC (non-HP). It's not perfect, but it's close. Is there a better choice?

Another Airweight loaded with WC. Calling Mike Pipes.

[GJM]

Another Airweight loaded with WC. Calling Mike Pipes.

You beat me to this!

[NPV]

Remington Golder Sabers are decent I can get a box of 50 for under $20. Though they are pretty stout and POI would likely be different as they are 125 gr. Winchester T/D or PDX1s would also be good backups they are a little less punchy than the Golden Sabers and again lighter bullet weight. Very smooth to reload though.

Come to think of it Speer Gold Dots Short Barrel load is 135 gr. so it would have a similar POI to your wadcutters, I'd give them a try.

I figure if you've just discharged 5 rounds under duress and are loading up to send additional lead downrange the felt recoil difference of the +P loads aren't going to be felt the same way they would be at the static range.

[deputyG23]

Hornaday 158 grain standard pressure XTP for me. Shoots to POA in my old snubs and the bullet noses don't get smashed in pocket speed strip carry like the 158 grain LHPs sometimes do. My newer 442 snub gets Ranger 130 grain +P bonded rounds for initial load and speed strip reload.

[Irelander]

You beat me to this!

Me four. I use Rem Target WC.

[Dave J]

I also carry WC’s when carrying a snub, for all the usual reasons.

For the reload however, IMHO being able to reload reliably and effectively outweighs the other factors. Not that I really expect a successful reload to happen until after the fight is over, but I figure I might as well leave the possibility open. My speed strip is normally filled with DPX, which has a nice tapered profile, and the POI isn’t that much different in my guns. I also appreciate the copper projectile, as it provides the means to avoid carrying exposed lead in my pockets.

[jandbj]

90 grain hornady 38 spl standard pressure loads with the pink gummy bear bullets make for a good speed strip reload.
https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1001573970/hornady-critical-defense-lite-ammunition-38-special-90-grain-flex-tip-expanding-box-of-25

[Sigfan26]

Federal HST in the gun, 110gr Critical Defense standard pressure reload


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[Frank R]

Underwood Ammo Xtreme Defender.
https://underwoodammo.com/product/handgun-ammo/38-special-100-grain-xtreme-defender/

[Leroy Suggs]

Federal HST 130 in the gun. Do not carry a reload.
I carry a reload for the primary, a G17 or G19.

[Moonshot]

Thank you to all who responded, and if anyone else has more suggestions, please let me know.

Based on what i am seeing here though, I think I will stick with my 158gr LSWC, for the following reasons...

A 2nd J-frame is not always an option, and even with a 2nd J-frame, it still only leaves me with 10 rounds. I want a reload, perhaps two.

I do not want any +P round in my airweight, for reasons already stated - groups open up and split times increase if shooting off-hand only, my wife and daughters do not shoot it as well as standard pressure, and the only reason I can see to use a +P is to help the HP expand. I do not have any confidence that a HP, even a modern one driven to +P velocity, will expand after passing through 4LD from a sub-2" barrel, so I see no reason to accept the higher recoil of a +P round.

Doc has recommended sticking with large commercial manufacturers with large government contracts - as they may be more likely to have better QC in place. This makes sense to me. Therefore, no boutique loads.

The Hornady 158gr XTP referenced might be a valid option if it meets all my other criteria and if I can find it at an affordable price. I have some Winchester Defend loads (part of their Train & Defend series). These are 130gr standard pressure HPs. I don't expend them to open up either, but they feed well as a reload. They actually meet most of my needs for a reload, but they cost over $25 for a box of 20. Too rich for my blood to allow for consistant and frequent practice.

My Federal 158gr LSWCs I can get at <$20 for a box of 50.

[WDR]

Just my two cents: I carry and use RA38B in my 442. Reasons: I got a good supply of it for ~$16/50 shipped to my door a while back. It shoots close enough to the sights of my 442 to be useful. It works well from speed strips and Comp-I's. I've shot a few into water jugs, and they do expand, but I suspect that might not be the case in real flesh and bone. Shooting it side by side with the Winchester "Defend" stuff... I can't perceive a difference in recoil. Certainly more with either of those, than the HBWC handloads I practice with, but it's not unmanageable for me. I'd not feel too terrible carrying my wadcutter handloads or a SWC. Where you place the bullet is far more important than what bullet it is. A wide meplat SWC, like a "Keith" style, is probably better, terminally, than most of the common SWC bullets you find in factory ammo. The downside to that wide flat nose, is of course, slower reloads.

The Critical Defense stuff ( and probably XTP too), and rounds loaded with the 110gr Barnes DPX look like they would be GREAT for fast reloads, but I have not tried them because I can't justify the expense. I keep planning on buying some of the Barnes bullets to load for myself, but even those are expensive, and come in silly 40 count boxes. I have heard of the light Barnes bullets keyholing from some 2" guns.


I think Malamute has mentioned before that even wadcutter ammo loads pretty well from the Safariland Comp-I's... And I agree. They seem to hold the rounds tight enough that its easier to get them in the charge holes, vs other options (HKS, speed strips).

The bottom line is that there really isn't any such thing as a free lunch when it comes to snub ammo and reloading them.

[Moonshot]

...Shooting it side by side with the Winchester "Defend" stuff... I can't perceive a difference in recoil. Certainly more with either of those, than the HBWC handloads I practice with, but it's not unmanageable for me. Same for me (with the Defend load - never tried the Ranger).

I think Malamute has mentioned before that even wadcutter ammo loads pretty well from the Safariland Comp-I's... And I agree. They seem to hold the rounds tight enough that its easier to get them in the charge holes, vs other options (HKS, speed strips).

How do you get the Safariland Comp 1 to work with wadcutters? I've tried, and the short rounds do not make it into the cylinder charge holes, preventing the speed loader release from engaging the extractor.

On the other hand, the HKS works well, if not particularly fast.

If it matters to speed loader use, I run the Pachmayr Compac Professional on my 642.

[WDR]

How do you get the Safariland Comp 1 to work with wadcutters? I've tried, and the short rounds do not make it into the cylinder charge holes, preventing the speed loader release from engaging the extractor.

On the other hand, the HKS works well, if not particularly fast.

If it matters to speed loader use, I run the Pachmayr Compac Professional on my 642.

Wadcutters work, but you have to get the rounds aligned with the charge holes, as only about ~1/16" of the case makes it into them before the center post hits the ejector/extractor, after that it's as simple as a push in as usual. I had my wife take a short 6 second video... but I can't manage to figure out an easy way to upload it. I'm a bit of a Luddite. I'll keep looking for a simple way to upload the video.


I don't think it'd matter, but my 442 is a "Pro" model that is cut for moon clips. If anything, the standard model should engage slightly more of the round before the center part of the loader hits the extractor star. I'm also using LG-405's for grips, which clear the Comp-I's just fine. The loader can get lined up nice and square to the rear cylinder face. I'm not sure how the Pachamayr grips compare, but if they force much of an outward cant the the loader, I could see where that may effect how wadcutters would feed from them.