RFI: "Budget" Build Kits (PSA/Brownells/etc.)

[einherjarvalk]

My father's been looking into purchasing a "basic" AR-15 recently with the intention of putting a magnified optic on it for use here in the Texas Hill Country once in a blue moon. While he is former Air Force, he's behind the curve a bit on modern firearms tech and I'm trying to see if I can help him get something put together in the $600 range that's a bit better than the basic M&P-15s that dominate that price point.

I currently have a spare Aero Precision Gen 2 lower that I've built out with a PSA LPK, but is currently sans stock/upper assemblies. I figure I can take a loss on selling him this lower in order to avoid the difficulties of a first-time AR builder needing to put one together (I wanted to replace it with an M4E1 lower anyway), and purcahse a "build kit" to go on top of it that'll keep it in the correct price range. I've been seeing complete uppers from Brownells and PSA recently in the $340-$450 price range, with the latter coming with free floated MLOK rails that should prove more helpful for a magnified optic than an A2 FSB. This is the kit I'm currently eyeing every time it goes on sale. (http://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-16-5-56-nato-1-7-mid-length-nitride-13-5-m-lok-moe-ept-rifle-kit-with-mbus-sight-set-5165447630.html)

However, since I mostly dabble in mid-/upper-tier parts, I'm not sure what corners are being cut on the newer PSA Freedom and Brownells build kit lines. Obviously neither will have things like chrome lining in the barrel and I'll need to source an H or H2 buffer for what is almost certainly going to be an overgassed gun, but does anyone have information on the build quality of these upper kits beyond hat? PSA's Freedom line claims to come with a SP-tested Carpenter 158 bolt, but MPI testing seems to be absent and I haven't seen one of their carriers in person to inspect the staking. The Brownells complete uppers are even more cost-efficient, but I've seen a handful of complaints about improperly staked gas keys and canted rails with poor fit, so I'm hesitant to go with those despite the cost savings.

Does anyone have any serious knowledge of these more budget options and how they work out for the more casual user, or suggestions for similar options in that price range? I'm sure a gun built with either would work fine for the few mags he'd put through it every couple of years, but I don't want to set him up with something that has RAS-47-like "it works great until it blows up" quality control.

[rjohnson4405]

Define "better" than the M&P at that price point.

Because by my standards, if you want better than the M&P(or occasional crazy good prices you can get on a Colt OEM), you gotta pay more. They are the cheapest serious rifle out there.

If you want more grip/stock/forend/barrel options for the same price and that's your version of "better" then PSA makes more sense.

[einherjarvalk]

I think my idea of "better" in this situation is basically "on par with M&P-15 build quality, but midlength and with a low-profile gas block in lieu of an A2 FSB."

Normally I'd point to Colt OEM or maybe building up a complete Aero Precision rifle, but both of those are a bit outside the price range he's wanting to pay.

[spinmove_]

If $600 is his budget, why not just save an extra $100-$200 and have him get a Colt 6920 OEM2 and go from there?


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[einherjarvalk]

If $600 is his budget, why not just save an extra $100-$200 and have him get a Colt 6920 OEM2 and go from there?


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The OEM2 would be around $750-$800 after shipping and FFL fees. I'd advise that if it weren't for the fact that it still lacks any sort of rail, stock, or sights in that form, which would add another $150-$200 to the cost at minimum.

[pangloss]

I've put together two rifles using assembled uppers from PSA. Both of mine have mid-length gas systems. One with a 14.7" barrel and welded flash hider, the other with a 16" barrel. I put these together a few years ago. Everything I read at the time said to avoid PTAC and Freedom parts from PSA. I have laughably few rounds through these rifles (~200 each), so I can't really say if they are any good. They both seem to function fine and haven't given me any problems in the few rounds I've put through them. Coincidentally, I put the first one together for my dad after I realized that he kept his M96 Swedish Mauser (~29" barrel) loaded as his house rifle. The upper on the second AR had a canted front sight base. PSA sent me a return label, I shipped the upper back to them, and they fixed it. It was an inconvenience, but I was reasonably pleased by their customer service. I think that for $600 it'll be hard to put together anything better than what you have in mind. This Aero Precision (LINK (https://www.brownells.com/firearms/rifles/semi-auto/oem-mid-length-16-rifle-prod81838.aspx?avs%7cCartridge_1=AKK_5xzzx56%2bmm% 2bNATO)) looks pretty good, but you'll definitely come in at over $600 once you buy everything you need. If the Brownells discount codes can be applied to rifles, you might be able to get it a little cheaper if you watch it for a while.

[leathermaneod]

My father's been looking into purchasing a "basic" AR-15 recently with the intention of putting a magnified optic on it for use here in the Texas Hill Country once in a blue moon. While he is former Air Force, he's behind the curve a bit on modern firearms tech and I'm trying to see if I can help him get something put together in the $600 range that's a bit better than the basic M&P-15s that dominate that price point.

I currently have a spare Aero Precision Gen 2 lower that I've built out with a PSA LPK, but is currently sans stock/upper assemblies. I figure I can take a loss on selling him this lower in order to avoid the difficulties of a first-time AR builder needing to put one together (I wanted to replace it with an M4E1 lower anyway), and purcahse a "build kit" to go on top of it that'll keep it in the correct price range. I've been seeing complete uppers from Brownells and PSA recently in the $340-$450 price range, with the latter coming with free floated MLOK rails that should prove more helpful for a magnified optic than an A2 FSB. This is the kit I'm currently eyeing every time it goes on sale. (http://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-16-5-56-nato-1-7-mid-length-nitride-13-5-m-lok-moe-ept-rifle-kit-with-mbus-sight-set-5165447630.html)

However, since I mostly dabble in mid-/upper-tier parts, I'm not sure what corners are being cut on the newer PSA Freedom and Brownells build kit lines. Obviously neither will have things like chrome lining in the barrel and I'll need to source an H or H2 buffer for what is almost certainly going to be an overgassed gun, but does anyone have information on the build quality of these upper kits beyond hat? PSA's Freedom line claims to come with a SP-tested Carpenter 158 bolt, but MPI testing seems to be absent and I haven't seen one of their carriers in person to inspect the staking. The Brownells complete uppers are even more cost-efficient, but I've seen a handful of complaints about improperly staked gas keys and canted rails with poor fit, so I'm hesitant to go with those despite the cost savings.

Does anyone have any serious knowledge of these more budget options and how they work out for the more casual user, or suggestions for similar options in that price range? I'm sure a gun built with either would work fine for the few mags he'd put through it every couple of years, but I don't want to set him up with something that has RAS-47-like "it works great until it blows up" quality control.

I recently bought a PSA rifle as an assembled upper and assembled lower separately. I had some similar concerns to yours as far as PSA, but I have a friend who has one that he is very happy with, so I figured why not give them a try. The upper I got has a 16” nitrided barrel with chrome lined bcg and standard charging handle. I was fine with the nitrided barrel, because from my research, a nitrided barrel can be more accurate than chrome lined and I won’t put enough rounds through it to need chrome lining. It has a mid length gas system. The gas key is properly staked. It also has a 13.5” mlok rail and came with MBUS sights. The bolt is marked MPI/HP. The interior of the upper receiver seems to be uncoated. The lower receiver seems very nice. I got it with their enhanced precision trigger and Magpul moe furniture. The trigger is very nice and the castle but is staked. My total after shipping and FFL fee was $600 almost even.

I’m not very experienced with building ar’s but I am used to shooting them, though this is my first personally owned one. Here are my few nitpicking issues. The gas block was not perfectly centered at 12 o’clock when I got it, but it was only off by a couple degrees(I’m pretty sure the rifle would have functioned just fine) and I was easily able to fix it. The free float rail does not have any fancy method of keeping it in place like some of the high end ones do, just pinched with two bolts at the bottom. I assume many people use this style with no issues, but mine slipped at little while shooting after adjusting it one time. I probably just didn’t have it tight enough, but I put it back together tighter and with Loctite 680, which is specifically designed for similar applications. I don’t foresee having issues with that again. Another point about the rail is that I’d does not perfectly match the receiver as far as height/width. I am talking like .5 of a mm, nothing significant, but if your a perfectionist, it could bother you. One other point about the rail, the barrel is not perfectly centered top to bottom at the end. Again, I’m talking like 1mm off, but if you look closely you can see it, or at least I can lol

That pretty much covers my observations I think. Overall I am very impressed with the rifle at the price I paid and I think it would be a great option for your dad. If you’d like any pictures, just let me know!

Oh btw, I’ve put almost 200 rounds through it so far, most of which were steel cases, and not a single malfunction. I had one time where the bolt didn’t lock open, but one of my younger brothers was shooting at the time and I think he may have been pressing against the bolt release. With the midlength gas system, I don’t think you’d have to change out the buffer.

I am really impressed with PSA and would not hesitate to buy more of their guns.

ETA: forgot to add that my extractor also has the little rubber o ring that is supposed to aid with extraction iirc. I’ve never noticed an issue without that, but from what I read, it’s a plus that it came with it.

ETA 2: also forgot to mention one real issue that I just discovered while cleaning my rifle last night. My charging handle latch pin is loose, so I will have to pick up another and replace it. Not a big deal to me, but it happened.


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[leathermaneod]

I've put together two rifles using assembled uppers from PSA. Both of mine have mid-length gas systems. One with a 14.7" barrel and welded flash hider, the other with a 16" barrel. I put these together a few years ago. Everything I read at the time said to avoid PTAC and Freedom parts from PSA. I have laughably few rounds through these rifles (~200 each), so I can't really say if they are any good. They both seem to function fine and haven't given me any problems in the few rounds I've put through them. Coincidentally, I put the first one together for my dad after I realized that he kept his M96 Swedish Mauser (~29" barrel) loaded as his house rifle. The upper on the second AR had a canted front sight base. PSA sent me a return label, I shipped the upper back to them, and they fixed it. It was an inconvenience, but I was reasonably pleased by their customer service. I think that for $600 it'll be hard to put together anything better than what you have in mind. This Aero Precision (LINK (https://www.brownells.com/firearms/rifles/semi-auto/oem-mid-length-16-rifle-prod81838.aspx?avs%7cCartridge_1=AKK_5xzzx56%2bmm% 2bNATO)) looks pretty good, but you'll definitely come in at over $600 once you buy everything you need. If the Brownells discount codes can be applied to rifles, you might be able to get it a little cheaper if you watch it for a while.

I originally wanted the rifle you have linked, but they were out of stock at the time and based on how sales have been going, I wasn’t sure when they might come back in stock. Of course I got the notification that they were back right around the time I got my rifle put together. No big deal though, I’m happy with what I got. That one can be a higher end second build :-)


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[lwt16]

I have several ARs including a department issued Colt, one built from BCM goodies, a PSA MOE rifle kit build, and a Delton build.

The PSA build has somewhere between 1k and 2k rounds through it and I have had one gas ring break. Other than that, it has been a solid performer. I've built several for others here at the department I work at and none have had issues. I'm assembling 2 more this weekend and a cursory glance at the complete uppers/BCGs it appears that they are good to go.

Mine gobble up brass and steel cased ammo with equal vigor and I've yet to have a malfunction with any of the above rifles.......except the factory Colt. To it's credit, it has north of 5k rounds through it and that issue was easily repaired by a department armorer.

Regards.