When should you begin training WHO skills??

[BaiHu]

Perhaps this has been covered from other angles, but I didn't see any direct posts with this question, so forgive me if I'm double posting. *disclaimer done*

I've always trained martial arts left and right sides IMMEDIATELY, but my introduction to shooting was through my father. Now I can see that he was an adequate teacher to get me on the range safely, but lacked sufficient skills to really 'teach' me how to shoot.

Taking my studying of the pistol seriously over the last 2 years, I just began thinking about putting some solid time in with my WHO skills. I can't change how I started, but does anyone have a solid teaching rationale why I should hold off on or begin to accelerate my WHO skills??

Thanks in advance for all the great advice I'm sure to see flowing soon.

[beltjones]

Perhaps this has been covered from other angles, but I didn't see any direct posts with this question, so forgive me if I'm double posting. *disclaimer done*

I've always trained martial arts left and right sides IMMEDIATELY, but my introduction to shooting was through my father. Now I can see that he was an adequate teacher to get me on the range safely, but lacked sufficient skills to really 'teach' me how to shoot.

Taking my studying of the pistol seriously over the last 2 years, I just began thinking about putting some solid time in with my WHO skills. I can't change how I started, but does anyone have a solid teaching rationale why I should hold off on or begin to accelerate my WHO skills??

Thanks in advance for all the great advice I'm sure to see flowing soon.

I highly recommend you get into a class with a good instructor sooner than later.

It's important to practice SHO / WHO, but it's more important to practice them correctly. When you lose the support of a second hand on the gun fundamentals of accuracy become several times more important. Holding the gun correctly, using proper trigger control, having proper stance and posture, etc, all take on a magnified role in your shooting, and it's better to practice them the right way from day 1 than to have to do the unlearn/relearn thing later on.

[BaiHu]

I highly recommend you get into a class with a good instructor sooner than later.

Totally on it. I've logged and gotten certificates in 4 classes: 2 NRA and 2 Tactical. I'm taking the NRA Basic Instructor Training in 2 weeks and I'm going to AFHF with Todd in RI this August.

Thanks!

[beltjones]

Totally on it. I've logged and gotten certificates in 4 classes: 2 NRA and 2 Tactical. I'm taking the NRA Basic Instructor Training in 2 weeks and I'm going to AFHF with Todd in RI this August.

Thanks!

Can you articulate proper SHO / WHO mechanics? I'm not saying there is only one way, or that I think you ought to type it out here or anything. But if you have a sense of what you should be doing, then I say go ahead and practice it.

I also firmly believe that improving SHO / WHO trigger control is perhaps the best way to improve two hand supported trigger control.

[bofe954]

I wish I would've started sooner.

[TGS]

BaiHu,

Let's definitely try getting together this weekend like we talked about.

SHO/WHO is like 1/2 to 5/8th's of my usual range session. I could show you some things that hurt/helped my results so you could play with them and find something. Nothing I was shown in any of the classes I took are things that helped my SHO/WHO results.

[BaiHu]

BaiHu,

Let's definitely try getting together this weekend like we talked about.

SHO/WHO is like 1/2 to 5/8th's of my usual range session. I could show you some things that hurt/helped my results so you could play with them and find something. Nothing I was shown in any of the classes I took are things that helped my SHO/WHO results.

Sounds good and I'll PM you as soon as I see what's happening with my schedule. I might be done even earlier with work.

[JV_]

IMO: 1/2 to 5/8 of a range session seems excessive for WHO and SHO skills.

I don't find SHO shooting that difficult, probably because the trigger pull and grip are nearly identical to 2 handed shooting. WHO is not as easy for me, I'm much more likely to snatch the trigger.

At each session, I shoot a mag or two (for each) SHO and WHO.

3 times per week I try to get in some dry fire practice. I keep it simple and focus on technique rather than speed. My drill is normally:

10 x Press Out
10 x WHO Wall Drill
10 x SHO Wall Drill
25 x Reload from Slide Lock

[NickA]

Can anyone point to some good video or descriptions of SHO and WHO manipulations, specifically draws and reloads, preferably from AIWB?

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[bdcheung]

Can anyone point to some good video or descriptions of SHO and WHO manipulations, specifically draws and reloads, preferably from AIWB?

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+1. I can draw, press-out and fire SHO, but drawing WHO from AIWB is a contortion I haven't figured out yet.

[TGS]

IMO: 1/2 to 5/8 of a range session seems excessive for WHO and SHO skills.

I don't find SHO shooting that difficult, probably because the trigger pull and grip are nearly identical to 2 handed shooting. WHO is not as easy for me, I'm much more likely to snatch the trigger.

At each session, I shoot a mag or two (for each) SHO and WHO.

3 times per week I try to get in some dry fire practice. I keep it simple and focus on technique rather than speed. My drill is normally:

10 x Press Out
10 x WHO Wall Drill
10 x SHO Wall Drill
25 x Reload from Slide Lock

I usually go to the range once a week. With each hand, 10 rounds DA, 10 rounds SA, 10 rounds DA/SA pairs (so 5 pairs) on 2" circles at 3, 5 or if I'm feeling ambitious, 7 yards. I'll usually do that once, and if I'm feeling ambitious or energetic, twice (otherwise I mentally tire too much during the 2nd string for any productivity). My sessions over the past 2 months have tended to be 150-200 rounds total (with 60 to 120 being SHO/WHO, respectively), and the rest being walkback drills and typewriter type stuff. Sometimes I'll throw in a DT or two as an assessment instead of going heavy on SHO/WHO.

Maybe 1/2 is excessive for how much you shoot. If my range sessions were 300 rounds, I probably wouldn't be doing 1/2 WHO/SHO. I kinda like shooting SHO/WHO as well, it's challenging but fun. I like how I can usually hit as well WHO with DA as I can SHO with SA.

[DonovanM]

As soon as you grasp the basics of trigger control, and can for instance put a sub 3" group together at 7 yards or so, I would start working on SHO/WHO. Just as long as you know what you're looking for.

It's also good to start with dry fire, but I think that about everything. I think it's better to learn fundamentals without the distraction of explosions going off a couple feet in front of your face.

[Bob Hostetter]

While I include both SHO and WHO work in any personal training session, I also own a Weak Handed setup (holster, belt, mag pouches, etc) that I use anytime I take a class from another instructor. In other words while I am right handed whenever I attend a class as a student I only use a left handed rig, and shoot left handed both supported and unsupported, as required by the class/instructor.

[ToddG]

It's difficult to establish when you should practice SHO/WHO or how much you should practice SHO/WHO without first defining your goals.

If someone is spending half his range time on one handed skills, there needs to be a well thought out reason. That reason could be:


it helps me with my other shooting
I believe that people are often forced to shoot SHO/WHO in gunfights
a game I play puts a lot of emphasis on SHO/WHO


... or whatever. But don't just shoot x-number of rounds or z-percentage of your practice SHO/WHO for the heck of it.

I'd say I put about 10% of my time into SHO/WHO. If I was practicing half as often as I do now, I'd probably up that number a bit. However, if I was practicing significantly less than I do now, I probably wouldn't put more time into SHO/WHO. When training resources are limited, the smart thing is to put your effort into high likelihood tasks. Getting good enough at SHO/WHO to be legitimately competent under stress -- and if something forces you to shoot one handed, you're probably already a tad stressed -- takes substantial time and rounds.

It's not wrong to train for the worst case scenario, but it's a mistake to ignore skills you're actually likely to need in favor of the one in a hundred problem. People like to say, "Yeah, but what if you're that one?" to which I can only respond, "What if you're one of those ninety-nine instead?"

[JeffJ]

I've been spending signifigantly more time on SHO shooting the last few months, because of my son who was born 1/5 - he causes a situation for me in which I am highly likely to have something in my weak hand that I can't drop to get 2 hands on the gun. Prior to that it was probably around 10-15%

[BaiHu]

It's difficult to establish when you should practice SHO/WHO or how much you should practice SHO/WHO without first defining your goals.

If someone is spending half his range time on one handed skills, there needs to be a well thought out reason. That reason could be:


it helps me with my other shooting
I believe that people are often forced to shoot SHO/WHO in gunfights
a game I play puts a lot of emphasis on SHO/WHO


... or whatever. But don't just shoot x-number of rounds or z-percentage of your practice SHO/WHO for the heck of it.

I'd say I put about 10% of my time into SHO/WHO. If I was practicing half as often as I do now, I'd probably up that number a bit. However, if I was practicing significantly less than I do now, I probably wouldn't put more time into SHO/WHO. When training resources are limited, the smart thing is to put your effort into high likelihood tasks. Getting good enough at SHO/WHO to be legitimately competent under stress -- and if something forces you to shoot one handed, you're probably already a tad stressed -- takes substantial time and rounds.

It's not wrong to train for the worst case scenario, but it's a mistake to ignore skills you're actually likely to need in favor of the one in a hundred problem. People like to say, "Yeah, but what if you're that one?" to which I can only respond, "What if you're one of those ninety-nine instead?"

As always, great points and much to consider. My main interest was piqued by the DOTW 19 and whether or not I've been neglecting an area of training. I try to dry fire at least 4 days a week and hit the range 2 days a week, but that's my ideal. I'm just slowly putting together priorities and standards that I need to meet that are relevant to my current skills.

Thanks.

[Smaug]

Can anyone point to some good video or descriptions of SHO and WHO manipulations, specifically draws and reloads, preferably from AIWB?

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_JuYJxXpnWQ&context=C3231bdaADOEgsToPDskLl5TUVx0-yRL1BcAL5tAMx

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iCIKHOcGLPo&context=C37829feADOEgsToPDskKOs44m0zzB_x4u26E479S4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJQY8v9V6AM&context=C309d4abADOEgsToPDskLYwGUmo1TEYt9BYIyJK4dz

[Jeff22]

It took me a while to figure out your terminology:

SHO = "Strong hand only"
WHO = "Weak hand only"

Okay.

My basic skill maintenance practice drills are either 30 rounds or 60 rounds.

All of my courses involve a 6 round string of strong hand only shooting and a 6 round string of weak hand only shooting, and some of them include a 6 round string of weak hand with support shooting (mirror image -- could be useful if you are a right handed shooter shooting around the left side of cover)

It's worth practicing on a regular basis with one hand only shooting because you don't know what particular set of skills will be required should you ever have to do it "for real". And, if you're an IPSC or IDPA competitive shooter, you will certainly be required to shoot strong hand only and weak hand only on a frequent basis in matches.