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Dismas316
03-24-2018, 09:47 AM
So I did my first completion this week which was a mix of steel and paper. Not USPCA or IDPA but a bit of a combo. 5 different stages shooting steel and paper in outdoor bays. Incorporated movement on all as well as one handed shooting. No par times, just accuracy/timed runs for each stage.

It was a blast. I finished the in 30 out of 50 participants, but was very disappointed that I only had 1 clean run. (It was actually my first stage) otherwise I would have finished in the top 20. I think I got way overconfident running the first stage and thought I could blaze my way to victory, lol. I was really surprised how much the “stress” of competition affected by accuracy, I get in now. If I would have slowed down a bit and took my time I would have done much much better but I’m fighting my aggressiveness to go fast through the course.

Pretty amazed at how quickly my fundamentals started to fall apart at speed. Really had to focus on not slamming the trigger going fast. I run a lot of the drillst using a timer as advocated on this site but clearly different in a live competitive situation. My mind went “blank” a few times trying to go fast.

As a golfer, the analogy I would use is that I am an awesome ball striker on the driving range but it is very different on the course. It was exactly the same here. I am chomping at the bit to do it again. I ran the course using my 19x

My goal in the next one is to just shoot clean no matter how slow I go which will be hard to resist going fast.

Anyway, this has got me thinking about the often asked question of glock 17 or 34. Now that the gen 5’s have hit the market, any thoughts on this? My goal in the near term is to rent both to shoot side by side to get a good feel. Am I at any disadvantage with the 19x? I looked to be one of the few that just had a stock set up, there were a lot of cool race guns there. Part of my competitiveness wants to kick their butts with a stock 19x but I tend to live under the delusion that I’m better than I actually am. (The driving range syndrome). In the end as an avg. shooter I really don’t want to be at a disadvantage. What are your thoughts around this?

My thinking is run the 19x for a while and get used to competing and then maybe step up to the 17/34 if I end up getting series about it. Of course it doesn’t hurt to be talked into another gun. :o

Overall it was a great experience and look forward to more opportunities to compete.

Talionis
03-24-2018, 10:56 AM
Right on! The first competition is definitely both an adrenaline dump, as well as a reality check about where your skills are at. Most people that have the ability to push through the initial hit to the ego and keep going find it more than a little addicting.

I don't think you are on the right track by setting the goal of shooting slowly just to have a clean match. While it is worthwhile to avoid misses and less than ideal hits, you may find that no matter how slow you consciously go, brief moments of inattention still cause your hits to be worse than you want, but now you are slow as well. Rather than seeing the competitive journey as trading speed for accuracy and vice versa, I have found it best to see the journey as a constant pursuit for more of both.

Regarding the 19X: the G34 is optimized for competition, so if you want to jump in and buy all new gear to compete while staying with Glock, that would likely be the best choice. However, the 19X is a great gun and would not be holding you back until you are capable of extremely high level shooting. Most new competitors see all the fast guys with optimized equipment and copy what those guys are using in an attempt to buy skill. Then they find out their scores are basically the same, but at least they have all the cool-guy gear now.

Good luck and have fun with it!

CraigS
03-24-2018, 10:57 AM
I have only done 1 IDPA and 3 Steel Challenges. My over riding goal is to always make hits so I go as slow as I need to. I found that in SC I can't hear the hits, and advice here was if you wait to hear them you are going too slowly. So I take my time to aim but then move quickly to the next. As in lots of other endeavors, I feel that speed will come w/ more trigger time. If you aren't going to use an optic, the 34 has a longer sight radius so that would be my choice. OTOH, you will want to decide what your goal is. For me, I want to improve my skills if I ever need them for defense. So I choose to shoot a Beretta 92 because that is what our HD guns are. That DA first shot definitely makes things a little more difficult so, IF I were really trying to win, I would probably have an M&P full size. I wish i had thought to try this 10 yrs ago.

Jesting Devil
03-24-2018, 11:28 AM
Skill will always trump gear. A GM will crush you with a glock 26, does that make it better? No way, it's the guy running it.

Glock 17 vs 34 really doesn't matter much if any. If you load your own ammo you can load lighter with a 34 due to the longer barrel giving you more velocity for the same powder charge. Sight radius is often mentioned but if it makes any difference, it is a very small one. I shoot my CZ better at distance than my 34 even though the sight radius is much shorter, the trigger and ergonomics make a much bigger difference. A 34 feels a little softer shooting to me but I track the sights better with a 17. Measurable on drills? Not for me. Usually a 19 isn't ideal due to the grip length for reloading but with a 19x, that's not an issue. I haven't shot one so I can't say if it will be at a noticeable difference but I'd guess not. Maybe find a friend at a match with a 34 (guaranteed there will be some) and see if you can try it back to back with your gun. Anecdotally, I shot a friends 19gen5 remarkably well the other day and I want one now.

Once you have a gun that's good enough (full size frame, decent sights, ok trigger, and adequately accurate), I think the biggest factor is actually psychological. If you perceive your gear to be at any disadvantage, you may be worrying about that on a stage rather than how to aggressively execute your stage plan. If you find yourself thinking, "If I had a 34, maybe I wouldn't have missed that steel," then you'd be better off with a 34 where you won't have that question in your mind for the next 3 stages. The best gun to compete with is the one that gets out of your way so you can focus on developing your skill.

Welcome to the sport! :)

BN
03-24-2018, 11:44 AM
Am I at any disadvantage with the 19x?
[FONT=arial]My thinking is run the 19x for a while and get used to competing

Your 19x is a great pistol. It won't be holding you back. Get good with it and revisit the new gun idea in a year or two. ;)

olstyn
03-24-2018, 11:47 AM
Right on! The first competition is definitely both an adrenaline dump, as well as a reality check about where your skills are at. Most people that have the ability to push through the initial hit to the ego and keep going find it more than a little addicting.

So true. My first few matches, 5 or 6 years ago, I was like "Wow, I suck. I want to go again!" Ever since then, it's been a slow journey of gradual improvement. I'm still nowhere near where I'd like to be, but it is gratifying to look at scores and see that these days, some of my hit factors when I blow it on a stage are better than the ones I used to get when everything seemed to be going right, and of course the high end is much higher. :)

To the OP, as others have said, welcome to the addiction. It's going to cost you a ton of time and money, but you'll also build skill and have a lot of fun, so you'll most likely think the time and money are worth it.

Dismas316
03-24-2018, 04:44 PM
To the OP, as others have said, welcome to the addiction. It's going to cost you a ton of time and money, but you'll also build skill and have a lot of fun, so you'll most likely think the time and money are worth it.

That very thought certainly has crossed my mind. It's not like this "hobby", ok lifestyle, hasn't cost me a good bit of cash already, I can see it accelerating pretty quickly by getting the bug of competition.

At least from my perspective, it's a bit more justifiable. At least that's what I keep telling myself.

RJ
03-24-2018, 09:56 PM
Awesome Dismas!

Sounds like you are on the right track. Lots of the guys here offering good advice too.

Me, not so much. I’ve shot 4 USPSA matches in like three years lol. Did my last one Friday night, so hopefully my pace will pick up.

My thoughts would be to keep the 19X, and shoot it a lot. Or at least until you are doing really well. For me at least, I need to move faster, avoid dumb mistakes like leaving steel standing, and put holes in all the things that need holes. I shoot a Production Glock 19. A 17 or a 34 isn’t really going to help ‘me’ so much as avoiding shooting that ‘Mike’ Guy. :)

Good luck and hope you continue!

schüler
03-25-2018, 02:40 PM
...
[FONT=arial]Anyway, this has got me thinking about the often asked question of glock 17 or 34. Now that the gen 5’s have hit the market, any thoughts on this? My goal in the near term is to rent both to shoot side by side to get a good feel. Am I at any disadvantage with the 19x?
...

First, congrats for getting out there and getting real.

Your personal shooting goals will drive your pistol choice.

IIRC, Mike Hughes (NLT/SIRT guy) worked to USPSA Grand Master with stock G19s, complete with stock plastic sights. Not the easy route but his personal choice.

Gabe White uses a G34 for everything - for his own personal reasons. I believe he details some of that reasoning in his MASF and other interviews.

Clusterfrack
03-25-2018, 02:46 PM
Skiing: if you don’t risk falling, you’re not pushing your limits and you won’t improve much.

Competitive Shooting: if you don’t risk some penalties... same as above.

RJ
03-25-2018, 03:29 PM
I have a newbie question that I hope the OP doesn’t mind my asking.

Context is USPSA.

How do you guys suggest a newbie approach stage planing? As in, making sure all the things that need holes get holes?

The other night I had at least one target with 4 holes, and another target with 0 (which killed me on the stage; not only did I get two Mikes I got a FTE for -30).

I’m in P, so I start with 10+1. I try and count 1...2...3...10 then mag change. But I find my ‘planning’ goes out the window when that beep goes off.

Any mental processes you guys use? Or is it just a question of getting better at mentally accounting for the targets as I get more matches in?

GJM
03-25-2018, 03:57 PM
When possible, you don’t want to do a standing reload. Think of target arrays, which should be eight shots or less, movement areas, and more target arrays. Reload between target arrays.

BN
03-25-2018, 03:57 PM
How do you guys suggest a newbie approach stage planing? As in, making sure all the things that need holes get holes?


Steve Anderson used to have a stage plan that you printed off to use to plan each stage.

I usually go down range beyond all the vision barriers during the walk through so I can locate all the hidden targets. We used to say that if you moved your feet, you should be reloading. ;)

RJ
03-25-2018, 04:09 PM
When possible, you don’t want to do a standing reload. Think of target arrays, which should be eight shots or less, movement areas, and more target arrays. Reload between target arrays.

I like this a lot.

Dismas316
03-25-2018, 04:21 PM
Skiing: if you don’t risk falling, you’re not pushing your limits and you won’t improve much.

Competitive Shooting: if you don’t risk some penalties... same as above.

Great analogy. Love skiing and you're right. That makes perfect sense, I became a good skier just going for it. I need to remember this my next match.

I did another competition today, very high level shooters, Gabby Franco was in my squad so I was going against some master shooters. (I think a gun magazine was filming her today) Lots of STI's and CZ race guns and me with my simple 19x . I had one of the RO ask me what the heck was that back plate popping out every time I shot the gun. Told him it was my striker control unit or otherwise known as the "gadget". He kind of starred blankly at me. lol

6 stages of tons of running and gunning with mix of steal and paper. Today I did pretty will, however, went slower and my penalties were at a minimum. That said, I think as a few others have said, my times still were slow so it's clear I need to get used to going fast. My fundamentals were much better today, saw the sights well, and accuracy for me wasn't bad. I just have to learn to go faster.

Most stages ran minimum 2 mags with 15-20 rounds so lots of shooting. Most my misses were on the b zone, so wasn't off by much. Still waiting on them to post all the results tonight. Given the level competition I expect to be at the very back of the pack but that's ok, I have a lot I can improve on and it was loads of fun.

Side note, I am signed up for Paul Sharp/William April in May, which a part of it is to help develop speed and skill shooting, it can't get hear soon enough.

Clusterfrack
03-25-2018, 05:34 PM
George already gave some good advice. Here are a few thoughts:

-Shadow M or GM shooters in your division. On this Saturday's match an unclassified guy asked if he could follow me on the walk-throughs and ask questions about my stage plans. If it had been a major match I would have said no (too distracting), but I was totally happy to at a local match. The only caution I have about this is that some plans are better suited to certain strengths: e.g. do you shoot a 20yd partial or take it from a closer position?

Here's a quick menu:

-Read the stage description.
-Figure out where all the targets are and make sure your round count matches the stage description.
-Figure out where you need to be to shoot the targets.
-Note any DQ danger zones (close 180's, R-L reloads, etc.) and figure out how you will navigate them.
-Memorize the order in which you will shoot all the targets, including reloads.
-Visualize shooting the entire stage from the first person. Do this at least 10 times until your brain hurts, right up to the time when you're on deck.
-Visualize the stage one more time before you shoot.
-Do not change your plan in the last minutes before you shoot.

This will let you concentrate on shooting, not trying to remember your plan.

Cut yourself some slack on making mistakes. This game is really hard, and even the top shooters FU stage execution.

PS. I think counting shots during shooting is a bad idea. Numbers are hard and require too much brainpower. I would totally lose focus if I tried to do that. Figure out which target arrays require reloads between them.




I have a newbie question that I hope the OP doesn’t mind my asking.

Context is USPSA.

How do you guys suggest a newbie approach stage planing? As in, making sure all the things that need holes get holes?

The other night I had at least one target with 4 holes, and another target with 0 (which killed me on the stage; not only did I get two Mikes I got a FTE for -30).

I’m in P, so I start with 10+1. I try and count 1...2...3...10 then mag change. But I find my ‘planning’ goes out the window when that beep goes off.

Any mental processes you guys use? Or is it just a question of getting better at mentally accounting for the targets as I get more matches in?

Norville
03-25-2018, 05:57 PM
Great advice ^^^

My two cents would be “count the targets” since, as you learned, an FTE and two mikes really hurts. I have been shooting USPSA for two years, and the last match of the season I got a bit cocky and ended up skipping a target, putting me about 50 percent on the stage. After slapping myself in the forehead I was top 5 overall on the remaining stages but ended up 10th or so overall. This is because I didn’t count th targets as listed in the stage brief.

OP, congratulations on getting out there and shooting your first match. It’s addicting, a lot of fun and a great way to spend time and money. You can’t buy skill, so practice both dry and live. Work on movement and stage planning, as well as planning reloads as required. And don’t forget it is supposed to be fun.

RJ
03-25-2018, 06:14 PM
-Do not change your plan in the last minutes before you shoot.



I did this very thing at least twice Friday. Geez. :|

Thanks for the advice.

This stuff is really a lot of fun. Shooting 120 rounds Friday was like 10 times more enjoyable than going to the square range. Cost was a wash, too; just $15 for my local club.

Dismas316
03-25-2018, 07:08 PM
This stuff is really a lot of fun. Shooting 120 rounds Friday was like 10 times more enjoyable than going to the square range. Cost was a wash, too; just $15 for my local club.

I’m with on this, while I might not shoot as many rounds as I do in a typical range session, But I certainly come away with very specific areas that I need to focus on, get more out of it, and have much more fun in the process.

CraigS
03-27-2018, 09:25 AM
...
PS. I think counting shots during shooting is a bad idea. Numbers are hard and require too much brainpower. I would totally lose focus if I tried to do that. Figure out which target arrays require reloads between them.
Wow that is a great idea. I know it's completely different but this made me think back to sports car racing on a track. When I started I was always looking at the tach to decide when to shirt. There were a few occasions where there was too much going on to look at the tach and I discussed it / a friend afterwords. He recommended that during the first practice session, I figure out where I should shift, and pick out markers of some type on the track. From then on I shifted by location, not by tach reading. This would be the same - reload by location. Brilliant idea Clusterfrack.

scw2
03-27-2018, 09:42 AM
At the match, one thing that helps is to mentally prepared and visualized using clusterfrack's recommendation.

I'd add one thing, and that is to think about what you want to do, not what you want to avoid doing. So for example, if you have a partial target with a no shoot, instead of thinking to yourself do not shoot the white target, tell yourself that you will shoot the middle of the brown target area.

Peally
03-27-2018, 10:30 AM
Welcome to the fun zone. Don't worry about the G19, in a true baller's hands that gun would bring you a decent placement at nationals regardless. When you've been doing USPSA for a while you'll figure out what you'll want to replace it with (17, 34, whatever) but for now I would just have fun with it. I started with a big uncompetitive 45 in production and it wasn't until I was mid A class when I switched guns. I'm shooting a VP9 now but it's still bone stock aside from the sights and got me to M, and GM is entirely possible. Gear can help here and there but it's veeeeery low on the reason list for someone screwing something up on a stage.

Practice going fast, hitting A zones, and not forgetting targets. Easier said than done sometimes ;)

Clusterfrack
03-27-2018, 11:26 AM
At the match, one thing that helps is to mentally prepared and visualized using clusterfrack's recommendation.

I'd add one thing, and that is to think about what you want to do, not what you want to avoid doing. So for example, if you have a partial target with a no shoot, instead of thinking to yourself do not shoot the white target, tell yourself that you will shoot the middle of the brown target area.

Yes. ^^^this. Quick story:

A couple years ago I shot a stage really well, except for a M/No-Shoot on a tight partial. Dammit! But then someone taped a target before scoring and I got a reshoot. Yes!

I spent the rest of the time I had visualizing the stage, and focusing on NOT shooting that No-Shoot. Here’s what happened:

Conscious mind: this is going really well!

Subconscious: Shoots targets, reloads, moves.

Conscious mind: Oh oh, here comes that NS. Don’t shoot it!

Subconscious: shoots NS dead center.

Conscious: WTF??? Make that up!

Subconscious: shoots NS dead center, twice.

Moral of the story: subconscious doesn’t understand negatives.

Dismas316
04-15-2018, 05:26 PM
Did another competition today, my 3rd. It was a USPSA type all steel today, (very windy so paper was a no go). 6 stages, did pretty well but each stage but one I just a couple errors that killed my time. 5 sec penalties so accuracy as key. I did win one stage so that was awesome. It was pure speed on 6 targets with a mixture of square and circles in which you had to hit the squares twice, total 16 rounds with a reload. Ran it at 13 sec. getting better each time and had a bunch of fun. Pretty addicting, can't wait for the next one, if I can ever run these clean I'll be super thrilled and will do well.

Dismas316
04-15-2018, 07:45 PM
Edit above. I won my squad of 15, not the entire stage. 4th out of 23, the other squad had some high level shooters.

holmes168
04-15-2018, 09:31 PM
Where are you shooting at? I see your in North Texas....

Dismas316
04-15-2018, 10:06 PM
It was up at a place called Proactive defense up by Argle, near the racetrack on I-35. They have NTLF do matches once a month up there.

GuanoLoco
04-15-2018, 11:40 PM
Hardware is fine, you need to work on your software.

Get a dry fire training program. Ben Stoeger has good books. Steve Anderson has good books. Pick one. Develop your subconscious gun handling skills in dry fire so you don’t have to think about them. Test those skills in live fire practice.

Learn to develop and memorize a stage plan so you can execute it without thinking about it much. This comes with practice.

Going slow to get your hits isn’t going to work. You will get your hits, but you will also be so slow that it won’t matter.

Learn to grip properly, then grip hard and shoot as fast as you can see an acceptable sight picture. This will improve with dry/live practice, but any given daym it is what it is. Make a point of hustling and doing everything BUT the shooting as fast as you can.

The only thing you should be actively thinking about is seeing an acceptable sight picture.

Dismas316
04-16-2018, 07:57 AM
Hardware is fine, you need to work on your software.


Learn to develop and memorize a stage plan so you can execute it without thinking about it much. This comes with practice.


All ll good advice and I have been doing exactly that. But you’re right on with the software part. I think my biggest issue has been stage planning. I tend to overthink/over analyze and that gets me in a little trouble. (Keep changing the plan until Inshoot). Once Instarted sticking to the plan and have it memorized, I shoot much better.

The guy guy who stages everything really complicates things by design so you really have to think about what your’re doing and have a good plan, which is challenging but I do like it. I also tend to try and over complicate it at times. Big area to work on for me.

GuanoLoco
04-18-2018, 12:56 AM
All ll good advice and I have been doing exactly that. But you’re right on with the software part. I think my biggest issue has been stage planning. I tend to overthink/over analyze and that gets me in a little trouble. (Keep changing the plan until Inshoot). Once Instarted sticking to the plan and have it memorized, I shoot much better.

The guy guy who stages everything really complicates things by design so you really have to think about what your’re doing and have a good plan, which is challenging but I do like it. I also tend to try and over complicate it at times. Big area to work on for me.

More consistent execution of an acceptable stage plan will beat less consistent execution of the best stage plan, all day long.

olstyn
04-18-2018, 06:23 AM
More consistent execution of an acceptable stage plan will beat less consistent execution of the best stage plan, all day long.

To add to this, don't look at what the best shooter you know did and think you should try to do it the exact same way, especially if that would significantly change your plan. His/her plan may not be something you're capable of executing well; it's important to be aware of what your capabilities under timer-induced stress are. Just because the M-class shooter on your squad saved time by taking those two partial targets from 25 yards doesn't mean you should if there's an opportunity to take them from somewhere else that's closer/easier. (I say this from painful experience of having burned myself that way before. Mikes do worse things to your score than a few extra seconds ever will.)

kmanick
04-22-2018, 09:16 PM
Ran my first match today , a 3 stage outdoors. Used my shadow 2
rocked the first stage ( a speed shoot) came in 4th in the 2nd stage and totally choked the 3rd LOl!
lots of moving on the 3rd and I had no plan :( I winged it and got totally flustered.
the good news is I freaking loved it and can't wait for the next one coming up in May.
So much to learn.............

olstyn
04-22-2018, 09:32 PM
lots of moving on the 3rd and I had no plan :( I winged it and got totally flustered.

Figure out the path you want to take through the stage, including the exact spots where you're going to stop and shoot. Try to look at it a couple of different ways in order to determine which way requires the least number of steps, and also make absolutely sure you're seeing all of the targets. Sometimes targets are sneaky bastards and they hide, especially on "memory stages." From there, determine where you're going to do your reloads, and unless the stage design absolutely forces it, don't go with a plan that requires you to shoot the gun dry; it's good to have a few extra rounds available for make-up shots.

Of course, none of that is a guarantee that you won't screw up, but it's at least a good baseline way to start.

Welcome to the addiction. :)

Mr_White
04-23-2018, 06:38 AM
Great thread with many great posts! I have been so busy with work, training, and spending a few days with my family that I haven't shot a match in months and months. It is long past time to get back to it.

Clusterfrack's stage planning list is an outstanding summary.

kmanick
04-23-2018, 07:43 AM
Great thread with many great posts! I have been so busy with work, training, and spending a few days with my family that I haven't shot a match in months and months. It is long past time to get back to it.

Clusterfrack's stage planning list is an outstanding summary.


link?
I ended up running the stage I choked 2nd and after seeing how some of the other guys ran it
really opened my eyes.

Mr_White
04-23-2018, 07:54 AM
link?
I ended up running the stage I choked 2nd and after seeing how some of the other guys ran it
really opened my eyes.

Sorry, don't have it right this second but it's earlier in this thread.

kmanick
04-23-2018, 08:09 AM
Sorry, don't have it right this second but it's earlier in this thread.

found it thanks!!! :)
https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?30389-My-First-Competition-as-a-newbie&p=722808&viewfull=1#post722808

olstyn
04-23-2018, 10:13 PM
seeing how some of the other guys ran it really opened my eyes.

As far as I'm aware, there's no rule against working together to figure out the best way to run a stage. :) Even after you get some experience under your belt, bouncing ideas off of your squadmates can be really helpful to both you and them in solving the problems that complex or strangely laid-out stages present. I'm not sure I remember the last match at which I didn't discuss at least one or two stage plans with other shooters.

kmanick
04-24-2018, 10:27 AM
true we did discuss the other stages, actually one of the RO's walked me through the one I came in 2nd in, that helped tremendously.
I got sidetracked talking to someone else before the stage started that I flubbed (my own fault) and I was too close to the top of the order to watch anyone else really run it well.
My first match...... lesson learned.

Clusterfrack
04-24-2018, 11:14 AM
true we did discuss the other stages, actually one of the RO's walked me through the one I came in 2nd in, that helped tremendously.
I got sidetracked talking to someone else before the stage started that I flubbed (my own fault) and I was too close to the top of the order to watch anyone else really run it well.
My first match...... lesson learned.

This is a common problem, and easy to avoid. When there are 2-3 shooters before you, politely step away from the conversation and start visualizing the stage again.

Honestly, I'm pretty antisocial before I've shot a stage. Before I shoot, I'm busy memorizing and visualizing. I save the conversations for after I shoot and load/clean mags.

Mr_White
04-24-2018, 11:19 AM
This is a common problem, and easy to avoid. When there are 2-3 shooters before you, politely step away from the conversation and start visualizing the stage again.

Honestly, I'm pretty antisocial before I've shot a stage. Before I shoot, I'm busy memorizing and visualizing. I save the conversations for after I shoot and load/clean mags.

Definitely. And pretty much everybody in USPSA gets that so there's no issue. I really try not to talk to people when I can see that's what they are doing, or they are 2 or 3 shooters away from their turn. Nobody's ever had a problem with me thinking about the stage when I'm up soon.

kmanick
05-05-2018, 04:44 PM
shot my 2nd match today
went much smoother than the first
A 7 stage.
Really walked through each stage today before I shot them and had no major hiccups.
I did have a few mikes though that ruined my overall scoring for the day but those were on me
rushing :(
I'm hooked can't wait for the next one

kmanick
06-25-2018, 04:46 PM
Just shot my first match yesterday in Carry Optics instead of Production.
I shot a Steel Challenge and basically shaved an entire minute off of my total overall time compared to last months Steel challenge that I did in Production.
shaved approximately 2 seconds off of each string I shot (Hey I'm new to this game plenty of time to shave off :) )
I used my performance Center M&P 9L with a shield mini sight on it.
I think I may be hooked on using an optic.

Dismas316
09-30-2018, 06:58 AM
Quick update, been doing completions for a while and have been steadily improving. Have really started to minimize brain farts and have been picking up speed with my accuracy. Been finishing in the top 3rd, yesterday finished 2nd in limited out of 10 shooters in the class of production

I have mostly run my 19x but the last few times I ran by 19.5 and I clearly seem to shoot it better which is a bit of a surprise to me. My acccuracty is speed is much better, tighter groups and it seems I get on target quicker. I have the AmeriGlo orange dot (square w/ black out U rears). My 19x has Dawson precision chargers (green) which is pretty easy to pick up. I assumed the larger grip would give me a bit better control but that’s not the case at all. I seem to really lock in the 19 much better with my grip and pick up the sights immediately. I seem to be on the A zone with my shots much more higher percentage with the 19 and always tight groups even on a miss. I think at this point I will relegate the 19x as a backup option. Odd because it’s a real joy to shoot and I love the feel but it looks like it may be more of a range gun vs what I use to compete with.

Anyway just some observations, curious if other have a similiar experience.