DotW 19: 2 Shot SHO & WHO Draws

[joshs]

Please read the rules (http://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?1837-Drill-of-the-Week) before participating in this thread.

Week 19: 2 Shot SHO & WHO Draws
results may be posted until 11:59pm EST on Monday 13-February-2012.

Range: 7yd
Target: 3x5 card
Start position: holstered
Rounds fired: 100

This week we are going to work on strong hand only and weak hand only draws. Continuing with the trend from last week, we are going to repeat similar techniques multiple times to improve skill.

Draw and fire two shots to the 3x5 card strong hand only with no time limit. Repeat for a total of 25 repetitions. Do not use you weak hand to clear you cover garment. If you are not confident in your ability to hit a 3x5 card at 7 yards strong hand only, then reduce the distance as required.

Repeat the drill weak hand only. If you do not have experience drawing with your weak hand, do not perform the weak hand portion of the drill from the holster. As an alternative, you may start from the ready position. If you are not confident in your ability to hit a 3x5 card at the distance you shot the strong hand string, you may further reduce the distance for the weak hand string.

Please report the following when you post your results in this thread:

starting position (ready position, open holster, retention holster, or concealed)
number of hits strong hand only
number of hits weak hand only




Training with firearms is an inherently dangerous activity. Be sure to follow all safety protocols when using firearms or practicing these drills. These drills are provided for information purposes only. Use at your own risk.

[jetfire]

Clarification: when you say weak hand draws, do you mean drawing the gun with your strong hand and transitioning it to your weak hand ala Bianchi Cup or do you mean actually reaching over and drawing the gun only utilizing your weak hand?

[joshs]

Clarification: when you say weak hand draws, do you mean drawing the gun with your strong hand and transitioning it to your weak hand ala Bianchi Cup or do you mean actually reaching over and drawing the gun only utilizing your weak hand?

Actually drawing with your weak hand. Again, if you do not have experience drawing with your weak hand (not directed at you Caleb), do not attempt the WHO string from the holster.

[jetfire]

No worries, I just wanted to make sure I knew what the drill was set up for.

[BaiHu]

HKP30L
SHO from open CompTac Straight drop
WHO was from compressed low ready
number of hits strong hand only: 46 at 7 yds
number of hits weak hand only: 50 at 5 yds

I 'know' how to do a cross draw, but I've only done it dry firing and with all the repetitions that it was going to require today, I thought I should start on a day I didn't feel I HAD to do it for a DOTW.

I started to feel a little too 'good' on my SHO, and squeezed a few second shots off a little too quickly and pulled those 4 just a tad high or low of the card.

The WHO I was very pleased with, b/c I haven't done much work on WHO and I will actually start a thread here about that: http://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?3042-When-should-you-begin-training-WHO-skills&p=50719#post50719

SHO 7 yds from open draw
http://i739.photobucket.com/albums/xx38/djdemarco/20120206_165323.jpg



WHO 5 yds from compressed low ready
http://i739.photobucket.com/albums/xx38/djdemarco/20120206_170434.jpg

BTW, I shot with a solid press out, but my follow up shot was slow-MUCH slower than ToddG's.

[ToddG]

SHO from concealment
WHO from high ready (because I wasn't sure the range would be OK with my WHO draw gymnastics)

Range for both runs was 7yd.
SHO, -5
WHO, -4

I tried to go at a realistic pace without sacrificing accuracy, and I made sure I was able to break the shot at or shortly after extension (press out) rather than punching the gun out and then aiming it while it was steady. I got 91% of my hits, which tells me my speed was just about right to push myself without going stupid.

[BaiHu]

SHO from concealment
WHO from high ready (because I wasn't sure the range would be OK with my WHO draw gymnastics)

Do you have a video of your method of WH draw? I've seen two and practiced two in the house with snap caps, but never ran it live.

The first is the roll the pistol across the belly version. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aYAlQA2A6J0

The second is the knees clamping as a intermediary position. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YNbXJUI5YuE

Was there a preferred method you guys had in mind for this drill?

[Ptrlcop]

G17 RTF2, Safariland 6360

SHO= -6

5from Holster/ 20 from the low ready:
WHO=-5

On duty my weak hand draw is my vest carried G27, since I wasnt running a bug I shot most from low ready.

El Snatcho, was biting me today.

[ToddG]

Do you have a video of your method of WH draw?

I do not use either of the techniques you mentioned. Because of the high degree of risk involved drawing WHO from aiwb, I will not put up a video of it. I do teach it in my aiwb-specific class, however, and also show it to aiwb-carrying students in AFHF if they ask.

Sorry if that comes across as "you gotta pay me to see it."

[BaiHu]

I do not use either of the techniques you mentioned. Because of the high degree of risk involved drawing WHO from aiwb, I will not put up a video of it. I do teach it in my aiwb-specific class, however, and also show it to aiwb-carrying students in AFHF if they ask.

Sorry if that comes across as "you gotta pay me to see it."

Completely understandable. Glad I haven't tried it live, then. I've also seen guys reach behind their back for an OWB at 12ish and further. I will be in RI this summer for AFHF, do you recommend I invest in an AIWB in addition to bringing my usually CompTac straight drop OWB rig? Sorry for off topic, but this drill really moves into the OT realm for me regarding the WH draw.

[DocGKR]

So clearly this is not intended to be a "slow fire" drill in the typical bullseye tradition, but rather a drill to be shot at a relaxed, but realistic pace that ensures the majority of shots are good hits. A small, but subtle distinction.

[C45P312]

Starting position: G17 in 6004
- 18/25 SHO @ 7yd
- 15/25 WHO @ 7yd

Man it was wired drawing WHO from a 6004. Took a couple of dry runs since it's been awhile, but i got it down. I really need to slow down when shooting WHO. I felt a need to rush for some reason.

[turbolag23]

Because of the high degree of risk involved drawing WHO from aiwb, I will not put up a video of it. I do teach it in my aiwb-specific class, however, and also show it to aiwb-carrying students in AFHF if they ask.


Could you go into a little more detail about the risk of WHO from aiwb? I know you teach aiwb students extra precaution, is this just compounded by the fact that your not drawing with your dominant hand? I felt it was easier and maybe somewhat safer than drawing WHO from strong side. You dont have to reach as far and can get a better initial grip.

[ToddG]

Guys, this is not going to turn into a "how to draw WHO" thread. This thread is for reporting results on the drill. You'll note that I did not draw WHO, myself.

[jthhapkido]

Start: G17, Concealed AIWB
Distance: 7 yards
SHO: -6
WHO: -5
(I have fewer bad habits with WHO. Can't shoot as fast, but handle the trigger better.)

I actually did about 10 shots of the WHO from the holster. The rest were from a compressed ready position. (Not full retention, but close.)

Whew! That was a LOT of single-hand shooting. Don't normally do that much one-hand-only shooting in one sitting.

[poptopjr]

Starting Position: Ready
Strong Hand Hits: 40
Weak Hand Hits: 33

[98z28]

starting position: concealed for all reps (long-sleeve untucked shirt)
Sig P226R 9mm, Richie Leather Vertical Speed Scabbard
number of hits strong hand only: 46 (-4)
number of hits weak hand only: 46 (-4)


I went at a somewhat realistic pace SHO through the entire drill (using a press out). I tried to do the same WHO, but missed 4 of the first ten rounds. I emptied the gun, did some dry-fire reps WHO, and then finished the drill. Going at a glacial pace, I managed to keep the remaining rounds on the card.

Trying to shoot WHO with both eyes open is a bitch. I have been experimenting with using my left eye when shooting WHO this week and didn't realize how much I screwed myself up. With the first ten rounds, I couldn't decide which sight picture and which target I should be looking at (both eyes open). After working it out with a few dry-fire reps, I settled on keeping everything the same when shooting WHO as I do when shooting 2H or SHO: Use the gun on the left and the target on the right. Not sure why it seemed like a good idea to try something different...

I used iron sights for the first 15 reps and the laser for the last 10 reps with each hand. I could not reliably activate the laser WHO, so I wound up using the irons a good bit even when trying to use the laser.

[DocGKR]

G17 w/RMR07 in an AIWB Fricke Seraphim concealed under a long sweat shirt and soft shell TNF vest.

Shot at 7 yds on 3x5 card.

SH drawn from holster: -3 (ave = 3.26 sec)
WH drawn from holster: -3 (ave = 4.88 sec)

Note that all the missed shots were low and within 0.5" of the bottom of the card.

To get a sense of pace and cadence, I timed all my runs--the WH only draw and shots were about 1.5 sec slower than SH only.

My FAST sucked today--best I could run clean was a 6.30 sec; on the other hand, I started the day by easily passing my cold run on the Defoor Test #1!

[167]

Pistol: Beretta 96D

Starting Position: Concealed IWB

SHO: 47/50

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-7vStRxsltkA/TzYYbGAuw_I/AAAAAAAAAPc/fepAdNviSzs/s320/025.JPG


WHO: 43/50

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-cHrsW3TNTvg/TzYYfatXvvI/AAAAAAAAAPk/roxg13dPgfQ/s320/024.JPG

[joshs]

SHO - concealed start: -3

WHO - from the ready: -4

[CraigBos]

SHO from ready
WHO from ready

Range for both runs was 5 yd.
SHO, -14
WHO, -12

This was a very good drill for me. I've never taken so many WHO shots in a row. It fatigued me. I need to work out or something!

I have changed numerous things in the last couple of weeks: firmer grip, pressing with the pad of my finger instead of the tip, weight more forward. As a result, I have been relearning how to shoot, thus the many misses. I can shoot ragged holes in 3x5 cards from 5 yd, but not consistently. Hoping for better with more practice.

Thanks!

[Mr_White]

SHO, AIWB concealed, 43 hits, 7 misses

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7036/6870393087_8c0efd2581.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/52790396@N08/6870393087/) DotW 19_SHO (http://www.flickr.com/photos/52790396@N08/6870393087/) by OrigamiAK (http://www.flickr.com/people/52790396@N08/), on Flickr

WHO, AIWB concealed, 47 hits, 3 misses

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7199/6870393331_ba7d7a128f.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/52790396@N08/6870393331/) DotW 19_WHO (http://www.flickr.com/photos/52790396@N08/6870393331/) by OrigamiAK (http://www.flickr.com/people/52790396@N08/), on Flickr

No timer, went pretty slowly, worked on safe draws, especially WHO. No pressout type stuff, just worked plain old trigger control.

[BN]

Shot this with my brand new Gen 4 G-17 with Ameriglo sights.

Ready position for all strings.

7 yards.

SHO -6
WHO -3

[JFK]

Well looks like I need some weak hand work.


SHO - Starting from Concealment AIWB C&D holster HK P30
WHO - Starting from low ready

SHO - Down 4
WHO - Down 14

[fuse]

SHO from concealed AIWB draw
WHO via a SHO draw, then passing it to the weak hand IPSC-style.

SHO -13
WHO -8

Yeah. Garbage.