RMS Shield red dot

[GJM]

A few buddies have been encouraging me to try out a RMS Shield red dot (https://www.brownells.com/optics-mounting/electronic-sights/reflex-sights/reflex-mini-sight-prod102336.aspx?dym=y). Since I have broken a half dozen Delta Point Pro Optics since fall, and dislike the small, tinted, curved display of the RMR, I was open to checking out the RMS.

I just received both a RMS Shield optic and the MOS specific mounting plate from Brownell’s. The plate was spendy at $85, and the optic was $400, which suddenly seems expensive with the drop in DP Pro and RMR prices. My initial reaction when taking the optic out of the box was on a per ounce basis, this thing is ungodly expensive. I was impressed by the MOS mounting plate. Very low, and it had to be slid in from the side like a Unity Atom set-up. I loctited the base plate but not the two screws securing the RMS to the mounting plate, while still in evaluation mode.

Here are some pictures. First, the RMS and my back up sights, a regular height MOS rear from 10-8 and a .230 front HD, that I previously verified zero with prior to mounting the optic.

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Next is a comparison of the RMS and a DP Pro.

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Here is the RMS and an RMR.

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Finally, a side view of the RMR, showing the standard height reserve sights.

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I threw away the included 2032 battery and started with a Duracell, that apparently offers the best duration in a red dot. Prior to hitting the range, I rough zeroed the red dot to align with my iron sights, and that got me within three inches at 25 yards. 25 rounds later, I was happy with my zero, and started a regular practice session.

Slight digress on the RMS controls. No accelerometer to sleep the dot, like on the DP Pro, so the optic is on until the battery dies. That feature on the DP Pro has broken on nearly every one of my nine units, and on a number of DP Pro units owned by friends. Also unlike the DP Pro, there is an auto adjusting red dot, and no manual control over dot intensity. In my session today, the auto intensity functioned worked perfectly, but I plan to test this in a variety of lighting conditions. Thee is a battery tray, that allows you to replace the battery without removing the optic, although I have seen at least one comment that tray is fragile. You could also remove the unit and change the battery like the RMR, if it lasts the specified two years referenced in the instructions.

Shooting the RMS was very natural, as the red dot is very low — the same height as your iron sights. This also eliminates, or at least greatly reduces optic/barrel offset, that is an inch or so with the DP Pro, and has me holding above a one inch square at 7 yards, to hit the square. I love how clear the display is, and it makes it easy to use your iron sights through the display. The display feels larger than the RMR, but smaller than the DP Pro. That said, I never felt the display small. To benchmark it, I shot Gabe’s entire test, and went 6/8 at the Turbo level, with just the two Bill drills slightly over time.

I need to shoot it a lot more than the 350 rounds I did today, to evaluate durability, retention of zero, and general suitability for gaming or EDC. For gaming, if it holds up, it is far superior to the RMR, because of the display size, shape and color. For EDC, it is intriguing as it sits low minimizing printing, and you can use your regular iron sights as reserve sights.

When I went to photograph it at home after leaving the range, both screws holding the optic to the base plate had come loose, but I never noticed a shift in zero, which is probably because of the large bosses in the base plate and how snug that plate fits in the MOS slot. I added blue loctite and will watch for this in future sessions.

[Sigfan26]

Best advice: don’t drop it, don’t get it wet, and read the instructions on cleaning the lens VERY CAREFULLY.


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[GJM]

Best advice: don’t drop it, don’t get it wet, and read the instructions on cleaning the lens VERY CAREFULLY.


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Thanks, here is a link to cleaning instructions:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=smNQvgOLzXc

[Sigfan26]

Thanks, here is a link to cleaning instructions:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=smNQvgOLzXc

I much prefer a TShirt and hooker spit.


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[CR78]

I'm really pumped to see you put one of these through it's paces in a hard use, but not deliberately abusive, scenario. Thanks for doing this. The new RMSc looks intriguing for a G43 too, and if your RMS proves worthy, I may a test the RMSc.

[Sigfan26]

I'm really pumped to see you put one of these through it's paces in a hard use, but not deliberately abusive, scenario. Thanks for doing this. The new RMSc looks intriguing for a G43 too, and if your RMS proves worthy, I may a test the RMSc.

Regular RMS fits a 43 (it just over hangs the edges slightly). The RMS-C is only thinner, that’s it.


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[GJM]

I spent a fair amount of time last night, and this morning, dry firing the RMS inside, in a variety of lighting conditions, from totally dark through typical indoor lighting. The auto intensity has worked perfectly. I am interested in what happens in direct, morning sunshine, and when the emitter gets moisture on it.

I really appreciate how low the RMS dot sits, at regular iron sight height, and how this contributes to the dot being exceptionally natural and quick to acquire.

[Rex G]

I had been considering trying one of these, with the thinner base plate option, on my G19 MOS. Thanks for sharing your results with us.

[Kyle Reese]

Aren't these made in the UK? How is the warranty service / CS on these?

[GJM]

Aren't these made in the UK? How is the warranty service / CS on these?


Yes, and unknown. I bought from Brownell’s, and hopefully they stand behind it if needed.

[Rex G]

Yes, and unknown. I bought from Brownell’s, and hopefully they stand behind it if needed.

It is good to see that Brownells now has these. I almost ordered from an evil-bay dealer in the UK.

[BillSWPA]

Brownells allowed me to return a sight pusher even though I made it clear to them that it was not in any condition for resale. I would buy from them if they carry the product.



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[BigT]

Mine worked fine when I cleaned it with a t shirt.


When I found out I was wrong and tried to follow instruction I turned it into a bathroom window.

[GJM]

Mine worked fine when I cleaned it with a t shirt.


When I found out I was wrong and tried to follow instruction I turned it into a bathroom window.

Please elaborate on this, as my wife just picked up the “appropriate” cleaning solvent from Home Depot.

[Sigfan26]

It is best to use compressed air before cleaning the lens.

[El Cid]

I spent a fair amount of time last night, and this morning, dry firing the RMS inside, in a variety of lighting conditions, from totally dark through typical indoor lighting. The auto intensity has worked perfectly. I am interested in what happens in direct, morning sunshine, and when the emitter gets moisture on it.

I really appreciate how low the RMS dot sits, at regular iron sight height, and how this contributes to the dot being exceptionally natural and quick to acquire.

How is it with a weapon light? I ask because my RMR06 on auto will dim in a dark room, but if I turn on the X300 I can't see the dot and it won't be brighter.

[GJM]

How is it with a weapon light? I ask because my RMR06 on auto will dim in a dark room, but if I turn on the X300 I can't see the dot and it won't be brighter.


Just tested with X300, and in a dark room with the light on, the dot is too dim to be quickly usable. However, those iron sights look marvelous when silhouetted by the WML!

[Inkwell 41]

Shield announced a "waterproof" version coming Q2 2018, at SHOT

[GJM]

Shield announced a "waterproof" version coming Q2 2018, at SHOT

With red dot sights, it is smart to dollar cost average by staggering purchases.

[El Cid]

Just tested with X300, and in a dark room with the light on, the dot is too dim to be quickly usable. However, those iron sights look marvelous when silhouetted by the WML!

Excellent point! I forgot this optic lets you use the stock irons.

[ADK]

Shield UK was great about refunding me for the two I had bought directly (one still unopened) after the lens showed bad scratching after a couple months of use and rain exposure totally killed it. Was awesome to use until the issues popped up. Can't trust for edc. Currently happy with RMR type 2. Even if shield were to come out with glass lensed, waterproof rms, it still would likely not be RMR type 2 durable. And might need to be slightly bigger/taller, obviating its one big advantage. Never say never though, lots of room for progress in slide riding red dots.

[jeep45238]

Anybody with astigmatism using this? How’s the starburst (aimpoints are no longer usable beyond 50y on a rifle for me now, as a reference) ?


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[GJM]

None of the available red dots for use on a pistol have reached the usefulness of an aimpoint on a carbine.

[Kyle Reese]

None of the available red dots for use on a pistol have reached the usefulness of an aimpoint on a carbine.Hence my reluctance to buy until the durability improves.

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[jeep45238]

None of the available red dots for use on a pistol have reached the usefulness of an aimpoint on a carbine.

My concern was about astigmatism/starbursting - I only mentioned aimpoints because they're commonly used, but I can't use them due to the astigmatism. I'd like to try my hand at one of these in the coming years, as I think it can provide feedback that could be difficult to catch with irons.

Not trying to be a smart ass :-)

[feudist]

None of the available red dots for use on a pistol have reached the usefulness of an aimpoint on a carbine.

Can you clarify? Durability or feature set? Or just the whole concept for CCW?

[BigT]

Please elaborate on this, as my wife just picked up the “appropriate” cleaning solvent from Home Depot.

The appropriate solvent is apparently not available here. So the importers gave me an alternative involving earbuds (Q tips) and dishwashing liquid.

After that it was useless.

Before that it was a spectacular gaming optic that worked really well for me.

I carried it for a while as well. While it wasn't great with a X300 the rest of the time I found the auto dimming much more real world useful than the manual adjustment on the DPP which was never seemed to never be on the right brightness.

As a result I have given up on red dots for carry until the next generation hopefully fixes that.

[Cheap Shot]

It is best to use compressed air before cleaning the lens.

Agreed, I also use a brush for lens cleaning a telescope after application of compressed air. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0006NAS7G/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o06_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1.

I'm comfortable using any cleaning procedures for glasses or scope lens to clean my RMR

[GJM]

https://www.guns.com/news/2018/12/06/shield-sights-announce-new-waterproof-version-of-their-rms-video

[vandal]

https://www.guns.com/news/2018/12/06/shield-sights-announce-new-waterproof-version-of-their-rms-video

Based on the RMS not the RMSc right?


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[Jamie]

https://www.guns.com/news/2018/12/06/shield-sights-announce-new-waterproof-version-of-their-rms-video

Looking forward to the GJM T&E. If it'll last 6 months of your schedule they might be on to something. :cool:

[JclInAtx]

On second look the firearm blog seems to have the same info, just formatted differently....
https://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2018/12/12/new-rms-w-red-dot-sight-from-shield-sights/

[Up1911Fan]

Any updates on this GJM?

[GJM]

Any updates on this GJM?

To my knowledge, not shipping yet. I sent a VP9 SK slide and an RMS Shield to Primary a few days ago.

[Up1911Fan]

To my knowledge, not shipping yet. I sent a VP9 SK slide and an RMS Shield to Primary a few days ago.

Just meant on the RMS in general.

[GJM]

Just meant on the RMS in general.

Let you know once the SK gets back, but I have liked it on other pistols.

[ChrisLapre]

I’ve had one on a G17 MOS for over two years now. Just changed the battery about four months ago. I have over 3k thru it with no issues and have carried it. I treat it like a carry pistol but not slinging it around or running it off of ballistic shields and its done just fine.

As for the lens scratching? Yep it happened. A trip to AutoZone to get headlight restorer and a little polishing... just like new.
Supposed to be coming out with a ruggedized version with a better lens. If they do I think it will be a great choice for hard use. Nothing else comes close to the low profile of this sight.


QUOTE=GJM;845955]Let you know once the SK gets back, but I have liked it on other pistols.[/QUOTE]

[Mike C]

ChrisLapre any info on time frame for ruggadized version? I keep looking for the RMSw variant and can’t find stocking dealer here in US for that specific model.

[GJM]

35236

[miller_man]

As just an outside observer of red dots so far, I have always liked the shield the best - small footprint and being able to use factory/normal sights is pretty awesome. Hope this new model does well and proves durable.

[flyrodr]

I sent an email to Shield yesterday and received a quick reply saying the RMSw would not be available until April.

[cornstalker]

I really want to try one of these, but to be honest, I am hell on my stuff. I don't see a plastic lens holding up to me. If it's anything like every pair of sunglasses I have owned, I will have it scratched up beyond being usable in about a month... Lol

[Mike C]

GJM, I absolutely hate buying anything overseas or through an overseas vender, even if it's the MFG. I avoid it at all costs if possible, I want some to deal with someone in the US that I can hold accountable as I've had poor luck with other things in the past and had better luck getting responses from US retailers. Thanks though. I'd also like to see if this ruggedized version has the glass sense that I've heard might be available.

[YVK]

I sent an email to Shield yesterday and received a quick reply saying the RMSw would not be available until April.

A dude who's done some of my Glock milling (I mentioned them to you in my pm) said the same after talking to them in person. They also said something about RMS maybe getting a glass lens at some point but that's unconfirmed.

[El Cid]

GJM, I absolutely hate buying anything overseas or through an overseas vender, even if it's the MFG. I avoid it at all costs if possible, I want some to deal with someone in the US that I can hold accountable as I've had poor luck with other things in the past and had better luck getting responses from US retailers. Thanks though. I'd also like to see if this ruggedized version has the glass sense that I've heard might be available.

I got my RMS from Brownells. They’ve always been helpful for me.

[GJM]

I got my RMS from Brownells. They’ve always been helpful for me.

That is where I bought my RMS a few months back.

[Mike C]

I'd love to buy from Brownells through the PF link but they aren't stocking the RMSw yet I need to call and ask when it might be available I just haven't had squat for time to sit on the phone with them or anyone else for the matter. I'm really only interested in the w version because the frame supports on the sides look much stronger and the boasted water proofing. Thanks I will get off my butt and call them.

[GJM]

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[GJM]

I liked the RMS on the VP9SK enough that I had one direct milled on a VP9B. Here it is.

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For pure gaming use, the display is definitely smaller than the DP Pro, but for EDC use the display size is reasonable. The best part is how it plays with OEM height sights. Here I have the OEM rear paired with the Night Fision front. With the RMS, the iron sights are very usable until the dot appears.

I haven’t spent much time lately working my draw with the VP9 to steel, so I decided to test the RMS display for one shot draws to an eight inch steel at ten yards. The exercise was to be patient waiting for the dot and see how the speed worked out.


https://youtu.be/S-UauisJQ0g

[Mike C]

GJM how are they holding up? Are you tracking round count on them?

[GJM]

GJM how are they holding up? Are you tracking round count on them?

I am not a round count tracker, but will report if they break, as I do track dot failures.

[Mike C]

I am not a round count tracker, but will report if they break, as I do track dot failures.

I don't imagine that you are considering your volume. I guess the better question is do you actually trust it for carry at this point? I am more looking at them for a training tool to help with shot calling and refining accuracy but at some point would like to look at them for permanent fixtures and as primary sighting.

[GJM]

I don't imagine that you are considering your volume. I guess the better question is do you actually trust it for carry at this point? I am more looking at them for a training tool to help with shot calling and refining accuracy but at some point would like to look at them for permanent fixtures and as primary sighting.

Still evaluating, but how well this optic coexists with conventional iron sights is a major plus for making me want to like it.

I am still waiting on an Acro, but I wouldn’t be surprised if a ruggedized DP Pro will still be best for gaming, an Acro for duty and and RMS-W for EDC.

[cornstalker]

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Do you have the RMSc model or just the RMS?

[GJM]

Do you have the RMSc model or just the RMS?

RMS

[flyrodr]

I emailed Shield earlier today and asked again about when we could expect to see the RMS-W. A quick reply said they should be available to ship at the end of this month.

[El Cid]

My Shield RMS will start getting a workout soon. I plan to start using the G19 it’s on as my match gun. I messed up though on the holster. When people say a “Roland Special” will work in any G34 holster that’s not exactly true. It works in plenty of them (such as Safariland ALS). Despite owning a G34 it failed to register in my brain the nose of a 34 is tapered and a KKM comp is not. So I’ll be borrowing or buying a heat gun this weekend. Not the holster makers fault.

[GJM]

36873

[23JAZ]

Still evaluating, but how well this optic coexists with conventional iron sights is a major plus for making me want to like it.

I am still waiting on an Acro, but I wouldn’t be surprised if a ruggedized DP Pro will still be best for gaming, an Acro for duty and and RMS-W for EDC.
Has anyone tested the RMSC? Thinking of adding one to my G48.

[GJM]

Has anyone tested the RMSC? Thinking of adding one to my G48.

Pretty sure it was the “C” that Walther was using in the factory PPS/optic offering.

[LtDave]

Correct. The Walther uses the RMSc.

I've had mine for about 10 months now as my EDC. No issues at all with the optic. An extremely accurate pistol/optic combo.

[backtrail540]

p/Bwmxauqhtfd

Looks like the regular rms will be available with a glass lense soon...assuming it's a carry over/upgrade from the soon to be released rms-w.

edit- apparently it didn't bring over the text portion of the post. If you click on the link it says glass options will soon be available, though they are not listed on the site yet.

[evi1joe]

My G43X is on its way back with an RMS-C on top...next stop is the optometrist to see if I can fix the astigmatism to clear up the dot.
I figure I'll likely upgrade to an RMS-W with glass at some point.


NOTE: I WANT to put an ACRO P1 on my other G43X, but (a) I need a few other guinea pigs to try it first and see what they think, and (b) I kinda want to see the HOLOSUN 509T, even though it's going to be very tall (like DPP height) I think...so it'll be interesting to see if the reticle helps with speed more than the height hurts speed (I find the lower SHIELD reticle is easier to see on the draw than a milled RMR for me).

[TAZ]

My G43X is on its way back with an RMS-C on top...next stop is the optometrist to see if I can fix the astigmatism to clear up the dot.
I figure I'll likely upgrade to an RMS-W with glass at some point.


NOTE: I WANT to put an ACRO P1 on my other G43X, but (a) I need a few other guinea pigs to try it first and see what they think, and (b) I kinda want to see the HOLOSUN 509T, even though it's going to be very tall (like DPP height) I think...so it'll be interesting to see if the reticle helps with speed more than the height hurts speed (I find the lower SHIELD reticle is easier to see on the draw than a milled RMR for me).

Who did the machine work for the RMS-C? I’m thinking of that optic for my 48.

[evi1joe]

Who did the machine work for the RMS-C? I’m thinking of that optic for my 48.

MKP Arms did it. It's $75 and they often get the gun milled and shipped back within 2-3 days. So far a lot of SIG P365 guys have been happy with them, and they've done a lot SHIELD RMS cuts (the RMS-C uses the same footprint as the RMS). They charge $20 for a slide-cover, and they don't do any coating--so I'll get the G43X done locally with DLC or cerakote.

https://www.mkparmsusa.com/home.html

[Trukinjp13]

MKP Arms did it. It's $75 and they often get the gun milled and shipped back within 2-3 days. So far a lot of SIG P365 guys have been happy with them, and they've done a lot SHIELD RMS cuts (the RMS-C uses the same footprint as the RMS). They charge $20 for a slide-cover, and they don't do any coating--so I'll get the G43X done locally with DLC or cerakote.

https://www.mkparmsusa.com/home.html

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190508/ed88e22bc1699e13bf51f49e30b4bf5e.jpgthis is high temp engine paint. I painted this slide 1 1/2 years ago. Has been in the Deep South and Michigan winters. Worked damn well for 8$



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[RAM Engineer]

Any updates on how the Waterproof RMS sights are doing, and/or any of Shield's offerings? I was waiting on a waterproof RMSc for my G43, but it seems like they're not planned at this time.

Also, suggest moving this thread into the Red Dot Sight subforum.

[Lon]

My RMSc’d PPS M2 is still going strong. Had it over a year now.

Edit to add: I changed the battery once, when I switched it from my PPS to my Q5.

[Up1911Fan]

How are these holding up? Any word on the W or a glass lens? I want a small dot on a 43X, shield or the sig RZ?

[GJM]

I believe the RMSc and new Romeo 0 share the same mounting footprint.

[Up1911Fan]

That would be awesome. I like options.

[flyrodr]

Any updates on how the Waterproof RMS sights are doing, and/or any of Shield's offerings? I was waiting on a waterproof RMSc for my G43, but it seems like they're not planned at this time.

Got my RMSw a couple of weeks ago; ordered it directly from Shield back in May, I think it was.

At Mark Housel's now, getting fitted onto a P365.

[Up1911Fan]

Got my RMSw a couple of weeks ago; ordered it directly from Shield back in May, I think it was.

At Mark Housel's now, getting fitted onto a P365.

Would love pics and impressions when you get it back.

[flyrodr]

Would love pics and impressions when you get it back.

Will do.

[Shooter Opinions]

How are these holding up? Any word on the W or a glass lens? I want a small dot on a 43X, shield or the sig RZ?

Just got an RMSw in and the glass lens option should be a custom option by October.

[flyrodr]

Picked up my P365 from Mark Housel this afternoon, after he installed the Shield RMSw. Quick range trip followed. I'm pretty sure I'm going to like it. I can certainly shoot it much more accurately with the dot on it than with irons. I had forgotten to put a holster in the car before going to pick up the pistol, so was only able to shoot it from a ready position. The dot acquisition was surprisingly quick for a first time outing. Haven't had a chance to evaluate the auto brightness. And don't intend to intentionally evaluate the unit's water resistance! Will report on durability as I get more rounds through it.

41856

[flyrodr]

Had a question about overhang on either side. Slide is 0.9" wide, and dot body is 1.0" wide, so overhang on either side is 0.05". Actually, since top edges are rounded, and lower edge of dot body is in that rounded part, there's a bit more overhang, but it's nothing objectionable.

[flyrodr]

Just an update on the P365/Shield RMSw combo. Several hundred rounds in, and both still working well. No hiccups from either.

Thoughts on the Shield. As this is the only Shield optic I have, I can only presume its operation is similar to the other Shields. I have yet to determine the battery life. The unit has no on-off switch, and only auto-adjustment for brightness. A plastic cover is provided to "cut off" the unit when not in use. It's not a tight, secure fit, and while it will work OK in a static situation, it can be easily knocked off (as, for instance, being carried in a range bag). My use has so far been restricted almost entirely to an indoor range, although I have taken the gun from indoors directly outdoors, and the dot brightness has adjusted OK. I do wish the dot was a bit larger. Size-wise, the Shield is a good match for the P365. Having recently been spoiled by shifting a Glock from an RMR to an SRO's picture window view, I'm not too unhappy with the Shield's window size.

As for the P365, it hasn't missed a beat. It is a "bouncy" little gun, and in attempting to control it with a tighter grip, have caused it to fail to lock back on an empty mag several times (by grabbing the slide lock). It works, or worked, in a pocket holster (about as well as any gun does), but adding the dot now pretty much limits it to a holster. Which is OK; Tony at JW knocked out a couple of options for me. An IWB for primary carry, and an OWB for the range (a couple I frequent restrict shooters to OWBs). One note about the mags. I have about a half dozen of them (10-, 12- and 15-rounders), and they all exhibit a "catch" when loading the fourth round. I don't know if there's an easy fix, but it's a minor nit.

It's an interesting combo, the gun obviously sized primarily for "tight" situations, and the smallish dot doesn't diminish that role too much, while being a virtually necessity for optically-challenged geezers like me.

[BigT]

After playing with some Shields any future ones I buy will be the 8 moa to make up for the perceived lack of brightness I experience with the 4 moa ones


For those interested they're now , or are very soon to be , available in a variety of colours.

[GJM]

After playing with some Shields any future ones I buy will be the 8 moa to make up for the perceived lack of brightness I experience with the 4 moa ones


For those interested they're now , or are very soon to be , available in a variety of colours.

Agree. The smaller moa Shields seem dim in certain light, where the larger dot is very usable to my eyes.

[Up1911Fan]

Agree. The smaller moa Shields seem dim in certain light, where the larger dot is very usable to my eyes.

Do you think it appears 8 MOA? I have a 3.25 on my G19 and want to put a Shield or RomeoZero on a G43X. I haven't seen a Shield in person, just womdering if an 8MOA dot overpowers the smaller window?

[GJM]

Do you think it appears 8 MOA? I have a 3.25 on my G19 and want to put a Shield or RomeoZero on a G43X. I haven't seen a Shield in person, just womdering if an 8MOA dot overpowers the smaller window?

Since the RMS has no manual adjustment, you can’t turn a smaller dot up, as is commonly done with smaller size dots. The larger Shield dot size is perfect for my eyes.

[flyrodr]

Since the RMS has no manual adjustment, you can’t turn a smaller dot up, as is commonly done with smaller size dots. The larger Shield dot size is perfect for my eyes.

Agree with George. I got the 4MOA, based on having both 3.25 and 6.5 MOA dots in RMRs, and thinking the 8 would be too large in the Shield. But, while I can live with the 4, it can look pretty small at times, making me wish I could turn it up.

[flyrodr]

Well, came home from the range this afternoon, and was cleaning guns. Started on the P365 with Shield RMSw, and noticed that top adjustment screw (a teeny hex head) was missing. Not sure what happened, presume it broke off, as opposed to backing out. Haven't had to adjust dot since I got it about two months ago. Literature had normal admonition to avoid excessive torque when adjusting, and included mini hex wrench to that end. Used that, and sight only required minor adjustment from factory setting to zero. So don't think I overdid it.

Estimate about 1,000 rounds through it since then. Emailed Shield this evening; will see what they say.

Has worked great until this. And actually still works fine. Just can't adjust vertically.

43171

[cornstalker]

Well, came home from the range this afternoon, and was cleaning guns. Started on the P365 with Shield RMSw, and noticed that top adjustment screw (a teeny hex head) was missing. Not sure what happened, presume it broke off, as opposed to backing out. Haven't had to adjust dot since I got it about two months ago. Literature had normal admonition to avoid excessive torque when adjusting, and included mini hex wrench to that end. Used that, and sight only required minor adjustment from factory setting to zero. So don't think I overdid it.

Estimate about 1,000 rounds through it since then. Emailed Shield this evening; will see what they say.

Has worked great until this. And actually still works fine. Just can't adjust vertically.

43171

That sucks. I am curious how this is going to pan out.

[flyrodr]

That sucks. I am curious how this is going to pan out.

So I had emailed Shield last night about 7:00PM EDT

Well, I woke up this morning, checked my email, and had three replies from Shield, the first a couple of minutes past 8:00AM their local time. The short version is that the tech rep said they had gotten a bad batch of adjustment screws, realized that, and replaced them all, which was why the original release of the RMSw was delayed somewhat. Except that my sight had apparently slipped through with the bad screws in place.

The happy ending is that a new sight is being shipped out today, and I'm to return the broken one after the new one comes in.

Can't asked for a quicker reply or better service.

[cornstalker]

flyrodr

Can't ask for more than that. Glad to hear they handled it well.

Not that it matters in the grand scheme of things, but are they sending the replacement out on good faith or are they doing a charge/refund arrangement?

[flyrodr]

flyrodr

Can't ask for more than that. Glad to hear they handled it well.

Not that it matters in the grand scheme of things, but are they sending the replacement out on good faith or are they doing a charge/refund arrangement?

Good faith!

[cornstalker]

As it should be. Good stuff!

[flyrodr]

Got an email this morning from Shield, saying replacement RMSw was being mailed out today.

[Grey]

Really looking forward to see if this RMSw holds up, the price certainly has it up in the RMR territory so it better deliver!

[flyrodr]

Replacement RMSw arrived yesterday. Mounted in on P365 and managed to get to range for a few minutes to more/less zero it with bulk ammo. Stance was a bit shaky.

(Sherlock that I am, I surmised it was related to the morning's several hours of digging holes for shrubs around the house. Especially when the digging was in good old Southern red clay that had been basically untouched for 40+ years, since it was originally mixed with foundation gravel and well-packed by the building crew.)

Will see how it performs.

Many thanks to Eric and especially Karen at Shield HQ for their quick action and terrific attitudes!

[Bigstrap3]

I have been following the shield red dot info for some time. We are commercial beekeepers here in Arizona and work in very dusty conditions a lot of the time. My old eyes are not letting me shoot with any accuracy to speak of anymore. I have been holding out for a RMS red dot for my S&W shield that has a more scratch resistant lense. There were rumors a while back that shield was coming out with a more scratch resistant lense. Has anyone got an ETA on that or just still speculation at this point thanks very much.. George

[flyrodr]

Just got around to looking at a couple of brochures that Shield included with the new RMSw they sent. On several models (RMSc, RMSw, SMS2, SMSc, etc.), there is reference to "an SiO2 Quartz coating on its crystal clear lens". The wording varies a bit from model to model, but the message seems to consistently be that the lens is polymer, with this hard coating. So whether the SiO2/silica/quartz is a separate piece of "glass" that's adhered to the polymer or what, I have no idea. Presume mine has the hard coating, but really don't know - - - although no visible dings in lens yet.

[Mike C]

Just got around to looking at a couple of brochures that Shield included with the new RMSw they sent. On several models (RMSc, RMSw, SMS2, SMSc, etc.), there is reference to "an SiO2 Quartz coating on its crystal clear lens". The wording varies a bit from model to model, but the message seems to consistently be that the lens is polymer, with this hard coating. So whether the SiO2/silica/quartz is a separate piece of "glass" that's adhered to the polymer or what, I have no idea. Presume mine has the hard coating, but really don't know - - - although no visible dings in lens yet.

Thanks for sharing all the info you have. I just put an RMSw on order the other day after PM'ing you. I hope to have it soon so I can send it off to L&M. Did you use all the original mounting screws for your setup or did you order or have some supplied to you when you sent it off for mounting? Thanks.

[flyrodr]

Did you use all the original mounting screws for your setup or did you order or have some supplied to you when you sent it off for mounting? Thanks.

I took the P365 and Shield down to Mark, and when I picked it up, noticed the original screws were still in the box. Years ago, Mark explained his rationale for using a different screw (Seems he said he used different thread pitch with more threads per inch to get a better grip. Just don't remember). He does great work!

[BigT]

I picked up a 8 MOA RMS and one of their Dovetail mounts last week and stuck it on my Shadow 2. This one has their new coating so we shall see how that holds up.

Initial impression after about 800 rounds and one match are very positive. The bigger dot really is better in every way and will, I think, become my default on any optic. Cleaner crisper, more stable ,easier to find and I found it easier to avoid the desire to look at it rather than the target, I think because I don't have to look FOR it.

The mount also did an excellent job of returning to zero when i removed and remounted it , as a by the way.

[GJM]

I have the large dot RMSc direct milled on a 43X. Testing the auto intensity in a range of lighting condition, it seems just right. If this optic holds up, it paired with the 43X is a perfect EDC combination.

[hiro]

I have the large dot RMSc direct milled on a 43X. Testing the auto intensity in a range of lighting condition, it seems just right. If this optic holds up, it paired with the 43X is a perfect EDC combination.

I'm not sure how long you've had the RMSc on the 43X but how does your experience with the RMSc/43X compare with Talionis here (https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?37128-Red-dot-update-June-2019&p=960107&viewfull=1#post960107) with the 365XL/R0?

[BigT]

I have the large dot RMSc direct milled on a 43X. Testing the auto intensity in a range of lighting condition, it seems just right. If this optic holds up, it paired with the 43X is a perfect EDC combination.
So your saying my 48 is incomplete...

[Eric_L]

https://www.shieldpsd.com/

15% off this weekend.

If you customize one- order a different color- you can get a glass lens.

[HeavyDuty]

https://www.shieldpsd.com/

15% off this weekend.

If you customize one- order a different color- you can get a glass lens.

Is that only for certain models? I’m not seeing how you can customize this: https://www.shieldpsd.com/shop-2/rmsc-reflex-mini-sight-compact-8moa

[Eric_L]

[QUOTE=HeavyDuty;961165]Is that only for certain models? I’m not seeing how you can customize this: [url]


https://www.shieldpsd.com/shop-2/rmsc-reflex-mini-sight-compact-custom

[Eric_L]

https://www.shieldpsd.com/shop-2/rmsc-reflex-mini-sight-compact-custom

That one did not come up “hot” as in a hot link....

[HeavyDuty]

[QUOTE=HeavyDuty;961165]Is that only for certain models? I’m not seeing how you can customize this: [url]


https://www.shieldpsd.com/shop-2/rmsc-reflex-mini-sight-compact-custom

Aha! Thanks - I wasn’t expecting a separate listing. Very tempting...

[awp_101]

https://www.shieldpsd.com/

15% off this weekend.

If you customize one- order a different color- you can get a glass lens.

I'm not gonna lie, the British Racing Green is a tempting option...

[backtrail540]

p/B5qwIaGB_7I

Glass lense announcement, across all lines (rms, rmsc, rmsw, and sms)

[HeavyDuty]

p/B5qwIaGB_7I

Glass lense announcement, across all lines (rms, rmsc, rmsw, and sms)

I don’t IG. What does it say? I don’t see an obvious announcement on their webpage.

[Bigstrap3]

THANK YOU FOR THE UPDATE? GREAT NEWS👍




p/B5qwIaGB_7I

Glass lense announcement, across all lines (rms, rmsc, rmsw, and sms)

[vandal]

Will the glass improve perceived dot brightness? (Maybe leading one to choose a 4moa over 8moa?)

[backtrail540]

I don’t IG. What does it say? I don’t see an obvious announcement on their webpage.


The new all glass lens is now available as a custom option on our website. The customizer will let you choose color, dot size, and lens material for the RMS, RMSw, RMSc and SMS. Custom orders will ship 4 - 6 weeks after the order is placed. .

[cornstalker]

Will the glass improve perceived dot brightness? (Maybe leading one to choose a 4moa over 8moa?)

My guess would be no, at least not until you have had a chance to scratch the polymer up cleaning it.

[HeavyDuty]

The new all glass lens is now available as a custom option on our website. The customizer will let you choose color, dot size, and lens material for the RMS, RMSw, RMSc and SMS. Custom orders will ship 4 - 6 weeks after the order is placed. .

Thank you! I saw the custom RMSc configurator upthread, It’s good to see glass has been extended as an option across the line. I can see a custom black RMSc with glass in my future, initially for my 43 using a Brownells slide to test the concept for me...

[Mike C]

Just wanted to share a little update on my order with Shield. I contacted them and they apologized for the delay and are expediting my order once they have more RMSw bodies. Time quoted on receiving them was the next 3-4 days. They also accepted my request to upgrade to glass on the order. It looks/sounds like they have boat loads of orders to fill but despite how busy they seem they are very responsive to requests and communication. CS is pretty great as I've experienced so far. Thanks again flyrodr.

[GJM]

I will be very curious how the glass lens option performs. I heard something suggesting it might not be as strong as the plastic lens, although it should be way better in not scratching.

How I clean the current RMS is to use compressed air to remove any loose debris and follow up with a Leupold lens pen.

I am running the 8 moa RMSc on my 43X. I like the large dot with an auto adjust system. This afternoon, I was shooting a 12 inch steel at 110 yards with it, and the dot covered a lot of the target. I think 5.5 moa would be ideal, but still lean towards the 8 vs the 4 for how I use the 43X.

[Mike C]

GJM, I am most interested in its performance as well. To be quite honest I expect to break the sight. Personally I still don't feel like the red dot is quite there yet anyways. The red dot for me is mostly to evaluate how it might carry, see how reliable it is through heavy training/shooting but above all I am looking at it as a training aid. I have followed a lot of your posts very closely and in listening to what you have said and others I trust I think the red dot will make an excellent training tool for me. I am excited and really hope to have it soon so I can send my slide off to have it cut and mounted.

[BigT]

I will be very curious how the glass lens option performs. I heard something suggesting it might not be as strong as the plastic lens, although it should be way better in not scratching.

How I clean the current RMS is to use compressed air to remove any loose debris and follow up with a Leupold lens pen.

I am running the 8 moa RMSc on my 43X. I like the large dot with an auto adjust system. This afternoon, I was shooting a 12 inch steel at 110 yards with it, and the dot covered a lot of the target. I think 5.5 moa would be ideal, but still lean towards the 8 vs the 4 for how I use the 43X.


I do think that beyond the party trick stuff , the bigger dot works better.

[evi1joe]

I will be very curious how the glass lens option performs. I heard something suggesting it might not be as strong as the plastic lens, although it should be way better in not scratching.
How I clean the current RMS is to use compressed air to remove any loose debris and follow up with a Leupold lens pen.

Yeah, I think SHIELD advertises the polymer as 10X stronger than glass (I assume that's due to 10X the flex of glass).

However, this glass looks 3.75X as thick as the polymer, so I expect it'll hold its own in everything other than a drop test. I'm hoping it has some kind of tough mineral glass with a sapphire coating. I wonder if we'll see any distortion from glass that thick (and curved). I notice the distortion with RMRs, but not with Holosuns (even though I know there is some).

NOTE: I usually just clean mine with compressed air, and then brush it off with a lens-pen brush. Once every 3-4 months, I'll use ELECTRICAL CONTACT CLEANER WD-40 on a q-tip (advice I got from them), which I roll around on the lens, then use a dry one, and some more compressed air.

[Dismas316]

I will be very curious how the glass lens option performs. I heard something suggesting it might not be as strong as the plastic lens, although it should be way better in not scratching.

How I clean the current RMS is to use compressed air to remove any loose debris and follow up with a Leupold lens pen.

I am running the 8 moa RMSc on my 43X. I like the large dot with an auto adjust system. This afternoon, I was shooting a 12 inch steel at 110 yards with it, and the dot covered a lot of the target. I think 5.5 moa would be ideal, but still lean towards the 8 vs the 4 for how I use the 43X.

How’s this optic working out of for you on the 43x so far? Any problems? Thinking about ordering one soon.

[GJM]

How’s this optic working out of for you on the 43x so far? Any problems? Thinking about ordering one soon.

Completely satisfied. Been using it daily since around October. I use care cleaning it, and have no scratches. Has held zero and is still on the original battery. They are hard to get now.

[evi1joe]

The custom Shield RMSc with GLASS seem to start at $560 (for black) and go up above $600 for the other colors.
The good news is it's only a 6 week wait time (plus shipping across the pond). IF they could cut $100 off of that, I'd be more interested.

Right now I'm waiting to see how the 6MOA holosun 407K does (since I preordered one for $220).

[GJM]

You guys jinxed me! I stopped by the LGS, and the owner asked to see my RMSc on the 43X, as he wanted one. I told him how well it had been doing, handed it to him, and he said “your dot is out.” I told him to stop kidding me, but sure enough, the dot was out. Worked fine yesterday. We pulled the optic, changed to a new 2032, and since I was on the way to the range, decided to verify zero first thing.

This is a walk back from 10-20 yards, so it looks like removing and reinstalling the optic did not change zero.

49149

When I got home, I tested the battery and it showed as under ten percent, so again the battery tester proved its value by confirming I had a bad battery as opposed to a bad optic. It lasted from October, which is a little less than I would have expected.

[Dismas316]

You guys jinxed me! I stopped by the LGS, and the owner asked to see my RMSc on the 43X, as he wanted one. I told him how well it had been doing, handed it to him, and he said “your dot is out.” I told him to stop kidding me, but sure enough, the dot was out. Worked fine yesterday. We pulled the optic, changed to a new 2032, and since I was on the way to the range, decided to verify zero first thing.

This is a walk back from 10-20 yards, so it looks like removing and reinstalling the optic did not change zero.

49149

When I got home, I tested the battery and it showed as under ten percent, so again the battery tester proved its value by confirming I had a bad battery as opposed to a bad optic. It lasted from October, which is a little less than I would have expected.

Well I guess it’s good it’s only the battery. You’ll start to have problems with the optic once I make the purchase and it arrives, lol.

[GJM]

Well I guess it’s good it’s only the battery. You’ll start to have problems with the optic once I make the purchase and it arrives, lol.

I used to break an optic every week, now it is a rare occurrence. Yet to break an Acro or SRO.

[Erick Gelhaus]

Last summer, I picked up one of the S&W Performance Center 4" Shield's with this PMO on it:
52201

Initially shot about 200rds through it with the optic to ascertain the reliability of the pistol & the dot. Last week, I shot Rangemaster's dotm with it - Dyal's 5 Yard Round-Up x3. While I was in the mid-90s on each run, the groups were noticeably low & right. Got it, I need more dry practice with the Shield.

What I didn't notice until I got home was that the dot had shifted well to the left within the optic's window. Decided I'd return to the range this week & re-zero the PMO.

I was consistently hitting to the right. After the third adjustment, I was still hitting to the right of the black at 10 yrs. When I tried making the fourth adjustment, I could no longer move the dot to the right. Any adjustment to the left resulted in the screw backing out of the body.

I got onto Shield's website last night for an RMA and had one pretty quickly.

Here's where the dot is now, just above the leftmost fiber optic rear.
52202

Rough round count was 650. Ammunition has been a mix of 115gr /124gr ball from American Eagle, CCI/Blazer and Hornady Critical Duty 135gr +P.

[frozentundra]

Last summer, I picked up one of the S&W Performance Center 4" Shield's with this PMO on it:


Curious who makes that optic? Does the "S&W Shield" use a footprint compatible with a rms "Shield" brand optic?

[Erick Gelhaus]

Curious who makes that optic? Does the "S&W Shield" use a footprint compatible with a rms "Shield" brand optic?

Shield, out of England, makes that PMO. The P/C Shield was all ready for the Shield PMO to be installed on it.

[LittleLebowski]

https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?43150-Brownells-G48-slide-cut-for-RMS-footprint

[Erick Gelhaus]

Received a replacement sight from Shield, it was a brand new, not the old one rebuilt. Installed without issue. Powered up fine. Zero'd it this week with 14rds using the wheel that comes with it.

[flyrodr]

Well, my RMS-w on a P365 has winked out twice now at the range. Two separate trips, both blinks after only 20-30 rounds. The "darkness" lasted a few seconds each time and then the dot comes back on. Not sure if problem is a battery shift or what. Can't replicate it by shaking, whacking on the housing with the palm of my hand, or letting the slide drop on empty chamber. Guess I'll have to contact Shield and see what they suggest. Darn . . .

I like the combo though.

[Lon]

Sounds similar to the RMR battery issue. Cut a small piece of electrical tape and put it on the slide side of the battery. See if that resolves it. Do you have a sealing plate?

[flyrodr]

Sounds similar to the RMR battery issue. Cut a small piece of electrical tape and put it on the slide side of the battery. See if that resolves it. Do you have a sealing plate?

No plate, and I honestly can't remember if I put any tape on battery when I installed it. I generally do that on RMRs. This is the second unit I've had. On the first one, one of the adjustment screws broke off as I was zeroing it. Shield sent me a quick replacement, with a prepaid label to return the old one in the same box. It has worked fine . . . except when it hasn't.

Can GJM's Rubrum opticus virus be transmitted via the internet?

[GJM]

Pretty sure I commented in another recent thread, that so far there is no proven great solution for a red dot on the 43X/48 and 365 sized pistols. Hoping the 507K works out.

[flyrodr]

Pretty sure I commented in another recent thread, that so far there is no proven great solution for a red dot on the 43X/48 and 365 sized pistols. Hoping the 507K works out.

Indeed . . . x2.

[DMCutter]

I spend my days low crawling under houses and other confined space entry and I pocket carry my 365 in a Vedder Pocket Locker. Even with coveralls and knee and elbow pads I take a beating. When my Vedder comes in for the Hellcat I'll start carrying it. While not Sage Dynamics level abuse it will be a good test of sweat and dust and general resistance to abuse. I'll keep everyone posted on how it holds up to work and weekly range sessions.

[HeavyDuty]

No plate, and I honestly can't remember if I put any tape on battery when I installed it. I generally do that on RMRs. This is the second unit I've had. On the first one, one of the adjustment screws broke off as I was zeroing it. Shield sent me a quick replacement, with a prepaid label to return the old one in the same box. It has worked fine . . . except when it hasn't.

Can GJM's Rubrum opticus virus be transmitted via the internet?

How did this resolve?

[flyrodr]

How did this resolve?

Working fine. Replaced battery, w/tape. Not sure if that was "it", but hasn't winked since.

Figured something on P365 or dot would rust/corrode (been doing a lot of yard work and sweating heavily, with gun in either pocket or IWB holster and getting well soaked), but nothing. Occasionally wipe with wet paper towel, then dry one, then a light wipe of oil.

So, well satisfied.

[HeavyDuty]

Working fine. Replaced battery, w/tape. Not sure if that was "it", but hasn't winked since.

Figured something on P365 or dot would rust/corrode (been doing a lot of yard work and sweating heavily, with gun in either pocket or IWB holster and getting well soaked), but nothing. Occasionally wipe with wet paper towel, then dry one, then a light wipe of oil.

So, well satisfied.

Thanks. I keep coming back to the RMSw as an option for my 43.

[Inkwell 41]

Looks like they have a G43X/48 MOS specific model now. Comes with glass lens.

[TAZ]

Looks like they have a G43X/48 MOS specific model now. Comes with glass lens.

Which model is that. Don’t see anything in their site.

[Inkwell 41]

Here it is.....


https://www.shieldpsd.com/shop-2/rmsc-reflex-mini-sight-compact-glock-edition-4-moa

[WobblyPossum]

Here it is.....


https://www.shieldpsd.com/shop-2/rmsc-reflex-mini-sight-compact-glock-edition-4-moa

So Glock decided to partner with an optic manufacturer to pair a specific red dot with their new MOS pistols, and they picked Shield instead of Trijicon, Leupold, or Vortex? SMH.

[call_me_ski]

I am growing impatient. I feel like I might take the chance on this new improved RMSc.

[GJM]

I am growing impatient. I feel like I might take the chance on this new improved RMSc.

Are they available now?

[call_me_ski]

You can add them to your basket on shields website. Doesn’t mention anything about a preorder so I assume yes? I would have also assumed that someone at Glock would be on speaking terms with someone at Trijicon and that has proven to be wrong. So who knows.

[HeavyDuty]

The new “Glock Edition” RMSc may be the solution for me - glass lens standard, and “a strengthened lens housing and upgraded electronics with improved battery contacts.” I’ve been waffling on what to do about a small carry pistol with RDS.

[Xhado]

So Glock decided to partner with an optic manufacturer to pair a specific red dot with their new MOS pistols, and they picked Shield instead of Trijicon, Leupold, or Vortex? SMH.

A European company partnered with a European company.

This isn't surprising.

[WobblyPossum]

A European company partnered with a European company.

This isn't surprising.

It’s surprising to me in that the pistol manufacturer has such a large share of the pistol market and the optic manufacturer has such a small share of the optic market.

[HeavyDuty]

It’s surprising to me in that the pistol manufacturer has such a large share of the pistol market and the optic manufacturer has such a small share of the optic market.

That’s a US-centric view, I don’t know that we can say Shield has a small share on a worldwide basis without more info. And I wouldn’t be surprised if Glock worked with them to develop the new “Glock Edition” SMSc with glass lens, tougher hood and improved electronics.

[farscott]

Shield has been a player in the miniature red dot market before Trijicon. Trijicon's first product was actually a private-labeled Shield product. I also understand that Shield is a current supplier to the British Ministry of Defence.

[Xhado]

It’s surprising to me in that the pistol manufacturer has such a large share of the pistol market and the optic manufacturer has such a small share of the optic market.

Shield is the MRDS company in Europe. Just take a look at how many Shields were in IPSC European Handgun Championship Production Optics.

Glock doesn't care about the US civilian market, they already sell every gun they make. If they want to expand in the European market it makes sense they make the gun to fit the most popular optic in Europe.

Glock also makes guns factory milled from RMRs. Those would sell like hit cakes here in the US. But why would they right now when the down right terrible MOS is flying off the shelves.

[WobblyPossum]

That’s a US-centric view, I don’t know that we can say Shield has a small share on a worldwide basis without more info. And I wouldn’t be surprised if Glock worked with them to develop the new “Glock Edition” SMSc with glass lens, tougher hood and improved electronics.


Shield has been a player in the miniature red dot market before Trijicon. Trijicon's first product was actually a private-labeled Shield product. I also understand that Shield is a current supplier to the British Ministry of Defence.


Shield is the MRDS company in Europe. Just take a look at how many Shields were in IPSC European Handgun Championship Production Optics.

Glock doesn't care about the US civilian market, they already sell every gun they make. If they want to expand in the European market it makes sense they make the gun to fit the most popular optic in Europe.

Glock also makes guns factory milled from RMRs. Those would sell like hit cakes here in the US. But why would they right now when the down right terrible MOS is flying off the shelves.

The G43X/G48 aren’t going to see a lot of military and law enforcement sales. The people looking to award LE/Mil contracts likely aren’t looking for slim, 10 round guns, at least not for the kind of contracts that earn big money. The optics that are meant to mount to guns this small don’t really have much of a role in LE/Mil contracts. If your gun has a wider slide, why not use a standard sized red dot like a regular RMR or 507 or an ACRO instead of one of these K/CC models since the standard sized optics have larger windows? The G43X/G48 and their respectively sized optics also won’t be very competitive in most of our shooting competition sports.

The G43X/G48 are fantastic CCW guns but not great service pistols or competition guns. That primarily means private citizens carrying concealed with small amounts of military special ops folks in NPEs and LE folks too lazy to carry larger guns. There are only a handful of places in the world where private citizens can carry guns for self defense. The USA is, by far, the largest of these places and the biggest market. It’s a market that dwarfs the markets in all the other other CCW permissive countries combined. Few people in the US are familiar with Shield optics as opposed to Trijicon, Leupold, Vortex and Aimpoint optics.

[jeep45238]

C&H makes a plate that will bump a 507K up to be usable.

[call_me_ski]

The G43X/G48 aren’t going to see a lot of military and law enforcement sales. The people looking to award LE/Mil contracts likely aren’t looking for slim, 10 round guns, at least not for the kind of contracts that earn big money. The optics that are meant to mount to guns this small don’t really have much of a role in LE/Mil contracts. If your gun has a wider slide, why not use a standard sized red dot like a regular RMR or 507 or an ACRO instead of one of these K/CC models since the standard sized optics have larger windows? The G43X/G48 and their respectively sized optics also won’t be very competitive in most of our shooting competition sports.

The G43X/G48 are fantastic CCW guns but not great service pistols or competition guns. That primarily means private citizens carrying concealed with small amounts of military special ops folks in NPEs and LE folks too lazy to carry larger guns. There are only a handful of places in the world where private citizens can carry guns for self defense. The USA is, by far, the largest of these places and the biggest market. It’s a market that dwarfs the markets in all the other other CCW permissive countries combined. Few people in the US are familiar with Shield optics as opposed to Trijicon, Leupold, Vortex and Aimpoint optics.

Glock would be smart to offer a factory mounted dot on a pistol like Sig does and potentially set up distribution/importation of the RMSc into the us until they have a better network. Off rsr it on sale on their web store or something.

[El Cid]

The G43X/G48 aren’t going to see a lot of military and law enforcement sales. The people looking to award LE/Mil contracts likely aren’t looking for slim, 10 round guns, at least not for the kind of contracts that earn big money. The optics that are meant to mount to guns this small don’t really have much of a role in LE/Mil contracts. If your gun has a wider slide, why not use a standard sized red dot like a regular RMR or 507 or an ACRO instead of one of these K/CC models since the standard sized optics have larger windows? The G43X/G48 and their respectively sized optics also won’t be very competitive in most of our shooting competition sports.

The G43X/G48 are fantastic CCW guns but not great service pistols or competition guns. That primarily means private citizens carrying concealed with small amounts of military special ops folks in NPEs and LE folks too lazy to carry larger guns. There are only a handful of places in the world where private citizens can carry guns for self defense. The USA is, by far, the largest of these places and the biggest market. It’s a market that dwarfs the markets in all the other other CCW permissive countries combined. Few people in the US are familiar with Shield optics as opposed to Trijicon, Leupold, Vortex and Aimpoint optics.

It’s also possible that Shield approached Glock so they can expand more into the US market. My Shield RMS has proven more reliable than 2 RMR06 type 1’s. Each of which cost twice what the Shield did.

[WobblyPossum]

It’s also possible that Shield approached Glock so they can expand more into the US market. My Shield RMS has proven more reliable than 2 RMR06 type 1’s. Each of which cost twice what the Shield did.

If Shield’s new “Glock” optic proves durable and reliable, I’m all for them expanding more into the US market. I love having options and competition drives innovation and decreases prices. I was only giving my opinion about what I thought would have been a smarter play from a business perspective. I also don’t know much of anything about the actual amounts of dollars involved so YMMV.

[Archer1440]

It’s also possible that Shield approached Glock so they can expand more into the US market. My Shield RMS has proven more reliable than 2 RMR06 type 1’s. Each of which cost twice what the Shield did.

Hardly surprising, since the RMR type 1 was not intended for slide mounting on pistols in the first place, a point which a lot of people seem unaware of.

[El Cid]

Hardly surprising, since the RMR type 1 was not intended for slide mounting on pistols in the first place, a point which a lot of people seem unaware of.

Hadn’t heard that but it’s believable. Of course my two weren’t riding pistol slides. One is in an ALG 6 Second Mount and the other was on a 16” AR. I should t have to buy a $10 plate from companies like Battle Werx for a $600 optic but that’s what happened. And neither optic is used for any work or defensive related stuff.

[HCM]

Shield has been a player in the miniature red dot market before Trijicon. Trijicon's first product was actually a private-labeled Shield product. I also understand that Shield is a current supplier to the British Ministry of Defence.


Hardly surprising, since the RMR type 1 was not intended for slide mounting on pistols in the first place, a point which a lot of people seem unaware of.


Hadn’t heard that but it’s believable. Of course my two weren’t riding pistol slides. One is in an ALG 6 Second Mount and the other was on a 16” AR. I should t have to buy a $10 plate from companies like Battle Werx for a $600 optic but that’s what happened. And neither optic is used for any work or defensive related stuff.

In the mid 2000s Trijicon heard about US SOF rigging mini red dots (Docter optics) to the top of ACOGs. Trijcon created an ACOG with a Doctor on top for US SOFthe ECOS) and then released "The Trijicon Red Dot" sight which was a re branded Shield. Both had durability issues so Trijicon developed the RMR (Ruggedized Minature Red Dot sight) as a replacement mini red dot sight for the ACOG.

My understanding is the Leupold Delta Point and it's successor, the Delta Point Pro were also originally developed as mini red dot back up sights for rifles with magnified optics.

It's only in the last couple years we have begun seeing MRDS optics designed to go on a pistol.