Beretta PX4 Storm full size .40 Middle child or Workhorse?

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

The PX4 Storm in 9mm is enjoying much celebrity currently. The .45 Storm has it’s own characteristics. In this thread, I would like to discuss the PX4 .40 full size. It is not as popular and deserves a closer look.

We’ve put many thousands of rounds on full size Storm .40s. Here are some observations:

Reliability? 100% reliability is our experience. Here are some reasons, in my opinion: Firstly, the cartridge is high pressure and will throw the slide back hard enough to eject well and setup reintroduction of the next round. Secondly, the harder hitting rounds require a stronger slide rebound spring which works well to strip off that top round and push it in.
Note- The .40 needs this. With a 9mm you can chamber moving the slide forward more slowly, a .40 needs to slingshot forward harder (as does the .45).
Thirdly, the recoil of the .40 is somewhat sharper than the 9mm. This causes the shooter to not slack off and have a loose grip. Though, we have done limp wrist tests and found them reliable still.

Wear & tear? We have found the .40s to not wear much on inside parts (compared to .45), slightly more than the 9mm.

Cleaning? We have found the .40 to get about 30% dirtier (per round) than a 9mm, ammo brands being equal.

I was not planning to make this thread about ballistics, but we could discuss that, if anyone is interested.



What has been your experience? What things would you like to discuss about the .40?

[StraitR]

Do we need separate threads for every PX4 SKU? Can this not fit in one of the other ten?

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Do we need separate threads for every PX4 SKU? Can this not fit in one of the other ten?

StraitR, While there is a certain logic to your comment, here's the reason: If one wanted to see if there was information on a certain caliber in another thread, well... one thread has 306 pages. That is a lot of time in searching for a specific inquiry. Additionally, if one thread is about a 9mm SKU then, it becomes rude to muddy it up with asking about a different caliber or model.

As with anything, if one likes the subject... more is better. If one does not like the subject (or pistol), more is annoying.

[PNWTO]

When you use the term “we” what exactly is the nature of that? Friends and family? Novices? Veteran USPSA shooters? LE?

[StraitR]

StraitR, While there is a certain logic to your comment, here's the reason: If one wanted to see if there was information on a certain caliber in another thread, well... one thread has 306 pages. That is a lot of time in searching for a specific inquiry. Additionally, if one thread is about a 9mm SKU then, it becomes rude to muddy it up with asking about a different caliber or model.

As with anything, if one likes the subject... more is better. If one does not like the subject (or pistol), more is annoying.


It's not that I dislike the subject, it's that there seems to be an abundance of threads on this subject with only slight variations. The issue with redundant or semi-redundant threads is that it pushes other topics and discussions back faster, where the threads die quickly unless someone goes looking. More often than not, they don't go looking (searching), but choose to start another thread and the problem is exacerbated. Rinse and repeat. What's left is lots and lots of short threads with very little information or discussion.

Each thread can be searched for content, so if you want to find specific information or key words, there's a tool for that.

23687

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

It's not that I dislike the subject, it's that there seems to be an abundance of threads on this subject with only slight variations. The issue with redundant or semi-redundant threads is that it pushes other topics and discussions back faster, where the threads die quickly unless someone goes looking. More often than not, they don't go looking (searching), but choose to start another thread and the problem is exacerbated. Rinse and repeat. What's left is lots and lots of short threads with very little information or discussion.

Each thread can be searched for content, so if you want to find specific information or key words, there's a tool for that.

23687

You make a good point. I am new to this Forum. I have tried the Search Thread mechanism, it can be a good tool, thanks. Sometimes nomenclature can vary, though.

Have you shared this concern with others that post multiple threads on the PX4? Perhaps we could all conglomerate into one thread. Then, these others will move down the list, out of the way.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

When you use the term “we” what exactly is the nature of that? Friends and family? Novices? Veteran USPSA shooters? LE?

PNWTO, I'm glad you could join us in this thread. I have observed your well mannered, well informed input in other threads. It is evident that you are a good, patient strategist, as well!

I look forward to your input about the PX4 .40. Have you any experience with one?

[TheNewbie]

PNWTO, I'm glad you could join us in this thread. I have observed your well mannered, well informed input in other threads. It is evident that you are a good, patient strategist, as well!

I look forward to your input about the PX4 .40. Have you any experience with one?

I may be mistaken, but did you say the PX4 was your duty weapon? Are you LE?

I may be running different posts by different people together.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

I may be mistaken, but did you say the PX4 was your duty weapon? Are you LE?

I may be running different posts by different people together.

Glad you could join the thread! This thread is about the PX4 Storm full size .40 caliber. I am hoping to open a thread to discuss it. Do you have any experience with one? Have you ever owned one?

[PNWTO]

PNWTO, I'm glad you could join us in this thread. I have observed your well mannered, well informed input in other threads. It is evident that you are a good, patient strategist, as well!

I have no idea what any of this means. If it sounds like I was prying then I will tell you I was not. I find your info credible and well-thought and was just wondering what the context of the observations were.


I look forward to your input about the PX4 .40. Have you any experience with one?

I do from a student who was attending Bill Rapier's class; not the biggest fan of .40 but it was nice shooting FS gun. Most of my experience with Beretta have been the abused items owned by Uncle Sam, but am really debating moving to the 92 or Px4 flavor.

[JHC]

I do think shooting .40 can teach very good grip fundamentals. I've seen several DoW that were speed with precision oriented where I shot a tic slower but dropped fewer points with my G22 vs 9mm guns.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

I have no idea what any of this means. If it sounds like I was prying then I will tell you I was not. I find your info credible and well-thought and was just wondering what the context of the observations were.



I do from a student who was attending Bill Rapier's class; not the biggest fan of .40 but it was nice shooting FS gun. Most of my experience with Beretta have been the abused items owned by Uncle Sam, but am really debating moving to the 92 or Px4 flavor.

I meant nothing negative at all! I am trying to keep things focused on the topic at hand. I am new to this Forum and quite well like it. You have been kind and helpful in other interactions. No negativity intended.
The "we" in my initial post consists of less than 10 students and myself. Being honest, I cannot say, I put those rounds on, if I did not. I do monitor all rounds fired and hardware maintenance. I only work with people that I know for years and can be positive that their intended use of the pistol is safe, legal and honorable. I also instruct them in other weapons, as well (depending upon their need). I do not mention having students because there are many well renowned instructors for people to access on PF and I do not want to put myself in that arena.

I carried the PX4 full sized .40 for 2 years. I now carry the PX4 .45.

I have always used the twin pistol method. I test and thoroughly evaluate a good specimen of the pistol I like. After an ample amount of rounds I clean it up to use it for an EDC. I then, get a twin pistol. I set it up identically and use it at the range for practice, tactical exercises and higher round counts. A "stunt double", you might say.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

If we’re just going to ignore questions or answer questions with questions, this is going to be a pretty lousy “discussion”. In general, if people want to post but not discuss (which typically involves talking to each other and answering questions), I’d encourage them to start a blog or post on FB.

And yes, we (the PF membership) generally prefer to have fewer longer threads and not a bunch of shorter threads that vary due to minutia. Yes, it makes the barrier to entry for participation higher, but that (reading a bunch before posting a bunch) is generally regarded as a good thing around here.

Carry on. :)

I see your points. I cannot "take the post back", though.

I had frequently been in contact with LangdonTactical and had heard from Chris Baker of Lucky Gunner about the Pistol Forum. I finally decided to join. I could not find more than the rules and FAQs, so I followed Ernest's example of multiple threads on more specific issues. I might have misunderstood by observation, but meant no harm.

[DAB]

i've always wondered about the "i must prove that this pistol is okey dokey before i carry it." mindset. do you give no credit to the manufacturer for doing proper design and testing? do you take no knowledge of the other pistols that are out in the wild that are being used by people everyday? no acknowledgement of independent testing done by various government bodies (who have far larger budgets than me).

when you buy a new car, you gas it up, check tire pressures, find the horn and radio buttons, and off you go. you don't first drive it 50,000 miles on a test track before taking it to the grocery store. you trust that it will do what you expect it to do.

sure, you might make sure your pet ammo load works fine (likely the gun maker has already shot everything commercially available in testing at some point) for your own peace of mind, but clean it up, load it up, and go.

me?

i carry a Beretta.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

i've always wondered about the "i must prove that this pistol is okey dokey before i carry it." mindset. do you give no credit to the manufacturer for doing proper design and testing? do you take no knowledge of the other pistols that are out in the wild that are being used by people everyday? no acknowledgement of independent testing done by various government bodies (who have far larger budgets than me).

when you buy a new car, you gas it up, check tire pressures, find the horn and radio buttons, and off you go. you don't first drive it 50,000 miles on a test track before taking it to the grocery store. you trust that it will do what you expect it to do.

sure, you might make sure your pet ammo load works fine (likely the gun maker has already shot everything commercially available in testing at some point) for your own peace of mind, but clean it up, load it up, and go.

me?

i carry a Beretta.

DAB, I have experienced differently. I do trust Beretta, but as President Reagon said, Trust and verify.

When the PX4 first came out in .45 I got one. It was a lemon. Went back to Beretta twice until they refunded my money. I had a PX4 9mm that had to go back for feeding issues. I've seen 2 PX4s need to go back to Beretta for extractor issues. I've seen safety levers on SubCompacts stop working from the right side. My point being, humans are involved in manufacturing, things can happen. That is why I have extensive testing first.

[JonInWA]

i've always wondered about the "i must prove that this pistol is okey dokey before i carry it." mindset. do you give no credit to the manufacturer for doing proper design and testing? do you take no knowledge of the other pistols that are out in the wild that are being used by people everyday? no acknowledgement of independent testing done by various government bodies (who have far larger budgets than me).

when you buy a new car, you gas it up, check tire pressures, find the horn and radio buttons, and off you go. you don't first drive it 50,000 miles on a test track before taking it to the grocery store. you trust that it will do what you expect it to do.

sure, you might make sure your pet ammo load works fine (likely the gun maker has already shot everything commercially available in testing at some point) for your own peace of mind, but clean it up, load it up, and go.

me?

i carry a Beretta.

Remington R51. SIG-Sauer P320. Initial Glock Gen4s. Smith & Wesson 9mm M&Ps......

Best, Jon

[RJ]

Remington R51. SIG-Sauer P320. Initial Glock Gen4s. Smith & Wesson 9mm M&Ps......

Best, Jon

Walther CCP?

[BehindBlueI's]

do you give no credit to the manufacturer for doing proper design and testing?.

Absolutely none. Because experience and history has said that's a terrible idea.


do you take no knowledge of the other pistols that are out in the wild that are being used by people everyday?.

More than the manufacturer, but guns change without notice as well.


no acknowledgement of independent testing done by various government bodies (who have far larger budgets than me).

Some more than others. I don't trust military contracts period, as politics matters as much (or more) than performance.

I honestly have zero interest in the PX4, but the poster seems to really be passionate about the platform and is doing some good work with it. It's interesting to me for that reason. I'm not shopping for a new platform and will continue with classic P-series Sigs for hammer fired and Glock for striker fired.

[DAB]

Do you make and shoot your own design?

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Do you make and shoot your own design?

DAB, If you could please clarify your question, I could more accurately respond.

In case this is it: I modify the Storms that are for my use the same. I install a Low Profile kit (levers and slide catch) and a Cougar D spring. I follow the same maintenance protocols as I do in .45 and 9mm.

My .40 does have Talon Grips, since my wife likes to shoot it or carry it, occasionally.

[BehindBlueI's]

Do you make and shoot your own design?

Me? No. Well, unless you count reloads. But I vet everything I carry and preferably carry something with a decade or more of service history behind it.

But I absolutely do not rely on "design" or manufacturer data. Nobody doubts Glock is a good product, but nobody who knows shit denies that they've had some bad roll outs. Their neat little single stack that had to be redesigned to feed reliably, Gen 3s that choked when a weapon light was installed on the rail, the 17M issues...plus manufacturers lie and cover things up. P320?

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

The Good, the Bad & the Ugly of the PX4 .40 full size.

Just a few things...



The Good: I have found the full size .40 to be flat shooting and of very quick feeling cycling. To me recoil is light and yet not boring. To have 15 rounds of 180 grn HSTs is good for “social work”. It is reliable and well balanced. Post muzzle burn or spark is manageable.


The Bad: I find the full size .40 dense feeling. The slide and barrel have more metal in them and then there is the ammo. Just the lead from 15 rounds of 180 grn fodder is 2,700 grns. 10 .45s in 230 grn are 2,300 grns. 18 9mm 124 grn drill bits are 2,232 grns. Some might not notice, but I can feel when my magazine on my .45 is full or getting empty. So, to me... it is noticeable.


The Ugly: There is a strange anomaly that I’ve often seen with the magazines in .40s (14 rounders). When they are filled, the inner coils go into the outer coils and stick to themselves a little. This makes a rattling of loose ammo. A Ninja could not sneak up on a music festival with that on his belt. You sometimes can take out a round and pump it up and down a few times, put the round back in and be fixed. I have tested shooting when it was rattling... shot just fine. Recoil reset things.

I was going to write that I’ve never seen any other caliber do that. Then, a few hours ago when my wife picked up her SubCompact 9, it did it. She disassembled the mag and switched to a different duty mag... pending inspection.

[LockedBreech]

This thread would be my time to shine, except I haven't shut up about my PX4 .40 fullsize since I joined the forum.

I have a 2008-production (PY25xxx) PX4 .40 fullsize that has, at this point, about 15,000 rounds through it. That count is not particularly high for a ten-year-old gun, especially by this forum's standards, but it was my one and only gun for a long time, so it got experimented with. It has done a roughly 2,000 round challenge (before I knew the 2K challenge was a thing and before I joined this forum, so it was not properly logged and tracked and therefore not a TRUE 2,000 round challenge) without issue. It has fired, by my estimate, 5-7 types of service JHP and every type of .40 range ammo I've been able to find. It has fired bullet weights from 135-grain to 180-grain.

I swapped the magazines and springs around the 10,000 round mark. The replaced magazines are X-marked as range only but continue to function without flaw. There is no major internal wear at all. If I knew nothing about the gun I'd guess it has 1-2K on it by the wear.

It doesn't get shot nearly as much since my primary transition in carry and range use to 9x19. However, I am still very fond it if and I would trust my life to it in a heartbeat. It is the reason I have found .40 in other platforms, even legendary ones, a bit of a letdown.

In my ownership of a Glock 22 Gen 4, Glock 22 Gen 3, first-gen M&P .40, Sig P226, and Sig P229, nothing has touched the PX4 .40 in my subjective experience. It's excellent.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

This thread would be my time to shine, except I haven't shut up about my PX4 .40 fullsize since I joined the forum.

I have a 2008-production (PY25xxx) PX4 .40 fullsize that has, at this point, about 15,000 rounds through it. That count is not particularly high for a ten-year-old gun, especially by this forum's standards, but it was my one and only gun for a long time, so it got experimented with. It has done a roughly 2,000 round challenge (before I knew the 2K challenge was a thing and before I joined this forum, so it was not properly logged and tracked and therefore not a TRUE 2,000 round challenge) without issue. It has fired, by my estimate, 5-7 types of service JHP and every type of .40 range ammo I've been able to find. It has fired bullet weights from 135-grain to 180-grain.

I swapped the magazines and springs around the 10,000 round mark. The replaced magazines are X-marked as range only but continue to function without flaw. There is no major internal wear at all. If I knew nothing about the gun I'd guess it has 1-2K on it by the wear.

It doesn't get shot nearly as much since my primary transition in carry and range use to 9x19. However, I am still very fond it if and I would trust my life to it in a heartbeat. It is the reason I have found .40 in other platforms, even legendary ones, a bit of a letdown.

In my ownership of a Glock 22 Gen 4, Glock 22 Gen 3, first-gen M&P .40, Sig P226, and Sig P229, nothing has touched the PX4 .40 in my subjective experience. It's excellent.

Excellent!

This type of experience has led us to have a saying, If you find a good .40 Storm, don't let it go. That is, if you want to trade this or that, switch to 9 or .45, whatever you do... when you have a good full size .40 workhorse, just keep it.

Please feel free to write about your .40 more, if you'd like. That's what this thread is for.

[beenalongtime]

The PX4 Storm in 9mm is enjoying much celebrity currently. The .45 Storm has it’s own characteristics. In this thread, I would like to discuss the PX4 .40 full size. It is not as popular and deserves a closer look.

Reliability? 100% reliability is our experience. Here are some reasons, in my opinion: Firstly, the cartridge is high pressure and will throw the slide back hard enough to eject well and setup reintroduction of the next round.

Wear & tear? We have found the .40s to not wear much on inside parts (compared to .45), slightly more than the 9mm.

Cleaning? We have found the .40 to get about 30% dirtier (per round) than a 9mm, ammo brands being equal.

What has been your experience? What things would you like to discuss about the .40?
The fact that Langdon models weren't produced in that caliber.:p
I realize I am still a relatively new shooter (I have a LOT to learn). In your other thread, you mentioned the section of the slide that was hollowed out in the 9mm, but not in the other calibers. I thought 9mm in Nato specs, is supposed to be a higher pressure round, closer to the 40S&W? I don't know that for a fact, nor do I know if it is just due to the length (more powder, the way 10mm has more oomph then the 40).


i've always wondered about the "i must prove that this pistol is okey dokey before i carry it." mindset. do you give no credit to the manufacturer for doing proper design and testing? do you take no knowledge of the other pistols that are out in the wild that are being used by people everyday? no acknowledgement of independent testing done by various government bodies (who have far larger budgets than me).

when you buy a new car, you gas it up, check tire pressures, find the horn and radio buttons, and off you go. you don't first drive it 50,000 miles on a test track before taking it to the grocery store. you trust that it will do what you expect it to do.

sure, you might make sure your pet ammo load works fine (likely the gun maker has already shot everything commercially available in testing at some point) for your own peace of mind, but clean it up, load it up, and go.


I think a gun would be closer to a race car. You want to know how it will handle (different types of ammo), how things look/feel (sights, grip, controls, POA, POI), and if there are going to be common problems that need fixing. You wouldn't just go out and jump in a race car cold/never driven before (in most cases).

The Good, the Bad & the Ugly of the PX4 .40 full size.

Just a few things...



The Good: I have found the full size .40 to be flat shooting and of very quick feeling cycling. To me recoil is light and yet not boring. To have 15 rounds of 180 grn HSTs is good for “social work”. It is reliable and well balanced. Post muzzle burn or spark is manageable.


The Bad: I find the full size .40 dense feeling. The slide and barrel have more metal in them and then there is the ammo. Just the lead from 15 rounds of 180 grn fodder is 2,700 grns. 10 .45s in 230 grn are 2,300 grns. 18 9mm 124 grn drill bits are 2,232 grns. Some might not notice, but I can feel when my magazine on my .45 is full or getting empty. So, to me... it is noticeable.


The Ugly: There is a strange anomaly that I’ve often seen with the magazines in .40s (14 rounders). When they are filled, the inner coils go into the outer coils and stick to themselves a little. This makes a rattling of loose ammo. A Ninja could not sneak up on a music festival with that on his belt. You sometimes can take out a round and pump it up and down a few times, put the round back in and be fixed. I have tested shooting when it was rattling... shot just fine. Recoil reset things.

I was going to write that I’ve never seen any other caliber do that. Then, a few hours ago when my wife picked up her SubCompact 9, it did it. She disassembled the mag and switched to a different duty mag... pending inspection.

I found it to be less balanced then the 40 compact. I even prefer the subcompact to the full size. I tend to use it currently, as a dry fire/practice pistol more, and plan on making it a emergency/bedroom gun. I should add, my full size is a type C.
Let me go ahead and state, I have a full type C in 40. I have two compacts in 40 (the range/carry one, and one I am doing some stuff to, that will make it the carry gun, unless a relative ends up with it). I have two subcompacts in 40, one type G and one Type C. The subcompact was my first and there were multiple reasons for 40. (stuff I don't need to go into here) The type C was bought on a whim as it was listed as a type D incorrectly (wanted to try both and had the funds).
I also have two 9 compacts (one my version of the EL, that I am awaiting sights to finish), and a subcompact 9 slide (was mislabeled as a compact). These were because of ammo shortages, I want choice, and I also have been asked to join a shooting competition last year, but my schedule wouldn't allow it (would love to do that and less recoil could help times). A full size may be coming (sitting at the LGS in the used case).

I've had a rattling issue once, where when I put the magazine back together, after initial cleaning, I moved the baseplate a bit, so it wandered in the magazine. My LEO relative, received his gun back from the department gunsmith, with new sights and new magazines. No one could load one magazine completely, so they gave it back to the gunsmith, and he found he couldn't either. He pulled it apart and found something in on top of the baseplate (sounds like a piece of a broken one, from the story I was told) and it did rattle some.
Generally, I prefer the compact 40 over the full size, but often it will be the subcompact (shorter range, more concealable). I am tending to use the type C's more as trainers, and due to that, I do let the trigger go out farther then the reset on a type F or G.

[Kyle Reese]

Any reason to not snap up a Type C PX4? These can be had brand new for like $320, shipped.

Sent from my VS995 using Tapatalk

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Any reason to not snap up a Type C PX4? These can be had brand new for like $320, shipped.

Sent from my VS995 using Tapatalk


TYR, I have never shot a type C. I’ve handled one, though. I have never heard of long term usage. If you like the action, Beretta makes good stuff. My only concern or question comes with the consequences of the action mechanically.

The slide will cock the hammer which then must fall a long way (building force) to land on the sear much farther down than a type F or G. Will this cause sooner wear and degradation of the sears? I don’t know. You also give up second strike capability, as the slide must half cock the pistol to be ready to fire again (like a Glock). The hammer rides in half cock which exposes the firing pin. It is safe enough, but I’ve found that after a day of carrying, lint will fill that area. With an F or G the hammer protects the impact surface.

Does any of this matter? Personal choice. Is it worth $320? No doubt! How will it do long term? I await anyone taking it long term to find that out.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

beenalongtime I don’t understand this reference, “The fact that Langdon models weren't produced in that caliber.”

The 9 and .45 have that area milled out. The NATO rounds are a little hotter, but not because of case size. A rimless cartridge (like 9, .40, .45 ACP) headspaces on the front of the case. Headspacing stops it from going in farther, aligning the headstamp (around the primer) to the breech face (where the firing pin protrudes).
The PX4 in 9 (& .45) can handle +P ammo which averages 10% higher pressures. .40 is already, technically a +P round. That is why you don’t commonly see any .40+P ammo. Perhaps, that is the answer. If Beretta thought you would shoot only +P long term, they might beef it up. The additional weight of the slide also helps to mitigate recoil.

You wrote, “dry fire/practice pistol more, and plan on making it a emergency/bedroom gun”. I would suggest that if you dry fire a lot, the possibility of firing pin damage might make it a poor choice for home defense, long term. If you use fresh snap caps, you could avoid that risk.


Your collection of Storms is impressive! How many rounds have you put on the full size type C?

You wrote, " I have two subcompacts in 40, one type G and one Type C." I have never heard of a SubCompact type C. Is this a limited addition?


You're going to be our Go To Guy for type C info!

[DAB]

DAB, If you could please clarify your question, I could more accurately respond.

In case this is it: I modify the Storms that are for my use the same. I install a Low Profile kit (levers and slide catch) and a Cougar D spring. I follow the same maintenance protocols as I do in .45 and 9mm.

My .40 does have Talon Grips, since my wife likes to shoot it or carry it, occasionally.

my reply was directed to BehindBlueI's.

the point is, at some point you have to trust the work of another if you don't do everything yourself.

do you do metallurgical tests on critical parts? dimension checks on all parts? where do you draw the line.

and if that is the standard you advocate, then what hope does the average shooter, who does not possess your deep knowledge, have in trusting a gun to function as advertised? all Harry or Sally wants to know is that the gun they have selected will perform as advertised. it will go bang reliably, will hit the target as intended. many people cannot afford 2 pistols, particularly the poor, who most need the ability for self defense in some lousy neighborhoods. they can afford a $400 pistol and 2 boxes of ammo.

[Johnny Bravo]

I have a PX4 Compact in .40 that I have done up with Trijicon HD's, D spring, and the low profile levers. I've got probably 6 - 7 hundred rounds through it without issue (admittedly not many). I'm more comfortable with .40 in such a short barrel than I am 9mm and the PX4 is a mild shooter in this caliber.

I am not real fond of anything other than TDA for AIWB carry and the PX4 fills the bill perfectly.

I am also curious to see how the high round count guns hold up even though mine will probably never become one of them.

And I apologize in advance for not having anything to add to the discussion, but maybe if the thread doesn't die I will have something later on.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

my reply was directed to BehindBlueI's.

the point is, at some point you have to trust the work of another if you don't do everything yourself.

do you do metallurgical tests on critical parts? dimension checks on all parts? where do you draw the line.

and if that is the standard you advocate, then what hope does the average shooter, who does not possess your deep knowledge, have in trusting a gun to function as advertised? all Harry or Sally wants to know is that the gun they have selected will perform as advertised. it will go bang reliably, will hit the target as intended. many people cannot afford 2 pistols, particularly the poor, who most need the ability for self defense in some lousy neighborhoods. they can afford a $400 pistol and 2 boxes of ammo.


I understand. Your points are valid. Since, as you say, I don't take out a caliper or test metal hardness, etc., there is a degree of trust in the manufacturer's reputation and testing.
In the same way, when one buys a car, you don't check piston ring tolerances or valves, but you can hear and feel (or smell) if they are working correctly (to an extent).

This is why I keep it simple: Test firing to verify that it works correctly from the factory. Again, how it works the way that you personally like to lubricate. Again, how it works with your defense ammo. Test all magazines, etc..

Now, here's the consistency of the statement- If a person is poor and cannot test a lot, but only tests a few mags full (or not at all), chances are they are too poor to shoot a lot and have trouble with high round count duration issues. Chances are that they do not practice enough to be safe (to neighbors, etc.) and probably won't practice much tactical application. They might one day need to pick it up, point and shoot. Then their issue will be more of ammo reliability or maintenance (lubrication, magazine maintenance, etc.)

If you are just getting a vehicle to go to the supermarket twice per month, your requirements are less. The twin gun protocol is only needed if you are fortunate enough to have enough ammo and ranges to shoot a lot. If you are too poor and just need a grab and shoot for little money, a Rossi .38 or Hi Power 9 will probably get a few rounds where you point them.

So we might be talking apples and oranges.

[beenalongtime]

beenalongtime I don’t understand this reference, “The fact that Langdon models weren't produced in that caliber.”

The 9 and .45 have that area milled out. The NATO rounds are a little hotter, but not because of case size. A rimless cartridge (like 9, .40, .45 ACP) headspaces on the front of the case. Headspacing stops it from going in farther, aligning the headstamp (around the primer) to the breech face (where the firing pin protrudes).
The PX4 in 9 (& .45) can handle +P ammo which averages 10% higher pressures. .40 is already, technically a +P round. That is why you don’t commonly see any .40+P ammo. Perhaps, that is the answer. If Beretta thought you would shoot only +P long term, they might beef it up. The additional weight of the slide also helps to mitigate recoil.

You wrote, “dry fire/practice pistol more, and plan on making it a emergency/bedroom gun”. I would suggest that if you dry fire a lot, the possibility of firing pin damage might make it a poor choice for home defense, long term. If you use fresh snap caps, you could avoid that risk.


Your collection of Storms is impressive! How many rounds have you put on the full size type C?

You wrote, " I have two subcompacts in 40, one type G and one Type C." I have never heard of a SubCompact type C. Is this a limited addition?


You're going to be our Go To Guy for type C info!

The reference is to a gun, in which you have posted in LangdonTactical's thread. The Compact carry and the Carry models.
Dry fire, is ALMOST always done with either a snap cap in it, or with a laser round (typically how I practice). I do pull the trigger without something in it, if I have taken it apart for some reason, to verify functionality.
I have not put a lot into the full size. (100 rounds) I wanted to verify it worked, and I found the balance to be (I can only describe as) off, compared to the compact. (which seems to auto aim when I raise it in my hands) I also think/thought, since I am a fairly new shooter, focusing on what I carry is to my benefit. (which is in very limited/specific situations)
My collection, well the benefits of being free and clear of a mortgage by my 40th birthday, and last year a decent amount of OT, due to others medical issues. Also with the prices they have been, my most expensive gun, was the first used subcompact type F, that I made into the G. All the others were under $400 before transfer.
I could recommend some people better qualified to talk about the Type C. Some are on both forums (the Beretta Forum, specifically, has had several discussions on the Type C/D subcompacts). The Subcompact types C/D were sold to police markets and again last year made their ways to the secondary markets, as evaluation guns. (seemed to have happened before/different dept?)

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

I have a PX4 Compact in .40 that I have done up with Trijicon HD's, D spring, and the low profile levers. I've got probably 6 - 7 hundred rounds through it without issue (admittedly not many). I'm more comfortable with .40 in such a short barrel than I am 9mm and the PX4 is a mild shooter in this caliber.

I am not real fond of anything other than TDA for AIWB carry and the PX4 fills the bill perfectly.

I am also curious to see how the high round count guns hold up even though mine will probably never become one of them.

And I apologize in advance for not having anything to add to the discussion, but maybe if the thread doesn't die I will have something later on.

You have, indeed, added to the discussion! Beretta recommends 200-300 rounds through a PX4 for break-in/testing to be sure it is reliable. You have quite surpassed that.

It you want more detailed information on high round count usage of some PX4 Storms, there are a few threads detailing that.

https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?16519-The-PX4-Compact-might-be-my-DA-SA-Glock-19

https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?25341-Beretta-PX4-Storm-Underrated-is-an-Understatement!

https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?29478-Beretta-PX4-Storm-45-High-round-count-long-duration-usage


Any questions... feel free to ask.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

beenalongtime ,

You wrote, "I also think/thought, since I am a fairly new shooter, focusing on what I carry is to my benefit."

That is very smart! In defensive situations- second nature, muscle memory, being used to a pistol, etc., will be your tools. Thinking and remembering consciously are not guaranteed.


Sometimes at the range I will shoot others' pistols (Compact, full size .40 or 9, SubCompact). Afterwards, I will always go back and re-drill with mine to "wash my hands" (as I call it) of the feel of anything else.

[DAB]

"training scars"?

[BehindBlueI's]

my reply was directed to BehindBlueI's.

the point is, at some point you have to trust the work of another if you don't do everything yourself.

do you do metallurgical tests on critical parts? dimension checks on all parts? where do you draw the line.

and if that is the standard you advocate, then what hope does the average shooter, who does not possess your deep knowledge, have in trusting a gun to function as advertised? all Harry or Sally wants to know is that the gun they have selected will perform as advertised. it will go bang reliably, will hit the target as intended. many people cannot afford 2 pistols, particularly the poor, who most need the ability for self defense in some lousy neighborhoods. they can afford a $400 pistol and 2 boxes of ammo.

What access and resources other people have is not my problem, nor does it affect my vetting process. Frankly, who gives a shit what the uninformed, non-dedicated, amateurs with 2 boxes of ammo have or do? And more importantly, why would I change what *I* do based on the lowest denominator of gun owners?

Draw the line wherever you want. Again, not my problem. I've already said where my line is. Start with a design with years, preferable decades, of acceptable service life. Vet your particular gun. My duty gun has just over 2k rounds through it. I recently bought a retiree's gun so I have an exact duplicate (well, other than the last four of the s/n) and will from here on out use that gun for training to keep the rounds off my duty gun. Any major flaws would have surfaced in 2k rounds. Which, by the way, they did the first time these guns were rolled out. We could have *trusted* Glock, but we actually vetted our equipment, found it lacking, and got the issue addressed and fixed. When I was issued a Gen 3 Glock 22 I could have *trusted* Glock but I vetted my equipment and found out the gun didn't run reliably with a weapon mounted light. The fact I don't take it to the level of metallurgical tests doesn't relieve me of the responsibility to vet my equipment before it's called upon to save my life or the life of someone else.

I can guarantee you when you and your colleagues are being shot at by some asshole who's already shot another of your colleagues is not the time to be vetting your equipment regardless of what Harry or Sally do with the SCCY they hide in their sock drawer. So, once again, I put zero trust in a manufacturer or design of a firearm until I've vetted my particular example because they all put out shit on occasion and they all lie about it.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

"training scars"?

To what or to whom are you referring?

[AdioSS]

Too much bickering/bitching.

This thread needs more .40 PX4!

https://i.imgur.com/2ty4V5wl.jpg

But currently this is sporting a standard FS Trigger group that I got off eBay.

I too was tempted by the Subcompact Type C .40s, but passed on it due to the tilt barrel instead of rotating. I’ve been on the lookout for a used .40 Compact, but those don’t seem to pop up much.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Too much bickering/bitching.

This thread needs more .40 PX4!

https://i.imgur.com/2ty4V5wl.jpg

But currently this is sporting a standard FS Trigger group that I got off eBay.

I too was tempted by the Subcompact Type C .40s, but passed on it due to the tilt barrel instead of rotating. I’ve been on the lookout for a used .40 Compact, but those don’t seem to pop up much.

Nice pistol! Did you do the stippling?

I do seem to attract hecklers recently. Maybe they make a spray for that.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

I am going to be putting some high volume rounds through my full size .40. Got it out and to the range yesterday. It will be my primary range pistol for a while. I'll average 600 rounds per week.

[beenalongtime]

Too much bickering/bitching.

This thread needs more .40 PX4!

https://i.imgur.com/2ty4V5wl.jpg

But currently this is sporting a standard FS Trigger group that I got off eBay.

I too was tempted by the Subcompact Type C .40s, but passed on it due to the tilt barrel instead of rotating. I’ve been on the lookout for a used .40 Compact, but those don’t seem to pop up much.

What have you done with the sights?
I have found a used one online, but then found a new one for not that much more (and the used missed pictures).
So is this the D conversion, or a hybrid DA/SA without safety/decocker?

[AdioSS]

https://i.imgur.com/OjXPKayl.jpg
It is a Type C. First I did a little reshaping then did the stippling. The sights are old night sights with orange fingernail polish on the front. I put a standard trigger & trigger bar in with the Type C trigger group. That shortened the reset & restored double action/second strike capability. I’m not sure if I prefer that or the TDA trigger.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

https://i.imgur.com/OjXPKayl.jpg
It is a Type C. First I did a little reshaping then did the stippling. The sights are old night sights with orange fingernail polish on the front. I put a standard trigger & trigger bar in with the Type C trigger group. That shortened the reset & restored double action/second strike capability. I’m not sure if I prefer that or the TDA trigger.

Very impressive!

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Take care of your Storm and it will take care of you!


I put about 1,000 rounds on my .40 this week and a half. Fun, reliable, smooth shooting... accurate!. One could get spoiled easily shooting this classy pistol. I was not able to keep my round count down to 300 per session, though.


23845

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Did anyone else get to shoot their PX4 Storm?


Pix???

[Storm SD]

My range pistol and what I shoot most of the time is a PX4 Storm SD .45, but my EDC is a PX4 Storm Full size .40. I have the same modifications (D-spring, low profile levers and slide catch, modified to a G model) as I do on my range pistol. In my picture, I also include my other EDC items. The knives consist of a Cold Steel Black Talon in my left side pocket and a Cold Steel tanto Voyager on the right. I also have a spare 14 round magazine and the self defense ammo pictured is the Federal HST 180 grain.

27956

[JonInWA]

While I don't have a PX4 Storm, I have been fairly heavily running my .40 HK P30L in V1 LEM, and, to a lesser extent, my HK VP40 and Gen4 Glock G22. I find both to be credible, reliable, and quite accurate with .40. HK's RSA setups do an excellent job in taming the recoil impulse, and do their increased slide weights....imagine that, increasing slide weight to ameliorate the .40 pressure spike, not just relying on jacked-up springing...

The Glock seems to run best (for me) with the Medium beavertail backstrap; it helps fix my hands and diffuse the recoil forces.

Good as these three .40s are, their ability to fire at speed is compromised by the inherent characteristics of the .40 cartridge; this becomes immediately apparent when you comparatively fire a similar 9mm in the same session...

Best, Jon

[Storm SD]

JonInWA When I started shooting handguns, my first gun was a Beretta 96 (.40 caliber). I felt the recoil to be quite snappy with that one. I later had other brands and models of 9mm, .40, and .45. What I found was that though the model 96 was heavier, the recoil felt much more manageable in the full size PX4 Storm .40. I would contribute this to the rotating barrel. The direction of the recoil seems to push back into the hand and allow acquisition of the next shot to be easier when shooting a rapid sequence. However, I've seen that in self defense situations, the target changes (falls down, runs, shoots back, etc.) after the first 1 to 3 shots. Since this is my EDC, I wanted something with a bit more power. I found the .40 to be the ideal middle ground between the smaller 9 mm with higher magazine capacities and the more powerful .45 with lower magazine capacities. I use a larger backstrap on my .40 than what I have on my .45 and in this manner, the grips on the two pistols end up feeling the same to me. I've carried 9 mm, .40, and .45. I usually shoot a .45 at the range and occasionally the .40 in the same session. I rarely shoot a 9 mm in the same session, but to me, the .40 seems to be quick and easily managed after shooting the .45. I understand the reason for your preference of the 9 mm, but I still prefer the PX4 Storm .40 for self defense. Thanks for your input though Jon.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

I’ve been putting some rounds on my PX4 Storm full size .40, type G recently. It was time to get it checked out and in shape.

I’ve been using Federal Champion 180 grn copper dipped cartridges and some 165 grn Winchester white box FMJs. I like the Federals better, they are more consistent and the same weight as my HSTs. The bore cleans up quickly and easily.

I had a few failure to feed issues caused by the extractor. It was poorly fitted and shaped from the factory. I took a new one, custom fit and shaped it. Now it runs like a sewing machine, eating everything and no slide hesitation.

I cleaned inside the slide and frame even though the round count is low, it is 6 years old.

It runs as smoothly as silk and I took the D spring from Storm SD ‘s SD (which he retired from range use) that had 27,326 rounds on that spring. Trigger pull is around 6 lbs 3 oz DA and 3 lbs 12 oz SA.
I’ll keep the D spring that was in it and is still only 3,460 rounds old in store for when the Storm .40 goes back to EDC duties.

I got new magazine springs for all .40 mags, including the range mags. The .40 seems to need new springs quicker than the .45. An indication of weak springs is failure to “nose up” on upcoming rounds.



Pistol round count 4,469

[TheNewbie]

I’ve been putting some rounds on my PX4 Storm full size .40, type G recently. It was time to get it checked out and in shape.

I’ve been using Federal Champion 180 grn copper dipped cartridges and some 165 grn Winchester white box FMJs. I like the Federals better, they are more consistent and the same weight as my HSTs. The bore cleans up quickly and easily.

I had a few failure to feed issues caused by the extractor. It was poorly fitted and shaped from the factory. I took a new one, custom fit and shaped it. Now it runs like a sewing machine, eating everything and no slide hesitation.

I cleaned inside the slide and frame even though the round count is low, it is 6 years old.

It runs as smoothly as silk and I took the D spring from Storm SD ‘s SD (which he retired from range use) that had 27,326 rounds on that spring. Trigger pull is around 6 lbs 3 oz DA and 3 lbs 12 oz SA.
I’ll keep the D spring that was in it and is still only 3,460 rounds old in store for when the Storm .40 goes back to EDC duties.

I got new magazine springs for all .40 mags, including the range mags. The .40 seems to need new springs quicker than the .45. An indication of weak springs is failure to “nose up” on upcoming rounds.



Pistol round count 4,469



What did you do to custom fit it?

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

What did you do to custom fit it?

Though I do not recommend anyone doing this at home...

When a round is coming up from the magazine it is tilted slightly upward. It will come under the extractor as it rises. It will need space to straighten out as it goes forward.

First, the rim must fit between the extractor and the breech face. I made the side of the extractor (not the claw yet) angled to enhance this induction. I polished and rounded the approach angle and deepened the space in the claw to allow for variations of rims.

Next, the casing must come up past the claw’s lower edge and fall into the curvature in the extractor claw.
The claw on a .45 Storm is much shorter than that of a 9mm or .40. This is because the slide is cut out farther to house the .45. The 9mm & .40 are higher pressure rounds and need more breech face depth. This means that the extractor claws are longer, often too long in the wrong spot, if not manicured.

I created an induction curve and reduced the bottom protrusion of the claw and polished it. The top of the claw will space and retain the cartridge sufficiently, as will the center. By reducing the lower point of the curve and polishing it, friction and the need to overcome the spring are greatly reduced.

This made for smooth sailing for all cartridges of any brand. This also allows the strangely shaped bullet that occasionally comes up to have the space to readjust as it hits the top of the chamber.

I hope my explanation was not too confusing. It is a fine tune type of operation. Metal tempering was not affected.

[Bobert1035]

I picked up a police trade in PX4 full size in 40 recently. It was filthy and shows a lot of holster wear, but the trigger is good, and it feels good in the hand (like all PX4s I imagine). I dropped in a 11# hammer spring, did the "G" conversion, and hit the range. Accuracy was fine when I did my part, recoil was brisk by not unmanageable. I really like it! At some point I'll either paint the dead OEM night sights or add something new.

[fixer]

Picked up a PX4 in 40 recently as well. Super nice shooting 40 caliber full size. I really like it. Literally about 50% less recoil than a G23. Ran through 200 rounds in one session and had no wrist pain (which my old G23 would set off in spades at 100 rds).

[Bobert1035]

My 92 in 9mm felt like a 22 after shooting the PX4 in 40 :cool:

[Storm SD]

I've started using my .40 caliber PX4 Storm as my range gun. It has been my EDC for the last couple of years. It currently has 10,283 rounds on it. As for maintenance on it, I completely disassemble the slide every 5,000 rounds to do a full cleaning of the slide. I disassemble the frame and slide at 10,000 rounds to do a full pistol cleaning. I also change the slide rebound spring every 4,000 to 5,000 rounds. I replace pins and springs that are worn during my 10,000 round cleaning. I did my 10,000 round cleaning a little early on this .40 at 8,381 rounds. It should be fun to use this on the range for a while. It will also be a little less expensive than buying .45's like I've been doing.

[JTQ]

Thanks for reporting.

I'll be interested to see how the durability of the .40 S&W gun compares to the .45 ACP gun.

[LockedBreech]

The PX4 .40 fullsize is why it took me so many years to understand why people don't like the .40S&W. It was my first handgun, and only handgun for years and years. When I finally shot a 9mm, it barely felt different. Took until I shot a Glock in .40 to understand.

Great platform in .40. Unfortunate it's not known as such, due to some ugly teething issues in the caliber about a decade ago. Mine is at somewhere between 12,000 and 15,000 (I stopped tracking at 12, so it's a rough estimate). One stoppage ever, a failure to return fully to battery roughly round 3,000 using a particularly sketchy batch of Magtech reloaded ammo. Swat to the back of the slide fixed it. Only thing I did was swap out the recoil spring and magazines at 10,000. Still bone stock otherwise.

[Storm SD]

36769

After a few months of switching my PX4 Storm SD to my EDC and my PX4 Storm .40 to my range pistol, I've decided to switch back. I retired my SD as my range pistol after PX4 Storm Tracker and I had both experienced cracked barrels. After learning what to look for from his experience, I was able to discover the crack in my barrel pretty early. I wanted to preserve my SD, so I retired it while my new barrel only had 5,628 rounds on it. However, I find the SD more enjoyable to shoot, so I will save up for a spare barrel and enjoy shooting it while I have it.

The PX4 Storm .40 is still a nice pistol that has also provided many enjoyable hours on the range. I had one issue during the last few months. Somewhere around 11,680 rounds, I noticed that the front sight was broken. It did not come out, but the break was at the left side of the front sight at the base. The break allowed for a very small amount of "play" from side to side. I was able to continue to use it in this condition until a new sight arrived from Beretta and I had the new one installed at 12,880 rounds. I passed 15,000 rounds (15,080) this week and I disassembled my slide for a thorough cleaning and to replace pins and springs. After cleaning and reassembly, I put this PX4 Storm .40 back on duty as my EDC and picked up the PX4 Storm SD for my range pistol once again. I would be curious if any other PX4 Storm owners have had a broken sight and what caliber it was on.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

I passed 15,000 rounds (15,080) this week and I disassembled my slide for a thorough cleaning and to replace pins and springs.

Which pins and springs did you replace?

[Storm SD]

Which pins and springs did you replace?

I replaced the rebound spring, firing pin spring, decocker lever spring, extractor pin and decocker lever pin. I checked the feel and tension on the extractor and decided to not change the extractor springs on this cleaning.

[Storm SD]

I am still using my PX4 Storm .40 as my EDC. This last weekend, I replaced my factory hammer with a spurless hammer. I tested it with 100 rounds of Federal Champions yesterday and it worked perfectly. After range cleaning it, re-lubing it, and putting it back on duty, I have been wearing it today. I sit at a desk a lot and never thought that the factory hammer pressed into my abdomen much until that spur was absent. The spurless hammer is much more comfortable than the factory hammer while sitting.

42917

42918

Current round count: 15,980

[Danjojo]

I like the ergos and shooting characteristics of the full-size PX4 pistols just never really trusted their durability and reliability. Long slide 40 version would have been tempting.

[Storm SD]

I like the ergos and shooting characteristics of the full-size PX4 pistols just never really trusted their durability and reliability. Long slide 40 version would have been tempting.

My personal experience for the reliability of the PX4 Storm has been excellent. I have used a PX4 Storm as an EDC for over 5 years now. As far as durability, I have a 9mm full size PX4 Storm with 9,697 rounds on it, my .40 that is pictured above with 15,980 rounds on it, my PX4 Storm SD in .45 with 37,120 rounds on it. All 3 of these are in very good condition and I plan to enjoy many thousands of rounds more from each of them. You'll find a lot of good information on durability under the thread "PX4 Storm .45 High round count, long duration usage" where PX4 Storm Tracker has documented the usage of his .45 and currently has around 85,000 rounds on it. I hope some of this information can put some of your fears to rest about the reliability and durability of the PX4 Storm.

[LockedBreech]

My 2008 PX4 .40 fullsize is at about 12,000 rounds, one spring change and mag change at 6,000, nothing else changed ever. No breakages and a total of 2 stoppages ever. They are definitely not fragile.

[Storm SD]

46203

I was able to acquire this PX4 Compact in .40 caliber this week for a good price. It was originally purchased 2 years ago, but the first owner put only 19 rounds through it during that time. I have been using a full size PX4 Storm .40 as my EDC. I plan to modify this Compact with the same modifications as my full size and, eventually, make this into my EDC. The shorter barrel and grip will be a little more comfortable and possibly be a little easier to conceal. So far, I have added a D-spring, converted it into a G model with decocker levers only, and added the larger backstrap (like I prefer). I plan to add a low profile slide catch, carry levers, and a spurless hammer. I shot 200 rounds through it without incident this week. It does have a pretty "snappy" recoil, which I don't mind, but the woman who originally purchased it thought it was too much for her and I can certainly understand why. I'll put a few hundred more through it before it becomes my EDC. I will be able to really compare the difference between the full size and the compact as an EDC soon.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Storm SD , since you will be moving to a shorter barrel, will you be using the same self defense loads for carry?

[Storm SD]

Storm SD , since you will be moving to a shorter barrel, will you be using the same self defense loads for carry?

No. I carry the Federal HST's in the 180 grain in my full size .40. I plan to carry the Federal HST's in the 165 grain in the Compact. Federal advertises 1010 fps muzzle velocity for the 180 grain and 1130 fps muzzle velocity for the 165 grain. I will use the 165 grain to compensate for the loss in muzzle velocity due to the shorter barrel of the Compact.

[Storm SD]

PX4 Storm Tracker , Sir, in addition to the information I posted above, I watched some YouTube reviews of the Federal HST 165 grain .40 before making my decision. I found one review using a Smith & Wesson Shield .40 with a 3.1" barrel. This was the closest comparison that I found to the 3.2" barrel of the PX4 Compact in .40. This is the link if you'd like to check it out. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K9jWLpm9R4Q. The average muzzle velocity from the 3.1" barrel was 1029.6 fps with 388.487 ft-lbs of energy using the Federal HST 165 grain. This was pretty close to the advertised 1010 fps from the Federal HST 180 grain using a 4" barrel.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Though I do not recommend anyone doing this at home...

When a round is coming up from the magazine it is tilted slightly upward. It will come under the extractor as it rises. It will need space to straighten out as it goes forward.

First, the rim must fit between the extractor and the breech face. I made the side of the extractor (not the claw yet) angled to enhance this induction. I polished and rounded the approach angle and deepened the space in the claw to allow for variations of rims.

Next, the casing must come up past the claw’s lower edge and fall into the curvature in the extractor claw.
The claw on a .45 Storm is much shorter than that of a 9mm or .40. This is because the slide is cut out farther to house the .45. The 9mm & .40 are higher pressure rounds and need more breech face depth. This means that the extractor claws are longer, often too long in the wrong spot, if not manicured.

I created an induction curve and reduced the bottom protrusion of the claw and polished it. The top of the claw will space and retain the cartridge sufficiently, as will the center. By reducing the lower point of the curve and polishing it, friction and the need to overcome the spring are greatly reduced.

This made for smooth sailing for all cartridges of any brand. This also allows the strangely shaped bullet that occasionally comes up to have the space to readjust as it hits the top of the chamber.

I hope my explanation was not too confusing. It is a fine tune type of operation. Metal tempering was not affected.

More questions have come up about this recently and I believe it is suitable to post pictures of the finished product. I still would not advise trying this if you are heavy handed or impatient, but here are some pics:

48159
48160
48161

[Storm SD]

I have put a few rounds on the new PX4 Compact .40 since I purchased it. It currently has 1,319 rounds on it. I also added the Carry levers, a spurless hammer, and a low profile slide catch and frame plug. I have found the Compact a little harder to shoot with the same accuracy as the full size. Though I have improved with it, I still plan on spending more time shooting it and developing the same shooting skill with it that I have with the full size before moving it to become my new EDC. I will provide pictures below of the new look of my PX4 Compact .40

48217

48218

48219

[Storm SD]

After putting 2719 rounds through my PX4 Compact .40, I've decided to do a full disassembly of the slide and frame, clean it, lubricate it, and use it as my EDC. It took me a while to become comfortable with it, but I finally feel that I am consistent and accurate with it. The only parts that I will replace as I reassemble it are the rebound spring and the decocker lever pin.

[Grouse870]

https://www.sportsmansoutdoorsuperstore.com/products2.cfm/ID/246943
Police trade ins for 269

[sheepdog]

[B]
The Ugly: There is a strange anomaly that I’ve often seen with the magazines in .40s (14 rounders). When they are filled, the inner coils go into the outer coils and stick to themselves a little. This makes a rattling of loose ammo. A Ninja could not sneak up on a music festival with that on his belt. You sometimes can take out a round and pump it up and down a few times, put the round back in and be fixed. I have tested shooting when it was rattling... shot just fine. Recoil reset things.

I was going to write that I’ve never seen any other caliber do that. Then, a few hours ago when my wife picked up her SubCompact 9, it did it. She disassembled the mag and switched to a different duty mag... pending inspection.

I have a 9mm mag for my PX4 Compact that I just noticed is rattling like crazy. Hmmm... does Mec-Gar make these for Beretta and merely operate under a non-compete clause? Or does Beretta or someone else make them?

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

I have a 9mm mag for my PX4 Compact that I just noticed is rattling like crazy. Hmmm... does Mec-Gar make these for Beretta and merely operate under a non-compete clause? Or does Beretta or someone else make them?

The last that I had heard, Beretta magazines for the PX4 are made by Mechanica Del Sarco. We had one time that a 9 mm SubCompact magazine did that rattle briefly. We disassembled it, cleaned it, made sure the springs were connected top and bottom well and repacked the magazine and it did not do it again. Storm SD is currently shooting a full size PX4 .40 at the range and carrying a PX4 Compact .40. I'll ask if he is getting any rattles.

[Storm SD]

PX4 Storm Tracker, I haven't had an issue with magazines rattling with either the full size or Compact magazines. I use 3 range mags and I alternate between 4 carry mags and haven't had the rattling issue with any of them.

[sheepdog]

The last that I had heard, Beretta magazines for the PX4 are made by Mechanica Del Sarco. We had one time that a 9 mm SubCompact magazine did that rattle briefly. We disassembled it, cleaned it, made sure the springs were connected top and bottom well and repacked the magazine and it did not do it again. Storm SD is currently shooting a full size PX4 .40 at the range and carrying a PX4 Compact .40. I'll ask if he is getting any rattles.

I think I figured it out.

I took the magazine apart and everything looked fine. I reassembled & reloaded it and some of the rounds were still loose. I checked each round for bullet setback and reloaded the mag two more times. Then I took another magazine and did the same thing. Some of the rounds move around, but they're not always in the same place (or the same number of rounds moving). These are 90 gr. 9mm Underwood XD rounds.

So I started wondering if that has anything to do with it. Those Phillips screwdriver-like fluted bullets make the cartridge a little shorter than my Hornady Critical Duty rounds (so there is a tad bit more room for the cartridge to move forward & aft in spots where the rounds aren't as compressed as the spring and magazine box start changing dimensionally as the mag tapers (allowing for even more movement, and generally towards the top in witness holes 8, 6, & 4). You can hear the rattle when the 9mm XD mag is loaded with 14+1 or 15 (with an empty chamber), but nothing moves when it is loaded 15+1 (as the 15the round is under more tension).

I then repeated all this (and more) loading up the magazines with my longer 115 gr. 9mm Critical Duty rounds. I just loaded up 14 at first and could barely hear it. In fact, in retrospect that might have been the magazine insert or floorplate retainer (whatever it's called in a Beretta vs. Glock). When the 15th round was in it was silent. I took them out and put them all back in again and got the same tight silent 15 rounds. I did this quite a few times (loading and unloading), and on one occasion 1 Hornady round moved (having loaded the magazine up with 15 rounds) and then 2 rounds moved with only 14 rounds, but this only happened one time each; and because they are longer cartridges, there is not as much distance to cover front & aft in the magazine case so the sound was less pronounced than with the XD rounds. In fact, I tapped the mag to make sure everything was seated after putting the 15th round in and it went completely silent (even without one in the chamber). I did this a few more times with the same effect (and now I am done playing for the time being).

I'm chalking it up to the shorter XD rounds at this point. That doesn't explain why the Hornady rounds seem to pack tighter (without even loading the magazine into the pistol). The bullets seem to be more consistent with one another than my cheap calipers (but how would I really know), but when they do move, the XD bullets do so more often and are noisier because they slam the case with more force.

Lastly, there are a few of other noises going on in the pistol while being shaken under normal circumstances, so when this bullet movement is occurring simultaneously with the play between the slide & frame, the play between the magazine & frame, and whatever noise the floor plate and/or insert/retainer shouldn't have been making, the ensuing cacophony makes for a perfect storm (pun intended). Now that I think about it, something similar happened once with my P229 using Underwood XD rounds (I just never bothered to get down to the bottom of it at the time). That's my story anyway, and I am sticking to it. ;)

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

sheepdog , great information! Thanks for sharing that.

[Akc47]

Everyone, great thread and exactly what I have been looking for, people who know the px4 40. I currently have a Glock 22 in 40 and an xdm in 40. Their intended purpose is home defense. The Glock is primary, the xdm is backup. I also have several 9mm and a couple of 380’s and a slew of revolvers. I carry the 380’s in summer and the 9mm in winter. But as I have gotten older and developed wrist and hand problems, the 40’s have gotten more uncomfortable to practice with. I know I could switch to the 9mm but I want to see if there is a 40 solution. I started looking for a softer shooting 40. My research led me to the px4 with its rotating barrel.
So, my first question is, 1) is it really softer shooting? This thread leads me to believe it is. Can anyone estimate if it is closer to a 9mm or just slightly less than a normal 40?
2) this thread also leads me to believe it is near 100% reliable with proper cleaning and maintenance. Are new guns normally trouble free?
3) I thought full size would be best, but some people seem to prefer the compact. Is the compact softer shooting or is it preferred by some for another reason? I can’t wait to learn from you guys and I hope this is the gun for me.

[Akc47]

Hello everyone. Nice to meet you and I’m glad I found this thread. Due to hand and wrist issues I’m thinking of selling my XDM 40 and buying the px4 40 as its replacement. Can anyone provide feedback on how much “lighter” shooting the px4 is over a normal 40 due to the rotating barrel? Does it have other features that reduces felt recoil? Thanks in advance.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Hello everyone. Nice to meet you and I’m glad I found this thread. Due to hand and wrist issues I’m thinking of selling my XDM 40 and buying the px4 40 as its replacement. Can anyone provide feedback on how much “lighter” shooting the px4 is over a normal 40 due to the rotating barrel? Does it have other features that reduces felt recoil? Thanks in advance.

Welcome to the Forum!

The PX4 Storm .40 is softer and lighter recoiling than other pistols because of a few things. Just how much lighter is subjective, but it seems like a lot in my experience. The rotating barrel keeps the slide and barrel locked together longer than standard tilt-lock pistols. This allows more energy dissipation. Since the barrel does not tilt, (which transfers shock off line) muzzle flip is less. The rebound spring has a buffer and the recoil is transferred lower in the frame, farther back, minimizing muzzle flip. The weight distribution and shape of the back of the grip also contribute to the softer recoil. The slide mounted levers allow a higher grip on the frame, assisting as well. Grip angle is more conducive to wrist health with a PX4.

There are a couple of things that can help this more. Choosing the correct backstrap of the 3 that come with it helps to spread the recoil throughout your hand better. Adding the rubberized Talon grips for under $20 also cushions shock. Lighter weight bullets have less push-back. Changing guide rod assemblies every 4,000 rounds helps avoid shock.

Reliability is excellent with all types of quality ammo. Worthy of a self defense or home defense weapon.

It will recoil sharper than a 9mm PX4, but not as much of a difference from standard 9mms. It is still a .40.

[Akc47]

Thank you for the information. If I can ask a few more questions:
1) Some people seem to think the compact has lighter recoil than the full size, what are your thoughts
2) Do you think Beretta will discontinue the px4 40 and if so, will they still support the ones already in circulation?
3) Since there are very few 40's in stock anywhere, would you be afraid to buy a LE trade? If I get a LE trade, what parts would you replace since I won't know how many rounds have been through it.
Thanks

[Wondering Beard]

Due to hand and wrist issues [...]

Are you sure you want to stay with a .40 S&W gun?

It's a rather unpleasant to shoot caliber irrelevant of platform (even if, as pointed out above the PX4 is easier to shoot) and going to a softer shooting caliber should help you more.

[Akc47]

I have considered this. But I don’t want to give up the 40 before I try a softer shooting gun. I have several 9’s that I can switch to if this doesn’t work out. I am willing to take the risk that it might not work. Plus I have a lot of 40 ammo already. 9mm and 357 mag I can still shoot fine. 44 mag is too much and I sold those already. Going to hang on to 40 cal as long as I can.

[Storm SD]

Everyone, great thread and exactly what I have been looking for, people who know the px4 40. I currently have a Glock 22 in 40 and an xdm in 40. Their intended purpose is home defense. The Glock is primary, the xdm is backup. I also have several 9mm and a couple of 380’s and a slew of revolvers. I carry the 380’s in summer and the 9mm in winter. But as I have gotten older and developed wrist and hand problems, the 40’s have gotten more uncomfortable to practice with. I know I could switch to the 9mm but I want to see if there is a 40 solution. I started looking for a softer shooting 40. My research led me to the px4 with its rotating barrel.
So, my first question is, 1) is it really softer shooting? This thread leads me to believe it is. Can anyone estimate if it is closer to a 9mm or just slightly less than a normal 40?
2) this thread also leads me to believe it is near 100% reliable with proper cleaning and maintenance. Are new guns normally trouble free?
3) I thought full size would be best, but some people seem to prefer the compact. Is the compact softer shooting or is it preferred by some for another reason? I can’t wait to learn from you guys and I hope this is the gun for me.

I have both a full size PX4 Storm .40 and a Compact PX4 Storm .40. I’ve found both of them to be very reliable with proper maintenance. I currently have 16,980 rounds on my full size .40 and 2,735 rounds on my Compact and I have had not issues with either gun. I’ll attempt to answer some of your questions. 1) “Is it really softer shooting?” With the full size .40, it is softer shooting than other .40s that I have used, but the recoil isn’t as light as most 9s. However, the recoil does feel a little different. Due to the rotating barrel, much of the recoil is forced straight back instead of up. So, the barrel doesn’t tend to recoil up as much making it easier to quickly acquire your target again. 2) “this thread also leads me to believe it is near 100% reliable with proper cleaning and maintenance. Are new guns normally trouble free?” I have had PX4 Storms in 9mm, .40 caliber, and .45 caliber and I believe the PX4 Storms are more reliable than anything out there. Many guns can be pretty trouble free with proper cleaning and maintenance, but I’ve found the PX4 Storm easy to disassemble, easy to clean and maintain, and easy to reassemble. The ease of maintenance adds to the dependability. 3) “I thought full size would be best, but some people seem to prefer the compact. Is the compact softer shooting or is it preferred by some for another reason?” I carry the PX4 Storm Compact .40 as my EDC. It is shorter than the full size. The Compact is 6.8 inches long and the full size is 7.55 inches long. Also, the Compact is 5 inches in height and the full size is 5.51 inches. These differences make the Compact more comfortable for me to carry. However, the recoil feels much sharper in the Compact compared to the full size. I spent more time at the range with the Compact getting used to shooting it than I thought that I would have to before I was comfortable enough with my consistency and accuracy to carry it. Also, the Compact magazine holds 12 rounds and the full size holds 14, but the full size magazine will work in in the Compact. It just sticks out at the bottom. I carry a full size magazine as my backup. In conclusion, if softer recoil is your concern, I think you’d like the full size PX4 Storm .40. It will still not be as soft as most 9mms of similar size, but with the way the recoil is directed back into your hand, it is very manageable (maybe even more so than other brands of 9mm). I hope you find this information useful. Let us know if you decide to get one.

[Akc47]

Thx SD. Full size vs. compact; all I care about is felt recoil so I think you answered that. I carry 9mm in winter and 380 in the summer. This will be a home defense gun, never a carry gun. If I love the px4 40 I might get the 9mm px4 as a carry gun later, but that is for another day.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Thank you for the information. If I can ask a few more questions:...
2) Do you think Beretta will discontinue the px4 40 and if so, will they still support the ones already in circulation?
3) Since there are very few 40's in stock anywhere, would you be afraid to buy a LE trade? If I get a LE trade, what parts would you replace since I won't know how many rounds have been through it.
Thanks

Beretta shows no plan nor reason to discontinue the .40. The PX4 was first made in .40. Many agencies and military affiliates still use the PX4. Beretta also seems to take note of fads. The .40 goes out of favor and comes back again later.

Beretta seems to still support discontinued products, as a rule. The .40 shares many (most) parts with a 9mm. The 9 was made as an adaptation of the PX4 .40.

LE trade-ins are a good option. If you can know its round count could help. That is probably not an option. The hammer spring on a stock PX4 should last longer than forever and other than cosmetics, a function test and feel of inner working springs is a good idea. This can be done without detailed disassembly. Beretta recommends to all LEO and military affiliates to have their armorer change small springs and wear items every 5,000 rounds. It is possible that they did, to not lose their warranty. So, I would just put in a new slide rebound spring (guide rod assembly) and give it a good cleaning and testing.

[Akc47]

I’ve never had a semi-auto DA/SA pistol but I’m looking forward to trying one. I know how they work, but is there anything I need to know about them? Harder to maintain? Repair? Etc.?

How hard are the safety levers to change to flat ones? I wanted a safety but after reading it seems like most prefer type g to type f? Is that true for most? Is that hard to convert?

[JTQ]

If I were changing out the safety/decocker lever, I'd choose this one

https://www.berettausa.com/en-us/px4-carry-decocker-g-safety-assembly/c8d710/


... I’m glad I found this thread.
You're welcome.;)

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

I’ve never had a semi-auto DA/SA pistol but I’m looking forward to trying one. I know how they work, but is there anything I need to know about them? Harder to maintain? Repair? Etc.?

How hard are the safety levers to change to flat ones? I wanted a safety but after reading it seems like most prefer type g to type f? Is that true for most? Is that hard to convert?

The biggest thing that I have found to be an obstacle with shooters new to DA/SA is the decision that the double action is difficult. If you do not allow yourself to be intimidated and talked into avoiding using it, it is not difficult at all. It has many safety advantages. LangdonTactical has quite a few good videos on DA/SA usage that might help.

There are no special maintenance requirements for a DA/SA PX4. Beretta states that it has fewer moving parts and less to go wrong. That is so true! I have put 117,800 rounds on my PX4 .45 and thousands of rounds on other PX4s for years. They are tough and durable with simple care.

As you have mentioned, many people have found that the long double action pull is sufficient as a safety and prefer a decock only (type G). One of the advantages of a PX4 is the simplicity of the conversion from type F to G. By removing one pin one can do the conversion at home for free. Installing new levers is as simple, by that same one pin removal. I just acquired another PX4 .45 and installed Carry levers. It took me under 5 minutes.

As to the question of difficulty... that is in the eye of the beholder. Are you fairly good with tools? Good dexterity? Patient? I have communicated with scores of people that have done the conversion to type G. "That was easy", is what I hear most. If things are patiently aligned and done correctly... easy...

[JTQ]

The biggest thing that I have found to be an obstacle with shooters new to DA/SA is the decision that the double action is difficult. If you do not allow yourself to be intimidated and talked into avoiding using it, it is not difficult at all. It has many safety advantages. LangdonTactical has quite a few good videos on DA/SA usage that might help.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FsoX26OhDCY

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

If I were changing out the safety/decocker lever, I'd choose this one

https://www.berettausa.com/en-us/px4-carry-decocker-g-safety-assembly/c8d710/


You're welcome.;)

I second that recommendation...

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FsoX26OhDCY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fPotECMtpSE

[Akc47]

Thanks for the video, just watched it. I’m not concerned about shooting with DA/SA trigger. I was a revolver guy for several decades before I got into semi’s. I can manage moving from SA to DA or DA to SA. I was mainly asking about the internal complication and storm tracker clarified that I think.
Only one of my semi’s currently has a safety (a smith M&P). My favorite 9mm is a PPQ and it came from the factory with a very light trigger and no safety. For target shooting it is awesome. But in a high stress situation I’m afraid of the very light first pull. That is why the safety appeals to me. But the type g setup might be even better since I have shot a lot of revolvers in my day.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

... I was mainly asking about the internal complication and storm tracker clarified that I think....

You can find more about the internal parts, their advantages and interactions in this thread: https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?29665-Beretta-PX4-Storm-Parts-What-does-each-part-do-and-how

[Akc47]

Has anyone heard on this board when dealers might get restocked on the 40?

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Has anyone heard on this board when dealers might get restocked on the 40?


The only one that I know of on the Forum that could correctly answer that is e_stern

[e_stern]

The only one that I know of on the Forum that could correctly answer that is e_stern

Very unlikely in the near future, 9MM is where it's at now.


.40 is likely to be a once a year thing.

[Akc47]

[QUOTE very unlikely in the near future, .40 is likely to be a once a year thing.[/QUOTE]

Thx e_stern.
Sounds like I’m getting myself all worked up for nothing, LOL. Going to be a while before I can get my hands on one.

[Akc47]

Thanks storm tracker. That thread you did on the parts is awesome. Looks like I will have time to study it before I can find one. Are you a gun smith?

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Thanks storm tracker. That thread you did on the parts is awesome. Looks like I will have time to study it before I can find one. Are you a gun smith?

Thanks for the positive words! I went to Gunsmithing School. I decided not to make the investment in a shop or going into it as a business, but wanted to be a better handgunner and know how to work on and maintain my own equipment.

[Akc47]

Does adding a Sprinco recoil reduction kit reduce recoil further without decreasing reliability?

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Does adding a Sprinco recoil reduction kit reduce recoil further without decreasing reliability?

Anytime you install a part not made by the manufacturer or an authorized affiliate you run the risk of decreasing reliability or voiding your warranty. That said... I have never tried this kit, but have heard from those that have. Most have said that it was a nice placebo, but some say it helps with recoil. It is supposed to make a progressive tension system, which theoretically could help.

[Akc47]

I went looking at guns today and found an HK USP 40. The SA trigger pull was very long, gritty and stiff. I also found a Beretta px4 in 9mm. The SA pull on it was shorter, lighter and smoother. Assuming the px4 40 trigger would be like the 9mm and that most HK’s would be similar to this one, I liked px4 better. Is the 9 trigger like the 40 trigger on a px4. In general, is the HK trigger not as good as the px4 in SA or was my experience an oddity?

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

I went looking at guns today and found an HK USP 40. The SA trigger pull was very long, gritty and stiff. I also found a Beretta px4 in 9mm. The SA pull on it was shorter, lighter and smoother. Assuming the px4 40 trigger would be like the 9mm and that most HK’s would be similar to this one, I liked px4 better. Is the 9 trigger like the 40 trigger on a px4. In general, is the HK trigger not as good as the px4 in SA or was my experience an oddity?

I have heard many reports that are similar to yours. My guess is that it would not be an oddity.

The PX4 9mm and the PX4 .40 use the same trigger and trigger mechanism and would therefore produce the same result.

[Akc47]

Is there any difference in an Inox version and regular other than color?

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Is there any difference in an Inox version and regular other than color?

Inox is short for inoxidizable. Meaning that it does not rust. In effect it resists rusting better. Other than the slide being stainless steel, there is no difference in parts, function or dimensions.

[Akc47]

Back before the pandemic and the social unrest, what was a fair price for the PX4 in 40?

[JTQ]

Back before the pandemic and the social unrest, what was a fair price for the PX4 in 40?
Forums all over the place have comments about finding new PX4's for $350+. In spite of them not being a terribly popular gun, I've typically seen them priced close to retail.

I'm not sure I've seen a sub-$500 PX4 in person. Just before the pandemic, I handled a full size PX4 in .40S&W at the nearby gun shop. They wanted $515 for it, and it was listed as a "Sale" item. I probably would have bought that gun in 9mm or .45 Auto at that price.

[learnerpermitted]

Forums all over the place have comments about finding new PX4's for $350+. In spite of them not being a terribly popular gun, I've typically seen them priced close to retail.

I'm not sure I've seen a sub-$500 PX4 in person. Just before the pandemic, I handled a full size PX4 in .40S&W at the nearby gun shop. They wanted $515 for it, and it was listed as a "Sale" item. I probably would have bought that gun in 9mm or .45 Auto at that price.

I do recall a period maybe 6-10 months ago when Bud’s had the FDE PX4 9mm for $400 for quite a while until they were sold out. I check periodically on slickguns.com and rarely see any of the PX4’s dip below 500 now.

[beenalongtime]

Back before the pandemic and the social unrest, what was a fair price for the PX4 in 40?


Before all this, most of my PX4's in .40 or 9mm, were bought for around $399. There were a couple of .40 C models (no decocker/safety), that I don't remember, but I think were a bit less (probably close after transfer fee).
About a month ago, sportsmansguide superstore? place had a bunch of them on closeout for $350ish. I wish I had picked up a full size DA/SA, but I just prefer the compact, so I skipped it.

[Akc47]

Well of course I get the fever for one when everyone is sold out, LOL. If anyone sees a full size F or G model for 350 to 450 please let me know. Or a good used one from 300 to 350. I visited 10 to 12 LGS stores today and only found one in 9mm. Not a 40 anywhere new or used. I will keep looking. I’m going to try and be patient, but we will see...

[JTQ]

I visited 10 to 12 LGS stores today and only found one in 9mm.
What did they want for that one?

[Akc47]

I think it was $575

[JTQ]

I think it was $575
That's the ballpark I typically see in $550 - $575 range. One gun store I frequented often, and they were a knowledgeable group of sales personnel, had a full size PX4C (Constant Action) in .40 S&W in their display case for at least two years. They never reduced the price on that gun the entire time it sat in the display case.

It was a less than popular gun model, in a less than popular configuration, in a less than popular caliber, and there it sat at full retail, for at least two years.

The store I mentioned above with the PX4 .40S&W for $515 on sale, also had a full size 9mm with night sights for $575.

[Akc47]

Thanks for the feedback everyone!

[Akc47]

Well, I bought a PX4 last night online. Says it was new. It is not full size, but a compact. I read up on the specs and the weight is not much different and it is only 1” shorter. I’ve also read a lot of reviews saying the compact recoil is the same as the full size, and that the compact will take 14 rd mags, so I took a chance. I paid $400, that includes gun, shipping and FFL fee on my end. Can’t wait for it to get here! I will have a lot more questions I’m sure, LOL.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Well, I bought a PX4 last night online. Says it was new. It is not full size, but a compact. I read up on the specs and the weight is not much different and it is only 1” shorter. I’ve also read a lot of reviews saying the compact recoil is the same as the full size, and that the compact will take 14 rd mags, so I took a chance. I paid $400, that includes gun, shipping and FFL fee on my end. Can’t wait for it to get here! I will have a lot more questions I’m sure, LOL.

We look forward to your follow-up report when it arrives. Any questions are welcome.

[Akc47]

Before I buy some, can you confirm the 14 rd and 17 rd mags will fit the compact? I know they won't be flush, but will they seat and work?

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Before I buy some, can you confirm the 14 rd and 17 rd mags will fit the compact? I know they won't be flush, but will they seat and work?

Confirmed. It is a PX4 quality that all size magazines of the same caliber fit into any PX4 that is smaller.

[JTQ]

Before I buy some, can you confirm the 14 rd and 17 rd mags will fit the compact? I know they won't be flush, but will they seat and work?

A video at the Beretta USA website on the PX4 page beginning about the 4:40 mark

https://www.beretta.com/en-us/px4-storm-full/



https://youtu.be/9i5EHo8jIoQ

[Akc47]

Storm, early in this thread you said you changed the D spring on your px4’s What is the purpose of this? I get the low profile levers. What is the approx. cost of these 3 changes? Can a newbie with average intelligence and YouTube do these mods? Thanks

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Storm, early in this thread you said you changed the D spring on your px4’s What is the purpose of this? I get the low profile levers. What is the approx. cost of these 3 changes? Can a newbie with average intelligence and YouTube do these mods? Thanks

Since the PX4 Storm is sold internationally and often winds up with wide spread use in countries that have different standards of ammunition, some even using rifle primers, the factory hammer spring is very strong. Since double action (and to a small degree single action) must overcome the hammer spring tension, it makes for a heavier trigger pull. It does make the hammer come down like a vault door closing and will ignite any functioning primer, but in the USA and places where ammunition standards are more handgun friendly, it is not necessary.

The Beretta Cougar (one of the forerunners to the PX4) had an optional D spring for the DAO model. The part is the same as the PX4 in size and coil count. Beretta sells this spring as an option for those that are not using ammunition with behavioral issues. This simple spring change (DIY for ~$10) will usually drop the double action pull to 8# instead of the normal 10-11#. SA will usually drop from near 5# to near 4#. A lighter spring will also cause less wear and tear on internal parts, reducing tension.

Other options also include hammer springs from LTT. A 12# spring will give excellent results and the chrome silicon additive will add longevity. There is also an 11# spring that has been good for many people, but can be a little more picky about some ammo types in some pistols. There is also a 10# being introduced. I look forward to seeing feedback on it. These spring are made on the coil count and length of a model 92, so pound comparison is not easily applicable. These CS springs when gotten from LTT also have a polished end to help with consistency. CS springs from LTT are in the same $10 range (if memory serves).

I have 88,700 rounds on the current D spring in my PX4 .45 G with no light strikes.

Low profile levers are attractive to most people because of the smaller size, making the pistol slimmer. There is also the problem some have had with the sharpness of the stock levers. This is not a poor decision on Beretta's part, however. This modification was requested by State Police to be able to function levers with winter gloves on.
There are 4 types of levers for the PX4. The stock and model 92 style can be type F or G. The Carry levers and Stealth levers are type G only. Individual levers average ~$45, give or take. Changing levers yourself is easily doable, depending on your personal dexterity, mechanical inclination and patience. Most people find it simple enough.

The low profile slide catch is the same story. Slimmer and more out of the way. The only exception I have found was that my wife (who has 9,400 rounds on her EDC PX4 SubCompact & 13,810 rounds on her range double) had a hard time using the low profile slide catch that the Sub comes with on her range pistol and put on the high profile for better results. A low profile catch averages $28.

[JTQ]

While I'm pretty sure this is not a .40 S&W gun, I ran into this video fairly recently about the PX4 that seems to have some good information


https://youtu.be/b0y4XbIhdbY

[Akc47]

Storm, I intended to buy a full size, but lack of market inventory pushed me to the compact. Is there another thread like this for compact or can I continue to post questions and range results here?
Thanks for the video JTQ

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Storm, I intended to buy a full size, but lack of market inventory pushed me to the compact. Is there another thread like this for compact or can I continue to post questions and range results here?
Thanks for the video JTQ

There is a thread about the PX4 Compact. It is about the 9mm, but a lot of things specific to the Compact.

https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?16519-The-PX4-Compact-might-be-my-DA-SA-Glock-19

You can also continue to post questions, observations and range reports here, because this thread is about the PX4 .40 caliber.

Either way is good.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Akc47 , I would recommend taking a look at lubrication suggestions here: https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?21539-Beretta-PX4-full-size/page3 in post 27.

Though it pictures a full size PX4 it is the same for a Compact. Correct lubrication enhances reliability, protects ammunition and clothing and makes your investment last longer.

[Akc47]

Thanks. I will bookmark that page. You said Beretta recommends 200 to 300 rounds to break it in. Any particular type of ammo or should I use several varieties?

Have you done any YouTube videos on maintenance for the full size? I’ve watched several LTT videos. I plan to do some upgrades to it (levers, D spring and sights) but will not change anything until break-in is complete.

For carry / home defense, what ammo do you use? In other semi’s I use hornady critical defense, but I have one Ruger that hates critical defense. I use sig in it. I have a lot of federal hollow points in 40 already also.

One last thing (for today), does anyone make a 9mm barrel that can be dropped into the 40? I thought I read in one of these thread “no”, but it would be great to have that option.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Thanks. I will bookmark that page. You said Beretta recommends 200 to 300 rounds to break it in. Any particular type of ammo or should I use several varieties?

Have you done any YouTube videos on maintenance for the full size? I’ve watched several LTT videos. I plan to do some upgrades to it (levers, D spring and sights) but will not change anything until break-in is complete.

For carry / home defense, what ammo do you use? In other semi’s I use hornady critical defense, but I have one Ruger that hates critical defense. I use sig in it. I have a lot of federal hollow points in 40 already also.

During break-in I usually use whatever target loads of inexpensive FMJ cartridges I would use for practice. After a few shooting sessions, testing it when a little dirty, when I have lubed it, then cleaned and lubed I will test my defense ammo in it. I use Winchester White Box in 165 grn, Federal Champion 180 grn and Remington UMC 180grn as target fodder.
I use Federal Premium HSTs in all calibers. I use the 180 grn in .40. Never a problem with bullet set-back or failures of any kind.

I do not have any YouTube videos, but... In this thread: https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?29478-Beretta-PX4-Storm-45-High-round-count-long-duration-usage/page3 in post 24 I break down maintenance recommendations.

[Akc47]

One last thing (for today), does anyone make a 9mm barrel that can be dropped into the 40? I thought I read in one of these thread “no”, but it would be great to have that option.

Thanks, I will bookmark all these pages.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

In post 49 of https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?29665-Beretta-PX4-Storm-Parts-What-does-each-part-do-and-how/page5 we see that the slide is cut out differently. Also, the breech face is cut out differently on a .40 from a 9 mm and so you would have to replace the slide, barrel, rebound spring, etc. It would be cheaper to get a separate pistol. There's certainly no kit to be able to go back and forth.

[beenalongtime]

At one point, Wal, from the Beretta forum, made a 9mm barrel, to fit a .40 slide, but full size only. The last one I believe was sent to Mr. Langdon.

Normally, it would be cheaper to find a separate gun, now may be the exception to that rule, however even slides and parts are being sold for more, based on what I see. Patience is key.
I've been watching out for a .45 PX4 and recently found a police trade in for under my budget. In another year, we may see .40's being traded back in.

[Akc47]

beenalongtime,
Sportsman's Supply has several NIB PX4 45's for sale on Gunbroker right now. FYI

[Akc47]

What are the best night sights that will fit the gun? I looked at the sights available on the Beretta website and the comments make it seem like most of them don't properly fit. The base of the sights overhang the frame of the gun, I think. What experiences have you guys had?

[revchuck38]

Akc47 - IMO the Ameriglo CAP sights that Langdon offers through his website (https://www.langdontactical.com/ameriglo-sight-set-px4-full-size-and-sub-compact/), I don't think they're available anywhere else. If you go this route, I recommend you send him the slide and let him do the installation as well. I have three full-size PX4s and have those sights on all of them.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Akc47 - IMO the Ameriglo CAP sights that Langdon offers through his website (https://www.langdontactical.com/ameriglo-sight-set-px4-full-size-and-sub-compact/), I don't think they're available anywhere else. If you go this route, I recommend you send him the slide and let him do the installation as well. I have three full-size PX4s and have those sights on all of them.

This ^^^

Make sure you check and get the one that is made for the Compact. The Compact does not take the same sights as the full size, 45 and SubCompact.

[Akc47]

Thanks guys. According to his web sight he is not currently doing installs. Can any competent gunsmith do it?

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Thanks guys. According to his web sight he is not currently doing installs. Can any competent gunsmith do it?

If your gunsmith is competent, has experience with Berettas and has the correct sight pusher, then yes.

It would be important for you to clarify with that gunsmith that sights on a Beretta have to go out to the shooter's left (port side) and back in from the left because of the tapered dovetail. If he removes the safety levers in order to get the slide in a vice you must be sure he does not crush the right safety lever blade slot.

[JTQ]

What are the best night sights that will fit the gun?
I often share this Sherman A. House article quoting Tom Givens for folks that may be chasing something they may not need

https://civiliandefender.com/2016/04/01/low-light-red-sights-and-tom-givens-glock-35/

The key quote


...in the 60 plus defensive shootings his students have been involved in, the lighting (or lack of lighting) was a factor in the outcome in exactly ZERO cases.

[revchuck38]

I often share this Sherman A. House article quoting Tom Givens for folks that may be chasing something they may not need

https://civiliandefender.com/2016/04/01/low-light-red-sights-and-tom-givens-glock-35/

The key quote

The reason so many of us like those sights is because of the huge orange/red blob on the front. It just happens to have a tritium insert. Also, an issue with the stock sights (per Langdon) is that they're designed to hit POA by lining up the dots; if you use a traditional sight picture where you want the bullet to impact on top of the front sight when the front and rear are level, it hits low.

[JTQ]

[MENTION=19887] If you go this route, I recommend you send him the slide and let him do the installation as well.


According to his web sight he is not currently doing installs.
jetfire/caleb and his PX4 with the MGW sight pusher


https://youtu.be/RjZLC-MVH40

[Sammy1]

Bass Pro/Cabela's had PX4 in 40 cal on clearance for $149.97. Checked my local store and sold out. https://www.basspro.com/shop/en/beretta-px4-storm-semi-auto-pistol

[beenalongtime]

beenalongtime,
Sportsman's Supply has several NIB PX4 45's for sale on Gunbroker right now. FYI

Thanks, but found my policeman's trade in for $275.

[Nephrology]

Bass Pro/Cabela's had PX4 in 40 cal on clearance for $149.97. Checked my local store and sold out. https://www.basspro.com/shop/en/beretta-px4-storm-semi-auto-pistol

That's a great deal for any quality semi-auto pistol, especially right now.

[Bobert1035]

That's a great deal for any quality semi-auto pistol, especially right now.

I thought I scored a good deal for $199 w no mags. $150 for any modern quality piece, in functioning condition, in any caliber, is a smoking deal!

[Akc47]

The reason so many of us like those sights is because of the huge orange/red blob on the front. It just happens to have a tritium insert. Also, an issue with the stock sights (per Langdon) is that they're designed to hit POA by lining up the dots; if you use a traditional sight picture where you want the bullet to impact on top of the front sight when the front and rear are level, it hits low.i

Rev, I agree on the orange dot. 👍. Does your other comment mean that the orange dot sights use a traditional sight picture where the top of the orange dot needs to be on the center of target?

Storm, thanks for the pointers on a gunsmith. That concerns me because a lot of people will tell you they can do something because they are sure they can figure it out. Do you think LT will start installing them again when the world becomes normal again?

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Storm, thanks for the pointers on a gunsmith. That concerns me because a lot of people will tell you they can do something because they are sure they can figure it out. Do you think LT will start installing them again when the world becomes normal again?

I agree. I have seen gunsmiths that do exactly as you described. I have seen a few PX4s that people have brought back with the sides of the sights marred badly.

You could also go to Beretta USA's website and look for locations of authorized dealers/gunsmiths.

As to future plans at LTT... the only one that could correctly answer that is LangdonTactical

[Gumby]

$150 for a 40 px4, dang!!!

[revchuck38]

Rev, I agree on the orange dot. 👍. Does your other comment mean that the orange dot sights use a traditional sight picture where the top of the orange dot needs to be on the center of target?

That's how it works for me with 115- and 124-grain ammo, 147-grainers hit a mite higher.

[beenalongtime]

PX4 Storm Tracker


I have seen the .40 compact extractor listed as compact/full size, as well as seeing a full size part number. Wondering if you have ever compared the two?

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

PX4 Storm Tracker


I have seen the .40 compact extractor listed as compact/full size, as well as seeing a full size part number. Wondering if you have ever compared the two?

Yes, I have researched that and have done close up photo examination comparisons. The .40 Compact and the .40 full size use the same extractor.

I have found many occasions where a part has two different part numbers and different listings, but is the exact same part.

[Akc47]

Is this where I post my first range report or is there a better place for that?

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Is this where I post my first range report or is there a better place for that?

We have been discussing the PX4 Storm 40 caliber. We have been sharing in your pursuit of one. It seems appropriate to post your range reports with it. I would certainly be interested in them.

[Akc47]

More like first impressions than a real range report.

Picked up my PX4 40 s&w compact yesterday and took it for a quick workout this afternoon. With my hand and wrist issues I’m not able to shoot hundred of rounds at a time.

So I shot 75 rounds. 25 Hornady 165 gr FTX, 25 Federal 135 gr JHP and 25 Blazer Brass 180 gr FMJ. I only had one round fail to load properly. One mag with Federal fired the first round and then locked open like the mag was empty. All I did was hit the slide release and it loaded and worked flawlessly after that.

At first my rounds were all over the place but once I got a feel for the sights, grip and trigger they began to tighten up. I did some fast-fire and some slow-fire. About 1/2 I used a hand rest and 1/2 freestanding. I also took a 38 special revolver out to the range and in Between each mag I would shoot 6 38 spl rounds to keep myself on my toes. The last 40 rounds I could keep each mag in a 3 inch circle at 7 yards freestanding. But this session was about getting to know the gun and not marksmanship.

I must say, this is an easy shooting gun. 10 out of 10 here. I could have shot a lot more rounds. My wrist and hands never began to tire or get sensitive. It was like shooting 9mm. It really was, I was amazed. When I shoot my Glock 22 my hand hurts after 50 rounds.

When I was getting use to the gun and playing around with it last night I was not crazy about some of the the controls.
1. The slide release was fine
2. but I can’t reach the mag release without a major shift of the hand and I’m using the smallest Back-strap. I know they make other mag release buttons so I will probably be getting one. Does anyone know what size comes on the gun?
3. Those giant safety levers are also not ideal. However, due to my hand and wrist problems I wear fingerless gloves while shooting. That helped a lot, so I may or may not change those to low profile.

But it is great to know Beretta makes a lot of aftermarket fixes for my issues and most are not very expensive.

The trigger was pretty good. I’m sure it will improve during breakin and even more with some of the mods I’ve seen on here. But for now it was better than my Glock trigger. I loved the SA/DA capability.

The sights were very functional in bright sunlight, but since this will be home defense I would like to get the Trijicon HD Night Sights at some point (if I can find the right gunsmith).

In summary, my dissatisfaction with some of the controls did not dim my overall view of the gun. I give it 9 out of 10 after one session and see the potential for it to get better with a few minor improvements. It feels great in the hand and even better when shooting. I’m pretty excited about the new addition.

Thanks to everyone for putting up with all my questions. If the full size ever gets back to sub $200 I see a second PX4 in my future, LOL. Is Beretta the best place to buy the low profile safety lever and the large mag release?

[JTQ]

Managing expectations.



2. but I can’t reach the mag release without a major shift of the hand and I’m using the smallest Back-strap.


This is a common comment I read and I'm always intrigued by what gun folks have experience with, or how big their hands are, where they don't have to rotate the gun in their hand to hit the mag release.

I often link to this Shannon Smith video on pistol reloads. You can skip to about the 2:05 mark

His key statement - "there is no gun on the planet that I can reach the mag release on without shifting the gun in my hand"


https://youtu.be/VfIaMB1TvLI

Over years of shooting, I've come to believe gun makers have put things out of your reach because they don't want you to touch them while you're shooting to keep you from fouling the gun. The mag release as one of those things that if you can't reach without changing your grip, is a net good thing.

[revchuck38]

Akc47 - Good report!

The magazine release button that comes from the factory is the small one. The set comes with that one plus a medium and a large one. Either the medium or the large are big improvements over the small one.

Going to a lighter hammer spring makes the gun easier to shoot in DA. Beretta offers a "D" spring, and LTT offers springs down to 10 lbs.

You might want to search for other PX4 threads on this forum. Two of them are over 100 pages with lots of good info.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

... I only had one round fail to load properly. One mag with Federal fired the first round and then locked open like the mag was empty. All I did was hit the slide release and it loaded and worked flawlessly after that.

2. but I can’t reach the mag release without a major shift of the hand and I’m using the smallest Back-strap. I know they make other mag release buttons so I will probably be getting one. Does anyone know what size comes on the gun? ...

Great report! Nice and thorough. There may be a connection between a failure to feed and the slide locking open. Assuming that you followed the lubrication recommendations... Is it possible that your thumb or part of your hand is dragging on the slide catch? If the slide catch spring is still in place, it cannot lock the slide back without pressure. Failure to load properly with a new .40 with a tight spring can be caused by limp wristing or..... one with a strong grip can have a timing issue. Since one is not used to the length of the DA pull the hand reflexes and starts recoil reaction a tiny bit prematurely making a limp wrist response, even with a strong grip.

The stock PX4s come with the small mag release button in place. The kit with the medium and large (as well as a small) can be gotten from Beretta or Langdon Tactical.

[Akc47]

At the bottom of page 9 JTQ recommended a stealth lever. But it says for the G model. If I want mine to stay an F model, will this lever still work or do I need a different one?

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

At the bottom of page 9 JTQ recommended a stealth lever. But it says for the G model. If I want mine to stay an F model, will this lever still work or do I need a different one?

The stock levers and the model 92 style levers for the PX4 are the only two options for remaining type F.

Both the Stealth levers and the Carry levers lack the detent ball/spring and blade on the right lever to deactivate the trigger bar and to cause the lever to stay down.

Post 43 here-> https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?29665-Beretta-PX4-Storm-Parts-What-does-each-part-do-and-how/page5

[Akc47]

So is this the one I want?
https://www.langdontactical.com/px4-safety-levers-92-style/

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

So is this the one I want?
https://www.langdontactical.com/px4-safety-levers-92-style/

If you don't want to use the stock levers then, Yes. You can even see the detent ball in the picture.

I would also mention that though the 92 style levers are much less sharp and easy to activate they have a wider profile.

[beenalongtime]

The sights were very functional in bright sunlight, but since this will be home defense I would like to get the Trijicon HD Night Sights at some point (if I can find the right gunsmith).

Thanks to everyone for putting up with all my questions. If the full size ever gets back to sub $200 I see a second PX4 in my future, LOL. Is Beretta the best place to buy the low profile safety lever and the large mag release?

The HD sights are not well liked on the compact. POI/POA tends to be off by all the reports I have read. There are three options:
The Ameriglo's that are on the compact carry. (bright orange around a night sight front, no vial blacked out rear).
EU00081 off of Beretta's sight, which I think are Ameriglo's, three dot.
Trijicon Bright and tough, model BE14, which were are specifically for the compact, where BE10's are on the full and subcompact size police PX4's I have.
I prefer to have vials in the back sight. On my most recent PX4 project, I am putting the B&T's and have the front Hackathorned, while blacking out the rear white rings. See: Trijicon-Front-Sight-Option-by-Tooltech-Gunsight&p=644001#post644001

Until the G carry levers came out, LangdonTactical, ground and sold the factory levers, closer to the G carry levers, and called them FUGLY levers. You could do the same, or try a WTB post, and see if someone upgraded. as they would allow the gun to remain F, if you replace the ball and spring.

[Bobert1035]

Just checking in here. I've had a PX4 in .40 for about a year now. Purchased it dirt cheap as a police trade in, and mainly to use as a MantisX dryfire trainer, and I wanted a .40 for variety. I really enjoy it (I'm a glock guy)! I actually pulled the trigger group out last night (with the digital help of EL and PX4 Storm Tracker) and gave it a good cleaning. It was filthy internally, to the point the trigger action was noticeably better afterwards. Can't imagine how good it would be with a TJIAB. I also snagged some ammo recently, which reinforces having a little caliber variety in the safe in times of panics.

[Akc47]

Storm -

- I very well may have touched the slide release lever. It was the second round of the second mag, so I was still thinking about 20 things, mostly where the rounds were landing on the paper and not grip fundamentals. That one "failure to load" doesn't really bother me unless it becomes a habit.
- On the stealth levers - If the 92 style are wider than the stock levers that came on it, I don't want those. So I guess if I get the G stealth levers and decide later I want the F safety feature, I can always switch back? If so, I'll try the G stealth.

BeenALongTime - Thanks for the sight feedback. The Trijicon B&T interest me the most but all three colors look the same, white. Do the tritium colors only show up at night? Yellow front / Green Rear would be my choice.

Rev Chuck - Is this the D spring of which you speak? https://www.langdontactical.com/d-model-hammer-spring/

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Just checking in here. I've had a PX4 in .40 for about a year now. Purchased it dirt cheap as a police trade in, and mainly to use as a MantisX dryfire trainer, and I wanted a .40 for variety. I really enjoy it (I'm a glock guy)! I actually pulled the trigger group out last night (with the digital help of EL and PX4 Storm Tracker) and gave it a good cleaning. It was filthy internally, to the point the trigger action was noticeably better afterwards. Can't imagine how good it would be with a TJIAB. I also snagged some ammo recently, which reinforces having a little caliber variety in the safe in times of panics.

I have seen double action in a PX4 lowered by a pound by cleaning and lubricating the fire control unit (hammer unit, trigger group). Excellent feedback, thanks!

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

... - On the stealth levers - If the 92 style are wider than the stock levers that came on it, I don't want those. So I guess if I get the G stealth levers and decide later I want the F safety feature, I can always switch back? If so, I'll try the G stealth....

When you remove your stock levers to install any other levers, you can always put them back on later. If you remove the detent ball and spring from the left lever shaft- that cannot be undone. It is a factory install part than cannot be put back in. But, since you don't want to convert your original levers to type G, that won't be a problem and the detent ball will not come out by accident.

As to your term "Stealth" levers, that refers to the lowest profile levers (type G only). These are very low profile and some folks have a hard time decocking with them. Less lever = less leverage. There was a problem with that until LTT came up with the Carry levers. The Carry levers are type G also, but are low profile while still giving a little more lever to activate. Much easier.

Left to right: Stealth, Carry, M-92 style, stock
57457

Left to right: Stealth, Carry, M-92 style
57458

You might also find that the slide catch levers will seem bigger after installing lower profile decocker levers. On a Compact you would need to either get low profile ambi levers from LTT or a single (left) side only lever from Beretta and a frame plug for the hole left by the right's absence.

Stealth levers can be gotten alone or in a kit. The kit has a Stealth lever set and low profile slide catch. If you get the Carry levers they come as just the levers.

I run Stealth levers on my EDC PX4 .45 & .40 and Carry levers on the others. My wife also has M-92 style levers on her Compact, but Carry levers on her EDC SubCompact.

[Akc47]

Awesome info. Storm. I think the Carry levers are what I want.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Awesome info. Storm. I think the Carry levers are what I want.

That is what I would recommend. After about 80,000 rounds with the Stealth levers on my PX4 .45 range pistol I switched to the Carry levers. They are so much easier to use.

[3-7-77]

Shameless self-plug for anyone looking to try Stealth levers:
https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?43643-WTS-PX4-quot-G-quot-Stealth-levers&p=1084518#post1084518

[Akc47]

Storm, is the D spring I referenced above the right one for the compact to lower SA trigger pull weight?

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Storm, is the D spring I referenced above the right one for the compact to lower SA trigger pull weight?

All PX4s can use the same hammer springs. Post 66 here -> https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?29665-Beretta-PX4-Storm-Parts-What-does-each-part-do-and-how/page7 explains why.

The D hammer spring will affect the single action a little. Normally dropping the weight from around 5# to 4# on average. The PX4 has a true single action. Many other DA/SA pistols do not. They have the trigger lift the hammer a little before dropping it. A Beretta does not have to move the hammer. This makes for a crisp, real single action. It also means that the hammer spring weight affects the SA less. The double action will feel its effect more.

If you find that your single action is heavier than you prefer, a Competition Trigger Group from Beretta or a TJIAB (trigger job in a bag) from LTT would affect that more.

[Akc47]

Storm, Beretta needs to pay you to write a book with all the information you have put out on these guns. Amazing.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Storm, Beretta needs to pay you to write a book with all the information you have put out on these guns. Amazing.

Thanks for the encouraging words. Fortunately, this Forum gives us a place to write it all out interactively.

[Akc47]

Just curious, do you do the same type thing for other brands, or are you a Beretta man through and through.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Just curious, do you do the same type thing for other brands, or are you a Beretta man through and through.

Though I did go to Gunsmithing school to learn as much versatility about any firearm, my focus seems to go with my interest. Back in the day I could tell you anything about a Smith & Wesson revolver, Ruger revolver or a Colt. I did action jobs and work on Smith & Wesson revolvers, as well as Rugers.

So, I am not a generically Beretta fan, but my interest in the PX4 Storm has me to find out everything I can about it because of that interest. I've been shooting PX4 Storms since they came out and have been researching and studying them since then.

[Akc47]

What it the primary attribute that attracted you to the PX4 over the thousands of other guns out there? I guess I have started the interview section of the thread, LOL.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

What it the primary attribute that attracted you to the PX4 over the thousands of other guns out there? I guess I have started the interview section of the thread, LOL.

I have been handgunning for over 40 years. I have had every kind of handgun out there. I found the PX4 Storm to have some traits that made it a keeper.

I like the DA/SA for safety in carrying and initial confrontation. I have carried many revolvers, 1911, etc.. Having the first trigger pull to be long and intentional, as well as safe holstering, is important to me. The PX4 has the most versatile and easily modified trigger pulls I've seen. My PX4 .45 G range pistol has a 5.75 lb DA and a 3.2 lb SA with no light strikes. It has 119,000 rounds on it and is still tight and accurate. The PX4 has backstraps that fit me well.

I like that the entire pistol can be disassembled for detail cleaning by the user. I like that parts are easily maintained. Beretta claims that it has less moving parts, which means less things to break. This is true.

Aftermarket options from Beretta & LTT make for so many variations and personalizing.

The quality of bar stock, cold hammer forged, chromium lining and other traits are outstanding. The barrel locking system, breech face advantages and capabilities to run with broken parts.... I could go on.

Super reliability. Super durability. Super accuracy. Consistency.

I like the design and class that shows in its engineering.

There are those nose-in-tail trail horses that must have whatever is currently in vogue or popular, but I like the PX4. It gives different size options and 4 calibers.

It suits my needs. It is fun.

[beenalongtime]

BeenALongTime - Thanks for the sight feedback. The Trijicon B&T interest me the most but all three colors look the same, white. Do the tritium colors only show up at night? Yellow front / Green Rear would be my choice.




Low light, not necessarily night.
BE14-C-600767 is the model closest to your choice (same colors, opposite locations). I ordered the green/green (easiest to find), for my experiment. (where I blacked out the rear and am having the white ring replaced with orange)

[gato naranja]

Having the first trigger pull to be long and intentional, as well as safe holstering, is important to me.

This is a very big reason why, despite decidedly NOT being a Beretta fanboy, I still prefer the PX4. Nothing is fail-safe or idiot-proof, but I find the PX4 is less "hairy for carry" than other semiautos I have used.

[Akc47]

I ordered the carry levers, the d spring and the mag release kit. Will I need any special tools to install them? Thx

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

I ordered the carry levers, the d spring and the mag release kit. Will I need any special tools to install them? Thx

A flat impact surface 1/16th punch (for the decocker lever pin), a 3/32nd for the hammer spring cap pin (it is also good to have that for an extractor pin punch if later you get industrious) and a thin bladed regular screwdriver for removing your backstrap retention wire. That same wire can be used as a tool for your magazine release button locking pin. Evidently, if you will have to punch out pins, you will want a small hammer.

[beenalongtime]

I ordered the carry levers, the d spring and the mag release kit. Will I need any special tools to install them? Thx


A flat head screwdriver (small), to move the spring, if you want to install the hammer spring from above and lube the trigger group. A wider flat blade to remove the backstrap spring, from below, if wanting to do it from below. Then punches for the pins.
A paperclip or a punch for the mag release.
2mm punch is recommended for the levers, but I have used a 5/64.

Some helpful vid's:
From above

https://youtu.be/YQum92bi5J8
From below

https://youtu.be/8cU1PQEsbCQ
Several video's on removing the levers, most, erroneously tell you to remove the extractor.

https://youtu.be/TVTctYOeXeg

[Akc47]

Thx guys!

[Akc47]

It is harmful to dry fire a hammer fired gun, correct? Is it ok with snap caps?
Great videos above, thx

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

It is harmful to dry fire a hammer fired gun, correct? Is it ok with snap caps?
Great videos above, thx

Beretta recommends that you do not dry fire your PX4 Storm without using snap caps. I always use snap caps and the firing pin in my PX4 .45 had 119,600 rounds on it and was still working.

If you find that you are wearing out snap caps too much or that it is troublesome to you and you want to dry fire, then you will simply need to replace your firing pin more frequently.

The ideal, according to your manual and Beretta, is to not dry fire excessively without snap caps.

[Akc47]

Got my parts and punches. Which upgrade is the easiest, LOL? Also, is the a video or step by step on how to change the mag release button? So much info it’s hard to find it all.

I found this one for the mag release change, seems easy enough.
https://youtu.be/XYkCUoCJDPU

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Got my parts and punches. Which upgrade is the easiest, LOL? Also, is the a video or step by step on how to change the mag release button? So much info it’s hard to find it all.

I found this one for the mag release change, seems easy enough.
https://youtu.be/XYkCUoCJDPU


This is pretty good too: https://youtu.be/VmoNjqUVBNk

The magazine release button switch could be a good first, easy thing to do. And it can build a little confidence.

[Akc47]

Ok, mag release swapped.
For the D spring the second video from above seems pretty good, so I’ll use it.
Is there a better video or step procedure for installing the carry levers?

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Ok, mag release swapped.
For the D spring the second video from above seems pretty good, so I’ll use it.
Is there a better video or step procedure for installing the carry levers?


https://youtu.be/GWc6i506oEQ

You do not need to remove the extractor, as most of these videos indicate.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Akc47 An additional note: if you remove the extractor and then you remove the levers... if you bump the firing pin block plunger when you're not ready for it nor have the levers getting ready in place, you will cause the firing pin and spring to jump about halfway out the back. Unless you know how it is correctly realigned you're going to run into trouble.
So, I recommend that you not remove the extractor in order to change levers.

[Akc47]

1. Install large mag release button ✅
2. Install D spring ✅

Moving on:
3. Install the LTT carry levers for de-cocker
Here is my issue, both videos don’t use the LTT levers. The LTT levers come with a spring that is larger and looks nothing like the spring that comes out. I’m not sure what to do with it. Should I try to put it in like the other one? Don’t think it will work but maybe. I haven’t tried yet, the difference in appearance has me scared to take it a part.

Also, if you don’t need to take the extractor out, why do both videos do it?

I tied to post a pic of both springs but couldn’t do it. Smh 🤦*♂️

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

1. Install large mag release button ✅
2. Install D spring ✅

Moving on:
3. Install the LTT carry levers for de-cocker
Here is my issue, both videos don’t use the LTT levers. The LTT levers come with a spring that is larger and looks nothing like the spring that comes out. I’m not sure what to do with it. Should I try to put it in like the other one? Don’t think it will work but maybe. I haven’t tried yet, the difference in appearance has me scared to take it a part.

Also, if you don’t need to take the extractor out, why do both videos do it?

I tied to post a pic of both springs but couldn’t do it. Smh 🤦*♂️

The Carry levers, as all PX4 levers, use the same lever spring. There is no optional or different spring. The Carry levers normally don't come with a spring. Are you referering to the black paper clip looking thing that came on the levers? That is only a packaging devise to keep them together in shipping.

As to why so many people remove the extractor for lever replacement is probably the way internet things go. One guy did it once, now everyone is copying his and adding their own spin to seem original.

[Akc47]

That is good to hear. I was visually comparing the spring they took out on the video to a picture on LTT’s website. I guess the picture includes pieces not to be installed. Thanks

[Akc47]

1. Install large mag release button ✅
2. Install D spring ✅
3. Install carry levers ✅. Tip - Do not buy a $10 set of punches to do this, LOL. It took several hard smacks to get the roll pin out and back in again. That was the hardest part. Would have been a little easier if I had 3 hands.

Next: install Talon grips for the PX4. Then finish break-in. Then get Trijicon Bright and Tough night sights.
Thanks for all the help and recommendations everyone.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

...Next: install Talon grips for the PX4. .

So far, so good!

https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?29478-Beretta-PX4-Storm-45-High-round-count-long-duration-usage/page10 <- post 91 could be of interest to you.

[Akc47]

Most of you have probably seen this, but it was new to me and I found it very interesting. My question is, is the video a fairly good representation of how the PX4 works? Storm has done a detailed explanation that explains every part in the PX4, but this kind of shows how they all work together.

https://youtu.be/80fJ_O4t-UU

As a second train of thought, I bought some extra mags from Beretta when I bought the PX4 40. a 10 rd, a 14 rd and a 17 rd. The the loads up 10 rounds and seems to work fine. The 14 and 17 I have not shot yet, but I did try to load them with practice rounds last night. The 14 loaded with 14 rounds as it should. However, the 17 could only load 15 rounds. I unloaded and reloaded it numerous times trying to get 16 or 17 in it. The box clearly said 17 on it and this mag is longer than the 14 round mag. What could be the issue? Are others having this problem? Should I take it apart and see what is what or just send it back to Beretta since it is new?

Thanks.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Most of you have probably seen this, but it was new to me and I found it very interesting. My question is, is the video a fairly good representation of how the PX4 works? Storm has done a detailed explanation that explains every part in the PX4, but this kind of shows how they all work together.

https://youtu.be/80fJ_O4t-UU

As a second train of thought, I bought some extra mags from Beretta when I bought the PX4 40. a 10 rd, a 14 rd and a 17 rd. The the loads up 10 rounds and seems to work fine. The 14 and 17 I have not shot yet, but I did try to load them with practice rounds last night. The 14 loaded with 14 rounds as it should. However, the 17 could only load 15 rounds. I unloaded and reloaded it numerous times trying to get 16 or 17 in it. The box clearly said 17 on it and this mag is longer than the 14 round mag. What could be the issue? Are others having this problem? Should I take it apart and see what is what or just send it back to Beretta since it is new?

Thanks.

The video you linked to is not bad. It does lack some nuances and timings that parts really do when interacting. However, for what it is, it could be a helpful tool in understanding part interactions. Different folks learn or absorb information differently. For those that soak it in better with a visual illustration, this could be helpful.

There have been some that have experienced trouble with the 17 round magazines in .40. We have not. My recommendation is to disassemble all new mags and clean them inside and out with rubbing alcohol. They come with a protective goop in them to prevent rust in storage or shipping. Once all of that is cleaned out they function better.

Sometimes the longer spring travel means more friction. I like to look over the follower (the polymer piece that actually pushes the rounds up) and check for burrs or molding over-fill. I have taken a diamond file (as one might use on finger nails) and smoothed it out a tiny bit (not changing dimensions). I would also recommend filling the mag and shooting it empty at least 5 times in testing at the range. That would smooth things and should cure the problem described. You could also put a little oil on the mag spring for the testing, but clean that oil off of the spring and box before using it for defense loads.

If it does not then work, then the mag might have a fault and Beretta will exchange or refund, even if you tested it at the range (in our experience). We have had troubles with SubCompact mags when they were having issues with them. They cheerfully switched them without hassle.

Are you using a load assistant, such as an UpLula? Trying to load new PX4 mags without an UpLula can be daunting for the first few times.

[Akc47]

I’m just using the mag loader that came with the pistol.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

I’m just using the mag loader that came with the pistol.

That should work. It doesn't quite have the leverage, but it does give you enough assistance to eliminate that as a cause for the problem.

[gato naranja]

I’m just using the mag loader that came with the pistol.

I will chime in here.

The magazine loader that came with our first PX4 was more of a suggestion than a help to me and Mrs. gn. One of the gents at the LGS/range noticed us making a hash of things and brought out an UpLula. Problem solved.

We now keep one in every shooting bag.

[Akc47]

Got the Talon grips installed.
Also had a few minutes to go to the range. Got another 60 rounds in (yes 60, not 600 like Storm, LOL). 60 rounds were from 5 different mags. No failures of any kind. Only issue is the 17 rd. mag only taking 15 rds., but it worked. Took it apart and cleaned. Didn't see anything with my untrained eyes. It really is a nice shooting gun. Are factory sights set for sight position 1, 2 or 3? At 25 yards, most of my shots were hitting 1 inch high but 4 inches left using picture 2. Do the sights need adjusting or is it likely my grip / trigger pull? Thanks

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

...Only issue is the 17 rd. mag only taking 15 rds., but it worked. Took it apart and cleaned. Didn't see anything with my untrained eyes. ..

Are factory sights set for sight position 1, 2 or 3? At 25 yards, most of my shots were hitting 1 inch high but 4 inches left using picture 2. Do the sights need adjusting or is it likely my grip / trigger pull?...

I am glad everything worked well for you!

If you get a chance to obtain or borrow an UpLula loader you might find that the 17 rounder will hold 17, but must be coaxed for a few loadings.

PX4 full sized pistols are zeroed in @25 yards. Compacts and SubCompacts are zeroed in @15 yards. There should be no windage (left to right) variation unless the sights are not mechanically centered on the slide. A visual inspection could determine that.

I have found that heavier bullets hit a slight bit higher. @10 yards a 180 grain bullet might hit an inch higher than a 165 grain loading. PX4s are designed for self defense or combat usage. Therefore, the sights are made for a dot alignment. Fast acquisition is enhanced that way. A bullseye pistol might have a 6 o'clock hold (by as much as 2") for that type of shooting.

I have found that placing the top edge of the front sight right at the POA (point of aim) will produce a POI (point of impact) centered on that top edge. The PX4 is capable of bullseye shooting. I do a few mags of precision bullseye shooting each session. It will produce a group of 1.5" @10 yards free standing, hand held.

As to whether there is shooter error or getting used to the pistol that is causing windage inaccuracy.... It is possible. Too much or (usually with a DA/SA) too little finger on the trigger can affect that. A grip that is not having both hands agreed on straight forward and tightly or rigidly keeping it that way during trigger pull can cause a problem.
I have also found that seeing the sights clearly enough to accurately determine the centering of the front sight is not as easy as one might hope.
I would make sure that sight picture is very even first, then check yourself with snap caps. You can randomly place a couple of snap caps in your mag (or have a friend do it, so you really are surprised when it comes up). When you are shooting and responding to recoil and want for the perfect shot... that snap cap will show you where your sights are going and when. You can see if it is flinching or post ignition push.

[beenalongtime]

PX4 full sized pistols are zeroed in @25 yards. Compacts and SubCompacts are zeroed in @15 yards.

With which sights and where did you find that info?

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

With which sights and where did you find that info?

This is the factory setting that pertains to original sights when the pistol is being manufactured. I got this information from Beretta.

[beenalongtime]

This is the factory setting that pertains to original sights when the pistol is being manufactured. I got this information from Beretta.

Important information, as my understanding is on the Compact Carry, when EL was working with Ameriglo, he sighted for longer ranges then that.

It also left me wondering about the bright and tough night sights, that were sold installed on some PX4's with factory night sights (AFAIK, mostly police packaged guns).

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Important information, as my understanding is on the Compact Carry, when EL was working with Ameriglo, he sighted for longer ranges then that.

It also left me wondering about the bright and tough night sights, that were sold installed on some PX4's with factory night sights (AFAIK, mostly police packaged guns).

Since the Ameriglo sights were custom-made for the Compact and then for the full size, you would have to inquire at LTT to see what preference they chose for zeroing. The same might be for any of the additional sights offered.
The information that I shared does only pertain to the original factory sights. If other variations of sights were produced with the pistol from the factory, one might figure that they used the same parameters of zeroing.

[Storm SD]

My full size PX4 Storm .40 reached a new mile marker this week. I pasted 20,000 rounds with it. It currently has 20,062 rounds on it in the picture here. I have had no failures or issues with it. I disassembled the slide and frame for a detailed cleaning and relubrication last week at 19,980 rounds. I'm using this full sized model most of the time as a range gun and carrying the PX4 Storm Compact in .40 caliber.

83495

[gato naranja]

My full size PX4 Storm .40 reached a new mile marker this week. I pasted 20,000 rounds with it. It currently has 20,062 rounds on it in the picture here. I have had no failures or issues with it. I disassembled the slide and frame for a detailed cleaning and relubrication last week at 19,980 rounds. I'm using this full sized model most of the time as a range gun and carrying the PX4 Storm Compact in .40 caliber.

83495

20,000 rounds of .40 is "vetting with a vengence." I worried about the longevity of the PX4 family when the first one came home from the LGS, but they just keep running.

Five-inch 9mm 1911s have been my "range toys" for the last few years, so most of my recent PX4 shooting has been with 9mm Subcompacts because they are what normally gets carried... and they are also the PX4 that requires more training on my part to shoot well. Because I am gradually shooting less - due to aging and ammo costs - I am considering backing away from the 1911s and making a full size PX4 my default range pistol, if only for the reason that the controls are identical to the Subcompacts.

[medmo]

My full size PX4 Storm .40 reached a new mile marker this week. I pasted 20,000 rounds with it. It currently has 20,062 rounds on it in the picture here. I have had no failures or issues with it. I disassembled the slide and frame for a detailed cleaning and relubrication last week at 19,980 rounds. I'm using this full sized model most of the time as a range gun and carrying the PX4 Storm Compact in .40 caliber.

83495

20k, very cool! It looks like you have changed levers and sights. Any other upgrades? Internals, hammer spring, etc?

[Storm SD]

20,000 rounds of .40 is "vetting with a vengence." I worried about the longevity of the PX4 family when the first one came home from the LGS, but they just keep running.

Five-inch 9mm 1911s have been my "range toys" for the last few years, so most of my recent PX4 shooting has been with 9mm Subcompacts because they are what normally gets carried... and they are also the PX4 that requires more training on my part to shoot well. Because I am gradually shooting less - due to aging and ammo costs - I am considering backing away from the 1911s and making a full size PX4 my default range pistol, if only for the reason that the controls are identical to the Subcompacts.

I often use a full size PX4 Storm 9mm for training. I use it for one of the same reasons that you mentioned... ammo costs. The recoil feels very light with the full size PX4 9mm and it is easy on the hands. It could allow you to shoot longer more comfortably. My 9mm currently has 37,369 rounds on it and I have also had no failures or issues with it. The durability and dependability are great with these guns. And as you also mentioned, the controls are identical to the Subcompacts so you wouldn't have to re-think your training for what you carry.

[Storm SD]

20k, very cool! It looks like you have changed levers and sights. Any other upgrades? Internals, hammer spring, etc?

I don't have a lot of modifications on this one, but I do have a few. The sights are actually the standard factory sights, but the levers are the Carry levers. The Slide catch is also the low profile Slide catch. I put a D-spring in it at 8,381 rounds, so I am nearing 12,000 rounds with that spring and I really like the feel of the trigger pull with the D-spring. Those are all of the modifications I done with it. I use a spurless hammer on my Compact 40 and if I do any more modifications on this full size, that will probably be next.

[gato naranja]

I often use a full size PX4 Storm 9mm for training. I use it for one of the same reasons that you mentioned... ammo costs. The recoil feels very light with the full size PX4 9mm and it is easy on the hands. It could allow you to shoot longer more comfortably.

The fly in the ointment is that I have been very spoiled by using a 41 ounce 9mm 1911 as the range toy. That thing is comfort personified with popgun recoil.

Even with a TLR-1 or X300 attached, a full size 9mm PX4 is going to weigh less than 32 ounces. I don't particularly want to get a 34 oz 92X and semi-permanently stick a light on it, but at least the controls would be similar to the PX4 and the weight a bit closer to the 1911.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

The fly in the ointment is that I have been very spoiled by using a 41 ounce 9mm 1911 as the range toy. That thing is comfort personified with popgun recoil.

Even with a TLR-1 or X300 attached, a full size 9mm PX4 is going to weigh less than 32 ounces. I don't particularly want to get a 34 oz 92X and semi-permanently stick a light on it, but at least the controls would be similar to the PX4 and the weight a bit closer to the 1911.

I would suggest that you also consider and factor in the agility of target transition and quickness of movement found in the lighter, more balanced PX4 Storm.

The rotating barrel will help to mitigate some of the recoil and the quickness that you gain could be an advantage.

[Akc47]

The rotating barrel made all the difference for me. I had hand surgery not long ago and it is still comfortable to shoot.

[star-dot-star]

A question for those using the full size 40. Does the felt recoil sit in the realm of the compact 9?

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

A question for those using the full size 40. Does the felt recoil sit in the realm of the compact 9?

There is something about the PX4 Compact that must have some soft put into it when it is manufactured. :)

We have found in our experience that the Compact 9 mm is exceptionally soft, but the Compact 40 is very soft for a 40... but certainly not even in the realm of the 9mm Charmin Soft. Going a step further, the full size 40 feels a little more thin (though it is strong) and it feels sharper in recoil than the Compacts.

So, the full size 40 is not in the same realm of softness as the Compact 9. However, it is far smoother and softer shooting than any other 40 caliber that I have experienced. I also hear that same report from a lot of other PX4 40 owners.

[ldunnmobile]

There is something about the PX4 Compact that must have some soft put into it when it is manufactured. :)

We have found in our experience that the Compact 9 mm is exceptionally soft, but the Compact 40 is very soft for a 40... but certainly not even in the realm of the 9mm Charmin Soft. Going a step further, the full size 40 feels a little more thin (though it is strong) and it feels sharper in recoil than the Compacts.

So, the full size 40 is not in the same realm of softness as the Compact 9. However, it is far smoother and softer shooting than any other 40 caliber that I have experienced. I also hear that same report from a lot of other PX4 40 owners.

Is the full size 9 softer than the compact 9? I would expect so but you never know.

[Noah]

Is the full size 9 softer than the compact 9? I would expect so but you never know.


I own both (see profile pic) but as Langdon himself also stated in the PX4 Full thread, both are extremely soft shooting but the PX4CC feels like it returns faster.

The full might be a pinch softer, but the compact is so soft compared to other 9mms while also returning faster than the full that if I had to pick the recoil impulse of one over the other, I'd go with the compact.

Either one literally feels like a compensated Glock or M&P to me, but an analogy might be the Compact feels like a comped Glock with 124s while a Full feels like a comped Glock with 147s.


I'm shooting brass 124 exclusively in both guns.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Is the full size 9 softer than the compact 9? I would expect so but you never know.

An interesting use of terminology here. The Compact feels "softer", but the full size recoils less with less muzzle rise. Neither the Compact nor the full size in 9mm have any bark, but the "reciprocating mass" is different.

What I mean by that is that the Compact is shorter and wide, so it soaks up recoil and is soft. The slide slamming back causes the first recoil impulse and the slide going forward again (reciprocating) is the second part. The Compact has less length of reciprocating mass and can be very flat shooting. There is not much weight difference between the full size and Compact, so length makes an effect.

I like the full size for its sight radius and nose heavier (comparatively) feel, but many like the Compact's center of gravity being closer to the hand... which also makes it feel softer.

So, they are both soft, but the Compact can "feel" softer because of different reciprocating mass IMO.

[Storm SD]

A question for those using the full size 40. Does the felt recoil sit in the realm of the compact 9?
I agree with the comments above that the 9mm compact still has a "soft" recoil. I believe my perception of "feel" is not very sensitive, so it is difficult for me to feel much difference between the 9mm full size and the 9mm compact. On the other hand, the felt recoil is definitely sharper on the full size .40 compared to the 9mm compact. That is not to say that the .40 is excessive by any means, especially in comparison with other .40s of other brands or models. I find the full size .40 to be very tolerable, even when shooting a couple of hundred rounds in a session. I would still attest that the felt recoil is noticeably sharper on the full size .40 than the compact 9.

[gato naranja]

There may be another possible factor in any "felt recoil" comparison between the compact and full size PX4s, and that is the grip length. Unfortunately, that is pretty difficult to quantify in any meaningful way because hands differ so widely. I prefer the full size PX4 grip from the standpoint of how it accommodates all my fingers, while the compact tends to leave my nether finger unsure of where to go... but I don't find a great deal of difference between the two as far as the push of the recoil.

My subcompacts leave my hand in no doubt where the pinky goes (I suppose I could extend it out into space like a member of the carriage set taking tea with the quality, but such airs are something up with which I shall not put!).

[star-dot-star]

I appreciate all of the feedback and descriptions which are helpful to establish a relationship I'm familiar with. Between the 9's the compact feels a little more lively but both are soft comparative to a Glock or Springfield with which I'm familiar. I've only had the opportunity to try 40sw with a Springfield XD which did have a bit more spice to it compared to the XD9 but it was only in follow-up speed that I felt most impacted which required a slightly more patient cadence.

Given the design of the PX4 it seems like an ideal platform for 40sw which has risen my curiosity.

[medmo]

Using “track the dot” for comparison, in 9mm, my PX4CC is flatter shooting than my Glock G19 GEN5 MOS and S&W M&P 2.0 Compact 4” OR. All three have a Holosun 407/507c. During recoil and slide reciprocation, the dot is easier to track and has less movement than the Glock or S&W. That is the only “data” that I have to back up me feeling that it shoots flatter. I would imagine that this would translate to the same results if all three pistols were in 40S&W.

[No.6]

The fly in the ointment is that I have been very spoiled by using a 41 ounce 9mm 1911 as the range toy. That thing is comfort personified with popgun recoil.

Even with a TLR-1 or X300 attached, a full size 9mm PX4 is going to weigh less than 32 ounces. I don't particularly want to get a 34 oz 92X and semi-permanently stick a light on it, but at least the controls would be similar to the PX4 and the weight a bit closer to the 1911.

Almost sounds like you're looking for an 8040 Cougar. Barrel length is in the middle between the PX4 full and compact sizes and the aluminum frame is a touch heavier than the PX4.

[LockedBreech]

Almost sounds like you're looking for an 8040 Cougar. Barrel length is in the middle between the PX4 full and compact sizes and the aluminum frame is a touch heavier than the PX4.

I have an 8040G (and an 8000F) and I really enjoy having them as part of the PX4's lineage. They are indeed a bit heavier and that's good advice if he absolute must have that weight.

However, I do think the PX4 is a roundly superior option to the Cougar. The recoil assembly is better thought out for maintenance and stripping and I honestly think the PX4 recoils more softly despite the reduced weight. I also believe the Cougar had a somewhat troubled track record for reliability whereas the PX4 has been established at this point as top-shelf reliable.

The Cougar's best advantage is the swappable grips, I definitely prefer my grippy metal Hogue Extremes on my 8000F to the PX4's stock frame.

[gato naranja]

Almost sounds like you're looking for an 8040 Cougar. Barrel length is in the middle between the PX4 full and compact sizes and the aluminum frame is a touch heavier than the PX4.

Hmmm... I hadn't even considered that possibility. Cougars have always been so rare in these parts that they slip under my radar.

In any event, I found a full-size 92X RDO at a decent price locally and had some trading fodder to boot, so I ended up with that.

[AdioSS]

I have an 8040G (and an 8000F) and I really enjoy having them as part of the PX4's lineage. They are indeed a bit heavier and that's good advice if he absolute must have that weight.

However, I do think the PX4 is a roundly superior option to the Cougar. The recoil assembly is better thought out for maintenance and stripping and I honestly think the PX4 recoils more softly despite the reduced weight. I also believe the Cougar had a somewhat troubled track record for reliability whereas the PX4 has been established at this point as top-shelf reliable.

The Cougar's best advantage is the swappable grips, I definitely prefer my grippy metal Hogue Extremes on my 8000F to the PX4's stock frame.
The 8000 Series Cougar was Beretta’s real underestimated pistol. They made many improvements that most people are totally unaware of. Everybody knows the old 92 & many are finally learning the PX4. It was the first Beretta designed in CAD. The radiused grip of later 92’s came from the design of the Cougar. The Cougar was available in 4 calibers unlike the PX4. It was the only factory 357Sig Beretta. It was the first designed for .40 S&W instead of redesigned like the 96. It was the first .45ACP Beretta.

The later Stoeger Cougars got an updated recoil assembly that is closer to the PX4. It doesn’t try to fall apart on you when putting the gun back together. Hogue also offers G10 grips for the Cougar that feel great. And I’ve found that sights designed for the Vertec slide 92’s work very well on the Cougar. The earliest Cougar used a unique mag release, but it didn’t take Beretta long to redesign it to take the same mag release as the 92. And Stoeger offered the 8040T which got a light rail. The universal G kit that was only released a few years ago even came from the Cougar.

If you couldn’t tell, I’m a big fan of the Cougar. I used to use an M9 to teach new shooters, but now use a 9mm Cougar. And a MiniCougar is my favorite gun to carry.

[DanTheWolfman]

Ahhhhh trying not to look at this thread just past up chance on one super cheap on GB as 2 ounces heavier loaded than other options...and needs grip tape. Want one though...

[AdioSS]

I’m definitely not trying to take away from the PX4 line, especially in .40!
https://i.imgur.com/72SsqYkl.jpg
I’ve got all 3 sizes in .40 plus 1.5 in .45 ;)

[Bucky]

If you couldn’t tell, I’m a big fan of the Cougar. I used to use an M9 to teach new shooters, but now use a 9mm Cougar. And a MiniCougar is my favorite gun to carry.

I carried a Cougar L for several years. To me, that was the sweet spot in the lineup. Slightly smaller than a G19, but also had a lighter slide than the full size and mini Cougars. I traded that gun during the laser fad. It’s one I miss.

[LockedBreech]

The 8000 Series Cougar was Beretta’s real underestimated pistol. They made many improvements that most people are totally unaware of. Everybody knows the old 92 & many are finally learning the PX4. It was the first Beretta designed in CAD. The radiused grip of later 92’s came from the design of the Cougar. The Cougar was available in 4 calibers unlike the PX4. It was the only factory 357Sig Beretta. It was the first designed for .40 S&W instead of redesigned like the 96. It was the first .45ACP Beretta.

The later Stoeger Cougars got an updated recoil assembly that is closer to the PX4. It doesn’t try to fall apart on you when putting the gun back together. Hogue also offers G10 grips for the Cougar that feel great. And I’ve found that sights designed for the Vertec slide 92’s work very well on the Cougar. The earliest Cougar used a unique mag release, but it didn’t take Beretta long to redesign it to take the same mag release as the 92. And Stoeger offered the 8040T which got a light rail. The universal G kit that was only released a few years ago even came from the Cougar.

If you couldn’t tell, I’m a big fan of the Cougar. I used to use an M9 to teach new shooters, but now use a 9mm Cougar. And a MiniCougar is my favorite gun to carry.

Thus far my 8000 is flawless, as is my 8040, though round counts through each are relatively low. Back in my college years I was helping a buddy on a budget pick out a home defense pistol, this was about a year or two after Beretta bought Stoeger. I recommended the 8000F and it ended up being a great performer, fit and finish wise was the equal of my 2013 92FS. His is why I got mine. Interesting and good to know that they updated the recoil assembly.

It's sorta sad that the Cougar fits a niche that likely has hit the peak of its popularity. I do rather like mine and don't have any intent to get rid of it.

[medmo]

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/961125475

I’ll just leave that there in case anyone has interest. Full size 40 that is DAO config at low price.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

My wife has been our 40 caliber specialist. She carries a PX4 SubCompact 40 with 300 testing rounds through it.

She also uses my full size 40 posted at home with 7,400 rounds on it.

She has 2 PX4 Compact 40s, one in reserve with 500 testing rounds through it.

She mainly shoots the other PX4 Compact 40 which now has 13,000 rounds through it. She just did a 100% disassembly for detailed cleaning.

These have all had nothing but complete reliability, durability, accuracy and ease of use. They all are adorned with spurless hammers, Carry levers, low profile slide catches, medium magazine release buttons and a D spring.

[LockedBreech]

Probably been a year or two since I chimed in to this thread, so just wanted to report my 2008 PX4 .40 with 20K+ is still great. It gets shot a lot less than all those years when it was my only gun, but it always works perfect and I always keep it perfectly maintained and near to hand in my living room.

It remains the one I trust more than all others, just because of the huge variety of defensive and range ammo it has run through without a flinch.

When I got this thing, I had barely graduated high school. Now I've been a lawyer more than 10 years and it still runs like a charm. That's a good gun however you slice it.

[PX4 Storm Tracker]

Probably been a year or two since I chimed in to this thread, so just wanted to report my 2008 PX4 .40 with 20K+ is still great. It gets shot a lot less than all those years when it was my only gun, but it always works perfect and I always keep it perfectly maintained and near to hand in my living room.

It remains the one I trust more than all others, just because of the huge variety of defensive and range ammo it has run through without a flinch.

When I got this thing, I had barely graduated high school. Now I've been a lawyer more than 10 years and it still runs like a charm. That's a good gun however you slice it.

Awesome report!

With all of the newfangled gadgets, flavor of the month and changes of fad and focus, it is always good to hear reports of an old faithful tried and true that keeps serving!