Why has AIWB become so popular?

[CoffeeParamedic]

Hey everyone,
I am new here, but been carrying for around 20 years. I have pretty much only carried a G19, recently moved to a different country and now bought another G19, I've been out of training and guns etc for around 2.5 years.

It seems that suddenly AIWB is remarkably popular and a lot of people have moved over to it.
I hear the pros and cons of it, but personally, I have never been able to carry comfortably AIWB.

Am I doing something wrong? Why is it suddenly so popular?

Thanks
CoffeeParamedic

[TGS]

Welcome. Use the search function.....it's not a new topic, and there's already lots of discussion/reading for you to digest:

AIWB (Appendix Carry) (https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?120-AIWB-(Appendix-Carry))

Appendix Carry...Thousands of Thugs Can't Be Wrong! (https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?3706-Appendix-Carry%85Thousands-of-Thugs-Can%92t-be-Wrong!)

[YVK]

I don't know what true prevalence is but part of what you're seeing on this site is a selection bias. This forum was started by Todd, he carried appendix, a lot if not most old timers here trained with him and picked it up from there. Forums attract like minded people, and that's how pf became the most AIWB friendly gun site out there. On other sites most of the time AIWB discussions become confrontational and AIWB practice is an exception, even though I think it grew somewhat in popularity.

[Gray222]

Why? Because it's awesome.

[blues]

I started carrying my Glock 19 AIWB, (back in 1989), in an Assault Systems cordura nylon holster way before I ever heard of the term AIWB...or cared, for that matter.

I carried that way because it worked (for me). It provided quick access to the gun, was more comfortable for my body than IWB, provided access with either hand and allowed me to secure the gun with an arm or hand in the event of a scrum.

No system is perfect for everyone but this is the method that works best for me by far and is my preference for both semi-autos and revolvers.

Today's holsters are way better than what was available back in the day.

[Peally]

I don't think it's particularly popular; YVK is probably on to something. I'll never bother goofing around with a "press out" draw either but since it was invented by the forum's founder I'm sure there's plenty of members here that use it.

If it works for you more power to you, if it doesn't don't lose sleep over it.

[RJ]

I hated behind the hip carry, I never liked the draw and my pants kept falling off. Plus I could never drive that way.

Appendix (I carry AOWB) fits right in my Inguinal Crease, the draw is fast and I find the amount of float between pants, belt and holster allows the gun to slide a bit for standing, sitting and driving. I really have come to like it.

[Peally]

I hated behind the hip carry, I never liked the draw and my pants kept falling off.

You're supposed to wear a belt you old coot ;)

[leathermaneod]

Am I doing something wrong? Why is it suddenly so popular?

Thanks
CoffeeParamedic

You may have too large of a gun for AIWB to work comfortably for you. I know there are many who do comfortably carry G19’s and bigger guns, but I’ve tried it and there is NO WAY I could possibly carry anything with that long of a barrel in that position. I use a G43 and a G26 very comfortably though. For me, in this position, barrel length is a bigger factor than grip length.

ETA: A good holster designed for AIWB is another significant factor, something I learned very recently. Mastermind Tactics makes a great AIWB holster and has awesome customer service!



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[Artemas2]

As a near skeleton anything behind the hip is impossible to conceal effectively and go about day to day life, AIWB solves that for me. It is also a mechanically more efficient draw and arguably safer re-holster.

I have also found it to be easier to protect against accidentally being bumped in crowded areas, and I am more aware of any printing if it occurs.

As far as comfort that mostly a matter of finding the right gun and holster combo for your body type.

[scw2]

You're supposed to wear a belt you old coot ;)

Maybe it's part of Rich's defensive plan. I think it's Tom Givens who says to get 2 WTFs out of the BG. I'm pretty sure if he flashed his junk to start his counterattack that would count as 1 of 2 WTFs. :rolleyes:

[blues]

Maybe it's part of Rich's defensive plan. I think it's Tom Givens who says to get 2 WTFs out of the BG. I'm pretty sure if he flashed his junk to start his counterattack that would count as 1 of 2 WTFs. :rolleyes:

Assuming the BG was wearing his specs!

;)

[scw2]

Assuming the BG was wearing his specs!

Why would the BG need to wear his specs? In his defense....

22879

[03RN]

You may have too large of a gun for AIWB to work comfortably for you. I know there are many who do comfortably carry G19’s and bigger guns, but I’ve tried it and there is NO WAY I could possibly carry anything with that long of a barrel in that position. I use a G43 and a G26 very comfortably though. For me, in this position, barrel length is a bigger factor than grip length.

ETA: A good holster designed for AIWB is another significant factor, something I learned very recently. Mastermind Tactics makes a great AIWB holster and has awesome customer service!



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The m9a3 is my limit22880

[03RN]

Fwiw I like both. Aiwb in jmcustom kydex or behind the hip in rgrizzle summer special style holsters.

Aiwb is faster, easier to conceal, and easier to draw if I'm on my back. Behind the hip is more comfortable.

[Hideeho]

Appendix carry is not new. I started policing in 78. It been the only way I carry. I learned from guys on the job since the 40’s. If you get a chance, watch the movie The Naked City from 1948. One of the characters is AIWB. Bad guys have been doing it just as long. Only, usually without holsters.

[JodyH]

AIWB has been around a long time, my guess is the first Chinese to carry a handgun back in the 1360's stuck in his sash front and slightly off center.

Strong side hip and behind the hip carry came about because of LE/Mil static firing line qualification/training.
It's easy for the instructor to stand to one side and slightly behind the line and watch what everyone was doing.

22884

[Hideeho]

Think you nailed it. What’s you’re prediction for the return of crossdraw?

[TGS]

Think you nailed it. What’s you’re prediction for the return of crossdraw?

Return of barrels 6" or greater in length as the norm is my prediction for when cross-draw becomes the norm again.

[Hambo]

I wouldn't trust 19th century photos to be accurate about methods of carry. They were posed and photographers wanted guns visible. They often had prop guns/knives/swords in their studio, so you see a lot of weird things show up in them.

The point that P-F has a preference for AIWB is true. If you surveyed the general gun carrying public, I would bet that pocket carry and off body carry are the overwhelming choices.

[RJ]

The point that P-F has a preference for AIWB is true. If you surveyed the general gun carrying public, I would bet that pocket carry and off body carry are the overwhelming choices.

Also Sock Drawer carry.

[Gray222]

https://i.imgflip.com/22boa2.jpg

[Totem Polar]

What’s you’re prediction for the return of crossdraw?

https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?29329-Hebrew-Hammer-Ranch-Edition

[JodyH]

I wouldn't trust 19th century photos to be accurate about methods of carry. They were posed and photographers wanted guns visible. They often had prop guns/knives/swords in their studio, so you see a lot of weird things show up in them.
If you've ever ridden a horse all day in rugged mountain country and you want to have a handgun ready to shoot it in the head if it runs away with you... you'll find appendix or crossdraw to be pretty convenient.
Lets you draw with the reins in both hands without steering the horse off a cliff.

[Casual Friday]

The internet. And I don't mean that in a bad way. Although AIWB is really only popular in small niche corners of the internet. The internet has allowed people to gain free access to techniques and methods they may not have known about otherwise. When I started carrying and shooting in the early 2000's I didn't have the internet. I had the LGS, Soldier of Fortune and Guns and Ammo magazine. First holster was an Uncle Mike's off the shelf at the LGS. (Pres Trump Voice) Sounds good, doesn't work. Second was another Uncle Mike's model. Didn't work either. Third was a Galco Fletch. Carried with that thing and thought it was the shit for years. Got the internet, heard about Raven Concealment, bought a Phantom. Mind blown. Joined PF several years later, read the 4 million page AIWB thread multiple times, bought a holster from Tony Mayer of JM Custom. Mind blown again.

Another reason is the trial and error that many people put into developing quality, purpose driven AIWB holsters like Tony, Rich@CCC, and others. Now we have tucks, grips, wedges, foam pads, wings, claws, you name it. If you can't find an AIWB holster in 2018 that works for you, it's probably not for you.

[JodyH]

Anybody remember the Milt Sparks Summer Special with nylon bonded to the outside of the leather?
That was my first AIWB holster back in 1994. Carried a early 2nd Gen Glock 17 in it.
Around 2000 I started taking "Tactical" classes and they all required strong side so for the next 15 years or so I carried strong side IWB.
Then I "re-discovered" AIWB with Todd and went back to it full time.

[Hambo]

Also Sock Drawer carry.

And I forgot car console carry. Condition 3, of course.

[TQP]

And I forgot car console carry. Condition 3, of course.

Under the driver's seat, in a pistol rug.

Back on topic, carrying IWB at 3-430 aggravates my previously damaged back. the only way it's tolerable is in something like a supertuck, with that big flat piece of leather on the back, and even then not all day.

Only problem is that I've regained some weight, and AIWB doesn't conceal well on fat guys. My winter solution is looser cover garments and get the weight back off before Hawaiian shirt season.

[JTQ]

Anybody remember the Milt Sparks Summer Special with nylon bonded to the outside of the leather?

I don't, but the original Summer Special was a single loop holster, and Tony Kanaley, formerly of Milt Sparks, has often showed some old pictures of the Summer Special carried forward of the hip, by I believe, Bruce Nelson.

[Hideeho]

My mentors went AIWB for weapon retention. If you look at older photos of police in New York you’ll see unformed officers carrying in duty holsters directly in front. That was another choice based on weapon retention. We were taught it was easier to defend against a gun grab from the front.

[UNM1136]

I remember an article in the late 80s/early 90s discussing special ops guys (green and black ops types) working in latin america preferring crossdraw and aiwb beacuse in crowds it was easier to maintain control of the gun, it greatly reduced the bodylanguage used in the draw, and an easier draw while seated, in a car or otherwise. Later talked to a couple of El Sal MILGRP guys who confirmed the preference. I started aiwb with a Kel-Tec P-11 with a pocket clip in about '04 at my sister's wedding. Used it evertime I carried that gun, and got away from it as I moved to a fill sized piece full time, until taking a TLG AFHF course about 8 or 9 years later. Had the opportunity to pick the brains of two SAS guys with undercover North Ireland experience, and they said the practice was pretty widespread, with anywhere from 11 o'clock to 1 o'clock, and a surprising number liking dead nuts center (see what I did there?).

pat

[BillSWPA]

and a surprising number liking dead nuts center (see what I did there?).

pat

Expressing one of the possible disadvantages of this mode of carry?


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[UNM1136]

My mentors went AIWB for weapon retention. If you look at older photos of police in New York you’ll see unformed officers carrying in duty holsters directly in front. That was another choice based on weapon retention. We were taught it was easier to defend against a gun grab from the front.

Phil Messina of Modern Warrior is/was retired NYPD. He used to recommend carrying a strong side pistol without belt keepers so you could rotate your piece from 3 o'clock to 1 o'clock while grappling. That would necessitate learning to draw from the appendix position as well as the conventional duty holster spot. I tried it when I was younger, and was too skinny to have enough room to move the holster much, and now that I have more room on the belt, admin has mandated I carry more crap.

pat

[Sherman A. House DDS]

Paul Sharp has experimented with a appendix position duty holster years back. I bet you could talk Ted Blocker’s folks into adapting one of their high rise holsters for the purpose, or even having a custom belt shank that would fit the Safariland hole pattern.


http://civiliandefender.com

[zephyr]

I know it's bee around for a long time but I don't recall it getting much if any coverage in all the gun mags I read religiously growing up in the 80's and 90's. I think at least some popularity for it today comes from the many Instagram and Facebook photos of carry porn setups which feature almost exclusively AIWB holsters.

Plus we have some really great kydex benders available now (especially on this forum) which we did not have in the past and kydex is well suited to AIWB construction so it really helped open the door to AIWB innovation.

Plus Plus, newer makers growing up today are likely more drawn to modern AIWB friendly manufacturing methods like CNC and vacuum forming vs working with wet smelly hides.

[Trukinjp13]

Also we have the GADGET. So theres that


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[JodyH]

I know it's bee around for a long time but I don't recall it getting much if any coverage in all the gun mags I read religiously growing up in the 80's and 90's.
Jeff Cooper and the "Modern technique", it was all about the strong side hip carried 1911 and Weaver stance.

[Cory]

I moved to it for a few reasons, but you said you already know the pro-con list. I think the number of folks who are carrying that way is increased some, but I don't think it's that prevalent overall. I've never met another person at a range who carried that way. It's probably appearing popular here because of TLG, and the fact that many top instructors seem to carry that way. PF has more exposure to those instructors than most places. Those who have some of the best performance from concealment also seem to carry that way. Many here who are more exposed to the top performers and top instructors learn about it, and then see it's merits.

-Cory

[Sauer Koch]

I've been carrying for less than a year, (Sig TDA) but for me, having my gun in front of me is psychologically reassuring, in the sense that I can 'see it', and guard it better. I'm comfortable carrying a DA/SA Sig in that position.

If it's on my hip (3:00-5:00), I feel like it's out of my site, which it really is. IF, someone figured out that it was there, and decided to grab it, I'd be at a huge disadvantage. That said, I do carry at 4:00 IWB sometimes. I guess it's a matter of knowing the pros & cons of where on your body that you carry your gun, and getting comfortable with that. Just my .02

[Hambo]

Jeff Cooper and the "Modern technique", it was all about the strong side hip carried 1911 and Weaver stance.

And appendix would have been a no-go in IPSC, not that anybody really thought about it. I remember seeing this http://www.kirkpatrickleather.com/double-rigs/idaho-john-rig-41 when John Shaw started shooting cowboy and thinking he was onto something.

[Rex G]

In the Eighties, AIWB was a very comfortable, expedient way to tote a second revolver, while “primary” was on, or just behind, the hip. I do not have wide hands, or long fingers, so have used relatively compact grips on my revolvers. I have carried revolvers as large as N-Frames AIWB, though normally medium and small-frame.

My “primary” weapon has generally been carried at 0300, to match the location of my police duty handgun position.

[Rex G]

I know it's bee around for a long time but I don't recall it getting much if any coverage in all the gun mags I read religiously growing up in the 80's and 90's.

Well, then, you missed Col. Jeff Cooper’s writing on Bruce Nelson, then an undercover narc, the designer of the Summer Special, who carried AIWB. Yes, that Summer Special. Milt Sparks made the Summer Special with Bruce Nelson’s blessing. Bruce Nelson, himself, penned at least one article on AIWB carry. After retiring from LEO-ing, Bruce Nelson started making a greater number of holsters, but sadly, died too young.

The current Milt Sparks company will not make a straight-drop Summer Special; all are now made canted. I have at least one straight-drop Summer special, that survived The Flood.

[PNWTO]

Bruce Nelson, himself, penned at least one article on AIWB carry.

You wouldn't happen to have a link for the lazy?


Jeff Cooper and the "Modern technique", it was all about the strong side hip carried 1911 and Weaver stance.

And the orthodoxy of strong-side, 3:30-4:30 carry hasn't gone away. I've ran in multiple people who will say that they love their pistol but can't carry it because they've bought five holsters and none work. I introduce the idea AIWB and the reply is akin to me declaring God is dead.

[zephyr]

Well, then, you missed Col. Jeff Cooper’s writing on Bruce Nelson, then an undercover narc, the designer of the Summer Special, who carried AIWB. Yes, that Summer Special. Milt Sparks made the Summer Special with Bruce Nelson’s blessing. Bruce Nelson, himself, penned at least one article on AIWB carry. After retiring from LEO-ing, Bruce Nelson started making a greater number of holsters, but sadly, died too young.

The current Milt Sparks company will not make a straight-drop Summer Special; all are now made canted. I have at least one straight-drop Summer special, that survived The Flood.

Cool, do you happen to have a link to the article?

[Rex G]

Cool, do you happen to have a link to the article?

Sorry, I do not. It was not in one of the the big three or four gun mags, perhaps published by something like “Firepower Publications.” The article was the first place I saw the term “size efficiency” being used, and I believe Bruce Nelson coined that term, himself, or was the first to apply it to firearms. He also related the story of the time he was boarded an airplane, to fly to or from a training class, and was authorized to fly armed, but was told he had to actually wear the guns, not tote them in his carry-on luggage, so he stepped into a restroom stall, removed the several weapons from the carry-on case/bag, and tucked them into his waistband, then boarded the plane with a total of eight handguns. None of the passengers noticed a thing. (Presumably, one was in an AIWB holster, and the rest “Mexican” carry.)

[JTQ]

The current Milt Sparks company will not make a straight-drop Summer Special; all are now made canted. I have at least one straight-drop Summer special, that survived The Flood.
Del Fatti offers the single loop ISP-NR http://www.delfatti.com/2011%20ISP.html

and the dual loop straight drop ISP-A2

[JTQ]

caleb has the picture of Bruce Nelson with the Summer Special I referred to earlier in this GunNuts Media post on AIWB.

http://www.gunnuts.net/2015/06/25/aiwb-safety-and-sanity/

[Rex G]

caleb has the picture of Bruce Nelson with the Summer Special I referred to earlier in this GunNuts Media post on AIWB.

http://www.gunnuts.net/2015/06/25/aiwb-safety-and-sanity/

I have seen those photos, and remember seeing the “draw, mutha” part, in the magazine I had. Notably, I am doubtful that Bruce Nelson authored the “draw, mutha” part. His article was very well-written, and “draw, mutha” seems more like the editorial tone of the magazine.

[DocGKR]

As noted previously, I started out using AIWB carry over 30 years ago when faced with the need to carry a service pistol (at various times in my military career a 1911, M9, or Sig P226/228) while wearing the Navy Service Dress Blue uniform--since the jacket is a double breasted type that could not be left unbuttoned, AIWB was the only option to allow easy access to the pistol. It also worked well with BDU/DCU uniforms when not wanting to appear armed, for example on MEDCAP's. Lou Alessi made us some holsters (APX-IWB) with a slight reverse FBI cant that worked very well for this option--the only potential downside of the Alessi holster was the plastic "Talon" clip that secured it to the belt--although to be honest none ever broke or caused any problems for us.

22916

Likewise I have used AIWB for over a decade in the LE and civilian world, to carry 1911's, G19's, and M&P's w/ambi-safeties. During a a past Independence Day celebration, a couple of friends from the PD were teasing me about my uncharacteristically running around unarmed in just a hippie-cam T-shirt and shorts, as shown in the photo below--not realizing I was carrying a 5" 1911 AIWB in an Alessi holster, along with a couple of extra mags...

22917

As discussed, I've been carrying AIWB for a LONG time--including bicycling to work everyday, horseback riding with my daughters, hiking, bouldering/rock climbing easier sport routes, etc... With the proper holster and attire selection, pistols the size of a G17 are more than acceptable for daily carry AIWB . Depending how your holster rides, the location of the holster on the belt, and your clothing, the shorter grip on the G19 can be an advantage over the G17 for some folks with AIWB. When carrying AIWB, a LONGER barrel helps keep the pistol tucked in and secure. However, if you go with too long a barrel for your physique, then important anatomic structures can get poked. It turns out that AIWB can be less comfortable doing certain activities like bicycling and equestrian events when using a longer barrel like a 5" 1911... Conversely, at 6 feet, 200 lbs, I find the G26 has far too short a barrel for stable carry and too short a grip for effective shooting. The G19 is the smallest I want to go with for daily carry (although I typically use a G17 holster). Recently, I've used primarily RDS equipped Glocks and M&P's in AIWB holsters by Fricke and JM Custom.

Note that the pistols I have most frequently carried AIWB--1911's, G19's, and M&P's are either striker fired or cocked and locked. There are NO problems if appropriate care and prudence is exercised while slowly re-holstering along with simultaneously tilting the holster AWAY from all critical anatomic areas that could be perforated or damage if the pistol inadvertently discharges. Much like other endeavors requiring error free performance such as flying, deep scuba diving, rock climbing, and performing surgery--DON'T MAKE ANY MISTAKES when doing this!

[Glenn E. Meyer]

Everybody is different and I make no judgments against those who carry this way or that, if they can do it efficaciously and safely. So this is just what works for me. My physique or lack of says that OWB works best with my various Glocks. In TX, I can conceal with loose big floppy garments of various types - jackets, fleece vests, dress vests, cover lt. weight shirt and tee shirt. I don't like IWB as it drives my pant sizes and OWB doesn't.

I also have decided that I don't like a method that entails a two handed draw. I see skilled AIWB folks at matches or classes, use both hands to get the gun. However, I've been 'one' handed enough (as I am now in part) that I don't want to draw that way. I also worry about needing my other hand (when it is in full play) to fend off adversaries, help the loved ones or save the six pack to want to futz around with both hands. Yes, in extremis you can draw with one from appendix but that is atypical and while I am a very stable genius, I don't want to have to switch gears in a draw stroke.

This is just me. Pocket carry for a J frame is a secondary EDC style if need be due to dress.

[jeep45238]

You may have too large of a gun for AIWB to work comfortably for you. I know there are many who do comfortably carry G19’s and bigger guns, but I’ve tried it and there is NO WAY I could possibly carry anything with that long of a barrel in that position.

That's the exact reason why I went from Beretta 92's to Sig P226's. The 226 is just shorter to make a difference (positively) for a full size gun in a JMC George holster. It is NOT the answer for driving around through - still a smidge big for that. And with that said, the Sig P239 enters the frame, and a JMC AIWB for that will be arriving soon (probably when I'm out of country).

[Zincwarrior]

Everybody is different and I make no judgments against those who carry this way or that, if they can do it efficaciously and safely. So this is just what works for me. My physique or lack of says that OWB works best with my various Glocks. In TX, I can conceal with loose big floppy garments of various types - jackets, fleece vests, dress vests, cover lt. weight shirt and tee shirt. I don't like IWB as it drives my pant sizes and OWB doesn't.

I also have decided that I don't like a method that entails a two handed draw. I see skilled AIWB folks at matches or classes, use both hands to get the gun. However, I've been 'one' handed enough (as I am now in part) that I don't want to draw that way. I also worry about needing my other hand (when it is in full play) to fend off adversaries, help the loved ones or save the six pack to want to futz around with both hands. Yes, in extremis you can draw with one from appendix but that is atypical and while I am a very stable genius, I don't want to have to switch gears in a draw stroke.

This is just me. Pocket carry for a J frame is a secondary EDC style if need be due to dress.

In Texas one is wise not to mess with old guys in Hawaiian shirts...:)

[45dotACP]

As noted previously, I started out using AIWB carry over 30 years ago when faced with the need to carry a service pistol (at various times in my military career a 1911, M9, or Sig P226/228) while wearing the Navy Service Dress Blue uniform--since the jacket is a double breasted type that could not be left unbuttoned, AIWB was the only option to allow easy access to the pistol. It also worked well with BDU/DCU uniforms when not wanting to appear armed, for example on MEDCAP's. Lou Alessi made us some holsters (APX-IWB) with a slight reverse FBI cant that worked very well for this option--the only potential downside of the Alessi holster was the plastic "Talon" clip that secured it to the belt--although to be honest none ever broke or caused any problems for us.

22916

Likewise I have used AIWB for over a decade in the LE and civilian world, to carry 1911's, G19's, and M&P's w/ambi-safeties. During a a past Independence Day celebration, a couple of friends from the PD were teasing me about my uncharacteristically running around unarmed in just a hippie-cam T-shirt and shorts, as shown in the photo below--not realizing I was carrying a 5" 1911 AIWB in an Alessi holster, along with a couple of extra mags...

22917

As discussed, I've been carrying AIWB for a LONG time--including bicycling to work everyday, horseback riding with my daughters, hiking, bouldering/rock climbing easier sport routes, etc... With the proper holster and attire selection, pistols the size of a G17 are more than acceptable for daily carry AIWB . Depending how your holster rides, the location of the holster on the belt, and your clothing, the shorter grip on the G19 can be an advantage over the G17 for some folks with AIWB. When carrying AIWB, a LONGER barrel helps keep the pistol tucked in and secure. However, if you go with too long a barrel for your physique, then important anatomic structures can get poked. It turns out that AIWB can be less comfortable doing certain activities like bicycling and equestrian events when using a longer barrel like a 5" 1911... Conversely, at 6 feet, 200 lbs, I find the G26 has far too short a barrel for stable carry and too short a grip for effective shooting. The G19 is the smallest I want to go with for daily carry (although I typically use a G17 holster). Recently, I've used primarily RDS equipped Glocks and M&P's in AIWB holsters by Fricke and JM Custom.

Note that the pistols I have most frequently carried AIWB--1911's, G19's, and M&P's are either striker fired or cocked and locked. There are NO problems if appropriate care and prudence is exercised while slowly re-holstering along with simultaneously tilting the holster AWAY from all critical anatomic areas that could be perforated or damage if the pistol inadvertently discharges. Much like other endeavors requiring error free performance such as flying, deep scuba diving, rock climbing, and performing surgery--DON'T MAKE ANY MISTAKES when doing this!There is a lot of wisdom in this post. I initially carried a Beretta 92FS appendix in a CCC shaggy, but it was too big and sitting in a chair would turn the nose of the holster and the flat surface of the chair into the proverbial nutcracker.

It fucking hurt.

I carried at 3:00/4:00 for a while after, but kept coming back to AIWB for my NPE option (a J frame) and ultimately when finally just coming back to glocks like I should have all along, I bought a Mastermind Tactics holster for my G17. It had a similar discomfort factor. Fortunately, it had the option to raise the ride height, included a wedge and a belt claw.

Turns out, a little adjustability, some experimenting with what works for you. Now it's great. It's comfortable, conceals a G17 with a RMR, in addition to being fast and secure. Being 5"9 and 155lbs a Glock 17 is the upper limit for me. A G34, 1911, or 92FS is too large.

Secure here meaning I can just cross my arms and the concealment is vastly improved. Also, if someone grabs at my gun I can quickly react by booping them on the snoot.

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[Qaz98]

I do think you have to realize that aiwb does require some trial and error in terms of adjusting the wedge and ride height. If you go with the aforementioned makers, you'll be fine. But when I transitioned I had to take some time to figure out how best to wear it. I think some people may get a crappy holster, and just out it on and not like the fit, and decide it's not for them. I also agree with the wedge and claw making an aiwb fit possible for almost anyone.

4 o'clock was also harder to conceal with kids and some shirts when the arms are raises. Don't shoot! Nah. But more like when at the store and grabbing items on a shelf.

I also know waaaaaaaay less and have waaaaaaaay less experience than everyone else, so take my words as that of a noob and new convert.

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[Bucky]

Hip pain was the only reason I even considered AIWB. It’s been working out well for me.

[stimpee]

I'll chime in with my thoughts here. I started carrying around 2010, and basically had limited myself to single stack guns (Walther PPS, Beretta Nano), and occasionally carrying my wife's bodyguard 380 in NPE. I carried with various holsters at 3-330. In permissive environments, I would occasionally carry a S&W M&P 9C. But that was as far as I would go, and I typically would be very self conscious and wear hugely oversized shirts.

I was/am sensitive to reaching and bending while carrying this way, since I would clearly print in these instances. I am probably WAY too sensitive to it, especially considering that TN is a pretty permissive environment. But I don't like to print.

Fast forward. In early December after much reading and study, I purchased a JM Custom Kydex Wing Claw 2.5 for a Beretta PX4. I have been shooting the PX4 quite a bit after working with and talking to Ernest Langdon, and shooting the gun a lot in validation testing of the Inox compact in 9mm and .40 (for full disclosure, this was before I left Beretta in July). I really like the compact, and the way I can shoot it. I am also a big fan of TDA in general, and in particular for the added safety (or at least perceived safety) of the TDA and exposed hammer for AIWB.

I have been carrying with that holster (and a single mag "pouch" as well) now pretty regularly. I am still needing to play with the wedge a bit, since the stock wedge is way too much. I have been not using a wedge at the moment.

I am flabbergasted at how well I can conceal this gun AIWB with this holster, and how comfortable it is. I don't even need a particularly stiff belt or to tighten my belt too much, and my pants don't get dragged down like they did with 330 carry. I have recently lost 20-25lbs, and am wearing much more form fitting clothes since I am not embarrassed by a "dunlop", and even with those clothes the gun doesn't show.

I am sold. I need to get in some good training to feel totally comfortable with this carry method, but in today's relatively safe, but completely unpredictable environment, I feel way better having a 15+1 gun that I can shoot very well on me, with an added 17rds in reserve in a full size magazine.

[Doc_Glock]

As discussed, I've been carrying AIWB for a LONG time--including bicycling to work everyday, horseback riding with my daughters, hiking, bouldering/rock climbing easier sport routes, etc...

When carrying AIWB, a LONGER barrel helps keep the pistol tucked in and secure. However, if you go with too long a barrel for your physique, then important anatomic structures can get poked. It turns out that AIWB can be less comfortable doing certain activities like bicycling and equestrian events when using a longer barrel like a 5" 1911...

I love AIWB for most things, but I definitely pinch a nut trying to ride a bike with a G19. I also generally prefer 3:00 OWB when hiking and clambering over rocks, but it is not a strong preference.

[APS-PF]

I do prefer AIWB to IWB but currently IWB until I can come up with a way to deal with seat belt placement with AIWB.

[Blades]

I do prefer AIWB to IWB but currently IWB until I can come up with a way to deal with seat belt placement with AIWB.

The seat belt concerns me also. I read somewhere about slipping the seatbelt behind the gun but I haven't tried it.

[Dagga Boy]

https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?29329-Hebrew-Hammer-Ranch-Edition

FYI....Crossdraw holsters work great for front appendix OWB as well. Additionally, for those reading gun magazines not remembering front appendix, along with Bruce Nelson, Peter Kokalis did a lot of work with IWB crossdraw worn just left of the belt buckle. Sparks made Executive Companion holsters in this configuration for him. Front appendix was always frowned upon in competition, and is to this day, so it often doesn’t get “press”. It was very popular for both undercover and off duty carry in the Revolver era....often sans a holster or with the cheap suede soft holsters with a clip.

[JHC]

Sorry, I do not. It was not in one of the the big three or four gun mags, perhaps published by something like “Firepower Publications.” The article was the first place I saw the term “size efficiency” being used, and I believe Bruce Nelson coined that term, himself, or was the first to apply it to firearms. He also related the story of the time he was boarded an airplane, to fly to or from a training class, and was authorized to fly armed, but was told he had to actually wear the guns, not tote them in his carry-on luggage, so he stepped into a restroom stall, removed the several weapons from the carry-on case/bag, and tucked them into his waistband, then boarded the plane with a total of eight handguns. None of the passengers noticed a thing. (Presumably, one was in an AIWB holster, and the rest “Mexican” carry.)

I seem to recall seeing some Bruce Nelson AIWB in Combat Handguns too way back in the day.

[JHC]

I know it's bee around for a long time but I don't recall it getting much if any coverage in all the gun mags I read religiously growing up in the 80's and 90's. I think at least some popularity for it today comes from the many Instagram and Facebook photos of carry porn setups which feature almost exclusively AIWB holsters.

Plus we have some really great kydex benders available now (especially on this forum) which we did not have in the past and kydex is well suited to AIWB construction so it really helped open the door to AIWB innovation.

Plus Plus, newer makers growing up today are likely more drawn to modern AIWB friendly manufacturing methods like CNC and vacuum forming vs working with wet smelly hides.

It didn't get a ton of coverage then. I penned an article about it way back when and sent it in to CH but they sent it back "does not meet our editorial format".
:D Good times. I was handy with it; living in the big NPE state of Texas at the time. ;)

[Bucky]

Front appendix was always frowned upon in competition, and is to this day, so it often doesn’t get “press”.

When I started shooting USPSA, before there were any “divisions”, many of us were running our Dot sighted guns in race holsters worn in front, ala Appendix Carry.

[Mr. Goodtimes]

In short, because it works.

I started carrying AIWB, probably around five years ago after reading Todd speak highly of it here. I thought to my self, “well, he’s a smart guy, an accomplished shooter and his argument for it makes sense, so I’ll give it a shot.” Once I tried it I never went back. The advantages over traditional IWB carry are numerous. Not only is it by far the fastest and most accessible way to get to a gun, it’s also the best way to hide one. Partly because of my build and partly because AIWB conceals well, carrying AIWB I can make a G17 disappear under a t shirt.


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[Dagga Boy]

When I started shooting USPSA, before there were any “divisions”, many of us were running our Dot sighted guns in race holsters worn in front, ala Appendix Carry.

When I shot competitively, all my stuff was set up that way to mirror my concealment/back up rigs. I should have clarified the IWB variants are what are heavily frowned upon in most places. I found it funny recently that Spencer Keepers and I were not allowed to shoot our front AIWB rugs from concealment in a match, because....dangerous, yet a lot of the other shooters were carry some pretty minimalist competition rigs and many angles and contorted into positions that were far more of an issue than our well made and designed AIWB carry rigs.

[RolandD]

I don't know if I would have ever tried AIWB, if I hadn't fallen into buying some used holsters really cheap. I got three holsters for less than the cost of any one of them. One happened to be a Cry Havoc Grim and I really didn't think I'd use it much. It has become my daily carry for over a year. Sits right at 12 o'clock and is invisible.

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