Any experience lowering fullsize pickups?

[rob_s]

I have a 2016 Ram 1500 Crew Cab Sport 2WD that's approaching needing new tires. Since I'm from the South, 2WD or not, my plan was always to raise the front end to level the truck and then get better "offroad" tires because:reasons. Now that the time is upon me I realize that I'm not interested in impressing young men with my truck like some are, and so there's really no reason to go raising and offroad-tiring a 2WD city truck that only sees dirt roads at best and instead tends to be used to haul a family in the cab and either building supplies or family supplies in the bed.

This then has me thinking about the obscenely high tailgate height of modern fullsize trucks, and considering lowering the rear ~2". There is, of course, still some amount of aesthetic drive here to have the truck look level. But I'm concerned as to what that will do to the ride once the bed is loaded, which in turn has me considering airbags, and then compressor to inflate them, and then sensors so that it will inflate on it's own (like an old Cadillac)... so it's all seeming a bit more involved. Plus I wonder about hitting/trimming bump stops, etc.

I'm also not as familiar with street tires as I am offroad, so I'm wondering about tire choices.

Overall I'm just looking for folks that might have experience with lowering, to include suspension and tire options, that might have some wisdom to share. I'm aware this is a gun forum not a truck forum but the truck forums for Rams are pretty focused on raising not lowering and attempts to get info there has been limited, plus I think there's some amount of universality to the issue that crosses brand lines.

[serialsolver]

My handicapped wife was having difficulty getting into my truck. So I lowered my 93 f150 with some after market shackles at the rear. I think it dropped the rear end down 1.5 or 2 inches. I have not had any trouble with bottoming out the suspension and I’ve had the truck pretty heavy loaded a couple times. I’m referring to the truck being loaded but not obviously over loaded. Hope this helps.


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[orionz06]

Leveling kits should be rather cheap and easy to install, as well as quite common. Tire wise I'd just grab a set of Michelins and call it a day.

[rob_s]

Leveling kits should be rather cheap and easy to install, as well as quite common.
both of these things are true (even though I'm not wasting my time turning wrenches on a car these days), but my concern is about the aftermath of cheap and easy, such as bottoming out when loaded.



Tire wise I'd just grab a set of Michelins and call it a day.
any particular model? I'm not too concerned with offroadability but I do live in a sub-rural area and dirt roads are not uncommon, neither is needing to drive over wet or soggy grass/mud, so I don't think I want to go full street tire. Even though aesthetically I think that's what I want. The truck has 20" rims stock that I'm planning to keep.

[orionz06]

both of these things are true (even though I'm not wasting my time turning wrenches on a car these days), but my concern is about the aftermath of cheap and easy, such as bottoming out when loaded.

For a while dropped trucks were a thing around here and some friends had no issues on crew cabs, quad cabs, and duallies. One guy had a massive dually with a Cadillac appearance conversion and all that and had it lower than you're looking and had minimal issues. I suspect Florida is far better than Western PA is for stuff like that, more so at a normal height on a truck that by comparison isn't really a "working" truck.



any particular model? I'm not too concerned with offroadability but I do live in a sub-rural area and dirt roads are not uncommon, neither is needing to drive over wet or soggy grass/mud, so I don't think I want to go full street tire. Even though aesthetically I think that's what I want. The truck has 20" rims stock that I'm planning to keep.

I'd consider this to be the gold standard truck tire, Michelin LTX (https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Michelin&tireModel=Defender+LTX+M%2FS&partnum=76TR0DLTX&vehicleSearch=true&fromCompare1=yes&autoMake=RAM&autoYear=2016&autoModel=1500%202wd&autoModClar=Crew%20Cab). If you keep the thing aligned and run the right pressures you'll see at least the guaranteed mileage with a smooth, quiet ride. In most cases, even up here, there isn't much need to deviate. Prior versions of that tire were on a private "fleet" of trucks that I worked on for a guy, all 1500/2500 Chevy Silverado/Subburbans and he towed boats from Pittsburgh to Ft. Lauderdale all the time and was touching 71-72k miles per set.

My choice would be the LTX AT2 (https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Michelin&tireModel=LTX+A%2FT+2&partnum=76SR0LTXAT2&vehicleSearch=true&fromCompare1=yes&autoMake=RAM&autoYear=2016&autoModel=1500%202wd&autoModClar=Crew%20Cab). A touch more aggressive but where I live is a little more demanding. They're still quiet. Co-worker is on set #2 and has a combined 130k on the two sets and will be swapping out for a third set before Thanksgiving (2009 F150).

[RevolverRob]

My handicapped wife was having difficulty getting into my truck. So I lowered my 93 f150 with some after market shackles at the rear. I think it dropped the rear end down 1.5 or 2 inches. I have not had any trouble with bottoming out the suspension and I’ve had the truck pretty heavy loaded a couple times. I’m referring to the truck being loaded but not obviously over loaded. Hope this helps.

It works fine on a '93. But I'm not even sure if anyone is still making a half-ton pickup with leaf-spring rear suspension. The Ram 1500 has a 5-link, coil-sprung rear axle. So that's out as a solution.


Leveling kits should be rather cheap and easy to install, as well as quite common. Tire wise I'd just grab a set of Michelins and call it a day.

My concern with leveling kits, is making sure that they do not dramatically change spring rates, when the truck is leveled (lowered/raised). Because most of them are effectively just spacers inserted between springs and attachment points. This can increase the leverage applied to suspension components. It wouldn't surprise me at all to find "leveled" trucks that have higher degrees of wear on steering components like any lifted truck without proper steering fixes applied.

The best way to lower anything is to purchase lowering springs set up at the proper spring rate for the load, and confirm that lowering keeps steering/suspension components within engineered tolerances of the suspension. OR to go airbags and do the same.

I'd probably...just leave it alone...to be brutally honest. To get a 2" drop in the rear for the requisite changes to the suspension seems not worth it to me (personally). But if you are going to do it, definitely do it right and get lowering springs or airbags. If you need lowering springs, Eibach still remains the gold standard in my opinion. QA1 also makes great pieces of kit.

I concur on the Michelin LTX tire choice. Excellent tires. I'm a very happy buyer and owner of Michelin tires, to the point where I will change wheels on a vehicle if I can't get a Michelin fitment to the wheels that are on it.

[DallasBronco]

Just want to throw out a couple of things to consider; leveling kits raise the front to match the rear, and this model of Ram has rear coil springs, not leaves. I haven't shopped these types of items, but I would suspect that there are lowing springs available for the truck, or go airbags. www.summitracing.com or www.jegs.com would probably be a couple of good places to do some research.

[rob_s]

I'd plan on using something like this. The reviews I've read all seem to indicate that there are no issues with bump/rubbing or bottoming out under load. I'm certainly not hauling pallets of block but I also don't want to bottom out when hauling a few hundred pounds of landscaping rocks either (although I do have a trailer I could use in those situations, and would probably prefer to use anyway).

2009-2017 Dodge RAM 1500 2wd/4wd Rear 2" Drop Coil Springs - McGaughys 44055
(https://www.suspensionsuperstore.com/2009-2017-dodge-ram-1500-2wd-4wd-rear-2-drop-coil-springs-mcgaughys-44055/)

[octagon]

To the OP. You have the lowest factory springs for Ram 1500 unless you have the long bed then you have the second shortest springs and very little difference to be had from factory springs. As stated the Ram uses coil springs front and rear. Rear springs for all 1500s fit each other so you could use 4WD or 2WD rear springs where front springs are different between 4WD and 2WD and are not interchangeable. This mean aftermarket lowering kit.

Aftermarket lowering springs often will affect ride and sometimes load as well especially going 2" or more lower but you may get lucky and find a quality kit that has minimal impact since Rams sit fairly high. The bumpstops for the rear axle will start getting close so the reduced suspension travel may be an issue with larger bumps unloaded and almost guaranteed when loaded. A stiffer spring rate rear will help with this when loaded while worsening the ride when unloaded.

Air bag type kits offer more adjustment options for height and usually very good balance of ride and load carrying ability but are more expensive and more complex with hoses,compressor,ride sensors etc.

How often and what type of loads are carried in the bed and/or towed? What is your budget in money and/or time/labor? What is the reason for lowering when you have dirt roads and the factory set up is well engineered and tested as well as a known quantity? If it is for bed access ease or ingress/egress there may be better(cheaper) options.

For tires I suggest checking out Tire rack and their pro and customer reviews for ant tire you consider or just to get ideas.

[txdpd]

https://www.suspensionshop.com/dodge-ram-1500-2wd-2009-2017-2-4-deluxe-drop-kit-mcgaughys-part-44050/

My roofer had a lowered Ram 1500, IIRC this is the kit he said he used. He did say he had to replace the shocks, not sure why. Modern pickups have obscene ride and bed wall heights, to the point that pickups have lost most of their utility value.

[JRB]

I've spent a lot of time with modifying vehicles and have worked professionally in aftermarket high performance through several phases of my life. Most recently I was the shop foreman of a prominent local performance shop that has two chassis dynos and 7 lifts and frequently builds top-dollar wild custom stuff from 1500hp 100% street cars A/C to wild 4wd stuff.

Overwhelmingly, when it comes to truck suspension lift/lowering, go with the minimum that will do what you want. If that means leaving it stock - do that!

In your case, the above-linked 2in/4in drop kit would work nicely, as the Ram trucks have gotten just a little bit higher with every passing revision it seems, so that much of a 'drop' brings it to where a 2wd truck used to sit. Drop spindles are what you want for anything IFS because that's what keeps the suspension geometry correct. Depending on the rear spring rate, I might recommend new upgraded rear shocks as well, because any OE shock is designed as a damper for the stock spring both in rate and travel. Lowering springs are typically a bit stiffer than OE, and that means the shock has to damp that much more force over that much shorter of a travel range. Bilsteins are the gold standard in most cases and they offer a variety of options.

Alternatively, a simple rear spring 2in drop plus shocks would do the job as well. If you've got a good torque wrench (Craftsman or better) chances are high that you can install either set in your driveway over a weekend. Just be sure to get it aligned after the install.

I also emphatically endorse the Michelin LTX's for a general purpose highway truck tire.

[rob_s]

I think I've arrived at just going with spacers in the front to level it out. It seems that getting it lowered/leveled is too much brain damage.

i think that with a 2" spacer in the front I'll get to level and should fit at least a 34" tire if not a 35". which should put me in a 275/65R20 vs the stock 275/60R20, although I'm frankly not sure any of that is really worth the premium and I may just go with the stock tire size in what I hope is a better tire.

LTX A/T 2 - SIZE: P275/60R20 - $228/ea, $912/4 (https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Michelin&tireModel=LTX+A%2FT+2&partnum=76SR0LTXAT2&vehicleSearch=true&fromCompare1=yes&autoMake=RAM&autoYear=2016&autoModel=1500%202wd&autoModClar=Crew%20Cab)

LTX A/T 2 - SIZE: LT275/65R20 - $291/ea, $1164/4 ($250 premium over stock size plus spacers & spacer install cost) (https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Michelin&tireModel=LTX+A%2FT+2&sidewall=Outlined%20White%20Letters&partnum=765R0LTXAT2OWLV4&tab=Specs)

[orionz06]

I think I've arrived at just going with spacers in the front to level it out. It seems that getting it lowered/leveled is too much brain damage.

i think that with a 2" spacer in the front I'll get to level and should fit at least a 34" tire if not a 35". which should put me in a 275/65R20 vs the stock 275/60R20, although I'm frankly not sure any of that is really worth the premium and I may just go with the stock tire size in what I hope is a better tire.

LTX A/T 2 - SIZE: P275/60R20 - $228/ea, $912/4 (https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Michelin&tireModel=LTX+A%2FT+2&partnum=76SR0LTXAT2&vehicleSearch=true&fromCompare1=yes&autoMake=RAM&autoYear=2016&autoModel=1500%202wd&autoModClar=Crew%20Cab)

LTX A/T 2 - SIZE: LT275/65R20 - $291/ea, $1164/4 ($250 premium over stock size plus spacers & spacer install cost) (https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Michelin&tireModel=LTX+A%2FT+2&sidewall=Outlined%20White%20Letters&partnum=765R0LTXAT2OWLV4&tab=Specs)

Those tires are pretty phenomenal for mostly pavement with the occasional need to go on a fire road, wet yard, light mud.

[rd62]

Those tires are pretty phenomenal for mostly pavement with the occasional need to go on a fire road, wet yard, light mud.

My new to me Tacoma came from the dealer with some pretty craptastic new tires. I'm considering the Michelin LTX AT2 as a replacement when the time comes.

90% of my driving is paved roads and highway. I'd like to not have a significant disadvantage when in the woods though. Do the LTX AT2 have pretty decent off road ability?

[orionz06]

My new to me Tacoma came from the dealer with some pretty craptastic new tires. I'm considering the Michelin LTX AT2 as a replacement when the time comes.

90% of my driving is paved roads and highway. I'd like to not have a significant disadvantage when in the woods though. Do the LTX AT2 have pretty decent off road ability?

No idea what offroad is to you. I know in western PA they're a great tire for the dude that drives his truck to work on the highway but may need to go into the woods a little for some hunting or vehicle camping. Boat launch, dragging some fallen trees out, etc. A co-worker just had 65k or so on the last set and is 30k into the second set with wear that's almost better than the last at the same time point.

[rd62]

No idea what offroad is to you. I know in western PA they're a great tire for the dude that drives his truck to work on the highway but may need to go into the woods a little for some hunting or vehicle camping. Boat launch, dragging some fallen trees out, etc. A co-worker just had 65k or so on the last set and is 30k into the second set with wear that's almost better than the last at the same time point.

That sounds like me. No rock crawling or anything like that. Boat launch, deer woods, boy scout camp outs, and the like. If I can get that with long service life all the better. I'm a Michelin fan but haven't bought truck tires since the 90's.

[BehindBlueI's]

Since I'm from the South, 2WD or not, my plan was always to raise the front end to level the truck and then get better "offroad" tires because:reasons. Now that the time is upon me I realize that I'm not interested in impressing young men with my truck like some are.


I think I've arrived at just going with spacers in the front to level it out.

So what's his name?

[rob_s]

So what's his name?

Bolke

[GJM]

Living in Florida way overcomplicates this. Out west, you just go down the street and ask your neighbor, the Mexican guy. Probably already has a spreadsheet comparing weights and dimensions.

[Soxfan9]

I think I've arrived at just going with spacers in the front to level it out. It seems that getting it lowered/leveled is too much brain damage.

i think that with a 2" spacer in the front I'll get to level and should fit at least a 34" tire if not a 35". which should put me in a 275/65R20 vs the stock 275/60R20, although I'm frankly not sure any of that is really worth the premium and I may just go with the stock tire size in what I hope is a better tire.

LTX A/T 2 - SIZE: P275/60R20 - $228/ea, $912/4 (https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Michelin&tireModel=LTX+A%2FT+2&partnum=76SR0LTXAT2&vehicleSearch=true&fromCompare1=yes&autoMake=RAM&autoYear=2016&autoModel=1500%202wd&autoModClar=Crew%20Cab)

LTX A/T 2 - SIZE: LT275/65R20 - $291/ea, $1164/4 ($250 premium over stock size plus spacers & spacer install cost) (https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Michelin&tireModel=LTX+A%2FT+2&sidewall=Outlined%20White%20Letters&partnum=765R0LTXAT2OWLV4&tab=Specs)

I would recommend sticking with the stock size. This will avoid issues with your speedometer. Also for what you are doing, if the truck doesn’t require LT rated tires don’t put them on. They weigh more which will effect ride and fuel economy.

[rob_s]

I would recommend sticking with the stock size. This will avoid issues with your speedometer. Also for what you are doing, if the truck doesn’t require LT rated tires don’t put them on. They weigh more which will effect ride and fuel economy.

My understating is that the LT tires are reinforced, no? Seems that would be a good thing as I’m in the construction biz and frequently visit job sites.

ETA:
funnily enough the LTX I link d to weighs less than the stock tire.

[Soxfan9]

My understating is that the LT tires are reinforced, no? Seems that would be a good thing as I’m in the construction biz and frequently visit job sites.
Yes, they are, but it’s for increased load carrying capacity. Better for hauling heavy loads or towing, but not necessarily more “rugged”.

[rob_s]

Well now I stumbled on the stock tire which evidently sells for $140/ea, making the stock-size LTX A/T 2 a $350+ premium overall.

I'll probably wind up hitting the easy button, and go spend that $350 on a new tool for the shop, or put it towards the family vacation in a couple of weeks. At this point in my life I'd literally rather have an extra a great meal or two out with the family than spend money on making my truck look cool.

[rob_s]

4 Wheel Parts has a place near my office so I stopped in on my travels today.

$2400 to put new springs in the front to level it out and replace the tires with 295/60/R20 Pro Comps (https://www.4wheelparts.com/Tires/Pro-Comp-295-60R20-Tire-A-T-Sport-42956020.aspx?t_c=13&t_s=536&t_pt=101509&t_pn=PCT42956020).

I think I'll pass.

[BehindBlueI's]

As you waffle back and forth on what you want to do, I'd advise not using 4 Wheel Parts as a touchstone for pricing. They are for the ignorant urban dwellers who have no idea what things should cost and what local shops in their area do quality work. Ask around for a local suspension shop that does good work. If you find someone who specializes in 4x4s, they often have near new takeoffs from people who took a new truck and went full on bro-dozer. Back in the early 2000's, I got a set of 35" Mickey Thompson MTZs for half of retail that way. Guy buys truck, goes full bro-dozer, pregnant wife can't get in said bro-dozer, he's back trading for smaller tires.

[rob_s]

Just to close the loop...

Well the flat plus the need for service pretty much made this an "easy button" preposition. Went the old-man (not to be confused with old-man-looking-to-pick-up-young-boys) route and just bought the damn stock tires again. $500 for four from the dealer while it was there for service and brake pads anyway.

At a certain point the weird vanity surrounding vehicles becomes pretty ludicrous, especially when factoring in the time wasted thinking about it.

At least they installed them white-letters-in, without even asking, so there's an "upgrade" over stock.