5.56 vs .300 BLK

[GJM]

Without knowing if accurate, this article suggests the good guy shot the TX church shooter through or between ballistic plates. Assuming you were engaging a shooter, wearing plates, how would 5.56 out of a 16 inch AR stack up against .300 BLK in the form of the Barnes 110 supersonic, shot out of an 8.5 inch .300? Assume 100 yards and in.

http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2017/11/06/good-guy-gun-stephen-willeford-photos-named-man-stopped-texas-shooter-first-baptist-church-johnnie-langendorff/

[Sigfan26]

Not an expert, but it's hard to say without knowing what kind of armor. Steel seems to generally be velocity rated. Based on that, I would avoid .300.

[5pins]

Against plates? I don't think either one, but I would say the 5.56 would have the better chance because of velocity. It would, of course, depend on the plates and type of bullet.

[1slow]

My best guess.
Assuming enough barrel for velocity and penetration of armor 5.56x45. If out of 8-10'' .300 for impact. A lot to be said for head shots if feasible.

[breakingtime91]

I think either would get the job done, not sure if the round hit anything vital. Something I took from the video was that he was assuming/imagining where the guy was once he got into the vehicle. This makes the argument for having some type of magnification to see exactly where he is. Either way the guy did a stellar job.

[GJM]

Was visiting Jim Brockman today and he said .22-250 is a beast for penetration.

[SecondsCount]

I would go with the 5.56.

A friend got into the AR 500 target business a few years ago and we tested targets at 50 yards using M193 (55 FMJ ~ 3200 FPS) and M80 ball (147 FMJ ~ 2700 FPS). The M80 barely looked like it made a mark in the steel while the M193 was putting small divots in it. We also shot some Hornady Vmax which I believe was 50 grain and it did a noticeable amount of damage as well.

[Failure2Stop]

Even low-cost but decent plates will stop both 5.56 and .300 unless they are purpose-built AP.
They're both going to zip through soft armor.
In this circumstance, I don't give an edge to either. I would personally prefer a fairly fast 110gr .30 that works well in soft tissue, and work to put a few of the former into the latter.

[Beat Trash]

If I think he's wearing rifle rated plates, then shoot in the face. If he's moving too much, then shoot in the pelvis/groin area and then if he's still a threat, shoot in the head. I'd rather have a 5.56 gun that I could afford to practice with and place my shots than a 300 blk that I can't afford as much training ammo for.

[Hambo]

Was visiting Jim Brockman today and he said .22-250 is a beast for penetration.

WTF?

[GJM]

WTF?

Not tracking.

Jim had a buddy shooting engine blocks down in TX, and the .22-250 was the only caliber, out of a bunch of them, to fully penetrate it.

[Cookie Monster]

From the interview with the private armed citizen, a semi auto with slugs could of done some good work.

[mmc45414]

Not tracking.

Jim had a buddy shooting engine blocks down in TX, and the .22-250 was the only caliber, out of a bunch of them, to fully penetrate it.Any idea of bullet weight? They could probably get a 77SMK going 3000.

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[GJM]

Any idea of bullet weight? They could probably get a 77SMK going 3000.

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Think he said 60 grain.

[TiroFijo]

Any idea of bullet weight? They could probably get a 77SMK going 3000.

If you have a 22-250 with a 1-8" barrel (1-9" probably will do fine), the the M855A1 bullet would be a beast.

[mmc45414]

If you have a 22-250 with a 1-8" barrel (1-9" probably will do fine), the the M855A1 bullet would be a beast.A friend has one with 1/9 set up for 90gr.

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[Hambo]

Not tracking.

Jim had a buddy shooting engine blocks down in TX, and the .22-250 was the only caliber, out of a bunch of them, to fully penetrate it.

I'm all ears when you talk about bears, but sometimes you veer into strange territory. Your original question was about body armor and two calibers, and then you throw out that some guy shot engine blocks with .22-250. Wonderful. I shot a .50 Maxi-Ball through a junk car but I wouldn't recommend a muzzleloader in a gunfight.

Failrure2stop nailed the answer. In the interview posted under 'mindset' the guy in Texas told everyone what he did, which is what anyone else in that situation should do: shoot where the armor isn't.

[GJM]

I'm all ears when you talk about bears, but sometimes you veer into strange territory. Your original question was about body armor and two calibers, and then you throw out that some guy shot engine blocks with .22-250. Wonderful. I shot a .50 Maxi-Ball through a junk car but I wouldn't recommend a muzzleloader in a gunfight.

Failrure2stop nailed the answer. In the interview posted under 'mindset' the guy in Texas told everyone what he did, which is what anyone else in that situation should do: shoot where the armor isn't.


This was a theoretical caliber penetration question, and I was frankly surprised to hear from my friend, Jim Brockman, about the .22-250. I certainly wasn’t making a platform or caliber recommendation for someone else.

That said, based on my experience with my .300 WM, if I had the opportunity to fire one surprise shot from 50-450 yards at that shooter to end that fight, I have done some of the best shooting in my life with that bolt gun and a Barnes 180 at just under 3,000 FPS.

[JTQ]

Doesn't penetration advantage usually go bullets with high sectional density? Don't the 6.5mm bullets typically have a sectional density advantage?

[5pins]

I have seen a .300 WM go right through steel rifle plates when nothing else would, with conventional bullets. I dont know about ceramic, it seems to do a little better then steel.

[Odin Bravo One]

This would probably do ok with match grade, lathe turned solid brass projectiles.

https://barrett.net/firearms/model82a1

[Kyle Reese]

If your target is wearing armor, and your projectile of choice isn't getting the desired result, why not work on destroying the CNS?