The new Glock 19 variants

[Glenn E. Meyer]

One likes to get new guns. Multiple versions aren't in the budget so my question. I have a Gen 2 19 with Trij night sights. It has served me for years for EDC, classes and matches. I do really like my Gen 4 17 and Gen 3 26.

But the 19 is the old guy. Do any of the newer 19s - Gen 5, 46, the military one, the FBI one, the whatever one - offer a significant improvement over the old geezer Glock 19. It's been refurb'ed at the factory and works pretty well.

Just musing about a trade but maybe I would wait for the Glock 58, 73 or 87 (probably dead by then).

One down side is that the old guy doesn't allow easy attachment of proton blasters but I don't have a WML on any guns anyway.

[Gio]

I think the gen5 provides a significant upgrade to the Gen2. It's got the same grip profile with a much more aggressive texture. I can't shoot stock gen2 and 3's as well because they get so slippery when your hands get sweaty it makes recoil control harder. In addition to that, the guns are just more mechanically accurate and are closer to 2" guns at 25 yds instead of 3-4" guns with premium defensive ammo. You already mentioned the rail, which is a nice option if you ever want to add a weapon light.

[blues]

One likes to get new guns. Multiple versions aren't in the budget so my question. I have a Gen 2 19 with Trij night sights. It has served me for years for EDC, classes and matches. I do really like my Gen 4 17 and Gen 3 26.

But the 19 is the old guy. Do any of the newer 19s - Gen 5, 46, the military one, the FBI one, the whatever one - offer a significant improvement over the old geezer Glock 19. It's been refurb'ed at the factory and works pretty well.

Just musing about a trade but maybe I would wait for the Glock 58, 73 or 87 (probably dead by then).

One down side is that the old guy doesn't allow easy attachment of proton blasters but I don't have a WML on any guns anyway.

Interesting you bring this up, Glenn. I was out yesterday shooting my formerly Gen 2 G19, refurbed by Glock with a Gen 3 frame under warranty, and am truly impressed with how good a gun it is. It shoots better for me now with the new frame than it ever did with the original Gen 2 frame. I can think of no reason why I'd want to switch. (Plus they even swapped out my three original vintage 1988 magazines at the same time.)

I don't doubt the new generation of guns brings improvement but this gun continue to serve faithfully after nearly 30 years. It's not going anywhere.

ETA:

In reading Gio's post...if I could wish for anything, it'd be that the grip had the same texture as my Gen 4 G17.

[SamAdams]

I think the gen5 provides a significant upgrade to the Gen2. It's got the same grip profile with a much more aggressive texture. I can't shoot stock gen2 and 3's as well because they get so slippery when your hands get sweaty it makes recoil control harder. In addition to that, the guns are just more mechanically accurate and are closer to 2" guns at 25 yds instead of 3-4" guns with premium defensive ammo. You already mentioned the rail, which is a nice option if you ever want to add a weapon light.

My 19s are Gen 3s. I prefer the triggers on them over the Gen 4 and don't need the reduced grip (wear 2XL size gloves). Any ideas on the best grip tape options out there ? Its usually not a problem unless its hot out and I do an extended shooting session. Thanks

P.S. - the Gen 5 G17 has caught my interest as a possible field gun (black bear/cougar country only)

[Gio]

My 19s are Gen 3s. I prefer the triggers on them over the Gen 4 and don't need the reduced grip (wear 2XL size gloves). Any ideas on the best grip tape options out there ? Its usually not a problem unless its hot out and I do an extended shooting session. Thanks

P.S. - the Gen 5 G17 has caught my interest as a possible field gun (black bear/cougar country only)

I tend to not use grip tape on my carry guns because I don't like how it interacts with my clothing. I also can't seem to find grip tape that will stay on the gun and not wrinkle or peel off from grip pressure.

[L-2]

I'm considering getting a G19Gen5, just to have. I don't need it; I just want it.
I've already got a G19Gen3 and a G19Gen4. Multiples can be budgeted; just do it.

If replacing an existing G19Gen2, I never recommend giving up something which is working fine without thoroughly vetting the possible replacement. I do recommend having a spare or two. Shoot 3,000 rounds less of 9mm during a year and it'll pay for that new G19Gen5.

Each Glock may shoot differently. Overall, I'm hearing the a Gen5 will generally be mechanically more accurate than a Gen2, which can be considered either real or academic. I know folks who only practice at 7 yards (the shortest pre-set distance at one of the ranges) and might occasionally try 10 yards. I suspect one of these persons won't notice much practical difference between a Gen2 and Gen5 G19 in this casual range practice.

The ability of a weapon mounted light (WML) on a G19Gen3-5 (vs. none on a G19Gen2) has already been mentioned, but you already have a G17Gen4 should you ever decide to try out a WML.

Depending on one's existing Gen2 holster, a Gen5 may or may not fit; again, due to having a rail on the Gen5 and the slide stop on the right side. Does the shooter need a reversible mag catch? Does the shooter need an ambi slide-stop? Your G17Gen4 already has the reversible mag catch, but not an ambi slide-stop, if you need one.

A G19Gen2 is/will be getting rare as they're no longer made. If it's working and in good shape, keep it.

GRIP TAPE QUESTION.
I've used the DecalGrip http://decalgrip.com/index.html products. The main side panels are all that I use as the other little pieces don't last long with me and peel off. There's a rubber version which I find harder on my hand/skin than the sandpaper version. On some of my Gen3 Glocks I've got one or the other or none on them.

[psalms144.1]

I agree with L2 in NOT trading in your 2nd Gen on a Gen5 - save your shekels until you can get the new pistol. Then you can retire your old warhorse to the "backup" shelf in the safe.

Of all the "new" Glocks coming to light, I think the Gen5 is your best bet. The "M"s aren't being sold to the public (and they're really just Gen5s with some special sauce on the internals). The MHS Glocks will have G17 grip length - which might not make you happy from a concealment perspective. And the G46 - who knows when/if we'll ever see it on this side of the pond. It's SUCH a radical departure, unless a major contract calls for it, I don't see GLOCK churning them out to the public.

From what we're hearing, the Gen5 trigger and accuracy are noticeably better than older generations, and I can't imagine anyone buying a Glock looking for less accuracy and a crappier trigger...

[blues]

From what we're hearing, the Gen5 trigger and accuracy are noticeably better than older generations, and I can't imagine anyone buying a Glock looking for less accuracy and a crappier trigger...

Ever the optimist...:cool:

[Lester Polfus]

When it comes to the 9mm Glock, the only big improvements I've seen have been when they went from Gen 2 to Gen 3 and I could easily hang a light under the dust cover. You've said that isn't important to you.

I haven't handled a Gen 5. I can sit down with a Gen 2, Gen 3, and Gen 4 Glock 17 or 19 and tell myself I can feel or see differences in how I shoot the various generations, but once I put myself on a timer and start shooting things like The Bill Drill, El Presidente, FAST Drill, and etc, there is no functional difference in my performance with any of the guns. I know this because I've done it more than once.

If I shoot a statistically significant number of groups, off a bench, and break out the calipers, the Gen 4 guns are slightly more accurate for me, but I don't think it makes a bit of real world difference.

If I were in your shoes I wouldn't trade your Gen 2. It is a known quantity. My only concern is that at some point (after tens of thousands of rounds) I'd want to consider putting it in ready reserve status. Even then, I wouldn't trade it off, but would throw pocket money in my sock drawer until I had enough for a new one.

The biggest difference I've seen among the generations is with the Glock 20, but that's not germane to your question.

[MSparks909]

I can tell a generational difference between my Glocks when I shoot them. Shooting my Gen 2 side by side with my Gen 4 and Gen 5 19 highlights differences in recoil and accuracy. The Gen 4/5 guns have a softer impulse than the Gen 2. It's not earth shattering but it's there. I had to drop a Wilson barrel in my Gen 2 to get it grouping as well as my stock Gen 4/5s. Part durability is also improved. Go figure, my Gen 2 with the fabled "machined" extractor gives me occasional BTF. My Gen 5s don't. Both of my Gen 4s needed Apex extractors to work properly.

If it won't hurt you financially to pick up a newer Glock then I'd consider it. I'm offloading my Gen 2 19 soon. My Gen 4s and Gen 5s do everything that my Gen 2 does...they just do it better.

[Greg]

To solidify my curmudgeon status, my 6 month old Gen4 19 has yet to bump my Gen3 out of carry duty. I've shot them both back to back, multiple drills, with a shot timer.

I even shot my Gen2 19 in a couple matches in 2016 just for kicks. It's just a 9mm - recoil impulse is puny in any pistol.

[JonInWA]

I'd trade off a earlier-than-Gen4 Glock chambered in .40, 10mm or .357 SIG in a heartbeat for a Gen4 or Gen5; the newer guns are (finally) adequately configured for the vicissitudes of those chamberings, and I believe will have increased durability because of the improvements. And improved grip textures, magazine releases, etc.

Otherwise, I'd have to be very, very convinced that there were indeed cogent and demonstratively quantifiable increases in performance/durability/reliability to be derived from moving from one of my proven Gen 3s to a newer Gen4 or Gen5. My personal Gen 3 G17, G19, G21 and G34 have thousands of trouble-free rounds through them in various venues. With Glocks (and most other firearms) it definitely makes sense for "someone else" to be the beta-tester/manufacturer's QC for the first year of so after a product release.

Doesn't necessarily mean, for example, that I wouldn't get a Gen5 G17, just that my proven, exemplary functioning and quite accurate Gen 3 G17 isn't about to go anywhere.

Best, Jon

[Lester Polfus]

I'd trade off a earlier-than-Gen4 Glock chambered in .40, 10mm or .357 SIG in a heartbeat for a Gen4 or Gen5; the newer guns are (finally) adequately configured for the vicissitudes of those chamberings, and I believe will have increased durability because of the improvements. And improved grip textures, magazine releases, etc.

Otherwise, I'd have to be very, very convinced that there were indeed cogent and demonstratively quantifiable increases in performance/durability/reliability to be derived from moving from one of my proven Gen 3s to a newer Gen4 or Gen5. My personal Gen 3 G17, G19, G21 and G34 have thousands of trouble-free rounds through them in various venues. With Glocks (and most other firearms) it definitely makes sense for "someone else" to be the beta-tester/manufacturer's QC for the first year of so after a product release.

Doesn't necessarily mean, for example, that I wouldn't get a Gen5 G17, just that my proven, exemplary functioning and quite accurate Gen 3 G17 isn't about to go anywhere.

Best, Jon

I know we have a "like" button, but can we get a "That's what I was trying to say, but you said it much better than me" button?

[JHC]

And now you can buy new, the grippiest Glock grip ever, new RTF2s: http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2017/09/28/glock-limited-time-offer-gen3-pistols-rtf2-grips-scalloped-slide-serrations/

What Hackathorn said were the best Glocks ever made (said to me at least when he noticed my RTF2 G17 in a class). Now he has written the Gen 5's are flat out awesome and the best Glocks ever.

[Nephrology]

i like my Gen 4 and Gen 3 pistols. They haven't been entirely problem free - mostly BTF - but they shoot and shoot more accuratley than I can.

I definitely feel the Gen 4 pistols - especially the 19s - shoot better for me than the 3rd gen guns. However, when I tried to put it on a timer, I found that I shoot Glock 19s better than Glock 17s, and the difference between the 3rd and 4th gen guns of the same model was exactly zilch.

So I'll repeat what everyone else already said - keep your old gun. Buy a new one if you want it - but don't expect it to do much your current glocks don't.


And now you can buy new, the grippiest Glock grip ever, new RTF2s: http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2017/09/28/glock-limited-time-offer-gen3-pistols-rtf2-grips-scalloped-slide-serrations/

What Hackathorn said were the best Glocks ever made (said to me at least when he noticed my RTF2 G17 in a class). Now he has written the Gen 5's are flat out awesome and the best Glocks ever.

I do really love the Gen3 RTF - I have the model 17.

Now you're making me look at the gen 5 guns... maybe next year :)

[JHC]

i like my Gen 4 and Gen 3 pistols. They haven't been entirely problem free - mostly BTF - but they shoot and shoot more accuratley than I can.

I definitely feel the Gen 4 pistols - especially the 19s - shoot better for me than the 3rd gen guns. However, when I tried to put it on a timer, I found that I shoot Glock 19s better than Glock 17s, and the difference between the 3rd and 4th gen guns of the same model was exactly zilch.

So I'll repeat what everyone else already said - keep your old gun. Buy a new one if you want it - but don't expect it to do much your current glocks don't.



I do really love the Gen3 RTF - I have the model 17.

Now you're making me look at the gen 5 guns... maybe next year :)

Gen 5's will be around a long time and probably get even better; new models added . . .

But RTF2's? oooooooh, a historic design requested by certain units for improved grip with gloves in order faceshoot jihadis. That's some cachet man. ;)

Now that I have some round count built up on my RTF2 17 and 19 (19 thanks to Gabe's class) the still awesome grip is more livable under light fabrics than when new.

[Coal Train]

And now you can buy new, the grippiest Glock grip ever, new RTF2s: http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2017/09/28/glock-limited-time-offer-gen3-pistols-rtf2-grips-scalloped-slide-serrations/
I wonder why the 19 model doesn't come with fish gills?

[JonInWA]

And now you can buy new, the grippiest Glock grip ever, new RTF2s: http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2017/09/28/glock-limited-time-offer-gen3-pistols-rtf2-grips-scalloped-slide-serrations/

What Hackathorn said were the best Glocks ever made (said to me at least when he noticed my RTF2 G17 in a class). Now he has written the Gen 5's are flat out awesome and the best Glocks ever.

I don't care how spiffy it looks, or who touts it, unless you're only planning on putting a limited amount or rounds through it, or want it as a collector item, I'd suggest giving pretty much any Gen 3 (or Gen 2) G22 a pass-there are simply too many well-established issues, including limited longevity that attach to them. Despite some forum disagreement by well-established forum members here (at least pertaining to Gen4 G22s), if you want/must have a .40 Glock, I strongly recommend only a Gen4 or Gen5 G22.

The RTF2 is an extremely grippy texture. Let me repeat: It's an extremely grippy texture. My understanding is that it was designed if not primarily, significantly around users firing it while wearing tactical gloves-i.e., Tier One unit operators, SWAT, et al. The grip texture goes higher on the receiver frame than other Glock textures do, so the thumb areas are covered. When you're hand is locked down on them, it's very effective against slippage.

However, conversely, my understanding is that unless you sand down the spikes a bit, they're also preclusive of hand and finger shifting, which isn't necessarily a good thing in a dynamic shooting environment when some manipulations require an ability to shift the gun expeditiously. They also reportedly are extremely aggressive in chewing up clothing that comes into constant contact against them.

My personal thought is that the Gen4/Gen5 polymid texture is a better solution, providing both general grippiness while also facilitating hand movements and adjustments.

So if your normal daily duty has significant portions of time involving tactical nomex glove wear, great-RTF2 may be your huckleberry. If not, keep in mind what Larry and Ken's backgrounded use with them is/was, and then make an informed decision as to it's applicability to you and your likely situational use. I suggest that probably for most, if increased grippiness is required on a Gen 3 (or earlier) Glock, an effective, inexpensive and less intrusive solution would simply be to cut a segment of a mountain bike innertube and slip it on the grip. Some forum members also recommend some of the decal-type grip appliques. Both are dirt-cheap, easily applied, and non-permanent, should truth/situations/experience change...

We've got a pretty highly experienced body of users here on p-f that can provide some balanced objective/subjective input. Another think to keep in mind is to keep a skeptical mind regarding the current potential motivations and affiliations of certain advocates of certain systems/platforms/brands/ items of kit. I know that we'd prefer to think that because of where they've been or what they've gone through there's a mystical objective brotherhood that transcends manufacturer branding allegiance or paid endorsement/royalty gigs, but I suggest some healthy skepticism is in order.

Best, Jon

[blues]

Another thing to keep in mind is to keep a skeptical mind regarding the current potential motivations and affiliations of certain advocates of certain systems/platforms/brands/ items of kit. I know that we'd prefer to think that because of where they've been or what they've gone through there's a mystical objective brotherhood that transcends manufacturer branding allegiance or paid endorsement/royalty gigs, but I suggest some healthy skepticism is in order.

Best, Jon

What? Say it isn't so!

Seriously though...good points and worth remembering.

[JHC]

I don't care how spiffy it looks, or who touts it, unless you're only planning on putting a limited amount or rounds through it, or want it as a collector item, I'd suggest giving pretty much any Gen 3 (or Gen 2) G22 a pass-there are simply too many well-established issues, including limited longevity that attach to them. Despite some forum disagreement by well-established forum members here (at least pertaining to Gen4 G22s), if you want/must have a .40 Glock, I strongly recommend only a Gen4 or Gen5 G22.

The RTF2 is an extremely grippy texture. Let me repeat: It's an extremely grippy texture. My understanding is that it was designed if not primarily, significantly around users firing it while wearing tactical gloves-i.e., Tier One unit operators, SWAT, et al. The grip texture goes higher on the receiver frame than other Glock textures do, so the thumb areas are covered. When you're hand is locked down on them, it's very effective against slippage.

However, conversely, my understanding is that unless you sand down the spikes a bit, they're also preclusive of hand and finger shifting, which isn't necessarily a good thing in a dynamic shooting environment when some manipulations require an ability to shift the gun expeditiously. They also reportedly are extremely aggressive in chewing up clothing that comes into constant contact against them.

My personal thought is that the Gen4/Gen5 polymid texture is a better solution, providing both general grippiness while also facilitating hand movements and adjustments.

So if your normal daily duty has significant portions of time involving tactical nomex glove wear, great-RTF2 may be your huckleberry. If not, keep in mind what Larry and Ken's backgrounded use with them is/was, and then make an informed decision as to it's applicability to you and your likely situational use. I suggest that probably for most, if increased grippiness is required on a Gen 3 (or earlier) Glock, an effective, inexpensive and less intrusive solution would simply be to cut a segment of a mountain bike innertube and slip it on the grip. Some forum members also recommend some of the decal-type grip appliques. Both are dirt-cheap, easily applied, and non-permanent, should truth/situations/experience change...

We've got a pretty highly experienced body of users here on p-f that can provide some balanced objective/subjective input. Another think to keep in mind is to keep a skeptical mind regarding the current potential motivations and affiliations of certain advocates of certain systems/platforms/brands/ items of kit. I know that we'd prefer to think that because of where they've been or what they've gone through there's a mystical objective brotherhood that transcends manufacturer branding allegiance or paid endorsement/royalty gigs, but I suggest some healthy skepticism is in order.

Best, Jon

The 18K I have through RTF2 guns without gloves leads me to prefer it to all others. Gun manipulations like reloads or changing hands were never an issue.

I'd love to see RTF2 Gen 4 or 5 but not likely.

Clothes are tricky when they're fresh. Cotton cover shirt was never a problem but microfiber shirts were dicey. But with 12K on one and 6K on the other, that's resolved

[Bucky]

I have enough Glocks for now. I'm going to wait for the Gen 6, then I won't buy another until the Gen 9 is available. The problem is, I only have enough room on the shelf in my gun safe for one more gun. I figure with these two, I can place them closely together, facing opposing directions, and they should fit just fine. :rolleyes:

[JonInWA]

JHC,what are your thoughts/experiences in comparing RTF2 with Gen4/Gen5?

Best, Jon

[JHC]

JHC,what are your thoughts/experiences in comparing RTF2 with Gen4/Gen5?

Best, Jon

Love then both. I think the teensy bit smaller Gen 4 grip improves my SHO + WHO hits, and the Gen 4 mag release better. For locking in my grip on strings of fire I like RTF2 more. Especially in very hot weather.

But very happy with either.

If I am to carry against bare skin, Gen 4 by a mile! I'm not man enough to carry RTF2 against bare skin. :D

[Bigghoss]

I have a few 3rd gens including a 19, a 4th gen 19 and a 2nd gen G22 but I've only fondled a gen 5 briefly at the store. The 4th gens offer enough improvement in my mind that I'm selling my 2nd gen G22 and my 3rd gen G21sf to get used 4th gens. It's not really enough difference to fret over, I just happened to find some deals on newer versions of guns I had (just for the sake of having I should add) and decided to upgrade. Grab another G19 in whatever gen you find a good deal on so you have a spare and rock on. For what it's worth Gen 4 polices trade-ins are popping up. G22's are ~350 and G17's are ~$400. Maybe some 19's will hit the market soon.

[GCBHM]

Just to answer your question in short, no. If you're pleased with your Gen 2, then there is no reason to get any of the newer versions unless you just want to. I have owned and shot all generations of Glock 19s now, and they all pretty much shoot the same to me. The primary difference in the Gen 5 is the updated trigger and slide lock springs. They're compressed in the Gen 5, where as the trigger spring in the previous gens are elongated, and the slide lock spring is a leaf spring. It is generally recommended to change these springs, along with the RSA, every 5000 rounds. With the Gen 5 all you need to replace every 5000 is the RSA b/c they other two springs are now essentially impervious to breakage. Outside that, and the other minor changes, it's still a Glock, and that's a good thing. Nothing wrong with any of the previous generations.

[Coal Train]

And now you can buy new, the grippiest Glock grip ever, new RTF2s: http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2017/09/28/glock-limited-time-offer-gen3-pistols-rtf2-grips-scalloped-slide-serrations/
If anyone is interested, the new production RFF2 17, 19, and 22s are starting to show up at several online retailers.

[Bigghoss]

For anyone interested, brand new G19 gen 3 for $425 with free shipping.

http://www.combatarmory.com/new-glock-g19-g3-handgun-9mm-w-2-15-round-magazines-free-shipping/

[Palisut]

At this point, I have 6 G19s: 2xGen2, 2xGen3, 1xGen4, and 1xGen5. If I could only keep one, it'd be the Gen5. I love the grip texture and lack of finger grooves, and it shoots better for me than any of the others. Once it's vetted with around 2k rounds, I will be carrying it exclusively (off duty). Well worth the money I (over)paid.

[FNFAN]

The problem is, I only have enough room on the shelf in my gun safe for one more gun. I figure with these two, I can place them closely together, facing opposing directions, and they should fit just fine. :rolleyes:

20869
:cool:

[Bucky]

20869
:cool:

Interesting. Though, it is tricky to sneak in a subtle 69 joke these days. :p