What do you think of this Model 10?

[BehindBlueI's]

https://s3.amazonaws.com/mgm-content/sites/armslist/uploads/posts/2017/09/12/7315270_01_smith_wesson_38_spl_snub_nose_640.jpg

Listed on Armslist locally for $285 as a nickel "Victory" model. That's not a factory length, is it? I've not contacted the guy yet, but considering asking for more info.

[RevolverRob]

Definitely a chopped barrel, the ejector rod would have been shortened or the barrel would be slightly longer, here you can basically see they are flush with each other. The front sight is also wrong.

My guess is it is a post-war M10, not a "Victory" model, but since the barrel has been cut the grips are probably non-original too.

That said, I've seen a few chopped up guns I wouldn't mind having. I'd check the crown. A lot of chopped up guns haven't been re-crowned after cutting or if they are re-crowned, haven't been crowned flush. If it hasn't been re-crowned or the re-crown is crooked, you'll be looking at having it re-crowned, re-barreled, or buying the tools and doing it yourself (not a really a job for a first-timer to be honest).

Aside from that, check the lock-up, and the trigger to determine if it's been futzed with internally.

The chrome-job/nickel looks post-barrel cut so you might get lucky and get one that was done properly.

ETA: No actually, I take it back. I bet it is a Pre-M10 "Victory" model. The barrel is non-factory, but the trigger guard screw is present (eliminated m10-4), the screw under the cylinder release is present, and the hammer looks like a Victory hammer.

[BN]

Make sure it isn't one of the ones that were originally chambered in 38 S&W and has been re-chambered to 38 Special.

I would probably pass and look for a better specimen if I wanted a shooter.

[BN]

Double tap. :(

[Willard]

I'd steer well clear. It appears to have been chopped behind the portion of the barrel where the locking bolt fits into the end of the ejector rod. You have one less point of lock up and I can't imagine that is good. Plus anyone who would do this might do no telling what else.

[okie john]

Smith made a few Victory models with two-inch barrels, but only a few.

That barrel has definitely been cut--no Smith barrels were ever shorter than the ejector rod of the gun on which they were mounted, and I believe that all of them had some kind of lug at the end to engage and protect the ejector rod. A Victory will have "Made in USA" stamped on the right side of the frame, and there should also be a hole in the butt for a lanyard loop.

It's probably not a bad shooter for the price mentioned.

Before you buy, just make sure that it's actually a 38 Special and not a 38 S&W. The Brits got some of those...


Okie John

[scott]

It's definitely either a victory model or pre-war that's been cut and refinished. 2 inch victory models exist, but they're rare, and this isn't one. Unless it's a 1945 gun, they're not as drop safe as later smiths.
I'd probably pass. Unless you need a beater for something, you're competent to check out the work that's been done, and you think you can get it for closer to 200; then you could do worse, I guess.

[BehindBlueI's]

Make sure it isn't one of the ones that were originally chambered in 38 S&W and has been re-chambered to 38 Special.


How would I tell?

[BehindBlueI's]

you're competent to check out the work that's been done

I'm definitely not, which is why I'm asking for input now. :)

[pangloss]

I may be confused, but I think my best friend's dad had a Victory model S&W revolver when we were growing up. However, my memory of it is that it was a larger frame pistol than a Model 10. Regardless, the barrel had been cut down and it was chromed. That specific revolver was awful. At ~10 yards, the point of impact would be feet off from the point of aim. It took decades to convince his dad to sell the pistol. It was still awful when he sold it, so this was not a case of kids that just couldn't shoot. Anyway, definitely give the Armslist revolver some extra scrutiny.

[Malamute]

How would I tell?

If you can get the gun in hand to look at it, the 38 S&W is about the length of a 9mm, but slightly fatter than 38 spl. Looking in the chambers, theres an obvious step where the 38 S&W chamber ended, then another step where the 38 special rechamber ended.

If you cant get to it in person, see if he will take a clear picture of the chambers.

Found a picture, it shows it pretty well once you know what to look for.

http://www.fototime.com/F07416FB0193628/standard.jpg

[BN]

How would I tell?

Look at the caliber stamping on the side of the barrel. It should say 38 S&W Special CTG or something like that. Because the barrel has been chopped, part of that will probably be missing.

Info here: http://smith-wessonforum.com/s-w-hand-ejectors-1896-1961/326457-identify-your-gun.html

Lots of hacked up guns out there. This is probably one of them. :(

[scott]

If you can get the gun in hand to look at it, the 38 S&W is about the length of a 9mm, but slightly fatter than 38 spl. Looking in the chambers, theres an obvious step where the 38 S&W chamber ended, then another step where the 38 special rechamber ended.

If you cant get to it in person, see if he will take a clear picture of the chambers.

It will also be marked "38 S&W CTG". If it's marked "38 S&W Special CTG" you're good to go.

ETA: Beaten to it. And I'm an idiot; didn't think about the chopped barrel. Might not be useful.

[farscott]

If it "was" a Victory model, the serial number starts with a "V". As noted by others, the barrel looks to have been cutback, the front sight is not factory, and the grips are not what shipped on a Victory. The lanyard loop is also missing.

Is it worth $285? Depends on what is locking the cylinder pin at the front of the barrel. If nothing, the gun is not safe to shoot as the gun could easily unlock. If the finish could be stripped from the parts and the action did not cross Bubba's bench, it might be worth $285 as the action parts are valuable.

[Malamute]

The barrel may have been changed to a 38 spl one, id take it all into consideration, barrel and chambers.

Barrels turn up pretty cheap on gunbroker if you wanted to get a better barrel, and of course have been available from a number of sources in the pre-internet days.

I think its probably safe to shoot, but definitely sub-optimal.

[BehindBlueI's]

Look at the caliber stamping on the side of the barrel. It should say 38 S&W Special CTG or something like that. Because the barrel has been chopped, part of that will probably be missing.

Info here: http://smith-wessonforum.com/s-w-hand-ejectors-1896-1961/326457-identify-your-gun.html

Lots of hacked up guns out there. This is probably one of them. :(

I meant from the frame/cylinder since the barrel may not be original, but Malamute addressed it.

This is starting to look like a lot of potential issues, glad I asked here what to look for.

[Malamute]

If you could get into it cheap enough and it wasnt a rechamber, it may be worth messing with. Barrels can be had in the $35 range. You could probably get it changed if you are handy, like get the correct longer barrel, or a good 2" with correct extractor rod.

if you have a link to the sale or more pics, send it to me and I'll see if I can tell any more about it.

[BehindBlueI's]

Here's the response for s/n and numbers on the frame under the crane:

4856?? and 335?? under crane

http://www.armslist.com/posts/7315270/indianiapolis-indiana-handguns-for-sale-trade--smith---wesson--38-snub-nose-

is the ad

[farscott]

Here's the response for s/n and numbers on the frame under the crane:

4856?? and 335?? under crane

Those sound like assembly numbers, not serial numbers. There should be serial numbers on the bottom of the grip frame and the ratchet side of the cylinder. Also on the barrel flat when the cylinder is swung out to the open position.

I would also ask for a photo of the right side of the frame. The rollmarks will help narrow down the gun. Right now, it is either a five-screw or a four-screw as we can see the screw for the cylinder stop in the trigger guard.

[farscott]

Here's the response for s/n and numbers on the frame under the crane:

4856?? and 335?? under crane

http://www.armslist.com/posts/7315270/indianiapolis-indiana-handguns-for-sale-trade--smith---wesson--38-snub-nose-

is the ad

The serial number is visible on face of the cylinder in the second picture, but I cannot read it.

[Malamute]

Yes, those numbers arent serial numbers. In that area they were just assembly numbers until the 50s I believe. Ask if theres a hole in the bottom of the grip frame, and exactly what the barrel markings are, or as mentioned, pictures of that side of the gun.

Saw this barrel in a quick look at gunbroker. 4" k frame nickel.

http://www.gunbroker.com/item/695028745

[john c]

What about this revolver appeals to you? One the one hand, with the obvious faults, this pistol appears absurdly overpriced at $285. On the other hand, it is only $285, so if you want a project, go for it.

If needed, you could get a new barrel and cylinder and then have a Pinto victory model. I think it'd look great with a blued cylinder and barrel.

From a shooting perspective, the Victory models did not have transfer bar safeties until very late in production. Without a transfer bar, it's only safe to load 5 in the cylinder.

In order to positively identify the important features, we'd probably need detailed photographs of the markings to determine whether it has a transfer bar and/or whether it was originally a .38 S&W instead of a .38 spl.

Finally, the number on the crane are assembly numbers. The serial number is on the butt only in this model.

Is this gun local? If not, there is no way I'd consider buying it. If the timing is bad or the there's a lot of endshake, this pistol is a lemon. Then again, it's only $285.....

[Malamute]

Its encouraging that the hammer, trigger and extractor star arent nickeled. That indicates its factory. Nearly all aftermarket nickel jobs plate those parts.

Edit: ^^^ I think you meant hammer block, rather than transfer bar.

The serial is on the back of the cylinder, under the extractor star, and probably on the bottom of the barrel also under the extractor rod.

[BehindBlueI's]

What about this revolver appeals to you? One the one hand, with the obvious faults, this pistol appears absurdly overpriced at $285. On the other hand, it is only $285, so if you want a project, go for it.

If needed, you could get a new barrel and cylinder and then have a Pinto victory model. I think it'd look great with a blued cylinder and barrel.

From a shooting perspective, the Victory models did not have transfer bar safeties until very late in production. Without a transfer bar, it's only safe to load 5 in the cylinder.

In order to positively identify the important features, we'd probably need detailed photographs of the markings to determine whether it has a transfer bar and/or whether it was originally a .38 S&W instead of a .38 spl.

Finally, the number on the crane are assembly numbers. The serial number is on the butt only in this model.

Is this gun local? If not, there is no way I'd consider buying it. If the timing is bad or the there's a lot of endshake, this pistol is a lemon. Then again, it's only $285.....

Err...it looks kinda neat?

Really, I have no use for it. I just thought it looked kind of neat, maybe for pirate carry (outside the waist band appendix, preferably in a sash, because WTF not?)

It's local.

[BehindBlueI's]

Here's the response for s/n and numbers on the frame under the crane:

4856?? and 335?? under crane

http://www.armslist.com/posts/7315270/indianiapolis-indiana-handguns-for-sale-trade--smith---wesson--38-snub-nose-

is the ad

Ok, he said there's a "V" in front of the 4856. Also said there's a step in the cylinder, so that pretty much kills the interest for me. Thanks for everyone's input.

[serialsolver]

The big question is what is the caliber. I would look for British property marks or take a dummy 38 special round to check the chambers. Since the front lock is missing it wound need a ball detente lock up on the yoke. That's not a big deal to install. If I had the coin I would give it a serious look and I don't like nickel guns. Hope this helps.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Malamute]

Ok, he said there's a "V" in front of the 4856. Also said there's a step in the cylinder, so that pretty much kills the interest for me. Thanks for everyone's input.

I wonder if hes seeing the normal 38 special chamber step or the double step of a rechambered cylinder?

The US used some of the 38 S&W caliber guns. Not all went to England.

[Willard]

BB,

I already posted, but wanted to follow up, since I thought maybe I didn't express it clearly. This part seems to be missing, so you're down one point of lock up:

20105

You maybe already got it from the first post and are ok with that, but I wanted to exercise due diligence so you didn't get stuck with a problem. Good luck with it either way.