That moment when you realize there's at least two Americas

[LittleLebowski]

I was reading this article (http://abc7ny.com/2041987/) about New Jersey 8th grade students refusing to have their picture taken with Speak Ryan and got linked to the public Facebook page (https://www.facebook.com/emalespina) of the mother of one of the children. Perusing her thoughts is alien, insane, pathetic, and sort of frightening for me. She's a school librarian who's putting up signs saying that her library is welcoming and a safe place for diverse students. She's convinced she's fighting the forces of evil with such actions. Not a single word about women's rights in Islamic countries, the political crackdown in Turkey, the rape epidemic in India, etc.

It's just insane.

https://media.giphy.com/media/p8Uw3hzdAE2dO/giphy.gif

[blues]

I understand that the library also has an impressive media wing where you can actually access the webz or get your marching orders from higher alien life forms...

17003

[Jeep]

You're absolutely right that there are at least two Americas. This woman has probably lived in a left-wing bubble all her life (or at least since she went to college), and as a member of NJ's extremely powerful teachers' union she is unlikely to ever escape that bubble. The chance she knows anything useful about foreign events is low, and the chance that she would criticize anything "Islamic" is lower. After all, in her world "Islamic" = Good; America = Bad.

The fact that America would turn into Venezuela if she and her friends had their way means nothing to her, since she is unlikely to know about Venezuela's collapse. Indeed, she is unlikely to know that socialism has failed everywhere it has been tried. All she knows is that America is a horrible, racist, sexist, etc. etc. place, and that Republicans keep voting against the huge raises that the public school employees of New Jersey (such as herself) so badly deserve.

[Robinson]

Yep, sometimes I'm just at a loss.

There are still a lot of Americans who don't think like the idiot you posted about. I think. But sadly our institutions of learning seem to be filled with them, and they definitely influence the thinking of our younger generations.

[Tamara]

That moment when you realize there's at least two Americas

There're at least two Americas, and the one I'm in is big on subject/verb agreement. :D :p

[Peally]

Jeep's right, it's just what happens when people live in a detached bubble their entire lives. It's a sign that the saltier side of America is doing good work, and it's a bizarre side effect as well.

[Jeep]

There're at least two Americas, and the one I'm in is big on subject/verb agreement. :D :p

Subject/verb agreement are way overrated.

[LittleLebowski]

There're at least two Americas, and the one I'm in is big on subject/verb agreement. :D :p

NOBODY expects the Grammat Nazis!

[Duelist]

Teacher, and School Counseling master's student here.

It's sometimes hard for me to hear about all the levels of acceptance and so forth that my profession is supposed to embrace, and even harder to see what some of us do embrace because they're told they're supposed to.

On the other hand, it is sometimes very hard for me to accept the condemnation we get among the community that trusts us with their children for wishing they compensated us as much as it does the guys it trusts with their plumbing.

[Jeep]

Teacher, and School Counseling master's student here.

It's sometimes hard for me to hear about all the levels of acceptance and so forth that my profession is supposed to embrace, and even harder to see what some of us do embrace because they're told they're supposed to.

On the other hand, it is sometimes very hard for me to accept the condemnation we get among the community that trusts us with their children for wishing they compensated us as much as it does the guys it trusts with their plumbing.

If you check, you will find that teachers in New Jersey are some of the highest compensated teachers in the United States, and their pension plan is extraordinarily good. Overall, they receive far better compensation than the average resident of New Jersey.

As for plumbers, well, without modern plumbing our mortality rate would be far higher. Summer cholera season didn't used to be a lot of fun. But the bigger point, I think, is that markets set wages for people like plumbers. Many more people want to be teachers than plumbers. Among other things, the hours are much better as are the vacations. Indeed, when you throw those in, and realize that most privately employed plumbers don't get pensions, my guess is that many plumbers in fact don't do as well as teachers in places like New Jersey.

In other states, teachers pay is significantly lower, but that often seems directly related to a lower standard of living.

And, of course, the other factor weighing in, especially these days, is the enormous number of highly paid people who work for school districts who never appear to actually enter a school building as we grow an ever larger bureaucracy to manage the crazy quilt of government education programs.

[rob_s]

Jeep's right, it's just what happens when people live in a detached bubble their entire lives. It's a sign that the saltier side of America is doing good work, and it's a bizarre side effect as well.

Prior to the internet, pretty much everyone lived in a detached bubble. Especially those that didn't think they did, or currently don't think they do.

Personally, I work harder and harder every day to further detach myself and thicken my bubble. I'm finally realizing, after nearly 43 years on the planet, that I simply just don't give a shit what someone else thinks, to include news media, politicians, leftists, rightists, and whatever other -ists there might be today.

There's basically like 5 old rich white dudes running the planet, and you've never heard their names and don't know who they are, and never will, and anyone outside those dudes just really doesn't matter, and those dudes know you don't matter, but are more than happy for you to spin your wheels worrying that some librarian put some sign up in their library that you think is offensive.

[CCT125US]

Prior to the internet, pretty much everyone lived in a detached bubble. Especially those that didn't think they did, or currently don't think they do.

Personally, I work harder and harder every day to further detach myself and thicken my bubble. I'm finally realizing, after nearly 43 years on the planet, that I simply just don't give a shit what someone else thinks, to include news media, politicians, leftists, rightists, and whatever other -ists there might be today.

There's basically like 5 old rich white dudes running the planet, and you've never heard their names and don't know who they are, and never will, and anyone outside those dudes just really doesn't matter, and those dudes know you don't matter, but are more than happy for you to spin your wheels worrying that some librarian put some sign up in their library that you think is offensive.

Well F me sideways, I agree with a solid 60 percent of this.....

[Totem Polar]

There's basically like 5 old rich white dudes running the planet, and you've never heard their names and don't know who they are, and never will...

Can you tell those 5 guys to get their shit together and quit fucking around for me, then?
:D

[voodoo_man]

Special snowflakes should be ignored completely and never engaged. They want to feel special and like their are doing something.

[Hambo]

There're at least two Americas, and the one I'm in is big on subject/verb agreement. :D :p

English speakers who understand English grammar = minority group. ;)

[blues]

English speakers who understand English grammar = minority group. ;)

Nobody sed there wuz gonna be grammer. (Naw spelin' nether)

[OlongJohnson]

It's been broken down into eleven. Pretty amazing explanation of how we got to be this way.

https://www.amazon.com/American-Nations-History-Regional-Cultures/dp/0143122029

[Duces Tecum]

Teacher, and School Counseling master's student here. On the other hand, it is sometimes very hard for me to accept the condemnation we get among the community that trusts us with their children for wishing they compensated us as much as it does the guys it trusts with their plumbing.

Rather than complain about the value the public sees in the profession you chose, couldn't you simply learn to plumb?

[txdpd]

Rather than complain about the value the public sees in the profession you chose, couldn't you simply learn to plumb?

Which I find ironic, since the elites of higher education have put a lot effort into making trades and skilled labor seem like undesirable career fields. Everybody shits and it's got to go somewhere.....you can't outsource plumbers to China. There's a substantial shortage of plumbers in this country, it's tremendously hard work and not many people want to do it.

That's just how I see things from my own little bubble.

[Duelist]

Rather than complain about the value the public sees in the profession you chose, couldn't you simply learn to plumb?
:p

I was a soldier. When I got done with that, I was hired by the government to teach new soldiers. When I got done with that, teaching in schools seemed like a natural transition to an interesting, rewarding field. And it is.

When I'm advising students on careers, trades are among the first things we talk about.

I live in Arizona. We don't quite get paid like they do in New Jersey. But we get to live in AZ.

[Wobblie]

I'm stunned by the incredible lack of respect shown by those students, and by extension, the parents.

[RevolverRob]

Prior to the internet, pretty much everyone lived in a detached bubble. Especially those that didn't think they did, or currently don't think they do.

Personally, I work harder and harder every day to further detach myself and thicken my bubble. I'm finally realizing, after nearly 43 years on the planet, that I simply just don't give a shit what someone else thinks, to include news media, politicians, leftists, rightists, and whatever other -ists there might be today.

There's basically like 5 old rich white dudes running the planet, and you've never heard their names and don't know who they are, and never will, and anyone outside those dudes just really doesn't matter, and those dudes know you don't matter, but are more than happy for you to spin your wheels worrying that some librarian put some sign up in their library that you think is offensive.

Well...I'll be dipped, but Rob_S is hitting it out of the ballpark today.


Rather than complain about the value the public sees in the profession you chose, couldn't you simply learn to plumb?

If everyone becomes a plumber, no one will be around to teach people how to shit in a toilet. Or shit on politicians. Or speak, or read, or write, or do basic arithmetic. For all our bitchin', moanin', and belly-achin' about the nature of education in this country...It is a DAMN SIGHT better than it used to be. Illiteracy rates are in the toilet and "shit for brains" is now just a euphemism where it used to have some disturbingly literal implications.

The point being, we can't all be plumbers, or AC contractors, or factory workers, or school bus drivers, or teachers for that matter. We have a really nice America (or two or twelve or whatever number it is). Where we have indoor, running, water, toilets, air conditioning, book stores, teachers in virtually every classroom, the ability to diagnose and deal with learning disorders, and to keep people free from a number of diseases. We can travel the globe, travel the country, we have infrastructure that simply does not exist in other places. Class hierarchy is a thing in this country and it ain't going away. Plumbers get to charge more money, because they clean up your shit, literally. Teachers make less, but are no less valuable. It's just the reality of our America(s). And last time I checked, DIY stores are pretty common in this country of ours...A teacher can be their own plumber if necessary...Ain't freedom grand?

I mean, you might not want the batshit Librarian to be your plumber, but she could, in theory, learn to do it on her own, by reading a book and watching some Youtube videos. Need I remind you, she can read the books, because she was taught how to read, probably in our public education system? And that Youtube is an American invention? ;)

[RevolverRob]

PS: Because this hits close to home for me lately...If you guys find folks with "radical" ideologies annoying. Just keep pressing them on how much they are willing to fight for those ideologies. Ask someone if they want to give up their toilet, air conditioning, and broadband internet for spotty satellite coverage, shitting in a hole, and 120-degree temperatures to help people in the developing world. Actions speak louder than words. I'll tell you straight up, there aren't a lot of things I'm willing to shit in a hole over. But there are a few, none of them are the garbage most people are "fighting for". People have a tendency to go hide their shame pretty fast when you challenge their convictions and point out the (il)logical limits of their ideologies.

Put another way - Most folks won't even give up 10-pennies of their paycheck to fight for change. Let alone help a legal team construct a strategy or put their career/life on the line to make the world a better place. It's why soldiers and true believers are so dangerous. Those are the people who will give up everything for what they believe. And when push comes to shove, I'd rather have a single soldier and a single true believer as my backup than a thousand vociferous ideologues.

Or as Flagan Sackett said, "There's no stopping a man who knows he's in the right and keeps a-coming."

[SeriousStudent]

Saw this on FB this morning. Perhaps relevant to this duscussion:


https://youtu.be/QJ2fMeer5Mw

There are longer versions of this, but ain't nobody got no time for that!

Prior to this, I never realized that Sam Donaldson was a KGB agent. But now certain events make a great deal more sense.

[Default.mp3]

Prior to the internet, pretty much everyone lived in a detached bubble. Especially those that didn't think they did, or currently don't think they do.I am reminded of this essay, part III to be exact: http://slatestarcodex.com/2014/09/30/i-can-tolerate-anything-except-the-outgroup/

The writer is a resident of this "other America" that many in this thread seem to be up in arms about, but is quite eloquent, IMO, and self-aware.

[Duces Tecum]

For all our bitchin', moanin', and belly-achin' about the nature of education in this country...It is a DAMN SIGHT better than it used to be.

Data source, sir? Eighth grade final examinations from the late 1890's and early 1900's do not support that assertion (google).


. . . "shit for brains" is now just a euphemism where it used to have some disturbingly literal implications.

"Shit for brains", when referring to current high school and college students, appears to be an unwarranted kindness. You may wish to begin your research by browsing for "campus unrest", "safe spaces", and "snowflakes". You will find other links along your journey. As you wander that path, you may wish to consider what young adults of college age were doing during WWII and where they were doing it.


Plumbers get to charge more money, because they clean up your shit, literally. Teachers make less, but are no less valuable.

It may comfort teachers to tell each other that they are as valuable as a plumber, but the data shows education today is inferior to the 1895 standards, while plumbing is superior. If you really believe teachers perform a useful service, you may wish to compare the SAT tests of graduating seniors with those of home schooled youths.

[11B10]

I was reading this article (http://abc7ny.com/2041987/) about New Jersey 8th grade students refusing to have their picture taken with Speak Ryan and got linked to the public Facebook page (https://www.facebook.com/emalespina) of the mother of one of the children. Perusing her thoughts is alien, insane, pathetic, and sort of frightening for me. She's a school librarian who's putting up signs saying that her library is welcoming and a safe place for diverse students. She's convinced she's fighting the forces of evil with such actions. Not a single word about women's rights in Islamic countries, the political crackdown in Turkey, the rape epidemic in India, etc.

It's just insane.

https://media.giphy.com/media/p8Uw3hzdAE2dO/giphy.gif




LL, some day I will figure out how to post links here. Until then, on Police magazine's site, I just read an article about the SF PD and the numbers for "pointing their guns." We've all heard about it before, but I committed the cardinal error of reading the comment (to be fair, it's within the article) from SF's Deputy Public Defender, Chesa Boudin about what this means. What frickin planet did this person grow up on?

[BehindBlueI's]

It's been broken down into eleven. Pretty amazing explanation of how we got to be this way.

https://www.amazon.com/American-Nations-History-Regional-Cultures/dp/0143122029

Added to wishlist, looks interesting.


Data source, sir? Eighth grade final examinations from the late 1890's and early 1900's do not support that assertion (google).


Even if we ignore that my son is learning things in 6th grade that would have been high school freshman material not terribly long ago, and even if we ignore that test scores may not be apples to apples between the eras under discussion, and even if we ignore the question of if test scores are the best measure of "educated"...who was going to school in 1890? Compulsory education wasn't a thing yet. To put it bluntly, the kids dragging down scores today were not in school to be tested in 1890 through the early 1900s.

Same with comparing home schoolers. It'd be more interesting if the studies were controlled for income level and parental involvement. Schools are hamstrung when the parents don't value education, instill discipline, etc.

I understand that public education has issues. So does private education and home school. However even the most cursory of glances shows that compulsory publicly funded education has been a huge boon for economic mobility and raising the quality of life, and one that crosses cultural and national borders. (Exceptions exist of course, primarily colonialism era schools with explicit curriculum to "educate" by destroying indigenous culture)

[Jeep]

LL, some day I will figure out how to post links here. Until then, on Police magazine's site, I just read an article about the SF PD and the numbers for "pointing their guns." We've all heard about it before, but I committed the cardinal error of reading the comment (to be fair, it's within the article) from SF's Deputy Public Defender, Chesa Boudin about what this means. What frickin planet did this person grow up on?

What planet did Chesa Boudin grow up on? Earth, but his parents and foster parents were all communist terrorists (for real), and his father was a for-real cop killer. Here is the Wikipedia entry for Mr. Boudin. As you will see the kid never really had a chance (and what you won't see is how sanitized this entry is--his parents, his foster parents and his grandfather were all hate-America firsters, and all of them loved Castro, the Soviet Union, and the idea that in the "Revolution" they could kill all their political enemies.

"His parents, Kathy Boudin and David Gilbert, were Weather Underground members.[1] When Boudin was 14 months old, his parents were arrested for their role as getaway car drivers[2] in the Brink's robbery of 1981 in Rockland County, New York. His mother was sentenced to 20 years to life[3] and his father to 75 years to life for the felony murders of two police officers and a security guard.[4][5] After his parents were incarcerated, Boudin was raised by "adoptive parents" Bill Ayers and Bernardine Dohrn, who, like his parents, were one-time members of the Weather Underground.[5][6][7] Kathy Boudin was released under parole supervision in 2003.[8]

Boudin descends from a long left-wing lineage. His great-great-uncle, Louis B. Boudin,[9] was a Marxist theoretician and author of a two-volume history of the Supreme Court's influence on American government, and his grandfather, Leonard Boudin, was an attorney who represented controversial clients such as Fidel Castro and Paul Robeson."

[LOKNLOD]

I'm stunned by the incredible lack of respect shown by those students, and by extension, the parents.

My class went to D.C. In the mid 90s, at peak (or is that rock bottom?) Clinton. My dad went as chaperone, and we did all sorts of fun stuff with him, including catching jars of farts in hotel etc etc. (that being probably the least egregious). I even carried the latest copy of Guns and Ammo rolled up in my back pocket on the White House tour.

But you can be damn sure if Bill or any other leaders had met us, we'd have been polite and respectful or there would have been hell to pay.

[RevolverRob]

Data source, sir? Eighth grade final examinations from the late 1890's and early 1900's do not support that assertion (google).

Final examinations of grade 8 are hardly representative of overall educational standards in our country. Particularly when you consider who was educated in 1890 versus 1990. Need I remind you that in 1890, children attending school came from predominantly wealthy, white, families, and were boys? - When you add the compulsory attendance of school children and integration of long-segregated populations (with inferior educational standards). Our NATIONAL level was abysmal in 1959 and even 1969. You can see the long-term results (1969-2012) of the National Assessment of Educational Progress studies for children aged 9, 13, and 17 here - https://www.nationsreportcard.gov/ltt_2012/ - If you look you'll notice most of the increases in our country have come from black, hispanic, and female students. Indicating a considerable race and gender gap that has narrowed considerably over the past 50 years. Not inconsequential given the reality of pre-1969 education.

You can see current efforts at national education assessment here: https://nces.ed.gov/pubs2017/2017144.pdf

Finally, as someone who has studied and worked to develop pedagogical tools, the idea that we somehow achieved teaching perfection in 8th grade in 1890 causes me to express audible mirth. I don't know about you, but my 7-year old nephew can write better software code than I can, and I sometimes write code for a living. Technology, teaching, and the realities of education have changed, but by and large assessment methods have not. Which makes for fundamentally flawed statistical analysis. I could go into even more detail, but I'll spare everyone else here. Suffice to say - you are wrong.



"Shit for brains", when referring to current high school and college students, appears to be an unwarranted kindness. You may wish to begin your research by browsing for "campus unrest", "safe spaces", and "snowflakes". You will find other links along your journey. As you wander that path, you may wish to consider what young adults of college age were doing during WWII and where they were doing it.

What the fuck does this even mean? Maybe you want to go check and see what young adults of college age were doing during Vietnam. This is some hokey ass bullshit. What were black college aged men doing during WW2? Oh right, being experimentally injected with syphilis. If that seems like it isn't relevant, you're right it isn't. Just like your whole shtick here.



It may comfort teachers to tell each other that they are as valuable as a plumber, but the data shows education today is inferior to the 1895 standards, while plumbing is superior. If you really believe teachers perform a useful service, you may wish to compare the SAT tests of graduating seniors with those of home schooled youths.

1) I've worked as a contractor and a teacher. Your inference of inferior is flawed (see above). Plumbing is superior? In the technological sense? I'm confused. Plumbing technology hasn't really changed in 120-years, just the rate at which it has been added into new home construction. I guess you can say low-flow toilets are an improvement...maybe.

2) I was home schooled. I've seen differences and again, you're not going to convince me that the entirety of our educational system is flawed. Does it work perfect? Fuck no. But given that about 85% of the breeding population shouldn't have bred, period. We're doing a damn sight better than could otherwise be.

Why indict a whole field where people are just trying to do their best with minimal resources in an anti-intellectual society? Think about it.

PS: Not normally one for the argument of authority. But do think seriously, before arguing with the guy who literally assesses data, pedagogical effectiveness, and historical trends for his current day job. And who previously worked as a contractor (so understands the value of labor)...

[Default.mp3]

Random thought for the evening: When reading this thread tonight ask yourself, "Should I respond to this or should I go dry fire, reload, deadlift, and/or get an extra hour or two of sleep tonight?"
https://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/duty_calls.png
Source: https://xkcd.com/386/

[RevolverRob]

Random thought for the evening: When reading this thread tonight ask yourself, "Should I respond to this or should I go dry fire, reload, deadlift, and/or get an extra hour or two of sleep tonight?"

Solid point.

But I dryfired, slept in, and went to the gym today. So, this is all I've got man!

Side note, this is why I need to get a dog. I could have spent this time training a dog instead of arguing on the interwebs.

[1slow]

PS: Because this hits close to home for me lately...If you guys find folks with "radical" ideologies annoying. Just keep pressing them on how much they are willing to fight for those ideologies. Ask someone if they want to give up their toilet, air conditioning, and broadband internet for spotty satellite coverage, shitting in a hole, and 120-degree temperatures to help people in the developing world. Actions speak louder than words. I'll tell you straight up, there aren't a lot of things I'm willing to shit in a hole over. But there are a few, none of them are the garbage most people are "fighting for". People have a tendency to go hide their shame pretty fast when you challenge their convictions and point out the (il)logical limits of their ideologies.

Put another way - Most folks won't even give up 10-pennies of their paycheck to fight for change. Let alone help a legal team construct a strategy or put their career/life on the line to make the world a better place. It's why soldiers and true believers are so dangerous. Those are the people who will give up everything for what they believe. And when push comes to shove, I'd rather have a single soldier and a single true believer as my backup than a thousand vociferous ideologues.

Or as Flagan Sackett said, "There's no stopping a man who knows he's in the right and keeps a-coming."

Well said !

[Ed L]

Random thought for the evening: When reading this thread tonight ask yourself, "Should I respond to this or should I go dry fire, reload, deadlift, and/or get an extra hour or two of sleep tonight?"

But that's something that applies to 90% of the things on the Internet.

[Drang]

Random thought for the evening: When reading this thread tonight ask yourself, "Should I respond to this or should I go dry fire, reload, deadlift, and/or get an extra hour or two of sleep tonight?"


Let's just say it's a wonder my ignore list hasn't grown in the last few days...

[okie john]

Here's a little bright spot in the culture wars:

http://college.usatoday.com/2017/05/30/protests-erupt-over-racism-at-evergreen-state-college/

Apparently, the FSA reps at Evergreen College asked white folks to GTFO for a day, which prompted a white professor to tell them to STFU. He's at risk of being fired and the individual factions are having at each other in an epic bitch fight.

Reminds me of a Jim Dodge quote: "The American Left is more concerned with doctrinal purity and shafting each other than they are with effective practice."


Okie John

[AMC]

Here's a little bright spot in the culture wars:

http://college.usatoday.com/2017/05/30/protests-erupt-over-racism-at-evergreen-state-college/

Apparently, the FSA reps at Evergreen College asked white folks to GTFO for a day, which prompted a white professor to tell them to STFU. He's at risk of being fired and the individual factions are having at each other in an epic bitch fight.

Reminds me of a Jim Dodge quote: "The American Left is more concerned with doctrinal purity and shafting each other than they are with effective practice."


Okie John

Watching the video of these "kids" ranting incoherently, and the school Administrator, Bridges, basically kowtowing to them, I'm reminded not so much of Mao's Cultural Revolution.....but the "Court" of "Justice" in Batman:The Dark Knight......

[Cookie Monster]

If I was king, I would double teacher salaries, maybe triple them the first day. There would be many more good and great examples of teachers out there in short order.

There are two Americas at least. My wife is in the other one. After the Manchester bombing, she was like "must be some kind of accident." Yea, no. "There is evil in the world that want to murder our children" I kept in my head and went and dry practiced with the AR so I could feel like an American again.

I want to add the General Mattis Face the Nation interview on a loop to have in the room I am dry practicing in.

I posted but it is the afternoon and I am stuck in the office, digesting lunch.

[Peally]

You would get a lot more teachers in it for the money, myself included. A doubled salary is an instant easy route to a whole lotta cash, all things considered (at least at the lower levels).

[Totem Polar]

Here's a little bright spot in the culture wars:

http://college.usatoday.com/2017/05/30/protests-erupt-over-racism-at-evergreen-state-college/


Criminy.



http://pinkie.mylittlefacewhen.com/media/f/img/mlfw7729-021_-_internet_fight.gif

[okie john]

You would get a lot more teachers in it for the money, myself included. A doubled salary is an instant easy route to a whole lotta cash, all things considered (at least at the lower levels).

I'd happily double teacher pay IF it was tied to results (NOT to time in the saddle) and if teacher's unions went away forever.


Okie John

[okie john]

Criminy.

http://pinkie.mylittlefacewhen.com/media/f/img/mlfw7729-021_-_internet_fight.gif

Exactly.

The 60-ish female professor in the first part of the video was probably just trying to get to the bathroom and got trapped outside of her office by protestors. The experience must have been terrifying, but at least she knew enough not to turn her back on a mob.

On the other hand, she (and the other faculty members who are the targets of this protest) were chanting that exact same bullshit when they were college kids back in the 1960's.

Live by the sword, die by the sword, motherfuckers.


Okie John

[Drang]

Here's a little bright spot in the culture wars:

http://college.usatoday.com/2017/05/30/protests-erupt-over-racism-at-evergreen-state-college/

Apparently, the FSA reps at Evergreen College asked white folks to GTFO for a day, which prompted a white professor to tell them to STFU. He's at risk of being fired and the individual factions are having at each other in an epic bitch fight.

That's hilarious, considering it's Evergreen.

For those of you unfamiliar with the Pacific Northwest... there's Berkeley.
Then Oregon has Reed College, which, despite common belief, wasn't really named after John "Ten days That Shook The World" Reed (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Reed_(journalist)), but may as well have been.
And then there's Evergreen State College...

[LittleLebowski]

There's a lot of disparity in teacher's salaries. New Jersey is vastly different than say Mississippi.

[Mr_White]

Saw this on FB this morning. Perhaps relevant to this duscussion:


https://youtu.be/QJ2fMeer5Mw

There are longer versions of this, but ain't nobody got no time for that!

I was raised by hippies and I almost went to Evergreen. I'm -25 years of productive life because of it, but frankly I feel very lucky to have woken up at all. Thank you for posting this Tom. I had time for it. I watched the long version, and while I have been realizing more and more as an adult that all this is true, it is a whole other dimension to hear it said by a former KGB propagandist. The overall explanation made by Yuri Bezmenov sharply and unflinchingly explains my parents and their generational cohorts, and rings absolutely true to me.

Here's the long version in case anyone else wants to take the red pill:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y3qkf3bajd4

[critter]

I've watched the Bezmenov videos (there are more) many times.

I've also conducted quite a bit of research into the red scare and McCarthy. It's pretty amazing how he was utterly shut down and then villainized, and it wasn't because of a 'lack of evidence' (that's the cover-up narrative) but rather finding leftist/Marxist 'connections' in well connected places. Had McCarthy been left alone, it's unlikely we'd find ourselves in the situation we have today. Our situation is a direct result of five plus decades of unchecked leftism (not to be confused with classic liberals, or democrats, those groups were simply infiltrated and pushed farther left).

Once completely unchecked, the most diabolical aspect (aside from infiltrating government and bureaucracy) could be implemented -- they were free to infiltrate and eventually take over the education system and transform it into a collection of government sponsored leftist indoctrination centers. There is no longer any attempt to hide or disguise this.

[Robinson]

Just watched the video -- wow.

I think since that time, the subversive efforts of the Soviets probably did not pan out in the U.S. quite like they had hoped, but they did plant seeds and influence parts of our society. The biggest example is acedemia IMO. The subversion is still ongoing but is mostly homegrown now.

[Soggy]

I think their subversion worked pretty good. After all this time, anti-communism is still a bigger sin that communism. Witness the "Trumbo" movie from last year.

America is irredeemably racist, so if you love America guess what that makes you?

Small government conservatives = Fascism.

Treating people as individuals = Racism.

Etc.

[Robinson]

My point is that the subversive leftist counter culture has taken on a life of its own. The Russians have no reason to try to undermine American society, they can just sit back and watch. Most Americans still don't buy into that crap, but there's no denying our young people are fed leftist propaganda constantly -- and not by the Russians.

[Tamara]

I am reminded of this essay, part III to be exact: http://slatestarcodex.com/2014/09/30/i-can-tolerate-anything-except-the-outgroup/

The writer is a resident of this "other America" that many in this thread seem to be up in arms about, but is quite eloquent, IMO, and self-aware.

Thank you for that link. I don't know how I missed it at the time, but it's spot on.

[Robinson]

I am reminded of this essay, part III to be exact: http://slatestarcodex.com/2014/09/30/i-can-tolerate-anything-except-the-outgroup/

The writer is a resident of this "other America" that many in this thread seem to be up in arms about, but is quite eloquent, IMO, and self-aware.

Good grief... I don't have a tribe. Some people piss me off more than others though.

[rob_s]

I am reminded of this essay, part III to be exact: http://slatestarcodex.com/2014/09/30/i-can-tolerate-anything-except-the-outgroup/

The writer is a resident of this "other America" that many in this thread seem to be up in arms about, but is quite eloquent, IMO, and self-aware.

I stand corrected. There are two Americas. Those that post unbelievably long diatribes of self-serving drivel on the internet, and everyone else.

what a fucking waste of time. The author of that crap, if they really cared about all of these "others" they're so concerned with could have better spent that time volunteering at one of a billion charities to actually help, but instead wasted god knows how many hours looking up obscure references to make themselves feel all intellectual and self-important and then weaving them into some sort of useless treatise.

[Tamara]

Good grief... I don't have a tribe.

Don't worry, neither does anybody else. :)

[blues]

Good grief... I don't have a tribe. Some people piss me off more than others though.


Don't worry, neither does anybody else. :)

Well, that finally explains "A Tribe Called Quest". Thanks. Always wondered what that was about.

[hufnagel]

Random thought for the evening: When reading this thread tonight ask yourself, "Should I respond to this or should I go dry fire, reload, deadlift, and/or get an extra hour or two of sleep tonight?"

I need to have a reason to buy more ammo... namely the reason of, I've shot up a bunch of stash in practice.

[hufnagel]

http://gunfreezone.net/index.php/2017/06/02/reichsfuhrer-olbermann/

I think this article relates to this thread. The "US" vs "THEM" mentality is definitively dividing the country, in ways that are going to get really interesting I predict.

[NickA]

Looks like Evergreen State College has been shut down the last few days due to "violent threats".
Also the professor Bret Weinstein was just on Joe Rogan's podcast, should be a good listen.

Sent from my LG-V510 using Tapatalk

[bravo7]

^^^It is indeed a good podcast.

[farscott]

I am reminded of this essay, part III to be exact: http://slatestarcodex.com/2014/09/30/i-can-tolerate-anything-except-the-outgroup/

The writer is a resident of this "other America" that many in this thread seem to be up in arms about, but is quite eloquent, IMO, and self-aware.

I like this insight from that essay.


My hunch – both the Red Tribe and the Blue Tribe, for whatever reason, identify “America” with the Red Tribe. Ask people for typically “American” things, and you end up with a very Red list of characteristics – guns, religion, barbecues, American football, NASCAR, cowboys, SUVs, unrestrained capitalism.

That means the Red Tribe feels intensely patriotic about “their” country, and the Blue Tribe feels like they’re living in fortified enclaves deep in hostile territory.

[critter]

Compare, if you will, the reality and rhetoric we see today with a few interesting quotes from Lenin.




A lie told often enough becomes the truth.

The best way to destroy the capitalist system is to debauch the currency.

The way to crush the bourgeoisie is to grind them between the millstones of taxation and inflation.

The goal of socialism is communism.

The press should be not only a collective propagandist and a collective agitator, but also a collective organizer of the masses.

The history of all countries shows that the working class exclusively by its own effort is able to develop only trade-union consciousness.

It is true that liberty is precious; so precious that it must be carefully rationed.

Give me four years to teach the children and the seed I have sown will never be uprooted.

Give us the child for 8 years and it will be a Bolshevik forever.

There are no morals in politics; there is only expedience. A scoundrel may be of use to us just because he is a scoundrel.

Our program necessarily includes the propaganda of atheism.
(critter disclosure: I'm non religious/agnostic, which is still an atheist...if I had a religion, it would be based on Liberty and the U.S. Constitution -- and that's the point, atheists may and do tend to substitute other systems, e.g., political ideology)

It is impossible to predict the time and progress of revolution. It is governed by its own more or less mysterious laws.

When one makes a Revolution, one cannot mark time; one must always go forward - or go back. He who now talks about the 'freedom of the press' goes backward, and halts our headlong course towards Socialism.

[OlongJohnson]

The overall explanation made by Yuri Bezmenov sharply and unflinchingly explains my parents and their generational cohorts, and rings absolutely true to me.

Here's the long version in case anyone else wants to take the red pill:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y3qkf3bajd4

Here's the Joe Rogan podcast with Bret Weinstein:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xq4Y87idawk

The parallels between what Bezmenov said and what has actually happened are striking.

It's interesting to me that Weinstein is himself a radical leftist, who claims to be actively working with other people around the world in ways that he won't talk about to bring about some kind of new world order with the intent of replacing the current economic and government systems. It suggests there is more going on than "left" and "right."

Going back a few decades, the fundamental Clinton move was "triangulation" - Define an issue as having two sides, get everybody arguing about those two sides, then while nobody's looking, do a third thing that was your plan all along.

[rob_s]

Probably the saddest part of all of this is the number of people on both sides that do the bidding and dirty work of the master manipulators thinking that it's based in free will, morals, ethics, and other fantasy concepts when everyone ultimately oucks a "side" based solely on their own personal needs first (I.e. What's best for them) and then sets about rationalizing a position on which to base their opinions.

Much like the guy that buys the gun because:cool and then stumbles into the self-defense cult and signs up for the newsletter in order to have a "real" reason to buy more guns, gear, training, etc.

At the end of the day there is no "side", there are just the puppet masters that created the sides to keep the serfs farming. The matrix is real, but it's not machines and computers pulling the strings.

[Totem Polar]

At the end of the day there is no "side", there are just the puppet masters that created the sides to keep the serfs farming. The matrix is real, but it's not machines and computers pulling the strings.

http://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0956/3176/t/2/assets/logo.png?13222547277532295458


AmIright?

[45dotACP]

http://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0956/3176/t/2/assets/logo.png?13222547277532295458


AmIright?
Quoted because impossible to double like

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk

[Peally]

Culvers is better