10 round G19 Magazine Project

[spinmove_]

As I continue to amass more Glock magazines and, slowly but surely, more Glock pistols, it occurs to me that it might be prudent to make sure that it works with neutered magazines for when I have to venture into one of those silly ban states. As it so happens my wife's family is from the Boston area so it's only a matter of time before we make trips there from time to time. I also have family near Illinois and California, so that'll be a thing too.

Given that I need to find a solution so that I can continue carrying my G19(s) in those states and actually have them work. If that can't be a thing, then I'll have to find something else and/or carry my Shield during those times.

Now I know 10 round G19 magazines are generally unreliable, but I figured that I would at least try to make some work reliably and figure out what it would take to make that happen. If I can find out the secret sauce to doing that, awesome! If not, then I'll look into alternative solutions. So far I've purchased 2 recently manufactured 10 round G19 magazines. I've already replaced the 2183 or something shite followers with 9mm6 followers.

I've only run 10 rounds through each so far and both magazines failed to lock open on the last round. Both had 0 hiccups on AE 115gr. FMJ. Immediately after both magazines were emptied I loaded up 10 rounds into one of my trusty Magpul practice mags and slung 10 rounds downrange. It locked open on an empty mag. My grip is such that it NEVER forces the slide lock up, so I know it's not my grip. These are the only two magazines that have ever exhibited this behavior in this gun, so I've sufficiently narrowed it down to these 2 magazines, which means it's not the slide lock nor it's spring. It seems to me that the follower on the magazine might be to blame, but they're both brand new 9mm6 followers. Is it possible that they're not jiving correctly with the magazine bodies?

[Larry Sellers]

As I continue to amass more Glock magazines and, slowly but surely, more Glock pistols, it occurs to me that it might be prudent to make sure that it works with neutered magazines for when I have to venture into one of those silly ban states. As it so happens my wife's family is from the Boston area so it's only a matter of time before we make trips there from time to time. I also have family near Illinois and California, so that'll be a thing too.

Given that I need to find a solution so that I can continue carrying my G19(s) in those states and actually have them work. If that can't be a thing, then I'll have to find something else and/or carry my Shield during those times.

Now I know 10 round G19 magazines are generally unreliable, but I figured that I would at least try to make some work reliably and figure out what it would take to make that happen. If I can find out the secret sauce to doing that, awesome! If not, then I'll look into alternative solutions. So far I've purchased 2 recently manufactured 10 round G19 magazines. I've already replaced the 2183 or something shite followers with 9mm6 followers.

I've only run 10 rounds through each so far and both magazines failed to lock open on the last round. Both had 0 hiccups on AE 115gr. FMJ. Immediately after both magazines were emptied I loaded up 10 rounds into one of my trusty Magpul practice mags and slung 10 rounds downrange. It locked open on an empty mag. My grip is such that it NEVER forces the slide lock up, so I know it's not my grip. These are the only two magazines that have ever exhibited this behavior in this gun, so I've sufficiently narrowed it down to these 2 magazines, which means it's not the slide lock nor it's spring. It seems to me that the follower on the magazine might be to blame, but they're both brand new 9mm6 followers. Is it possible that they're not jiving correctly with the magazine bodies?


Stuck here in CT....I've replaced all of my 10 round 19 magazines with the 9mm3 followers. Knock on wood, not an issue with 115 AE, 115 blazer brass, 115 aguila, 124 AE, 147 lawman and 147 grain HST's.

What I did notice is that the 2183 follower places the bullet on a very flat angle as opposed to the #3 follower that appears to place the round on a similar angle to the standard capacity magazines.

[spinmove_]

Stuck here in CT....I've replaced all of mine with the 9mm3 followers. Knock on wood, not an issue with 115 AE, 115 blazer brass, 115 aguila, 124 AE, 147 lawman and 147 grain HST's.

Do they lock open on the last round? How many rounds do you have through them?

I ask because DocGKR has reported issues with using new magazines and the 9mm3 followers which makes me leery of them.


Sent from mah smertfone using tapathingy

[Larry Sellers]

Do they lock open on the last round? How many rounds do you have through them?

I ask because DocGKR has reported issues with using new magazines and the 9mm3 followers which makes me leery of them.


Sent from mah smertfone using tapathingy

Indeed they do lock open. This is with the standard glock slide stop and the vickers as well. The magazines probably have in the area of 5-6K through them. I have some standard capacity magazines that are "permitted" to be used in the home or at the range, but I do train and carry with the 10s. I had heard a nasty rumor that glock was going to re-design their 10 rounders but I'm not holding my breath. When I called glock and told them about issues with the previous 2183 follower not locking the slide back they sent me the #3 followers as a solution. This is just my observation from my limited experience. The #3's also allow the 10th round to be loaded into the magazines much easier than the 2183.

eta: this is a 4th gen 19.

[OlongJohnson]

A solution for illogical 10 rd mag limits (https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?23204-A-solution-for-illogical-10-rd-mag-limits)

[BN]

I have 2 circa 2003 ten round G-19 mags that came new with my 2003 G-19. They have 2183-1 followers. I only use them on the range, but I don't think either has ever had a failure. Probably only a few hundred rounds through each mag. Just a sample of 2. I wonder if the older 10 round mags might be better??

[spinmove_]

A solution for illogical 10 rd mag limits (https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?23204-A-solution-for-illogical-10-rd-mag-limits)

Yup, I've read through that one. If it comes to that, I might have to perform surgery, but I'd prefer not to if I don't have to.


Sent from mah smertfone using tapathingy

[Joe Mac]

I've been meaning to dig back through old threads on this issue, but as we have a new one and I'm lazy...

For many years I've been traveling to CA frequently with full-capacity mags, only learning last year that I've been out of bounds. I bought three recent 10-rd G19 mags to test (2183 follower), and they've given me zero problems thus far, in only 300-400 rounds. I've run them at top speed, one handed, deliberately limp-wristed, etc., with no issues. Most of those have been 124+P Gold Dot, as I want to prove them with carry ammo.

This isn't enough rounds for me to trust them, but...what problems am I supposed to expect?

[IceDevil]

.. So far I've purchased 2 recently manufactured 10 round G19 magazines. I've already replaced the 2183 or something shite followers with 9mm6 followers.

I've only run 10 rounds through each so far and both magazines failed to lock open on the last round.

The 10 round mag bodies have a protrusion in the front right corner of the mag (when looking down at the top of the mag with the bullets pointing away from you) that needs to be filed down to let the 6 follower go all the way up. If you compare a regular mag with your 10 round mag with the 6 follower side by side I would expect that the follower in the 10 round mag will protrude less out of the top of the magazine than the regular magazine. That could impact slide lock function. Might be worth checking on your mags.

[OlongJohnson]

Yup, I've read through that one. If it comes to that, I might have to perform surgery, but I'd prefer not to if I don't have to.


Sent from mah smertfone using tapathingy

It could be pretty affordable (about the same as a case of steel case 9mm) to pick up a lower with all the parts still in it off GB. Just swap your slide back and forth between lowers depending where you're taking it.

[Lost River]

Do you own other handguns that are more compatible with the 10 round issue, like 1911s, or Glock G30S, or ... ?

A J Frame BUG?

[StraitR]

Do you own other handguns that are more compatible with the 10 round issue, like 1911s, or Glock G30S, or ... ?

A J Frame BUG?

I agree with your line of thinking. Use a gun with purpose built 10 round or less magazines. If one travels to such places often, it's probably a good reason for the Glock shooter to get a 26 or 43.

[theJanitor]

I agree with your line of thinking. Use a gun with purpose built 10 round or less magazines. If one travels to such places often, it's probably a good reason for the Glock shooter to get a 26 or 43.

My cheap ass would probably just load up ball ammo that feeds well, during the time you're in one of those states

[pangloss]

Glock frames are as cheap as I have ever seen them on Gunbroker right now if you want to chop a G19 frame. Having said that, I would just carry my G26.

Sent from my Moto G Play using Tapatalk

[Lost River]

Consider even a pair of J Frames, or something that you (or a spouse) would use on a semi-regular basis in your regular AO (jogging gun, lounge around the house gun, purse gun, etc). If the bride is a non enthusiast, but is willing to at least do some familiarization fire with a revolver, the 10 round issue could actually be an opportunity, rather than a hindrance.

Picking up a K Frame-J Frame combo, or 2 J Frames, or whatever, that essentially operate in the same fashion, and can be run by the person with the least amount of training in the house makes a fair bit of sense. For a traveling gun, something that she is comfortable unloading and reloading as she sees fit, in various environments may not be so bad. Odds are as a shooting enthusiast, you are going to be competent in conflict resolution, no matter what you have in your hands (within reason).

[Malamute]

...I also have family near Illinois and California, so that'll be a thing too.



Is Illinois a problem with mags of greater than 10 rds?

[StraitR]

Is Illinois a problem with mags of greater than 10 rds?

I believe most, but not all, strict firearms restrictions are in and around Chicago. From what breakingtime91 tells me, there are some pretty cool gun folks in S. Illinois. I sold my LMT MWS 308 to some dude in Illinois a few years back and shipped it to an FFL in Springfield.

[breakingtime91]

Is Illinois a problem with mags of greater than 10 rds?

No, no mag restrictions in Illinois. I travel from Wisconsin down to Missouri all the time, no issue legally.

[Malamute]

OK, I didn't think so, but was surprise when that was mentioned.

I know a couple guys in Illinois, they have a bunch of shooting stuff going on thru the summer. I think many get focused on the laws and think of it as not being gun oriented, but the people don't seem deterred much.

[LSP552]

I'm spending a lot of time in the East Greenwich, RI area now, which is just South of Boston. While RI doesn't restrict capacity, I find myself in MA pretty regularly. I'm been bonding with a 4th Gen 26 the last few months just for that reason. The G26 gives me just a bit more dress around options and I'm only dealing with one gun while flying.

I personally feel I'm giving up some time and consistency on the draw going from the 17/19 to a 26, but its likely not significant in the food court at the Providence mall.

I did just order a couple of 10 rd mags for a 19, just to see how they work. I'm expecting them to not, but who knows.

Edit to add: With the Glock +2s, I'm not giving up much in handling (except reloads still suck), and I just leave them in RI when in ban land.

[breakingtime91]

I'm spending a lot of time in the East Greenwich, RI area now, which is just South of Boston. While RI doesn't restrict capacity, I find myself in MA pretty regularly. I'm been bonding with a 4th Gen 26 the last few months just for that reason. The G26 gives me just a bit more dress around options and I'm only dealing with one gun while flying.

I personally feel I'm giving up some time and consistency on the draw going from the 17/19 to a 26, but its likely not significant in the food court at the Providence mall.

I did just order a couple of 10 rd mags for a 19, just to see how they work. I'm expecting them to not, but who knows.

I gotta get a g26 sometime to replace this shield, or maybe a g43. Who knows..

[Malamute]

I did just order a couple of 10 rd mags for a 19, just to see how they work. I'm expecting them to not, but who knows.

Ive seen DocGKRs comments and others about them not working well, but so far the handful Ive had for 8 or 10 years have been OK in practice shooting Ive done with them. It makes me curious if theres some quirks about the guns that may bear on their function, perhaps as Wayne has said about the ejection without a mag being a likely precursor to other problems.

[LSP552]

I gotta get a g26 sometime to replace this shield, or maybe a g43. Who knows..

The G26 definitely punches above it's weight. I had a G43 and swapped it for a 4th Gen 19 with Steve. I have XL hands, and even with the Talon Grip, it was pretty squirmy because it was just too small for me to grip well. The G42 doesn't have enough recoil to move much and I shoot that little toy pretty well. I have over a 1,000 rds through my G42 and really like it for a pocket gun.

I could see a low key application for a G43, but G26 hides pretty well. I've just about gone 17 and 26, with the 19s mostly sitting in the safe.

[spinmove_]

Ive seen DocGKRs comments and others about them not working well, but so far the handful Ive had for 8 or 10 years have been OK in practice shooting Ive done with them. It makes me curious if theres some quirks about the guns that may bear on their function, perhaps as Wayne has said about the ejection without a mag being a likely precursor to other problems.

Most of the Doc's complaints were from using HSTs and 147gr. flat nosed FMJ. Feeding issues were the main problem even with newer manufactured samples. This project is to determine what it would take to make them work.


Sent from mah smertfone using tapathingy

[spinmove_]

It could be pretty affordable (about the same as a case of steel case 9mm) to pick up a lower with all the parts still in it off GB. Just swap your slide back and forth between lowers depending where you're taking it.

That might actually work. I'll have to keep my eyes peeled for deals on lowers.


Sent from mah smertfone using tapathingy

[spinmove_]

OK, I didn't think so, but was surprise when that was mentioned.

I know a couple guys in Illinois, they have a bunch of shooting stuff going on thru the summer. I think many get focused on the laws and think of it as not being gun oriented, but the people don't seem deterred much.

My bad, I thought Illinois had magazine restrictions. They practically have every other idiotic restriction...


Sent from mah smertfone using tapathingy

[spinmove_]

Consider even a pair of J Frames, or something that you (or a spouse) would use on a semi-regular basis in your regular AO (jogging gun, lounge around the house gun, purse gun, etc). If the bride is a non enthusiast, but is willing to at least do some familiarization fire with a revolver, the 10 round issue could actually be an opportunity, rather than a hindrance.

Picking up a K Frame-J Frame combo, or 2 J Frames, or whatever, that essentially operate in the same fashion, and can be run by the person with the least amount of training in the house makes a fair bit of sense. For a traveling gun, something that she is comfortable unloading and reloading as she sees fit, in various environments may not be so bad. Odds are as a shooting enthusiast, you are going to be competent in conflict resolution, no matter what you have in your hands (within reason).

It's something I've considered. I do have a Shield (I think I mentioned that in the OP) so I'm not totally without at least something. The thing that keeps bringing me back is that the wife has a .gov job and if her job gets relocated, we're moving to follow it. There's a decent chance that if that happened, we'd be moving to a ban state, and now I'd have to do something about my Glocks anyway.

I'm trying to find a solution pro-actively before that happens so that I can either just have a solution for my Glocks or know exactly what I'm moving to en masse by changing platforms. The G30/G36 had crossed my mind, but then I'd be in .45auto territory when I'd prefer to stick with 9mm because that shit is expensive. The simplest turn-key solution would be G26, but if I'm moving to ban-state land then it wouldn't really be all that different than changing platforms anyway (all 10 round G26 mags, smaller holsters, etc.).


Sent from mah smertfone using tapathingy

[L-2]

I read through the thread but may have missed whether the original 2183 followers were actually a problem in this thread's Glock.
Not all G19 models have a problem with specific ammo and 10 round mags with the #2183 followers.

An alternative is going with a G26gen3 or G26Gen4 which already come with 10 round mags.
Going with the G26 models (for 10-round concerns) will let one have more peace of mind and save the continual need to test the G19 10-round mags due to worrying.

I caught there's already an S&W Shield and don't quite understand why the bother with the Glock 19 as the S&W Shield is a fine gun, especially if it's just for travel/holiday/family/vacation times. I'm just saying the G26 models are similar enough to the G19 should there be some reason why the S&W Shield isn't being used.

[Malamute]

Most of the Doc's complaints were from using HSTs and 147gr. flat nosed FMJ. Feeding issues were the main problem even with newer manufactured samples. This project is to determine what it would take to make them work.


Sent from mah smertfone using tapathingy

I missed that detail. Makes sense to figure it out. Ive shot mostly WWB in the 10 rd mags.

[spinmove_]

I missed that detail. Makes sense to figure it out. Ive shot mostly WWB in the 10 rd mags.

Based on what I've been able to glean 115gr and 124gr ball should function fine enough in the neutered magazines. Given that I find it irresponsible to carry FMJ when good JHP loads are available I don't really consider that an option. Although I think there are some states that ban civilians from carrying JHPs, so there's that.


Sent from mah smertfone using tapathingy

[spinmove_]

I read through the thread but may have missed whether the original 2183 followers were actually a problem in this thread's Glock.
Not all G19 models have a problem with specific ammo and 10 round mags with the #2183 followers.

An alternative is going with a G26gen3 or G26Gen4 which already come with 10 round mags.
Going with the G26 models (for 10-round concerns) will let one have more peace of mind and save the continual need to test the G19 10-round mags due to worrying.

I caught there's already an S&W Shield and don't quite understand why the bother with the Glock 19 as the S&W Shield is a fine gun, especially if it's just for travel/holiday/family/vacation times. I'm just saying the G26 models are similar enough to the G19 should there be some reason why the S&W Shield isn't being used.

For travel and visiting, yes, the Shield and/or G26 would work. For the possibility of having to move and the fact that I shoot a larger gun better I'd prefer to find something that works in the G17/G19.


Sent from mah smertfone using tapathingy

[DocGKR]

Correct--all our neutered Glock 10 rd mag problems have been with 9 mm 147 gr HST, Ranger Talon, and flat nose FMJ.

[spinmove_]

Correct--all our neutered Glock 10 rd mag problems have been with 9 mm 147 gr HST, Ranger Talon, and flat nose FMJ.

I'm assuming the 2183 followers and I think IIRC the 9mm3 followers both had issues in your department's magazines. Did you guys ever try the 9mm6 followers? Is it possible that there's a spring tension issue?


Sent from mah smertfone using tapathingy

[DocGKR]

Multiple follower types tried including the ones mentioned; both weaker and stronger springs tried (including neutered G17 springs in neutered G19 mags). Unlikely a spring tension issue. Most of the failures to feed were nose-dive issues...

[spinmove_]

Multiple follower types tried including the ones mentioned; both weaker and stronger springs tried (including neutered G17 springs in neutered G19 mags). Unlikely a spring tension issue. Most of the failures to feed were nose-dive issues...

Ok, so if it's unlikely a spring tension issue, then it strikes me that it's either a follower geometry or magazine body geometry issue. Given that multiple followers are having issues (notably followers that seem to work great in standard capacity magazines) then it stands to reason there's something funky going on with the magazine geometry.

I might have to tear apart my sample of two to see what might cause something like that.


Sent from mah smertfone using tapathingy

[DocGKR]

It is likely the whole going from a double stack to single stack issue with the neutered Glock mags and why other neutered 10 rd mags that remain double stack and simple use an elongated base plate like on the M&P seem to feed normally.

[Exiledviking]

Not sure if it's already been covered but it appears that Glock may be addressing the issue with the 10 round mags. Someone recently got a G32 with 10 round mags and the mags were double stack instead of the usual single stack for neutered mags. So, let's hope that Glock has finally acknowledged the problem and they're going thru the 10 round neutered mags and making them function reliably by making the double stack 10 round mags. Is it OK to link to a thread on another forum for the thread in question?

[spinmove_]

Not sure if it's already been covered but it appears that Glock may be addressing the issue with the 10 round mags. Someone recently got a G32 with 10 round mags and the mags were double stack instead of the usual single stack for neutered mags. So, let's hope that Glock has finally acknowledged the problem and they're going thru the 10 round neutered mags and making them function reliably by making the double stack 10 round mags. Is it OK to link to a thread on another forum for the thread in question?

If it isn't, feel free to PM me that link if you could, please.


Sent from mah smertfone using tapathingy

[Bigghoss]

Not sure if it's already been covered but it appears that Glock may be addressing the issue with the 10 round mags. Someone recently got a G32 with 10 round mags and the mags were double stack instead of the usual single stack for neutered mags. So, let's hope that Glock has finally acknowledged the problem and they're going thru the 10 round neutered mags and making them function reliably by making the double stack 10 round mags. Is it OK to link to a thread on another forum for the thread in question?

They just started making 15-round G17 mag's for the two or three states that have 15-round limits and they seem to work well so it wouldn't surprise me if they started making double stack 10-rounders. It would likely simplify production and reduce costs because a limited double stack would be able to share parts and tooling with the standard mag's and that alone should be enough reason to drop the single stacks and move to doubles even if they won't admit the problems with the singles.

[Inspector71]

Retired LE here carrying in 50 states under LEOSA. I would love to carry my G17 around with me in my RV travels, but after tons of research on the internet, decided to moth ball the G17 and just go with revolvers. Not willing to buy another semi auto pistol. When in travel status, I take my S&W models 686/60/36. The bonus is that my wife is comfortable with the revolver format.

[AMC]

Retired LE here carrying in 50 states under LEOSA. I would love to carry my G17 around with me in my RV travels, but after tons of research on the internet, decided to moth ball the G17 and just go with revolvers. Not willing to buy another semi auto pistol. When in travel status, I take my S&W models 686/60/36. The bonus is that my wife is comfortable with the revolver format.

Slight derail....but based on your username, did you retire from that department?

[Inspector71]

AMC: No from that department. But, I'm a long time fan of Harry Callahan.

[LSP552]

Not sure if it's already been covered but it appears that Glock may be addressing the issue with the 10 round mags. Someone recently got a G32 with 10 round mags and the mags were double stack instead of the usual single stack for neutered mags. So, let's hope that Glock has finally acknowledged the problem and they're going thru the 10 round neutered mags and making them function reliably by making the double stack 10 round mags. Is it OK to link to a thread on another forum for the thread in question?

The 10 rd G19 mags I received this week are single stack with 2183 followers. They both worked well for a limited number of 124 ball and 124 +P Gold Dots. I plan on putting some rounds down range with these and will post back any problems. I'm hoping the Gold Dot feed profile will not cause me problems. I will continue to use the G26 as my ban state travel companion.

Let's hope the switch to a double stack system for 10 rd mags becomes the norm.

[csheehy]

LSP552: Not trying to hijack the thread, as I see it as a related issue...so:

What do you do for your G26 mags as far as a baseplate? I'm debating between a G43 with a Vickers +2 mags, or a G26 with either Pearce extensions or maybe factory +2's. Tried both guns this week at a LE shoot arranged by Glock and a Mass distributor. Wasn't comfortable with tucking the pinky under the mag with either gun. Someone, maybe you, used the term "squirmy" in reference to the 43. That's an excellent description. Then tried the 26 with a 19 mag in it and there was plenty to hold on to--so leaning strongly towards the 26--with some sort of extension on the mag.

T-I-A

Chris Sheehy

[LSP552]

LSP552: Not trying to hijack the thread, as I see it as a related issue...so:

What do you do for your G26 mags as far as a baseplate? I'm debating between a G43 with a Vickers +2 mags, or a G26 with either Pearce extensions or maybe factory +2's. Tried both guns this week at a LE shoot arranged by Glock and a Mass distributor. Wasn't comfortable with tucking the pinky under the mag with either gun. Someone, maybe you, used the term "squirmy" in reference to the 43. That's an excellent description. Then tried the 26 with a 19 mag in it and there was plenty to hold on to--so leaning strongly towards the 26--with some sort of extension on the mag.

T-I-A

Chris Sheehy

Chris,

I prefer the factory +2 base plates by far. It's been a long time ago but I had issues with the Pearce +2s. Perhaps they have changed, I don't know. You will find the Glock factory +2 to be an almost universal recommendation and I have never heard of them causing any issues.

When I'm in 10 rd territory, I will use the Pearce finger extension that doesn't add capacity. I've been pleased with these and haven't had any problems in the past. While I don't like the feel of tucking my little finger under the factory 10 rd base plate, I find it really doesn't effect my accuracy. It does effect my draw and consistency at speed a bit, but I "think" that's just me and could likely adjust to it if I had to.

[csheehy]

Thanks. Exactly the kind of info I was looking for.

CJS