My first IDPA match! (with a Glock 34)

[rodralig]

A little over a year since I got into firearms that I finally took the plunge and participated in my first IDPA match, albeit at the club-level.

Well, I actually got into IDPA late last September when I participated in "practice matches/clinics" at the Piru Range (once every 1- or 2-months).

Unfortunately when the IDPA matches were retired from Piru, so were the clinics. And then it got really hectic at work and at home; I was left with nothing else but live fire at indoor ranges and dry fire at home. Oh yes, there were a couple of tactical-specific classes with ITTS in Angeles; and a GSSF match (with a G19) last April.

So, about a couple of weeks back - I finally took the plunge and bought a G34 with a Blue Label coupon. And over the weekend, participated in my first match at the Prado range:

YouTube playlist of ALL stages (in the order I had to take them):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VAsxMZSq21w&list=PLoB519OXK2XYO8Ckd8q0uh1wEUcLZ1ls6&index=1

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VAsxMZSq21w&list=PLoB519OXK2XYO8Ckd8q0uh1wEUcLZ1ls6&index=1


Yeah, in spite of properly cleaning and lubing the G34 the night before the match, it went through several malfunctions (I had to do a quick strip & clean & lube mid-stages). Could it be my technique? Or, the lube wasn't enough for conditions (WAY HOT at Prado over the weekend)...? Or, it was just a "new" pistol?

Anyways, I finished with a result of 50/92 for Combined, 27/54 for the SSP division and 8/31 for Unclassified shooters. There were a couple of stages where I ranked in the Top #10 (#2 and #4). I would believe that this is a decent finish for a "new" shooter; but then, I try to be diligent in my practice (dry fire / dot torture drills) - is this the usual expectation? Or should I make changes to my routine, either because they are NOT effective enough (or I might not be athletically-inclined)...?


... Regardless, looking through footage, I believe there are lots that need work:

First shot from draw at distance (say 10-yards) - too long for me to get a sight picture
NPA (Natural point of aim) constrant transition from target back to front sight
Fine-tuning the grip i can't seem to get the firm/stable grip when compared from low ready


Regardless, this indeed way more FUN than static shooting...!!! Except for the heat, I think I'm hooked!


That said, early this year I told myself I'd make Marksman by the EOY, but then someone from another forums commented that I shoot aim for something higher. He adds that if someone is breathing and have some familiarity with firearms - Marksman would be a given. Thoughts?

Cheers!!!
_

[FNFAN]

Good job! I think there were more malfunctions in that match than I've had with all my Glock shooting! What brand ammo may I ask? You did a good job clearing them and your reloads were pretty quick. You'll kick some butt when your gun runs right!

[Luke]

What's up with the glove?

[Norville]

A G34 should just run and run. What ammo? Had you shot it prior? I never clean a running Glock before a match!

[Gadfly]

Glock 34 should run. No break in period. I hate to be the guy that says ammo... but.... ammo? Also, could the glove be rubbing the bottom of the slide on recoil?

Just thoughts. The 34 is generally reliable. At least, it should be.


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[rodralig]

A G34 should just run and run. What ammo? Had you shot it prior? I never clean a running Glock before a match!


Good job! I think there were more malfunctions in that match than I've had with all my Glock shooting! What brand ammo may I ask? You did a good job clearing them and your reloads were pretty quick. You'll kick some butt when your gun runs right!

Thank you...

My reloads were quick? I can't say really as I don't know the standard/average out there. Using one of Stoeger's dry fire drills (pointed at 7-yard target, at beep, reload and get sight picture) - I'm currently at 1.6+ par.

PS: I'm used Blazer Brass 115GR FMJ. When I got the pistol, I ran about 400-rounds through it at an indoor range (without any cleaning nor lubing). Then, I cleaned/lubed it the night before the match. Was using Breakfree CLP.



What's up with the glove?

How do I say it? Glock knuckles?

When I dry practice, I try to get a high enough grip - so much that the proximal joint of my middle finger had developed a callous (my grip puts this joint in the corner of the recess on the trigger guard) that it hurts when I shoot.



Glock 34 should run. No break in period. I hate to be the guy that says ammo... but.... ammo? Also, could the glove be rubbing the bottom of the slide on recoil?


Insightful. Maybe I'll try swapping out the G34's extended controls with my G22's...

Cheers!

[taadski]

Apologies in advance for the stalker behavior. It was a slow night at work... ;)

Looking closely at 3 separate examples of the malfunctions you were having, I'm gonna go ahead and say it appears you're interfering with the slide cycling. It doesn't appear to be the glove hand involved, but instead your support hand thumb.

In each of the stills below, (again, three different incidences) you can not only see contact between the thumb and slide, but you can even make out your skin blanching, indicating to me there's some significant pressure involved. Plenty to be causing the hiccups you were experiencing.



http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo324/taadski/Mobile%20Uploads/FullSizeRender_zpsgtyzyrgt.jpg


http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo324/taadski/Mobile%20Uploads/FullSizeRender_zpskaaqzq7z.jpg


http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo324/taadski/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_3143_zpskkynsr7n.png

[Peally]

When I dry practice, I try to get a high enough grip - so much that the proximal joint of my middle finger had developed a callous (my grip puts this joint in the corner of the recess on the trigger guard) that it hurts when I shoot.


I get callouses on the exact same spot shooting a VP9 due to my grip. Gloves will impede your performance, unless you need them for tactical or weather reasons embrace the suck ;)

Also, if your grip is causing you actual regular pain and bleeding when you're shooting you need to adjust it.

Just my 2 cents as an internet dip that's been doing this a while.

[EricM]

Undercutting the trigger guard can very effectively address this issue as well. Be aware though that type of modification can affect which competition divisions you are eligible for.

[Luke]

Trimming my calluses down made a big difference for me. I cut them down but sanding would work I'm sure. It's like instant relief.

[Peally]

I just pick at them at work, but then again I don't shoot enough for super manly looking hands.

[BN]

It's funny. I was just sitting here picking at the callus on my Glock knuckle while I read this. :)

[JCS]

I went through about a 3 week period where my Glock knuckle was really painful. Now it's just there and doesn't get agitated by much. It just looks horrible lol


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[1911Nut]

RE: Glock Knuckle
Buy some self-adherent tape like you can get at Walgreen's or CVS
Wrap a couple of turns around your knuckle
Keep it in your shooting bag
It sticks to itself and stays in place, even when your hands are sweaty in 100+ degree weather
Easy on and easy off
A roll lasts a long time

[rodralig]

I get callouses on the exact same spot shooting a VP9 due to my grip. Gloves will impede your performance, unless you need them for tactical or weather reasons embrace the suck ;)

Also, if your grip is causing you actual regular pain and bleeding when you're shooting you need to adjust it.


Oh, I forgot to also mention - it is NOT only because of the callouses; but, I have sweaty palms.

Yes, I did realize that gloves can impede performance, hence, I actually went through 3 different gloves to find the thinnest one available.



It's funny. I was just sitting here picking at the callus on my Glock knuckle while I read this. :)

:D *LOL*



RE: Glock Knuckle
Buy some self-adherent tape like you can get at Walgreen's or CVS
Wrap a couple of turns around your knuckle
Keep it in your shooting bag
It sticks to itself and stays in place, even when your hands are sweaty in 100+ degree weather
Easy on and easy off
A roll lasts a long time

Thanks, I'll try that in my next match.

BTW, does anyone have any recommendations for sweaty palms? During the classifier this weekend, I see some shooters putting some powder on their hands. What are those? Where can I get them?



Apologies in advance for the stalker behavior. It was a slow night at work... ;)

Looking closely at 3 separate examples of the malfunctions you were having, I'm gonna go ahead and say it appears you're interfering with the slide cycling. It doesn't appear to be the glove hand involved, but instead your support hand thumb.

In each of the stills below, (again, three different incidences) you can not only see contact between the thumb and slide, but you can even make out your skin blanching, indicating to me there's some significant pressure involved. Plenty to be causing the hiccups you were experiencing.



No offense taken. Actually I appreciate the stalker behavior! ;)

Thanks to your analysis, I was able to prevent further FTF and FTEs in the week after (leading to my FIRST qualifier). During dry practice, I modified my support hand grip such that the thumb is indexed at the trigger guard rather than the slide or frame. Somewhat similiar to what Vogel uses...

That said, during the qualifier, I experienced a different kind of problem - the slide failing to lock on empty.

My guess here is that my shooting hand grip is interfering with the slide stop lever, which, is more pronounced because of the extended one on the G34. Rather than swapping out from my G22, I just ordered a couple from eBay. Will see how that works in my next match.


BTW, just an update to ALL...

Due to the prodding of fellow shooters, I decided to try the classifier for the FIRST time! Since IDPA Prado holds a classifier only every quarter, I dropped all my appointments Saturday and took the plunge.

In spite of a few, obviously shooter-induced, "malfunctions", I was able to get a score of 120.64. This places me smack in the middle of Sharpshooter. Woot!

I've captured footage for my to review and learn from:
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLoB519OXK2XYz2zLPxPOoydUXIH8AF1-S

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CKjIjiWbk_0&index=1&list=PLoB519OXK2XYz2zLPxPOoydUXIH8AF1-S


Yeah - I love Stage #2 the best! I hate those head shots in Stage #1. *LOL*

Cheers...

[Mirolynmonbro]

You can find liquid chalk on Amazon. My gym sells it too.

I saw somebody was making their own by crushing chalk in a fine powder and mixing it with hand sanitizer

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[HopetonBrown]

Wow, that's a great score for anyone, let alone someone relatively new to shooting. Congratulations.

Liquid Grip is probably the most popular within sport shooting. You can find it in sporting goods stores. It's mostly used by tennis players.

I took the extended controls off my Glock 34, as I would get failure to lock back with the OEM extended slide release, and the OEM extended mag release would hurt my palm.

[taadski]

No offense taken. Actually I appreciate the stalker behavior! ;)

Thanks to your analysis, I was able to prevent further FTF and FTEs in the week after (leading to my FIRST qualifier). During dry practice, I modified my support hand grip such that the thumb is indexed at the trigger guard rather than the slide or frame. Somewhat similiar to what Vogel uses...

That said, during the qualifier, I experienced a different kind of problem - the slide failing to lock on empty.

My guess here is that my shooting hand grip is interfering with the slide stop lever, which, is more pronounced because of the extended one on the G34. Rather than swapping out from my G22, I just ordered a couple from eBay. Will see how that works in my next match.


Nice job getting the support hand stuff remedied so quickly! And nice job on the classifier. Your pure shooting looks pretty clean. One can tell you have a diligent practice regiment. ;)

Watching all three stages of your classifier, it looks like a lot of your low hanging fruit (aside from the slide lock issues) is on the mental management side. Meaning visualizing the course of fire, knowing where and when you're going to be moving, transitioning, reloading, etc... and minimizing the time between those. Having every step built into your mental stage prep is super important for success at this sport, especially as the stages get more complex. The standard is that if you can't close your eyes and visualize yourself shooting every individual target on the stage (like a first person movie) then you're not yet sufficiently prepared to shoot it. Learning to do this in a timely and accurate fashion is a skill set all it's own.

Like others have suggested, I'd lose the glove. I understand there is a comfort issue with it, but I suspect it's a primary culprit with regard to riding the slide release lever. And the fact of the matter is that it takes away from your having as good a tactile interface with the gun as possible. I'd experiment with grip tape (only b/c stippling isn't legal) if you feel like you need more traction. Re sweat....I have pretty sweaty hands too. I honestly usually make due with just rubbing my hands in the dirt as I'm coming to the line. :cool: Not particularly hygienic, but it works and I'm cheap. ;) The hand lotion antiperspirants work well too. I've only used Pro-Grip but apparently the tennis based Prince "grip enhancer" is the same shit and works identically. They should help a bunch also.

Anyway, congrats on jumping into the competitive shooting world with both feet. In addition to just being a pure kick in the ass, I think there's a ton that can be taken away from it. Chiefly, the motivation to continue to work hard on the basics, and a means for evaluating those basics under a little wee bit of stress.


t

[Wobblie]

A G34 should just run and run. What ammo? Had you shot it prior? I never clean a running Glock before a match!
Back when I shot a lot of USPSA the rule of thumb was not to clean the gun after the last practice session before match day.

[rodralig]

You can find liquid chalk on Amazon. My gym sells it too.

I saw somebody was making their own by crushing chalk in a fine powder and mixing it with hand sanitizer


Liquid Grip is probably the most popular within sport shooting. You can find it in sporting goods stores. It's mostly used by tennis players.

Thanks! I've already ordered one of these from Amazon:

https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B003L7N0...d=ST1QL2UN31RS (https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B003L7N0EC/_encoding=UTF8/ref=as_li_ss_tl?coliid=I158FD7F8L5U7A&colid=ST1QL2UN31RS&linkCode=ll1&tag=pistolforum-20&linkId=0aa044e55706d571e154ef2ebee0c8ca)



Wow, that's a great score for anyone, let alone someone relatively new to shooting. Congratulations.

I took the extended controls off my Glock 34, as I would get failure to lock back with the OEM extended slide release, and the OEM extended mag release would hurt my palm.

Thank you Sir! I was kind of surprised, actually... More so, was worried before the match that I'd even make Marksman. Much less, if any of my practice sessions were doing any good.

But then again, thanks for many of the advice you've given. Singe-hand shooting (Strong & Weak) when doing the Dot Torture drills, for one! And transitioning to a 9mm platform.

As for the standard slide release, I've already ordered one from eBay. Should be arriving by the weekend.

Ah - I would keep the the extended magazine release, or else I would need to shift my grip to release the magazine. I've also installed them in both my G19 and G22.

Yes, it does hurt. But I guess I got used to it...



Nice job getting the support hand stuff remedied so quickly! And nice job on the classifier. Your pure shooting looks pretty clean. One can tell you have a diligent practice regiment. ;)

Thank you Sir!!!

All I have are 10- to 20-min dry practice sessions around 3 times per week, and 100-rds per month. And my drills aren't much (maybe even less than a fourth of Ben Stoeger's book); I alternate a couple among the below:

Slow Fire Trigger Control on a white wall
Slow Fire Trigger Control on a 10-yd simulated target
Trigger Control at Speed, ie., breaking without disturbing the sight on a white wall within a prescribed par
10-second slow motion draw to extension
Sight picture on a 10-yd simulated target from draw within a prescribed par
Slide lock reload on beep, get back to a 10-yd simulated target sight picture within a prescribed par
Transitioning eye focus from Target to Front Sight, wait 2-seconds; then transition from Front Sight to Target, wait 2-seconds
Dot Torture at 5-yards once a month

That's it!

PS: I definitely need to add target transition drills to my dry practice...



Watching all three stages of your classifier, it looks like a lot of your low hanging fruit (aside from the slide lock issues) is on the mental management side. Meaning visualizing the course of fire, knowing where and when you're going to be moving, transitioning, reloading, etc... and minimizing the time between those. Having every step built into your mental stage prep is super important for success at this sport, especially as the stages get more complex. The standard is that if you can't close your eyes and visualize yourself shooting every individual target on the stage (like a first person movie) then you're not yet sufficiently prepared to shoot it. Learning to do this in a timely and accurate fashion is a skill set all it's own.

*nod* *good advice* I will definitely put them into practice by my next match. I guess it just that I didn't know enough of the Classifier; all I knew are what I've seen in YouTube. And that, just a couple of days before since I never really intended to take the classifier.



Back when I shot a lot of USPSA the rule of thumb was not to clean the gun after the last practice session before match day.

Even if the gun just went through, say, 200-rounds? Is there a reason for this?

[Wobblie]

200 rounds? Why would you clean a gun after only 200 rounds?

[rodralig]

200 rounds? Why would you clean a gun after only 200 rounds?

No? I was told that it would be best to clean the gun after every range trip (most particularly for my 1911 MCO than my Glocks).

Since my range trips are usually 50 to 100 rounds, maybe a good guess, is when it hits 200 rounds I should clean it?

No?? :confused:

[HopetonBrown]

No? I was told that it would be best to clean the gun after every range trip (most particularly for my 1911 MCO than my Glocks).

Since my range trips are usually 50 to 100 rounds, maybe a good guess, is when it hits 200 rounds I should clean it?

No?? :confused:

I clean 1911s after every range trip. I clean Glocks after about 1,000 rounds.

[Wobblie]

Many years ago when I competed in two or three USPSA matches a month and practiced twice a week on top of that, I would clean my compensated 1911 when I could feel the slide start to cycle slower than normal. This was partly due to the fact that I hate cleaning guns, reinforced by my gunsmith's caution not to "wear the gun out taking it apart and putting it back together all the time."

The gun I now shoot in geezer IDPA is a Tanfoglio .38 super and it seems to require more frequent cleaning, possibly because my bunny-fart hand loads leave more residue than my hell-fire 180 power factor loads of yore. Cleaning guns after every range trip is an obsessive-compulsive disorder. That's just opinion, however, and we all know what that's worth. And some people like cleaning guns.

[rodralig]

I clean 1911s after every range trip. I clean Glocks after about 1,000 rounds.


Many years ago when I competed in two or three USPSA matches a month and practiced twice a week on top of that, I would clean my compensated 1911 when I could feel the slide start to cycle slower than normal. This was partly due to the fact that I hate cleaning guns, reinforced by my gunsmith's caution not to "wear the gun out taking it apart and putting it back together all the time."

The gun I now shoot in geezer IDPA is a Tanfoglio .38 super and it seems to require more frequent cleaning, possibly because my bunny-fart hand loads leave more residue than my hell-fire 180 power factor loads of yore. Cleaning guns after every range trip is an obsessive-compulsive disorder. That's just opinion, however, and we all know what that's worth. And some people like cleaning guns.

Lessons learned.

Since I keep a log of my round count for each gun, I could then track my cleaning then...

That said, what is a best practice for lubing the gun? Should I follow the same cycle as cleaning it?

[Wobblie]

Lessons learned.

Since I keep a log of my round count for each gun, I could then track my cleaning then...

That said, what is a best practice for lubing the gun? Should I follow the same cycle as cleaning it?

Ah Grasshopper..keeping a log of round count is, in itself, obsessive compulsive. The therefore I cannot help you. Plus I have had way too many Stump Knocker Ales to think clearly.

[HopetonBrown]

That said, what is a best practice for lubing the gun? Should I follow the same cycle as cleaning it?

I don't know how you lube it when you clean it.

I'm at a local public range a lot, my friends work there. When a 1911 being shot by the general public stops working, it's usually because he hasn't lubed it, the extractor tension is all screwed up, or they're using lame mags.

Years ago I took this class (http://reedsindoorrange.com/jardine/Jardineflyer8hr.02.jpg) from John Jardine, who's a nationally known, well respected gunsmith. It's quite a drive from you, but worth it if you're gonna spend a lot of time behind a 1911.

I was 1 of only 2 guys with a 1911 in a Hackathorn class, and pulled him aside to ask how to field lube a 1911. He had a 5 point lube for when on the range: hammer, rails, hood, disconnector (lock the slide back to access it) and bushing.

[rodralig]

I don't know how you lube it when you clean it.

I'm at a local public range a lot, my friends work there. When a 1911 being shot by the general public stops working, it's usually because he hasn't lubed it, the extractor tension is all screwed up, or they're using lame mags.

Years ago I took this class (http://reedsindoorrange.com/jardine/Jardineflyer8hr.02.jpg) from John Jardine, who's a nationally known, well respected gunsmith. It's quite a drive from you, but worth it if you're gonna spend a lot of time behind a 1911.

I was 1 of only 2 guys with a 1911 in a Hackathorn class, and pulled him aside to ask how to field lube a 1911. He had a 5 point lube for when on the range: hammer, rails, hood, disconnector (lock the slide back to access it) and bushing.

Hi...

My apologies; but I don't think I precisely phrased my question...

What I meant to ask was if you only clean your, say Glock, every 1000-rounds, when do you lube it? Every range session regardless of round count? Every 500-rounds? Or, you'd just clean and lube it at the same time?

In regards to Jardine's Class, thanks again! I'll keep that in mind whenever I travel up north to meet up with relatives.

That said, how was Hackthorn's class? I just missed the cut-off for his class this October, unfortunately:

http://www.aztectrainingservices.com/product-page/ken-hackathorn-2-day-advanced-pistol-feb-22-23-2017

Cheers!

[HopetonBrown]

I lube the Glock every few hundred rounds I guess. I might run a bore snake through it every few hundred. Glocks aren't that demanding of maintenance, so it's whenever I feel like it I suppose.

I liked Hackathorn. We took him out to dinner for burritos after.

[olstyn]

I lube the Glock every few hundred rounds I guess. I might run a bore snake through it every few hundred. Glocks aren't that demanding of maintenance, so it's whenever I feel like it I suppose.

I treat my Walther basically the same way. Every couple of matches/trips to the range, I pull the slide off, and if I can still see lube, it doesn't need lube yet. If it's gotten dry, I throw some in there. ~1800 rounds since last full cleaning, zero malfunctions. I'll probably give it a thorough cleaning sometime soonish, including cleaning the nooks and crannies inside the slide and hosing out the frame, but it'll almost certainly keep running fine even if I don't, as long as I throw some lube its way occasionally. Modern polymer frame guns need a lot more "feeding" than "care." :)

[Sterling Archer]

Back when I shot a lot of USPSA the rule of thumb was not to clean the gun after the last practice session before match day.
I go by this rule now. I remember one time I practiced for a match, cleaned my gun and didn't realize I tweaked a spring during disassembly/assembly. The following day I had several malfunctions that kinked my match.

[1986s4]

Do to circumstances beyond my control I haven't shot IDPA for a while but last I did gloves where not allowed. Has this changed? Or maybe I'm mistaken? Glad you're having fun! I miss it and hope to rejoin the fun ASAP.
Some 1911's may need frequent cleaning. My Colt doesn't and I treat it like a Glock. It gets more lube than a Glock needs but that's about it.

[Peally]

If they are illegal it's such a disadvantage that no one would ever really care regardless. Considering there's plenty of shooting matches in the freezing cold I'd be surprised if they were completely illegal though.

[That Guy]

Do to circumstances beyond my control I haven't shot IDPA for a while but last I did gloves where not allowed. Has this changed? Or maybe I'm mistaken?

I have no experience with pre-2005 rule books but none of the ones I've read (2005 - present day) say anything about gloves. I would be very surprised if gloves were ever not allowed.

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[1986s4]

I have no experience with pre-2005 rule books but none of the ones I've read (2005 - present day) say anything about gloves. I would be very surprised if gloves were ever not allowed.

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Yes, I must be mistaken. I did a quick google search with no ban on gloves found. Some clubs do stages where gloves are required to simulate winter use. Even shooting specific gloves would yield no competitive advantage.

[That Guy]

Some clubs do stages where gloves are required to simulate winter use.

...Why not simply shoot that stage during the winter? That'd be a fairly accurate winter simulation. :)

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[Peally]

Some people live in God forsaken hellholes where it doesn't get down to -20F on the regular ;)

[1986s4]

...Why not simply shoot that stage during the winter? That'd be a fairly accurate winter simulation. :)

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I don't know. Just reporting on what I found out.

[Wobblie]

Some people live in God forsaken hellholes where it doesn't get down to -20F on the regular ;)