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JV_
12-30-2011, 12:05 PM
When you find yourself having a bad range session, what is your problem and what drills do you use to try and bring it together?

For me, it's trigger control. I usually try some slow fire exercises, but I'm often unable to bring it together. I'd like some more options.

gtmtnbiker98
12-30-2011, 12:16 PM
Honestly, when I'm having a bad day - I pack it up, conserve the ammo, and call it a day. There's always tomorrow.

ToddG
12-30-2011, 12:27 PM
It depends a lot on what is going wrong.

If a particular skill is going poorly, I drill it. For example, if my cold FAST reload is 2.5 or something, then part of my day's range plan gets pushed aside so I can work reloads for an hour.

If it's a general "nothing is going right today" event, I usually work through something like the 99 or FASTs just to force myself to perform when I'm frustrated, then call it a day. I'm a big believer that skill building does not happen under those circumstances. I know there are guys who tough it out because they think it's a mindset thing, but wasting effort, time, and ammo just to prove I can pull the trigger when I'm sad doesn't seem worth it to me.

Now, if I were in a class or at a match and things were sucking -- and believe me, I have many of those t-shirts in the closet -- then yes, I stick with it. I'm not at those events primarily for skill-building practice but to learn and test.

So... it depends.

Jac
12-30-2011, 12:51 PM
If it's a general "nothing is going right today" event, I usually work through something like the 99 or FASTs just to force myself to perform when I'm frustrated, then call it a day. I'm a big believer that skill building does not happen under those circumstances. I know there are guys who tough it out because they think it's a mindset thing, but wasting effort, time, and ammo just to prove I can pull the trigger when I'm sad doesn't seem worth it to me.


This is a point my flight instructor made often, particularly when working on landings. If we'd scheduled a bunch of touch-and-goes, but the landings just weren't happening, he'd have me just blow it off and go do something else... you can make bad landings all day long, but all it will get you is mad. You're certainly not learning anything, or internalizing good practices.

JeffJ
12-30-2011, 12:53 PM
Trigger control/anticipation seems to be what gets me most often. I'll usually go to a 3x5 walk back drill starting about 3 yds. If that doesn't start to sort things out then I'll do some ball and dummy drills utilizing the "dry fire 10 times if you catch yourself doing something wrong" technique. If that doesn't work I revert to self-loathing, cussing under my breath and packing up my stuff while contemplating my self worth. Fortunatly I'm an optimist and I'm usually done with self-pity by the time I get to the main road.

YVK
12-30-2011, 01:03 PM
If the problem is in specific manipulation, then I do what Todd does - try to spend some time on it, doing at very slow pace and build up.
If I can't hit anything, I go to ball and dummy. Few clean runs with B&D serve as a positive reinforcement that the very basic building block - ability to hit target at slow pace - is still there, meaning decent trigger control and no anticipation. After that, it depends - I may wrap it up, or I may try to come back to a practice plan. I do try to leave on a [relatively] positive note. A couple of circle drills usually suffice to confirm I still can hit high-prob target at 7 yards or so, and then I am done for good.

Mr_White
12-30-2011, 02:09 PM
Great topic, JV!

I would do well to work on this aspect of my practice.

If I am doing poorly at something, I usually keep doing it and really run it into the ground, waste ammo, and hate myself for a while. If other things are going well in my life, my happiness at any given moment is often determined by how I last shot.

I need to adopt a constructive practice instead. Thanks for the ideas, everyone.

mongooseman
12-30-2011, 02:44 PM
A college professor once explained it to me like this; With any skill you're going to have slumps. You will maintain a skill at a certain level, practice, and at some point your skill level dips sharply (slumps). Continue to practice but don't get frustrated. Your skill level will eventually recover and will be at a higher level than before it took that sharp dip. According to the good doctor, it was important to recognize that this was a natural progression and to maintain focus on your goal. Seems to work for me.

JV_
12-30-2011, 02:50 PM
I'm definitely in a slump...

-Sent using Tapatalk.

ToddG
12-30-2011, 02:55 PM
There is a huge difference between a slump and a bad day at the range. A bad day at the range could just be something with your eyes, too much caffeine the day before, being distracted, etc. If you've got the time and access, it can often be as easy as grabbing lunch and then trying again.

LittleLebowski
12-30-2011, 02:58 PM
I'm definitely in a slump...

-Sent using Tapatalk.

Considered changing it up? Bringing a .22 pistol or any rifle you can enjoy at the range?

JV_
12-30-2011, 03:07 PM
We should meet up and shoot some carbines. I can use some carbine 101 tips.

-Sent using Tapatalk.

ToddG
12-30-2011, 03:28 PM
Some thoughts on slumps:

mongooseman is spot on, it's going to happen to everyone. The better you get, the more likely you are to find periods where you're not getting better (or worse, where it seems you're actually worse than you used to be).

First, recognize that sometimes we're not really worse, we just have grand memories. That's why performance tracking is so important. I can always remember that my personal best F.A.S.T. is yadda yadda, but what was I averaging over the course of last month? Is that better or worse than the month before? Is it better or worse than this month last year?

Just like with the bad day at the range, I try to assess whether it's something I'm actually doing wrong. Have I become sloppy with my grip? Am I not really focusing on the sights? Are there things I'm doing on autopilot that need refinement? Happens to me all the time. If I put a ton of time into my reloads for a month, something else has to suffer.

There's also a certain amount of burn out that occurs if you're really pushing yourself at the range every week. For me, from Thanksgiving through SHOT (about two months) I normally ratchet my shooting schedule down considerably. I didn't this year, but for the next few weeks I don't expect to shoot as much as normal. It's good to take a little break. Whether that means not going to the range or, as LilL suggested, bringing a "fun gun" to work on shooting without worrying about the minutiae of performance it's better than pounding your head into the wall.

A certain amount of improvement happens in the brain, not in the eyes and fingers. If you never give yourself time to internalize some of the lessons you've learned, they'll slip away.

A slump can also be an indicator that you need to change what you're doing. Maybe it's the way you practice, maybe it's the way you shoot. But something isn't working and it's time to be brutally honest in your self assessment. It's better to determine that you're doing something wrong so you can fix it than to bury your head in the sand and pretend that the bad times will go away if you just wait them out.

LittleLebowski
12-30-2011, 04:40 PM
We should meet up and shoot some carbines. I can use some carbine 101 tips.

-Sent using Tapatalk.

Sounds like a plan! I just happen to have two carbines setup fairly identically (5.45 and 5.56) if you need to borrow one.

JV_
12-30-2011, 04:40 PM
For me, this is definitely a slump.

I'm consistently unable to nail the head shots on a FAST, my head splits are approaching 1s.
My recoil management has become pathetic.

It's been going on for most of December. I've tried to push through it, which I think is a mistake. I'm considering not going for a 2 weeks or so, and just doing dry fire / fundamental work.

JV_
12-30-2011, 04:42 PM
LL - Shifting to PM.

JHC
12-30-2011, 05:44 PM
Plan A
Plan B
Plan C

I usually follow one of those as they suggest the prob. A or B suggest the areas where I typically crash.

Plan A for just plane sucking at trigger presses - 3x5 cards slow at distance and 2 fast on 3x5 from the draw.

Plan B for messing up reloads: shoot 1 reload 1. (shoot 1 reload 2 makes sense but I'm always rationing ammo)

Plan C just bag it and save the ammo. Usually when it's not a specific drill but a general fog/funk

JHC
12-30-2011, 05:50 PM
It's a timely thread. Heading into Ken Hackathorn's class we hit it pretty hard and disciplined. And we were pretty hot that weekend. Since then, ouch, just soft on the hard skills. Yesterday after the cold FAST pooped the bed, I changed to just working flashlights and moving which the class proved, I am not up to speed on. The stimulus to my brain felt fresh instead of the stale feeling drills and I learned a couple things.

jetfire
12-30-2011, 05:56 PM
Three different types of "bad range session."

Type 1: I'm shooting okay but am frustrated with thing x.
Solution: Work on thing x.

Type 2: I am shooting poorly due to poor physical mechanics caused by fatigue/injury or other physical condition.
Solution: Identify cause (lack of sleep/injury) and modify practice session accordingly to maximize effective practice.

Type 3: I am shooting poorly because my mental game is messed up and i'm not focused in my head.
Solution: Finish whatever drill I'm doing, pack my shit up, go home and have a drink. Get the bad juju out.

2 and 3 are often linked; as poor physical condition can lead to poor mental discipline. The difference is that I can still learn and improve if my body is broken, but if my mind isn't right I'm not learning anything.

That only applies to practice though. At matches, I have to power through. In a match if I have a bad shot and shoot a no-shoot or blow a stage with too many points down, my goal is to focus on everything I did CORRECTLY on that stage, and not on the one mistake. If I think about the mistake, I'll get stuck in that gear and won't be able to break out. So instead I have to look to the positive aspects, focus on those and power through.

fuse
01-03-2012, 10:04 PM
For me, this is definitely a slump.

I'm consistently unable to nail the head shots on a FAST, my head splits are approaching 1s.
My recoil management has become pathetic.

It's been going on for most of December. I've tried to push through it, which I think is a mistake. I'm considering not going for a 2 weeks or so, and just doing dry fire / fundamental work.

Is it possible you're simply not quite acclimated to the G19?

Possibly some residual muscle memory from all your recent 17 shooting?

orionz06
01-03-2012, 10:56 PM
I shoot really fast and really close with a carbine, maybe a mag or 2 of 1-5 or half and half, depends on my target set up. Depending on where I am I might destroy stuff with my .22 pistol. I try to close with "The test", something I am normally pretty good at, even on a bad day. If none of that works I perform a liquid reboot and take a break from dryfire for a few days.

JV_
01-04-2012, 06:25 AM
Is it possible you're simply not quite acclimated to the G19?Dunno, but after almost 3K I'd hope that I'm close to that adjustment point. Normally, switching in the Glock family just means I have to slow down to get my hits - but I can still get them!

fixer
01-04-2012, 08:12 AM
Good thread. this happened to me the other day at the range. I left convinced I was the only one in the universe that has bad days at the range.

First thing I did was convince myself, that even with this "bad day", I am better, more accurate, more overall proficient, than one year ago. If I look back at other range efforts (old targets, memories, etc), and compare to my "bad day", it doesn't seem so bad.

Then I try to figure out what was wrong. It turns out that I had developed a really bad grip habit and I was jerking my shots low and left.

I went through the basics of trigger pull, sight focus, stance, and fired other pistols with similar results (ruling out the particular pistol I was using which is normally accurate). I also consulted one of the shooting charts to at least get a clue where to concentrate.

Dr. No
01-04-2012, 09:50 AM
A partner and I have been experiencing this quite a bit. I have been especially frustrated at major matches lately because I have not performed to the level I expect myself to.

And therein lies the problem. :) I shot a local match this weekend and went into it nice and relaxed. As it turns out, I shot like a champ and ended up 6/70 overall. I had one 'shooting' error that I can learn from, but otherwise everything ran great.

When I went to USPSA Nationals last year it was my first time to shoot with the HK pro team. I had thoroughly convinced myself that I needed to shoot like a champion in order to impress them and do well. Instead I ended up shooting like a dickhead .... and so did everyone else! We were all too caught up in pushing the performance instead of just relaxing and shooting to the best of our ability. After we finally settled down we all shot very well and ended taking home 4 trophies.

Lately I have been frustrated and I just need to go back to that state. Let the frustration go. ENJOY my time on the range. Focus on that picture of the front sight. Live in that moment when the gun goes off, I watch the slide recoil and my sights come back down, and I can hear the brass tinkle off the concrete. It is my zen place.

D

Greg Perry
02-04-2012, 01:30 AM
Shooting, like golf, is obviously as much a mental as physical challenge. In his "Little Red Book" of golf instruction, famed golf teacher Harvey Penick had this to say:

If you play a bad round, let not your mind be troubled and think nothing more about it.
If you have two consecutive bad rounds, check your grip, stance, alignment, and ball position.
If you play three bad rounds in a row, it's time to consult your professional.

I've always tried to follow this approach. I go to the shooting range for the same reason I go to the golf course: I want to get better, and I enjoy it. If I'm not performing as well as I'd like, I'll very seldom bag it and go home. Instead I'll find a way to get around the course without grooving my mistakes, find some way to enjoy my time there, and take something positive home with me. Even if my shooting skills are not honed to a razor edge on a given day, shooting is still fun for me. I don't consider it a waste of time or ammo. I'm more concerned with wasting a precious opportunity to do something I really enjoy. To paraphrase the golfer's motto: A bad day at the range is better than a good day at the office.

Greg Perry

BWT
02-06-2012, 01:18 AM
The other thing is... this is going to sound awkward, maybe a bit unwieldy and I may not convey it correctly, but, just here's some thoughts on performance, etc.

Set Goals. Be careful with expectations.

Hard to differentiate those very much, but... I think it does matter, follow me in this train of thought for a moment.

When you set expectations, you're setting a bar. You're setting a bar when you set goals but it's different in how you approach it and how you feel about it, you set out with the hopes of achieving it, of accomplishing it, you're happy with any progress, and you're a little bit more forgiving, but you can see progress, it's going from where you are to where you want to go.

Setting expectations is different. This isn't so much a bar, as much as it is an ultimatum. Different mindset. It's an ultimatum to yourself, sure you can get disappointed, sure you can get discouraged with goals, or don't know how to accomplish it, but a goal is a loose end, you're looking to do it, but you don't have the hows, the why's, etc. set out, you don't always know how you're going to do it, but you know you're going to go after it, and even if you don't achieve that goal, you'll get better.

Expectations is giving an ultimatum to yourself. You try to bully yourself through to doing something, you try to force yourself through it, because if you don't perform at this level you *suck*, and you're a failure. It creates a completely different environment and mindset, where before you were open, relaxed, teachable, receptive, and flexible, you're trying to accomplish something. Now with expectations, you must do this, or you fail yourself.

That's the easiest/quickest way to set it up.

What I fear you're doing, is one, burning out, that's just what I perceive, it may be wrong, but it's what I perceive, I look at this, the tone, the words, what you've conveyed and I see a man that is worn out, this has become more than a hobby/lifestlye to you, it's personal. You take this as a personal reflection on yourself, again, what I perceive, it matters to you. I think you're swapping guns, etc, shooting a lot, but I don't think you're so much enjoying it. We always enjoy our successes, but we always grow so intolerant of even the most minute of failures down the road. It creates doubt, it creates disappointment, it builds anxiety.

I think when you're terrible, and you know it, and you're working into becoming better, it's easier, because you don't have a lot of expectations, heck anything is better than what you are now, right? Well, as you become more proficient that dynamic is changed, now there are expectations.

What I'd do if I was you, is one, take a break, frankly, you need to have fun with it. You know why they tell people not to do what they love for a profession? Because it'll take the fun out of it, the novelty out of it. Somewhere along the lines this became a job for you, instead of an outlet/goals/hobby. I take my self-defense seriously, I take shooting seriously, heck I bought another gun yesterday... my 7th, sound like a lot to you? No, but everyone I know, and I mean every single person I know, that I've met that hasn't been at a gun match, or from a gun forum in my personal life, that's more than they own, that's inherited, that's bought, etc.

I say that to say, I don't view owning a gun and carrying a gun for self-defense as not a necessity/wise decision or view it as a hobby, but getting back to the point, I think you've taken the fun out of shooting. I think you need to write down some basic/achievable goals, and take some time off from shooting, you're going to wonder how that makes you a better shooter, I'm going to tell you now, why I believe it will. You'll come back. What? That's right, you'll come back. Instead of this limping along, beating yourself down, downward spiral that very competent/competitive/hard working people get in, you'll come back and manage those expectations in, and set goals, and maybe you'll start enjoying it again.

Let me add this last thing, again, this has all been shooting from the hip, I've assumed alot, I may be wrong, and if I am, cool, tell me how wrong I am, but, this is all stuff I've learned from my own life, and what I do to myself. No one I've ever known has performed better under pressure. I thought about it and I thought I knew a guy that did, he was a supervisor of mine, he's a cyclist, and the dude literally cycles, tens of miles a week, when he's training, hundreds, maybe approaching thousands. I've seen the guy cycle over 60-80 miles in a day. He's competed at state and national levels. Now, I went to the restroom while typing this and I thought about it, and I never asked him, maybe I will some day, but whenever we were doing anything, I knew how to beat him at a game or something, keep him joking, keep him light hearted.

Don't talk crap, don't, just don't, do not let him get under pressure, or feel pressure, you'll beat him when you're joking, when he gets serious he goes in the zone. Now, here's why I think I'm wrong, I don't think he does better because of pressure, I just think he begins to actually focus and try, close, but different, I think if he was focused but in an optimistic/cheerful mindset he would do well, he would perform better, and honestly, all people do perform better under those circumstances, IMHO.

So what I'd say is, take a break, quit analyzing it, quit driving/pushing for a little bit, put down the guns, the timer, the drills, step away for a little bit, realize you've hit a plateau, and be forgiving of yourself, acknowledge how far you've come, come back in a week or two, or maybe pickup another hobby for a little bit, just because let's be honest, being successful and getting better, feels good. For the non-christian, etc., honestly it builds confidence and validates who you are.

Just what I see, IMHO. Give it some time, walk away, for a bit, de-compress, in your time of reflection/rest, set some light hearted goals, and come back to it with a renewed attitude. Since I happen to mention my faith, I'm going to mention this, I don't know where you are in that regard, but, you're supposed to let your body and your mind rest. It's so weird in our culture, that we just don't allow that, we see resting as being ineffectual (again something I struggle with) and unproductive. Where truthfully at times, not resting is destructive, we get so one-tracked that we forget our limits, and are often in-fact, ashamed of them.

Again, it goes back to building confidence and validating yourself through means of what you can do, etc.

Anyway man, hope this was helpful. Cause it sure was alot, lol. :D

ETA: It took me so long to write this that it timed out my account from inactivity, lol, I had to sign back in to post it. :D

Serenity
02-24-2012, 01:12 AM
My last bad range day I was working on a thing with my 226 and getting frustrated (all me; the gun always performs). I got out the S&W m67 and shot a few through it and that always puts a big grin on my face (it doesn't only aim itself; it walks over and repaints the plate for you, I swear). When I went back to the 226 I was relaxed and fresh and did a lot better. Take a gun with you that you know that you can shoot well no matter what. AND leave on a good note; even if it is just the least bad note.

Slavex
02-24-2012, 07:32 AM
I usually head the parking lot, down a couple beer, let it settle in and then head back to try again.
ok, not. I hate beer.
I actually had a good example of this the other night, I'm getting back into shooting more often and in higher volumes after a couple months of very little shooting due to some health stuff. The other night I attended our weekly steel challenge practice and couldn't hit anything, now I was using my backup to my backup and figured it had to be the gun. So I swapped it out for my match gun. Things improved a bit, but I quickly determined that it was an off night. Since there were other people there that wanted to shoo the steel I couldn't drill anything. So I packed up, helped out, traded insults with my friends and chilled. Went back out on my own the next day and did much much better.

Jeff22
02-24-2012, 10:24 PM
If I can tell that my focus just isn't there that day, I may give up on it. Most often I also have a .22 handgun or conversion unit with me and I'll transition to the .22 and do accuracy drills on a B-34 1/2 scale target at 50 feet. Often times expending 100 rounds helps me to "shoot through" my lack of focus, and I'm okay again, at least for a little bit.

I've been shooting for many years so I can usually tell where I'm at with my mental focus and what's up. Almost always. But NOT always.

I do find frequent practice with something OTHER than my primary platform keeps me fresh and sharp. I carry a Sig .40 at work but the occassional training session with an M1911A1 or M9 or S&W 15 or (whatever) keeps me from being bored and the variety helps in my skill development, I think.