View Full Version : Best Autoloader trigger
As a companion to the best non-1911 trigger thread that is going on, I would like to start one on defining what a "best autoloader trigger" is. Rather than just saying what pistol has your favorite trigger is, I would like to hear what characteristics of the trigger make it so good.
My definition of "best" is that the trigger is suitable for defensive carry, and it allows the best performance on PF style drills, on shooting reactive targets like at the Rogers School, and it allows for best possible strong hand and support hand only shooting. That trigger will be in the 4.75-5 pound range, have take-up travel, have roll to help with one hand shooting and so that I can work it between targets.
Comedian
12-28-2011, 09:22 PM
Broken in, stock Glock trigger, for me.
Cosmo M3
12-28-2011, 10:14 PM
Walther PPQ
My question may be confusing -- what I am interested in are the characteristics of an ideal trigger, and why they are ideal?
I really do like about three millimeters of take-up and a crisp four pound break; and I really, really like a straight trigger, as opposed to one that pivots. I like a pronounced reset, too. The take-up is a necessary part of my presentation. The crispness of the break is significant only in very precise shooting, but does have a measurable effect in that area. The straight trigger is the real crux -- I believe that it makes up for inconsistencies in the force of my trigger press, and keeps the sights aligned even if I press harder than I want to. I have not yet learned how to use trigger roll in SHO shooting, and if you get time and patience I'd love a description of how it helps.
ToddG
12-29-2011, 04:16 PM
My ideal:
No rough patches or grittiness in the stroke from front to back. The trigger should move smoothly.
Significant pre-travel and significant resistance/weight in the pre-travel part of the trigger stroke so that I have as much tactile feedback as possible that the trigger is moving (whether I want it to or not). This can be achieved with a DA stroke followed by lighter/shorter SA strokes.
Relatively little additional weight to move past the break point, with as little abruptness to the break as possible (i.e., I like a rolling trigger).
A short reset and very forceful reset (italicized part added thanks to a reminder by Comedian)
I'd like something along the lines of a tuned ~6# DAO revolver with a SIG SRT-type reset.
Mine would be very close to Todd's except I'd prefer a bit shorter pre-travel. Using P30 as a reference for the length of pull, I'd like trigger break point not all the way back but perhaps midway. 5.25-5.5 lbs or so weight and yes, straight non-pivoting trigger would be nice.
If you combine mine and Todd's you get this:
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Comedian
12-30-2011, 02:03 PM
Small amount of pre travel, followed by a smooth pull, leading to a crisp break. Short, forceful and tactile reset with no creep before the break. 5.5 lb pull weight.
ToddG
12-30-2011, 02:16 PM
Small amount of pre travel, followed by a smooth pull, leading to a crisp break. Short, forceful and tactile reset with no creep before the break. 5.5 lb pull weight.
Thanks for that reminder! Edited my previous post.
rsa-otc
12-30-2011, 02:25 PM
Echoing Todd's preferences.
All triggers should be smooth with no grittiness.
Right now I'm running an M&P45 With the Duty enhancement kit. It's super smooth now after several thousand rounds with a nice short and positive reset. What I would like to see is on the first shot the trigger have the same 5.5 to 6 lb resistance from the start of the trigger pull thru the break with no wall at the end. As Todd has described like a 6 lb double action revolver. About 1/2 the travel distance that most DA/SA autos currently exhibit on the first shot. Then the current reset characteristics my M&P has now for follow up shots.
Having the increased resistance over a greater length of travel would allow me the "CHANCE" to recognize a brain fart and get my finger off the trigger before the gun goes bang inappropriately.
digiadaamore
12-30-2011, 02:45 PM
Walther PPQ
^ im going to reiterate my support for the ppq. i just did some dryfire practice with it for me this is beyond any other trigger period its just mind blowing.people spend 4000$ on a 1911 that feels like this except this isnt just a hard break
Cosmo M3
12-30-2011, 03:20 PM
People mentioning guns with aftermarket triggers...i dont think that is what the TS is looking for.
Factory stock triggers?
^ im going to reiterate my support for the ppq. i just did some dryfire practice with it for me this is beyond any other trigger period its just mind blowing.people spend 4000$ on a 1911 that feels like this except this isnt just a hard break
1) beyond "mind blowing," what are the specific characteristics that make you like it so much?
2) how do your times/splits/accuracy on drills with the PPQ trigger stack up with the same for other known pistols?
digiadaamore
12-30-2011, 07:56 PM
1) beyond "mind blowing," what are the specific characteristics that make you like it so much?
2) how do your times/splits/accuracy on drills with the PPQ trigger stack up with the same for other known pistols?
one there is no slack what so ever all movement is accomplishing something, there is no hard break wall feeling like some guns(nothing,nothing,full weight) and like todd talked about with his glock changing the connector the break is totally smooth theres no stop no increase it just rolls all the way to the release sort of the feeling of rolling a marble with the tip of you finger.
in terms of timing i havent been able to shoot with timing gear, but i can say it is noticeable how much faster i am, not just to me but the people i shoot with. i have always been the best shooter amongst the guys i shoot with and its made me that much better. in terms of groups it is big compared to the berettas ive always shot i didnt really think they could get better i was shocked how well i shoot it. im hitting the range in the morning i might be able to get some pictures of the groups i shoot with it if anyone cares
While small groups are pleasing, if groups were my primary objective, I would shoot a 1911. My interest is how the PPQ compares to a Glock with a minus connector, and an M&P with a DCAEK trigger on known drills like the FASTest, Bill drill, and other such tests? Out of curiosity what pistol have you been shooting that you are comparing to the PPQ?
digiadaamore
12-31-2011, 01:02 AM
While small groups are pleasing, if groups were my primary objective, I would shoot a 1911. My interest is how the PPQ compares to a Glock with a minus connector, and an M&P with a DCAEK trigger on known drills like the FASTest, Bill drill, and other such tests? Out of curiosity what pistol have you been shooting that you are comparing to the PPQ?
For me full size beretta, the thing is the ppq is stock not modified like the m&p would be. And ive felt the glock for me its no comparison, there is a certain amount of personal preference involed in these things. I agree about groups and one of the things i havent mentioned, the trigger reset , (which is beyond comparison,itslike a gamer 1911!) along with everything else allows me to shoot more accurately faster im not talking bench resting. There more room on the edge between being fast and still accurate
OlympicFox
01-10-2012, 07:03 PM
My ideal:
No rough patches or grittiness in the stroke from front to back. The trigger should move smoothly.
Significant pre-travel and significant resistance/weight in the pre-travel part of the trigger stroke so that I have as much tactile feedback as possible that the trigger is moving (whether I want it to or not). This can be achieved with a DA stroke followed by lighter/shorter SA strokes.
Relatively little additional weight to move past the break point, with as little abruptness to the break as possible (i.e., I like a rolling trigger).
A short reset and very forceful reset (italicized part added thanks to a reminder by Comedian)
I'd like something along the lines of a tuned ~6# DAO revolver with a SIG SRT-type reset.
I'm with Todd on this one.
I used to be fond of 1911 triggers (carried one in the military for many years) and generally blamed lots of problems I had with shooting my first P226 on the DA trigger pull, even after having the Sig trigger job and SRT trigger installed. Now on my second P226, I'm getting much better and discovering that I much prefer the DA/SA trigger, especially in a defensive gun. Target guns are another story, but also one that I personally find boring. :cool:
muther_beetches
01-11-2012, 02:39 PM
sig p-series with reduced power hammer spring, langdon tactical trigger job (no longer available), short trigger and srt
-and-
beretta 92-series with d hammer spring, langdon trigger job, with ltt speed bump trigger (again, no longer available)
both of these ignited every round of carry ammo i put through them, and gave me all the qualities that toddg listed except the return isn't quite "forceful" as in glock with nypd insert- not sure i like it that forceful.
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