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MadMax17
12-20-2011, 10:02 PM
Hey all,

Just have a question concerning dry fire practice, mainly reloads and draws. Obviously practicing with an empty magazine for the draw or reload will be different than a fully loaded magazine. In your opinion, is this difference worth spending money on things like Dummunition (http://glockstore.com/pgroup_descrip/20_Training+Devices/7760_Dummunition/?return=%3ftpl%3Dindex%26category_id%3D20%26_Train ing%2BDevices%2F) or these training magazines (http://glockstore.com/pgroup_descrip/20_Training+Devices/4047_Dry-Fire+Practice+Magazine/?return=%3ftpl%3Dindex%26category_id%3D20%26%26%26 page%3D3%26nothumbs%3D%26filter_1%3D%26filter_2%3D %26filter_3%3D%26filter_4%3D)

My carry gun is a Glock 19, with a G17 mag for reload.

Thanks for the help.

-Max

JDM
12-20-2011, 10:50 PM
I've never realized a need for weighted practice mags. the weight of a loaded mag during live fire reloads is a non issue.

Dummy ammunition has many uses, and having 10 or 15 dummy rounds is a good idea.

JeffJ
12-21-2011, 12:08 PM
I've never though about it. You might be on to something but I don't know. I do practice reloads with dummy rounds just so I have something to index my finger on and I figure its better than repeatadly dropping the slide on an empty chamber (note, I don't have any real reason to believe that - I just though about it one day and it made sense to me so certainly don't quote me on that or start chiming in that I'm an idiot and it doesn't matter because I'm going to use the dummy rounds regardless.)

jetfire
12-21-2011, 02:01 PM
I use snap caps/dummy ammo for practicing reloads because it's easier to depress the slide-lock lever when you're doing that vs. using an empty magazine. I want the dry fire reload to feel as close to the "real thing" as possible.

ToddG
12-21-2011, 02:28 PM
I simply remove the follower and spring from my mag to get the same "no resistance" slide release.

Ga Shooter
12-21-2011, 02:41 PM
On Head Hunter's recommendation I bought and love these for inserting a full feeling mag.




http://www.benniecooley.com/safetymags.html


There is a video somewhere on here (but I could not find it) with him doing a reload dry fire practice with them.

JDM
12-21-2011, 05:30 PM
I simply remove the follower and spring from my mag to get the same "no resistance" slide release.

BRILLIANT!!!!

I'd of never thought of this.

Mr_White
12-21-2011, 05:54 PM
I practice drawstroke like a madman. More in the past than now. This was to retrain my drawstroke when I switched from strong side to appendix carry.

I noted that the feel of a gun with one dummy round in the chamber and an empty magazine in it has different momentum than a gun full of real ammo and the difference does affect the drawstroke a little.

So I got a weighted training magazine and continued drawing like a madman.

The increased weight coupled with clear overuse promptly gave me a minor case of tendinitis in the my right elbow, which totally sucks big time. I think I even remember the moment I first felt a twinge of pain in my elbow during an hours-long drawing session. It's ok, you can all call me stupid. I won't be offended.

I had to lay off drawstroke practice to a large degree, and it has mostly, but not completely healed. I still have to ration my draw practice to avoid aggravating it. I do not use the weighted magazine anymore, and just accept the difference between a light gun in dry practice and a bit heavier one in live fire.

I love the saying that:

Dumb people don't learn from their mistakes.
Smart people learn from their mistakes.
Really smart people learn from the mistakes of others.

Learn from mine.

jetfire
12-21-2011, 06:32 PM
Moral of the story: overtraining is bad and can lead to injury. Whether it's weights, punching, or guns.

ToddG
12-22-2011, 11:20 AM
BRILLIANT!!!!
I'd of never thought of this.

Actually, I stole the idea from HH. Though I believe he actually goes the extra step and simply files/dremels the slide catch notch on his followers so he can also use those magazines for malf clearances, etc.

JodyH
12-22-2011, 11:34 AM
I simply remove the follower and spring from my mag to get the same "no resistance" slide release.
That works with Glocks, but H&K's require spring tension to help secure the baseplate on the mag. Its easy to rip the mag baseplate off if you don't have a spring and follower in the mag.

Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk

MadMax17
12-22-2011, 04:40 PM
Ok so the majority opinion is that it doesn't really make a difference practicing drawing and reloading with an empty magazine...?

JodyH
12-22-2011, 05:17 PM
For reload practice:
I bought 30 of the nickle cased orange plastic dummy rounds to load my magazines with when I do reload practice.
I start with an empty magazine inserted, slide locked back, aimed in at a spot on the wall, finger holding the trigger back.
I perform my reload with one of the dummy filled magazines.
This gives me feedback on whether I prematurely dropped the slide, if no dummy round gets ejected it means I screwed up.
Lather, rinse, repeat until the dummy magazine is empty.

For draw practice I just run with an empty mag well on full sized guns and run a dummy round magazine on sub-compacts that need a magazine inserted to fill out the grip.

MadMax17
12-22-2011, 09:57 PM
Ok, thanks for the opinions everyone.

Have another question on dry-fire, probably Todd can answer, as it's a question about his dry-fire routine. In the below routine, what's the difference between "wall drill from the holster" and "draw and fire":

1.10 reps of Wall Drill from press-out, 2H
2.20 reps of Wall Drill from the holster, 2H
3.5 reps of Wall Drill from the holster, SHO
4.5 reps of Wall Drill from the holster, WHO
5.10 reps draw & fire at 3/4 speed, 2H
6.10 reps draw & fire, slow, 2H

SLG
12-22-2011, 10:12 PM
Ok, thanks for the opinions everyone.

Have another question on dry-fire, probably Todd can answer, as it's a question about his dry-fire routine. In the below routine, what's the difference between "wall drill from the holster" and "draw and fire":

1.10 reps of Wall Drill from press-out, 2H
2.20 reps of Wall Drill from the holster, 2H
3.5 reps of Wall Drill from the holster, SHO
4.5 reps of Wall Drill from the holster, WHO
5.10 reps draw & fire at 3/4 speed, 2H
6.10 reps draw & fire, slow, 2H

Not Todd, but...

Wall Drill is done inches from the wall, and forces you to focus on your front site. Regular draw and fire is at the target/distance of your choosing, often 5-10 yards at a light switch or mini target.

ToddG
12-23-2011, 12:26 AM
Not Todd, but...

... the right answer nonetheless.

MadMax17
12-23-2011, 09:27 AM
Not Todd, but...

Wall Drill is done inches from the wall, and forces you to focus on your front site. Regular draw and fire is at the target/distance of your choosing, often 5-10 yards at a light switch or mini target.

Ah ok, that makes sense now, thanks! What speed should the wall drills be done at?

ToddG
12-23-2011, 10:24 AM
The Wall Drill (http://pistol-training.com/drills/wall-drill)

ToddG
12-23-2011, 11:12 AM
So (and at the risk of asking a stupid question), wall drill from holster or press out is done by standing the same distance from a blank wall one would if doing the "static" wall drill as described in the above link and incorporating the draw or press out?

Correct.