View Full Version : Week 205: iEl Prez
Mr_White
02-24-2017, 10:57 AM
Week 205: iEl Prez
Results may be posted until March 24th, 2017.
Designed by: Kevin B.
Range: 10 yards
Target: Two USPSA Metric or IDPA targets
Start Position: Facing uprange, wrists above shoulders
Rounds Fired: 12
Procedure: Start with pistol loaded with exactly six rounds and holstered, facing uprange with wrists above shoulders. Upon start signal, turn and draw and shoot two shots to the first target (T1), two shots to the second target (T2), two shots to the first target again (T1), reload the empty gun, and shoot two shots to the second target (T2), two shots to the first target (T1), and two shots to the second target (T2.) No extra shots allowed. You'll end up with six hits on each target.
Comments from the designer:
The benefits to running it this way are:
1. It forces transitions in both directions.
2. There is a cognitive component after the reload; you have to come back to the correct target.
3. It is easier to set-up as it requires only two targets v. three.
Scoring is +1 second for a B/C; +3 for a D; +10 for a miss. There are the same number of splits and transitions as the original, but I think this version is a bit more difficult.
Add your raw time and penalties to determine your score: A/-0 = no penalty, B/C/-1 zone = +1 second per shot, D/-3 zone = +3 seconds per shot, Miss = +10 seconds per shot
Concealment is optional.
Targets spacing can be either one or three yards (one yard is more like the USPSA Classifier version of El Presidente, three yards is the classic Cooper version.) If you need to space the targets some other way due to range constraints, just note it in your results.
Please report the following when you post your results in this thread:
Equipment used: gun, holster, concealment (if any)
Variations used: USPSA or IDPA targets, target spacing
Raw time
Penalties
Total score
Anything you noticed
Training with firearms is an inherently dangerous activity. Be sure to follow all safety protocols when using firearms or practicing these drills. These drills are provided for information purposes only. Use at your own risk.
Mr_White
02-24-2017, 10:57 AM
Many thanks to Kevin B. for this contribution to the Drill of the Week!
Glock 17, VM2, sport coat; ipsc target, 3 yards; 9.13+3= 12.13
I ran it 5 more times, never clean. Best run was 7.68+1.
Equipment used: gun, holster, concealment (if any) Gen 4 G17 MOS w/ Leupold DPP, Blade tech OWB holster, jacket concealment.
Variations used: USPSA or IDPA targets, target spacing USPSA targets, 3 yard spacing
Raw time 10.55
Penalties 0
Total score 10.55
Anything you noticed Slow. Time to be gained on the mag change. Also have to switch back to factory mag release. The Vickers one is too low profile being a lefty and using finger, especially with gloves on.
Equipment used: CZ 75 SP01 from CCC Gestalt and polo shirt
Variations used: Had to make do with B8 targets in 1 lane spaced ~1.5 feet apart due to range constraints. Given the small transition, I assumed black is down 0, on paper is +1 sec, and a complete paper miss is +10.
Raw time: 10.08 seconds
Penalties: +5 seconds based on 5 shots on paper in the white
Total score: 15.08 seconds
14297
Anything you noticed:
-Draw was about 2 seconds, reload about 2 seconds, transition was about 0.7 sec, and follow up shots were about 0.5 seconds.
-Feel like the draw and reload were a bit slow.
-Transitions were a tad slow, ideally could be closer to the split time on the follow up shots
-Called the left miss on left target, but failed to call the other misses...
Mr_White
02-27-2017, 12:15 PM
Variations used: Had to make do with B8 targets in 1 lane spaced ~1.5 feet apart due to range constraints. Given the small transition, I assumed black is down 0, on paper is +1 sec, and a complete paper miss is +10.
Those are definitely a lot tougher targets!
Is there an "official" way of completing this drill within the confines of an indoor range - one lane only, should be able to do the turn tho will get funny looks. What modifications to the range and targets?
I was thinking that 3-5 yards against vertical 3"x5" cards might work.
Kevin B.
02-27-2017, 01:04 PM
Is there an "official" way of completing this drill within the confines of an indoor range - one lane only, should be able to do the turn tho will get funny looks. What modifications to the range and targets?
I was thinking that 3-5 yards against vertical 3"x5" cards might work.
I think vertical 3x5 cards at 5 yards would be a workable solution.
Mr_White
02-27-2017, 03:15 PM
Gen3 G34, concealed in a Keeper under a polo shirt
USPSA Metric targets, ~1 yard spacing
6.19 clean
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eJQn45Ih8fg
Glock 17, VM2, sport coat; ipsc target, 3 yards; 9.13+3= 12.13.
Or not. I misread the instructions, and stopped after the fourth pair of shots. Will re-run.
RIF.
Equipment used: P30 V2, Kydex OWB, concealment/button down shirt untucked
Variations used: IDPA targets, target spacing- ~1 yard
Raw time: 10.52
Penalties: +4
Total score: 14.52
Anything you noticed: Could speed up on turning, drawing, pretty much everything except picking up sight picture and trigger pull. In other words, I think I could save time by "cleaning things up". My draw was considerably slower than usually and I didn't need a shot timer to tell me, I could feel it. Was wearing a button down shirt for work and when untucked the damn thing hung down to my thighs. Misses weren't all over the place, but still misses. Great drill and thanks for posting it.
Doc_Glock
03-03-2017, 01:32 PM
Fun drill. These are my first ever El Presidente's. Ran it five times. Twice with G319L and three times G4G19
Please report the following when you post your results in this thread:
Equipment used: gun, holster, concealment (if any) G3G19L Warren sights x 2, G4G19 Defoor sights x3, Eidolon holster concealed.
Variations used: USPSA or IDPA targets, target spacing 3x5s vertically at 5 yds
Raw time G19L: 15.82,12.06
G19: 12.48, 10.49, 11.89
Penalties G19L: +2, +4
G19: +1, +4(DQ), +2
Total score G19L: 17.82, 16.06
G19: 13.48, DQ, 13.89
Post G19L runs
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170303/0c446528bcc8bb9d0b94d1b9ae896015.jpg
Post first two G19 runs
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170303/49191c551340b0a0409377a0da76b2e0.jpg
Anything you noticed
I have never done this drill before. I went on the recommendation above for 3x5s spaced out in a single shooting lane at 5 yards. I think it worked fine. It was challenging. The G19 was I think faster as I worked through the learning curve. One run, however I blew it and shot the wrong target after reload. Which is kind of the point of the drill to get one to think on one's feet. The penalties seem fair as shooting faster without assuring the hits seems to give you about the same score as slowing down and making them.
Glock 19 Gen 4 in RCS Eidolon. Overwatch Precision trigger and WOTG sights. Shot from concealment, 36° outside today.
USPSA targets, 3 yards
30:40 - slow but clean, no penalty
I probably should have tried to shoot it faster, but I wanted to shoot it clean.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170303/4a5e5cf00c4eb7eddfc4830ae0c67361.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170303/e1f5566541f84b2a06f9db69a3c56e97.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170303/7b9d5a1c83b11ccd9be29b274d95938a.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170303/fa88c0edc84370d89d3be3107af46d2f.jpg
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
SsevenN
03-03-2017, 08:40 PM
I shot this drill four times after work today.
Equipment used: FNS-40L, safariland open topped, passive retention holster concealed
USPSA target metric, 10 yards as dictated
Raw time: 10.63
Penalties: 1
Total score: 11.63 (best of four)
(other total scores: #1 (https://pistol-forum.com/usertag.php?do=list&action=hash&hash=1) - 12.21 +3, #3 (https://pistol-forum.com/usertag.php?do=list&action=hash&hash=3) - 11.40 + 3, #4 (https://pistol-forum.com/usertag.php?do=list&action=hash&hash=4) - 11.32 +2)
Anything I noticed:
I'm fucking Derek Zoolander and apparently cannot turn left.
Spinning got me very discombobulated, I think it's because when turned around the sun was shining right into my eyes - I should have closed them or looked further down or something.
I only intended to run this once because of ammo rationing, but it was a lot of fun.
For some reason I kept finding myself observing the muzzle flash rather than staying fixated on my FSP.
The FNS-40L shoots like a 9mm with 124 grn boolits. :cool:
That Guy
03-12-2017, 12:52 PM
I shot this on IDPA targets that were 259cm apart - so not exactly, precicely, quite 3 yards, but as far apart as I could get them.
Major difficulty increase was that the condition of the ground in the shooting bay made dropping magazines a bad idea. Therefore I started with more than 6 rounds in the gun and did tactical reloads. This slowed me down as my pockets were not conducive to doing tactical reloads; I really struggled to get that magazine stowed.
I used my full size Beretta PX4 in a JMCK IWB holster under a concealment garment.
My best run (out of four) was 13.11s with zero penalties bringing the total score to 13.11s
My reload was 4.19s on this one, clearly the best reload of them all.
My worst run was... well, let's not go there. :p I had a five second reload, followed by the gun going dry because my reload only had a few rounds in it, so I had to spend another fiveish seconds digging out my first magazine... It was ugly.
My shooting felt really sloppy, I was breaking shots with nowhere near a clean sight picture. Nevertheless, I managed to only shoot a few down zeroes during my four runs with this drill. I was quite surprised how cleanly the shots broke.
After some of the more confusing drills we've shot with my girlfriend in practice, the cognitive challenge of keeping track which target to shoot next didn't really feel much of a challenge. So I suppose we've gained something from our training, at least. :)
Equipment used: Glock 19 jmck George and ccc mag bmc from concealment.
Variations: USPSA targets spaced 1 yard apart. *Disclaimer: I need to look at all the rules before shooting* Hands were relaxed at side and I didn't do slidelock reloads.
I shot this at 7 Yards and 10 Yards. I didn't keep track of misses for each run, just the totals of two combined runs.
7 Yards
8.21
8.10
Penalties: 21a 3c
https://youtu.be/T3-H-ML6bXk
10 Yards
8.66
7.56
Penalties:17a 7c
https://youtu.be/RTrm4FxVhlM
Yikes, I pushed way too hard for speed at ten yards.
I needed to dial it back and get my hits. This was my first time doing any variation of EL Prez. My footwork and stance is rough. I'm leaning back too much.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Sal Picante
03-22-2017, 01:37 PM
Appendix & concealed using a SKD ReadyTac pouch, on steel torso targets (painted white in the middle) at 10 yards about 1-2 yards apart.
4.28 + 2 C: 6.28
(I kinda went for broke...)
Mr_White
03-22-2017, 02:46 PM
Appendix & concealed using a SKD ReadyTac pouch, on steel torso targets (painted white in the middle) at 10 yards about 1-2 yards apart.
4.28 + 2 C: 6.28
(I kinda went for broke...)
Dang....
Sal Picante
03-22-2017, 04:43 PM
Dang....
Never go full retard, except when you go full retard... LOL!
It's been a while since I've shot a full El Pres... I've been working 4 Aces and reloads A LOT tho!
I've gone faster, but this was on video... https://www.facebook.com/wiil.shoot/videos/1452986554972335/?permPage=1
I think this drill is easier on 2 target, tho ...
Sal Picante
03-22-2017, 04:44 PM
Dang....
Also - this Appendix draw stuff is really fun!
Mr_White
03-22-2017, 04:47 PM
Also - this Appendix draw stuff is really fun!
Totally
Never go full retard, except when you go full retard... LOL!
It's been a while since I've shot a full El Pres... I've been working 4 Aces and reloads A LOT tho!
I've gone faster, but this was on video... https://www.facebook.com/wiil.shoot/videos/1452986554972335/?permPage=1
I think this drill is easier on 2 target, tho ...
Man....that is just fantastic!
Sal Picante
03-23-2017, 11:12 AM
Totally
The thing I'm REALLY waiting on is the 92 Keepers holster ... I understand. It is perfect.
Mr_White
03-23-2017, 12:11 PM
The thing I'm REALLY waiting on is the 92 Keepers holster ... I understand. It is perfect.
I sure like my Keepers....
Trigger
03-23-2017, 12:44 PM
Never go full retard, except when you go full retard... LOL!
It's been a while since I've shot a full El Pres... I've been working 4 Aces and reloads A LOT tho!
I've gone faster, but this was on video... https://www.facebook.com/wiil.shoot/videos/1452986554972335/?permPage=1
I think this drill is easier on 2 target, tho ...
Damn that was fast. Well done!
cheshire_cat
03-23-2017, 02:42 PM
4.28 + 2 C: 6.28
Holy Gaucamole
Sal Picante
03-23-2017, 05:20 PM
I'll try to get it on video... Tomorrow or Monday...
Beretta 92G, JMCK AIWB holster
USPSA targets, ten yards, one meter spacing
Three attempts: 11.75, 12.51, 12.05
Penalties: +1, +1, 0
Total score: 12.75, 13.51, 12.05
Split times on my final attempt (12.05 clean)
2.17/.59/.98/.57/1.06/.52/3.01/.49/.92/.43/.88/.43
I was very happy with my results based on where I am right now as a shooter. I went through the process as correctly as I know how. Just more practice time to speed up.
I basically had 1 second splits when changing targets and .5 splits on the same target. It seems like I should be able to get that down to .8/.3 splits and take .3 off my draw and reload. That would get me under 9.5 seconds clean.
Shot this again. Couldn't do the turn due to range restrictions and had to shoot on B8s.
Overall time was 9.11 seconds, before penalties. I think the right target was okay since the shots low would have been in a USPSA A, but I was pushing shots low/left on the left target into what would the C zone. Need to clean up my grip more and slow down to my ability. I have a problem shooting too fast at distance after working all session closer in. Also 2nd shots tended to get shot before I had adequate sight confirmation.
15066
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions Inc. All rights reserved.