Business owners that ban guns responsible for customer's safety...

[BaiHu]

http://www.wtsp.com/mb/news/local/florida/bills-aims-to-hold-businesses-who-ban-guns-responsible-for-customer-safety/396284288

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[El Cid]

Not holding my breath but it's a step in the right direction.

And Bill Jackson's! Glad to see they are still in business. Loved going there as a kid.

ETA: I wonder if they still have the business tucked in the "woods." Looking at it through my adult view finder it seems like a horrible idea for security purposes.

[fishing]

too much gubmint interference if this bill is passed - i'd rather not patronize their business - the choice (while i disagree with such bans) should be that of the business owner.

[Glenn E. Meyer]

Gee - we never discussed that idea before!

I guess there was too much gubmint interference in the candy business in the 1880's to 1900's when hard candy was dyed with lead compounds or chromium ones to get a pretty color.

Where's the popcorn?

[Duces Tecum]

too much gubmint interference if this bill is passed - i'd rather not patronize their business - the choice (while i disagree with such bans) should be that of the business owner.

Hypothetically, what if it was the only pharmacy in town? If you don't patronize them, you don't get the penicillin your doctor prescribed after you answered that last CraigsList ad? "I have my principles!", you say, "I'll just stand here in front of the pharmacy and drip on the sidewalk!"

Remember the Masterpiece Cakeshop issue? That was the bakery that refused to make a wedding cake for the gay couple. The bakery owner's defense was that their religious beliefs would be violated if they were required to bake a cake to celebrate an event they deemed distasteful. The court held for the cake.

In a perfect world a just court might have held that the 2nd Amendment, being an enumerated right and all, removes the business owner's option of requiring law abiding citizens to be disarmed before getting penicillin. Since we don't live in a perfect world, an intermediate step might be to shift the responsibility for customer protection to the business owner. That step says that you can, if you wish, void a person's enumerated right to protect himself. But if you do, you assume the responsibility for his welfare while on your business premises.

[BehindBlueI's]

Does it also prohibit anyone from filing a lawsuit against the business or employees if a patron injures someone?

[BaiHu]

Funny how that "it goes both ways" stuff works, eh?

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[fishing]

Gee - we never discussed that idea before!

I guess there was too much gubmint interference in the candy business in the 1880's to 1900's when hard candy was dyed with lead compounds or chromium ones to get a pretty color.

Where's the popcorn?

food and drug standards do not equal what is going on in this case.

[Glenn E. Meyer]

Gubmint interference is gubmint interference. Why should the government intervene to prevent you from being poisoned or being shot by a crook? After Billy dies of poisoning, just don't go to that business.

This has been discussed into the dirt - we had a long thread about it just awhile ago. Sorry to say - another thread where someone just says 'gubmint' isn't up to the sophisticated arguments we just went over.

Pass the bright red lead popcorn and bright yellow chromium popcorn.

Remember that business gun bans were a prime strategy to make CCW licenses useless. Yawn, this has all been said before.

[Mr. Goodtimes]

Not holding my breath but it's a step in the right direction.

And Bill Jackson's! Glad to see they are still in business. Loved going there as a kid.

ETA: I wonder if they still have the business tucked in the "woods." Looking at it through my adult view finder it seems like a horrible idea for security purposes.

It's still tucked away in the woods.


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[El Cid]

It's still tucked away in the woods.


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If I ever get back to that part of FL I'll have to stop by. I remember as a kid seeing Randall knives in person for the first time there. Prior to that I just drooled over them in magazines. And the scuba and ski training set ups were pretty slick too!

[Sherman A. House DDS]

We recently had this become law in Tennessee. I've noticed a number of posted businesses are no longer posted.


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[JAD]

Businesses that have metal detectors get my attention. Business have all sorts of signage around the front door, and I'm a poor and slow reader.

[ragnar_d]

We recently had this become law in Tennessee. I've noticed a number of posted businesses are no longer posted.


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I remember hearing about that one. The wife wanted to go up to the Galleria in Cool Springs and I'd read online that it was a posted no-go zone. I noticed the signs were absent, only a small blurb posted on the website and then read up a little bit more online. I was pleasantly surprise by that law.

[Sherman A. House DDS]

I remember hearing about that one. The wife wanted to go up to the Galleria in Cool Springs and I'd read online that it was a posted no-go zone. I noticed the signs were absent, only a small blurb posted on the website and then read up a little bit more online. I was pleasantly surprise by that law.

Great! Cool Springs has more, "parking lot crime," (to quote my mentor, Tom Givens) than the mall owners will have you believe. Close to the freeway, and near the edge of the country part of TN, it's an easy escape. They have an Apple Store, and a bunch of other stores that sell items shitbags love to steal and fence.


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[Leroy Suggs]

I ignore the signs and provide my own security. I do not expect a store or cafe to protect me.

[ragnar_d]

Great! Cool Springs has more, "parking lot crime," (to quote my mentor, Tom Givens) than the mall owners will have you believe. Close to the freeway, and near the edge of the country part of TN, it's an easy escape. They have an Apple Store, and a bunch of other stores that sell items shitbags love to steal and fence.


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Yup. That was my read of it as well, especially as it was the time between Thanksgiving and Christmas (I pretty much hate going out in public that time of year, but that's another story). Didn't mind going, but I'm not rolling out naked (to quote the great Walter Sobchak). There was an area down in Birmingham with similar issues (Homewood maybe?). Nice neighborhood, lots of folks with their guard down because it's a "good area" and quick access to I-65.

I think it's a similar story in Huntsville at the newer high end shopping center (Apple Store, 3-4 jewelry stores, White House Black Market type stores). More than a few times I've seen stories of fights/dust ups (http://www.waff.com/story/29805565/police-sheriff-detail-weekend-fights-at-bridge-street), purse snatching (http://www.wbrc.com/story/19531774/huntsville-police-search-for-purse-snatcher), assault (http://www.al.com/news/index.ssf/2016/02/woman_punched_in_the_face_and.html), and all sorts of other fun shenanigans . . . mostly local "yutes". Somehow, management thinks that a no guns sign, a "youth escort policy", and a couple roving Paul Blart types in a Nissan Frontier make all the bad things go away. The place isn't bad, but I don't want the wife to go there at night without me . . . and I don't go there without the Bat Belt.

[blues]

I ignore the signs and provide my own security. I do not expect a store or cafe to protect me.

I've got to get an order in for one of hubcap's throwing stars...;)

http://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/NvUAAOSwMNxXa0vB/s-l300.jpg

[Leroy Suggs]

:cool: :cool:

[TheNewbie]

For me it's simple. Let private business do as they please. I couldn't imagine being told I can't allow guns, and I can't imagine telling someone they have to allow them. If it's the only place in town , then open your own business and allow guns.

Just leave people alone if at all possible.

[fishing]

Gubmint interference is gubmint interference. Why should the government intervene to prevent you from being poisoned or being shot by a crook? After Billy dies of poisoning, just don't go to that business.

This has been discussed into the dirt - we had a long thread about it just awhile ago. Sorry to say - another thread where someone just says 'gubmint' isn't up to the sophisticated arguments we just went over.

Pass the bright red lead popcorn and bright yellow chromium popcorn.

Remember that business gun bans were a prime strategy to make CCW licenses useless. Yawn, this has all been said before.


i don't have the ability to run a lab assay or other test on the food snacks etc that i buy to ensure that they don't contain poison.
i do have the ability to not patronize private businesses for any reason.

it's not worth arguing with you if you seriously believe your analogy to be valid.

[fishing]

I ignore the signs and provide my own security. I do not expect a store or cafe to protect me.

now on the topic brought up by op - do you expect the government to mandate that private businesses protect you after the fact (in the form of liability) should something happen to you in a situation like the one described in the original article?

[TAZ]

Not 100% sure I like more government telling people what they can and can't do. Would have preferred they eliminate any liability the business may face should a patron injure a bystander aka personal responsibility. Eliminate any legal weight of any signs and the only way you can be trespassed if an employee specifically asks you to leave and you refuse. That IMO makes more sense.

[TheNewbie]

Not 100% sure I like more government telling people what they can and can't do. Would have preferred they eliminate any liability the business may face should a patron injure a bystander aka personal responsibility. Eliminate any legal weight of any signs and the only way you can be trespassed if an employee specifically asks you to leave and you refuse. That IMO makes more sense.


Well said.

[BaiHu]

Not 100% sure I like more government telling people what they can and can't do. Would have preferred they eliminate any liability the business may face should a patron injure a bystander aka personal responsibility. Eliminate any legal weight of any signs and the only way you can be trespassed if an employee specifically asks you to leave and you refuse. That IMO makes more sense.
In the end, no sign has stopped a criminal, so... Less government is better, but again it/sign goes both ways.

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[BobLoblaw]

Not 100% sure I like more government telling people what they can and can't do. Would have preferred they eliminate any liability the business may face should a patron injure a bystander aka personal responsibility. Eliminate any legal weight of any signs and the only way you can be trespassed if an employee specifically asks you to leave and you refuse. That IMO makes more sense.

Basically forcing leftist business owners to take the signs down actually helps them. Lost sales due to disrespect of others' 2A rights will be a thing of the past. I like knowing who gets my money.

[Glenn E. Meyer]

My serious analyses are in other threads on this endless topic. Thus, it is boring to repeat them. Search if you want, folks.

In a few simple sentences, if you open your business to the public - I opine you do not have the right to limit the right of self-defense. You don't have to open a business.

Nor do I agree with a strategy designed by antigunners to make carry useless. You are not 'private' if you are open to the public. You accept all kinds of government regulations to be open to the public (subtle point for some).

Here's the last good discussion - so we can move beyond the 'gubmint: https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?23312-quot-Respecting-quot-a-public-establishment-s-quot-Right-quot-to-deny-gun-carrier-s-access/page10&highlight=private+property

[Mjolnir]

The store and everyone in it is Unorganized Militia under The US Code. Case closed. Bring your weapons.

The problem is the INSURANCE COMPANIES.


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