Trump Protesters Attack White Nationalist

[Chance]

From CNN.com (http://www.cnn.com/2017/01/20/politics/white-nationalist-richard-spencer-punched/):


Alt-right founder Richard Spencer was punched on Friday during an interview with the Australian Broadcasting Corporation near President Donald Trump's inauguration.

Video posted online by the outlet shows the white supremacist speaking to Washington bureau chief Zoe Daniel when he was interrupted by individuals off camera.

....

As Spencer was speaking, a masked individual ran up, socked him in the face and fled. Spencer left, later tweeting there was, "no serious damage."

I don't know anything about Richard Spencer, and I'm not posting this because I agree with or advocate his political opinion. But a guy getting punched is not why I think the story's remarkable: it's remarkable because of liberals' reaction to it.

From The New York Times: Attack on Alt-Right Leader Has Internet Asking: Is It O.K. to Punch a Nazi? (https://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/21/us/politics/richard-spencer-punched-attack.html?_r=0) There are people out there who are straight-up condoning violence against people they disagree with. Their cognitive dissonance gives me a headache:

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The guy that tweeted that must be a Nazi sympathizer, right? Here's his profile:

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To be clear: if Richard Spencer were hit by a train, I couldn't possibly be bothered to give a fuck. And, obviously, a vast number of liberals are appalled by this attack too, so I don't want to overgeneralize.

I'm just genuinely alarmed at how many people think they're so progressive that it's time to start silencing the "other side" with violence. I'm worried we might look back on this event as the first shot in a kinetic social war.

[blues]

I don't see anything new in regards to the reaction to people of Spencer's ilk so much...but rather the avenues of communication and rebroadcast that are available due to social media.

I can remember as a kid the attempts made on (and ultimate assassination of) George Lincoln Rockwell.

There have always been folks inclined to believe that anything was fair game in furtherance of their politics or point of view. But now we see and hear about it without respite.

[LOKNLOD]

When utopia is the prize, all means are valid to achieve it.

Unfortunately, the fastest way to get to dystopia is to head towards utopia and then take a hard left.

[blues]

When utopia is the prize, all means are valid to achieve it.

Unfortunately, the fastest way to get to dystopia is to head towards utopia and then take a hard left.

I'll only argue to the extent of saying that, imho, neither extreme, hard left or hard right, is something to be wished for.

[txdpd]

For all we know Spencer paid someone to punch him. For all we this Koopa doesn't even exist and is a paid hack to write stupid crap to get people "outraged".

The real question isn't "is it okay to punch a nazi" but "is there any better way to generate revenue for an attention whore nazi and attention whores on social media, than the nazi getting punched on live television?"

Unsurprisingly most of these "outrageous" things turn out to be manufactured events.

[John Hearne]

Don't have time to get a link for you, but look at Ben Shapiro's videos on Youtube where he discusses microagressions. His point is that the whole rationale about microagressions is that they ultimately allow macroagressions - i.e. physical violence.

[Chance]

I can remember as a kid the attempts made on (and ultimate assassination of) George Lincoln Rockwell.


Wasn't around then. I guess I'm just surprised at how open people are being in their condoning this. They're not even bothering with the pretense of being nonviolent and then condoning it with a wink-and-a-nod.


For all we know Spencer paid someone to punch him. For all we this Koopa doesn't even exist and is a paid hack to write stupid crap to get people "outraged".


I understand what you're saying, but I'm just providing a small sample of the stuff I've seen. There are numerous people I know for a fact are real and share those opinions. People's reaction is what I find troubling, not whether this was an actual attack or just something to provoke a reaction.

[ssb]

The NYT did an article on this that was heavily shared on my Facebook, something along the lines of "Is it OK to punch a Nazi?" There was a whole lot of "I don't condone violence but..." thrown around, both in the article and the reactions that I read. Baffling that they fancy themselves arbiters of just whose speech is an appropriate trigger for physical violence. Many of them live in a bubble (academia) where everybody around them thinks as they do (or in the alternative is too cowed to speak up), and I don't think they'd like it very much if all those people they try hard to disguise their disgust for had a say in whose speech earns a punch in the mouth.

As an aside, this administration's transition has taught me that I really need to figure out a better way to keep in contact with some people, one that doesn't expose me to everybody's political view affirmation. People that should be smarter often aren't.

[LOKNLOD]

I'll only argue to the extent of saying that, imho, neither extreme, hard left or hard right, is something to be wished for.

Agreed, and in the end both looking a lot alike, anyways.

[blues]

Wasn't around then. I guess I'm just surprised at how open people are being in their condoning this. They're not even bothering with the pretense of being nonviolent and then condoning it with a wink-and-a-nod.

If there's a silver lining, however tarnished, it's that that info is useful. Both in allowing you to be aware that this is the case...and perhaps, in helping to identify the miscreants if it ever should come to that.

Having been raised on the notion that defending the rights of even those folks we don't care for was the proper course of conduct by which to live our lives, I have been sorely disappointed for a good long time. That said, I refuse to abandon that belief and I suppose it will get me into trouble (yet again) before my time is through.

[Edwin]

For context on who this Nazi is, here is some of his writing.

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[blues]

It does test the limits of one's resolve to defend another's rights. (I'd say more but I don't think it would be appropriate.)

[Robinson]

Whoever wrote that crap is an asshole. He has the right to be an asshole. I have the right to call him an asshole.

[Zincwarrior]

Is it ok to punch a Nazi? If watching Indiana Jones 10,000 times has taught me anything, its you betcha. He really hates those guys.

I don't think this guy was a Nazi though. He don't think he even has a bad German accent.

Seriously though: I have no problem blowing the brains of real genuine Nazis onto the nearest wall. But to be a Nazi you would have to be at least 90, I don't see the issue.

American Nazis aren't Nazis, just losers. Supremacists aren't Nazis, just losers. The Nazi Party literally died in the Spring of 1945.

[Joe in PNG]

Illinois nazis... I hate Illinois nazis!

That said, you protect everyone's free speech mainly to protect you own. Even bastard nazi wannabees.
Best to let the idiot babble on. It's great when idiots let you know they are idiots by opening their gob and telling you directly.

But, attempts to suppress speech usually empowers the idiot. Why are people trying to shut this person up? What is he trying to say? And if a billion clickbait headlines have taught me anything, controversy and forbidden subjects sell, and sell well.

[Zincwarrior]

Illinois nazis... I hate Illinois nazis!

That said, you protect everyone's free speech mainly to protect you own. Even bastard nazi wannabees.
Best to let the idiot babble on. It's great when idiots let you know they are idiots by opening their gob and telling you directly.

But, attempts to suppress speech usually empowers the idiot. Why are people trying to shut this person up? What is he trying to say? And if a billion clickbait headlines have taught me anything, controversy and forbidden subjects sell, and sell well.

Agreed, instead of shutting them up, just point and laugh. Its fun for the whole family.

[Jeep]

Is it ok to punch out a Nazi? If it is, it is also ok to punch out a commie (there really isn't a dime's worth of difference between them--both violent collectivist trying to create Utopias no sensible person would want to live in), and there were a whole lot more commies in Washington this past Friday than Nazis--including, presumably, the puncher in this case.

But to the American left, talking about punching out Nazis is just virtue signaling. It shows they are down with the struggle while they pursue their bourgeois lifestyles. They have no intention of personally taking any risks.

[Win94ae]

Nazis are easy to spot, they are the violent ones.

[Indy5000]

The NYT did an article on this that was heavily shared on my Facebook, something along the lines of "Is it OK to punch a Nazi?" There was a whole lot of "I don't condone violence but..." thrown around, both in the article and the reactions that I read. Baffling that they fancy themselves arbiters of just whose speech is an appropriate trigger for physical violence. Many of them live in a bubble (academia) where everybody around them thinks as they do (or in the alternative is too cowed to speak up), and I don't think they'd like it very much if all those people they try hard to disguise their disgust for had a say in whose speech earns a punch in the mouth.

As an aside, this administration's transition has taught me that I really need to figure out a better way to keep in contact with some people, one that doesn't expose me to everybody's political view affirmation. People that should be smarter often aren't.

Please share if you find one!

[Edwin]

Is it ok to punch a Nazi? If watching Indiana Jones 10,000 times has taught me anything, its you betcha. He really hates those guys.

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[Totem Polar]

Unfortunately, the fastest way to get to dystopia is to head towards utopia and then take a hard left.

Brilliant.



...Many of them live in a bubble (academia) where everybody around them thinks as they do (or in the alternative is too cowed to speak up), and I don't think they'd like it very much if all those people they try hard to disguise their disgust for had a say in whose speech earns a punch in the mouth.

As an aside, this administration's transition has taught me that I really need to figure out a better way to keep in contact with some people, one that doesn't expose me to everybody's political view affirmation. People that should be smarter often aren't.

I concur on both fronts.

[MickAK]

For context on who this Nazi is, here is some of his writing.

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I really despise that this person is even being discussed, or had a camera on him to witness his punching, or is in the news and getting good people conflated with what he represents.

Despite that, you are spreading a lie. The text in the image you shared was not written by Richard Spencer, it was published in an online magazine he edited, and was subsequently removed. The author is Colin Lidell, and the context was that this is how people treat the whites of South Africa.

I debated even bringing that up, because I don't particularly care and I find Spencer douchey and someone popularized by the media in an attempt to demonize Trump. But, you shouldn't spread things on the internet if you can't be bothered to fact check them slightly. That is a cause of a lot of problems today. If you want to share something, research it a little. Don't just copy and paste or hit the share button. We can all use a reminder of that from time to time. Thanks.

[Chance]

But, you shouldn't spread things on the internet if you can't be bothered to fact check them slightly. That is a cause of a lot of problems today. If you want to share something, research it a little.

In all fairness, finding objective facts about someone like this is pretty challenging, if not impossible. There's far too much hyperbole around these polarizing figures, and people don't seem to know what some of the words they're using means (seriously: "fascism" was Merriam-Webster's most searched for word (http://mashable.com/2016/12/19/merriam-webster-surreal-word-of-the-year/#Rb6gnNXgQiqS) last year).

That's tertiary to the point of my original post: I don't know anything about the guy, just that he was subjected to violence by someone on the opposite end of the political spectrum, and a lot of people don't seem to think that's a bad thing. I think it's a bad thing, and I think people not thinking it's a bad thing is a bad thing.

[MickAK]

In all fairness, finding objective facts about someone like this is pretty challenging, if not impossible.

It took me about 4 minutes. It does take a bit of practice.



That's tertiary to the point of my original post: I don't know anything about the guy, just that he was subjected to violence by someone on the opposite end of the political spectrum, and a lot of people don't seem to think that's a bad thing. I think it's a bad thing, and I think people not thinking it's a bad thing is a bad thing.

There is always a line. If someone is in a public space near me speaking freely about the joys of pedophilia and how it needs to be more understood and accepted he will be one knocked out individual shortly. The problem is where the line is drawn, who put it there, and who ends up on the other side.

[Edwin]

I really despise that this person is even being discussed, or had a camera on him to witness his punching, or is in the news and getting good people conflated with what he represents.

Despite that, you are spreading a lie. The text in the image you shared was not written by Richard Spencer, it was published in an online magazine he edited, and was subsequently removed. The author is Colin Lidell, and the context was that this is how people treat the whites of South Africa.

I debated even bringing that up, because I don't particularly care and I find Spencer douchey and someone popularized by the media in an attempt to demonize Trump. But, you shouldn't spread things on the internet if you can't be bothered to fact check them slightly. That is a cause of a lot of problems today. If you want to share something, research it a little. Don't just copy and paste or hit the share button. We can all use a reminder of that from time to time. Thanks.

Ah my mistake, I attributed the article wrongly as his work instead of the website he created so that only makes him slightly less disgusting of a human being. Thanks for the correction!

edit: tl;dr It's not a lie, it's an alternative fact. ;)