The hunters side arm, can 9mm work?

[flux]

I have dispatched a fair amount of injured plains game with a 9mm with headshots with no issues.(even .380 worked on two occasions)I have hunted small game as well very carefully using a 9mm , but had mixed results,this was ages ago. For a dedicated handgun for the African plains, where non dangerous game will be encountered, any merit in running 45 over 9mm? Seeing that dangerous game is out of the equation, should I just stick with 9mm. Am I correct in saying .45 is more versatile for this role.
I have heard of people hunting deer with G21 sized guns, I don't mind trying this on smaller game, will the 45 be a better choice in this regard. My knowledge of handgun calibers performance on game is limited.

[FPS]

Fwiw, an Alaskan guide last summer killed a grizzly with 9mm hard cast penetrator ammo from buffalo bore (he stayed calm and knew where to shoot). So it is possible, but not sure if it is optimal or not in your case.

[PNWTO]

The guy at HiPowersandHandguns.com, or whatever, routinely used to hunt deer with a 9mm Hi Power.

I think the core of your question is really dependent on location, as well as bullets. I'm usually more wary of two legged predators than four legged ones, so my G19 suffices a good deal of the time. We have a huge cougar population, but I feel that 9 is appropriate and that if a cougar really decides you're it, you wont have much warning. ECQC for cougars, anyone?

Now if I'm in the backcountry hunting, especially close to the Canadian border, then I have to plan for bears.

[FPS]

The guy at HiPowersandHandguns.com, or whatever, routinely used to hunt deer with a 9mm Hi Power.

I think the core of your question is really dependent on location, as well as bullets. I'm usually more wary of two legged predators than four legged ones, so my G19 suffices a good deal of the time. We have a huge cougar population, but I feel that 9 is appropriate and that if a cougar really decides you're it, you wont have much warning. ECQC for cougars, anyone?

Now if I'm in the backcountry hunting, especially close to the Canadian border, then I have to plan for bears.

Sounds like you live near where I live (Eastern WA?)

[flux]

One of the reasons I chose not to include revolvers in this discussion, was due to the 2 legged threat being prevalent, farm attacks etc. here. So semi s capacity is a factor.

[PNWTO]

Sounds like you live near where I live (Eastern WA?)

Yep! Near Yakistan.

[PNWTO]

One of the reasons I chose not to include revolvers in this discussion, was due to the 2 legged threat being prevalent, farm attacks etc. here. So semi s capacity is a factor.

Frankly, GJM's USP 45 thread is a gold mine of info on this very topic. Between his experiences and Lost River's, there is a grand argument to be made for a handy .45.

[Malamute]

I have dispatched a fair amount of injured plains game with a 9mm with headshots with no issues.(even .380 worked on two occasions)I have hunted small game as well very carefully using a 9mm , but had mixed results,this was ages ago. For a dedicated handgun for the African plains, where non dangerous game will be encountered, any merit in running 45 over 9mm? Seeing that dangerous game is out of the equation, should I just stick with 9mm. Am I correct in saying .45 is more versatile for this role.
I have heard of people hunting deer with G21 sized guns, I don't mind trying this on smaller game, will the 45 be a better choice in this regard. My knowledge of handgun calibers performance on game is limited.

Are you able to use any load you want or are you restricted in the loads you can use or limited in whats available

If stuck with FMJ Id want to go with 45. May still want to go with 45 if good field loads are available, it gives a little more upward mobility in game size.

[GJM]

Bill Wilson has reported good success harvesting hogs in TX with a Beretta 92 and Barnes JHP. With good bullet placement, he says it drops them about like a .308.

I want .45 with Super ammo for penetrating a bear's skull, since that requirement strikes me as pass/fail, in that you penetrate the skull or not. Otherwise, a 9mm with good ammo wouldn't bother me a bit, especially considering the situation you describe.

[Artemas2]

How thick is a bear skull? I ask because the common practice in my area for euthanizing cattle/most other livestock is a .22 lr to a "soft spot" in the skull, some butchers claim that bigger bullets tend to deflect and just piss Bessie off.
Generally the animal is not angry and trying to eat you so shot placement tends to be easier.

Not that I would consider a 22lr for bear defense:) just something I thought might be of interest.

[M2CattleCo]

I killed many hogs back in the day with 124 NATO. You just have to get it in the brain.

[Lost River]

A properly loaded .45 ACP is not too much different than the original .45 Colt loads used for years to dispatch everything up to and including American Bison. While I prefer a 9mm for use against human threats, when it comes to animals, many of which can sometimes be exceedingly difficult to put down (even after receiving mortal wounds) I very much prefer a .45 in a semi auto.

If looking for a single semi auto handgun to fulfill the role of Outdoorsman's sidearm for animal applications, as well as potentially using the same gun for defense against human aggressors, without a doubt, I would opt for the .45.

[Skeeter]

Here's the American Hunter article https://www.americanhunter.org/articles/2016/8/10/alaska-outfitter-defends-fishermen-from-raging-grizzly-with-9mm-pistol/ about the Alaska guide stopping a Grizzly with Buffalo Bore Outdoorsman 9mm (https://www.buffalobore.com/index.php?l=product_detail&p=388).

Heck, I purchased some of this ammo after reading the article, and coincidentally test fired a few rounds last night in a G19. Didn't note any different POI at 25 yards, and didn't notice more recoil even though it's +P. It's a hard-cast flat nose 147 grain bullet (1100 FPS) that's designed to penetrate deep rather than expand.

[Malamute]

A properly loaded .45 ACP is not too much different than the original .45 Colt loads used for years to dispatch everything up to and including American Bison. While I prefer a 9mm for use against human threats, when it comes to animals, many of which can sometimes be exceedingly difficult to put down (even after receiving mortal wounds) I very much prefer a .45 in a semi auto.

If looking for a single semi auto handgun to fulfill the role of Outdoorsman's sidearm for animal applications, as well as potentially using the same gun for defense against human aggressors, without a doubt, I would opt for the .45.

I seem to approach the "people gun for animals" vs the "animal gun for people" question in reverse from many. I feel better with the larger revolver for animals and will make it do for other uses (may be a product of my environs). As far as autos go though, I loaded some Lyman/Keith 452424 260 gr 45 Colt bullets in 45 auto in the past, they shot fine for the small amount I tried. I believe they were right on 45 Colt velocities for the 255-260 gr bullets. The bullet type had a noticable improvement over RN bullets on effect on animals. If using an auto for all purposes, Id get some more of them loaded and tried in the current gun.

[1slow]

Frankly, GJM's USP 45 thread is a gold mine of info on this very topic. Between his experiences and Lost River's, there is a grand argument to be made for a handy .45.

This !

[flux]

Regarding .45 , I know there isn't a significant difference in performance with regards to humans, does this change when shooting at game?
Secondly, how does the performance of the 45 get affected out out of shorter barrels, like out of a G30?
I have read that thread, made me want an HK which are almost unobtainable here.

[bravo7]

While bow hunting in the back country I prefer a G20 with underwood pills in extended mags.

[DocGKR]

9 mm works fine as a hunting back-up, particularly in the lower-48 where large bears are not as common.

[flux]

9 mm works fine as a hunting back-up, particularly in the lower-48 where large bears are not as common.

Great, seeing that it dispatches injured game and may just encounter hogs, would you advise sticking to the 147gr Ranger T load , the other option are 110gr non expanding brass bullets that penetrate like crazy.

[DocGKR]

Not going to matter much in that environment, as long as shot placement is good.

[Chance]

I ask because the common practice in my area for euthanizing cattle/most other livestock is a .22 lr to a "soft spot" in the skull....

I've seen that go horribly wrong. Five additional shots later and the pig was still squealing. Supposed to be a demo of how effective the technique was, so they didn't bother bringing additional rounds, or an additional firearm.

[Welder]

I've seen that go horribly wrong. Five additional shots later and the pig was still squealing. Supposed to be a demo of how effective the technique was, so they didn't bother bringing additional rounds, or an additional firearm.

I have seen the exact same thing with a steer.

[SLG]

I have seen the exact same thing with a steer.

Me too, but with a squirrel. :-)

[serialsolver]

I have seen the exact same thing with a steer.

I did that to an old cow. Three rounds of 44 sp and she just looked at me. Ya got to know were the brain pan is. I know now.


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[Tabasco]

There's a guy round these parts who works for a local meat processing facility. He comes by with a special trailer for the carcass and a .22 rifle. Cow is down, gutted, and in the trailer in about 1/2 hour. Never seen him screw it up. He says you need to use solid bullets, I think he uses Remington Yellowjackets or Hornets, whichever is non-hollowpoint. Have to hit them in the "X" formed between the eyes and horns.

[Flintsky]

Bill Wilson has reported good success harvesting hogs in TX with a Beretta 92 and Barnes JHP. With good bullet placement, he says it drops them about like a .308.

I want .45 with Super ammo for penetrating a bear's skull, since that requirement strikes me as pass/fail, in that you penetrate the skull or not. Otherwise, a 9mm with good ammo wouldn't bother me a bit, especially considering the situation you describe.

I took a hog a few months ago with a Sig MPX 9mm using Federal 147gr HST. I had a nice broadside shot that hit the heart and it dropped that hog quick......almost like a rifle hit.

[MickAK]

The reason I switch sidearms for woods work is muzzle flash. It's entirely unscientific. I've seen more than one animal attempt to be scared off by a shot and whether or not they see the flash tends to determine whether they nope off or get more aggravated, or just stay put. My personal view, from examining a few brown bear and hog skulls is that any service caliber with decent ammo will penetrate sufficiently if the angle is right, which has a lot more to do with luck on the bounce of a charge (slight dips up and down, up slope or down slope, angle of fire) than marksmanship (as long as you hit the spot). Also why I practice moving to the right while firing when I'm practicing with my woods gun. I thought a few times about making a thread asking opinions but it seems a little thin for a whole thread, maybe it could tag on to this one.

To the 9mm vs. .45 question if you tagged a shoulder bone the extra mass might help. Otherwise I wouldn't expect much difference.