a truly dumb Wilderness Belt question (and maybe a few that aren't)

[s0nspark]

Ok, I am contemplating switching to a Wilderness belt from the Looper leather belt I have been using that is on its last leg. I have not seen one in action, though, and am unclear about the velcro - does it fold back over top of one's belt loops? I feel dumb even asking that but I'm just trying to make sure it will work with my clothing.

Is there any downside to going with the Frequent Flyer over a traditional Instructor?

Also, 5-stitch/CSM or no? I remember vaguely reading something that Gabe Suarez said about a really stiff belt actually not working as well for AIWB. Thoughts?

Thanks for helping a belt noob ;-)

[JV_]

When you fold the strap over (velcro) to secure it, it does go over the outside of some loops. I like the stiffness of the 5 stitch belt. It's not too stiff, but it's not flimsy either, and it works well (for me) with AIWB. I would choose the frequent flier plastic buckle over the metal one.

Out of curiosity, what size are you looking for?

[s0nspark]

When you fold the strap over (velcro) to secure it, it does go over the outside of some loops. I like the stiffness of the 5 stitch belt. It's not too stiff, but it's not flimsy either, and it works well (for me) with AIWB. I would choose the frequent flier plastic buckle over the metal one.

Out of curiosity, what size are you looking for?

Thanks - that was how I was leaning but didn't want to make any assumptions :-)

I will need a 38" I believe...

[VolGrad]

When you fold the strap over (velcro) to secure it, it does go over the outside of some loops. I like the stiffness of the 5 stitch belt. It's not too stiff, but it's not flimsy either, and it works well (for me) with AIWB. I would choose the frequent flier plastic buckle over the metal one.
I agree with everything in this post up to the recommendation of the FF plastic buckle model.

I have a 5-Stitch in black, a CSM in Coyote, both in 1.5". Frankly, I can't tell much difference between the stiffness of the two. They don't carry any different for me. I say skip the exta $5 the CSM adds and stick with the 5-Stitch.

I also have a black 5-Stitch Frequent Flyer in 1.5" (with the plastic round buckle). I wouldn't have bought this one but picked it up from a buddy (actually traded a leather belt for it).

I would like to tell you the FF belt doesn't carry as well as the regular Instructor belts but that wouldn't be an honest assessment. I actually think it carries about the same. If not the same, the difference is negligible. While the round plastic buckle on the FF belt does seem a bit less "tactical" than the large V shaped metal buckle on the regular instructor I don't like it quite as well. It probably is plenty tough but the plastic feels .... well, like plastic.

I'd suggest going with the regular Instructor belt with the metal buckle in 5-Stitch.

[s0nspark]

I'd suggest going with the regular Instructor belt with the metal buckle in 5-Stitch.

Thanks - I definitely prefer the look of the regular Instructor buckle (tacticool or not) ... the FF buckle is reminiscent of an infinity symbol and I don't want people equating that with my waistline LOL

[Al T.]

Be careful when ordering one. They don't measure like other belts.

http://www.thewilderness.com/storepinnacle/index.php?p=page&page_id=Belt%20Sizing/FAQ

[s0nspark]

Be careful when ordering one. They don't measure like other belts.

http://www.thewilderness.com/storepinnacle/index.php?p=page&page_id=Belt%20Sizing/FAQ

Yes, I was basing my 38" guesstimate on their instructions... thanks for the heads up in any case!

[ToddG]

I've been using a Frequent Flyer for quite a while now and think it is outstanding. As for its appearance, it's a belt I wear underneath an untucked cover garment so the only people who'll ever see it are me, my wife, anyone I'm about to shoot, and students/friends on the range. From among that crowd, none of them are likely to have a meaningful opinion on my belt buckle's appearance. YMMV.

[s0nspark]

I've been using a Frequent Flyer for quite a while now and think it is outstanding. As for its appearance, it's a belt I wear underneath an untucked cover garment so the only people who'll ever see it are me, my wife, anyone I'm about to shoot, and students/friends on the range. From among that crowd, none of them are likely to have a meaningful opinion on my belt buckle's appearance. YMMV.

LOL - thanks Todd.

I am not a frequent flyer (in fact I have never flown) but I wouldn't want a hassle if I needed to hop a plane unexpectedly.

The delrin buckle is rugged in your opinion?

[GJM]

I have worn a 1.5 inch Wilderness Instructors belt with the Titanium buckle for years. I think the lighter weight of the Titanium buckle is worth the extra cost. I like the non-black colors.

[ToddG]

I am not a frequent flyer (in fact I have never flown) but I wouldn't want a hassle if I needed to hop a plane unexpectedly.

I got it specifically so I wouldn't have to take my belt off at airports. Now you have to take your belt off regardless at many airports because they want to examine your orifices via x-ray.


The delrin buckle is rugged in your opinion?

Well, I am not rugged in my opinion so I could be the wrong person to ask. It's certainly held up well to substantial range use. It's obviously not intended to serve as a rigger's belt.

[GJM]

The buckle on Frequent Flyer and Instructor belt is durable. What wears out is the webbing and velcro, and The Wilderness will replace the web belt/velcro for less than a new belt.

[s0nspark]

The buckle on Frequent Flyer and Instructor belt is durable. What wears out is the webbing and velcro, and The Wilderness will replace the web belt/velcro for less than a new belt.

Cool! Thanks for the info...

[LittleLebowski]

Be careful when ordering one. They don't measure like other belts.

http://www.thewilderness.com/storepinnacle/index.php?p=page&page_id=Belt%20Sizing/FAQ

Could you explain?

[wrt81]

I use the Frequent Flyer belt as well. I have them in 5 stitch and the CSM models. The CSM models are slightly stiffer but the 5 stitch work fine as well. I opted for the Frequent Flyer version based on the cheaper price. They have held up fine over the ~2 years I've had them.

[Chefdog]

So, the consensus is that the CSM isn't worth the extra $ over the 5 stitch. What about the regular 3 stitch? Is it just too soft to use as a gunbelt?
The FF belts are on sale right now, and I'm going to get one, just thought I'd see if anyone has tried the 3 stitch and how it worked out.

[SmokeJumper]

I'm a little late to this post, but I can't say enough about the Wilderness belts, great USA made gear. I've been wearing one since college with zero issues. For starters, sizing- follow the directions for sizing on the website. As a side note, I've found that two different sizes work great for me, one for OWB carry and the a slightly longer one for IWB/AIWB carry, probably just my personal preference, but a few guys from work do the same thing. Secondly, quality is outstanding and if you wear out your velcro or need to move up or down a size, they will replace/repair your velcro for free, and just send in your old buckle and they'll sew your new belt on it for less $ than a new belt. The loose/bitter end does fold over a belt loop or two deepending on your loops and size. Some guys do thread it through, I do not care to do so. Rigidity is very good, I've found for regular concealed carry the 5-stitch is the only way to go, rigid, yet still flexible for sitting, driving, in/out of vehicles etc. The CSM is betters suited if your gonna hang/run sub loads, just my opinion. As for the Frequent Flyer, its good, just no metal so if you fly a lot or go to government buildings and walk through metal detectors on a regular basis, it is a good choice. I use one occasionally to break it up and try something different or lighter, but the weight thing is negligible. Otherwise I go with the metal buckle, I like the sturdy metal buckle the best, just my opinion again. I've worn traditional riggers belts, Ares Gear Ranger belts, but always come back to my Wilderness belts. Enjoy your belt, but be warned, you'll most likely own more than one!

[Odin Bravo One]

Well, I am not rugged in my opinion so I could be the wrong person to ask. It's certainly held up well to substantial range use. It's obviously not intended to serve as a rigger's belt.

FWIW, Rigger's Belt's are not exactly meant to rope with, even though they have the handy V-Ring. You can do it............but I don't recommend it. It is not pleasant. And I really don't recommend it with the plastic belt.

[Al T.]

Could you explain?

If you go to the store and buy a belt for your 36 inch waist, that belt is actually cut a bit bigger for your clothing. If you order a 36 inch belt from wilderness, you get a belt that is precisely 36 inches. This is usually too short.

From the link:


Our standard Original Instructor, Titanium Instructor and Frequent Flyer Belts are sized by a true measured belt size to the nearest single inch, not a two inch range or generic small, medium, large, etc. Our Sport and Easy-Fit belts have more generous sizing, but we still strongly recommend checking your actual size. We ask that you put a cloth tape through the belt loops of the pants that you would normally wear the belt with, pulling as tightly as you typically pull a belt, and measure to the nearest single inch. If you regularly wear an in-the-waistband holster and mag pouches, we recommend you place them in your pants for measuring.

[rudy99]

If you go to the store and buy a belt for your 36 inch waist, that belt is actually cut a bit bigger for your clothing. If you order a 36 inch belt from wilderness, you get a belt that is precisely 36 inches. This is usually too short.

From the link:

+1. I wear 34 sized pants and purchased a 34 sized Wilderness belt. I can barely get the velcro to make contact and will most likely be purchasing a larger size.

On another note, does everyone wear this belt with the buckle at 12 o'clock? I have noticed if I get a bigger size, the tail end of the belt will run into my holster. I believe I've seen one person who wore the Wilderness belt with the buckle at something like 10 o'clock. I'm not sure how you AIWB people use this belt and get the holster on.

[VolGrad]

I generally have mine pulled just left of 12 o'clock, not really 11 as it's still inside the first two belt loops.

I do it for the same reason you mentioned.

[JV_]

On another note, does everyone wear this belt with the buckle at 12 o'clock? I have noticed if I get a bigger size, the tail end of the belt will run into my holster. I believe I've seen one person who wore the Wilderness belt with the buckle at something like 10 o'clock. I'm not sure how you AIWB people use this belt and get the holster on.

With AIWB, I put the buckle at 4-5 o'clock.

[wrt81]

On another note, does everyone wear this belt with the buckle at 12 o'clock? I have noticed if I get a bigger size, the tail end of the belt will run into my holster. I believe I've seen one person who wore the Wilderness belt with the buckle at something like 10 o'clock. I'm not sure how you AIWB people use this belt and get the holster on.

I wear my buckle at 12 oclock but I wear the belt "reversed", I thread it starting on the right and go around instead of the usual way of starting on the left side. This keeps it from hitting my holster clips/straps on the right side (I wear my holster just behind the hip 330-4oclockish).

[Shellback]

I wear my buckle at 12 oclock but I wear the belt "reversed", I thread it starting on the right and go around instead of the usual way of starting on the left side. This keeps it from hitting my holster clips/straps on the right side (I wear my holster just behind the hip 330-4oclockish).

That's exactly how they recommend wearing them when you purchase one at the store to eliminate the overlapping problem. I wear mine so often that I get a little confused wearing a "normal" belt threading it through the loops the right way. I got mine when I was in the PHX area about 3 years ago, stopped in to the store/factory, and they whipped out a custom made one for me right on the spot.

[Kyle Reese]

FWIW I love mine- wear it every day in Afghanistan with no complaints. Money well spent.

[VolGrad]

That's exactly how they recommend wearing them when you purchase one at the store to eliminate the overlapping problem. I wear mine so often that I get a little confused wearing a "normal" belt threading it through the loops the right way. I got mine when I was in the PHX area about 3 years ago, stopped in to the store/factory, and they whipped out a custom made one for me right on the spot.

Doesn't that just put the overlap part in the way of your extra mag pouches? It does for me.

[Shellback]

Doesn't that just put the overlap part in the way of your extra mag pouches? It does for me.

It hasn't affected placement of my mag pouch but the "tail" usuall ends up butting up to the leading edge of the pouch in my normal carrying position, roughly 9:00. One thing to keep in mind is that these belts are hand made so there will be some slight differences in sizes along with people ordering the improper size due to being unfamiliar with exactly what they need.

Also, people place their gear at different intervals and spacing so what may work for me in my carrying positions may not work for others due to physique, holster/pouch size and placement and proper length of the belt. I know this is obvious but I'm practicing my typing skills. ;)

Either that or I just got lucky with the sizing on mine.

[ToddG]

My FF buckle is at 2 o'clock and the velcro wraps around my right side to about 4 o'clock. Makes potty breaks a little more difficult but otherwise it works well.

I had been putting the buckle at 10 o'clock just forward of my mag pouch, with the velcro ending just before my pistol at 1 o'clock. But now that I'm carrying a Clinch Pick at 11 o'clock I cannot fit a double width of belt there.

[JDM]

Wilderness Ti 5 stitch. 32" waist and 35" belt.

I start threading my buckle at 4 o'clock toward my left side. My mag pouch is split by the first belt loop to the left of my fly, and I place my shaggy just left of the first loop to the right of my fly at about 1:00. Then the tail gets fed through the buckle and secured. There is usually just enough belt left over to tuck into the loop on my Shaggy. The little bit of extra thickness helps keep the holster where it should be.

I also thread the tail of my belt through my belt loops rather than laying it atop them.

Todd is right, bathroom breaks become a bit more interesting with appendix carry.

[JohnN]

If you guys didn't sit down to pee things would be easier for you:).

[Sparks2112]

I'm actually going to disent here and say go for the CSM. I've got the 1.75" CSM and it's excellent for hanging crap off of. Service pistol, 2 reloads, light, knife. Also I'm not skinny anymore and this belt does a great job containing my Krispy Kreme diet results. Ymmv

[s0nspark]

I meant to follow up and say that I went with the 5-stitch frequent flyer... it was the cheaper option and I figured that would be a good place to start with something that was (for me) untried.

Well..... I love this belt!

It is light, sturdy, and very secure... My old leather belt will be lucky to even see the light of day now! :-)

Thanks for all of the advice!