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07-26-2016, 08:06 PM
I was wondering what shooters do here in regards to reloading and tracking brass. Do you tend to keep your brass in batches, and then when some start showing signs of wear, throw the lot out, or do you just mix everything together, and throw out individual cases when they begin to age?

(And if the former - how do you go about keeping your brass in batches. Do you mark them, or just always keep them separate and do more tumbles for different batches, etc)?

I was thinking of keeping them in batches of 100's, but then realised that these would get mixed up when shooting WA1500 after picking them up after the event. Keeping them in batches of 200's - there would be 50 not shot. I can see with spares not shot, etc that it all started to get complicated and was wondering if it was worth while, or if there's a method to make it easier?

GyroF-16
07-26-2016, 08:59 PM
Well, I'm pretty new to reloading (less than a year), but here's what I do:
After a shooting session (typically 150 rds), I pick up that brass and put it in a ziplock bag. Then with a Sharpie, I'll write "3x fired" or whatever's appropriate on the bag. When I have enough 3x or whatever brass, (like 400-500) I'll clean it all in one batch. Then I goes into a gallon ziplock labled "3x fired, cleaned". Then when I reload it, I'll put a "4" on the ammo box, so I'll know what to write on the next ziplock when I pick up the brass. I have a couple of thousand of brass, so I don't have any with more than 4-5 firings yet. I figure when I get to 10 firings, I'll dispose of it (this is .40 S&W).
I also sort brass by manufacturer (all Speer together, Federal, Winchester, etc) and reload and shoot them as a batch. I can't really articulate a good reason for this, other than a bit of OCD on my part, I guess. I have found that primer seating in "lower quality" ammo brass (like S&B), is significantly more difficult, so I've been avoiding it.

Hope that helps.
I'll be interested to hear if others have different methods that I can adopt.

Gyro

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07-26-2016, 09:10 PM
Thanks for the idea Gyro..

I mostly load 9mm and 38 specials... not sure if it's worth tracking them or not, but the idea of combining them into x shots fired so they can get mixed up provided they're with others of the same 'age' sounds sensible and achievable. (Except I may need to buy more brass :) )

MGW
07-26-2016, 09:16 PM
I'm not shooting high enough pressures to worry about it (9mm or .45). I get a lot of once fired brass from various sources. I keep it separate from my range brass and use it for matches. After the match I mix it in with my range brass. Enough range brass gets lost or left at places that I can't pick up brass that it doesn't get reloaded tons of times.

They only cases I've ever had issues with is nickel plated so I just don't reload nickel plated anymore.

Edit to add if your talking rifle brass then that's something outside my experience.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

ranger
07-26-2016, 09:27 PM
I have been reloading for decades. Now I reload about 90% 9mm, 5% 45, and 5% 40. I just pick up brass at the range, tumble, and load. I throw away any 9mm brass that looks like it may have been loaded to "9mm Major" plus any "glocked" 40 brass (early G22s tended to not support case and led to bulges). Biggest issue with 45 bras is the "new" small primer brass - I separate those in a separate container until I get enough to change the primer system from large to small.

When I shot USPSA OPEN with 38 Super and 9x21 Major I watched brass closer.

Welder
07-26-2016, 10:15 PM
I don't separate brass by how many times fired, because most of my brass comes from IDPA matches and was already reloaded ?x by somebody else. Kinda gets passed around if you know what I mean.

What I do do, and I doubt anyone else does it, is to deprime each case by hand with a Lee Hand Press while watching TV or whatever. Any loose primer pockets (almost always FC) go to a stash for use at lost-brass matches, and any really loose primer pockets go to a brass scrap bucket. At the same time I sort out WCC, CBC, and S&B brass which goes into its own stash which I might reload if the end of days comes and I start feeling like dealing with tight / crimped primer pockets.

Also I sort out any brass by Freedom Munitions (FM and....IMT????) which has that infernal internal step, and it goes straight into the brass recycle bucket.

So what I end up with is PMC, FC, Winchester, R-P, Speer, etc brass that doesn't have headaches associated with using it. I care much less about how many times fired.

BehindBlueI's
07-26-2016, 11:04 PM
I reload a multitude of various pistol calibers. If the brass cracks, crumples, or is visibly damaged I chuck it in the trash. If it looks ok, it goes into a bin labeled (caliber - dirty) and is then tumbled when there's enough to bother with. It then goes in a bin labeled (caliber - clean) and that's that.

dbateman
07-26-2016, 11:10 PM
For pistol ammo I buy brass in a fairly large lot and just load it all. Then I shoot it all and load the whole lot again.
I don't really track the number of firings, I did at one point but these days I'm not to concerned about the number of firings on my cases.

I know it's time for new brass when I see a few cases start to split, sometimes I just throw my old brass out, other times I load it and use it for some type of shooting where I won't be picking up my brass.

Clusterfrack
07-26-2016, 11:23 PM
Nope. For 9mm it's just not necessary. I find a split case now and then, but no big deal.

andre3k
07-27-2016, 04:00 AM
Once you start dealing in bulk amounts of brass, its pretty time consuming to keep up with how many times its been fired. I keep try to keep a five gallon bucket filled with prepped brass for all the pistol calibers I load for. Bad brass is caught during QC after I'm done loading or whenever I happen see a bad case.

olstyn
07-27-2016, 09:46 AM
I don't separate brass by how many times fired, because most of my brass comes from IDPA matches and was already reloaded ?x by somebody else. Kinda gets passed around if you know what I mean.

Same for me, except substitute "USPSA" for "IDPA." Some of my fellow competitors don't reload, so some of the brass I pick up after matches is once fired. The rest? No idea, but as long as it's not mangled and it doesn't split when I load it, no worries. I pitch cases that are bulged/too hard to size, as well.


Also I sort out any brass by Freedom Munitions (FM and....IMT????) which has that infernal internal step, and it goes straight into the brass recycle bucket.

Yup. I try to avoid even picking those up. I've personally seen one of those separate at the ledge - got stuck in the chamber and ended the match for the person it happened to. Admittedly, it was in a 9 Major Open gun, but still, with 9mm brass being effectively free, there's just no reason to bother with that ledge stuff. (FM, IMT, and AMMOLOAD are the headstamps I've seen it in, although I've seen a few FM lately that don't have it.)

I've been sorting out CBC and saving it for later for a while due to the fact that they tend not to be tolerant of the seating depth required for MG bullets to cooperate with my two Walther guns' short/tight chambers. I figure when I eventually switch bullet types, maybe I'll find one that plays nice with that brass, and then I'll have a decent quantity of a single headstamp to use for a while. I just look at the headstamp before putting any given piece of brass into the press and segregate them out at that time, though; pre-sorting seems like it would take too much time and effort.

Peally
07-27-2016, 10:03 AM
For 9 and 45 it's always been "until the case falls apart". If a case looks super sketchy or dirty I'll chuck it. Can't have ugly brass.

Sal Picante
07-27-2016, 11:16 AM
I shoot indoors, primarily, so it is easy for me to recover my brass.


I separate a "batch", as measured by a 5 gallon bucket. This is mostly mixed stuff.
I keep cleaning/loading from that specific bucket until I find more than 2 split casings in a session. After that, the pickup from the session goes to the scrap bucket.
I'll keep cycling through the stuff until all of it is in the scrap bucket. That's ~6 loadings of minor PF ammo. 9MM actually has a fairly high chamber pressure (comparable to 40, really) so the brass doesn't last as long as you'd think.
I try to source once-fired brass from PD's, etc. and aggregated that all into 5-gallon buckets. Then the cycle begins again...
I keep a supply of cleaned "match brass" which I know is once-fired. This I load for major matches.

JAD
07-27-2016, 11:18 AM
With 45 I segregate large and small primer, but age really isn't a factor. I will shoot split cases as long as they hold powder.

CCT125US
07-27-2016, 12:52 PM
I separated and sorted for years. So many more areas to spend time on. As mentioned, there are headstamps I don't like to load. FM, CBC / Magtech, nickel cases in general, any oddball maker that has a stiff rebound in the die. After loading thousands of rounds 15 plus times, I stopped caring. My time is better spent working on not sucking.

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07-27-2016, 07:40 PM
Thanks for the advise and ideas guys. I wish I could get brass as cheap as what you get it in the states. With costs getting close to half a dollar per case the option of tossing out a batch of 1,000 cases because a few are split is an expensive option.

I like the idea of tracking brass as shots fired, instead of actual x100 batches and will give this a try to see if it takes up too much of my time. It's much better than what I had first planned (group batches together in lots of 100's)!

CCT125US
07-27-2016, 08:59 PM
Thanks for the advise and ideas guys. I wish I could get brass as cheap as what you get it in the states. With costs getting close to half a dollar per case the option of tossing out a batch of 1,000 cases because a few are split is an expensive option.

I like the idea of tracking brass as shots fired, instead of actual x100 batches and will give this a try to see if it takes up too much of my time. It's much better than what I had first planned (group batches together in lots of 100's)!

If the loaded rounds end up in an box, it's easy to run a sharpie over all the primers and mark them. That way any unmarked scavenged cases can be put into another batch. All of "your" cases can be tracked by times loaded if that makes you feel better. When I took a class from TLG, I used brass that had been loaded 12 times. We policed our brass at the end of class and I considered them lost. At that point I could care less about losing 1300 cases.

olstyn
07-27-2016, 09:22 PM
If the loaded rounds end up in an box, it's easy to run a sharpie over all the primers and mark them.

It would be easy to have multiple colors of permanent marker, too. Reasonably simple to keep track of multiple batches that way.

dbateman
07-27-2016, 11:27 PM
Thanks for the advise and ideas guys. I wish I could get brass as cheap as what you get it in the states. With costs getting close to half a dollar per case the option of tossing out a batch of 1,000 cases because a few are split is an expensive option.

I like the idea of tracking brass as shots fired, instead of actual x100 batches and will give this a try to see if it takes up too much of my time. It's much better than what I had first planned (group batches together in lots of 100's)!

What country do you live in ?

You don't necessarily have to throw the cases out, I suppose it depends on what you're doing.
If you're just shooting local matches ect and not real worried if you have an ammo issue now and then just keep on loading them, if you're going away and investing a bit more time and money you're better off just replacing your brass when it starts to fail.

I am about to replace all of my 38super brass, my 38super brass is about five years old. I have no idea how many loding cycles those cases have been thru.
In my situation by the time I have a few cases fail the brass has paid for itself.

olstyn
07-28-2016, 12:07 AM
What country do you live in ?

That question occurred to me, too. The idea that 9mm cases are a scarce/expensive resource that needs to be carefully conserved is foreign to me. (Normally I think of them as free.) I shudder to think what loaded ammo must cost wherever -ad- lives.

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07-28-2016, 02:32 AM
Sorry guys - I thought it was in my profile. I live in Australia. Brass is around $0.40c each at the moment. The idea of picking up someone else's brass at the range would probably get me a black eye. ;)

I guess it comes down to supply and demand. Not as much demand here in Australia, so the price goes up.

CCT125US
07-28-2016, 09:24 AM
I just looked up the customs import regulations. Does customs consider empty cases as ammuntion? It was not clear on the DIBP website.

olstyn
07-28-2016, 09:57 AM
Brass is around $0.40c each at the moment. The idea of picking up someone else's brass at the range would probably get me a black eye. ;)

Ouch. If it was "someone else's brass" I was picking up, I wouldn't be picking it up. At any given match at my local club, there are 60+ shooters, probably 40 of which are shooting 9mm, and *maybe* 10 of us bother to pick it up at the end of the match. I'm just making use of something that other people are abandoning. Same situation at practice sessions; it's quite common for me to run into people who don't reload. Quite often, they ask me if I want their brass. My response is usually something like "You don't reload? Sure, I'll take it, and thank you."

Rosco Benson
07-28-2016, 10:43 AM
For my practice .45ACP and 9mm reloads, I don't keep track of the number of times a case has been reloaded. I just pitch them individually when they get case neck cracks.

Back in the 1980's, Remington .45 brass was thinner than most others. This would allow the bullet to set-back into the case when feeding. Rick Miller had been given a big bunch of once-fired Remington brass, so he bought a tool (from C-H as I recall) to roll a cannelure into the cases where the bullet base would end up. Several of us shot with Rick (and still do) and fired brass tends to get mixed up. To this day, I still encounter one of Rick's cannelured Remington cases from the 1980's in my practice brass. These things have been reloaded dozens of times.

An issue that will arise with brass that has been reloaded an obscene amount of times is that the rim will get beat up from repeated extractions. The whole case head will peen out a bit and increase in diameter slightly. This can cause misfeeds with improperly relieved and tensioned extractors or if the cut on the breechface, that the casehead must ride up in feeding, is a little undersized. The stoppage looks like a typical three-point feedway stoppage. I have a Commander that about drove me nuts on this. It would run fine with factory ammo, but it would suffer intermittent stoppages with my practice reloads. I finally discovered that the breechface cut was a few thousandths undersize (probably tool wear at Colt). Opening this up a wee bit fixed the problem.

I've been told that the South African IPSC shooters, during the embargo years, would chuck their battered cases in a lathe and touch up the rims.

Rosco

olstyn
07-28-2016, 11:18 AM
I just looked up the customs import regulations. Does customs consider empty cases as ammuntion? It was not clear on the DIBP website.

Must be that and/or export restrictions & import duties, or folks would be making a killing shipping brass from the US to Australia.

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07-28-2016, 05:57 PM
From https://www.border.gov.au/Busi/Impo/Proh/Firearms-and-weapons/ammunitions-magazines

Components of ammunition include projectiles, cartridge casings, whether new or spent, and primers designed or adapted for use in ammunition are also controlled under the Regulations and require permission to import prior to importation.

Additionally, I've struggled to find a shop in the US that has Australia as a shipping option for brass, and wonder what freight would end up being even if I could. If I could find a shop willing to export to Australia, as well as something where freight wasn't prohibitively expensive, I'd try for an import permit, and be buying by the bucket loads.

dbateman
07-28-2016, 06:24 PM
Sorry guys - I thought it was in my profile. I live in Australia.

I'm in Aussieland, NWQLD.

dbateman
07-28-2016, 06:32 PM
From https://www.border.gov.au/Busi/Impo/Proh/Firearms-and-weapons/ammunitions-magazines

Components of ammunition include projectiles, cartridge casings, whether new or spent, and primers designed or adapted for use in ammunition are also controlled under the Regulations and require permission to import prior to importation.


Additionally, I've struggled to find a shop in the US that has Australia as a shipping option for brass, and wonder what freight would end up being even if I could. If I could find a shop willing to export to Australia, as well as something where freight wasn't prohibitively expensive, I'd try for an import permit, and be buying by the bucket loads.


The Australian side is pretty straight forward, you just apply for an import permit. They are free and take week or so to get issued.


The US side is a bit more of a pain, plus you need an export licence.

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07-28-2016, 07:31 PM
The Australian side is pretty straight forward, you just apply for an import permit. They are free and take week or so to get issued.


The US side is a bit more of a pain, plus you need an export licence.

Oh - so the USA also considers Brass a controlled export item? :(

Looks like I'll stick to counting my brass at this stage...

olstyn
07-28-2016, 10:08 PM
Oh - so the USA also considers Brass a controlled export item?

Yeah, I did some searching, and it looks like you have to first register as someone who wants to do ITAR/ACEA exporting ($2250/year, ouch) and then apply for an export permit (unknown cost, but almost certainly non-zero). The profit margin after those expenses is probably poor enough to make it not worthwhile. Seems silly, given that cartridge cases are manufactured in many countries around the world. It's not like you'd be exporting some sort of secret tech that enemies of the USA couldn't otherwise get their hands on.

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07-28-2016, 11:03 PM
Yeah, I did some searching, and it looks like you have to first register as someone who wants to do ITAR/ACEA exporting ($2250/year, ouch) and then apply for an export permit (unknown cost, but almost certainly non-zero). The profit margin after those expenses is probably poor enough to make it not worthwhile. Seems silly, given that cartridge cases are manufactured in many countries around the world. It's not like you'd be exporting some sort of secret tech that enemies of the USA couldn't otherwise get their hands on.

Well, I guess that puts the nail in the coffin then for me... back to counting my brass....

I never thought I'd see the day where Australia would make something easier than America when it came to something firearms related!

dbateman
07-30-2016, 06:22 AM
The export permit is $250usd, but you can put multiple items on it.
So say a dealer exporting 200 pistols, mags, pin and spring kits ect. Would be done on one permit.
They could also add other items if they wanted. You can put 100 items on a permit and only ship 50, but you can't get paperwork for 50 and ship 100.

You can do it as an private individual but it takes time and Can time consuming.
That being said somethings you just can't find it over here or if you can they want too much for it.

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07-30-2016, 05:21 PM
Thanks dbateman. I guess plus you have to find someone in America with the brass willing to go to the trouble of an expert permit. By the time you go to the time and trouble at both ends, plus the freight, I'm guessing that the value would start to narrow down and you'd need to purchase in significant batch sizes for it to be worth while.

I guess this has gone a little OT though. :)

I'm going to try tracking my batches in # of shots as Gyro suggested. It seems to be the most practical and allows for any size batches of brass instead of keeping it to a certain count. If it ends up being too much work or not worth while, I can always stop, but at least if I start - I have options.

Thanks to everyone who has replied with their time and information!

olstyn
07-30-2016, 05:26 PM
Thanks dbateman. I guess plus you have to find someone in America with the brass willing to go to the trouble of an expert permit. By the time you go to the time and trouble at both ends, plus the freight, I'm guessing that the value would start to narrow down and you'd need to purchase in significant batch sizes for it to be worth while.

Yeah, it'd probably have to be significant, recurring volume in order to make it worth it - basically you'd have to work out all of the logistics and permitting on both ends and set it up as a business. If it was financially and logistically feasible to send small quantities, I'd have PMed you asking for your address a long time ago. :)

rojocorsa
08-01-2016, 03:59 PM
Wait, so CBC brass is on the shit-list?

I have a ton of once fired CBC 9mm that I'm planning on reloading since I bought a few cases of Magtech 9mm.

olstyn
08-01-2016, 04:23 PM
Wait, so CBC brass is on the shit-list?

I have a ton of once fired CBC 9mm that I'm planning on reloading since I bought a few cases of Magtech 9mm.

Depends on the gun and the bullet in question. MG JHP and CMJ bullets don't play nice with CBC brass in my Walther P99 and P99c. My understanding is that the issue arises from CBC brass' walls getting thicker closer to the case mouth than typical 9mm brass. Combine this with a gun with a short/tight chamber and/or a bullet with an unforgiving profile and you end up with the brass bulging out at the base of the bullet, which causes failures when you case gauge/chamber check. 115 grain bullets would probably have the lowest likelihood of causing problems, and round-nose generally tend to be more forgiving than JHP, but in the end it's a matter of testing it out with your bullets and your guns.

rojocorsa
08-01-2016, 04:31 PM
My only concern is to keep 2 9mm Berettas, one Glock, and one normal CZ-75 fed. I just care about having good practice ammo and to shoot at matches when I can.

olstyn
08-01-2016, 05:19 PM
My only concern is to keep 2 9mm Berettas, one Glock, and one normal CZ-75 fed. I just care about having good practice ammo and to shoot at matches when I can.

Of those, I'd *guess* that the CZ has the shortest/tightest chamber, but again, you'll have to determine that with your bullets. Plunk test in each, and keep shortening the OAL until it plunks successfully in all of them. Then seat & crimp a bullet to that OAL in a couple of CBC cases and plunk them in the gun with the tightest chamber and you'll have your answer.