SIG 320 Performance as a Duty Weapon

[Gewehr3]

Greetings,

I have mixed opinions about the readiness of the SIG P320 to be adopted as duty gun.

Overall, do you think that the 320 has had the bugs worked from it's design, and it performs on par with other proven designs such as Glock, and Berretta?

I've seen several posts about the trigger bar breaking. What are the other faults of the design?

Thanks

[MGW]

Well, the FBI just decided it didn't. There are other agencies such as OkHP that decided it is good enough. If I was going striker fired for duty carry it would probably be Glock or HK VP9. The VP9 based on SME's here.

[Luke]

I think the Texas highway patrol, Hawaii somebody's, and New Jersey (and I'm sure more) all switched to the P320.


I remember rich Jenkins starting s thread last month about a place is Florida switching to the 320 aswell.

[BCL]

Hit up PPGMD and/or Alma Cole; they have run them pretty hard over the last year or so and should be able to tell you which parts break and when.

[RJ]

I remember rich Jenkins starting s thread last month about a place is Florida switching to the 320 aswell.

Que?!

Might have been somebody else...I'm about as qualified to start a thread here on duty pistols as I am to drive a Formula 1 car for Ferrari -- it's possible; but only when I'm asleep. :cool:

[Beat Trash]

The trigger bar breaking seems to happen when YouTube trained gunsmiths attempt to detail strip the gun, or reassemble it.

The striker assembly has a lot of small parts and springs on it.

Several state police agencies have adopted it. Don't know what the actual details in their individual testing was. Texas DPS tested it. Don't know the actual details of the testing. FBI tested it, we don't know the details of the testing.

Unless you have some serious connection with an agency or are involved, you most likely don't know what was involved in a testing process. Some agencies have to factor in politics. Some agencies have to factor in the cost per unit, after any trades of existing duty weapons are included. I've seen what my agency went through when shopping for 1,200 new guns. Much more involved than what an individual consumer would do one walking into a gun store to buy a gun.

This is why I read through some rather long threads about DPS, FBI and MHS pistol selection. Interesting reading, but unless you're involved or "in the know" you don't know all the facts. Those who are involved are usually not at liberty to discuss it on an open forum.

I own a pair of 320c's in 9mm. My wife loves hers. I like mine just enough to not sell it off. I like it better than the M&P9 that I've been issued since the M&P was first released. If I didn't own a gen4 Glock 19 and a VP9 then I'd really like my 320c. I would have no issues carrying of these three guns as a duty weapon though.

[DpdG]

Well, the FBI just decided it didn't. There are other agencies such as OkHP that decided it is good enough. If I was going striker fired for duty carry it would probably be Glock or HK VP9. The VP9 based on SME's here.

Clearly the Glock submission won the FBI trials, of which I have absolutely zero knowledge, involvement, or stake in. Given the lack of available details though, I'm not sure Glock winning means the P320 failed the testing.

It seems that two (or more) submissions could have passed the trials and the decision to award the contract to Glock was made on other reasons, such as pure cost per unit, existing agency familiarity (training, parts, armorer support), or a multitude of other reasons, tangible or political. The M9 trials are an example of this, where both the Beretta 92 and the Sig P226 passed the trials, leaving other factors to decide the contract award.

[HCM]

Well, the FBI just decided it didn't. There are other agencies such as OkHP that decided it is good enough. If I was going striker fired for duty carry it would probably be Glock or HK VP9. The VP9 based on SME's here.

The FBI announced Glock won the contract. Passing performance testing and winning the contract are often two different things. There is no information indicating how the 320 actually performed.

For example, the P320 was recently adopted by the TX Department of Public Safety (DPS). Three guns passed performance testing, the Glock 17 Gen 4, the HK VP-9 and the Sig 320. The HK VP-9 was actually the top performer in the DPS testing but they chose the P320. Some factors in this decision were their recent, unsuccessful attempt to transition to the S&W M&P and the fact DPS has been a "SIG Agency" for nearly 30 years.

The OK Highway Patrol and the State of HI DPS ( which includes the prisons and various state LE and investigative agencies) have been the biggest contracts in addition to TX.

[HCM]

Clearly the Glock submission won the FBI trials, of which I have absolutely zero knowledge, involvement, or stake in. Given the lack of available details though, I'm not sure Glock winning means the P320 failed the testing.

It seems that two (or more) submissions could have passed the trials and the decision to award the contract to Glock was made on other reasons, such as pure cost per unit, existing agency familiarity (training, parts, armorer support), or a multitude of other reasons, tangible or political. The M9 trials are an example of this, where both the Beretta 92 and the Sig P226 passed the trials, leaving other factors to decide the contract award.

The ATF trials were another example with both the Gen 4 Glock 22 and the S&W M&P 40 passing the trials. In this instance both actually got contracts but ATF only chose / purchased/ issued the Glock. I believe the M&P contract was to allow other agencies to purchase them if desired.

[psalms144.1]

I have PRECISELY ZERO information regarding the FBI's selection of the G17/19, but I don't think anyone should use that choice as an indication that the P320 isn't "duty ready" yet. I've shot a few P320s, thought they were fine for what they are - a polymer framed striker fired pistol. None of them impressed me enough to make me want to lay out coin as a possible G19 replacement, but that doesn't mean I don't consider them ready for prime time.

If I were a tinkerer who wanted to stipple my pistols grips myself, I would SURE be interested in the P320, where a messed up stippling job can be corrected with a $40 replacement grip, as opposed to having to buy a new pistol. If I were in an agency or state that limited the number of serial numbers I could list on my authorized list (or carry permit), the P320 would be an obvious choice. And, there have been plenty of guys I would trust with my life who say the P320 is not only duty ready, but the best option on the market today, so, there must be something going on there. In fact, I recently had another agent in my squad who wanted a personal weapon that was lighter and easier to shoot well than our P229R DAK .40, and my first suggestion was she check out the P320. She did, and opted for the G19 instead, but mainly because she was more familiar with the GLOCK from the number of other folks in the squad who carry them.

Having said all that, I have no feedback from any agency yet who's issuing the P320 in bulk, either good or bad.

[Sammy1]

City near us just purchased them. Only time will tell. I know one of the instructors and I'll pass on any problems or issues if they arise.

[Al T.]

Several local departments are looking at 320s. Apparently one hold up was Safariland being slow on the holsters (due to SIG changes?). SCHP looked at SIG and Glock, but no decision yet..

[MGW]

I'm a Sig fan. I own a few and have owned a 320. I had accuracy issues with my 320 but I believe it was a sample of one problem. I also really liked the trigger and the way it shot. I have a trooper acquaintance that owns one bought on his own dime and competes with it at a really high level. I don't know his round count but it's several thousands by now I'm sure. The only thing he's done to it to my knowledge is change sights.

I'm not saying that the FBI's test put the 320 on the not ready list. I would like to think, but don't know for sure, that their test had the best chance of being unbiased though and the Glock came out on top because it was the best duty pistol they could find. Within their specs anyway.

I think the 17 is a safer bet over the 320 because of how long it has been around. Yes I know there were issues with Gen 4's but they still have a long record of reliability. It's also fairly simple to maintain and to find spare parts for.

I guess if it was a larger agency that was fielding the pistol with internal factory trained armor support the P320 would probably be fine. Several agencies are adopting it so it can't be total junk.

The question was are the bugs worked out and is it on par with Glock or Beretta for duty use. Bugs worked out? Maybe. On Par with Glock? Not in my opinion. Beretta? I have no idea.

[Nj Det 354]

P
I think the Texas highway patrol, Hawaii somebody's, and New Jersey (and I'm sure more) all switched to the P320.


I remember rich Jenkins starting s thread last month about a place is Florida switching to the 320 aswell.

NJSP going to Glock 19.

[stinx]

P

NJSP going to Glock 19.

Why are NJSp going Glock? They only recently transitioned to P229 elites?

[Nj Det 354]

Major problems. Unable to resolve the issue. Decided to move on to a new weapon.

[EVP]

Major problems. Unable to resolve the issue. Decided to move on to a new weapon.

Just out of curiousity what was having issues, the 229s or 320s?

Also what issues were y'all seeing?

[DpdG]

That stinks. Any idea what issues they were having with the P229? Although problems are not unheard of, the P229 is a pretty mature platform and widespread problems seem pretty unusual.

Thanks,

[John Hearne]

Although problems are not unheard of, the P229 is a pretty mature platform and widespread problems seem pretty unusual.

Sig has a remarkable ability to ruin tested designs by wringing out a few more pennies of profit.

It's just speculation but I'm betting this proclivity cost them the FBI contest.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk

[psalms144.1]

Sig has a remarkable ability to ruin tested designs by wringing out a few more pennies of profit.Sig went through a BAD stretch where QA, CS, and pretty much everything about the company (except the number of finishes available for every model) went into the dumper. When we transitioned to P229/P239 DAKs about 8 years ago, we had a lot of issues with the P239s that Sig couldn't fix, requiring plenty of pistols to be replaced. I've heard from folks "in the know" that Sig has been TRYING to turn that around in the last 2-3 years, and getting back to it's roots as one of the very few top-name pistols that people would be willing to take into a gunfight right out of the box.

Of course, the management at the top only cares about the bottom line, and the vast majority of gun buying CLEETI wouldn't know a good trigger pull from a bad one, and is going to feed the pistol the crappiest, cheapest reloads possible, so has very low expectations (based on history) for reliability and accuracy, so why spend more on quality components and construction?

GLOCK had the same issue with the Gen4, when they redesigned major components of what was, until the, the epitome of reliability, AND switched to a lower-cost (MIM) extractor at the same time. Result? The great BTF plague of 2010-2012, which, unfortunately, continues to this day with some of the gun that come off the line. And S&W continues to sell the M&P9FS which is very likely to produce wildly unacceptable accuracy. I could go on, but it'd just make me madder.

Sorry for the rant, and the drift!

[Sero Sed Serio]

Major problems. Unable to resolve the issue. Decided to move on to a new weapon.

Are you able to expand on what problems they had?

[Nj Det 354]

Failure to eject. Extractor problems on the 229.

[John Hearne]

Failure to eject. Extractor problems on the 229.

Any idea if it was the small AKA legacy extractor or the new, large E2 extractor?

[Kram]

Any idea if it was the small AKA legacy extractor or the new, large E2 extractor?

Large E2 extractor. Supposedly, the specific issue was found to be poorly machined extractor springs. Yet guns with new installed springs or new SIG supplied complete slide assemblies still had issues.

[L-2]

My SIGs are just for off-duty carry and personal enjoyment. My P226R had weak extractor springs (long E2 extractor). I can see a statewide agency with ~2400 sworn would be a logistical problem to constantly maintain that extractor for an intermittent problem which could occur at any moment. The replacement of these springs, while not really difficult for a SIG, still requires a special tool or two and will take more time than completely detail stripping and putting a Glock back together.

[stinx]

Leave it to Sig to F-up a reliable no issue gun, just to save a few pennies.

[HCM]

Weren't NJSP carrying P228's ?

It seems SIG can be their own worst enemy.

[11B10]

Reading this thread has me putting the evil eye on my not even a year old P320C. My last trip to the range (last Friday), I began by shooting my carry loads to recycle that ammo. No problems with either gun (never did). Then, I used the same ammo I have nearly always used for practice - Winchester white box (230 grain for the .45 Sig and 180 grain for the .40 S & W). I had two guns with me, my Sig and my S & W .40. BOTH guns had never before had any FTE/FTF's. BOTH had issues last Friday. The issues were handled by a simple re-racking of the slide (s). Anybody else hear of problems with the Winchester white box ammo?

[Clusterfrack]

Problems with WWB? Surely you jest.

[Nj Det 354]

Weren't NJSP carrying P228's ?

It seems SIG can be their own worst enemy.

Yes and some 229's. Then got all new 229 Elites. The new guns had the problems. No problems with the old guns.

[AMC]

The PD where I live just adopted the 320 about 9 months ago. I didn't notice til a couple of them walked past me at the county fair a few weeks ago. Neither of them were what I'd call "gun savvy" (even though the Sergeant said she was a Firearms Instructor), so their answers to my questions were largely "They're OK I guess."

As for this whole E2 extractor thingy.....gotta admit they don't give me the warm fuzzies. Trying to get anything with the "Legacy" slide other than a MK25 now is nigh impossible, which makes me sad. Had to settle for the E2 design for my competition/training gun. Time will tell, I guess. But that "Hell and Back" reliability wasn't earned with MIM extractors. Just sayin'.

[Sero Sed Serio]

Large E2 extractor. Supposedly, the specific issue was found to be poorly machined extractor springs. Yet guns with new installed springs or new SIG supplied complete slide assemblies still had issues.

I am incredibly underwhelmed with the new long extractors--I had the same issue with the long extractor 226 I had (9 failures to extract in the first 200 rounds), although a trip to the mothership and a new spring did fix the issue. Also although the spring is listed as a 20,000 part, it seems like it is going out on people at around 8k or so.

I do find it interesting that the newly introduced guns (the 225 A-1 and 320 come to mind) are using the legacy extractor design as opposed to the new long extractor. Hopefully that will prove to work in the long run, as I have really high hopes for the 320 and think it has a lot of potential.

[ReverendMeat]

As for this whole E2 extractor thingy.....gotta admit they don't give me the warm fuzzies. Trying to get anything with the "Legacy" slide other than a MK25 now is nigh impossible, which makes me sad. Had to settle for the E2 design for my competition/training gun. Time will tell, I guess. But that "Hell and Back" reliability wasn't earned with MIM extractors. Just sayin'.

There's still the SP2022

[John Hearne]

The E2 is an interesting creature. It was implemented to make P226's and P229's cheaper to manufacture. It was a two prong approach. First, they reduced the amount and complexity of machining needed to create the void for the extractor - what had been the most expensive part of making a legacy slide. Second, by going to a physically larger extractor, it allowed them to manufacture it using MIM technology. By being physically larger, the extractor was less susceptible to small voids causing failures.

I never like the design from a maintenance standpoint. The legacy design allowed for a very quick and painless removal of the extractor. It was wicked simple to remove and clean behind the hook. The E2 design involves the removal of a single-use pin and requires specially cut punch to remove the extractor pin. As an added bonus, any work with the firing pin positioning pin requires the removal of the extractor as well. They used to be completely separate.

I've often wondered why the P320 returned to the plunger powered design of the legacy slides. I can't help but think that if the E2 design was so great, we'd see it in their most recently designed pistol.

I just hope that someone crunches the numbers and figures out how much net loss their has been to their image and market viability based on these continued failures with major and/or prestige departments. Rightly or wrongly, a lot of agencies look to what the FBI is using or what their state police are using when selecting a pistol. Plus, as we've seen, failures in one line cause people to look askance at the other offerings. I strongly suspect that failures in the classic pistols (P220, 225, 226, 228, 229, etc.) will harm P320 sales and the P320 is the key to Sig's long term viability in the market. QC issues are QC issues to most folks.

[Jamal28]

Well NC highway patrol is on there second batch of extractors for the 229 in 357 sig. And there guns are barely 4 years old.

[HCM]

Well NC highway patrol is on there second batch of extractors for the 229 in 357 sig. And there guns are barely 4 years old.

I thought NC went P226 this time around? They has P229 DAK's prior to the M&P's.

[KeeFus]

Well NC highway patrol is on there second batch of extractors for the 229 in 357 sig. And there guns are barely 4 years old.

NCSHP has P226's with the SRT trigger. They've had issues with some extractors from the factory. Now they are placing trigger bars.

[Backspin]

NCSHP has P226's with the SRT trigger. They've had issues with some extractors from the factory. Now they are placing trigger bars.

Do you know if they are using legacy slides with the short extractor or the newer slides with long extractor?

[KeeFus]

Do you know if they are using legacy slides with the short extractor or the newer slides with long extractor?

I want to say they're short. Will look the next time I see one of the guys.

[DocSabo40]

What are everyone's thoughts on the takedown lever on these? I picked up a P320C with the new style lever as a backup to my P229, and I can't stand it. The lever digs into the second joint of my thumb unless I adopt a very low grip with my left hand. I brought 300 rounds to the range yesterday and left with 150 because it just plain wasn't fun. First pistol I've had this issue with.

I imagine with large-scale issue, like to a PD, that a certain number of shooters would have a similar problem. Unless my hands are way out of spec.

[11B10]

What are everyone's thoughts on the takedown lever on these? I picked up a P320C with the new style lever as a backup to my P229, and I can't stand it. The lever digs into the second joint of my thumb unless I adopt a very low grip with my left hand. I brought 300 rounds to the range yesterday and left with 150 because it just plain wasn't fun. First pistol I've had this issue with.

I imagine with large-scale issue, like to a PD, that a certain number of shooters would have a similar problem. Unless my hands are way out of spec.


I'm assuming this gun has the newer, slim lever? Since I swapped mine out, I've had no problems.

[pblanc]

What are everyone's thoughts on the takedown lever on these? I picked up a P320C with the new style lever as a backup to my P229, and I can't stand it. The lever digs into the second joint of my thumb unless I adopt a very low grip with my left hand. I brought 300 rounds to the range yesterday and left with 150 because it just plain wasn't fun. First pistol I've had this issue with.

I imagine with large-scale issue, like to a PD, that a certain number of shooters would have a similar problem. Unless my hands are way out of spec.

I believe that SIG-Sauer came out with the newer take-down lever with the slimmed down exterior in response to this complaint from a number of shooters. The redesign of the slide stop lever, with a slimmer exterior that pointed forward instead of backwards, was also in response to criticism from shooters who had failure of slide lock or accidental slide lock from inadvertent contact with it.

I have a P320 compact with the redesigned levers and have no problem with either. But then I also have an older P320 full-size with the original style levers and I have had no problem with them either. My weak (left) side thumb is in a relatively low position when I shoot and is well below the TDL.

[Jamal28]

NCSHP has P226's with the SRT trigger. They've had issues with some extractors from the factory. Now they are placing trigger bars..

Wow i gad no idea ncshp was replacing triggers bars. Sig needs to get a handle on this before they lose this contract.

[DocSabo40]

I'm assuming this gun has the newer, slim lever? Since I swapped mine out, I've had no problems.

It does have the newer lever. I'll see if I can change my grip enough to adapt to the gun.

[seamastersw]

I think the Texas highway patrol, Hawaii somebody's, and New Jersey (and I'm sure more) all switched to the P320.


I remember rich Jenkins starting s thread last month about a place is Florida switching to the 320 aswell.

The NJSP dumped their worn P228s about 2 years ago for a P229 enhanced elite. The P229 hasn't been working well and has beenprone to failures so that too is being dumped in favor of a gen 4 G19 with a surefire light.

[gtmtnbiker98]

The NJSP dumped their worn P228s about 2 years ago for a P229 enhanced elite. The P229 hasn't been working well and has beenprone to failures so that too is being dumped in favor of a gen 4 G19 with a surefire light.

What issues?

[Kram]

What issues?

See the posts on page 3.

[KeeFus]

Do you know if they are using legacy slides with the short extractor or the newer slides with long extractor?

Long.

[RJ]

Problems with WWB? Surely you jest.

Depends on which WalMart you buy them at.

:cool:

*ducks and runs*

[L-2]

The initial question was whether the P320 was ready for duty. While I haven't bought one, from my readings/studies so far, I wouldn't buy one yet.
See:
http://sigtalk.com/p250-p320-modular-pistols/58104-p320c-double-feed.html

There are reports of failures to extract/double feeds occurring even after being sent back to SIG.
Other issues indicate a few parts have been redesigned already. I didn't quite understand how these new parts are being communicated to present owners as to whether replacement is necessary, optional, or a recall. These parts are extractors, take down levers, and trigger bars.

I try not to buy a gun (or a car) within the first year or two of release, but I understand the temptation. I'm actually concerned regarding the forthcoming FBI-Glock as its gun will likely be considered a new model. Different topic, I digressed. Disregard.

[Alma]

I use the P320 for competition and personal carry so other sources might be better to discuss its readiness as a Duty gun.
I have about 20k rounds through four P320s with 15k being fired through my primary Competition gun and 5k through the remainder. After about 5k through one of my guns that was manufactured mid 2014, I did replace an ejector, but otherwise have seen zero issues with my guns. Many other Team SIG shooters have put more than 20k rounds through single guns in the last year without issue. SIG is continuing to improve the platform and some incremental changes may have include a slightly changed the extractor profile and increased the tension. I am very active in a Facebook group that has 5,600 P320 owners and based on that sample group the issues described are very, very far from being widespread. If they do occur, SIG has been very good with remediating any issues. I would say that about 3/4 of the reports I have seen are resolved by not buying junk ammo. Having a few users dogpile onto a report of problems can be a concern but certainly does not give you insight into the overall reliability and dependability of the platform. Multiple agencies have found the P320 to be ready for duty and have been rolling it out to the field. As with any new platform, time will give us a better understanding of it's reliability but so far the overall picture has been very good.

[DocSabo40]

Leave it to Sig to F-up a reliable no issue gun, just to save a few pennies.

Well I mean, they are not exactly alone in this regard.

[JBP55]

I would expect to see a glowing report on the P320 from a Team Sig Member.

[Alma]

I would expect to see a glowing report on the P320 from a Team Sig Member.

No conspiracy there and I certainly don't try to hide my affiliation. Just trying to offer my experience since someone asked for it earlier in the thread. My integrity is worth far, far more than what little I get from SIG as a sponsored shooter. I have been impressed enough to pay retail price for multiple P320s now and have easily spent thousands of my own dollars investing into SIG platforms over the last two years. I figure that buys a right to share my opinion about the P320. I have also standardized on SIGs. My Glocks and CZs are all gone and I don't miss them; the P320 has been very good for me. The popularity and sales of the P320 have exploded for good reason.

[L-2]

Gewehr3, I'd say it's about time to feel good about the P320. It's been out since ~1/2014 which is in my personal opinion 2 year range before trying & buying.
I liked reading Alma's experience and overview of the model line also. I haven't heard or read anything glaring, like Remington's R51 product had.

I'll even say it compares favorably with Glock's Gen4 initial issues. Against my better judgement, I'll even buy a gun before it's been out 2 years. My latest gamble was with the Glock 43, which then came out with a newer connector, lightening the trigger pull, after I'd already bought mine. I later got the new connector for free, but not before spending money on a Ghost-branded one.

[LockedBreech]

I believe most any reputable competitive shooter or gunmaker values their reputation over any particular brand, so while a bias might be inherent it doesn't invalidate the opinion. Example, Bill Wilson sells modded Berettas now but I'd still trust his take on the Beretta 92 since he knows his reputation goes further than the current product line. I think the opinion of a team shooter is valuable, bias or not, simply for the number of rounds downrange, which will certainly exceed what I put through my guns.

[pblanc]

I have two P320s, a full-sized .45 ACP and a compact 9mm Luger, and have had no real problems with either. The compact 9mm ejected a few spent cases back at my head within the first 100 rds but that has smoothed out.

Both of my P320s exhibit the well-documented double click trigger phenomenon but did not when they were new. Per SIG, this is completely normal but there have been a handful of cases of failure to fire in live fire reported, due to failure of the sear to reset after striker release. I find this phenomenon slightly unsettling since in dry fire I can easily arrest the trigger press after the first click (striker release) and before the second (sear reset). But I have not been able to duplicate a failure to fire due to failure of sear reset in live fire, despite trying to do so.

I have been following the P320 long before I bought one, essentially shortly after it came out, because I was not really happy with any of the polymer frame, striker-fired pistols I had tried. I have read about a handful of failures to extract or failures to feed as well as a handful of ejection issues. There have been a couple of reported trigger bar fractures which is probably the most severe failure I have read about. But the reported problems do not seem to be any more frequent than with any other manufacturer's pistol.

The take down lever and the slide release lever were redesigned and trimmed down as a response to complaints from users who said the initial levers got in the way of their thumb placement. That was not an issue with reliability. My P320 full size has the original TDL and slide release lever. They work fine and I have no complaint with them. The original trigger was redesigned, again in response to early users who experienced trigger sting, and the pistols now seem to be shipping with the so-called adverse trigger. Again, this was not a reliability issue.

[RJ]

No conspiracy there and I certainly don't try to hide my affiliation. Just trying to offer my experience since someone asked for it earlier in the thread. My integrity is worth far, far more than what little I get from SIG as a sponsored shooter. I have been impressed enough to pay retail price for multiple P320s now and have easily spent thousands of my own dollars investing into SIG platforms over the last two years. I figure that buys a right to share my opinion about the P320. I have also standardized on SIGs. My Glocks and CZs are all gone and I don't miss them; the P320 has been very good for me. The popularity and sales of the P320 have exploded for good reason.

I've always wanted to ask this question.

When a Team shooter (say Team Sig, in your case) shoots a gun at a match, where does that gun come from?

I mean, do you provide your own gun (i.e. out of your pocket) or is the gun you shoot given to you by the manufacturer?

[bigredfish]

I've recently passed 10,000 rds with my Full size 320 purchased in April of '15, mostly my competition gun but have used it for a couple of classes as well. Have had no problems other than a couple of brass to the face at about 7000 rounds which I chalked up to a worn out recoil spring. Mine has the original TDL and slide release, which I never did have a problem with. I suspect I'm getting close to time to replace the extractor just to be safe, but would probably do the same on any competition gun over 10K rds. Quite a few have popped up in the past year at local IDPA matches and I'm just not seeing any problems. Now on the Compact version, I have personally seen one with obvious extractor issues (newish born on date), and have shot 2 others pretty extensively with no issues. Don't know that this means much as it relates to a duty gun though.

[Alma]

I've always wanted to ask this question.

When a Team shooter (say Team Sig, in your case) shoots a gun at a match, where does that gun come from?

I mean, do you provide your own gun (i.e. out of your pocket) or is the gun you shoot given to you by the manufacturer?

It varies quite a bit from one sponsorship to the next. In the sport shooting world, discount sponsorships (where the sponsored shooter gets discounts on products) are by far the most common.
I purchased my first P320 locally and shot that during the beginning of the 2015 season until the Team program was more established. Since Grayguns was a sponsor he worked with SIG to get team guns that had been enhanced by Bruce Gray's shop. Thereafter the team worked as guinea pigs to really find out how well the P320 itself and grayguns modifications held up to heavy use, and what would be the most desirable configurations for a competition oriented P320. At last check as a team we were easily over 300,000 rounds shot down range. There is some product support in there from the likes of Lucas Oil Outdoor Line, Blade-Tech, Springer Precision, and several others. It really isn't polite to kiss and tell but I will say that there are a very, very small number of shooters Nation-wide who actually get checks from sponsors for endorsements.

[11B10]

It varies quite a bit from one sponsorship to the next. In the sport shooting world, discount sponsorships (where the sponsored shooter gets discounts on products) are by far the most common.
I purchased my first P320 locally and shot that during the beginning of the 2015 season until the Team program was more established. Since Grayguns was a sponsor he worked with SIG to get team guns that had been enhanced by Bruce Gray's shop. Thereafter the team worked as guinea pigs to really find out how well the P320 itself and grayguns modifications held up to heavy use, and what would be the most desirable configurations for a competition oriented P320. At last check as a team we were easily over 300,000 rounds shot down range. There is some product support in there from the likes of Lucas Oil Outdoor Line, Blade-Tech, Springer Precision, and several others. It really isn't polite to kiss and tell but I will say that there are a very, very small number of shooters Nation-wide who actually get checks from sponsors for endorsements.




Alma - I bought my P320C/.45 last November and so far have only changed the TDL because of the mentioned thumb clearance issues for some shooters. I can only dream of shooting as much as nearly everyone here, including you. I carry my Sig every day but only shoot <500 rounds a month. I have had absolutely no problems, but then again, I shoot very sparingly. My biggest question is if the advice I have been given previously regarding magazine loading is gtg. Specifically, I've been told numerous times (including Sig's tech line) it's OK to carry a full mag (9rds) with a round chambered. Likewise with my always-carried extra mag. What say you?

[Alma]

How have you found that to work when doing live fire practice at the range? Using your carry ammo I would fully expect that you could have the magazine topped off and have one in the chamber and that it would function correctly.
You should to test that scenario (way you typically carry and ideally with your carry ammo) in live fire practice to assure and gain confidence that everything functions as it should. I will say that the 17th round in my oldest 17 round magazines was very tight at first. Now that those magazine have broken in a bit I don't have issues loading a full 17 rounds by hand. When I shoot 3 Gun I use a 23 round magazine (21 round factory mag with a Springer Precision plus two and Grams spring kit) that I can run 23+1; however, on the mags on my belt I will typically only load them to 22 rounds to make it easier for me to seat the magazine without having to think about it. I personally wouldn't download a backup magazine for self defense scenarios because I suspect I would already be at slide lock, with an empty gun. In competition I usually reload while one round is still in the chamber. Again, the bottom line is that you need to go out and test, and understand that loading that last round will get a bit easier over time.

[Clusterfrack]

I've found a pretty big difference between Italian and USA p320!mags. Italian FTW.

[11B10]

How have you found that to work when doing live fire practice at the range? Using your carry ammo I would fully expect that you could have the magazine topped off and have one in the chamber and that it would function correctly.
You should to test that scenario (way you typically carry and ideally with your carry ammo) in live fire practice to assure and gain confidence that everything functions as it should. I will say that the 17th round in my oldest 17 round magazines was very tight at first. Now that those magazine have broken in a bit I don't have issues loading a full 17 rounds by hand. When I shoot 3 Gun I use a 23 round magazine (21 round factory mag with a Springer Precision plus two and Grams spring kit) that I can run 23+1; however, on the mags on my belt I will typically only load them to 22 rounds to make it easier for me to seat the magazine without having to think about it. I personally wouldn't download a backup magazine for self defense scenarios because I suspect I would already be at slide lock, with an empty gun. In competition I usually reload while one round is still in the chamber. Again, the bottom line is that you need to go out and test, and understand that loading that last round will get a bit easier over time.




I have always loaded the gun "full" - never had any FTF's, FTE's - nothing, including live fire. The pistol feels as though I've been carrying and shooting it for years. I just wish I could shoot more because it's such a joy to shoot. As for the mags getting broken in, they have been flawless since day 1. It's the first Sig I've ever owned and in asking this question about loading them this way, I'm attempting to head off any future issues re: premature spring failure.

Thanks for taking the time to give me such good feedback.

[11B10]

How have you found that to work when doing live fire practice at the range? Using your carry ammo I would fully expect that you could have the magazine topped off and have one in the chamber and that it would function correctly.
You should to test that scenario (way you typically carry and ideally with your carry ammo) in live fire practice to assure and gain confidence that everything functions as it should. I will say that the 17th round in my oldest 17 round magazines was very tight at first. Now that those magazine have broken in a bit I don't have issues loading a full 17 rounds by hand. When I shoot 3 Gun I use a 23 round magazine (21 round factory mag with a Springer Precision plus two and Grams spring kit) that I can run 23+1; however, on the mags on my belt I will typically only load them to 22 rounds to make it easier for me to seat the magazine without having to think about it. I personally wouldn't download a backup magazine for self defense scenarios because I suspect I would already be at slide lock, with an empty gun. In competition I usually reload while one round is still in the chamber. Again, the bottom line is that you need to go out and test, and understand that loading that last round will get a bit easier over time.





In my first post, I said the only thing I changed was the TDL. Not so as I also changed the factory "day" sights to TRUGLO TFX Pro's, which have been a good news/bad news thing, for me, anyway. The only real gripe I have - the front fiber optic is not as bright (at least to my eyes) as the rears. I have added one of my old favs, a Dave Spaulding recommendation - orange "enhancement" on that front sight. I did this by using my personal fav - neon orange duct tape ($2.99/roll at WalMart). I cut just enough to cover the entire sight and then put a hole in it to allow the tritium to shine through at night. Therein lies the tricky part - getting that hole big enough without tearing the square of tape. I have used various nails, a drill bit, a center punch, etc. In re-reading this, it sounds as though I must change the tape often. I do not - it stays put, assuming you clean the sight properly first. I have used the neon duct tape on several non-tritium guns and love the results. The front sight practically jumps at your eyes.