Beretta introducing a Langdon Tactical 92!

[beenalongtime]

I considered ordering one EARLY on, but while I would have been able to get a number under 100, it would have been an unenjoyed safe queen. Today I realized there was a number that meant something, turned out was available, and I won't mind shooting, compared to the 92 Inox I picked up used, thanks to all my OT.

Now it is wait and start to fill up the range pack for the first day off, after I have the gun.
I expect I will prefer my PX4, but now I will have a few things to get me excited about a range day, instead of just wanting to sleep when I am off (fallen asleep waiting for my oil to drain).
So the LTT With a trigger job, does it come lubed up and ready to go OOB, or should I asked my LGS to lube it for me, before picking up (been 80 hours a week for a while, just want to get to the range)?

[NuJudge]

I wasn't that fast on the draw with my wallet, and I did not call to ask for a specific number, and the serial number that arrived was shockingly low. There is lube on the pistol, and appears to be oil, but it had stayed very much only in the places with reciprocating contact, so it may well be a thin grease. I think I will redo the lube before I shoot it.

The trigger pull on the LTT feels even better than that on the 92G I installed a TJIAB in (YMMV). Having fingers like a piano player, I thought I might dislike the really thin grips, but they're fine. I have the sense that the rear sight is taller, and the rear sight notch a lot deeper than on my 92Gs. I also have the sense that I probably will not use the slide serrations at the front of the slide for press-checking, instead relying on the scallops at the front of the slide for that purpose. I probably won't have time to shoot it until after the CMP Games matches.

I am entirely satisfied.

[OlongJohnson]

I have a Wilson Trigger bar and action job from Bucket at Wilson and it light strikes WWB, but works with everything else I have run in it.

Interesting, given the reputation Winchester pistol primers have in reloading communities for seeming to be soft from time to time. Wouldn't surprise me at all if they weren't fully seated, though.

[Jeep]

I have a Wilson Trigger bar and action job from Bucket at Wilson and it light strikes WWB, but works with everything else I have run in it.

What weight hammer spring are you using?

[GyroF-16]

What weight hammer spring are you using?

I was wondering the same thing…
I had a few light strikes with an 11 pound spring, with, and without the Wilson trigger bar. But since changing to 12 pound have been 100%.
( this was on my Centurion, not the LTT Elite).

[LOKNLOD]

Got mine today. Not sure what else to say, but "Wow!" :cool:

[Steven T]

Got mine today. Not sure what else to say, but "Wow!" :cool:

Just picked up mine as well, Wow indeed!
But now my other Beretta's trigger seems so inadequate, that Ill have to put one of Langdon's trigger jobs in a bag in it.

[Bill]

Just picked up mine as well, Wow indeed!
But now my other Beretta's trigger seems so inadequate, that Ill have to put one of Langdon's trigger jobs in a bag in it.

Welcome to the club. I just include them in the beretta budget for each new pistol automatically now. Its like replacing oem glock sights.

[Steven T]

Welcome to the club. I just include them in the beretta budget for each new pistol automatically now. Its like replacing oem glock sights.

I can find no fault in your logic Sir! I'm making it SOP.

[pastaslinger]

What serial number ranges have people been getting this week?

[Steven T]

What serial number ranges have people been getting this week?

159 for me. Mr Langdon posted (don't remember were) that Beretta wasn't shipping the pistols in sequential order.

[hththt]

Yeap he mentioned he has received guns with serial 400+ but not all the lower ones are in. Mine (low 2xx) is still not in yet

[pastaslinger]

The waiting is pain

[Doc_Glock]

My LTT Elite is now at 2164 rounds. It is about 1200 since last malfunction. Still shoots much better than I can.

Today I had a dead primer with Fiocchi 115 grain. D spring would not light it, but it appears to have been hit quite hard.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180803/5f7679254f3beda39ff5294386b51f45.jpg

Many more hits never lit it off.

Cumulative Ammo Types:

Speer Lawman 115 grain
S&B 124 grain SB9B
PPU 115 grain NATO A-355
Speer Lawman 147 grain
American Eagle 147 grain
Barnaul White box 115 grain
Wolf Poly 115 grain
Wolf Lacquer mil spec 115 grain
Brown Bear 115 grain
Silver Bear 115 grain
Magtech 115 grain
S&B 115 grain
Armscor 115 grain
Fiocchi 115 grain

All four other malfunctions were with Speer Lawman 115 grain which does not seem to agree with this pistol for some reason.

I am quite convinced it is as reliable as it’s ammunition at this point.

[Bucky]

My LTT Elite is now at 2164 rounds. It is about 1200 since last malfunction. Still shoots much better than I can.

Today I had a dead primer with Fiocchi 115 grain. D spring would not light it, but it appears to have been hit quite hard.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180803/5f7679254f3beda39ff5294386b51f45.jpg

Many more hits never lit it off.

Cumulative Ammo Types:

Speer Lawman 115 grain
S&B 124 grain SB9B
PPU 115 grain NATO A-355
Speer Lawman 147 grain
American Eagle 147 grain
Barnaul White box 115 grain
Wolf Poly 115 grain
Wolf Lacquer mil spec 115 grain
Brown Bear 115 grain
Silver Bear 115 grain
Magtech 115 grain
S&B 115 grain
Armscor 115 grain
Fiocchi 115 grain

All four other malfunctions were with Speer Lawman 115 grain which does not seem to agree with this pistol for some reason.

I am quite convinced it is as reliable as it’s ammunition at this point.

I wonder if a different gun would have set that off, or if it’s truly dead.

[JimLob65]

That looks like a pretty good crater. Sure looks to be a dud round.

[dtrice]

My LTT Elite is now at 2164 rounds. It is about 1200 since last malfunction. Still shoots much better than I can.

Today I had a dead primer with Fiocchi 115 grain. D spring would not light it, but it appears to have been hit quite hard.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180803/5f7679254f3beda39ff5294386b51f45.jpg

Many more hits never lit it off.

Cumulative Ammo Types:

Speer Lawman 115 grain
S&B 124 grain SB9B
PPU 115 grain NATO A-355
Speer Lawman 147 grain
American Eagle 147 grain
Barnaul White box 115 grain
Wolf Poly 115 grain
Wolf Lacquer mil spec 115 grain
Brown Bear 115 grain
Silver Bear 115 grain
Magtech 115 grain
S&B 115 grain
Armscor 115 grain
Fiocchi 115 grain

All four other malfunctions were with Speer Lawman 115 grain which does not seem to agree with this pistol for some reason.

I am quite convinced it is as reliable as it’s ammunition at this point.
I have some WWB left to burn through, but how does it like the magtech? It's cheap and I've never had a problem with BHP or my Sigs. They ate them like candy.

[Doc_Glock]

I have some WWB left to burn through, but how does it like the magtech? It's cheap and I've never had a problem with BHP or my Sigs. They ate them like candy.

Loves Magtech. As do pretty much all my guns. Love the Shooting Size 250 round packages.

I won’t shoot WWB any more. Just junk. And I have a low threshold for shooting junk ammo.

[Coal Train]

Received notice that mine shipped out today.

I’m looking forward to receiving it. ;)

[EVP]

Loves Magtech. As do pretty much all my guns. Love the Shooting Size 250 round packages.

I won’t shoot WWB any more. Just junk. And I have a low threshold for shooting junk ammo.

Enel is the Speer lawman a light load? I have always had good results with Speer lawman and thought of it as good training ammo.

[Doc_Glock]

Enel is the Speer lawman a light load? I have always had good results with Speer lawman and thought of it as good training ammo.

Didn’t seem like it. Lawman is always pretty hot in my experience. I can’t explain it. The 124 and 147 Lawman ran fine.

I would like to retry the 115 again now that it is broken in a bit.

The more I shoot, the more I realize that reputable guns are more reliable than most ammo.

[ReverendMeat]

S/N 399, just took it out for a famfire, same 100 course of fire as I did with my PX4CC at 7 yards, nothing super fancy. Shot great when I wasn't snatching the hell out of the trigger like an idiot. Going from 92 to PX4 and back, the triggers are definitely different. The LTT is going to be my main shootin' gun, with my well-vetted 92G for carry and the PX4 as a backup just in case.

[SoCalDep]

#263 is on its way! Got my shipping confirmation today. The sad part is that it will be some time this next week I'll be able to get to the FFL to start the paperwork, then a 10-day waiting period since the fact I own many...many... handguns is irrelevant to the fact I must be buying this one (that's been on order since the day it was announced) because I'm overcome by emotional murderous rage and must take 10 days to "cool down", at which point I will no longer be dangerous.

The fact that my job, which is regulated by the state that mandates the 10-day waiting period requires me to carry a pistol... Is apparently irrelevant.

That said, I'm very happy about this pistol and it will be worth it in the end... when I cool down.

[OlongJohnson]

If you've ever thought about moving to a different state on account of those laws, they are working as intended. Just sayin'.

[Inkwell 41]

Eagerly waiting for mine to ship. At a gun show today and there were a couple LTT M9s. I really liked the feel compared to a standard 92. Those grips are way cool and totally awesome. Really happy that I ordered the LTT Elite.

[Inkwell 41]

Got a call this afternoon from a number that I didn't recognize. Almost didn't answer it, but it may have been an opportunity to screw with some scam caller, so I took a chance. Turns out it was Aimee Langdon, calling to let me know that the Sn I was waiting on still had not arrived. She offered me another Sn in its place. The one that I asked for has a special meaning to me, so I declined. I really appreciate LTT for making the offer, they know that people want their LTT Elites and are doing everything they can to get them out. I don't need to say it, but Langdon Tactical Technology is a class act. I look forward to receiving mine, and to other LTT specific Beretta's.

[JimLob65]

Although I am sure some weren't happy about the initial batch being sent back, and the ensuing delay, I doubt any Langdon customers have any complaints about the CS they experienced. I had similar CS experiences from WC while buying my Brig Tac and Cen Tac.

[Caesar]

Put 350 rounds through my Elite LTT today. No malfunctions or stoppages in 700 rounds and it’s more accurate than I am.

The roll pin on the right decocking lever started to walk out so I used the bottom of the magazine to push it back in. If anyone has a trick to keep this pin in, please share. I’d never find it if it fell out at the range.

[beenalongtime]

Got a call this afternoon from a number that I didn't recognize. Almost didn't answer it, but it may have been an opportunity to screw with some scam caller, so I took a chance. Turns out it was Aimee Langdon, calling to let me know that the Sn I was waiting on still had not arrived. She offered me another Sn in its place. The one that I asked for has a special meaning to me, so I declined. I really appreciate LTT for making the offer, they know that people want their LTT Elites and are doing everything they can to get them out. I don't need to say it, but Langdon Tactical Technology is a class act. I look forward to receiving mine, and to other LTT specific Beretta's.


There are times like that, one wishes money was not a finite commodity so you could just say, "I'll take that number as well".

[Cory]

Put 350 rounds through my Elite LTT today. No malfunctions or stoppages in 700 rounds and it’s more accurate than I am.

The roll pin on the right decocking lever started to walk out so I used the bottom of the magazine to push it back in. If anyone has a trick to keep this pin in, please share. I’d never find it if it fell out at the range.

My Langdon M9 does this. I can tell you a magazine push or leatherman push doesnt stop it from walking. I intend to tap mine with a punch but I dont have a punch set.

I think that its something of an issue with the G decocker kits, but hopefully just tapping the pin in further will do the trick.

-Cory

[Prdator]

All Three of mine are in and they are flat amazing the last two has the best triggers that I have on any of my 92's and that is saying something!!!

[JimLob65]

All Three of mine are in and they are flat amazing the last two has the best triggers that I have on any of my 92's and that is saying something!!!

Did you get the trigger job done on your pistols?

[Prdator]

Did you get the trigger job done on your pistols?

Yes and with the 12# hammer spring. I have eleven 92's that have either a full hose custom trigger job ( like the Elites) or the Trigger job in a bag, None of them are even close to bad just VERY slight degrees of great to amazing. And I freely admit Im very much a trigger snob!! Ernest his self has told me that on more than one occasion.. LMAO... In fact I doubt that the vast majority of people could tell any difference in the triggers on my 92's its such a very small change.. I can say that every Langdon trigger I have felt is better than the Wilson ones that I have got to shoot.

[JimLob65]

Yes and with the 12# hammer spring. I have eleven 92's that have either a full hose custom trigger job ( like the Elites) or the Trigger job in a bag, None of them are even close to bad just VERY slight degrees of great to amazing. And I freely admit Im very much a trigger snob!! Ernest his self has told me that on more than one occasion.. LMAO... In fact I doubt that the vast majority of people could tell any difference in the triggers on my 92's its such a very small change.. I can say that every Langdon trigger I have felt is better than the Wilson ones that I have got to shoot.

I own both a Cen Tac and a Brig Tac, both with the action tune and chrome silicon springs as well as a Elite LTT with a trigger job. My observations are that both the WC pistols have a noticeably lighter DA trigger with a slight amount of stacking while the LTT has an incredibly smooth DA trigger with a very crisp SA break. Biggest difference I find is thst the Langdon pistol has a DA break that is much closer to the frame, which doesn't work quite as well for me personally although I am sure I could get accustomed to it fairly quickly.

Really tough choosing between them! All awesome examples of the 92 series.

[Bucky]

I really have enough Berettas, but every time this thread pops up, I have to talk myself out of this. :eek:

[JimLob65]

I really have enough Berettas, but every time this thread pops up, I have to talk myself out of this. :eek:

Go 'head.... Tame the plunge:p!!

Seriously, you won't regret it.

[MSparks909]

Should have mine in hand sometime this week :cool:

[JimLob65]

Go 'head.... Tame the plunge:p!!

Seriously, you won't regret it.

DAMN!! I really need to stop posting from my phone.....:(

[Bill]

My gun has shipped. Will I be that guy that shows up at the Gun Shop 90 seconds after the tracking number says delivered, knowing damn well that my gun hasn't been opened or logged into their ATF books yet?? Maaayyyyybbbeeeeeeeeeee ;) I've found a dozen krispy kreme donuts goes a long way to grease those wheels. . . .

[Cory]

My gun has shipped. Will I be that guy that shows up at the Gun Shop 90 seconds after the tracking number says delivered, knowing damn well that my gun hasn't been opened or logged into their ATF books yet?? Maaayyyyybbbeeeeeeeeeee ;) I've found a dozen krispy kreme donuts goes a long way to grease those wheels. . . .

I went on my lunch break. It had been signed for, but wasnt opened or received. I recognized the fedex box from ELs instagram and pointed it out in the stack of not yet received delivery. They opened it and received it, then did the transfer to me. About 25 minutes later I walked out with a grin.

-Cory

[Bigghoss]

I don't know how many times I showed up at the gun store before they had had a chance to log it. Being on a first-name basis with the store owner really helps.

[Coal Train]

I picked mine up today and was able to put 100 rounds through it. I can’t really add anything other than what has already been said. It is absolutely an outstanding gun and, assuming it is durable, a great value. The trigger job and the sights are excellent. I found it easy to shoot close and at distance. I’m looking forward to spending more time with it.

[awp_101]

I really have enough Berettas
I’m not familiar with this concept...:confused:

[Dagga Boy]

Just finished the first range trip......first 30 rounds was a 97 Super Test. It is awesome.

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=1459953857439394&id=289679681133490

[Arbninftry]

Just finished the first range trip......first 30 rounds was a 97 Super Test. It is awesome.

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=1459953857439394&id=289679681133490

DB you once wrote that you and your wife loved the Cent Tac. Is this a better shooter for you?

[Larry Sellers]

If I wasn’t limited to 10 rounds in the people’s republic of CT I’d be all over one or two of these.....


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Bill]

Picked up #286 today! Was at the gun counter exactly 19 minutes after Fed-ex delivered it. Will shoot it this weekend. First impressions are all positive. Trigger job is excellent. Trigger guard radius is subtle. . . in that way that you don't notice it at all....until you pick up your M9 and go, "ohhhhh, riiiiiighttttt"

[Doc_Glock]

Just finished the first range trip......first 30 rounds was a 97 Super Test. It is awesome.

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=1459953857439394&id=289679681133490

Great shooting!

[Dagga Boy]

DB you once wrote that you and your wife loved the Cent Tac. Is this a better shooter for you?

I like the CenTac as more of a carry gun. The LTT 92 Elite is being set up as a pure dedicated light gun and I only have 20 round magazines for it. For how I intend to run it as a bedside and tactical pistol....It is looking really good. I am having a bit of a hard time between the PX4 DA and the 92’s. They are a little different in where they break and I am actual much better with the PX4. The single action on the 92 is amazing, and very predictable.

[ncrockclimb]

Just finished the first range trip......first 30 rounds was a 97 Super Test. It is awesome.

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=1459953857439394&id=289679681133490

What mag are you using?

[Dagga Boy]

What mag are you using?

20rpund Mecgar’s. I think I have a total of 12 for the LTT Elite.

[ncrockclimb]

20rpund Mecgar’s. I think I have a total of 12 for the LTT Elite.

Thanks! I don't want to drag this too far off topic, but the LTT 92 is going to be my first Beretta and I am still learning about the platform. I think I know the answer since you have 12, but is this the "best" mag for the gun? Does it feed reliably? Does it lock the slide back after the last round?

BTW, thanks for all your posts. I lurk a lot a post seldom, and have learned a ton from you and a number of other prolific posters.

[JimLob65]

You can be totally confident in Mec Gar magazines. I run18 & 20 round Mec Gar magazines almost exclusively and have never had a magazine related problem.

[ncrockclimb]

Great info. Thanks. Will be placing my order for a few tonight, and dropping my order on Langdon for a 92 next week.

[hththt]

The 18 rnd mecgar is a flush fit, the 20 isn’t. Not sure if that matters

[Dagga Boy]

I use the 18’s for flush fit, and the 20’s for things like how I am using the LTT Elite. For me it is going to be an “offensive pistol”. That means it is in a role of being taken to a fight. While we would always prefer long guns for taking to fights, that is not often reality. In my home, to get from my room to my kids room, trust me it will be offensive in how that goes. Same as when I was in LE....we took pistols into fights all the time. Nature of the beast. My concealed carry defensive pistols are things that are smaller and much more streamlined like the PC4CC. I don’t use weapon mounted lights on defensive carry pistols. I am not hunting anything or searching with those guns. I use those with a handheld exclusively, and the light will often be in my hand well ahead of the gun.

[Dagga Boy]

Also....I have a Wilson mag guide enroute from Langdon Tactical. I really like them, especially with the extended magazines.

[Shipwreck]

I might be odd man out - but I personally like the 15 round factory mags. You can easily get replacement springs and parts for them. Not an option on the Mecgars.

[Bill]

I'm in the minority of people who actually prefer a thicker grip panel on my 92's. More palm swell fills my hand better, and with a slightly diminished grip strength from arthritic issues, bigger is better; more friction with less applied effort. That said; Boy is this pistol a sweetie. Its my first time handling a 92 with the front serrations, and before I got it I assumed I wouldn't use them, as I've just gotten used to using the scallop at the front of the slide. . . Nope! These are super handy, and I fear now I'm gonna be spoiled for other slides.

[Dagga Boy]

I might be odd man out - but I personally like the 15 round factory mags. You can easily get replacement springs and parts for them. Not an option on the Mecgars.

I tend to use the factory Beretta magazines for training mags for that very reason.

[LockedBreech]

I am strongly considering (about 80% there actually) selling my 92A1 with walnut grips to fund about 40% of a purchase of an Elite. It's my ideal 92, which the 92A1 was at the time I bought it, but then the Wilson options tempted, and now the Langdon option looks like quite literally my perfect 92-series platform. Definitely going to need to budget for it but I think it's well worth it.

[Shipwreck]

I am strongly considering (about 80% there actually) selling my 92A1 with walnut grips to fund about 40% of a purchase of an Elite. It's my ideal 92, which the 92A1 was at the time I bought it, but then the Wilson options tempted, and now the Langdon option looks like quite literally my perfect 92-series platform. Definitely going to need to budget for it but I think it's well worth it.


I'd keep it, if I were you.

I have owned 28 Beretta 92 variants over the years. I personally like the normal grip serrations that the 92A1 and 92FS has, compared to the checkering Beretta uses. That checkering is nothing like the nice, sharp checkering on a 1911.

Out of all the models, including a Wilson Brig, my favorite is still the normal 92FS model. It balances the best, IMHO. If you want a rail... I'd just keep the 92A1, if I were you.

[pastaslinger]

I might be odd man out - but I personally like the 15 round factory mags. You can easily get replacement springs and parts for them. Not an option on the Mecgars.

Who needs that stuff when the mags are $25 a piece and last a long time?

[Shipwreck]

Who needs that stuff when the mags are $25 a piece and last a long time?

Well, I have had to change a few springs in factory mags if I leave them loaded - they still worked, but did not always lock the slide back. So, I replace em with +10% mag springs. Problem solved

[EVP]

I like the CenTac as more of a carry gun. The LTT 92 Elite is being set up as a pure dedicated light gun and I only have 20 round magazines for it. For how I intend to run it as a bedside and tactical pistol....It is looking really good. I am having a bit of a hard time between the PX4 DA and the 92’s. They are a little different in where they break and I am actual much better with the PX4. The single action on the 92 is amazing, and very predictable.

DB please feel free to share your comparison of these two as you get more range time with the LTT. I recently picked up a Cen Tac and am enamored with it. The gun shoots so well and flat plus it is the perfect size. It conceals easier then a g19 even with a mag guide and flush fit mecgars, cannot complain about that.

[Dagga Boy]

DB please feel free to share your comparison of these two as you get more range time with the LTT. I recently picked up a Cen Tac and am enamored with it. The gun shoots so well and flat plus it is the perfect size. It conceals easier then a g19 even with a mag guide and flush fit mecgars, cannot complain about that.

Honestly the gun I want is the M9A1 Compact frame with the CenTac slide....Aiwb heaven if you like the 92. I have the frame and debating getting it done to be an add on to the CenTac or waiting to find a Centurion slide.

[ncrockclimb]

Is it just me or does Beretta have THE MOST confusing model nomenclature out there. I am trying to figure what is what, and it is not (at least to me) at all intuitive.

[karam.19]

Is it just me or does Beretta have THE MOST confusing model nomenclature out there. I am trying to figure what is what, and it is not (at least to me) at all intuitive.

I think S&W revolvers have them beat.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Bucky]

Is it just me or does Beretta have THE MOST confusing model nomenclature out there. I am trying to figure what is what, and it is not (at least to me) at all intuitive.

UM, GLOCK?

[JTQ]

Is it just me or does Beretta have THE MOST confusing model nomenclature out there. I am trying to figure what is what, and it is not (at least to me) at all intuitive.
I don't think it's too hard to figure out, but there are a lot of differences that can affect holster selections, such as rail/no rail, Brigadier slide or not, and the 92A1/96A1 have the rounded trigger guard vs the squared trigger guard of just about all the rest.

http://www.beretta.com/en-us/beretta-92-series/?__hstc=42665914.83117e8d1690d8ce52ceb3fc085b4960. 1531495711645.1533854565427.1533947994248.7&__hssc=42665914.1.1533947994248&__hsfp=333195834&_ga=2.39259555.1220752522.1533947994-1173474158.1531495727

If you own a 92FS or an M9, just about everybody makes a holster for those guns. You start getting a rail, or a Brigadier slide, and any of the various combinations with those, and you start finding some holster limitations.

[Inkwell 41]

Picked up mine tonight.


Incredible

[JSGlock34]

Is it just me or does Beretta have THE MOST confusing model nomenclature out there. I am trying to figure what is what, and it is not (at least to me) at all intuitive.

It's part of the fun with Pizza Guns! This Lucky Gunner: Evolution of the Beretta 92 (https://www.luckygunner.com/lounge/guide-beretta-92/) chart and article will either help or utterly confuse you. It's not too dated, though it predates the Langdon Elite, and I take issue with the line connecting the M9A1 and 92A1. Still, it captures a great deal of information and is a good place to start. If you really want to dive into the deep end, the Beretta Forum (http://berettaforum.net/vb/showthread.php?t=98238) FAQ on the 92 has a family tree that is far more comprehensive.

https://loungecdn.luckygunner.com/lounge/media/Beretta-92-chart01.jpg

[GyroF-16]

Also....I have a Wilson mag guide enroute from Langdon Tactical. I really like them, especially with the extended magazines.

DB- I had a Wilson mag guide on my Centurian for a little while... I run Elite-type rubber base plates on all my mags, and I found that under recoil, the mag guide and base plate would each shift just enough to hang up and prevent an empty mag from dropping free. It happened 2-3 times per practice session for awhile before I figured out what was causing it. I tried filing the back of the base plates down, to no gain.
In the end, I took the mag guide off. It’s cool, but seemed to be an either-or proposition with the Elite base plates. I’ll be interested to hear whether there’s any issue with the 20-rd Med-Gars.

Gyro

[fixer]

UM, GLOCK?

No joke.

I've lost count of how many time I've heard folks in gun stores flummoxed, some to the point of visible irritation, that the G22 isn't a 22 caliber pistol.

[Cory]

It's part of the fun with Pizza Guns! This Lucky Gunner: Evolution of the Beretta 92 (https://www.luckygunner.com/lounge/guide-beretta-92/) chart and article will either help or utterly confuse you. It's not too dated, though it predates the Langdon Elite, and I take issue with the line connecting the M9A1 and 92A1. Still, it captures a great deal of information and is a good place to start. If you really want to dive into the deep end, the Beretta Forum (http://berettaforum.net/vb/showthread.php?t=98238) FAQ on the 92 has a family tree that is far more comprehensive.

https://loungecdn.luckygunner.com/lounge/media/Beretta-92-chart01.jpg

That's a pretty good chart. For the exhaustive (and largly community/peer reviewed) version go here: http://berettaforum.net/vb/showthread.php?t=98238

The main differences to recognize (and the ones that impact name) are G, FS, Vertec, Brigadier.

-Cory

[Dagga Boy]

DB- I had a Wilson mag guide on my Centurian for a little while... I run Elite-type rubber base plates on all my mags, and I found that under recoil, the mag guide and base plate would each shift just enough to hang up and prevent an empty mag from dropping free. It happened 2-3 times per practice session for awhile before I figured out what was causing it. I tried filing the back of the base plates down, to no gain.
In the end, I took the mag guide off. It’s cool, but seemed to be an either-or proposition with the Elite base plates. I’ll be interested to hear whether there’s any issue with the 20-rd Med-Gars.

Gyro

I have had zero issues with any of the hard base pads. The Beretta 17’s and the Mecgar 18’s and 20’s have all been problem free. I find the big bases on the Mecgar 20’s and the mag guide combine well for a positive reload. I treat the out of battery reload as a shooter induced malfunction. I am looking to solve the problem quickly, but when this occurs in the wild versus the range it can get pretty convoluted with a lot of potential for Murphy. The big Mecgar and the Mag Guide simply help make things cleaner for a positive resolution of a problem under stress.

[Bucky]

No joke.

I've lost count of how many time I've heard folks in gun stores flummoxed, some to the point of visible irritation, that the G22 isn't a 22 caliber pistol.

They should have played on that and made the G40 a .22. Instead they made it a .40.... kind of. ;)

[GyroF-16]

I have had zero issues with any of the hard base pads. The Beretta 17’s and the Mecgar 18’s and 20’s have all been problem free. I find the big bases on the Mecgar 20’s and the mag guide combine well for a positive reload. I treat the out of battery reload as a shooter induced malfunction. I am looking to solve the problem quickly, but when this occurs in the wild versus the range it can get pretty convoluted with a lot of potential for Murphy. The big Mecgar and the Mag Guide simply help make things cleaner for a positive resolution of a problem under stress.

DB-
Yes, I like the rubber bases for the same reason that you like the big bases on the MecGar 20s. I didn’t mean to muddle the issue by writing “empty mags.”
My message was just:
“Head’s up- I’ve had interference issues with big baseplates and the Wilson Mag Guide.”

Hope it works well for you, but if you have a mag hang up when you’re trying to eject it, look at that interface. I looked for interference in the mag well, and from the mag release button, before discovering the source of the problem.

[JSGlock34]

My preference still runs to the Mec-Gar 18 round anti-friction magazines, particularly if the identically made but lower priced "OEM" SKU is available. I bought a number of the latter a few years back when they were available for something like $17/each and haven't looked back. Though my experience is a bit dated now, I found the 17 round Beretta OEM base pads easily cracked, and posted about it previously (https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?13248-Beretta-92-Magazines&p=351233&viewfull=1#post351233). I don't know if Beretta has improved the base pad or changed the material or if I just had a run of bad luck, because I only have bought the Mec-Gar magazines since that experience.

[Jared]

My preference still runs to the Mec-Gar 18 round anti-friction magazines, particularly if the identically made but lower priced "OEM" SKU is available. I bought a number of the latter a few years back when they were available for something like $17/each and haven't looked back. Though my experience is a bit dated now, I found the 17 round Beretta OEM base pads easily cracked, and posted about it previously (https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?13248-Beretta-92-Magazines&p=351233&viewfull=1#post351233). I don't know if Beretta has improved the base pad or changed the material or if I just had a run of bad luck, because I only have bought the Mec-Gar magazines since that experience.

Your report on the 17's made me relegate mine to range use only, where I proceeded to beat the crap out of them. I haven't been able to duplicate the issue you had with my normal use. I dunno if you had bad luck or not, I still use OEM 15 rounders or MecGar 18's for defense tho.

[JSGlock34]

Your report on the 17's made me relegate mine to range use only, where I proceeded to beat the crap out of them. I haven't been able to duplicate the issue you had with my normal use. I dunno if you had bad luck or not, I still use OEM 15 rounders or MecGar 18's for defense tho.

Considering I haven't seen widespread p-f user reports of 17 round magazines breaking, it seems that I drew a poor hand from the deck. All three of my 17 rounders failed in that manner, and it was difficult to source replacement baseplates at the time, so I'm comfortable with my decision to move away from them. On the other hand, I haven't seen a good reason to buy something other than the 18 round Mec-Gar magazines. I found them easier to load than the 17 round magazines, they hold more BBs, Les likes their taper for reloading, the spring seems to last longer than the OEM magazines, they have a nice high-vis follower, and they are often priced equal to or lower than the Beretta magazines (particularly in the 'OEM' flavor). What's not to like?

[einherjarvalk]

For those of you with both the Wilson BrigTacs and LTT Elites, how do the two compare? I've been meaning to add a metal-framed handgun of some sort to my lineup and the 92 series seems to be at the top of the lineup, so I'm hoping to do it right the first time.

I've shot a 92 Inox a long time ago and liked it, but other than that I'm not super well versed in Berettas or what makes the BrigTac and LTT Elite distinct from a functional point of view.

Edit: nevermind, went back a bit further and found the answers I wanted. Sounds like the LTT Elite is the definitive version. Hopefully they'll still be in production come tax time.

[pastaslinger]

For those of you with both the Wilson BrigTacs and LTT Elites, how do the two compare? I've been meaning to add a metal-framed handgun of some sort to my lineup and the 92 series seems to be at the top of the lineup, so I'm hoping to do it right the first time.

I've shot a 92 Inox a long time ago and liked it, but other than that I'm not super well versed in Berettas or what makes the BrigTac and LTT Elite distinct from a functional point of view.

Edit: nevermind, went back a bit further and found the answers I wanted. Sounds like the LTT Elite is the definitive version. Hopefully they'll still be in production come tax time.

Brig Tac isn't a slouch at all, it's just the sights are hard to see. For the money the cen tac is what I'd go with now between the Wilsons

[hththt]

Picked mine up today. Was very excited but noticed that there were a couple of what looks like knife marks (think paper cuts) on the barrel. Also there were some discolor spots on the barrel (not rust color but deep burgundy color). There were a few spots on the slide that got nicked and were showing shiny metal underneath. Nothing too extreme and I’m may be picky but was just wondering if this is the norm for Beretta. This is my first Beretta so I have no prior experience. Thanks!

[ncrockclimb]

I want to get an OWB Kydex holster for the 92 Elite LTT. What do I look for? Holsters for a M9A1 or ​Vertec / M9A3? I have a few Blade Tech holsters, and for Beretta the offer a 92/96 Brigadier, 92FS or M9. Which one would be my best bet?

[MSparks909]

I want to get an OWB Kydex holster for the 92 Elite LTT. What do I look for? Holsters for a M9A1 or ​Vertec / M9A3? I have a few Blade Tech holsters, and for Beretta the offer a 92/96 Brigadier, 92FS or M9. Which one would be my best bet?

Yeah you’ll need one for the M9A1

[GyroF-16]

I want to get an OWB Kydex holster for the 92 Elite LTT. What do I look for? Holsters for a M9A1 or ​Vertec / M9A3? I have a few Blade Tech holsters, and for Beretta the offer a 92/96 Brigadier, 92FS or M9. Which one would be my best bet?

You’ll want one that fits the M9A1, to address the rail and square trigger guard.
I couldn’t find it on the Blade Tech site, but they offer one here:
http://benstoegerproshop.com/blade-tech-classic-owb-holster-for-idpa-ipsc-uspsa/

I ordered one from JM Custom Kydex (made to order in about 2 weeks), for a similar price, and have been very pleased with it.

[Larry Sellers]

Midway has 18 and 20 round magazines on sale today at clearance prices FYI....

[Blackbag]

My go to for the Mec-Gar’s has been Grab a Gun...... 18 rounders are $22.49 and the 20 rounders are $27.09.

[Stony Lane]

The Red Hill Tactical Holster for M9A3 is a good choice.

https://www.redhilltactical.com/Beretta-Parts-and-Holsters_c_15.html

[Stony Lane]

6 Mec-Gar 15-round magazines for $89.95, if you trust Botach.

https://www.botach.com/mec-gar-beretta-92fs-m9-9mm-15rd-blue-pistol-magazines-6-pack/

[JSGlock34]

6 Mec-Gar 15-round magazines for $89.95, if you trust Botach.

https://www.botach.com/mec-gar-beretta-92fs-m9-9mm-15rd-blue-pistol-magazines-6-pack/

Unfortunately those are the 15 round variety. Their price on the 18 round anti friction magazines isn’t that great.

[dtrice]

Does anyone know if a normal 92 frame could have the trigger guard radius-ed like the LTT elite? Thanks.

[Inkwell 41]

Does anyone know if a normal 92 frame could have the trigger guard radius-ed like the LTT elite? Thanks.

Try Allegheny Arms, http://alleghenyarms.com/.

They do lots of Beretta 92 work.

[JSGlock34]

Wilson also offers a dehorn.

[ncrockclimb]

Has anyone put the AMERIGLO SPARTAN SIGHTS on their Elite LTT? I really like the looks of the front site. LangdonTactical what is the width of the rear notch on that site? I am debating between using the full set, or just getting the AMERIGLO SPARTAN front and the Wilson Combat Battlesight rear. Any feedback from folks on either sight setup would be really appreciated.

I have been using the TruGlow TFX Pro on almost all my pistols, and really like the wide notch in the rear. I would like to come as close as possible to replicating it on my Elite LTT.

[Vic20]

I purchased mine with the full set of Spartan Sights, and I am very please with them. I had the Ameriglo front sight that came on my PX4 CC and I really like the bright orange of the front sight along with the benefit of the tritium inserts. On the Elite LTT, the look and work great. I am glad I went for this upgrade.

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[MSparks909]

I purchased mine with the full set of Spartan Sights, and I am very please with them. I had the Ameriglo front sight that came on my PX4 CC and I really like the bright orange of the front sight along with the benefit of the tritium inserts. On the Elite LTT, the look and work great. I am glad I went for this upgrade.

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What are the dimensions of these sights?

[MSparks909]

Put 200 through my LTT 92 this morning. As expected, 0 malfunctions or issues. I shot it exclusively with a TLR-1 attached, and it will most likely have a WML attached 90% of the time. Love the sights; my favorite 92 sights by far. IMO this is the best 92 variant available. I intend to purchase a second one when my gun fund replenishes. The only change I’ve made is I swapped the grips out for standard width gray/black Wilson G10s...I just don’t like the thin grips on radius backstrap cut 92s. It might be nitpicking to some but I definitely notice a difference in recoil control when shooting at speed. I wish LTT made standard width grips in addition to their ultra thins.. LangdonTactical

[LangdonTactical]

Put 200 through my LTT 92 this morning. As expected, 0 malfunctions or issues. I shot it exclusively with a TLR-1 attached, and it will most likely have a WML attached 90% of the time. Love the sights; my favorite 92 sights by far. IMO this is the best 92 variant available. I intend to purchase a second one when my gun fund replenishes. The only change I’ve made is I swapped the grips out for standard width gray/black Wilson G10s...I just don’t like the thin grips on radius backstrap cut 92s. It might be nitpicking to some but I definitely notice a difference in recoil control when shooting at speed. I wish LTT made standard width grips in addition to their ultra thins.. LangdonTactical

I think maybe two people have said they want the grips to be thicker. It could be done for sure, but I am not sure it is worth making it a product. We don't hear very often "the 92 would be great if you could just make the grip a little bigger" :)

[LangdonTactical]

By the way, we have the Elite LTTs in stock and shipping. Standard guns ship within 24 hours and guns with a Trigger Job ship within a couple of days. Maybe the same day if depending on when you order.

[Vic20]

What are the dimensions of these sights?

I don't have a good way to measure the opening of the rear sights with any kind of accuracy, but I have included a couple more photos to compare it directly again my Wilson Combat 92BT with the standard Wilson Battle Sight. It would appear to my aging eyes they are about the same width. Obviously the Spartan Sights with the Tritium inserts are on the left.

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[ncrockclimb]

By the way, we have the Elite LTTs in stock and shipping. Standard guns ship within 24 hours and guns with a Trigger Job ship within a couple of days. Maybe the same day if depending on when you order.

Order placed and message sent about the specifics of the trigger job and sights.

I am not a collector or "gun of the month" guy, and only buy (and keep) guns that I will regularly use and train with. I am more excited about the 92 Elite LTT than any gun I have purchased in YEARS! Thanks for creating this pistol!

[ncrockclimb]

I don't have a good way to measure the opening of the rear sights with any kind of accuracy, but I have included a couple more photos to compare it directly again my Wilson Combat 92BT with the standard Wilson Battle Sight. It would appear to my aging eyes they are about the same width. Obviously the Spartan Sights with the Tritium inserts are on the left.



Great post! I went with the Spartan Sights rear on my new pistol.

[GJM]

Great post! I went with the Spartan Sights rear on my new pistol.

How are they in terms of POA/POI?

[ncrockclimb]

How are they in terms of POA/POI?

I'll let you know after I get my pistol. I just placed my order today.

[EVP]

I get slightly annoyed at Ameriglo because they need to incorporate the use of yellow tritium in their rear sights more.

Also Wilson needs to put out some rear sights with their use of yellow tritium as well for a solid 3 dot arrangement.

[dtrice]

I don't have a good way to measure the opening of the rear sights with any kind of accuracy, but I have included a couple more photos to compare it directly again my Wilson Combat 92BT with the standard Wilson Battle Sight. It would appear to my aging eyes they are about the same width. Obviously the Spartan Sights with the Tritium inserts are on the left.

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The Wilson looks every so slightly wider. Which sight picture works better to you? The Spartans are a square notch and the Wilsons are U notch. I think stock Beretta 92 rear site height is .270, but I would think the Brig slide probably uses something taller. Does anyone know the height on the LTT?

[beenalongtime]

How about a Spartan rear for a PX4?

[Bill]

Appropriate since we're on the topic of sights: My Elite LTT slide slid off my work bench this morning, landing on the front sight and breaking it (totally my fault). I've ordered a set of spartans to replace it. My question is, will the spartan front work with the standard Elite LTT rear sight (which I like, being all blacked out)? Or will I need to put in the spartan rear to get an appropriate zero? I feel like Ernest did a video clip on this a ways back, but I haven't been able to find it on his social media anywhere.

[Vic20]

The Wilson looks every so slightly wider. Which sight picture works better to you? The Spartans are a square notch and the Wilsons are U notch. I think stock Beretta 92 rear site height is .270, but I would think the Brig slide probably uses something taller. Does anyone know the height on the LTT?

I personally like the Spartan sights on the Elite LTT much better. For me personally I think it is just the combination of the brighter front sight (to my eyes, anyway) and the square notch. On the Wilson BT, the white from sight is not as visible to me in daylight, and in low light the tritium insert is rather dim for my liking compared to the Ameriglo Spartan front sight on the Elite LTT. As far as POA/POI this gun shoots exactly where I expect it to. I don't know if Langdon Tactical "sighted them in" when they installed them, but I find for me the shot goes right where I want/expect it to as long as I'm doing my part.

Just a few other observations and comments while we are all sharing :)

Put 275 rounds through it without a single issue. Various loads including Winchester White Box, Walmart Federal FMJ 115g, and a handful of other +p, 124g, and hollow points from Federal, Remington and Fiocchi.
Ordered mine May 3, and didn't request a specific serial number. Got a number just under 200, so I was very pleased. As NCROCKCLIMB stated, I also am not a gun collector and only buy what I am going to shoot, but having a relatively low serial was just icing on a already very tasty cake for me. I purchased the LTT Trigger job and I am very happy with the results. I had the action tune done to my Wilson BT when I ordered it, and the Elite LTT is still so much smoother. Well worth it in my opinion.

[beenalongtime]

Appropriate since we're on the topic of sights: My Elite LTT slide slid off my work bench this morning, landing on the front sight and breaking it (totally my fault). I've ordered a set of spartans to replace it. My question is, will the spartan front work with the standard Elite LTT rear sight (which I like, being all blacked out)? Or will I need to put in the spartan rear to get an appropriate zero? I feel like Ernest did a video clip on this a ways back, but I haven't been able to find it on his social media anywhere.

http://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?21095-Beretta-introducing-a-Langdon-Tactical-92!&p=774579&viewfull=1#post774579

Wilson Rear Sight
Dawson Fiber Optic Front sight
From that post:

From here: http://www.langdontactical.com/ameriglo-spartan-sights-elite-ltt/
Available as a set or Front Sight Only. If you want the Front Sight Only, you must combine with a Wilson Combat Battlesight Rear for proper Point of Impact.

Unsure if Wilson has more then one rear. Hopefully this will help some.

[Bill]

http://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?21095-Beretta-introducing-a-Langdon-Tactical-92!&p=774579&viewfull=1#post774579

Wilson Rear Sight
Dawson Fiber Optic Front sight
From that post:

From here: http://www.langdontactical.com/ameriglo-spartan-sights-elite-ltt/
Available as a set or Front Sight Only. If you want the Front Sight Only, you must combine with a Wilson Combat Battlesight Rear for proper Point of Impact.

Unsure if Wilson has more then one rear. Hopefully this will help some.

Unfortunately that doesn't answer the question precisely, although I do appreciate the help! Really, I just need to figure out if the rear height and notch width between the two are the same/similar. . . and thats an answer I will find out once my full set of spartans arrives. . . I'm just being impatient. Saying that the Spartan front requires the wilson battlesight rear isn't helpful (as you noted) as that rear comes in different height options (.270, .290 etc)

[BJV]

Unfortunately that doesn't answer the question precisely, although I do appreciate the help! Really, I just need to figure out if the rear height and notch width between the two are the same/similar. . . and thats an answer I will find out once my full set of spartans arrives. . . I'm just being impatient. Saying that the Spartan front requires the wilson battlesight rear isn't helpful (as you noted) as that rear comes in different height options (.270, .290 etc)

I have a Vertec slide that has a Spartan front paired with a Pepperoni/Wilson (square notch) rear:

632SQ-S Wilson Combat Battlesight, Flat Square Notch, Serrated, .290


This setup provides a drive-the-dot sight picture for my gun. In terms of width, I see bars of light on both sides of the front sight at extension, and I find the setup to be a good balance between speed and accuracy. For those with the PX4C/C Ameriglo sights, it's a similar sight picture, but with a round orange front rather than square. I like it and would recommend it.

[LangdonTactical]

Appropriate since we're on the topic of sights: My Elite LTT slide slid off my work bench this morning, landing on the front sight and breaking it (totally my fault). I've ordered a set of spartans to replace it. My question is, will the spartan front work with the standard Elite LTT rear sight (which I like, being all blacked out)? Or will I need to put in the spartan rear to get an appropriate zero? I feel like Ernest did a video clip on this a ways back, but I haven't been able to find it on his social media anywhere.

Lots of questions here on this thread on sights. First things first, we need to isolate that we are talking about the Vertec/M9A3/Elite LTT slide. The Brigadier has a different deck hight and will not be the same, nor will the standard slide or any PX4 variant. They are not all the same. The dovetails are all the same on the 92 rear sights, so you can swap sights around, but they may not give you the correct point of impact.

Vertec/M9A3/Elite LTT Rear sights;

Height / Notch
Standard .290"/ .150"
Elite LTT .290"/ .145"
Spartan .300" / .155"
Wilson .300 .300" / .150"
LesPep Wilson .305" / .150"


Keep in mind that all of these are production sights and the measurments can be off by +- .003" on any of them depending on when they come off the machine.

Also, the Wilson rears have several other hights up to a .310" tall and all the way down to the standard 92 .270" height. So you have the option to make the gun really hit where you want.

The make the square notch in a couple differnt heights as well I believe.

[LangdonTactical]

Lots of questions here on this thread on sights. First things first, we need to isolate that we are talking about the Vertec/M9A3/Elite LTT slide. The Brigadier has a different deck hight and will not be the same, nor will the standard slide or any PX4 variant. They are not all the same. The dovetails are all the same on the 92 rear sights, so you can swap sights around, but they may not give you the correct point of impact.

Vertec/M9A3/Elite LTT Rear sights;

Height / Notch
Standard .290"/ .150"
Elite LTT .290"/ .145"
Spartan .300" / .155"
Wilson .300 .300" / .150"
LesPep Wilson .305" / .150"


Keep in mind that all of these are production sights and the measurments can be off by +- .003" on any of them depending on when they come off the machine.

Also, the Wilson rears have several other hights up to a .310" tall and all the way down to the standard 92 .270" height. So you have the option to make the gun really hit where you want.

The make the square notch in a couple differnt heights as well I believe.

Sorry about the format. I looked way better before I posted it.

[ncrockclimb]

Langdon Tactical has really impressed me so far!

I placed my order yesterday around 3:30. I had a few notes / questions about spring weights and sights. Aimee called me within a few minutes of me hitting send. She was great to work with and we finalized the details of my order on the phone. I just got notified that Fed Ex picked up my order and it will reach my FFL for transfer tomorrow. Wow. That is awesome.

If the pistol is anywhere close to being as good as the customer service, I am going to have a new favorite 9mm.

[GyroF-16]

Lots of questions here on this thread on sights. First things first, we need to isolate that we are talking about the Vertec/M9A3/Elite LTT slide. The Brigadier has a different deck hight and will not be the same, nor will the standard slide or any PX4 variant. They are not all the same. The dovetails are all the same on the 92 rear sights, so you can swap sights around, but they may not give you the correct point of impact.

Vertec/M9A3/Elite LTT Rear sights;

Height / Notch
Standard .290"/ .150"
Elite LTT .290"/ .145"
Spartan .300" / .155"
Wilson .300 .300" / .150"
LesPep Wilson .305" / .150"


Keep in mind that all of these are production sights and the measurments can be off by +- .003" on any of them depending on when they come off the machine.

Also, the Wilson rears have several other hights up to a .310" tall and all the way down to the standard 92 .270" height. So you have the option to make the gun really hit where you want.

The make the square notch in a couple differnt heights as well I believe.

Thanks very much, Ernest!

Could I trouble you for the similar front sight data for the dovetailed Vertec/M9A3/Elite LTT slides?

[LangdonTactical]

Thanks very much, Ernest!

Could I trouble you for the similar front sight data for the dovetailed Vertec/M9A3/Elite LTT slides?

Yeah, I can try to put that together soon. More measuring with a caliper :)

[ncrockclimb]

I got my new LTT 92 today. I have yet to fire it, and have done a little more than hold it and try fire it a few times. At this point, all I can say is “WOW!” There’s a lot to like about this pistol, but the thing that jumped out at me Immediately was the quality of the trigger.

I have a few hours of work to do at the office tomorrow. Afterwards, I hope to go by the range and fire at least a few magazines. Expect more post and a longer review later

[ncrockclimb]

After 150 rounds at the big outdoor range, I remain very VERY impressed. I will do a more comprehensive post later.

The Ameriglo sights are really great.

[karam.19]

The Elite LTT is my first 92. I noticed this small spring (I think) right above the trigger. Does anyone know what this is? https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180819/514895d96a8900c57f2b898abb445446.jpg


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[EVP]

Totally normal

[LOKNLOD]

The Elite LTT is my first 92. I noticed this small spring (I think) right above the trigger. Does anyone know what this is?


That's the end of the slide stop spring.

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[karam.19]

That's the end of the slide stop spring.

29272

Thanks. Knowledge is half the battle!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Bucky]

Thanks. Knowledge is half the battle!


Also of note, keeps the trigger pin in place. So, you kinda want that there. ;)

[Shipwreck]

Also of note, keeps the trigger pin in place. So, you kinda want that there. ;)

You beat me to it.

My very first Beretta from the 1990s did not have that piece hanging down. It was not assembled right. That damn trigger pin used to start to walk out everytime I shot it. I had to keep an eye on it and keep pushing it back in. Later, I found out more about the parts in the gun, and it was fixed.

[hththt]

Mr. Langdon, I'm thinking of getting another Elite LTT. My first one had the trigger job done and the trigger is one of the best I have felt in any pistol, period. I love it.

The question is I already have a couple of TJIABs lying around and I was wondering if getting an Elite LTT with the trigger job is any different then just getting a factory Elite LTT and then install the TJIAB in myself. Is there anything extra that I would get with the Elite LTT with the trigger job already done? Thanks!

[HCM]

That's the end of the slide stop spring.

29272

Yup. I’ve broken one on a 96D.

[Prdator]

That's the end of the slide stop spring.

29272

Okay smarty pants...( hope you get that new job bro:cool:) where did you find that at? it looks like a animation of how it comes apart maybe?

[Prdator]

Mr. Langdon, I'm thinking of getting another Elite LTT. My first one had the trigger job done and the trigger is one of the best I have felt in any pistol, period. I love it.

The question is I already have a couple of TJIABs lying around and I was wondering if getting an Elite LTT with the trigger job is any different then just getting a factory Elite LTT and then install the TJIAB in myself. Is there anything extra that I would get with the Elite LTT with the trigger job already done? Thanks!

Not Ernest but I know a bit about this. The TIB will give you an amazing trigger.. Having Ernest do the trigger work on your gun can give you just a bit better trigger. I had the same thing going on when I ordered my last Elite and I just decided to have LTT do the trigger and hold on to my TIB in case I wore a trigger bar out or needed a spare part for one of my guns. With dedicated Dry practice this last year ish that I have been on DA/SA I've worn more than a couple trigger bars out.. And now when that happens I can just grab a spare and replace it vs waiting on a new one.

Best of luck to you man.

LangdonTactical

[LOKNLOD]

Okay smarty pants...( hope you get that new job bro:cool:) where did you find that at? it looks like a animation of how it comes apart maybe?

It's a screenshot from World of Guns: Gun Disassembly (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_of_Guns:_Gun_Disassembly). It's a videogame who's entire point is to take apart and put together guns :cool:

There was a whole thread about it a couple years back... LINK (https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?19588-Learning-Firearm-Mechanics-with-quot-World-of-Guns-Gun-Disassembly-quot)

Best part is it's free to play! But if you want to get straight to the good stuff, you can unlock everything for a few bucks.

[karam.19]

It's a screenshot from World of Guns: Gun Disassembly (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_of_Guns:_Gun_Disassembly). It's a videogame who's entire point is to take apart and put together guns :cool:

There was a whole thread about it a couple years back... LINK (https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?19588-Learning-Firearm-Mechanics-with-quot-World-of-Guns-Gun-Disassembly-quot)

Best part is it's free to play! But if you want to get straight to the good stuff, you can unlock everything for a few bucks.

VR Gunsmithing?! That’s pretty awesome. We are taking gun nerdism up to an 11.


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[LangdonTactical]

Mr. Langdon, I'm thinking of getting another Elite LTT. My first one had the trigger job done and the trigger is one of the best I have felt in any pistol, period. I love it.

The question is I already have a couple of TJIABs lying around and I was wondering if getting an Elite LTT with the trigger job is any different then just getting a factory Elite LTT and then install the TJIAB in myself. Is there anything extra that I would get with the Elite LTT with the trigger job already done? Thanks!

I am doing exactly the same thing to the Elite LTTs that I do to the TJIAB. The big difference is that I check everything after the work is done. I have to go back into the gun about every 10 to 15 guns to fix things that are not to my liking. Normally it is the trigger bar fit, sometimes it is other things. Bottom line, you're going to be very close with a TJIAB if you have one on hand.

We are pretty much shipping everything within a day at this point. We are still waiting on a few serial numbers, but other than that we are caught up.

[Caesar]

After shooting my LTT from a rest and holding the front sight dot on the X, the gun is shooting 3 inches low at 25 yards with Winchester White Box. Anyone else experiencing this?

[beenalongtime]

After shooting my LTT from a rest and holding the front sight dot on the X, the gun is shooting 3 inches low at 25 yards with Winchester White Box. Anyone else experiencing this?

Which WWB, or is it the same with 115, 124 and 147?

[Caesar]

Which WWB, or is it the same with 115, 124 and 147?

115

[GyroF-16]

After shooting my LTT from a rest and holding the front sight dot on the X, the gun is shooting 3 inches low at 25 yards with Winchester White Box. Anyone else experiencing this?

Not me. With my 115 gr handloads (slightly softer-shooting, but very similar to WWB) I have to hold at 6 o’clock of the black on a B-8 to get the elevation right. From about 15 yds and in, everything’s on.

[Dagga Boy]

After shooting my LTT from a rest and holding the front sight dot on the X, the gun is shooting 3 inches low at 25 yards with Winchester White Box. Anyone else experiencing this?

Just shot the State of Texas armed security guard qual. 50 rounds and it goes to 15 yards. All the low shots were at 15 yards with 115 WWB. Indoor range and I couldn’t see the shots to adjust. I was holding the center at 7 yards. So....I think the WWB 115 Walmart stuff does shoot low with the gun, but not likely reflective on what decent Ammo will do.

[karam.19]

I decided to personalize mine a bit. I think it came out well.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180824/ce28b1cee9b2b9ca22fff9b1b77ba352.jpg

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180824/1f36e743a7e03f95d7d72d1c78432fb5.jpg


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[Larry Sellers]

I decided to personalize mine a bit. I think it came out well.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180824/ce28b1cee9b2b9ca22fff9b1b77ba352.jpg

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180824/1f36e743a7e03f95d7d72d1c78432fb5.jpg


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What’s the sight setup you’ve got on it?

It looks great!


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[karam.19]

What’s the sight setup you’ve got on it?

It looks great!


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It’s an ameriglo spartan front sight with a Wilson combat U notch battlesight with a .310” height. The higher rear sight makes it basically combat sight setup for my eyes. Previously, it was a little low.


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[Larry Sellers]

It’s an ameriglo spartan front sight with a Wilson combat U notch battlesight with a .310” height. The higher rear sight makes it basically combat sight setup for my eyes. Previously, it was a little low.


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Awesome. I’d be looking to add a pepperoni rear to mine as I like the square notch. Pistol should be here Tuesday and I’ll go from there.

Thanks again!


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[pastaslinger]

Awesome. I’d be looking to add a pepperoni rear to mine as I like the square notch. Pistol should be here Tuesday and I’ll go from there.

Thanks again!


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The Les rear sight is way better, my issue with the original Wilson rear sight is not that it is a u notch but that it has that weird counterbore type cut, I find it very distracting

[karam.19]

The Les rear sight is way better, my issue with the original Wilson rear sight is not that it is a u notch but that it has that weird counterbore type cut, I find it very distracting

I went with the battlesight because I’m just a U notch kind of guy. It just feels better.


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[Larry Sellers]

Curious as to the rear sight that folks are pairing up with the spartan front as far as height. I’d be adding the sights myself after I shake the pistol out. I know there are numerous heights available from Wilson.

Thanks again!


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[LSP552]

Honestly the gun I want is the M9A1 Compact frame with the CenTac slide....Aiwb heaven if you like the 92. I have the frame and debating getting it done to be an add on to the CenTac or waiting to find a Centurion slide.

I’d kill for a non-rail Compact with the CentTac slide! Love my 92C but could use the dovetail front for sure. I’m on the fence about my next Beretta. Just when I think it’s a PX4CC......I handled a CenTac.

[pastaslinger]

I’d kill for a non-rail Compact with the CentTac slide! Love my 92C but could use the dovetail front for sure. I’m on the fence about my next Beretta. Just when I think it’s a PX4CC......I handled a CenTac.

I'm trying to think of other 92 variants I'd like but the LTT elite is basically it... Maybe different colors? Reversed version with inox frame and slide and black barrel? I'd buy that.

[Exiledviking]

I'm trying to think of other 92 variants I'd like but the LTT elite is basically it... Maybe different colors? Reversed version with inox frame and slide and black barrel? I'd buy that.I have to agree with you. I'd sell both my 92G-SD and WC Brigadier Tactical to buy 2 LTT Elite pistols. They are the ultimate 92 for me. Alas, California says the 92 LTT Elite is not "Safe" and cannot be sold new in California.

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[dtrice]

I’d kill for a non-rail Compact with the CentTac slide! Love my 92C but could use the dovetail front for sure. I’m on the fence about my next Beretta. Just when I think it’s a PX4CC......I handled a CenTac.
If it can get 15 round magazines ("flush" i.e., not extended/ +2 baseplate) and the contoured trigger guard like the LTT. I'll put my money down right now.
With the LTT elite and this hypothetical compact, could make our own LTT Centurions. So two SKUs give us 3 pistols.

Should we get a chant going? "What do we want? LTT Elite Compact! When do we want it? Yesterday!" :D


I'm trying to think of other 92 variants I'd like but the LTT elite is basically it... Maybe different colors? Reversed version with inox frame and slide and black barrel? I'd buy that.
To me, for a full size 92 the LTT is indeed what I would want. Now on to a complimentary compact version.

[ncrockclimb]

2 range session and 300 flawless rounds later, I am even more enamored with this pistol.

29565

[Flat6]

I’ve been following the threads on this pistol with interest. Over the last 30 months moved from Glocks to TDA starting with Sigs and then over the last year creeping towards Beretta PX4 compact and Centac. I have a 92a1 I picked up cheap added decocker for backup/dry fire.

Centac is my favorite pistol. More than any custom 1911 I’ve owned. It’s an all a rounder shooting comp, occasional ccw, pistol classes. Looking to add another 92 and not sure if I should just get another Centac or the LTT, either with TJIB. Thanks

[JimLob65]

I’ve been following the threads on this pistol with interest. Over the last 30 months moved from Glocks to TDA starting with Sigs and then over the last year creeping towards Beretta PX4 compact and Centac. I have a 92a1 I picked up cheap added decocker for backup/dry fire.

Centac is my favorite pistol. More than any custom 1911 I’ve owned. It’s an all a rounder shooting comp, occasional ccw, pistol classes. Looking to add another 92 and not sure if I should just get another Centac or the LTT, either with TJIB. Thanks

If you decide to order an LTT order it with the trigger job. I think it costs nearly if not the same and it gets a once-over to make sure that the trigger bar is just right.

[karam.19]

I’ve been following the threads on this pistol with interest. Over the last 30 months moved from Glocks to TDA starting with Sigs and then over the last year creeping towards Beretta PX4 compact and Centac. I have a 92a1 I picked up cheap added decocker for backup/dry fire.

Centac is my favorite pistol. More than any custom 1911 I’ve owned. It’s an all a rounder shooting comp, occasional ccw, pistol classes. Looking to add another 92 and not sure if I should just get another Centac or the LTT, either with TJIB. Thanks

It really comes down to barrel length. I would go with a LTT instead of a duplicate. Like the previous poster mentioned, I would just order it with a trigger job since it will be inspected first. Also, you’ll get a LTT a lot faster than a Centac.

I’ve been actually playing around with getting a Centac and having it shipped directly to LTT for a trigger job. I just don’t know if it’s worth $1300 for a gun that is half an inch shorter.


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[Larry Sellers]

It really comes down to barrel length. I would go with a LTT instead of a duplicate. Like the previous poster mentioned, I would just order it with a trigger job since it will be inspected first. Also, you’ll get a LTT a lot faster than a Centac.

I’ve been actually playing around with getting a Centac and having it shipped directly to LTT for a trigger job. I just don’t know if it’s worth $1300 for a gun that is half an inch shorter.


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I went back and forth with the choice of the 2 pistols. I ended up with the LTT due to the frame beveling. Down the road I hope to see a “carry” version of the LTT. I shoot full framed guns better than most others and being relegated to guns with reliable 10 round magazines limits me in some aspects.


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[Dagga Boy]

I am so impressed with the LTT Elite I am building a carry version. M9A1 Compact frame, Centurion slide and a stainless compact barrel are going to LTT this week. I am sure down the road there will be more LTT Elite’s, but I am not patient enough.

[Larry Sellers]

I am so impressed with the LTT Elite I am building a carry version. M9A1 Compact frame, Centurion slide and a stainless compact barrel are going to LTT this week. I am sure down the road there will be more LTT Elite’s, but I am not patient enough.

And to think I was going to save money in ‘19.....


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[Blackbag]

Centac is my favorite pistol. More than any custom 1911 I’ve owned. It’s an all a rounder shooting comp, occasional ccw, pistol classes. Looking to add another 92 and not sure if I should just get another Centac or the LTT, either with TJIB. Thanks

I am in the same boat as you. Would love to get the LTT Elite, but due to my state having a Handgun Approval Roster, the Elite probably won’t be available for sale until the end of 18 or beginning of 19. The Centac is already approved so I will just get a 2nd Centac for now. Maybe an Elite next year.

John

[beenalongtime]

I am so impressed with the LTT Elite I am building a carry version. M9A1 Compact frame, Centurion slide and a stainless compact barrel are going to LTT this week. I am sure down the road there will be more LTT Elite’s, but I am not patient enough.

How does the compact compare in size to the PX4 compact? When you get it back, please contrast/compare the two.

I thought about something like that (and my LTT Elite is still one of the numbers he is waiting on), but was able to get my hands on a stainless M9a1 compact, and it didn't feel to me as good as the PX4. The full size elite however, I intend more as a range and practice gun (get some benefit if I tire of shooting my regular practice pistol), the same as my TZ99.

[JTQ]

How does the compact compare in size to the PX4 compact? When you get it back, please contrast/compare the two.
A data point from the first post in "The PX4 Compact might be my DA/SA Glock 19"

https://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?16519-The-PX4-Compact-might-be-my-DA-SA-Glock-19


Of course, most would say “get a 92 Compact” and while that was an option, there were a few things that have stopped me from carrying it full-time:
1) No front sight options. You get what you get unless you send it off to Tool Tech and have a night sight put in. No front dove tail!
2) No G model available, or at least not currently. Of course, I could send it down to Wilson Combat and have it converted, but that’s an added cost.
3) 13 round magazines. Not a big deal, but in my opinion, a gun that size should have 15 rounds of 9mm.
4) Hard for me to load with the standard mag. I can do it really well with a full size mag in the compact gun, but a quick reload with the standard 13 round mag often ends up with some of my skin between the frame and floor plate of the magazine. The grip on the 92 Compact is about a ¼ of an inch too short for my hands.

So, this brings me to the PX4. I started playing with the PX4 Compact and realized it had the features I was looking for in a smaller, lighter compact carry gun. The PX4 also has has 15 round mags (17 with extension), dove tail front and rear sights, the safety converts to a G configuration easily and it has the same manual of arms as my full size 92s. Most importantly, I can load it full speed without catching the heal of my hand with the magazine floor plate. Not to mention, the trigger is smooth and shootable out-of-the-box.

[Dagga Boy]

How does the compact compare in size to the PX4 compact? When you get it back, please contrast/compare the two.

I thought about something like that (and my LTT Elite is still one of the numbers he is waiting on), but was able to get my hands on a stainless M9a1 compact, and it didn't feel to me as good as the PX4. The full size elite however, I intend more as a range and practice gun (get some benefit if I tire of shooting my regular practice pistol), the same as my TZ99.

I am quite dedicated to the PX4CC for just about everything these days. The LTT Elite will really never have the light off it and is dedicated to a bedside gun and for “overt” work. My thought was a nice long nose short grip gun to compliment it for a back up or concealment variant and they are great 10 round guns for restrictive places. The “problem” with the PX4 is they need PX4 mags. With the 92 Elite, having a little gun around that takes 92 mags is nice. I have a LTT custom 92 Compact. Lives in a fanny pack with a bunch of stuff that I often grab taking the kid to school in gym shorts. Neat gun in a limited role. I think The M9A1 Compact based one will be wicked out of a Keeper AIWB rig.

[Larry Sellers]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180830/9ea2bd49fb072dfa570f01ad4ff02c3c.jpgPicked mine up from the FFL a short time ago. Am I seeing things or do I have a blue frame?




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[karam.19]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180830/9ea2bd49fb072dfa570f01ad4ff02c3c.jpgPicked mine up from the FFL a short time ago. Am I seeing things or do I have a blue frame?




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No. There is a hint of blue. You notice it under direct light and cleaning.


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[Larry Sellers]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180830/ce2545cff08227f799e6e77b79567054.jpg
Maybe it’s my 2 hours of sleep, but there’s no hint of blue here.


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[newyork]

That’s straight blue


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[Arbninftry]

Remember what that dress did, You guys might break the Internet with a LangdonTactical Blue or Black meme. .

[Larry Sellers]

Remember what that dress did, You guys might break the Internet with a LangdonTactical Blue or Black meme. .

Like I said, 2 hours of sleep last night and a day full of errands has me losing whatever sanity I have left. Contrasted to the frame and grips it looks blue to me. The trigger is great, will hopefully get it out tomorrow.


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[Tim92G]

I just received an email from Aimee that she got my order and reserved my 2 digit ser#. Great customer service.

Well not long after I placed my order I had a serious health scare so I had to cancel my order, so after many test and surgery "No Cancer" I placed another order Tuesday for a 92 Elite LTT with the trigger job and it will be @ my ffl tomorrow by 4:3pm and ill pick it up Saturday

[karam.19]

https://youtu.be/bmYlGrC4tpQ


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[StraitR]

That’s straight blue




Yup, and I dig it.

[LOKNLOD]

Shot mine some more today. I continue to be impressed by how well it shoots for me!

[Dagga Boy]

Shot mine some more today. I continue to be impressed by how well it shoots for me!

Me too. 297 Super Test shot in about 22 seconds total time. Clean Dot Torture at 5 yards. It is simply making me look good.

[Doc_Glock]

Pistol: Beretta Langdon LTT Elite 92
Langdon trigger job, D spring.

Caliber: 9mm


Ammunition: Cumulative Ammo Types:
Speer Lawman 115 grain
S&B 124 grain SB9B
PPU 115 grain NATO A-355
Speer Lawman 147 grain
American Eagle 147 grain
Barnaul White box 115 grain
Wolf Poly 115 grain
Wolf Lacquer mil spec 115 grain
Brown Bear 115 grain
Silver Bear 115 grain
Magtech 115 grain
S&B 115 grain
Armscor 115 grain
Fiocchi 115 grain
MEN 124 grain


Dates of testing: 6-9/2018


Total rounds fired: 2905


Stoppages:

3 FTEject held slide open. Closed on empty round when I dropped mag Speer Lawman 115
1 Stovepipe Speer Lawman 115 grain.

2 FTLBE last 300 rounds.


Malfunctions:0


Breakages:0

The LTT Elite pistol was generally a delight to shoot. I consider it very reliable and accurate, however, around the 800 round mark it choked four times, all on Speer Lawman 115 grain ammunition. I ran it another 2000 rounds after that with different ammunition and had no problems. It would be interesting to re try the Speer 115 grain after this break in to see if it is still problematic.

Toward the end of the test it failed to lock back once in an old surplus mag, and once on a fresh 18 round Mecgar. No oil in 2900 rounds is probably the culprit.

[pastaslinger]

I'm really jealous

[SouthNarc]

LangdonTactical Ernie do you have any inclination to do an LTT Elite with a Centurion length slide? Or a Compact?

[TCFD273]

LangdonTactical Ernie do you have any inclination to do an LTT Elite with a Centurion length slide? Or a Compact?

I’d be all over a LTT centurion slide/compact frame.


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[Jared]

The existing M9A1 compact is really close, just needs the G levers, dovetail sights and the rest of the LTT goodies. I'd be all over it myself.

[Dagga Boy]

LangdonTactical Ernie do you have any inclination to do an LTT Elite with a Centurion length slide? Or a Compact?


I’d be all over a LTT centurion slide/compact frame.


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Headed to Ernest Tuesday......

[GJM]

Ernest has done so much to help Beretta USA and Beretta shooters.

[TCFD273]

Headed to Ernest Tuesday......

Are you having done to the front sight?


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[Tim92G]

I picked up my 92 ELITE LTT this afternoon and I'm very pleased. The double action and the single action are great. I see no issues with the fit and finish inside or out.
I want to thank Ernest for making this great gun possible.

[rainman]

Me too. 297 Super Test shot in about 22 seconds total time. Clean Dot Torture at 5 yards. It is simply making me look good.

DBoy; what sights did you get on your LTT 92? I've been eyeballing the Spartans (while I wait for the People's Republic of MD to make up their minds about admitting my gun!).

Thanks.


-Rainman

[Blackbag]

DBoy; what sights did you get on your LTT 92? I've been eyeballing the Spartans (while I wait for the People's Republic of MD to make up their minds about admitting my gun!).

Thanks.


-Rainman

Rainman, I am from Maryland too. Has it been submitted for the Handgun Roster? I bought a Cen-Tac and love it! Was either going to buy a 2nd Cen-Tac but might wait for the Elite if it is close.

[Dagga Boy]

DBoy; what sights did you get on your LTT 92? I've been eyeballing the Spartans (while I wait for the People's Republic of MD to make up their minds about admitting my gun!).

Thanks.


-Rainman

I debated the Spartans, but was not sure how they were for POA/POI from any reports. Went fiber optic and so far I am very happy with the level of precision I am getting.

[Dagga Boy]

Are you having done to the front sight?


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I ll do a front fiber optic in red and a Les Peperoni rear.

[rainman]

Rainman, I am from Maryland too. Has it been submitted for the Handgun Roster? I bought a Cen-Tac and love it! Was either going to buy a 2nd Cen-Tac but might wait for the Elite if it is close.

My condolences... :p

The LTT has been submitted, but the HR Board meets quarterly. I've been told that a decision should be made "soon".


-Rainman

[rainman]

I debated the Spartans, but was not sure how they were for POA/POI from any reports. Went fiber optic and so far I am very happy with the level of precision I am getting.

Thanks for the feedback.

Does anyone with an LTT and Spartan sights care to chime-in regarding POA/POI?

Thanks.


-Rainman

[karam.19]

Thanks for the feedback.

Does anyone with an LTT and Spartan sights care to chime-in regarding POA/POI?

Thanks.


-Rainman

I initially had front and back Spartans. The point of impact was 2-3” lower than point of aim. I then went to a .310 Wilson combat rear sight (I prefer U notch sights). That moved the point of impact about 1” below point of aim. I figured this out using a laser boresight.


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[Larry Sellers]

Thanks for the feedback.

Does anyone with an LTT and Spartan sights care to chime-in regarding POA/POI?

Thanks.


-Rainman

Curious to this as well. I’d like to pair the spartan with a pepperoni rear, just not sure of the height that would give me tip of the blade-ish hold at 25


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[Curtis_B]

My LTT with full set of Spartans hits POA/POI with Fiocchi 115s. That’s based on a single range trip so far, 160 rounds at distances to 10 yards, shooting freestyle only.

This is my first 92, and it’s an amazing gun. I didn’t shoot it as well as my PX4CC mod 5, but I have many more rounds through that pistol.

[Larry Sellers]

My LTT with full set of Spartans hits POA/POI with Fiocchi 115s. That’s based on a single range trip so far, 160 rounds at distances to 10 yards, shooting freestyle only.

This is my first 92, and it’s an amazing gun. I didn’t shoot it as well as my PX4CC mod 5, but I have many more rounds through that pistol.

Any chance you can take a set of calipers to the front sight and tell me its dimensions?

Thank you

[Bill]

I found the Spartans to hit behind the dot at 10 yards all day.

[Curtis_B]

Sorry for the slow response, here's what I came up with for Spartan front dimensions:

W: 0.145
H: 0.165 (from top of sight base)

Hope that helps.

[LangdonTactical]

LangdonTactical Ernie do you have any inclination to do an LTT Elite with a Centurion length slide? Or a Compact?

Not sure I want to answer that just yet. If you were me, and maybe a logical kind of guy, would you already be working on that and have been thinking that way for a long time? :)

[TX_Southpaw]

Not sure I want to answer that just yet. If you were me, and maybe a logical kind of guy, would you already be working on that and have been thinking that way for a long time? :)

*Ear to ear grinning*

Hopefully it won't take as long to get another project rolling.

[TCFD273]

Not sure I want to answer that just yet. If you were me, and maybe a logical kind of guy, would you already be working on that and have been thinking that way for a long time? :)

Yes!


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[JPedersen]

Not sure I want to answer that just yet. If you were me, and maybe a logical kind of guy, would you already be working on that and have been thinking that way for a long time? :)Yes! Yes! Awesome.

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[LangdonTactical]

Yes! Yes! Awesome.

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Don't get your hopes up just yet. The Elite LTT sales are not nearly as high as expected. If things do not turn around and the numbers go up pretty soon, we will have to see if Beretta keeps listening to me. I suspect a lot of people are not putting their money where their mouth is on this gun. They say it is the gun that they want, but only if they can get the super good guy bargain deal off Gunbroker or some other dealer that is selling them under MAP pricing. Seems to be the way people like to buy things in this industry. I see the same thing going on with the PX4 Compact Carry on this very forum.

To be honest it makes me sad and makes me wonder if it is worth it sometimes. The "that's what I want, but I am not going to buy unless I can get it for $75 under MAP pricing" seems to be a thing here. :(

Not exactly the way to incentivize a company to listen to their customers.

[Hambo]

Don't get your hopes up just yet. The Elite LTT sales are not nearly as high as expected. If things do not turn around and the numbers go up pretty soon, we will have to see if Beretta keeps listening to me. I suspect a lot of people are not putting their money where their mouth is on this gun. They say it is the gun that they want, but only if they can get the super good guy bargain deal off Gunbroker or some other dealer that is selling them under MAP pricing. Seems to be the way people like to buy things in this industry. I see the same thing going on with the PX4 Compact Carry on this very forum.

To be honest it makes me sad and makes me wonder if it is worth it sometimes. The "that's what I want, but I am not going to buy unless I can get it for $75 under MAP pricing" seems to be a thing here. :(

Not exactly the way to incentivize a company to listen to their customers.


That's definitely going on and not just in firearms. Even if you're damn near giving something away there's a guy who wants to beat you down for five more dollars.

I also believe that at the $1K or greater price range the market narrows significantly. I don't pretend to understand business or the number Beretta needs to sell for an item to be profitable, but there was a market for stiffly priced used Elites, so new Elites should sell. Perhaps some corporate patience is in order, if that's possible. Or maybe it was a bad business idea from the start.

Thanks for trying. Thanks for making parts available.

[GyroF-16]

Don't get your hopes up just yet. The Elite LTT sales are not nearly as high as expected. If things do not turn around and the numbers go up pretty soon, we will have to see if Beretta keeps listening to me. I suspect a lot of people are not putting their money where their mouth is on this gun. They say it is the gun that they want, but only if they can get the super good guy bargain deal off Gunbroker or some other dealer that is selling them under MAP pricing. Seems to be the way people like to buy things in this industry. I see the same thing going on with the PX4 Compact Carry on this very forum.

To be honest it makes me sad and makes me wonder if it is worth it sometimes. The "that's what I want, but I am not going to buy unless I can get it for $75 under MAP pricing" seems to be a thing here. :(

Not exactly the way to incentivize a company to listen to their customers.

Ernest-
I’m really sorry to hear that the sales haven’t been as high as you’d hoped. Do you know how it compares the those for the original Elite I, and later Elite II in their first few months? I know those guns are fairly legendary in the Beretta community now, but I wonder how soon the word got out during initial production…

FWIW, I love my LTT Elite, and did my best to “put my money where my mouth was” when it finally became available.


Edited to add:

Also FWIW- I think I’m your target audience for this gun (Beretta lover, competitive shooter, financially able to buy the LTT Elite). My awareness that the gun even exists is through THIS forum. I’ve also seen it mentioned on Beretta Forum, after it’s release. I just checked, and the LTT Elite is listed on the Beretta USA webpage, but listed after most of the other M9/92s, and after the PX4s, with no thumbnail photo with the link.
What I’m getting at, is that I’m afraid that the LTT Elite has had fairly low exposure to the larger population of handgun buyers. I’m not a marketing guy, so I won’t try to recommend a solution. And I wish you great success with this venture.
Just wanted to let you know looks like from “out here” in the sea of consumers.

[Dagga Boy]

Don't get your hopes up just yet. The Elite LTT sales are not nearly as high as expected. If things do not turn around and the numbers go up pretty soon, we will have to see if Beretta keeps listening to me. I suspect a lot of people are not putting their money where their mouth is on this gun. They say it is the gun that they want, but only if they can get the super good guy bargain deal off Gunbroker or some other dealer that is selling them under MAP pricing. Seems to be the way people like to buy things in this industry. I see the same thing going on with the PX4 Compact Carry on this very forum.

To be honest it makes me sad and makes me wonder if it is worth it sometimes. The "that's what I want, but I am not going to buy unless I can get it for $75 under MAP pricing" seems to be a thing here. :(

Not exactly the way to incentivize a company to listen to their customers.

Which is why I am sending my own cobbler up parts to LTT to have a custom done. We sadly live in a industry where a marketing/sales specialist with little practical experience can read a market and figure out that a purple kryptek lower end pistol that is affordable to many is a better decision than a professional grade tool meant for a market where most of the professional users are cheap and unwilling to invest in high grade tools. Sad, but normal. This is not new or remotely limited to Beretta.

[Cory]

It sucks to hear the sales on this aren't going as well as hoped. I want this model to stick around for a long time.

I was glad that by the time the gun came out I was financially sound enough to pick one up. I think part of the problem with sales has to be that this gun isn't being emphasized or embraced by Beretta at all. Beretta's Instagram and Facebook don't make half the mention of this that they do their A3. Most LGS folks don't know what the Elite LTT is. The firearm itself is truly the 92 perfected, but if nobody knows it's out there than it won't hit the selling marks we all want. Right now I don't think it has the name brand recognition that the Brig Tac and A3 do. It's likely just going to take some time for that name to build. As they start showing up at matches I think they will increase in recognition.

I guess what I'm saying is I just really want the gun to stick around. I think it's the best 92 there is and I'm glad to own one.

-Cory

[JohnN]

Welcome to my world, a big problem for brick and mortar shops.
Don't get your hopes up just yet. The Elite LTT sales are not nearly as high as expected. If things do not turn around and the numbers go up pretty soon, we will have to see if Beretta keeps listening to me. I suspect a lot of people are not putting their money where their mouth is on this gun. They say it is the gun that they want, but only if they can get the super good guy bargain deal off Gunbroker or some other dealer that is selling them under MAP pricing. Seems to be the way people like to buy things in this industry. I see the same thing going on with the PX4 Compact Carry on this very forum.

To be honest it makes me sad and makes me wonder if it is worth it sometimes. The "that's what I want, but I am not going to buy unless I can get it for $75 under MAP pricing" seems to be a thing here. :(

Not exactly the way to incentivize a company to listen to their customers.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

[Blackbag]

Sorry to hear about the slow sales. I have cash in hand, but have to wait a few more months until my state approves the new elite for sale to the public. I hope it sticks around long enough to buy a second one if I am happy with the first.

[Prdator]

I guess I need to buy another one or two soon. :cool:

[Canyonrat]

GyroF-16 makes a good point. I was not even aware LTT Elite was on the Beretta USA website. There, I was going in under Firearms->By Gun Series->92 Series. No LTT Elite, no M9A3 Black, no Langdon M9. You have to go in under Product->Pistols to even find it. It is definitely cult-following-only status at this point to be in the know.

The LTT activities in the industry though have got to be increasing interest and sales in other PX4 and 92 models by enthusiasts, even if it is not all directly reflected in the numbers for the LTT models themselves. LTT is actually the only real interesting new thing Beretta has going for it right now in my book.

[LangdonTactical]

It sucks to hear the sales on this aren't going as well as hoped. I want this model to stick around for a long time.

I was glad that by the time the gun came out I was financially sound enough to pick one up. I think part of the problem with sales has to be that this gun isn't being emphasized or embraced by Beretta at all. Beretta's Instagram and Facebook don't make half the mention of this that they do their A3. Most LGS folks don't know what the Elite LTT is. The firearm itself is truly the 92 perfected, but if nobody knows it's out there than it won't hit the selling marks we all want. Right now I don't think it has the name brand recognition that the Brig Tac and A3 do. It's likely just going to take some time for that name to build. As they start showing up at matches I think they will increase in recognition.

I guess what I'm saying is I just really want the gun to stick around. I think it's the best 92 there is and I'm glad to own one.

-Cory

It will stick around for a while, it's not going anywhere anytime soon. I just don't want to see it become another Elite II that goes away after a few years and then everyone telling Beretta that they need to build it again. If the numbers don't support it, why would they?

[LangdonTactical]

Welcome to my world, a big problem for brick and mortar shops.

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Exactly, they come into your shop to see the gun, play with it, then go home and buy it online. If people don't start supporting the brick and mortar shops, they will have to buy just to try. Not to mention the question of "who's going to do your transfers" when you do buy online? Where are you going to have that gun shipped to when you get it for less money online!

[LangdonTactical]

GyroF-16 makes a good point. I was not even aware LTT Elite was on the Beretta USA website. There, I was going in under Firearms->By Gun Series->92 Series. No LTT Elite, no M9A3 Black, no Langdon M9. You have to go in under Product->Pistols to even find it. It is definitely cult-following-only status at this point to be in the know.

The LTT activities in the industry though have got to be increasing interest and sales in other PX4 and 92 models by enthusiasts, even if it is not all directly reflected in the numbers for the LTT models themselves. LTT is actually the only real interesting new thing Beretta has going for it right now in my book.

That is a whole different problem for sure.

[LangdonTactical]

Ernest-
I’m really sorry to hear that the sales haven’t been as high as you’d hoped. Do you know how it compares the those for the original Elite I, and later Elite II in their first few months? I know those guns are fairly legendary in the Beretta community now, but I wonder how soon the word got out during initial production…

FWIW, I love my LTT Elite, and did my best to “put my money where my mouth was” when it finally became available.


Edited to add:

Also FWIW- I think I’m your target audience for this gun (Beretta lover, competitive shooter, financially able to buy the LTT Elite). My awareness that the gun even exists is through THIS forum. I’ve also seen it mentioned on Beretta Forum, after it’s release. I just checked, and the LTT Elite is listed on the Beretta USA webpage, but listed after most of the other M9/92s, and after the PX4s, with no thumbnail photo with the link.
What I’m getting at, is that I’m afraid that the LTT Elite has had fairly low exposure to the larger population of handgun buyers. I’m not a marketing guy, so I won’t try to recommend a solution. And I wish you great success with this venture.
Just wanted to let you know looks like from “out here” in the sea of consumers.

Thank you for your support!

[Doc_Glock]

To be honest it makes me sad and makes me wonder if it is worth it sometimes. The "that's what I want, but I am not going to buy unless I can get it for $75 under MAP pricing" seems to be a thing here. :(
.

That doesn't surprise me. I couldn't give away a mint M9A3 at $700 face to face locally. It seems that once a pistol is outside the $400 price point, it is hard to move outside a true enthusiast audience.

[JimLob65]

The slower than expected sales of the LTT Elite is really unfortunate as it is an awesome pistol. Personally I put out the cash for mine willingly even after buying a Brig Tac and a Cen Tac within the previous year. Well worth it, every penny, an opinion I have done my best to spread!!

Beyond that I applaud Langdon Tactical for dipping their toes into this sector after seeing all the whining and bitching directed at Wilson Combat on a different forum, nearly all unwarranted IMHO. Seems all too many talk big, get excited about what most would see as nearly the perfect iteration of a Beretta 92 but either fail to put their money where their mouth is or nitpick the hell out of what usually proves to be their poor assumption. And yes, I am aware of the qc issues from the Tennessee plant. It appears these issues and this kind of criticism hasn't been directed at the LTT Elite pistols.

If you are on the fence, buy one. You won't be disappointed! It is an outstanding pistol, and a damn good value from a company that provides outstanding CS!!

[Inkwell 41]

If you are on the fence, buy one. You won't be disappointed! It is an outstanding pistol, and a damn good value from a company that provides outstanding CS!!

Completely agree.

Finally got to the range with mine last night. With 124 gn match ball, it was a LASER beam. Sell a couple of kids, some plasma, anything, but buy the LTT Elite. IT IS THAT GOOD.

[Arbninftry]

FedEx has mine in route. LangdonTactical thank you goes out to you and your wife for the great customer service

[JimLob65]

FedEx has mine in route. LangdonTactical thank you goes out to you and your wife for the great customer service

Be sure to let us know what you think about it once you get it.

[Craig@SSD]

Don't get your hopes up just yet. The Elite LTT sales are not nearly as high as expected. If things do not turn around and the numbers go up pretty soon, we will have to see if Beretta keeps listening to me. I suspect a lot of people are not putting their money where their mouth is on this gun. They say it is the gun that they want, but only if they can get the super good guy bargain deal off Gunbroker or some other dealer that is selling them under MAP pricing. Seems to be the way people like to buy things in this industry. I see the same thing going on with the PX4 Compact Carry on this very forum.

To be honest it makes me sad and makes me wonder if it is worth it sometimes. The "that's what I want, but I am not going to buy unless I can get it for $75 under MAP pricing" seems to be a thing here. :(

Not exactly the way to incentivize a company to listen to their customers.


I was unaware that you felt this way about the pistol being offered here (privately) to PF members, at the price we listed. My apologies, and I have removed our thread for the PX4cc completely.

For what it's worth, you must be a registered PF member and also meet some specific criteria to view our Business Supporter section. Subsequently, none of our listings are available for "general public" consumption, nor can be found via off-site search engine. To test, you can log out of your account, at which point you won't see our name or sub-forum. Even some registered members are unable see our section, or follow the link I posted in the PX4cc thread, as they don't meet the criteria Tom_Jones set up to view our sub-forum (at my request). Prior to becoming a PF Business Supporter, I discussed privacy with Tom at length with the goal of avoiding issues on pricing just like this. I wanted to offer some things to the active PF membership that we won't do publicly. Lesson learned.

[Sigfan26]

I was unaware that you felt this way about the pistol being offered here (privately) to PF members, at the price we listed. My apologies, and I have removed our thread for the PX4cc completely.

For what it's worth, you must be a registered PF member and also meet some specific criteria to view our Business Supporter section. Subsequently, none of our listings are available for "general public" consumption, nor can be found via off-site search engine. To test, you can log out of your account, at which point you won't see our name or sub-forum. Even some registered members are unable see our section, or follow the link I posted in the PX4cc thread, as they don't meet the criteria Tom_Jones set up to view our sub-forum (at my request). Prior to becoming a PF Business Supporter, I discussed privacy with Tom at length with the goal of avoiding issues on pricing just like this. I wanted to offer some things to the active PF membership that we won't do publicly. Lesson learned.

Perhaps contacting LTT via PM first would have been a good idea?


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[theJanitor]

As a manufacturer/wholesaler/distributor, I understand that the existence of MAP acknowledges that goods will be sold under that threshold, just not advertised publicly. I don't think the Px4CC deal offered here, in the way described, was in conflict with typical MAP guidelines

ETA. I really want one of these LLT 92's, but I'm just not willing to add another type of pistol to the mix. I can barely be proficient with the 1911/glock/j-frame set that I have now

[captain92]

I have a standard Langdon M9 on the way. Will be my first Beretta, I found out about it on this and the Beretta forum. Perhaps my next pistol may very well be an Elite II.

[opmike]

I would have no idea this gun even existed if it weren't for this and a couple of other forums. Same thing for the Compact Carry. They are guns that are, largely, known by forum-dwelling enthusiasts and enthusiasts alone.

Compare that with the marketing might of a company like WC. Information on the Brigadier Tactical was being posted all over the place and comment sections were filled with everyone from those that were switched-on to your garden variety Fudd. They also periodically post eye-candy about that gun on their Facebook page from time to time. The WC FB page has 157K likes. The Beretta Facebook page has over 1 million. How many times has the LTT showed up on a post over there? To test my little hypothesis, I scrolled through three months (all I could bare) of content on the Beretta Facebook page. After having my eyes glaze over from all the images of shotguns and ducks, I saw no less than three posts featuring images of Wilson Combat 92s. Anyone want to guess how many 92 LTT posts appeared during the same timeframe? If it'a a nonzero number I must have missed it.

This gun is only barely present on the Beretta website. Buried on the second page, without a thumbnail, after guns like Picos and Nanos in your choice of Lavender, Blue, or Pink. What do car dealerships do with the "exotic" models in the product lineup? Do they park them out back or tuck them in between all the endless rows of pickups and SUVs because they are "low volume" sellers? Or do they park those sons of bitches right there in the fucking showroom and/or out front?

It will always be challenging to move full sized 1,000 dollar handguns in 2018; an era where nearly everyone is telling people to just buy a Glock 19, ammo, and training for the same coin. It will be an order of magnitude harder if the world doesn't know it exists.

[DpdG]

Say what you will about Sig's obnoxious marketing, but they seem to be selling the Legion series at a better clip than the premium Beretta offerings, despite them being relatively comparable feature-wise. Perhaps split the difference between Sig and Beretta's current non-marketing strategy? I'd hate to see a quality offering slip by the wayside due to the market not knowing it existed.

[beenalongtime]

I was into the subcompact PX4 before I found one. On the Beretta forum, I found out about the compact and lots of what you found was available for them were common mods/upgrades. I never understood the grey, but I don't understand if it is some sort of reflective thing, or just to differentiate from the normal pistols?! I do really appreciate you working to get more/better sight options, although I will admit to buying those from Beretta's site recently, due to a sale and the fact I have to pay another company to covert them into the once advertised Spartan's, for carry/backup caliber gun. (I work nights and do things that make those a requirement) I do fear the new levers will never come to fruition though, as you have pointed out, too many people advertise things they never produce or sell and proving intent (for good or fraud) is hard.

I did build my own version of the PX4CC, and it cost me around 1.5x what the MSRP is, since it has differences. (Inox, night sights, Grip-on grips that allow disassembly without removal, 92 style levers currently) It is a mostly a range toy/backup caliber, as my normal is another caliber that is in line with relatives and other LEO's I deal with. (I don't think most cases where I would need to use it, I would be needing to fire more then two rounds anyway, based on my times at gun point)

Now the LTT Elite, well I never really caught the 92 bug. No military experience (4F, but still was threatened with arrest if I didn't sign up for a draft that wouldn't take me), and the only one I remember handling was a 96D, with large grips that made the gun seem fat and not very manageable. Been working a bunch of OT due to others medical issues this year and a lightly used 95 Inox one came into my LGS. It felt better (thinner Pachmeyer wood grips), although doesn't have options I would like (G config, Wilson trigger bar, so probably will be a couple trip to the range safe queen). Several people there that are into higher end guns (most of their customers want to spend less then $400), have/are into Wilson Combat ones and have never heard of yours (where mine is being sent). I considered one EARLY on, because it was just orderable (could have got a number under 100), but decided I wouldn't enjoy it and instead found/bought a Sig Tacopps 10mm, to both retry the 1911 platform and relive some first shooting 10mm experience (Glock 20 which the grooves don't fit well).

Then one day, after looking at a bunch of different guns including a Wilson Combat one, I realized there was a number that would mean somethings (478), and different grips make it a VERY different gun. While I don't expect it to be a carry gun (tried a 92 compact and something about hand size feels so much shorter then the PX4), or a nightstand gun (have a full size PX4 for that/same platform), it would be a fun range toy that WOULD get shot. I've ordered your grips and put them on my Inox 92, and that feels like a different gun, and tempts me to get a Wilson trigger bar NP3'd and have you do a TJIAB, but figure I am money ahead to just wait for the toy that is done already. The question I have is how many of the regulars that are into higher guns, will first reLearn/remember it after handling it, will want to borrow/shoot it, and then will the gun store put in an order? This isn't advertised ANYWHERE near as well as the Wilson Combats (which you had a hand in), and they do need exposure IMHO, before numbers pick up. Also, when higher end buyers shop, don't they already have a platform in mind? (my experience is with .45 lovers)

In one way, I kind of feel like your are advertising against yourself, with your past Wilson experience, on another, I feel there are other people who will feel this way about this 92, rather then the PX4: "I mean why did I not know this stuff? I consider myself a gun guy and a Beretta guy, but I did not really know anything about th..." quote from you, taken from the PX4 thread.

Thank you!

[JPedersen]

Don't get your hopes up just yet. The Elite LTT sales are not nearly as high as expected. If things do not turn around and the numbers go up pretty soon, we will have to see if Beretta keeps listening to me. I suspect a lot of people are not putting their money where their mouth is on this gun. They say it is the gun that they want, but only if they can get the super good guy bargain deal off Gunbroker or some other dealer that is selling them under MAP pricing. Seems to be the way people like to buy things in this industry. I see the same thing going on with the PX4 Compact Carry on this very forum.

To be honest it makes me sad and makes me wonder if it is worth it sometimes. The "that's what I want, but I am not going to buy unless I can get it for $75 under MAP pricing" seems to be a thing here. :(

Not exactly the way to incentivize a company to listen to their customers.Ernest,
As others have stated ... I am genuinely bummed that you are discouraged! I really think that momentum will build for this new offering. I am in the minority here in that it takes me awhile to save up for $1k+ purchases. (I wish I had the bandwidth to buy whenever I wanted. ) My guess is that sales will pick up as exposure and knowledge of the product expands. I assume Beretta knows this as well... they are "big boys" who entered into the agreement with you as well. Hopefully they will lend some strength to the effort as well so you dont feel as though it is all on you.

As far as MAP goes and the Px4cc - I ordered 2 of the Mod 4's the moment they were released in an effort to encourage your work. (That is part of the slowdown in getting a LTT Elite... ha!) I know being an innovator / motivator takes a ton of work and can seem thankless at times. I hope that you can be encouraged by the great work you have accomplished so far on these projects. The best days for you and yours are ahead... I believe that.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

[karam.19]

From the email advertisements I get from Beretta, I sometimes wonder if they are a firearm manufacturer or a clothing outfitter.


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[MSparks909]

I think Beretta needs to market this better on social media. Get a few out to reviewers, post it every ~2-3 weeks until sales numbers grow. Don’t get discouraged just yet!

[farscott]

I hate to write this, but I am not surprised by the LTT Elite sales. I see the following issues.

1) The general public knows little about the 92-series guns other than the M9 has been replaced by the SIG M17.

2) DA/SA hammer, especially metal-framed, guns are a niche market today. Polymer-framed striker-fired pistols are "the hotness".

3) Very little marketing to make prospective buyers aware of the LTT Elite's existence. Beretta has not done much to make people aware of this offering. LTT has done a lot, but LTT is not the marketing powerhouse that Wilson is.

4) The gun market is soft right now. Prices are lower than they were ten years ago. A kilo-buck 92-series gun has lots of competition at half the price.

As someone who has been fortunate enough to get at least one of each of the Wilson and LTT Beretta offerings, I have found no other local shooters who even knew the guns were on the market. Even the Brigadier Tactical, marketed by Wilson, had zero local buyers other than me. None of my shooting buddies knew anything about the gun until I brought it to a shooting get-together. When I brought a PX4 Storm Carry to another get-together, no other guys even knew what it was. The gun that got the most excitement was the Langdon M9 as it was a Galatin-marked M9. That pistol sold at least two more Langdon M9 as I know the FFL that placed the order.

[LangdonTactical]

I was unaware that you felt this way about the pistol being offered here (privately) to PF members, at the price we listed. My apologies, and I have removed our thread for the PX4cc completely.

For what it's worth, you must be a registered PF member and also meet some specific criteria to view our Business Supporter section. Subsequently, none of our listings are available for "general public" consumption, nor can be found via off-site search engine. To test, you can log out of your account, at which point you won't see our name or sub-forum. Even some registered members are unable see our section, or follow the link I posted in the PX4cc thread, as they don't meet the criteria Tom_Jones set up to view our sub-forum (at my request). Prior to becoming a PF Business Supporter, I discussed privacy with Tom at length with the goal of avoiding issues on pricing just like this. I wanted to offer some things to the active PF membership that we won't do publicly. Lesson learned.


I am in no way trying to tell you that you can not do what you're doing. It is your business and I am sure the PF members appreciate the deal you are giving them. It only frustrates me for the reasons that I mention. Everyone wants to get a good deal, I get that. And I know there are deals to be had and people look for things to go on sale, especially big-ticket items. I have worked really hard to raise the value of the PX4 in the market, so it does frustrate me when people are not even willing to pay Minimum Advertised Price for something. Not retail mind you, just MAP. Much of this is Beretta's own fault for constantly dumping the PX4s on the market at low pricing and not holding people to their MAP pricing.

I am sorry that I interfered with your business and the deals you are offering, that was not my intent.

[LangdonTactical]

I hate to write this, but I am not surprised by the LTT Elite sales. I see the following issues.

1) The general public knows little about the 92-series guns other than the M9 has been replaced by the SIG M17.

2) DA/SA hammer, especially metal-framed, guns are a niche market today. Polymer-framed striker-fired pistols are "the hotness".

3) Very little marketing to make prospective buyers aware of the LTT Elite's existence. Beretta has not done much to make people aware of this offering. LTT has done a lot, but LTT is not the marketing powerhouse that Wilson is.

4) The gun market is soft right now. Prices are lower than they were ten years ago. A kilo-buck 92-series gun has lots of competition at half the price.

As someone who has been fortunate enough to get at least one of each of the Wilson and LTT Beretta offerings, I have found no other local shooters who even knew the guns were on the market. Even the Brigadier Tactical, marketed by Wilson, had zero local buyers other than me. None of my shooting buddies knew anything about the gun until I brought it to a shooting get-together. When I brought a PX4 Storm Carry to another get-together, no other guys even knew what it was. The gun that got the most excitement was the Langdon M9 as it was a Galatin-marked M9. That pistol sold at least two more Langdon M9 as I know the FFL that placed the order.

You are correct on all accounts and I do appreciate your support!

As Ken Hackathorn once told me, "There are two types of gun companies, those that market well and those that build good guns, and the two shall never meet"

[LangdonTactical]

From the email advertisements I get from Beretta, I sometimes wonder if they are a firearm manufacturer or a clothing outfitter.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

No arguments from me there :(

[LangdonTactical]

Ernest,
As others have stated ... I am genuinely bummed that you are discouraged! I really think that momentum will build for this new offering. I am in the minority here in that it takes me awhile to save up for $1k+ purchases. (I wish I had the bandwidth to buy whenever I wanted. ) My guess is that sales will pick up as exposure and knowledge of the product expands. I assume Beretta knows this as well... they are "big boys" who entered into the agreement with you as well. Hopefully they will lend some strength to the effort as well so you dont feel as though it is all on you.

As far as MAP goes and the Px4cc - I ordered 2 of the Mod 4's the moment they were released in an effort to encourage your work. (That is part of the slowdown in getting a LTT Elite... ha!) I know being an innovator / motivator takes a ton of work and can seem thankless at times. I hope that you can be encouraged by the great work you have accomplished so far on these projects. The best days for you and yours are ahead... I believe that.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

I am not discouraged really, I am in this for the long hall and I know it is not going to be an easy ride. The whole point of my post was to tell people to not get their hopes up just yet on the Compact and Centurion just yet. The sales numbers need to support of my current project need to support the new projects, it's just that simple.

Thank you so much for your support, people like you do make a big difference for Aimee, me and LTT.

Thanks!

[Dagga Boy]

You are correct on all accounts and I do appreciate your support!

As Ken Hackathorn once told me, "There are two types of gun companies, those that market well and those that build good guns, and the two shall never meet"

Another Ken genius observation. Same in many areas of our industry.

[karam.19]

You are correct on all accounts and I do appreciate your support!

As Ken Hackathorn once told me, "There are two types of gun companies, those that market well and those that build good guns, and the two shall never meet"

You know who does well at marketing their firearms? Glock. Draw the conclusion. Burn.


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[WobblyPossum]

I think the points about advertising are spot on. The Sig Legion pistols and the WC B92s are in the same price range as the LTT 92. They’re all metal framed TDA pistols in the $1100 price range. That’s a pretty small market to begin with. Right now, the only people who seem to know about the LTT guns are people who frequent gun forums and people who attend training classes. Those are small amounts of people when looking at gun owners as a whole. Sig has been marketing the hell out of the Legions and WC has been marketing the hell out of their Beretta collaborations. The same should be done with the LTT 92 because right now only a tiny subset of this market even knows the gun exists. Beretta doesn’t seem to be advertising it much. Get the guns into the hands of YouTube celebrities for reviews. The same people who extolled the virtues of the WC 92s will sing the praises of the LTT 92. Talk to Beretta about putting the LTT 92 into more of its social media and making the in easier to find on the Beretta website. It makes absolutely no sense that when you search under the “92 Series” tab on the Beretta site you don’t find the LTT. That needs to be fixed ASAP. Beretta’s Instagram and Facebook pages have a ton of followers but those followers aren’t seeing the LTT 92. Looking at Beretta’s Instagram feed, I’m seeing three photos of the LTT 92, one each in August, July and June.


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[Craig@SSD]

I am in no way trying to tell you that you can not do what you're doing. It is your business and I am sure the PF members appreciate the deal you are giving them. It only frustrates me for the reasons that I mention. Everyone wants to get a good deal, I get that. And I know there are deals to be had and people look for things to go on sale, especially big-ticket items. I have worked really hard to raise the value of the PX4 in the market, so it does frustrate me when people are not even willing to pay Minimum Advertised Price for something. Not retail mind you, just MAP. Much of this is Beretta's own fault for constantly dumping the PX4s on the market at low pricing and not holding people to their MAP pricing.

I am sorry that I interfered with your business and the deals you are offering, that was not my intent.

No apology necessary, EL. The PX4 Compact Carry is a product of your hard work, so I can appreciate your passion, and happily took down the listing. I would have done the same, had you contacted me directly and asked. As a side note, even at the price I had them listed, we only sold a handful and still have 25 left in stock. Maybe it's just "summertime in the gun industry", and we'll see the PX4cc sales bounce back with the rest soon. Hopefully the same is true for the LTT 92 sales.

FWIW, our Beretta rep does actively push both the PX4cc and LTT SKU's to us, and I believe the commercial warehouse has some LTT's currently.

On the industry side, as it pertains to battling online pricing, I agree that it's tough. We're a MIL/LE dealer without the need for a storefront, but our sister company (shared warehouse space and corporate offices) is a privately owned commercial chain with nine brick & mortar stores, and both of us deal with issues of online pricing (particularly GB). I think it's just the market we live in today, but it doesn't make it any easier.

Thanks for your reply and clarification.

[Trooper224]

Sometimes I get the feeling that Beretta would like to stop making guns and start hitting catwalks during fashion week instead of shooting ranges.

I certainly hope things improve with the LTT pistol. It's certainly on my radar, it's just a matter of getting the bank account to align. Ernest, I certainly hope you continue pushing in this direction and I hope it pays off for you in the end. I jumped on the 92 wagon a few years ago, right before the big pizza blaster renaissance started. I quickly asked myself how I could have passed the 92 by for so many years, it's simply a great firearm. Your videos and forum posts helped shorten my learning curve with the gun by a great degree and I sincerely appreciate your efforts. I shot a PX4 for the first time last weekend due entirely to your efforts with the type, so you are making a difference. Hopefully the dollars will start to validate your efforts.

[SoCalDep]

I hate to write this, but I am not surprised by the LTT Elite sales. I see the following issues.

1) The general public knows little about the 92-series guns other than the M9 has been replaced by the SIG M17.

2) DA/SA hammer, especially metal-framed, guns are a niche market today. Polymer-framed striker-fired pistols are "the hotness".

3) Very little marketing to make prospective buyers aware of the LTT Elite's existence. Beretta has not done much to make people aware of this offering. LTT has done a lot, but LTT is not the marketing powerhouse that Wilson is.

4) The gun market is soft right now. Prices are lower than they were ten years ago. A kilo-buck 92-series gun has lots of competition at half the price.

As someone who has been fortunate enough to get at least one of each of the Wilson and LTT Beretta offerings, I have found no other local shooters who even knew the guns were on the market. Even the Brigadier Tactical, marketed by Wilson, had zero local buyers other than me. None of my shooting buddies knew anything about the gun until I brought it to a shooting get-together. When I brought a PX4 Storm Carry to another get-together, no other guys even knew what it was. The gun that got the most excitement was the Langdon M9 as it was a Galatin-marked M9. That pistol sold at least two more Langdon M9 as I know the FFL that placed the order.

Boy is that all true...

I think the biggest issue is marketing. Beretta has a lot going for it as a competitive and combative pistol, but Beretta is the damn millennial of gun manufacturers... If they can't get an immediate military contract they give up because it's tooo haaard to actually work for customers. I know they probably make more (other than the M9) from their shotguns, but if that's the case... that they don't want to market, why are they trying to sell pistols? I have been a Beretta fan in one way or another for 16 years. I remember the Cougar (I had several) and couldn't understand why they couldn't lengthen the .45 barrel and add a rail to the already wide frame... or market the gun at all. That was too hard so they decided to discontinue the gun and sell the machinery to Turkey where they... promptly add a rail! The 90-Two... Where do we start... a good idea (basically an M9A3 with stupid cosmetics and horrible execution before its' time) destroyed by a lack of thought into actually shooting said gun... and an inability to adapt and advertise. Then the PX4 comes out and Beretta does a couple months of advertisements before just "giving up" because it's tooo haaard.

That said, Beretta came out with the G-Kit, and put a dovetail on the Centurion Tactical Slide (so you're telling me there's a chance!), and moved their operation from a gun unfriendly state to more America, so I think there's hope. This means there needs to be a couple things going on, partly the responsibility of Beretta, and partly the responsibility of the customer and fan who want what they want.

First, Beretta needs to improve their marketing. If they're gonna make the guns, they should advertise them right. Today, this means things like re-posting and liking ALL the LTT instagrams... ALL the Mike Seeklander instagrams where he features the Centurion Tactical (and BrigTac before that). Re-posting some of the great LTT Elite posts I've seen from users across the country because I follow them. I follow them because I learned of them here or from LTTs instagram, and all easily found, and followed, by Beretta. I don't do facebook, but the same could probably be said there and youtube as well. In 2015 Beretta came out with a great (and very nice) magazine/catalog with cool articles. The BrigTac had just been released and the M9A3 had just been denied by the Army. They should do another one pushing the new direction of Beretta handguns and featuring the law enforcement officers, military use, competition, and firearm instruction that is the foundation of the Beretta handgun brand.

We, as consumers, need to voice what we want, both on forums and directly to Beretta, and we need to be the ambassadors for the brand. It's not just about buying the product, although of course that's part of it. If the guns don't sell, they simply won't make them anymore. People choose every day what gun or guns to buy, and one of the biggest reasons they don't choose Beretta is that it's not "popular". We need to work to make it so again if we want the platform to survive. Obviously we shouldn't buy crap just because someone tells us to buy crap. That's dumb. I bought the LTT Elite because it has great ergonomics for a decock-only system, it's comfortable, and has a great trigger that's really manageable at speed or when accuracy is necessary. It also has great features I like on my guns (fiber optic front sight with black rear, LTT grips, and Beretta extended mag release, and "D" spring). A few years ago, after with Wilson gun first came out, I knew I didn't like the Brigadier as much as the standard slide, so I bought an M9A1 and added some of the modern Beretta/Wilson stuff to it. In the end and with drop-in parts I spent about as much as an LTT Elite costs. That gun served me very well on duty, when training, and ultimately in a very memorable Ernest Langdon class that certainly solidified my confidence in the Beretta platform. The LTT Elite is a better gun with more features at a price that, while not cheap, is very reasonable.

I know what it feels like to work really hard for stuff and feel like the wheels are just spinning, and I know the demoralization it can cause. It takes a lot of guts to stake your reputation on a product like Mr. Langdon has. For that I'm TRULY grateful. I have not only a great Elite LTT, but several other great guns that I'm not sure I'd own otherwise. Thankfully, I know several people on my department who have also purchased LTT Elites, and I'll be wearing mine at a big department event tomorrow, so hopefully some more people will hear about it.

[Arbninftry]

Be sure to let us know what you think about it once you get it.

LangdonTactical

So, all I can say, is this is one of the most striking pistols I have ever seen. MIne came in tonight and all of can say is it meets and exceeds any expectation. I own several 92s, I absolutely love my BrigTac, but this might be the ultimate 92.
I will be getting a second when I sell some Tupperware.


I understand where you are coming from, I left a successful and six figure job contracting for a large DOD contractor. Booz Allen. And then moved to where I grew up to open a gun shop. Thus now I am a state employee. The gun business is a very shitty nut to crack. I wanted to be that guy that sold quality and not trash, but in the end the shmucks out number the true shooter.
Hang in there, we want you to succeed.
We the shooters will be better off if you can design a gun vs some engineer that does not even own a gun.

Thanks. Keep your feet and knees together

[LangdonTactical]

LangdonTactical

So, all I can say, is this is one of the most striking pistols I have ever seen. MIne came in tonight and all of can say is it meets and exceeds any expectation. I own several 92s, I absolutely love my BrigTac, but this might be the ultimate 92.
I will be getting a second when I sell some Tupperware.


I understand where you are coming from, I left a successful and six figure job contracting for a large DOD contractor. Booz Allen. And then moved to where I grew up to open a gun shop. Thus now I am a state employee. The gun business is a very shitty nut to crack. I wanted to be that guy that sold quality and not trash, but in the end the shmucks out number the true shooter.
Hang in there, we want you to succeed.
We the shooters will be better off if you can design a gun vs some engineer that does not even own a gun.

Thanks. Keep your feet and knees together

Thank you for the kind words and support. I am not going anywhere.

[Bill]

I wonder what impact some targeted marketing at the gamer-side of the house would produce. Sponsorship of some major matches and the like. I see the LTT market as mostly committed shooters who train, and those that are high round count gamers. The forums hit a decent cross section of the two, but I'm sure there are a bunch of the pure gamer types that only live in the competition circles. God knows the Langdon name pulls weight in those groups. I wonder if match sponsorship and a Beretta USPSA team or the like would raise awareness for the new Elite while its on the shelves brand new ready to go. Beretta Italy seems to have some gamer dudes running M9a3's. Get Stoeger in the mix maybe? He still shooting 92's like he did back in the day?

[Larry Sellers]

I wonder what impact some targeted marketing at the gamer-side of the house would produce. Sponsorship of some major matches and the like. I see the LTT market as mostly committed shooters who train, and those that are high round count gamers. The forums hit a decent cross section of the two, but I'm sure there are a bunch of the pure gamer types that only live in the competition circles. God knows the Langdon name pulls weight in those groups. I wonder if match sponsorship and a Beretta USPSA team or the like would raise awareness for the new Elite while its on the shelves brand new ready to go. Beretta Italy seems to have some gamer dudes running M9a3's. Get Stoeger in the mix maybe? He still shooting 92's like he did back in the day?

Believe he’s shooting tanfos


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[pastaslinger]

I'm not sure Beretta would be able to really make much difference if they had a USPSA team or abything. The problem comes back to everyone using CZ or Tanfoglios due to the trigger pull and the weight. Berettas can have pretty good trigger pulls and are midweight pistols but the reset will never be as short as the non firing pin block CZ guns.

Don't forget that Beretta doesn't even make a base model dovetailed gun on a regular basis other than the 92a1, which is not even the same as the rest of the 92 lineup. There are no regular production brigadiers or vertecs (not that I like the vertec frame anyways). I don't understand why in 2018 Beretta doesn't just consolidate their lineup and upgrade the m9 and m9a1 to vertec slides, offer them in G configuration from the factory, and get rid of the front sight staking that makes changing the sights a pain in the ass without a dedicated sight pusher. I cannot even change a Beretta front sight with a punch and hammer on unlike with virtually every other gun without marring the Beretta front sight or slide due to the staking.

A regular production competition oriented steel frame 92 might be another step in the right direction for USPSA popularity. The Elite LTT is already pretty optimal but if it had a steel frame it might be even more popular in competition.

[hotrodder636]

I for one am grateful for what you have done here. I started off 2018 with no Berettas and now I have 3 working on more.

Unfortunately it does seem the Beretta marketing is not very good on the LTT Elite which is disappointing. However, those of us enthusiasts shoudl spread by word of mouth. I posted a pic pf mine on a beretta FB page and it has been seen by I don’t know how many now.

Regardless, I would enjoy another LTT pistol so I hope this goes well. 30023



Don't get your hopes up just yet. The Elite LTT sales are not nearly as high as expected. If things do not turn around and the numbers go up pretty soon, we will have to see if Beretta keeps listening to me. I suspect a lot of people are not putting their money where their mouth is on this gun. They say it is the gun that they want, but only if they can get the super good guy bargain deal off Gunbroker or some other dealer that is selling them under MAP pricing. Seems to be the way people like to buy things in this industry. I see the same thing going on with the PX4 Compact Carry on this very forum.

To be honest it makes me sad and makes me wonder if it is worth it sometimes. The "that's what I want, but I am not going to buy unless I can get it for $75 under MAP pricing" seems to be a thing here. :(

Not exactly the way to incentivize a company to listen to their customers.

[GJM]

I was at a match today (shooting a Glock) when Ernest texted me a picture of one of my pair of full boat Langdon pistols.

30024

[Jackdog]

I was at a match today (shooting a Glock) when Ernest texted me a picture of one of my pair of full boat Langdon pistols.

30024

What’s all involved with a “full boat Langdon pistol?”


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[Doc_Glock]

I was at a match today (shooting a Glock) when Ernest texted me a picture of one of my pair of full boat Langdon pistols.

30024

I asked for a quote on the “full house” Langdon pistol when I ordered my LTT. Aimee did not appear to have ever heard the term. So I just got a “stock” LTT. Should have used “full boat” I guess.

What is involved in this treatment?

[Blackbag]

I was at a match today (shooting a Glock) when Ernest texted me a picture of one of my pair of full boat Langdon pistols.

30024



I so want!!!!

[GJM]

What’s all involved with a “full boat Langdon pistol?”


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Ernest does his trigger job, a carry bevel all over, anodizes the frame, coats the upper and NP3 to internals.

[Dagga Boy]

Looking at it.....NP3 small parts and likely the action job.

[Balisong]

I was at a match today (shooting a Glock) when Ernest texted me a picture of one of my pair of full boat Langdon pistols.

30024

That's possibly the most beautiful Beretta I've ever seen. How is it different from the LTT Elite except the NP3 small parts?

N/m, has been answered

[Canyonrat]

It’s funny how many Inox lovers tend to want to purify their look by eliminating black levers and parts. Put some shiny silver bits on a black gun though and it’s “wow, neato!” That is a fine looking LTT pistol though.