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Mr_White
06-17-2016, 11:01 AM
I think it's time to run this one again.

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Week 169: Senior Airman Andy Brown Challenge

Results may be posted until July 17th, 2016.

Designed by: Gabe White, based on Senior Airman Andy Brown's outstanding resolution of the 1994 active shooter event at Fairchild Air Force Base, where he successfully neutralized a rifle-armed assailant at 70 yards with four shots from his Beretta M9 pistol.
Range: 25 yards
Target: Tennis ball, or other ~2.6" circle
Rounds Fired: 1 minimum, no maximum
Procedure: Start with pistol loaded and holstered, facing downrange at the 25 yard line. Keep pistol holstered and run from the 25 to the 0 yard line, then back to the 25 yard line. Face downrange and start the timer. Upon the start signal, draw and engage the target. You have completed the challenge when you hit the target one time.

Variations:

Concealment is optional.

Positional shooting (kneeling, prone, etc.) is optional.

A tennis ball will be useful as a reactive target (you will easily know when you have hit it) and at 25 yards is the approximate equivalent of a ~7.3" circle at the 70 yard engagement distance of the actual event. Either put the tennis ball on a safe surface to shoot at, or hang it from a cord. Alternatively, make a ~2.6" circle on a piece of paper and use that, or use some other similarly-sized target.

Shoot until you hit the the target. Of course we want to hit on the first shot, but the point is to accomplish the fundamental task of hitting the target, whatever that takes.

In doing whatever it takes to hit the target, you have two options in this challenge: shoot from the 25 yard line until you hit, or, if after unsuccessfully trying to hit the target at 25 yards for some number of shots (your choice of how many, but you must fire at least one shot from the 25 yard line), move to a position at the 10 yard line and shoot from there until you hit. If you want to use this option, set up a simulated point of cover at the 10 yard line and offset laterally by 5 yards from the lane/position where the target is located. See accompanying diagram. If you don't have anything to use as simulated cover, you can just mark the spot on the ground you are going to move to.

Please report the following when you post your results in this thread:

Equipment used: gun, holster, concealment (if any)
Target used: tennis ball or alternative target
Number of shots fired from 25 yard line (note any positional shooting), number of shots fired from 10 yard line (note any positional shooting)
Total number of shots fired to make one hit
Total time to make one hit
Observations: anything you noticed

Training with firearms is an inherently dangerous activity. Be sure to follow all safety protocols when using firearms or practicing these drills. These drills are provided for information purposes only. Use at your own risk.

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7668/17426938562_58632e0271_k.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/sxXBFY)Senior Airman Andy Brown Challenge (https://flic.kr/p/sxXBFY) by OrigamiAK (https://www.flickr.com/people/52790396@N08/), on Flickr

Mr_White
06-17-2016, 11:28 AM
Equipment used: Gen3 G34, concealed in a Keeper under a polo shirt
Target used: tennis ball
Number of shots fired from 25 yard line (note any positional shooting), number of shots fired from 10 yard line (note any positional shooting): 2 @ 25 yards (standing), 0 @ 10 yard line
Total number of shots fired to make one hit: 2
Total time to make one hit: 3.80
Observations: Disappointingly took a bit longer than when we did this last year, and still took two shots to make the hit. But it easily could have taken a lot more than two. Used my carry G34 (same as my practice/training/match G34) loaded with 124gr + P Gold Dots.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YRpmeva880c

okie john
06-17-2016, 04:12 PM
http://i.imgur.com/0zukLAu.jpg

Equipment used: gun, holster, concealment (if any): Gen4 G19, American Eagle 147-grain FMJ ammo, K-Rounds IWB holster, no concealment.
Target used: 3" Shoot-N-See. The hit clips the middle scoring ring, which is 2" in diameter.
Number of shots fired from 25 yard line (note any positional shooting): 2, both fired offhand at 25 yards
Number of shots fired from 10 yard line (note any positional shooting): N/A
Total number of shots fired to make one hit: 2
Total time to make one hit: 8.54 seconds
Observations

Shot this one cold. The last time I fired a handgun was 12 days ago on 05 JUN 16.
Except for a Dawson adjustable rear sight and an Ameriglo front sight painted red, this gun is stock. It even has the grooved trigger.
It really helps to practice regularly at the 25-yard line, know your zero, and have a proven accurate load.


Okie John

JHC
06-17-2016, 06:13 PM
Nice shooting from two Glocks! ;)

Last year on this I thought the time included the sprint. I pulled a hammy. :(

okie john
06-17-2016, 06:17 PM
Nice shooting from two Glocks! ;)

Last year on this I thought the time included the sprint. I pulled a hammy. :(

Thanks. The time probably should include the sprint.


Okie John

JHC
06-17-2016, 06:41 PM
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

okie john
06-17-2016, 07:27 PM
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

Oh, yeah. I'm old and fat, and it's going to torpedo my ranking...


Okie John

okie john
06-18-2016, 06:18 PM
I shot this drill twice today. My club has an old-school bullseye pistol range, essentially a 100-yard long shed with benches at the firing line. On half of it you can hang targets at 10 and 15 yards, on the the other half you can hang them at 25 and 50. Shooters change targets en masse, so I couldn't run downrange and back, then turn and fire like Mr. White did. To get 50 yards of running, I had to run out of the range shed and across the parking lot, which requires making three 90-degree turns at speed to clear the building, then running sideways for a car length to avoid knocking rearview mirrors off of parked cars, then sprinting about 10 yards to the fence, then turning around and coming back along the same route. This raised a couple of eyebrows, as few other people do this kind of stuff on this range. I did this wearing jeans and a T-shirt, boots, 5.11 belt, holster, loaded pistol, and spare mag. No concealment.

Equipment used: gun, holster, concealment (if any): Gen4 G19, American Eagle 147-grain FMJ ammo, K-Rounds IWB holster, no concealment.
Target: 3" Shoot-N-See

First Try
Run Time: 22.73 seconds
Number of shots fired from 25 yard line (note any positional shooting): 2, both fired offhand at 25 yards
Number of shots fired from 10 yard line (note any positional shooting): N/A
Total number of shots fired to make one hit: 2
Total time to make one hit: 7.94 seconds + 22.73 for the running = 30.67 seconds

At this point, I should have declared victory and gone home. But


NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

Second Try
Run Time: 20.03 seconds
Number of shots fired from 25 yard line (note any positional shooting): 12, all fired offhand at 25 yards
Number of shots fired from 10 yard line (note any positional shooting): N/A
Total number of shots fired to make one hit: 12
Total time to make one hit: 50.21 seconds + 20.03 for the running = 80.24 seconds

Observations

I pose no danger to Usain Bolt's place in history.
Shot this one with no warm-up.
Same pistol and load as yesterday.
I shot the second run immediately after the first one, so I didn't wait for my heartbeat to slow down again. Covering 50 yards in 20-ish seconds one time was no big deal, but doing it twice back to back makes the shooting task exponentially harder. The group I made on the second attempt would have been in the A-Zone had I been shooting at an IPSC target, but that little black ball is decidedly difficult to hit when you're huffing and puffing like I was.
I've always had a lot of respect for SRA Brown's shooting in this incident, and this drill has only increased that. I've shot a couple of IDPA stages that attempt to recreate the geometry of this event, but none of them put a target past 25 yards, and none of them make the shooter to ride a mountain bike as fast as you can for a quarter-mile (as SRA Brown was forced to do) then make a 70-yard headshot.


Okie John

jiminycricket
06-20-2016, 01:39 AM
G19 Gen4 in a Blade-Tec IWB Phantom holster under a buttoned down shirt.

I shot this cold this past Saturday with my first round being my already chambered defensive round: Hornady's Critical Defense. The other rounds in the magazine were 115 gr. Blazer Brass. My target was a 2.6" circle drawn with a sharpie on a 3x5 index card affixed to an IPSC target.

I ran to and from the target, hit the timer, then drew and fired only one shot because I realized I forgot to put on my ears. Oops. It was a damn miss too at low left. So I started over, ran again, and hit the timer for a hit on my first shot. I didn't want it to be just luck, so I ran a third time, hit the timer, and finished with a hit on the first shot again. I'm fairly pleased.

First attempt: Missed at 3.something seconds

Second attempt: 1 shot at 2.86 seconds

Third attempt: 1 shot at 3.39 seconds

backtrail540
06-20-2016, 05:41 PM
Glock 17 rtf2, Dark Star Gear AIWB, under a polo
Tennis ball hanging via tape from a uspsa target
2 runs/2 shots each run
Run 1 - 6.09 second round hit
Run 2 - 4.86 second round hit
All shots fired from 25 yard line

I honestly thought I would struggle much more with this. I was assuming at least 5 to get a hit. My first run I missed the first shot then the second round hit. When I checked the ball it was just a graze, enought to leave two black dots on the ball, and move it visibly but not a good hit. My second run actually moved material on the ball but still wasn't a particularly good hit. Either way, I was surprised I got hits as quick as I did, although they weren't particularly fast or solid.

JHC
06-20-2016, 05:51 PM
A few years ago in a class Hackathorn said he felt the RTF2s were the best guns Glock ever made. FWIW.

Skeeter
06-21-2016, 11:37 PM
Equipment used: Gen4 G19, concealed in a Keeper under a polo shirt. Blazer Brass 9mm, 124 grain ammo.
Target used: Paper with red-sharpie 2" circle
Number of shots fired from 25 yard line (note any positional shooting), number of shots fired from 10 yard line (note any positional shooting): 2 + 8 shots @ 25 yards (standing, slight lean w/ left shoulder on Jeep). No shots @ 10 yards.
Total number of shots fired to make one hit: 2
Total time to make one hit: 10.28
Observations: Did this indoors almost a week ago during league night. It took five or six shots at 25 yards to hit a tennis ball of duct tape, it wasn't worth remembering the time!

First try this afternoon was a lesson in the affect of angled sunlight. Facing the sun at an angle, wearing sunglasses -- The groups were high and left by ~2", and not as tight as the subsequent run with light from the back. Figuring the sunlight angle was playing tricks on my eyes and sights, I drove a short distance to another shooting area with the sun at my back. Now I had a pretty tight (for me) ten shot group. After the hit on the second shot, 8 more shots to make a total of ten and check the 25 yard POA/POI. Side note: Both of my Glock 19's shoot about 1.25" high at 25 yards using standard Glock night sights (6.5mm rear).

The terrain wasn't good for actual running, so not much heart/breathing rate increase before starting the timer. However, the big take-away was the affect of light angled toward my eyes. I wanted to go back and experiment with how to use the sights better with light angled toward me, but no time.
8702

JAD
06-24-2016, 09:19 AM
Equipment: Wilson cqb commander, sparks ex rso, polo
Target: Starbucks tall latte cup small end on
Result: 4.32 seconds, 2 rounds.
Observations: I saw the dirt signature on the first round. I Imagine that if I had been looking at my sights instead, I might've made the shot on the first round.

jdesro
06-27-2016, 05:47 PM
Equipment used: Smith & Wesson M&P 9mm Compact, JMCK AIWB holster
Target used: tennis ball
Number of shots fired from 25 yard line (note any positional shooting), 4 (standing) number of shots fired from 10 yard line (note any positional shooting) None
Total number of shots to make one hit: 4
Total time to make one hit: 32.80 Sec.* (first shot was at 21.22 sec.) *see below
Observations:

Shot this on Sunday. I kind of changed the rules on myself and started the timer before the run and used the total time of the run and the shooting for my time. Took some video as well.

First off, I made a mistake when I paced this off, and afterwards found out that I set the target out at about 28 yards instead of 25.

Watching the video afterwards I noticed some things.

First observation: I run like a fat kid chasing the ice cream truck - running is really not my forte, and it shows. I really should incorporate more running into my fitness regimen.

Next, it appears as though I just barely hit the tennis ball on my first shot. On the video you can see it start to spin on my first shot, but of course I could not notice that from the firing line.

One neat thing I noticed on the video that I'm not sure you can see on the Youtube video is the bullets in flight. I guess the light was just right that day and if you look closely you can just make out a copper streak as the bullets pass by the tennis ball.


https://youtu.be/5CaF_xFBghw

Range1
07-08-2016, 12:13 PM
Equipment used: Ran Glock 34 3x and a Glock 23 w/9mm conversion 2x, Safariland ALS holster and wearing a vest
Target used: tennis ball
Number of shots fired from 25 yard line: Ran a total of 5 times, first 4 times shot 8 to 10 rounds each time before calling the run a fail. Last run was 4 rounds and a solid hit at 10.29 seconds.
Total number of shots fired to make one hit: Total for the 5 runs would be 42 or 4 if only the last run is considered
Total time to make one hit: 10.29 seconds for the successful run
Observations: anything you noticed: My skills since retiring are ridiculously deteriorated. The fact I have done next to nothing since April does not help. Being able and motivated to practice live fire whenever one desires is a definite plus.

Mickey
07-08-2016, 06:47 PM
Ran this a couple of different ways

First run
Equipment usedGlock 34 w/ JMACK AIWB
Target tennis ball on top of 50 Gallon plastic drum
Total number of shots fired at 25 yard line1
Total number of shots fired to make a hit1
Total time to make one hit 16.33 (This includes the time for the sprint)
Observations this was a great run for me every thing just fell into place, I should have packed up and went home.;)

B]Second run[/B]
Equipment usedGlock 34 w/ JMACK AIWB
Target tennis ball on top of 50 Gallon plastic drum
Total number of shots fired at 25 yard line3
Total number of shots fired to make a hit3
Total time to make one hit 17.14 (This did not include the time for the sprint)
Observations Not bad but it was slower than my fist run that included the sprint.

B]Third run[/B]
Equipment usedBeretta M-9 Commercial
Target tennis ball on top of 50 Gallon plastic drum
Total number of shots fired at 25 yard line3
Total number of shots fired to make a hit3
Total time to make one hit 24.69 (This includes the time for the sprint)
Observations I just had to try this with the old trusty M-9 not as fast as with the Glock but still got it done in under 5 rounds.

Overall I really liked this drill it forced you to concentrate on that front sight after you got your heart rate up!