MPX Pistol with SB Collapsing Brace Approved

[BES]

Really surprised that this was approved! This configuration has me seriously interested in an MPX pistol now. I'd really like to have something extremely compact for the house and truck like this. From what I've read and been advised by those more knowledgeable than me, it seems that a 9mm pistol PDW would be a better choice than a pistol AR in 5.56. Also easier to operate by someone with limited skill in a defensive situation, like a family member, than a handgun. Thoughts or suggestions ?

812481258126

[psalms144.1]

While the 9mm might be more efficient in extremely short barrels, I'm not sure I'd say the 9mm is a BETTER cartridge in a shoulder fired weapon. Adequate for SD/HD? Yes. Less blast and recoil? Yes. Better ability to penetrate barriers? No. Equivalent capability at extended ranges? No. Accuracy at ranges past normal pistol ranges? Probably not equivalent.

I really do understand the appeal of a pistol caliber carbine, and I'll only surrender my MP5K the day before I retire, but, if I thought there was any chance of getting into a gunfight and I had time to choose a shoulder fired weapon, it'd be the M4, pretty much all the time.

[rauchman]

This is purchasable without special licensing through the ATF? Wow, ....skirting that razor's edge. Would never have thought something like this would fly.

[TCinVA]

I want one for my Zenith.

[GJM]

Are these for sale yet on a complete MPX, or are they still in development?

[SteveB]

The NFA branch has repeatedly said that these braces are legal only if used for their design purpose; as arm braces. The minute you mount this thing like a rifle, you have created an illegal SBR. Photos like the guy shooting above could be used as evidence of a federal crime. I know a Class III dealer who will not let customers shoulder-mount these guns in his store; he's been told by ATF that if someone shoulder mounts one of these, then hands it to him, he has received an illegal firearm.

[GJM]

The NFA branch has repeatedly said that these braces are legal only if used for their design purpose; as arm braces. The minute you mount this thing like a rifle, you have created an illegal SBR. Photos like the guy shooting above could be used as evidence of a federal crime. I know a Class III dealer who will not let customers shoulder-mount these guns in his store; he's been told by ATF that if someone shoulder mounts one of these, then hands it to him, he has received an illegal firearm.

Steve, looking at the picture, I think there is space between the brace and his shoulder -- looks like he is "cheek welding" it. Is cheek welding permitted under the interpretation of the law?

[SteveB]

Steve, looking at the picture, I think there is space between the brace and his shoulder -- looks like he is "cheek welding" it. Is cheek welding permitted under the interpretation of the law?

I don't know; is the toe of the "brace" in contact with his body? Cheek welding is apparently legal, providing the attachment to the buffer tube only changes the diameter and shape of the tube and doesn't provide a buttstock. I don't want to be the test-case for this. My plan for the AR pistol is to stick a foam tube on the buffer tube and call it a day.

http://siterepository.s3.amazonaws.com/2675/atf_response_letter_for_ar_pistol_pack.pdf

[Chuck Haggard]

Steve, looking at the picture, I think there is space between the brace and his shoulder -- looks like he is "cheek welding" it. Is cheek welding permitted under the interpretation of the law?

My understanding is, with the AR pistols since they have a receiver extension (AKA "buffer tube"), that having a cheek weld is legal sine you are not shouldering the gun.

[Beat Trash]

My first and foremost concern is that what the ATF proves today, could be rescinded tomorrow.

[TCinVA]

To the best of my knowledge, cheek welding is fine. Shouldering is supposedly the no-no.

[GardoneVT]

Really surprised that this was approved! This configuration has me seriously interested in an MPX pistol now. I'd really like to have something extremely compact for the house and truck like this. From what I've read and been advised by those more knowledgeable than me, it seems that a 9mm pistol PDW would be a better choice than a pistol AR in 5.56. Also easier to operate by someone with limited skill in a defensive situation, like a family member, than a handgun. Thoughts or suggestions ?

812481258126

May as well apply for an SBR stamp at time of purchase and do it right the first time.

This is an ATF "Rule Change" time bomb, likely to go off around Janurary of 2017 or thereabouts. I doubt a Clinton 2.0 administration will permit grandfathering or a waiting period in that event.

[psalms144.1]

My first and foremost concern is that what the ATF proves today, could be rescinded tomorrow.This, this, a thousand times, THIS!

Have we all forgotten that, not too terribly long ago, shouldering the Sig Brace was A-OK with the compliance branch? Then a ridiculous number of f-tards flooded the ATF with "what about my gun?" questions until they finally reversed themselves, and said "screw you all - no shouldering the brace." "Cheek weld?" Really? I think the ATF has made itself clear that the brace is only a brace when it's used as a brace. On the arm.

But, it is a lot more fun to watch someone else get arrested and charged on NFA violations so we can collectively argue how many angels can dance on the head of a pin...

[Trajan]

The NFA branch has repeatedly said that these braces are legal only if used for their design purpose; as arm braces. The minute you mount this thing like a rifle, you have created an illegal SBR. Photos like the guy shooting above could be used as evidence of a federal crime. I know a Class III dealer who will not let customers shoulder-mount these guns in his store; he's been told by ATF that if someone shoulder mounts one of these, then hands it to him, he has received an illegal firearm.

Do I need to get my Glocks SBR'd everytime I shoot one from retention?

[psalms144.1]

Do I need to get my Glocks SBR'd everytime I shoot one from retention?Not until 278,000 internet ninjas send that question, along with photos and videos, to the compliance branch. Then, who knows...

[Trajan]

Not until 278,000 internet ninjas send that question, along with photos and videos, to the compliance branch. Then, who knows...

Meh, I just checked, theres a small small gap between the side of my ribs and the grip so I'm good.

[SteveB]

I'm no expert, but it seems to me that the ATF is concerned with modification of an existing firearm. The AR pistol has a receiver extension as part of its design. I would guess you can shoot it any way you want to. Any addition to, or modification of, the buffer tube that creates what the ATF could interpret as a buttstock turns your pistol into a rifle.

[Jeep]

It is absolutely amazing that the difference between a perfectly lawful activity and a felony is whether the "brace" touches the shoulder or (perhaps--we'll tell you after we arrest you) there is a check weld.

It is even more amazing that a permissible check weld today can become a felony tomorrow because of the administrative guidance of a mid-level civil servant.

What this whole discussion tells me (again) is that we are losing our country. Americans never used to have to fear prosecution and jail because they didn't have a permissible check weld or a part of a gun touched their shoulder. And we shouldn't have to fear them now, even if the right to keep and bear arms was not Constitutionally enshrined. The fact that the second amendment exists makes this situation even more outrageous.

[psalms144.1]

...It is even more amazing that a permissible check weld today can become a felony tomorrow because of the administrative guidance of a mid-level civil servant.

What this whole discussion tells me (again) is that we are losing our country...All I have to say is this: 11/08/16. Think it's bad now?

[Tamara]

All I have to say is this: 11/08/16. Think it's bad now?

Yeah, imagine what it would be like with an anti-gun administration that vows to use every unilateral power the Executive Branch has to go after guns.

[ranger]

I recently bought the MPX pistol and filed for the SBR Form 1. I shot my buddies' SBR'd MPX and it is really nice alternative to AR style SBR.

[Hauptmann]

Better than an shorty AR-15?........ under some circumstances. The only advantage over a AR would be that it would have a greatly reduced muzzle blast. Shooting an AR-15 indoors, especially with a shorter barrel is absolute distracting torture. Think of it like getting hit in the face by a 19yr old private with a pillow every time you pull the trigger. A subgun with a barrel over 5" is definitely less distracting and thus, easier to shoot well. However, a subgun is a multi-hit system with limited effective range. Thus, like a handgun you need either very accurate hits, or multi-hits to end the threat. At ranges over 25yrds it becomes harder to accomplish quick multi-hits, and most 9mm JHPs slow down enough at longer ranges that they no longer expand(about 100yrds).

However, I would probably take a MPX 9mm over a shotgun, provided it had a good reddot on top and I was fast and accurate with the trigger.

[HeavyDuty]

My first and foremost concern is that what the ATF proves today, could be rescinded tomorrow.

This came up in an archive search. Give this man a cookie.