Gabe White hates on Competition...

[Sal Picante]

Check this out!

http://www.tactical-life.com/tactics/experts-competitive-shooting-defensive/#balsum16-experts-ayoob


Engaging targets in the open when cover is close by, reloading on the run (though it’s much wiser to reload behind cover and then move), engaging targets in the order that gives us the fastest times instead of those that would be the greatest danger to the shooter, always having a chance to plan your “attack” or even rehearse your run—these are but a few of the things that set people up for failure in the real world. It appears that the more skilled you become in competition, the easier it is to preprogram behaviors that could be fatal in a real self-defense encounter.

:rolleyes:

[Totem Polar]

I think you just quoted Ken Hackathorn.

[Sal Picante]

I think you just quoted Ken Hackathorn.

Wait... That can't be...

[CCT125US]

His troll is weak and needs fed :)

[gtmtnbiker98]

Thanks for the demonstration. As to how to properly fail a troll attempt. LOL

[Sal Picante]

C'mob guys.... It isn't like I didn't put the :rolleyes: in there...

[MVS]

Pretty good article for a change. Must be because I agree with it. :)

Separate but related question. Was Ken Hackathorn actually in the Army Special Forces? I have seen it printed different ways. Some print that he trained them, others that he was a member.

[Totem Polar]

All I know is that the "related article" link has "experts on 45 vs 9mm" as the first option. Let's see what Gabe and Ken both think of that, before I pee down my pant leg with anticipation. :D

[GJM]

I am sitting in the hotel room looking at Gabe and pals, and I can assure you he is lovin' on competition.

[Hambo]

Separate but related question. Was Ken Hackathorn actually in the Army Special Forces? I have seen it printed different ways. Some print that he trained them, others that he was a member.

Yes. As for the "trainer" stuff you've seen in print, he did a lot of training for various units well after he was out of the military.

[Mr_White]

Good one Les, troll me when it's hard for me to respond! ;)

[Mr_White]

Dammit, I just found a treble hook stuck in the bottom of my water bottle and now it looks like I pissed all over myself. I don't know where the heck it came from. Was it you Les?

[Cheap Shot]

*Throws drop wallet on ground, side steps and runs away*

[Cheap Shot]

I am sitting in the hotel room looking at Gabe and pals, and I can assure you he is lovin' on competition.

Yeah, thats not awkward........

[taadski]

Dammit, I just found a treble hook stuck in the bottom of my water bottle and now it looks like I pissed all over myself. I don't know where the heck it came from. Was it you Les?


Nice coverup. 🎣🐠

[GJM]

Pepperoni knows Gabe is at area one, and figured he could have some fun.

We shoot this afternoon and Sunday morning, so Les you can pretty much troll Gabe for the next two days unchallenged, as I doubt he even looks at PF unless there happens to be a link to this PF thread on Practiscore. Seriously, Gabe is so focused on this match he loaded calories at lunch yesterday and skipped any alcohol at the PF dinner at the Mex place last night.

[Mr_White]

you can pretty much troll Gabe for the next two days unchallenged

Good tip!

[Randy Harris]

Well....how did the match go?

[Luke]

Well....how did the match go?

Word on th skreet is Gabe was 28th. Pretty sexy for limited MINOR going against the big dawgs. And there was like 160 people in limited!

[Randy Harris]

Congrats to Mr. White!

[Luke]

GJM finished 3rd in his class :)

[Mr_White]

I'll have to post full report and video later, can't do it for a couple days, but basically I think I did significantly better than last year, probably better than 2014 even though placing was worse, but still nowhere near where I wanted to be. Like last year, have a lot of thinking to do. Timing works out that this was the biggest match of my year, first thing, but I do have a state and section match still coming.

[Randy Harris]

basically I think I did significantly better than last year, probably better than 2014 even though placing was worse, but still nowhere near where I wanted to be.

I can certainly empathize with that...I was 14th in Master Stock Service Pistol at the IDPA World match last fall but I actually had a legit shot at 10th (which is what my goal was) if I'd just done a few small things differently.

[Wendell]

...Was Ken Hackathorn actually in the Army Special Forces? ...

Yes. And (if I recall correctly) he served in Vietnam.

[Eyesquared]

Yes. And (if I recall correctly) he served in Vietnam.

If I understand correctly, because of the timing and circumstances outside of his control, he never saw combat. I think this is part of why he's pretty low key about the whole SF thing.

[GJM]

GJM finished 3rd in his class :)

Unfortunately, I had a very poor match on day one. Fortunately, it was a very small class.

[MVS]

Unfortunately, I had a very poor match on day one. Fortunately, it was a very small class.

Did you compete in the carry optics division then? How did your overall scores stack up?

Edit, I don't see a delete button, so I will just say disregard. Saw the answer in your other thread.

[Luke]

Unfortunately, I had a very poor match on day one. Fortunately, it was a very small class.

I noticed, you really could see a big difference in the scores. Does that mean your done with trijicon for gaming?

[GJM]

Did you compete in the carry optics division then? How did your overall scores stack up?

Edit, I don't see a delete button, so I will just say disregard. Saw the answer in your other thread.


I noticed, you really could see a big difference in the scores. Does that mean your done with trijicon for gaming?

I think I am done with the RMR for gaming. My average overall average stage, match placement was 64 places higher on day two with the Delta Pro.

The guy who won CO is an excellent shooter -- an M in open prior to GM, with a GM level open percentage. Crunching numbers, I would have needed an exceptional match, coupled with an off match for him, to win CO at the Area match.

Here is something funny. Per the USPSA top 20 list, as a function of how few people have been classified in CO, Omar has the third highest USPSA CO classification percentage at 78.07 and I am fourth at 77.035. He is a lot better than me than that .72 would suggest.

[Mr_White]

Omar is an awesome dude, and very experienced at burning stages at Open speed.

Sure was fun on the PF squad!

[GJM]

Omar is an awesome dude, and very experienced at burning stages at Open speed.

Sure was fun on the PF squad!

We had an excellent squad -- bunch of PF members, plus two very talented Production shooters from CA, Jeremy and Steve. A big highlight was how well our Rogers group dos on the standards stage, that involved difficult strong and support hand only shooting. Another highlight was watching each stage RO react to Gabe's appendix rig. Even got questions on his Gadget, which underscores how attentive the RO staff was. YVK rocked his Tangfo very well, and I am anxiously awaiting the return of his 4.1 HK pistols, and see what he thinks of HK triggers after some time shooting the Tangfo.

[GRV]

Gabe, how often do you get hassled about your gear by ROs?

I've tolerated my fair share of rangesplaining on just about every topic---most recently it was about how to staple targets---and it's my least favorite past-time. eyemahm and I have already gotten lectured about how illegal our gear is by a few local USPSA ROs while shooting the shit at a Steel Challenge match; we agreed to disagree, but that doesn't really work with those types, they won't give up until you say "oh, okay, thanks for that.". Honestly, it's one of the reasons we've hesitated to try getting involved in USPSA, and why we've been pretty happy the past few months practicing alone and becoming relative hermits in the local shooting community.

[Talionis]

and see what he thinks of HK triggers after some time shooting the Tangfo.

"Well, it's nice to have a gun that works." ;)

[taadski]

Gabe, how often do you get hassled about your gear by ROs?

I've tolerated my fair share of rangesplaining on just about every topic---most recently it was about how to staple targets---and it's my least favorite past-time. eyemahm and I have already gotten lectured about how illegal our gear is by a few local USPSA ROs while shooting the shit at a Steel Challenge match; we agreed to disagree, but that doesn't really work with those types, they won't give up until you say "oh, okay, thanks for that.". Honestly, it's one of the reasons we've hesitated to try getting involved in USPSA, and why we've been pretty happy the past few months practicing alone and becoming relative hermits in the local shooting community.


Not Gabe, but if this weekend was any indication, you better be content to discuss it regularly if you plan on competing that way. I stopped counting the number of times he had to explain it very early in the weekend. Fortunately for Gabe, he really likes sharing the info and discussing it.

That said, Gabe's public notoriety is on the steep upward curve amongst gamers. As an example, I opened the new Front Sight magazine (USPSA's official journal) this morning and found this article:




http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo324/taadski/Mobile%20Uploads/FullSizeRender_zpsalyfvzfy.jpg




Congrats, G!

[GJM]

"Well, it's nice to have a gun that works." ;)

I think YVK resembles that comment.

[taadski]

I think YVK resembles that comment.


It's funny how outspoken you've gotten re reliability after putting your (collection of 6+) shadows on the shelf for a few weeks. :p

[GJM]

It's funny how outspoken you've gotten re reliability after putting your (collection of 6+) shadows on the shelf for a few weeks. :p

I just counted them, and there are only five. Five, I might add, that all work.

[YVK]

I think YVK resembles that comment.

YVK resembles sitting till midnight and filing on his tanfo slide, with short interruptions for respringing his tanfo frame, so the goddamn thing would be able to shoot 160 rounds without significant stoppages. YVK is anxious to be reconciled with guns that shoot. YVK has 50 bucks for your RMR, you've proven it is no good for dynamic situations. That's it.

[Sal Picante]

Five, I might add, that all work. ....for now.

[Mr_White]

Gabe, how often do you get hassled about your gear by ROs?

I've tolerated my fair share of rangesplaining on just about every topic---most recently it was about how to staple targets---and it's my least favorite past-time. eyemahm and I have already gotten lectured about how illegal our gear is by a few local USPSA ROs while shooting the shit at a Steel Challenge match; we agreed to disagree, but that doesn't really work with those types, they won't give up until you say "oh, okay, thanks for that.". Honestly, it's one of the reasons we've hesitated to try getting involved in USPSA, and why we've been pretty happy the past few months practicing alone and becoming relative hermits in the local shooting community.

Locally, none, because anyone with a question has already seen me and any questions they have, already addressed.

When I get out to a bigger match where the ROs don't all know me, like at Area 1, I get a fair number of questions, but nothing I would describe as a major hassle.

Three or four times at this match, I'd get told make ready, then be stopped by the RO who looked puzzled and started saying "I don't think that's legal" or "Have you checked if that is legal?" Then I tell them, yes, I know it's very unusual but definitely legal in Limited (some of them are thinking I am shooting Production with a holster illegally in front of the iliac crest and that's their issue, separate from AIWB itself.) I tell them I understand if they want to ask the Rangemaster, but it has been thoroughly addressed already. None of them have called him. It helps that the big NROI dude they'd be asking, at least here out West, is from the same locale as me and he knows my deal. When I saw him this time, he asked me "Are you going to scare the shit out of my ROs again?" The Board of Directors also issued a clarification a while back that AIWB was LEGAL in Open, Limited, and Limited-10. I believe this was in response to there being a few clubs in the East who were trying to disallow AIWB in those divisions under the catch-all "I declare this holster to be unsafe" clause, which was totally wrong. I am pretty sure minimalist holsters like the Vanguard, MIC, Zach, etc., that just cover the trigger guard might still be illegal. But if we are talking Keeper, JM, Dark Star, Shaggy, etc., there should be no issue.

The worst thing is being all ready to shoot the stage, they have me make ready, then stop me with a distracting side discussion before proceeding with Are You Ready Beep. I usually take an extra twenty seconds at that point to think through the stage again.

I'm sure some of this is regional.

Even if there is some hassle, I believe what USPSA has to offer is worth it. Let me put it this way - I despise cold ranges. USPSA is all cold range, but I deal with it, because I think it's worth it.

They also stop me sometimes when the see the Gadget and think my gun is breaking, but that's ok, then I get to tell them about it. :)

[Mr_White]

I don't have a ton of thoughts formed yet, and I haven't delved deep into the scores to see what's what very specifically, but here's the video anyway:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Ym5b8wBp34

[GRV]

[...]

Thanks! That was very helpful. The fact that a statement has been issued is extremely promising.

[pr1042]

https://www.uspsa.org/uspsa-NROI-ruling-details.php?indx=59

[HCM]

They also stop me sometimes when the see the Gadget and think my gun is breaking, but that's ok, then I get to tell them about it. :)

This ^^^ has Meme written all over it.

[Clobbersaurus]

I don't have a ton of thoughts formed yet, and I haven't delved deep into the scores to see what's what very specifically, but here's the video anyway:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Ym5b8wBp34

I've watched your USPSA videos since coming on this site, and take this for what it's worth as I'm still a novice in the shooting sports, but damn Dude, I noticed some huge differences!

Your foot speed is much faster and your movements look super fast compared to your previous videos. Your new appendix reloads are sick.

Also, that jumping shot at 1:08 was freakin awesome!

[Mr_White]

I've watched your USPSA videos since coming on this site, and take this for what it's worth as I'm still a novice in the shooting sports, but damn Dude, I noticed some huge differences!

Your foot speed is much faster and your movements look super fast compared to your previous videos. Your new appendix reloads are sick.

Also, that jumping shot at 1:08 was freakin awesome!

Hey thanks man!

I've been looking at some other people's match videos from Area 1. I shoot points like a decent Production guy, but get my ass kicked on time in Limited. It's the story of my life in Limited. I gotta figure out how to solve that riddle, but I just keep coming back to thinking that I need to shoot and move a lot better than I do. Though some Dumb Errors also accounted for a fairly significant amount of time. Not all of it though.

Definitely had a lot of fun jumping around at that match. I have to think that losing ~20% of my body mass helped there. Taking those shots in the air at 1:08 when I jumped off the bridge was the single funnest part of the match for me. Too bad I messed up that stage elsewhere.

It's really hard to get through 16 stages without crashing and burning a few times, and having lots of small errors all over the place.

[Clobbersaurus]

It's really hard to get through 16 stages without crashing and burning a few times, and having lots of small errors all over the place.

I have a hard enough time getting through 7 stages and not tanking a stage.

16 stages shooting Limited minor from concealment? At least no one can say you don't enjoy a challenge! LOL!!

[Mr_White]

I have a hard enough time getting through 7 stages and not tanking a stage.

16 stages shooting Limited minor from concealment? At least no one can say you don't enjoy a challenge! LOL!!

I tend to focus on the things I can be critical of, to the exclusion of things that were good. I think I need to remember to feel good more often about being able to at least function as a credible Limited M, doing things my way. That's not going to make me get any better, but maybe I should keep it in mind more than I do.

[nycnoob]

Gabe,

Any thoughts on why you were "fast enough" for Rogers and you appear to be "slow" in USPSA?
Do you think it is the accuracy requirement (size of the A zone)? Rogers is all reactive an no planning
but it does not appear that you are having difficulty with the planning.

[Mr_White]

Gabe,

Any thoughts on why you were "fast enough" for Rogers and you appear to be "slow" in USPSA?
Do you think it is the accuracy requirement (size of the A zone)? Rogers is all reactive an no planning
but it does not appear that you are having difficulty with the planning.

Rogers amounts to a par time test. That is not to take away from Rogers. It is a difficult test and I think it tests consistent performance more than anything else. Both Manny and I were fast enough for Rogers, but Manny is fast enough to shoot about 98% at Area 1, and I was only fast enough to shoot about 75% at Area 1. Now there are some rough edges in there and it isn't quite as simple as that makes it sound, but time is the biggest factor.