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Lon
04-06-2016, 08:07 PM
So on April 24th I leave the Detective Section and head back to Patrol as a Sergeant. Any pearls of wisdom from the LE guys out here? What are the do's and don't's that you guys have seen over the years? I have my own thoughts on the matter, but am curious to see what you guys have to say.

41magfan
04-06-2016, 08:21 PM
It's simple ...... just be the Sergeant you always wished for when you were a slick-sleeve. :^)

Simple ain't always easy, though.

AMC
04-06-2016, 08:25 PM
Welcome to the party. I don't know how long you've been out of patrol, or if you guys have a "Re-Entry" program like we do, but spend some time getting familiar with any policy or law changes that have occurred since you last wore the blue suit. A light touch and an approachable but professional manner goes a long way toward building trust in the beginning. Eventually you'll want to set your expectations with your guys, but spend some time getting to know them and the job before you start cracking the whip as a new supervisor. Be consistent and fair. Having favorites is a sure way to poison the watch. I don't know how long you've been on the job, but it always helps if you've got some time in to have built credibility. You know how cops are. Get out there and back your guys up on calls, but make sure you let them know you're not checking up on them (even if you are) but you're just there to help. Don't forget how your pen works if your guys get backed up on paper. I'm surd you've had a bunch of different bosses through the years. Hopefully you learned something from them. Now its your turn. Lead and TRAIN your folks. Finally, congratulations. Hope something here helps.

voodoo_man
04-06-2016, 09:28 PM
It's simple ...... just be the Sergeant you always wished for when you were a slick-sleeve. :^)

Simple ain't always easy, though.

Pretty much...

Just the easy common sense stuff - treat people like you want to be treated, and always with respect and try to maintain their dignity, and yours. Just a few suggestions off the top of my head that I've seen work well.

Get the files of the people who work directly under you (or that you are directly responsible for) and find out when their birthdays are, when their spouse and kid's birthdays are and preemptively give them those days off without making them pay for it, if you follow what I'm saying. One of my old timer Sgt's whose retired now used to do that, manpower be damned - "family is the most important thing a man has, if you show him you care about him and his family, he'll do good work for you." He was right.

Holiday requests always work by guy with most kids and/or most seniority, no exceptions.

Reward the bums, but reward the workers more.

Be completely approachable, tell them you will work with them and give everyone your cell phone number right away. They have a question, problem, complaint or want to shoot the shit, you should be the first person they come to, always, and they should know that.

Above all, please do not micromanage. It kill moral and makes everyone want to stop working.

tanner
04-06-2016, 09:46 PM
Expect lots of this. 21 guys/gals on my shift. Only one has more than 5 years on the job.


07074

JR1572
04-06-2016, 09:51 PM
So on April 24th I leave the Detective Section and head back to Patrol as a Sergeant. Any pearls of wisdom from the LE guys out here? What are the do's and don't's that you guys have seen over the years? I have my own thoughts on the matter, but am curious to see what you guys have to say.

Congrats.

The same may be happening to me Friday...

JR1572

BehindBlueI's
04-06-2016, 10:23 PM
Condolences. Err, I mean congrats. I guess. Actually why I don't take the sergeant's test.

I'd just ask you remember you got promoted, you didn't retire. Don't be a dick, but don't be a push over, and wait at least a month before starting your campaign for LT... ;)

41magfan
04-06-2016, 10:28 PM
A few random comments:

Lead from the front and set the example for quality work. My guys hated it when I beat them to calls.

Learn and embrace the workable differences between leadership and management.

If the troops know you care about them, they will accept your discipline. In fact, when you do it right, many of your guys & gals will come to you promptly and divulge to you their mistakes without you asking. Use those opportunities to make them better.

Be consistent - they will tolerate your shortcomings if you're consistent in your expectations.

And always remember - in the absence of the carrot, there is only the stick.

Remember all those window to window talks you've had with co-workers about your supervisors? Don't do that stuff you complained about.

I finished up my career as a Captain, which was a Division Commanders position in my agency and admittedly a bit removed from real police work. How I got that far without knowing what ________ taste like is undeniable proof that God looks after folks that do the right thing no matter what. When I look back at some of the conflicts that put me at odds with the Bosses, there's no logical reason why I was not only retained, but promoted ...... several times.

Anyhow, I said all that to put my commentary into some proper context; My days as a Sergeant were without a doubt the best days of my LE career ...... enjoy and make the best of them.

Oh, and congratulations on the promotion.

tanner
04-06-2016, 11:26 PM
My days as a Sergeant were without a doubt the best days of my LE career ...... enjoy and make the best of them

I have heard this several times over from administrators I respected. I try to take it to heart and keep everything I perspective. Someday in the not too distant future, these will be "The Good Old Days".

Beat Trash
04-07-2016, 05:15 AM
I was a Patrol Sergeant for 14 years before taking over our Canine Unit.

Breath... Relax... Repeat as necessary... Especially when dealing with your newer officers.

You no longer have a personal opinion, especially when talking around newer officers. "The Sergeant said..." Not you said...

Don't go around telling war stories about back in the day. Things were different back in your day. No one really cares, they're just being polite.

When you respond to the scene of a UOF incident, the first person you talk to is your officer. "The first words out of your mouth should be, "Are you ok?" Yes, you have to conduct an interview with the suspect. But go to your officers first.

Never ask an officer to do anything that you would not do. Especially if it's dangerous. Lead from the front. You can manage the incident from the front as well as from the rear.

In my agency, the command staff loves to use the words "manager" when referring to supervision. Bullshit. You manage a fixed object. You manage your check book, you manage your time, you can manage an incident. But you lead the people assigned to the incident that you are managing. You lead and inspire people. Be a leader, not a manager. First, foremost and always.

Being a leader and inspiring people doesn't happen over night. Don't go full whammo on your first day.

If a decision needs to be made by a Sergeant, make one. When asked for a decision on the radio, make one. Even if it's wrong, make a decision. "Hmmm..." is not an appropriate response from a leader.

Do not be afraid to admit you are in error. You won't lose the respect of the officers nearly as quick as if you make a mistake and deny it. Grass is green. If you accidentally say that grass is pink with purple poke a dots, don't stick to the, "I'm the Sergeant and grass is pink, damn it!" theory...

Don't just show up on a radio run when there's a problem. Show up just to cover over. Cover over on a traffic stop. Get your people used to seeing you during the good times and not just during the bad. Otherwise being told to stop by your office ends up like being sent to the principles officer as a kid.

Never supervise by emotion. If an officer pisses you off, walk away. You comment and correct behavior and actions. Not the person. Never say, "You're f*ck'n an idiot". Say something like, " The choice you made probably wasn't our best course of action, wasn't it?"

You're not their friend. You're not their buddy. If you do it right, you'll be more like their big brother or an Uncle. If you do it right, your people will literally go to the gates of hell, and kick the door in for you. If you do it right, it can be the most rewarding part of your career.

If you do it wrong, your people will stay up at night thinking of ways to get even with you.

You are in a unique position in life in that your starting over with a blank slate. What you do with it is up to you.

Good luck...

JustOneGun
04-07-2016, 09:58 AM
My idea on becoming a leader is, you can't do it all at once. After you get your head above water the biggest thing a leader can do is become an expert on what you are leading. For me that means being an expert on the strengths and weaknesses of your troops. It also means become an expert(I mean an EXPERT) on rules and procedures. Both of these take time but are necessary to get the most out of your troops.

With the above in mind, you can let your troops do the job they were hired to do. Give them enough rope to be effective. Poke your head into the situation when their weaknesses might be showing through. After you save them from themselves make it a training issue. Ultimately that allows you to train them and work your way out of a job. At some point they don't need you anymore. You will be on the outside looking in and only step in when it is required by them needing help or when the rules require you to step in.

As to knowing rules and procedures, I had a sergeant who described himself as pedantic. He had learned the book far better than anyone in IA or even the Chief's office. This allowed him to discipline his troops properly and fairly. But it also allowed him to defend his decisions as proper because he was such an expert at the rules and procedures.

Many in the command staff above hammer the troops they don't like or who don't fall in line with their plan. However, in my old department they were also ignorant of the actual rules. They were yes men there to get people to tow the party line and nothing more. That pedantic sergeant respectfully protected his troops when they were not at fault and ensured fair punishment when they did screw up. Not much more is needed from a boss.

60167
04-07-2016, 10:37 AM
Nothing you say or do will ever matter if your crew doesn't respect you.

pablo
04-07-2016, 12:25 PM
Take care of the paperwork and admin stuff. I rarely need a patrol supervisors advice on anything I'm doing in the field, not trying to sound arrogant but we're not doing brain surgery here. What I do need is my payroll submitted on time, training request and orders processed, performance evals filed and when I ask for days off I actually need them to be put in the book or denied.

If you have decent troops and you don't thwart their every effort, you will probably get away with being a completely incompetent field supervisor. You can't BS your way out of taking care of the paperwork.

jondoe297
04-07-2016, 12:53 PM
Don't become so possessed with the idea of being the Sergeant that you protect your stripes at all costs. Stand up for your guys when they're in the right, even if it puts your balls up against the band saw. Don't throw your guys under the bus to protect yourself.

LSP552
04-07-2016, 01:20 PM
I was a Patrol Sergeant for 14 years before taking over our Canine Unit.

Breath... Relax... Repeat as necessary... Especially when dealing with your newer officers.

You no longer have a personal opinion, especially when talking around newer officers. "The Sergeant said..." Not you said...

Don't go around telling war stories about back in the day. Things were different back in your day. No one really cares, they're just being polite.

When you respond to the scene of a UOF incident, the first person you talk to is your officer. "The first words out of your mouth should be, "Are you ok?" Yes, you have to conduct an interview with the suspect. But go to your officers first.

Never ask an officer to do anything that you would not do. Especially if it's dangerous. Lead from the front. You can manage the incident from the front as well as from the rear.

In my agency, the command staff loves to use the words "manager" when referring to supervision. Bullshit. You manage a fixed object. You manage your check book, you manage your time, you can manage an incident. But you lead the people assigned to the incident that you are managing. You lead and inspire people. Be a leader, not a manager. First, foremost and always.

Being a leader and inspiring people doesn't happen over night. Don't go full whammo on your first day.

If a decision needs to be made by a Sergeant, make one. When asked for a decision on the radio, make one. Even if it's wrong, make a decision. "Hmmm..." is not an appropriate response from a leader.

Do not be afraid to admit you are in error. You won't lose the respect of the officers nearly as quick as if you make a mistake and deny it. Grass is green. If you accidentally say that grass is pink with purple poke a dots, don't stick to the, "I'm the Sergeant and grass is pink, damn it!" theory...

Don't just show up on a radio run when there's a problem. Show up just to cover over. Cover over on a traffic stop. Get your people used to seeing you during the good times and not just during the bad. Otherwise being told to stop by your office ends up like being sent to the principles officer as a kid.

Never supervise by emotion. If an officer pisses you off, walk away. You comment and correct behavior and actions. Not the person. Never say, "You're f*ck'n an idiot". Say something like, " The choice you made probably wasn't our best course of action, wasn't it?"

You're not their friend. You're not their buddy. If you do it right, you'll be more like their big brother or an Uncle. If you do it right, your people will literally go to the gates of hell, and kick the door in for you. If you do it right, it can be the most rewarding part of your career.

If you do it wrong, your people will stay up at night thinking of ways to get even with you.

You are in a unique position in life in that your starting over with a blank slate. What you do with it is up to you.

Good luck...

I would have enjoyed working with you!

AMC
04-07-2016, 02:08 PM
My initial response last night was on my phone during 7M ( or Code 7, or whatever) while pounding down a burrito so I could get back to finishing off all my paperwork as Watch Commander. If I had time and put a great deal of thought into it, I still don't think I could have said it better than Beat Trash. Some day to day and special occasion stuff I might add.....do NOT participate in the gossip, as Beat Trash alluded to. This is hard, because yesterday you were one of the guys, and cops gossip more than 1950's housewives over the back fence. Learn to accept that your new first name is "Sarge". Live the advice you give to your troops. When attending Holiday parties, Promotional parties, etc., arrive late and leave early. Give them some time without the boss around. Even a really good boss who they like and respect....is still the boss.

Coyotesfan97
04-07-2016, 03:18 PM
Take care of your people and they'll take care of you.

Don't micromanage in general. Oh there will be problem children who need it but overall cops like doing there job without constant supervision. Don't run calls from the office on the radio.

Don't obsess about stats. Each person on your squad will like to do something in particular whether it's working dope, DUIs, warrants, or traffic. There'll be guys who don't do a lot of on views but there isn't anyone taking a call in their beat. I can remember a commander being upset at one of our two man cars because they didn't write enough tickets. That month they cleared six parole violation warrants and put six felons back in prison. No mention about that.

For Gods sake don't gossip or talk about things that were told to you in confidence. That ruined my opinion of one of my first Sergeants who I respected a lot

Sometimes doing goofy things builds morale and encourages work. I know one guy who would give out King Leo peppermint sticks for an on view felony arrest or three on view misdemeanor arrests in a shift. If you had a cool call you could present it in briefing and if the squad and Sergeant agreed you'd get a King Leo.

Congratulations and good luck! Probably ever supervisor I know who promoted past Sergeant has said that was the best job they've had.

Lon
04-07-2016, 06:18 PM
Some great advice. Thanks a bunch.

Beat Trash, great post.

I'm looking forward to it, I keep hearing it's the best job in the department from a bunch of different current and former sgts who went up the ranks.

LtDave
04-07-2016, 06:27 PM
Sergeant is the best job in Law Enforcement. Trust me, being a Lieutenant sucks. Patrol watch commander especially sucks, Detective Lieutenant sucks slightly less than being a WC. Absolutely the best ever job I ever had was Detective Sergeant. Spend a few years in patrol, then put in for the Detective Sergeant job. You'll have a lot fewer headaches in Detectives, and you get to work all the interesting cases.

Lon
04-07-2016, 06:30 PM
Sergeant is the best job in Law Enforcement. Trust me, being a Lieutenant sucks. Patrol watch commander especially sucks, Detective Lieutenant sucks slightly less than being a WC. Absolutely the best ever job I ever had was Detective Sergeant. Spend a few years in patrol, then put in for the Detective Sergeant job. You'll have a lot fewer headaches in Detectives, and you get to work all the interesting cases.

At our place the Dicks have a captain as a boss. I wish we had detective sgts.

voodoo_man
04-07-2016, 06:37 PM
Sergeant is the best job in Law Enforcement. Trust me, being a Lieutenant sucks. Patrol watch commander especially sucks, Detective Lieutenant sucks slightly less than being a WC. Absolutely the best ever job I ever had was Detective Sergeant. Spend a few years in patrol, then put in for the Detective Sergeant job. You'll have a lot fewer headaches in Detectives, and you get to work all the interesting cases.

Our Sgt's are the workhorses of the PD, they do everything and then some. Lt's spot is basically the best job ever. You have very little responsibility and the only issues you will ever encounter are those that the Captain gives to you. Otherwise, we go entire shifts without hearing, seeing or knowing who or where the Lt is.

Coyotesfan97
04-08-2016, 04:59 AM
Our Sgt's are the workhorses of the PD, they do everything and then some. Lt's spot is basically the best job ever. You have very little responsibility and the only issues you will ever encounter are those that the Captain gives to you. Otherwise, we go entire shifts without hearing, seeing or knowing who or where the Lt is.

I like Lieutenants like that.

LittleLebowski
04-08-2016, 06:14 AM
Great thread, gents.

voodoo_man
04-08-2016, 07:15 AM
I like Lieutenants like that.

We all do. Best types.

41magfan
04-08-2016, 10:23 AM
I wouldn't consider this until you've been at it for a while (at least a year or two), but I used UPWARD EVALUATIONS throughout my entire career. I developed my own form based on a template from another field and geared it towards LE work. I routinely did them on an annual basis, but attrition often dictated whether to conduct them more or less often.

To maximize the potential of the eval, I required everyone to submit them anonymously by either typing the responses or having another person do the handwritten portion. I didn't want to know the origin of the comments, good or bad. Obviously, you've got to be pretty thick-skinned to initiate something like this and a handful of outliers will invariably use it as a tool to voice their selfish contentions, but on the whole I found it one of the best methods for gauging my effectiveness as a manager and leader.

Lastly, part of the eval involved some open ended questions that served as a "Suggestion Box" of sorts. The only stipulation was that the feedback had to be specific in the who, what, when, where and how. Everyone seems to have a knack for identifying problems, but few are able to outline workable solutions. This format allowed the individual to sound off on things not addressed in the evaluation.

Anyhow, I found the instrument extremely helpful if you're secure enough to take the criticism it will inevitably generate.

voodoo_man
04-08-2016, 02:49 PM
I wouldn't consider this until you've been at it for a while (at least a year or two), but I used UPWARD EVALUATIONS throughout my entire career. I developed my own form based on a template from another field and geared it towards LE work. I routinely did them on an annual basis, but attrition often dictated whether to conduct them more or less often.

To maximize the potential of the eval, I required everyone to submit them anonymously by either typing the responses or having another person do the handwritten portion. I didn't want to know the origin of the comments, good or bad. Obviously, you've got to be pretty thick-skinned to initiate something like this and a handful of outliers will invariably use it as a tool to voice their selfish contentions, but on the whole I found it one of the best methods for gauging my effectiveness as a manager and leader.

Lastly, part of the eval involved some open ended questions that served as a "Suggestion Box" of sorts. The only stipulation was that the feedback had to be specific in the who, what, when, where and how. Everyone seems to have a knack for identifying problems, but few are able to outline workable solutions. This format allowed the individual to sound off on things not addressed in the evaluation.

Anyhow, I found the instrument extremely helpful if you're secure enough to take the criticism it will inevitably generate.

Can you please send me this form as I'd love to use it.

41magfan
04-08-2016, 03:00 PM
Can you please send me this form as I'd love to use it.

I'm afraid it was never digitized, so I'll have to locate a copy that I may have retained. If I can locate one, you're welcome to it.

voodoo_man
04-08-2016, 03:18 PM
I'm afraid it was never digitized, so I'll have to locate a copy that I may have retained. If I can locate one, you're welcome to it.

Yes please. I've been meaning to do something like this.

Lon
04-08-2016, 07:29 PM
I like the upward eval idea. For CALEA we did a staff study that included upward evals. It was quite illuminating for several of the sergeants and captains. I'd like a copy as well if you find it.

JR1572
04-24-2016, 08:31 PM
So on April 24th I leave the Detective Section and head back to Patrol as a Sergeant. Any pearls of wisdom from the LE guys out here? What are the do's and don't's that you guys have seen over the years? I have my own thoughts on the matter, but am curious to see what you guys have to say.

Did you start your new gig today?

JR1572

Erick Gelhaus
04-24-2016, 09:15 PM
Oddly enough this thread has more than philosophical value.

Lon
04-24-2016, 09:39 PM
Did you start your new gig today?

JR1572

I did. Beautiful sunny day. Nothing crazy happened. I have an all veteran officer day shift right now. The junior officer has 13 years on the job. They all know how to do their jobs and require very little in the way of answering questions about how to handle something. So right now the biggest thing I have to worry about is keeping them motivated and keeping their morale as high as I can. We've got some financial issues city wide and we're looking at potentially Laying off some guys later this year so that'll be my biggest challenge.

I want to thank everyone who gave input. I've taken a lot of it to heart and have a good idea of what direction I want to head as a supervisor.

iWander
04-26-2016, 08:57 AM
Welcome to the party. I don't know how long you've been out of patrol, or if you guys have a "Re-Entry" program like we do, but spend some time getting familiar with any policy or law changes that have occurred since you last wore the blue suit. A light touch and an approachable but professional manner goes a long way toward building trust in the beginning. Eventually you'll want to set your expectations with your guys, but spend some time getting to know them and the job before you start cracking the whip as a new supervisor. Be consistent and fair. Having favorites is a sure way to poison the watch. I don't know how long you've been on the job, but it always helps if you've got some time in to have built credibility. You know how cops are. Get out there and back your guys up on calls, but make sure you let them know you're not checking up on them (even if you are) but you're just there to help. Don't forget how your pen works if your guys get backed up on paper. I'm surd you've had a bunch of different bosses through the years. Hopefully you learned something from them. Now its your turn. Lead and TRAIN your folks. Finally, congratulations. Hope something here helps.
Perfectly stated. I've dedicated myself to be the LEADER I only had one as a patrolman, rather than the spineless, frightened MANAGERS I almost always had.