Glocks and Range 124 gr LE only rounds

[Glenn E. Meyer]

During the great ammo panic, I bought a few boxes of Winchester Law Enforcement 9mm Nato 124 Gr. FMJ.

It says it is not for retail sale (but managed to get into Academy or WalMart - I forget which). Pressure levels exceed industry standards.

So what do folks think of this stuff? I've shot through my WWB, PMC, etc. stuff for matches. There is the stash of expensive HP wonder ammo.

Should I shoot it out? Save for the apocalypse? Will it blow me and my Glocks up in a flash of thunder?

[Kyle Reese]

I've shot lots and lots of it from Gen 3 and 4 Glock 17s w/o issue. I'd just expend it for training purposes.

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[Trajan]

IIRC that stuff is only going 1150. Real NATO goes 1250.

[aboveandbeyond]

Stock springs are meant for these high pressure loads. Don't worry about it, just shoot!

[Glenn E. Meyer]

So I won't blow up? LOL - just asking. I guess I will put it in my full capacity Glock mags that I bought after the ban went down - they say LE also. Wow! How cool is that! CDNN was selling them really cheaply then. Sure it won't blow the safety off my Glock - haha! Last mystery I read had an FBI agent flicking off the safety of her Glock.

Thanks for the input.

[TGS]

Winchester Ranger 124gr FMJ?

We use that. Some of the filthiest ammo I've ever put my hands on....my fingers turn black after loading 1-2 boxes.

[Sterling Archer]

So I won't blow up?
Only Glock 40s blow up ;)

[VolGrad]

... just make sure to decock that GLOCK. I heard a LEO decock one on TV the other night and almost gagged.

[Chuck Haggard]

The "NATO" 9mm that Winchester is selling OTC is barely hotter than WWB 115gr. It's not the +P+++++!!!!! shit people make it out to be.

Even regular full power NATO 124gr is no hotter than 124gr +p Gold Dot

[Sigfan26]

The "NATO" 9mm that Winchester is selling OTC is barely hotter than WWB 115gr. It's not the +P+++++!!!!! shit people make it out to be.

Even regular full power NATO 124gr is no hotter than 124gr +p Gold Dot

Giant +1 on this. NATO specs are much different , testing wise, than SAAMI IIRC

[pangloss]

Winchester Ranger 124gr FMJ?

We use that. Some of the filthiest ammo I've ever put my hands on....my fingers turn black after loading 1-2 boxes.
You should try some of Winchester's new steel - cased stuff. It's the dirtiest I've ever seen.

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[FNFAN]

Will it blow me and my Glocks up in a flash of thunder?

Doubtful! It's my lil' Beretta Nano's favorite non-jhp load so it should do just fine in your Glock. Shoot & enjoy!

[TiroFijo]

The "NATO" 9mm that Winchester is selling OTC is barely hotter than WWB 115gr. It's not the +P+++++!!!!! shit people make it out to be.

Even regular full power NATO 124gr is no hotter than 124gr +p Gold Dot

NATO spec for 9 mm (STANAG 4090) allows for a VERY wide margin of power. Now that most submachine guns have been replaced by assault rifles the rounds are normally loaded just a hair hotter than normal SAAMI specs, below SAAMI +P pressure in most cases. That is the case with modern (made in the last 15 years or so) 9 mm NATO ammo.

[TiroFijo]

Regarding muzzle energy, the NATO standard is exceptionally lax.

According to STANAG 4090, the test barrel is 7.85", the muzzle energy must be between 400 and 600 ft·lbf, and bullet weight between 108 and 128 gr.

This means that a humble SAAMI spec 115 gr 9 mm load that has about 1140 fps in a 4" barrel, but probably does about 1260 fps in a 7.85" barrel (with 405 ft-lbs) meets the NATO spec. And a hot load that does 1475 fps with a 124 gr bullet out of a 8" barrel also meets the spec at the top end (599 ft-lbs).

In normal locked breech, recoil opeated pistols, recoil impulse (bullet mass*bullet velocity + powder mass*gas exit velocity) is what governs the cycle. It doesn't matter the chamber pressure or bullet type/weight, there is a certain window of recoil impulse that balances best in a certain design. The 9 mm case is exceptionally strong, but extra recoil impulse is what can lead to functional/durability problems. The glock 17 and all glocks in 9 mm have been designed from the ground up for NATO specs.

[Mack]

I haven't shot a whole lot of this stuff but it has never given me an issue. I haven't chronographed it but I would concur with what others have said that it is slightly hotter than regular practice ammo but doesn't feel as stout at +p loads. Last time I shot it in my 34 there wasn't much discernible difference in muzzle rise between it and the 115 grain Perfecta I was shooting and my split times were no different.

[Totem Polar]

Better ballistic minds than I have already chimed in, so I'll just note that I like the "NATO" (note use of quotes) Winchester stuff just fine because it gives me a wider margin of error, in terms of function, when my shooting grip is compromised.

Frankly, I'm a lot more worried about underpowered range fodder (eg. PMC 115 ball) than too hot in a Glock. I'd only shoot 124+P GDHP if I could afford it in large amounts.

JMO